Right now it's CthulhuTech. Why? Because I like the intersection of horror and sci-fi roleplaying. The idea of fighting monsters (or being a monster, if you're a Tager) is novel for someone who's been fighting monsters (in D&D) for over 20 years. Plus all teh cool techno-gadgets make it slick.

I hate GURPS, because I've just had bad experiences with the system. I intensely dislike the simplistic attributes, the cookie-cutter mechanics and universal genericness of it all. I much prefer systems that are tailored to the genre.

PS: get a degree where you'll actually have a chance to land a job after university; the chances of you getting a teaching post at the uni, even with a post-doc, are slim-to-none.

>>13926339
edit: fighting monsters WITH MECHA AND PLASMA CANNONS. URgh.

>>13926339

I am a biology major.

This English class is just a requirement. Thank you for the input though, and the response. I will be incorporating the data of this thread into the paper itself.

You'll never get enough information out of /tg/. Study your local university.

That said, I like D&D 3.5, CoC, and pretty much any numbers-heavy game with a good deal of internal consistency. Reason? I like fighting challenging encounters and seeing if I can win, or at least 'not lose'.

I don't like Paranoia because ... well, it's run entirely on the DM's whim, and not by numbers - that worries me.

1. Warhammer 40,000, not so much for the game, but all the other hobby aspects. Also like 4th edition D&D quite a bit.

2. Hard not to be general here, but I want to say White Wolf games, so Vampire, Werewolf or any variation of those.

1. Warhammer Fantasy Roleplay. Dark fantasy, ALL the standard tropes subverted to all hell, a fun system that works most of the time, and it was the game I started with.

2. FATE, specifically Spirit of the Century. I love the Aspect part of the game, but every fucking thing else bugs me. Stunts, skills, attributes, the dice mechanic. I tried to like this game, but I just couldn't.

>4chan being used for social studies

It was predicted this day would come. Long, long ago it was said that we would become an object of fascination, a parody of our once proud selves...

Soon, Cthulhu and Nyarlhotep will rise and destroy us all. We can find solace in that.

>>13926339
>Right now it's CthulhuTech.
Enjoy your rape camps and fetish monsters and more rape along with a good old dose of atheist masturbation session on how all religions died.

1. D&D does not matter the edition, but preferably not 4th. The only reason is that it is what I had started on, and have yet to expand my horizons very far.

2. Mechwarrior, just because I found it rather uninteresting. Maybe with a different GM than the one I had would change my opinion, but that is how it stands at the moment.

>>13926375

I've been lurking /tg/ for a good while now. Based on my observations, and my writing skills, /tg/ will prove not only to be more than sufficient as an ethnography site, but will also provide both a different perspective from other classmates papers as well as something I can enjoy writing about and participating in.

As a foresight, I've opted to include another board to contrast with /tg/ in my research, establishing a dichotomy of what a board can be, and what a board shouldn't be.

While I can simply observe the other board, with /tg/ as my subject, research will partly rely on relevant and on-topic threads such as this.

1. Rippers. Because honestly, there's just something that appeals to me in the concept of going out, killing monsters, dragging their corpses back to base and then undergoing horrible procedures that are an affront to all that is holy to replace parts of your body with monster bits. An unholy abomination of SCIENCE and folklore. Of course, I usually end up going insane from overusing rippertech, but it's totally worth it.

2. Dungeons and Dragons. I have nothing against the game per se, it's just that it doesn't really feel coherent. There are way too many races, way too many monsters, it all just feels extremely kitchen sink to me, even with the specific settings like Forgotten Realms, Eberron, Dark Sun or Greyhawk. I like my settings to be a bit more focused both in theme and options. It just seems kind of silly to have a world with thousands of different sentient races running around.

>>13926430
I, for one, do not approve of your abusing us. Its... so cold. And distant. 4chan isn't a fucking science project for social studies. I see it as an abuse of trust on your part.

And then you're a Tripfag. Fantastic... I think I'll stop posting for a month or so.

1. Trolling
2. Offering useful data for some lazy bastard's survey

1. Mutants & Masterminds. It's cool if you're not playing with minmaxers and I'm really into capes comics.
2. I don't really hate any system. But I hate WoD players. "Hey dude we have those games, we're vampires, it's not your typical dnd h&s, come over and check it out". I came over. It was your typical h&s. While I understand not all WoD players are like this, this is my experience with them.

1. This thread is against the rules you are a massive faggot, OP.
2. Go to 1.

>>13926486
Thank you.

>>13926282
If you're studying /tg/, you might find the archive useful.
>http://archive.easymodo.net/cgi-board.pl/tg/

1. D&D 3.5. I find it fascinating seeing how much you can do within the limits of the rules. I've tried point-buy games and found them not limiting enough, if that makes any sense. I'm hoping to try Pathfinder soon.

2. d20 Modern. I find it so fucking stupid that I have to sink three levels in any of six of the most boring classes possible before I can do anything worthwhile. And even then, I have to qualify for some ridiculous prerequisites meaning I HAVE to pick certain attributes. We're changing over to GURPS for modern campaigns.

>>13926512
What rule does this go against?

>>13926486

I should like to imagine that coming from someone who has been a regular /tg/er and is only now tripfagging for the purpose of this research, I can conduct accurate and un-biased (at least negative bias) research of the board.

Please don't think of me as an observer removed, conducting a cold analysis of this place. Indeed, I'll continue to post as normally as ever, just as I always have. I feel though that it is more sincere to make clear the intentions of this observational period, rather than watch from the shadows and release information afterward. My main goal, being that this is a study of an ethnography site, is to compile this research in the most sincere way, and to always keep such threads to the specifications and rules, rather than making meta threads (despite the subject nature being meta). As you can see, the main intent of this thread is to learn of people's feelings and opinions of various /tg/-related games.


Alternatively, to give back to the community, I intend to base a quest on the information gathered.

I don't have a specific one yet, but WoD is certainly a step in the right direction, with it's simplistic abstraction of action and events with rather intuitive meaning. Just about anything that reminds the player and the dm/gm/st that this is a story first, and a body of rules second.

This is probably going to seem unfair but I despise the negative potential that comes from DnD 3.5. The game rewards anyones interest in shopping for items, feats, skills, class combinations, etc. A hammer isn't innherently bad because a person uses it for murder. It just makes me mad that there seems to be a lot of hammer-related violence when it comes to DnD.

rolled 10 = 10

>>13926574
>I intend to base a quest on the information gathered.

woooo, ANOTHER QUEST.

Do the resarch, i don't care. But don't shit up this board with MORE quests..

>>13926536

I am using sup/tg/, 1d4chan, and various other related sites. Believe me when I say I'm not a newfag to this culture we've created, nor am I an amateur when it comes to reasearch.

Thank you for the input and advice however, it is greatly appreciated.

---

In keeping to the central goal of this thread, here is my opinion of the subject question;

1. My favorite game would have to be Shadowrun, because of the range of creation allowed, and the possibilities permitted by the setting and rules. In addition I enjoy that genre of fantasy, science fiction and the like.

2. For games I dislike, I would probably have to say Star Wars. Not a problem with the game itself, but the inherent nature for players to want to run characters rooted in the force, making things difficult for someone wanting to play a more "average" character.

>>13926574
>Alternatively, to give back to the community, I intend to base a quest on the information gathered.

That only makes it worse! Not more fucking quests! There hasn't been a good one since the Fetus one. So, no thanks.

And I still see it as abuse to use a fan board like this one, which no matter how seriously we take it, is still all fun and games, and conduct scientific research on it. No matter your intentions, that's still fucking cold.

Tripfag scum.

1. Favorite Wargame is 40k, because I still play the Tongue in Cheek, entertaining version, not the Melta-spam retardation it is today. Favorite RPG is AD&D.
2. I really rather dislike 4th edition (inb4 hur hurr troll) as well as Magic.

>>13926619

Quests are an integral part of the board, as much as any other aspect.

Just because you dislike them, doesn't make them intrinsically bad. If there is enough opposition I likely won't run one, but that shouldn't dictate opinions on the matter.

>Guy puts on a trip for the first time
>People calling him tripfag scum

Beautiful.

1. Mechwarrior, the only half believable representation of gigantic mechs.

2. MtG fucking CCG in general, its fucking dumb, you are paying fucking money for pieces of fucking paper, at least with 40k you get nice models.

rolled 90 = 90

>>13926655
>Quests are an integral part of the board
GET

THE FUCK

OUT

QUESTS ARE NOT EVEN RESPECTED. THEY'RE TOLERATED. THAT IS THE OFFICIAL WORD ON QUEST THREADS.

KILL YOURSELF KILL YOURSELF KILL YOURSELF KILL YOURSELF KILL YOURSELF KILL YOURSELF KILL YOURSELF KILL YOURSELF

>>13926655
>Quests are an integral part of the board, as much as any other aspect.

Only since the summer, tripfag. It's not a long standing tradition or anything. We used to occasionally have quests. Now we have them EVERY FUCKING DAY. And none of them are as good as they used to be.

And they only continue because the board is split on them, and what are you gonna do about it? But I don't need another 5 quest threads on the front page, thank you very much.

>>13926282
1.
LARP
It's much more fun to backstab someone IRL. "sneak attack, reach out and touch someone"
2.
There is one RPG in my country that I hate. Not only the rules of it are very crappy one also the story and novels for it is so much wrong in so many levels... and most of the gamers in my country grew up on this....

1. GURPS. I always loved the level of customisation you could and the modular nature. Don't want to use some rules? Don't use them! Also, as a massive history nerd setting campaigns in various periods really appeals to me, and I've found that GURPs works well for this epoch-hopping style games.

2. I have no specific games that I hate, but I am rapidly becoming disillusioned with all GWS games. Prices rises, balance issues and rampant mehreen wank are all pushing me away.

Also: HOW THE FUCK ARE THEY PLAYING JENGA? MY BRAIN IS FULL OF FUCK.

>>13926677
>mechs believable in any sense
>40k having "nice" models
You're stupid in oh so many ways.

>>13926655
>Quests are an integral part of the board, as much as any other aspect.

Nope. I quite like quest threads, but they are very new. I'm pretty newfaggy myself (been on here 2 years) and I still haven't got used to quests everywhere.

>>13926702

>>13926684

Is that really necessary? We can remain the very portrait of civility and grace.

>>13926697

I have no idea. I've seen a similar picture on a ride of people playing chess.

---

Again, thank you for all the input. The response so far is in accordance with what I expected.

>>13926725
>Is that really necessary? We can remain the very portrait of civility and grace.

By lurking, you meant "I joined up 5 minutes ago" didn't you? Because... boy, you are new here, and it shows. Sciencefag.

>>13926688

moralfag detected

>>13926697
glue can do wonderful things

>>13926767
Shit troll detected.

Things seem to be getting off topic, and I happen to know that there are more than a dozen people here who have preferences and dislikes towards games.

rolled 16 = 16

>>13926655
>Just because you dislike them, doesn't make them intrinsically bad. If there is enough opposition I likely won't run one, but that shouldn't dictate opinions on the matter.

Looks like im not the only one who dislikes quests.
>>13926619
>>13926648
>>13926684
>>13926688
>>13926714

Anyways, my response;
1. dnd 3.5 by virtue of its the only pnp rpg i have ever played.
2. not really.

>>13926787

1) Mordheim! Best game by GW, because they abandoned it couple years ago. Small-scale wargaming, RPG aspects (improving stats and skills), one-shot games or long campaings with storytelling and special missions. Many fan-made addons (not all are good, but there is plenty to choose from). Cool for hobby aspect too, you neel like 15 miniatrures tops, so you can give each guy individual feel. You are not bound to use GW models, anything in same scale will do...

2) M:tG cause "more money invested = better chance to succeed". I've got plenty of that approach from real life events, so I don't need it in my games.

>>13926815

No, really? Well, if you want more traffic, how about we discuss the merits and downsides of D&D 4e over 3.5e?

>ethnography
hory shiet an anthropologist neckbeard
WELCOME TO OUR TRIBE
Roll for initiative.

>>13926845
>>13926677
>>13926653

I see dislike of Magic for those reasons quite often. Consider if those negative aspects of the game were mitigated, would your dislike still remain?

I personally dislike the barrier-to-entry of the game, however that's based on personal observation.

>>13926697

Yes, there is rampant favoritism of Space Marines. I believe though that as the hobby becomes more mainstream (with the advent of movies, video games, RPGs and the like), GW will invariably have to broaden their scope.

Or not. And Matt Ward gets his way forever.

1. My favorite game would definitely have to be Call of Cthulhu. Excluding the plot elements (which I love, Lovecraft being one of my favorite authors) even just the rolling system would have me sold on this game. I love the percentage-based skills. Also, I love running slowly-paced horror games that can span multiple evenings. With non-Lovecraftian horror, long horror games are hard to do.

2. As far as systems I dislike, I have major issues with World of Darkness. It's nothing to do with the plot and concept, it's just the rolling system. Not a fan of the whole "# of successes" thing.

>>13926848

How about D&D 4e against AD&D instead? It would be a refreshing change.

>1. What is your favorite game (tabletop, role-playing, board game, etc...), and care to give an explanation (short or long, whichever) as to why?
I prefer the older GW skirmish games like Mordheim, Necromunda, and Gorkamorka. Battlefleet Gothic was a very nice game but I'm not much of a fan of the over-the-top baroque ship architecture, and the game is harder to play without the company support for the models.
for RPGs, I'm partial to 4E DnD and Pathfinder.

>2. The same as question 1, but in reverse. Is there a particular game you dislike, and any reason why?
without a doubt, 40k. the game design and balance are years behind every other game GW publishes, and a decade behind competing publishers. it is the most popular tabletop in america by virtue of exquisite marketing and demographic targeting, not by the merit of its product, which on its best day, is second place to nearly every competing manufacturer in every aspect.

rolled 18 = 18

>>13926867

Rollan

>>13926848

I've never played 4e so I can't rightly say, although 3.5 seemed decent enough. I don't understand the hate for either though.

>>13926915

Actually, we had 2 or 3 of those in the last few days. Mostly involving planescape and the Blood War.

>>13926934
>sages his own thread.
>takes D&D trollan at face value

Wait... what is wrong with you?

>>13926955

>don't know shit about email field

>>13926885
>I see dislike of Magic for those reasons quite often. Consider if those negative aspects of the game were mitigated, would your dislike still remain?
Probably not. But they'll never do such thing, cause it's too good business the way it is now.

>>13926955

>Mistakes rolling for sage

No comment.

>>13926916

In the same field, which competitor would you prefer over GW? At least, in relation to tabletop wargames? Obviously it's the elephant in the room but it's always nice to broaden one's horizons.

Favorite: hard question, I love 3.5 since it got me into the world, recently I've been into Dark Heresy, WHFB, and whitewolf. Trying to round up interest in the games, but no one wants to leave 3.5.

I don't hate any games besides the game-which-must-not-be-named.

My favorite game is the one I haven't played yet. A vista full of opportunities untapped potential and a story yet written by my and my fellow player's actions.

My least favorite system is so bad my mind rebels against coming up with the core system, as it is full of pages upon pages of varying degrees of critical hits of A - E class varied by type of damage. Oh, gods, I remember now... Rolemaster. Or as I call it, Roll-mather. I refuse to ever play that horrible mechanized computer RPG ever again.

>>13927058

FATAL? Or am I wrong in assumption?

>>13927068

... What do you think?

>>13927106

I think different people have different "games-which-must-not-be-named", and an intent of this thread is to learn exactly why.

Hey guys, just so you know, by calling someone a newfag you are immediately making clear your own newfaghood. Have a good evening!

>Is that really necessary? We can remain the very portrait of civility and grace.
I like you OP.

>>13927145

Then let me clarify it for you, on /tg/ the game which must not be named is always FATAL. Always. Otherwise they'd name it, because no one would know what the fuck they were talking about.

1. Hard to choose with so many great games, but I wouldn't be playing any of them in DnD 4e hadn't drawn me back into the hobby after abandoning it in frustration earlier. If there's one game you can point out to demarcate the gradual change in RPG design from complex simulation engines to arbitrated stories, that's the one.

2. This depends on whether I have to have played the game or not. FATAL seems to be truly a horrific testament to the worst in nerdkind, but I've no experience with it. Of the games which I have played... I'll say the card game known as "war." Because it creates no opportunities for decisions, and thus literally has no gameplay. It's like a single throw of craps that takes a half-hour to resolve. Awful.

As for the MTG question... I love the game. It's rules, the art, everything is great... except the business model. I haven't owned real MTG cards in maybe ten years and have no plans to start again any time soon, preferring to play in a virtual environment where the playing field is level and the costs are minimal.

>>13927150
Well, I hate the presumptuous tripfag. To each his own, huh?

>>13927160

In FATAL discussions and bashing, people *do* refer to is as FATAL.

Conversely, I've seen BESM referred to as "that game" and the Book of Erotic Fantasy named "that thing I don't want to talk about."

>>13927150

I just want to keep things related and on-topic.

>>13927199
>I just want to keep things related and on-topic.

Not gonna happen OP. No thread on /tg/ manages to stay on topic till the end.

>>13927217

I've seen it before.

---

A question presents itself;

Are people's decisions on what they like and dislike more influenced by the game itself, or the typical players?

Would it affect people's answers if it were split up as games you like/dislike regardless of the player base?

I suppose it would be relevant to bring into consideration which games' player bases people like/dislike, however such discussions never go well.

Sageing this exploitative shit thread.

>>13927262
Exploitative? What the fuck, man? Do you even know what the word means?

>>13927299
maybe he meant explosive shit

>>13927299

Definetly do. The OP is letting us do his homework or him, instead of going outside and doing some actual research in some actual game stores. Fuck that. I also find it very much against the spirit of /tg/.

>>13927247

Player bases do matter, but note that the quality of a game and the quality of its player base are not unrelated. A game that attracts idiots will not have the same traits as a game that attracts rational and personable people. The game for idiots tend to have have "flashier" story backgrounds and will show a notable lack of balance and/or depth.

Games attract the customer base they market towards.

>>13927324

Then in that sense, wouldn't the alternative mean that the game stores would also be doing my homework for me? That's a recursive statement.

As aforementioned, I feel it would be more sincere to let this whole process be known, rather than conduct it from the shadows. It'll happen one way or another, why not incorporate willing people who wish to contribute into the process?

>>13927324

yeah, we doing his work.
OP why not just pull out the answers from your ass or use a random generator? You are such a fag to ask OUR opinion.

>>13927381

That's an interesting notion.

However sometimes don't you end up with idiots amongst the serious, and vice verse?

And then there's the whole other issue of bad groups or GMs. I suppose it's all a personal experience?

>>13927427

not that anon but:
You always have idiots. The difference is how many. it's a big difference if you have 30% idiots or just 30% rational people

what a shit thread.

>>13927427

You don't "sometimes" get a player that doesn't fit. There is always a That Guy, and if you do not know who it is, then it is you. "That Guy" is defined as the player who does not fit in, usually because they are being an ass. It could be a player who insists on being serious in a humorous campaign (or vice versa), or one who complains a lot, or one who doesn't participate much, or just some guy with ban hygiene habits, but there is always a That Guy.

>>13927472

or projecting to threads, there is always a "shit" thread and there are always haters with shitposts like this one:
>>13927465

>>13927472
>>13927464

I'm aware of the trends of an outcast, one too many "that guy/DM/game" threads, let alone experiences.

However, do we consider that it would be certain games to give rise to them on a higher basis? Just because FATAL is a bad game, does that mean that it invariably attracts those of a worse caliber?

The more I think about it, the more that seems plausible, however wouldn't that make a profound comment on certain games and their natures? Or even, certain types of people or players?

>>13927554

No one plays FATAL. So there is no player base.

>>13927554

Not really. I'm sure the people I consider repulsive don't like me all that much either. Games, like all products, are geared to a certain niche. This is not profound, this is to be expected.

>>13927564

I've seen people play FATAL before. I've seen threads about people playing FATAL before.

Never good things said, but it's not un-played. That's besides the point though, substitute FATAL for any sort of game or medium that people dislike. Does that pertain to their dislike, is the question.

>>13927554

it's like vidya games. There are a lot of games for idiots that sometimes normal people play to because why not? But usually they get bored and play something else.
But of course it's a matter of viewpoint.

>>13927602

Overtime though, games or media can create a niche, perhaps one they didn't intend to from the get-go.

The question is, is it the people attracted to them, or the makers capitalizing on it? Thinking about it, it's like a combination of both.

>>13927618

Any game that lasts will have some group of people that like it. Their reasons for liking it will depend on the game, but it takes a very rare example of bad writing for a game to be liked by nobody. When the game's target niche is one that is considered unfavourable by others, you get a "bad game" that is played by "assholes". I put it in quotes because the players of the "bad game" will see ti as a "good game", and will have another group that they consider "assholes".

>>13927653

It does not matter if the creators had one in mind or not, the game will still have a target niche. The target audience might not even be the same as what the creators intended it to be. It will still attract similar people, however. The games niche is based on its intrinsic qualities and how those qualities appeal to certain people, which may or may not be intentional.

>>13927653

well, the reality is always more complex. It's always more then one thing that counts. I mean we can say that the air is 78% nitrogen and 22% oxigen but thats not true there is 1-2% of shitload of things in there. But thats shit nobody cares about and in an everyday discussion you won't go talking about it in depths. Mostly because as I said nobody cares about this

>>13927705

That makes sense. People take it as it comes, in the way it works.

>>13927659

Considering that then, what kind of an effect would such games and players have on a person's opinion of them? Could a perceived notion ever have as much effect as experience?

Because there's a good number of people who dislike certain games, or types of players, despite never having any contact with them. It seems justified from firsthand, but without experience or hearsay, is there any base to it?

>>13927748

most of the guys hate the 4th ed. while never played i. Because its all over the place, hyped like fuck. thats failsafe mode to get a stable hater base. I think it's mostly because the hype affect visibly on the "idiots" mostly. I say visibly because it can affects the "normal" people to, but you don't care about a guy who don't want to argue with you

>In my college English class, for my overall course project I have chosen /tg/ as my ethnography site and subject of my thesis.
>So, as the first bit of research I thought it prudent to conduct a simple starting questionnaire, to get things underway. So I pose the question to the userbase of /tg/;

Since I'm bored I've decided I'm going to fuck with this little project of yours since I'm a damn good troll. I'm going to reply several different times with different responses. This basically means your results and data will be skewed because several responses are all from the same exact guy and I've lied on all of them.

Have a good night.

My gf just read this thread over my shoulder and flipped the fuck out. (She's a PhD student in rhetoric and writing - the sort of non-literature English I bet you're doing...)

My favorite traditional game? As of late, it's Carcassonne, though I play it via my iPhone and not on a table. That app had a very good tutorial system and a wide range of AI opponents (10, I think) to give me a smooth learning curve of more advanced tactics. Even when I lost, I never felt like I got completely destroyed, since the difficulty ramped up so gradually.

As for question 2... it's not so much that I *dislike* miniatures games like 40k, but I find that shit really intimidating. With all the different codices, it's like everyone's playing with different sets of rules. Not only do you have to learn how to play your team, you have to learn what everyone else's team is doing. I suppose if I had friends who were into 40k that I could play just-for-fun casual games with, I'd feel differently, but the prospect of being a complete noob jumping into my local tournament scene just sounds really unpleasant.

I'm curious, OP: What university are you going to? Chances are you're being taught by someone my gf has at least met professionally.

>>13927902
Don't worry, I already did that. Fucking asshole deserves to get his shitty ill founded project thrown out of class. This is not a site you do research on.

>>13927902

That actually won't have any effect on the research, as it's an observational piece on an ethnographic site. I thank your participation though.

---

Well, this turned out to be a thread more productive than I had anticipated, and I thank everyone for their participation. The information collected will prove very useful in the preliminary write up of the site.

The actual intent of the thread was to make clear the intent of the research, and gauge people's responses to it, both good and bad.

As seen, many people contributed productively, while a fair number of people expressed their displeasure. This is what I was looking for, to see the amounts of people that participated and in what way. The trolls cherrypicked from the decent content as it were. Hence the need to use a tripfag name for this thread, to see how that in turn would also polarize people.


Through it all though, we ended up with a good and meaningful conversation about people's preferences and dislikes of games and /tg/-related material and media. This confirms my belief that /tg/ is the optimal board in my experience on which to conduct this research, and the counterpoint board was rightly chosen.

---

So, I'd like to give a huge thank you once more to everyone. You've all been a huge help, and your responses and input will greatly contribute to this preliminary research and writing.

As I've come to expect of /tg/.

>>13927995
You do realize ho goddamn infuriating and presumptuous that entire reply is? You're a prick man. That's all I can say. A goddamn asshole and a cancer.

Please never post again.

>>13928037

I expected as much. Conversely, I also expected only certain people to take offense to it, which also helps the research.

>>13927981

I've always liked the notion that this site is people's secret special, personal club.

Or maybe it's the notion that they could actually be helping someone, that people are against?

>>13927949

UNCC, I doubt we've had the same people.

>>13927902
>>13927981
>>13928037

dear gentlemen: yhbt. very hard.