Toasters toast bread, not toast.

You'd have to be full on retarded to put toast into a toaster.

>Toasters don't toast toast

no shit, they toast bread. Fucking stupid ass nigga bitch

>Anyone ever done anything similar?

COMPLETELY INVALIDATE THE CHOICES MY PLAYERS MADE WHEN CREATING AND ADVANCING THEIR CHARACTERS ALL TO SATISFY MY STRANGE FETISH FOR FORBIDDING A PLAYER FROM EVER PLAYING A CHARACTER SMARTER OR MORE CHARISMATIC THAN THEMSELVES? NO NOT REALLY.

>>16403310

UNLESS THE TOAST WAS NOT TOASTED TO YOUR TOAST-TASTES, IN WHICH CASE YOU *WOULD* PUT TOAST BACK IN THE TOASTER.

Why does toast not look like a word anymore?

>>16403337
Then it's not toast, it's half-done bread, innnnnnnit?

The condition of toast-ness being contingent upon being fully toasted to your toast-tastes.

Q. E. D.

>>16403310
but what if your toast has not been toasted adequately to your tastes?
>>16403297
in all seriousness, I haven't myself. I mean there's a bit of respecting the character/player role play line, and admittedly, the line can be blurry to start, not helped by metagamers, and then there's just asking something well outside of a player's abilities that could easily make these challenges frustratingly unbeatable.

Though I will say the idea is cool and does have merit, and if players can pull it off, it's truly something spectacular.

May I reheat the non-toasted "not toast" in the toaster after it has already been covered with a thick layer of Nutella?

>>16403356

NOW YOU'RE COMMITTING THE SPECTRUM FALLACY. ALL TOAST IS TOAST, THERE IS NO MAGICAL LINE WHERE *THIS* MUCH BROWN IS TOAST AND ANYTHING LESS IS "HALF-DONE" BREAD.

OR ARE YOU SERIOUSLY GOING TO SUGGEST TO ME THAT TOAST IS BOTH A BINARY STATE *AND* THAT ITS TOAST-INESS COULD BE FLIPPED BY SWITCHING WHICH PLATE IT SITS ON? YOU CAN'T HAVE IT BOTH WAYS!

>>16403350
Because when toast a world like toast enough toasts, it toasts having toast and starts to toast toast toast toast.

So toast toast toast toast toast toast toast.

Toast.

>>16403337
>implying the DM is only giving them skill check forbidden puzzles throughout the entire game.

Players can choose when to make spot, listen, tumble, use rope, etc, any time they want. Nothing wrong with giving them an immersive puzzle which makes them get involved a little more than rolling dice. At least there is no luck involved if you are allowed to make a decision for yourself.

HEY OP, NEXT TIME DON'T POST A PICTURE MORE INTERESTING/INFURIATING/WHATEVER THAN YOUR QUESTION/STORY

>>16403371
we've got ourselves a Sorites' paradox up in this bitch.

>>16403371
I'm not suggesting both. There is indeed a line which delineates where bread becomes toast, but it's relative to the observer's desire. I love toast fully-done. If it's half-done it's not toast, it's still just bread. That line may vary from person to person but it doesn't stand at the exact point at which you place a piece of bread into a toaster. There has to be a duration of time, just as there has to be a duration of time between dough and bread while it's forming the oven. Simply placing a piece of bread into a toaster does not magically turn it into toast if the duration of toasting is zero.

>>16403297

Sounds like a retarded idea you're running there OP. I go to my DM's sessions to game, not to practice for my not-upcoming drama college audition. Why did they even roll characters, shit. Well, they like that sort of thing and it's inside their comfort zones, then whatever, but if you're just being an aspie-plan-imposing faggot then fuck you.

It is toast when you decide that it's toast. Until it has reached that level of toastdom, it is not toast in your eyes.

>>16403390

I KEEP HEARING THAT IT'S IMMERSSIVE SOMEHOW, BUT NOTHING WOULD SHATTER MY SUSPENSION OF DISBELIEF FASTER THAN THE INT30 WIZARD, WHO'S PROBABLY READ HUNDREDS OF BOOKS ABOUT SPHYNXES AND PUZZLES, AND THE WIS16 MONK, WHO'S SPENT A GOOD DEAL OF HIS LIFE PONDERING KOANS AND RIDDLES FOR FUN, SUDDENLY CAN'T SOLVE A CHILD'S RIDDLE BECAUSE THEIR *PLAYERS* WERE ASKED TO SOLVE IT INSTEAD.

YES, SOMEONE ELSE ON THE TABLE WHO HAPPENS TO HAVE HEARD THE SAME RIDDLE CAN CERTAINLY FEED THE ANSWER TO THE WIZARD'S PLAYER SO *HE* CAN SAY IT, BUT BY THEN THE DAMAGE HAS BEEN DONE.

>>16403366
Sure, but I'd recommend a toaster oven instead.

>>16403437
I'd say deciding who is going to actually solve the rule in game and then letting the players pool their collective intellects for a bit would be fine. But at that point, why are you using a game with randomized task resolution mechanics?

>>16403437
>>16403371
>>16403337

.....
Karkat? Is that you??

People toast bread, how did so many of you not get this?

>>16403473
Shhh, they're arguing about whether or not you should be able to toast toast. Just because it's toast doesn't mean that you can't put it in the toaster again, especially if it's not as brown as you like it. Or if you really want to fuck with someone and you leave a piece of toast until the toaster catches fire.

>>16403473
I dunno about you, but I've ever met anyone who can toast bread without the assistance of a toaster or at least some kind of tool/heat combination.

>>16403506
>Hasn't met johnny storm

>>16403470
He is kind of like Karkat except extremely helpful and knowledgeable about RPGs

Also I disagree with your purpose here OP but thats okay I guess

>DM starts non-skill related challenge thread

>Thread hijacked for proper bread/toast discussion.

Normal day on /tg/

I don't do that. When a challenge arises it is the character who stands to gain or lose from it so it is the character who makes the attempt.

WTF does toast have to do with /tg/ anyway? Reported.

>>16403752
Going to use this logical fallacy or some variation of the sort for my Call of Cthulhu campaign.

gtfo.

>>16403752
You must be new here.

>>16403832
That looks like a loli magazine he's holding.

FUCK YOU ALL TOAST IS BURNT BURNT DOUGH BECAUSE BREAD IS BURNT DOUGH ENJOY YOUR OVERLY BURNT PIECE OF GOOEY SHIT!

>>16403880

>>16403880
So, wait, you're saying all bread is proto-toast because it's already been in the oven?

So that should read DOES THAT MEAN THAT TOASTERS DONT TOAST PROTOTOAST, PROTOTOAST TOAST PROTOTOAST?

Toast isn't toast without butter.

I can understand if the person's character and themselves do or don't have a certain skill. I can understand asking the social -retard playing the Barbarian to act out a scene, just to see how well his character would have done. And vice-versa. Their characters knowing things that they know themselves. But if it's something that the player knows that the character wouldn't, or vice-versa, I wouldn't except it.

>>16403921

this thread must live, FOR PROTOTOAST!

>>16403930

THAT IS A GODDAMN LIE

>>16403930
I prefer peanut butter with banana slices on a piece of fresh toast.
Delicious.

DID SOMEONE SAY TOAST?!

FUCK YEAH, TOAST UP IN THIS MOTHERFUCKER!

LET'S BURN THE WORLD! MY HEATING COILS WILL UNLEASH THE FIRES OF HELL UPON YOUR FEEBLE BREAD, YOUR INADEQUATE APPLIANCES, AND EVERYONE AND EVERYTHING YOU LOVE!

>>16404892
FUCK YOU, THAT'S A VERTICAL WAFFLE IRON.
WHERE THE FUCK WAS THAT THING MADE, IN CANADA OR SOMETHING?

>>16404907
HEY. FUCK YOU. I'M A CLASSIC SIDE-SLOT ONE-SIDE-AT-A-TIME TOASTER! AND I'M FUCKING AWESOME!

JUST STICK YOUR HAND IN MY SLOT. DO IT. I FUCKING DARE YOU. I WILL BURN THE -SHIT- OUT OF YOU YOU FUCKING FILTHY MEATBAG!

>>16404796

Search your feelings, you know it to be true.

This thread is GOLD

Also,

FUCK BUTTER, TOAST NEEDS JAM OR JELLY

SAY OTHERWISE AND I'LL FUCKING CUT YOU

>>16404979
I use peanut butter.

You mad, bro?

Anyone who puts both jelly/jam AND butter on a piece of toast should just do the world a favor and kill themselves.

>>16404992
THATS FINE AS LONG AS JAM OR JELLY IS USED AS WELL. I FIND IT PB UNNECESSARY, THOUGH I SUPPOSE AN EXTRA-CHUNKY JAM WOULD BE BETTER HELD TO THE TOAST IF PB WAS APPLIED FIRST

>>16405001
Bu-but... You can't have toast of any kind without butter! It's just the way toast works! It makes it all buttery and delicious!

Although this might be because I often make the toast into a sandwich, and peanut butter goes against the butter first, not jelly.

Still. y u so toast nazi?

I put lard on my toast. It's surprising that lard is healthier than butter.

can we archive this?

>>16405013
WHO THE FUCK MADE YOU KING OF TOAST?

NO ONE THATS WHO

FUCK YOU

>>16405013
JELLY IS USED TO MAKE STUFF GOOD

BUTTER IS FUCKING BUTTER

THE TWO SHOULD NEVER MIX

I WILL HAVE ORDER IN MY BREAKFAST

I don't toast my bread in/on a toaster anyway.

I fry it in unsalinated butter on a motherfucking teflon pan.

Like a.... gourmet toaster?

Anyway, shit's cash.

why is the inability to toast toast so believed on tg?

WHO DOESNT LIKE DOUBLE TOASTED TOAST

>>16405043
YOU'LL NEVER WIN, TOAST NAZIS! THE COMMONWEALTH OF ALLIED-AND-MIXED TOAST TOPPINGS WON'T ALLOW IT!

I have my white toast dry, as God intended.

>>16405120
MIXED CONDIMENT DOGS. PARISH BENEATH OUR MIGHT.

You can too have toast without butter. Ever hear of something called jelly? Peanut butter? Jam? Nutella? Cheese?

>>16405167
NO!

WE WILL DEFEAT YOU WITH THE ULTIMATE AFFRONT TO YOUR DELICATE SENSIBILITIES AND STOP-LIKING-TOAST-TOPPINGS-I-DON'T-LIKE ATTITUDE!

JAM TOAST... WITH BUTTER ON TOP! SECRET TECHNIQUE: TOAST-TOPPING-ORDER-REVERSAL!

Wait, so if toast isn't actually toast until it reaches a certain predetermined, subjective degree of "toasted"ness by the toastmaster in question, then couldn't someone put bread/prototoast/burntdough in a toaster until it reached the point they determine to be "toast", then take it out and put it BACK in the toaster, not for the purpose of reaching the level of "toasted"ness which designates toast-- as that level has already been reached-- but simply to overtoast the toast, or TOAST THE TOAST?

>>16405206
Precisely. Just because someone determines the toast does indeed qualify as toast doesn't mean it's a perfectly toasted toast, and it's possible that it will need to be retoasted.

>>16405205
YOU'VE FORCED MY HAND HERETIC

BEHOLD THAT WHICH IS ONLY SPOKEN OF IN WHISPERS

BEHOLD WHAT NO MORTAL WOULD EVER DARE TOUCH

FACE YOUR DOOM

>>16405219
well it might not even be on a need basis, but rather the toastmaster could intentionally desire to ovretoast it, whether out of sadistic glee or just a general hatred for starving children in africa (expressed by his intentional wasting of food), in which case I believe he would be toasting toast.

>>16405206
You've answered your own question here. At that point it becomes OVERTOAST and not regular toast. That shit's off the scale, yo.

>>16405238
YOU FOOL. I LOVE NUTELLA.

IN FACT...

I MADE A TOAST SANDWICH WITH BUTTER, PEANUT BUTTER, JAM, AND NUTELLA -ALL AT ONCE!-

YOUR WEAPONS ARE USELESS AGAINST ME! I AM THE MASTER OF TOAST, TOAST TOPPINGS AND TOAST SANDWICHES! BOW BEFORE MY MIGHT, FILTHY TOAST NAZI!

THE PEANUT BUTTER IS MADE CREAMY AND ITS STICKINESS TEMPERED BY BUTTER! THE JELLY GIVES IT A FRUITY DELIGHT! THE NUTELLA ADDS ORGASMIC CHOCOLATE AND EXTRA NUTTINESS! AND THE TOAST IS ITS CRUNCHY VESSEL! I AM THE ALPHA AND OMEGA! THE TOAST AND PROTOTOAST!

I!

AM!

GOD!

I tried Nutella.
It tasted as bad as Sonichu.

>>16405271
yes yes, but it's not a question of what it ends up as, the simple question is: In the aforementioned described scenario, isn't it thus possible to take toast...


...and toast it?
thereby toasting toast, as was the initial dispute of the thread.

Toast no longer looks like a word to me.

Thanks guys.

If a taoist toasts toast, is there no toast?

I love you.

>>16405286

Sorry, there are no bananas on that sammich.

You are disqualified, please leave the premises.

>>16405286
I came in your toaster.

>>16405238
I don't buy Nutella because it's got palm oil in it, along with alots of other bad ingredients. Not only are the actual ingredients pretty bad for you, palm oil is a major contributor in the destruction of our environment. (I know that they are silly but it's fun to have silly convictions.)

Also: Nestle makes Nutella.

Read up on Nestle. It's HILARIOUS. They ACTUALLY MURDERED BABIES. FOR MONEY. hahahhahaa. They are an actual, real life supervillain multi-national/billion corporation, easily on par with the tobacco companies (who I have a soft spot for).

so /tg/, I heard you like taoist.

>>16405357
How much money?

I mean murdering babies is pretty bad and stuff.

But, money.

S'good.

Toasters don't toast bread. People toast bread.

>>16405319

You're welcome!

>>16405380
see
>>16403506

>>16405346
I MADE THE ULTIMATE TOAST TO MY TASTES. IT'S GOOD ENOUGH FOR ME. I MIGHT TRY BANNANAS SOMETIME. BUT I HAVE GIVEN UP ON ALL PRETENSE OF KEEPING TOAST TOPPINGS APART. THE PRINCE OF TOAST DEMANDS EXCESS AND PERFECTION!

>>16405353
Delicious.

>>16405357
>Go to look it up
>Come to http://stopnestle.com/
My god, their spelling and grammar is atrocious.

>>16405404
>and perhaps sisters and brothers

I don't know why that is as fucking funny as it is.

>come on /tg/

>philosophical implications of toast

i love you guys

Archived.

http://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/16403297

>>16404979

I love BUTTERED TOAST.

>>16404979
GOLD?

MORE LIKE GOLDEN BROWN!

AMIRRITE GUISE?

>>16405425

Thank you, good elegantgent.

>>16405431
I-it was only a matter of time...

>>16405411
I lost it when they kept spelling "cereal" as "serials" mostly because I kept imagining it as an old radio show.

>>16404979
>SAY OTHERWISE AND I'LL FUCKING CUT YOU

Otherwise and I'll fucking cut you.

>>16405378
From memory... It was during the 70s or 80's. I mean, take this with a grain of salt, but that's obvious because anyone who says stuff like this is usually a nutcase who doesn't know their ass from the elbow, but it's worth mentioning anyway.

Anyway, from memory, Nestle made Infant Formula. They started giving the stuff (or selling very cheaply) away to 3rd world countries as a tax write-off. Then kids started dying because of bad water, incorrect sterilisation techniques, all the stuff you'd expect from a 3rd world country.

For whatever reason, whether they just decided that the charity wasn't getting them enough positive attention or that there was a higher infant mortality rate due to the consumption of infant formula, they withdrew their formula from that area (there wasn't free/cheap formula anymore).

And, of course, the mothers' milk had dried up. Because biologically they had weaned their kids. So, you have a group of mothers who can't feed their kids because they have no breast milk, no facilities to use formula, and no money to buy the formula in the first place.

I doubt Nestle even got much money out of it. It was either crazy Mao situation or a failed business plan when people didn't step up to buy more formula.

I eat my toast dry. All your condiments are either too sticky or too gross to look at...

>>16405485
The baby murder ratio doesn't favor them.

I'm going to actually answer the OPs question, because this has come up in my game, and I have some things to say on this issue:

Non-die test challenges are fine. But they only work well if you don't have a pre-conceived solution. Asking riddles and shit is a pain in the ass, as either it's too simple because they've heard it before, or takes too long and breaks immersion because they can't solve it.

A great example of a non-die skill test is actually combat. Any time players come up with a plan for combat with tactics and the like, they aren't rolling to plan "split up and attack the two guard groups at once."

you see similar stuff any time you plan a heist, or anything else.

Set challenges, then let them find their own solution. And if it sounds plausible but isn't what you had planned for a solution, fucking run with it.

>>16403437
as a DM, I'd give the player's a riddle. Give them a chance to solve it. who cares who solves it? Yes, wizard is likely to answer it, but who's to say the barbarian hasn't reached a unique conclusion based on his tribe's creation mythos?

if the player's don't get it at first, ask for INT or WIS checks, and the higher they roll, the more hints you can give out. I've found, that way it's more rewarding for the player's, because THEY figured it out.

Remember, the player playing the monkey-grip barbarian cannot ACTUALLY swing that big of a weapon. He states his intentions, and the rules support or deny his actions. Similarly, no one to my knowledge can actually cast fireball, but the player states his intentions, and the rules support or deny his actions.

If an un-social person wants to play a bard, I'll let 'em. They try to be diplomatic and fail horribly, but they roll well, I will out-of-character negotiate what they ACTUALLY said, so anyone can play any type of char they want.

>>16405551
>>16405583

I approve of these methods.

Anyway, just because someone has a high INT does not mean they will always get everything right. I think you'll find that those who we consider geniuses have gotten things wrong before.

My problem is that the philosoraptor doesn't make sense and it isn't even the toasters toasting toast instead of bread bit. It should be that toasters don't toast bread, People toast bread.

>>16403371
But there is a magical line, first you have bread, half way along you have breast and then you have toast.

Breast is the magical line.

>>16403506
>>16405390

Look, that cuts both ways. Toasters do not spontaneously toast bread. Human agency is vital to the process. The superior part, I would argue. Humans toast bread, that's how it is.

Up until we invent auto-toasting toaster robots.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=avU5onrWfYo

YEAH TOAST!

I'm astonished at how many people in this thread are so pro-rollplaying and anti-roleplaying. I cannot understand this attitude:

>>16403430 I go to my DM's sessions to game, not to practice for my not-upcoming drama college audition

I mean jesus, what do your games consist of? Just nothing but fights and skill checks? Fuck, that sounds dull.

>>16405583 if the player's don't get it at first, ask for INT or WIS checks, and the higher they roll, the more hints you can give out. I've found, that way it's more rewarding for the player's, because THEY figured it out.

Exactly, and for charisma tests, you give a bonus if the player roleplays a good response. If they're trying to convince a dryad to let them pass through the mystic forest, you want players to say something like "I swear on my honour we will cut no wood, nor make a fire, nor harm any living thing that dwells within your forest, milady", not "I roll diplomacy". If they're trying to solve a murder, you want them to interview witnesses and look for evidence, not "I have 20 Int, I should be able to just make a skill test to know who did it".

Now, obviously, sometimes you'll have a stupid player trying to play a smart PC or a shy player trying to play a charismatic PC and you should make allowances, but you should still try to encourage them by giving bonuses to even a lackluster attempt at roleplaying. That's the fucking POINT of an RPG. The "R" stands for "Roleplaying", you fuckers. If you're just in it to roll dice and kill shit, you might as well play Diablo.

>>16405485

It's actually worse than you're making it sound - they gave women in hospital free formula knowing that it would dry up their milk & they'd have to continue buying it, and they bribed health workers to tell the women to start using the formula in the first place. They were doing the same thing in Bangladesh as recently as 2007.

It really is some crazy supervillain-type shit. Doctor Doom would reject it as "too evil".

op thats kind of a dick move
when i do puzzles i usually allow an int check for hints
or something like that

I make them choose random encounters

Ladies and gentlemen of this thread,
Let us have a toast to bread!
For without bread, there would be no toast.
Toast!

toast is toast once bread is cunchy, not necessarily brown, however, that toast is shitty toast, and needs browning more.

also, my toaster toasts one side more at a time, so i have to stop half way, flip it over and toast my toast. ergo, toast can be toasted.

BACK FROM PAGE 15!

FUCK YEAH TOAST!

>>16407750

I choose the one on the left.