>>11574230
I throw a rave

>>11574230
I start digging. Stupid primitives and their "curses" aren't going to stop me from getting rich/making the discovery of a lifetime.
(I know what this is from. Always sends a chill down my spine, especially when you look at the monuments planned).

>>11574246
And thus, a 'B' horror movie is born.


Glorious.

>>11574230
Great, we found a nuclear waste dump site.

>>11574246
I suppose you could do that. Though you and your small team are alone and far away from people, music or any kind of recreational substance.

Not a very fun rave.

What is this from?

TIME CUBE IS ALL

>volfings B-Tfn

>>11574284

Inscription on Yucca Mountain

>mclingto I

>>11574284
Today's nuclear waste dump sites. They need to be around for thousands of years, after all.

I objectively point out in my personal notes that not even scientists, social and linguistic experts can make good fanfiction.

>>11574283
Fuck that there I'm ordering Jimmy Johns. A fuckload of Jimmy Johns.

THEY WILL BE HERE IN UNDER A SECOND THE COMMERCIAL SAID SO.

>>11574284
Part of a project to figure how to mark nuclear waste sites for future generations/aliens. let me see if I can find the artwork for it.

Dig and find whatever is this "nothing of value". Obviously they were trying to protect something important.

>>11574318
No, you need to sing the Allstate jingle and your agent will be here in a flash.

I see what you're doing here.

>>11574284
http://books.google.com/books?id=igAAAAAAMBAJ&pg=PA97&lpg=PA97&dq=yucca+mountain+the+dan
ger+is+unleashed+only+if+you+substantially+disturb+this+place+physically.+This+place+is+best+shunned
+and+left+uninhabited.&source=bl&ots=Gbvai6h-8X&sig=5IuxmXO7-JnooMjk73Kt5B--GgM&hl=e
n&ei=LBNeTPiOEYKosQP0nMGqCw&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=2&ved=0CBYQ
6AEwAQ#v=onepage&q=yucca%20mountain%20the%20danger%20is%20unleashed%20only%20if%20you%20substant
ially%20disturb%20this%20place%20physically.%20This%20place%20is%20best%20shunned%20and%20left%20uni
nhabited.&f=false

>>11574332
It's standard misdirection rhetoric. Look at that symbol! Obviously it's an abstract representation of a gem, or three chests around a pillar...perhaps a sarcophagus?

>>11574353
It looks like an angel to me.

>>11574230
I contact Atomic Robo.

>>11574364
Hm...you may have a point there. the yellow triangle looks like an ascending beam of light.

Perhaps we've found a holy site?

Any culture that wouldn't react properly to this is a lost cause anyways, and deserves their well-earned radiation.

>>11574375
i don't care if you grew up reading 8-bit theater, i'm fucking done with it and giving it a shitty ending SO BUY MY COMICS GUYS I MAKE COMICS NOW EVERYONE COME TO MY GAME-CON AND BUY COMICS I MADE PLEASE GIVE ME YOUR MONEY I EARNED IT

>>11574387

During the days of Saddam, Iraqis ate poisoned rice with that symbol on the bags because in Iraq that symbol does not mean death.

>torivie Joseph

>>11574417
New! Pirate Rice! Its fantastic matey!

>>11574428

It turned out the rice sent by the humanitarian groups to assist, but Saddam hit it with some bioagent. The groups put that symbol on it, and tossed the bags out. However, since that symbol was unknown to Iraq, Saddam put his best trollface on and passed it to the populace.

>consmays to

>>11574401
you're butthurt. over 8-bit theater. I'm not saying I never get butthurt over silly things but in those cases I usually remind myself to pick my battles.

>>11574428
Seems pretty delicious to me.

>>11574464
i'm not butthurt, you are :) i was well over it by the time I posted, and now you're continuing the conversation! mad much? :)

>>11574401
I havent been to his site since 8-bit ended. Is he really getting like that? Because i've been enjoying the comic books since they came out.
You seem to have taken the webcomic's passing rather hard. Do you want to talk about it?

>>11574464
>>11574487
>>11574492
Less webcomic bitchery, more discussing what to do with this site.

I think there's treasure here. Why else would they go to these lengths to keep us away?

>>11574230
Right. So I put some warning signs, inform the local government that some expendables should probably check that out and would they kindly send me pictures thankyouverymuchithinkmyplaneisboarding.

>>11574401
Yes, heaven forbid anyone actually gets someplace in their chosen profession. Christ man, get a grip.

>>11574520
"This place is not a place of honor."

I'm intrigued by this!

>>11574492
No, he isn't getting like that. Naturally he talks about the projects he's on and stuff he's up, but why wouldn't he?

I haven't read Atomic Robo yet, but it seems likely that I will eventually once I'm caught up on other things.

Anyway. I've decided that this little piece, and my vision of the archaeologist running off, is going to be a hook for my Shadowrun game. Doesn't get any more expendable than that.

>>11574230
fukken mine it! must be something very valuable down there

>>11574548
It's all just reverse psychology. Look at these spikes, who would go to that effort for nothing?

>>11574520

I dunno, there IS that constantly repeating posted warning that they carved clean through blocks of solid stone. And the first few of our slave teams we have doing exploratory digs have started showing signs of wasting diseases.

I say we leave it the hell alone.

>>11574621
I say we send more in.

>>11574609
I find these giant spikes very soothing.

>>11574629
I'm not sure. I mean, my slaves are losing their hair and throwing up blood. They also won't stop shaking.
I, for one, am not wasting any more.
It was probably cursed by wizards.

>>11574658
They're already dying, might as well use them up first. I mean, those wizards must have been protecting something very valuable to go to all this trouble.

DYNAMITE EVERYWHERE.

Those ancients were hiding candy. I demand their sweetmeats.

>>11574658

Then I shall have mine dig, it obviously houses a weapon with which I can end all before me.

>>11574629

Fine, but they're coming from YOUR slave pool. And no more trained specialists. Acquisitions is down 10% this month on their impressment numbers; it appears the Mexos have caught on, and have started attacking the "Holy Pilgrimages".

>>11574666
They can no longer stand up.
What, you think I didn't try that? We should have been tipped off by the foot of lead.

>>11574658
Here's what we do. Get some new slaves, pick a spot to start then place them at 100 foot intervals and just have them sit there for several hours a day. Once we find the doesn't get ill distance we have clerics positioned there to periodically heal them.

>>11574621
I say it's no wonder you're still leading a slave team with an attitude like that.

Listen, I have a good feeling about this one. All these walls and attempts to drive us off with their dark architecture? They're hiding something.

To show how confident I am, I'm going to use some of that explodium I've been saving. That'll get past the barriers in the earth.

>>11574717
How exactly do you plan on getting through the thick layers of ancient witch-metal?

>>11574717
...You saved some of that explodium? I thought you used it all.

Hey, wait a minute. Is your explodium sweating?

>>11574717
Perhaps... perhaps we should all start migrating upwind of this operation. I'll leave a light on for you guys once I'm far enough away to feel safe.

>>11574692
What if the sorcery is like the Orange Plague? What if it can be carried, or is spread by wind?

>>11574757
Pah, plagues are not of energy! The warning would have mentioned the winds if it could be transmitted thus.

>>11574717

Let me get this straight: you're going to use some of our rare explodium to blow up a hole in a trackless waste, a waste that makes men sick no less, that you might find treasure that may or may not be there? And you're going to do this when the Children of Moroni are hitting trade caravans, and when we might have to send Reavers to conduct impressments?

You would've been left on the Ending Stone, had your father not been a Councilor.

>>11574731
You weren't here for the cave-in in the Ancient's worm-tunnels were you? Explodium can get through whatever trickery they

>>11574732
A little bit goes a long way. And I have a good handful or so still here. Think how far we'll go on that!

I'll have a slave check the box soon.

>>11574738
And I'll be right behind you. Better safe and profiting than dead!

perhaps we can bombard it from above? i'm sure the arch-inheritor would spare a skyship for the promise of riches untold...

>>11574773
This is a spell of the Old Peoples! They flew like birds, and could kill with pieces of the sun! Their power is unmatched, and unknown. You cannot know how it works.
And what if the God-King finds out? He worships them, just like the tribals!

>>11574820
The God-King is a fool; if we harness the gifts these Old People have left us.. we could surpass him a million times over!

>>11574801
And let me get this straight: after all we've done to get to this trackless waste (filled with work of the Ancients) an all the work our slave teams have done to move the not-rocks and stones, you would give up and return to the nearest oasis without even a peek?

Why did we come here, if not to discover what they held so dearly?

>>11574828
You had best not let the Padre hear you speak that way. Do what you will, but I, for one, will be watching from a safe distance, you blasphemous madman.

I think this is what they wanted yucca mountain to look like

>>11574868
How could spikes like those survive for 10000 years, I wonder.

>>11574864
Hah, fool! That's just it; this 'blasphemy' is merely the path to greatness! I will take the first step that others fear to!

>>11574894
They couldn't with current materials.

http://www.vanderbilt.edu/AnS/Anthro/Anth101/wipp.html

>>11574820
Ah yes, "flight" and "sun-bombs". The magical abilities of the Old People allegedly stemming from their unmatched power. We have dismissed that claim.
You are a superstitious fool. This power shall be ours, and you shall not have it.

>>11574864
Then he'd have to deal with the Padre, not the God-King. Because only if the God-King heard what has been said could the God-King do anything.

>>11574914
Indeed, brother. Get the tools, we're opening this tomb up!

>>11574937
>>11574933
The Inquisition will hear of this. You will pay for your treachery.

>>11574972
They'll not hear of it from you! My knife has long awaited this day...

>>11574828

The God-King is a fool with many zealots. Let HIM poison his thralls chasing what might be.

>>11574851

We've recovered many tons of lead, and some fine dressed blocks of their not-rock. We'll profit well by this... unless you keep feeding slaves to the hole in the ground. Do you not remember the Old Ones' parable, where they tried to travel to the Star of the War God? Even with all their knowledge, it still earned them nothing but death. Pursuit beyond reason is folly.

>>11574972
The Inquisition is a room of withered cowards who cannot provide for themselves and leech off the work of brave and strong prospectors as ourselves.

The Inquisition will hear of this when we ride back to the towns, richer than any have seen.

>>11574983
You... *cough*... fool. I will... watch... from the field.... of the Ancient's Ascension... as you are struck down.

>>11574990
You can leave with your share of the lead and not-rocks and slaves, while I will stay behind with those that wish to see this through.

>>11575018
Burn the tribal's corpse. I will take half his slaves.

oh god i love you /tg/

Why didn't they say anything interesting.
like, OUR GREAT AND POWERFUL WRATH DEMANDS YOU NEVER STEP FOOT INSIDE OUR SACRED FORTRESS, LEST OUT MIGHT DRAIN ALL LIFE FROM YOUR FRAIL BODY.

I mean really, if you wanna sound terrifying, do it. Don't write some shit in languages that are gonna end up obsolete.

>>11575050
Yes, brother. Not even his bones will remain.

>>11575065
From what I've read, the plan would be for new signs to be added as languages changed and the site maintained until nobody was around/able to any longer.

>>11575055
I know what new setting I want to run a game in!

>>11575065
Well, if they said that, we would know something great was in there. They sound more imploring than commanding. They sound almost sad.

>>11575098
Exactly. Read the link posted up a few posts. If they make the place look important, it'll attract people and eventually somebody would disturb the site. The intent is to create an area that endures and gets across the message "Nothing of any worth is here. This is not a place to stay at."

>>11575116
But something like that seems like reverse psychology at it's best to me. "there is nothing of value here" Yeah. Sure.

i like the idea of a caste of keepers to watch over the forsaken ground and stop intruders from disturbing the horrible ancient power that lies beneath.
inb4 near-future automated security robots slaughtering prospectors in the distant future.

Continue digging until the center is split, resulting in a catastrophic destruction of this world. Remnants of this world fly off, colliding with other worlds and repeating the process until a controlling factor is met.

Meanwhile, on a larger scale, scientists watch from a distance as the Trinity nuclear test progresses.

the primary message to be conveyed is one of danger.
just danger.
not threat, because that sounds like protection of riches.

>>11575155
Yeah, it would probably work much better with "There's something of great value here", because then people would think "Naah, they be joking"

>>11575159
Something like that was suggested by Thomas Sebok, called the "atomic priesthood." It has more cons than pros, in my opinion. Lifted from Wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nuclear_semiotics)

"Similar to the Catholic church - which has preserved and authorized its message over 2000 years - the atomic priesthood had to preserve the knowledge about locations and dangers of radioactive waste by creating rituals and myths. The priesthood would indicate no-go-areas and the consequences of nonobservance.

This approach contains a number of critical issues that let one doubt about its effectiveness:

1. The more contingencies an atomic priesthood has to cope with the bigger gets its influence.
2. The system of information relais favors the creation of hierarchies.
3. Those who split the message in independent parts would be able to use it to discriminate certain kinds of addressees.
4. The knowledge of a location of radioactive waste grants power. Humans are inclined to have power privileges, even information privileges."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nuclear_semiotics

>>11575034

Fine. I leave for City-Atop-The-Mountain. If you're not there within a fortnight of my arrival, I will continue on to Jewel-Of-The-Desert, where I will have one drink to mark your passage onward, and another to celebrate the end of your idiot line. Water and riches.

>>11575173

((So, the plot of Final Fantasy: Spirits Within?))

>>11575213
Is that some "A Canticle for Leibowitz" I see?

>>11575230
It was said that God, in order to test mankind which had become swelled with pride as in the time of Noah, had commanded the wise men of that age, among them the Blessed Leibowitz, to devise great engines of war such as had never before been upon the Earth, weapons of such might that they contained the very fires of Hell, and that God had suffered these magi to place the weapons in the hands of princes, and to say to each prince: "Only because the enemies have such a thing have we devised this for thee, in order that they may know that thou hast it also, and fear to strike. See to it, m'Lord, that thou fearest them as much as they shall now fear thee, that none may unleash this dread thing which we have wrought." But the princes, putting the words of their wise men to naught, thought each to himself: If I but strike quickly enough, and in secret, I shall destroy these others in their sleep, and there will be none to fight back; the earth shall be mine.
Such was the folly of princes, and there followed the Flame Deluge.

>>11575224
And I and whoever stays behind will use some of the explodium to clear the rubble. If it is as you say a folly, I will accept your judgment and hurry to reach the caravan. Keep an eye tailward for a white signal rocket.

If I am right, I shall meet you at Jewel-Of-the-Desert to unload my riches upon the markets there. Then I shall buy you a drink, then found my own caravan.

>>11575263
And the demon Fallout.

>>11575285
And I will found an army to wipe the God-King from the face of the Earth. No more shall those of the Moon lord over us.

>>11575292

And the Troll Country that is No Mutants Allowed.

>vathoust 1956

I now want to see a game of postapocalyptic scavengers and traders running caravans from town to city to ruins and back again. It'd be a combination of RPG for the caravan leaders doing their indivdual things (exploring ruins, doing business in the city, whatever) and wargame elements when it came to managing the caravan/its resources and battle between groups.

Fuuuck, this thread makes me wanna play some fallout3

>>11575322
Perhaps now we can discover the tombs of Aria SI and steal the power of their dead captive god.

>>11575285

If you are right, you're buying me that brown-eyed dancing slave at Luxor, and I will stand in the Grand Plaza, rend my robes, proclaim my Sin of Doubt, and accept the lash.

You'll note I don't look worried.

>>11575354
Alright. Allow the fool to leave, then set off the explodium.
We are going to be rich!

What you need to do is have something not dangerous porotected and their do that when people find it they get bored and leave

>>11575213

Sounds like Empire of the Atom. Not a bad short novel, all things considered.

Synopsis: Post-apocalyptic solar system with space travel and atomic power, but medieval weaponry and horrible mutations from radiation.

How is a skull not considered a universal symbol of death or danger?

It's human remains. It will always be what is left when we die. We instinctively fear our corpses.

>>11575552
I've always wanted to go forward in time, take my skull, and use it as decoration/possibly a webcam.
Not everyone.

>>11575552
Not necessarily true. I can't think of specific examples now, but there are/were societies that engaged in ritual cannibalism, or would regularly unearth and clean off their ancestors' remains.

And who's to say that following populations would keep the same values regarding the dead and their remains that we do?

>>11575552

Because it can also be used as a power symbol. For a society that reveres the dead, it's a marker for wisdom, power, magicks, a boon. If it makes dead, you could conceivably use it to make someone ELSE dead. They're trying to dispel even the thought that it can be harnessed, to instill the understanding that it hurts all who go near it.

NOBODY associates someone wasting away, from disease or famine, with anything good or positive.

>>11575552
the fact that cultures have taken them as trophies, and used them as symbols of power as well.

It's a power that is sometimes taken as a sign of strength and the fear they inspire. Nazis wore the Totenkopf for this reason. And because of this, we can't be sure it wouldn't be taken as a challenge of courage, daring others to enter, or a hollow threat meant to scare someone away from something of value.

The problem with the project is the thing we are trying to convey is much the same of the Pharoah's Curse in Egypt. I mean, yes, it is literally the case here, but look how well it worked on the lower Nile region. Even if they actually don't find anything of worth in the tomb of the atom, the same information might well dare them to continue.

Enjoy your Necrons /tg/

>>11575628
>NOBODY associates someone wasting away, from disease or famine, with anything good or positive.

Unless one stands to benefit from it happening to somebody else. The design of the site has to convey that NOTHING good can come of the place and to not ever linger long enough to try something.

>>11575635
>The problem with the project is the thing we are trying to convey is much the same of the Pharoah's Curse in Egypt. I mean, yes, it is literally the case here, but look how well it worked on the lower Nile region. Even if they actually don't find anything of worth in the tomb of the atom, the same information might well dare them to continue.

Hopefully the containment method for the waste will be secure and nearly impossible to breach without sufficiently advanced tools. At which point presumably said intruders would be able to detect radiation and understand its dangers, regardless of what our signs said.

Somebody needs to archive this thread RFN.

>>11575861
Where? It won't last on suptg's archives probably.

>>11575338
Been doing some thinking on this. But drawing a blank. Mostly because I focus on relatively unimportant things like tech level and currencies.

Anyone know what they'd like to see/do in a PostApoc Merchant/Traveler RPG/Wargame?

>>11575778

That's generally the idea. Design the casks so that you'll need advanced metallurgy just to crack the damn thing. And if you develop computer-controlled pneumatic tools but not Geiger counters... Well, I feel bad for ya, son.

As to the design side, they might be served well by designing the containment to look PHYSICALLY restraining, as though we're intending to PHYSICALLY prevent something from getting out AT US. Make it look like a fortress or a vault, they'll wonder what we're trying to keep people away from. Make it look like a prison, they might get the hint that we're trying to keep IT away from people.

>>11575940
Check the link here if you haven't: >>11574913

It's a study about how best to do this. They go into things like not putting things in the center (because that makes it seem important/worth something) or not using clean, smooth craftsmanship (implying this is a place we cared about and liked). Interesting read.

>>11575990

I read the design doc years ago. Agreed, it's an interesting study in the manipulation of human psychology. Still, I think our curious nature will prove our undoing. We need to focus on making it impossible to brute force. That's really all we CAN do. All the warnings in the world mean nothing when the audience isn't guaranteed to behave with rational self-interest.

>>11576053
Gotcha. With our current construction skills and materials, not much we can do beyond come up with ways to convince people not to dig. Until we learn to make diamond vaults or something.

>>11575940
I'm liking that idea.

What about coffins?
They've remained relatively unchanged for the whole of human history, starting with wood, working our way up to marble, and basically just moving between the two. We recognize coffins from thousands of years ago, seems like a fairly universal symbol for death. Hell, strap some fake bodies in and you've got yourself something that I, for one, would want to get away from.

>>11576100
Sounds like somebody's never heard of grave robbers!

If there's bodies, someone sooner or later is going to want to dig them up to a)Loot them b)Use them/their coffins for parts c)Bury them somewhere else (gotta save them souls) d)Remove them to use the land.

Not to mention they'd have to disturb the land to get to them, which would stir up any leaked radiation/compromise the protective measures in place. And would mean increasing the risk of exposure sooner or later.

Or the fact that coffins might not even be used ~10000 years from now; they didn't use coffins in the Neolithic and that was a few thousand years ago; who's to say what will happen in the future?

>>11576097
you're suggesting that we make something we want people to stay away from out of diamonds. Are you serious?

>>11576273

Why not? If it's made out of diamonds it doesn't matter how much they want it, they can't get at it until they have the technology level to be able to say 'no, wait, that's a nuclear waste dump.' It's also going to be more practical than a metal-built dump if it's built at a time with practical and safe nanoassemblers available.

>>11576097

We've got stuff you can hit with a jet plane, stuff you can't open the top of unless you're torquing six bolts in two directions at the exact same time. Which, incidentally, is the stuff we're using. You make it resilient enough that you're not getting to it no matter how many times you hit it with a rock or an axe or drop it off a cliff, and complex enough that by the time you have the tools to do it, you have the tools to determine that it's a very, very bad idea.

>>11576273
That or some other similarly hard material. Not the whole area, just the underground storage for the waste casks.

But yeah, that is something of a stupid idea. Blame it on too little sleep.

>Ultimately, the decision for the WIPP markers was motivated by cost-effectiveness. Current plans call for the area over the waste storage panels to be outlined by "earthen berms," which is another way of saying "large piles of dirt." These berms will be jagged in shape and will radiate out from a central, generally square area. The jagged nature of the berms is meant to convey a sense of foreboding, and the exact size, shape, and configuration of the berms will be such that they will not quickly be eroded or covered. The four corner berms will be higher than the others to provide vantage points to see the area as a whole. Inside the corner berms will also be buried concrete rooms containing highly detailed information, such as maps, the periodic table, and astronomical charts indicating the date that the facility was sealed. This data will be engraved upon stone slabs which are too large to be removed from the rooms' entrances.

>Inside of the square arrangement of berms, multiple granite "message kiosks" will be engraved with more basic information describing the site's contents. This text will be provided in all of the official UN languages and Navajo (the local indigenous language). Additionally, space will be left on the kiosks for a future generation to inscribe the message in another language. The granite surfaces will be protected by a concrete "mother" wall, and the messages will be placed up high to prevent them from being defaced or buried by the desert sand.

>Lastly, the berms and the area they surround will be peppered with underground "time capsules" at varying depths. These clay, ceramic, glass, and aluminum oxide disks will be inscribed with warning information, and may contain samples of wood to allow a future society to date the markers using carbon-14 dating.

Information kiosks!

>>11576376
Damn. I was hoping they'd go with the big blocks of obsidian instead.

Still that does sound pretty impressive. Almost makes me wish I lived in 9000AD so I could see it.

Seriously. I would have drawn a friggen field with the hands and arms of skeletons reaching out of it, strangling the foolish and unawary traveler. Thatd keep some bitches away.

>French authors Francois Bastide and Paolo Fabbri propose the breeding of so called radiation cats. Cats have been domesticated for thousands of years and most certainly will be in the future. These radiation cats should change significantly in color when they get in contact with radioactive emissions and serve as living warning indicators. In order to transport the message, the cats should be braced in the collective awareness through fairy tales and myths. This can be reached through poetry, music and painting.

Radioactive cats? I thought it was supposed to be radioactive crows...

/tg/....

YOU AM PLAYGODS!

>>11576376
How do we stop people from digging? By leaving time capsules for them to dig up! BRILLIANT!

>>11576448
That's nothing compared to Stanislaw Lem's Idea:

>Polish science-fiction author Stanisław Lem >proposes the creation of artificial satellites which will >transmit information from the orbit to Earth for >millennia. Furthermore, he proposes a biological >coding of the DNA in a mathematical sense which >would reproduce itself automatically. Practical, >Information Plants which only grow near a terminal >storage site shall inform about the dangers. The >DNA of the so called atomic flowers shall contain the >necessary data about the location and its content.

>Here the question remains, who will recognize the >meaning of the atomic flowers in 10000 years and if >it is worth to decoding their DNA.

Because if there's one thing humans know to stay away from, it's colorful flowers.

>>11576497

If you have the knowledge base to decode the DNA of flowers into a message you translate from a new language you've probably figured out by now that that shit there's radioactive.

>>11576476

That keeps them digging in the berm. If I'm recalling the site map correctly, you're leaving tantalizing things for them to dig up and try to wrap their brains around in multiple locations, so that hopefully they'll get around to grokking it before they go digging up every square inch.

Personally, I'd bury one of the info caches directly above the storage vault, about ten yards underground. Then you'd go another twenty yards down, you'd hit several yards of concrete and lead, and THEN you'd hit the vault.

>>11576523
"Sir, the readings have come in! That area holds radioactive materials!"

"Are you sure? We'd better double-check. Start decoding the genetics of the flowers nearby, just in case they have something to say."

>>11575761

Necrons wouldn't warn people away. Their shit would say "Knock loudly, meatbags, and see what happens"

satbus 3D

>>11574230
sounds like a radioactive material placed underneath alot of lead-filled earth.

Why don't they just try and make the site look like nothing was buried there. When a site is filled up, just cover up the entrance and carve/mold it to look like the mountain side. Still have your mother load of lead just encase some one wants to look for coal there.

>>11576160
Kinda forgot about this thread.
But the coffins above ground. More as markers than anything.
Grave robbers only tend to rob things when people are wealthy/have tons of expensive looking decoration. The only decoration these'll have would be warning labels.

>>11574913
This is fascinating.
Also kind of depressing, that this is our great legacy.

>>11576872
Okay, but what happens if the containment systems fail and you have a happy little community over a bunch of radioactive waste.

Or when somebody comes digging and disturbs the site and damages the containment. Or they have no idea what's there and do something like blow the mountaintop off or something.

You want to keep people away so none of that happens.

>>11576896
Still have the issue that coffins aren't and won't be a universal symbol of "stay away, radiation/bad things here." Not everyone uses coffins today, they didn't thousands of years ago and there is no guarantee they will thousands of years from now.

And it isn't just wealth and riches that people could loot graves for. The coffins themselves. Depending how big and what they're made of, they could be used as coffins (somebody in our group died, here's a convenient spot!), storage, broken down for their components.

Look at the design doc. It calls for things like spikes coming from the ground, black cubes and giant earthworks. None of those can be used for a practical purpose, their meaning isn't culture-specific and they're a tad more imposing/unnerving.

You also have to keep in mind this is something that will be here for tens of thousands of years. Humans might not be the only ones visiting and any alien visitors are not going to understand why coffins=radioactive waste storage.

>>11577020

If they're capable of interstellar travel, they damn sure better have a Geiger counter analogue. Or be made of something that ignores GRB, high energy particles, and other Really Bad Things.

>>11577054
True. My point still stands that coffins are an odd choice for a warning.

>In this discussion and then later in the descriptions of the designs that test these design guidelines we will use the expression "the Keep" to define an area whose size and shape is the "footprint" or the vertical projection on the site's surface of the final interment area.

The nerdy connotations amuse me, but I suppose it is a choice word for something like this.

Just chilling, the way that thing is written. Made right now but it already has an ancient feel.

Poit!

>>11576376
>These berms will be jagged in shape and will radiate out from a central, generally square area. The jagged nature of the berms is meant to convey a sense of foreboding, and the exact size, shape, and configuration of the berms will be such that they will not quickly be eroded or covered. The four corner berms will be higher than the others to provide vantage points to see the area as a whole. Inside the corner berms will also be buried concrete rooms containing highly detailed information, such as maps, the periodic table, and astronomical charts indicating the date that the facility was sealed. This data will be engraved upon stone slabs which are too large to be removed from the rooms' entrances.

So in other words, we've littered the site with monuments that could have busied many slaves, with vantage points for overseers, and with many rooms containing very expensive, stone-carved tables of scientific knowledge.

If they don't think they've found Nixon's Pyramid, they'll think they've found an old military test ground. Either way, it's an archaeologist's mother lode.

>>11581628
And hopefully they dig around the outside before going for the inside, so they figure out they shouldn't poke much further.

Also the whole area leading up to the earthworks will be littered in signs saying to go back and why, with a progression of languages from newer inwards to older.
Glad to see this thread's still around.

>>11576376
Personally, when I see information kiosks, I think: tourist attraction!

Am I the only one who thinks this is a bad idea? Just leave the site unguarded, barren, and completely indistinguishable from the surrounding desert. The damn poison's dug deep enough. They wont dig that deep.

>>11576405

I felt the Forbidding Blocks thing was cooler as well. It's just more intimidating than a bunch of earthworks, and given the desert climate it makes the whole area even more inhospitable than it might otherwise be.

As a modification, I'd have the walls of the alleys between the cubes moulded/carved with sequential images of a human figure sickening and dying in agony and despair as they walked then crawled towards the centre.

This whole facility would be an awesome element in a far-future post-apoc game. Curious adventurers explore these remnants of the People Before, venturing into a not-city of cyclopean stone blocks, turn a corner to be confronted with depictions of someone dying of terminal radiation poisoning.

And that's before they even encounter the radiation lich who lairs in the ancient waste storage chambers far below.

>>11585997
>This whole facility would be an awesome element in a far-future post-apoc game.
In the unlikely event I ever end up running a post-apoc LARP, I'll definitely be setting up the Forbidding Blocks as a set piece (in spraypainted foam,not Obsidian). It'd be interesting to see how many people figure out the meaning without any of the obvious trefoil symbolism.

>>11586111

Bearing in mind that each of those blocks are fucking huge (25' on a side, with 5' gaps between), that'd be some insanely impressive set-design.

>>11585573
Who's "they?" And why wouldn't they dig? What if somebody's building there, prospecting for minerals/loot, digging for the hell of it? You can't assume just because the place is ugly nobody's going to visit; a few thousand years is enough for the climate to change or somebody to decide they want to dig a shelter there.

>>11586111
That sounds awesome and you are awesome for wanting to do that. See how many people decide "gotta be something useful here. Dig!"

Why not fill the place with physics data, and then have a bunch of questions with a plea to not disturb the area UNTIL the discoverers can answer the questions.

One would assume that the physics lessons alone would be enough to electrify any civilisation, and by the time they had digested the meaning they would know to stay the fuck away.

>>11586270

Throw some thatching and animal skins on top, sounds like a perfect place to camp!

>>11586301
You want to put valuable information and a reason to stick around on top of a nuclear waste dump. How is that going to be safe?

Look, if our descendants are in such a hurry to dig so greedily and so deep, they deserve what they get.

>>11586366
Fuck the future. What have they ever done for us?

This seems familiar to me...

>dig deep
>strike mithril
>discover that it's an ancient demon cage and we just cracked it open
>BOATMURDER BOATMURDER BOATMURDER

>>11586430
You know what DF needs? The ability to hide things in abandoned forts so you could hand off the save to somebody else and watch them reclaim and try to discover the secrets of your construction.

Then you get shit like not knowing what a lever does (does it deactivate the still-running spikes in the main corridor, or irrigate those rooms we found?) or where things even are (discovering a great hall where your farms were going to be).

I'd imagine it'd be like the caverns and HFS; you don't know where they are until you find them.

Obviously, slade is the ancient remnant of nuclear waste dumps.

>This place is a message… and part of a system of messages… pay attention to it!

>Sending this message was important to us. We considered ourselves to be a powerful culture.

>Some ignored the message... all died.

>To save yourself... and receive great power and prosperity... you must make ten places important to your people into the message.

>>11587663
>To save yourself... and receive great power and prosperity... you must make ten places important to your people into the message
>you must make ten places important to your people into the message

This ancient tongue is undecipherable. I don't understand a word of thisl.

I would laugh at the primitives and harvest the valuable radionuclides they foolishly discarded as "waste" to fuel my star cruiser.

>>11587663
>This place is a message… and part of a system of messages… pay attention to it!

>Sending this message was important to us. We considered ourselves to be a powerful culture.

>Some ignored the message... all died.

>To save yourself... and receive great power and prosperity... you must make ten places important to your people into the message.

>If you do not heed this message... the demon Radiation that dwells here... will slay you all by a wasting sickness in two weeks.

>If you pass it on... all our power is yours.

>>11587694
Missing nothing. It's a chain-letter.

>>11587730
A chain what?

>>11587730
Or, as it is termed in anthropology, a "religion".

Image is what they should paint inside the vault facing the door after they seal it off.

>>11587864
I can't imagine this accomplishing anything. Even if our retarded offspring DID understand it.

...and 200 years from now British Plutonium digs all the waste up and reprocesses it, bitching all the while about 21st century ignorance and superstition.

>pubmal urban

Oi!

bump

>riffse Survival

>>11586354

The waste itself is hundreds of metres below the ground. Living on top of it would probably be OK. And as mentioned, the physics lessons would be tailored to teach future generations about WHY the stuff buried beneath is dangerous.

STRIKE THE EARTH!

>>11592766
Urist cancels Carve Up/Down Stairway: irradiated.

If there is anything there, someone, sometime, is going to go in, regardless of warnings. Better to bury everything as deep as possible and collapse the entry shaft. Preferably in the middle of a desert. Or the ocean floor.

Or make a fake 'treasure' room so that anyone who thinks they should find something finds it.

>>11593132
It's thousands of years man. You can't know a desert will still be a desert. And the ocean floor would be far too expensive.

A final message before the last seal needs to be written, something like:

-----------------------------------
You have come this far.

You have either not seen, or not heeded our warnings

If you open this last gateway, there is a fail-safe, it is intended for your safety

It is a red circle behind the blue rock at the entrance, use it to seal this place once again, after you discover your mistake.

Good luck, move quickly.
------------------

The last door should also open freely, so it doesn't get blowup.

>>11593285
Egypt tried that, in many cases they figured it out.

You know what?

This would be a pretty funny thing to do with a bunch of DnD players.

Have them discover something like this. Have them dig. Have them find radioactive goo. Then 3 months later BAM cancer. Better get on some powerful juju there.

>>11594969
Well I'm sure we can think of a better way to hide it than the ancient egyptians.

>>11594969

You could put something actually valuable in the fake treasure room. They come in, get the shiny and leave without venturing deeper/

>>11595094
Or maybe not even have a "treasure room" in the first place? The idea is to keep people out, not digging deeper.

>>11592635
>Living on top of it would probably be OK.
Until an accident or geological event happens that releases toxins.

>the physics lessons would be tailored to teach future generations about WHY the stuff buried beneath is dangerous.

By which point they're going to either get overconfident (we know what it is and how to handle it!) or something like that.

And again, you'd have a population living above this thing. Because if you make those educational materials removable then your plan is done once somebody leaves with them.

>>11595197
Yes, because treasure hunters/archeologists are going to just take the shiny stuff sitting on the table and not think "Maybe there's more."

>>11595201
Nuclear waste sites are genrally situated in geologically stable stratifys. They, for example, stick them in salt beds because salt will flow and seal itself if it faults.

This thread makes me want to DM a game of Mutant.

Make for a nice change of pace from the usual terror-bots and lethal stuff.

Just miles of wastelands and a giant pile of rocks covered in carvings of dying people.

Archived this, it's more than worthy. Let's vote it up!

>>11598187
voted but not sure how long it will stick around.

Anyways, been thinking on and off about a caravan-based game. There's two scales in it: Personal and Caravan (name change soon). The first focuses on the leaders and heroes of a caravan train/other group. Caravan scale is more like a wargame and simulation; the units are Hirelings and the leaders and abstracted into leader units.

Fluff's kind of vague so this can be used as postapoc trading and scavenging, Silk Road gameplay or wagon trains in space.

>>11598280
Personal Scale characters are the Player Characters. So far I have the following characteristics:
Physical:
-Muscle; physical strength
-Endurance: health and grit
-Agility: reflexes
Mental:
-Cunning; Quickness of mind and tongue.
-Education; Book learning and past experience
-Intelligence: Not sure...might replace with something else.

Under each Characteristic would be a handful of skills. Not sure how many yet since I'm not sure the mechanics either.

>>11595256
That's the damn point make the treasure hard to find. But make the actual waste next to impossible to even tell it's there.

>>11598280
Why wouldn't it stick around? Setting discussions are prime archive material, and it's already at +2.

So what will the purpose of your game be? Just to get rich? Uncover artifacts? Just explore the world?

>>11574230
I have either a robot or a bunch of people who I don't give a shit about excavate and catalog the site.

Also, I'm pretty sure that we're dealing with exactly this problem when we try to figure out how to keep people the hell away from our radioactive waste disposal sites for the next ten millennia.

>>11598386
So...provide an incentive to dig around the nuclear waste and reward exploration where there shouldn't be any? All right then.

>>11598402
If supgtg does regular purges like the big one they just did, this one might be too much discussion, not enough content. I'll be optimistic though.

Not sure what the idea behind this game is. Leaning towards a kitchen sink approach were either every player has their own share in a caravan and all are vying for profit and fame and use Hireling extensively, or something closer to Traveller where it's one group of different people relying on themselves.

>>11598427
It's better to do that than make an obvious monument AND not make a treasure room. It's not like you're gonna advertise the treasure room, it's suppost to throw people off.

>>11598482
Now I'm getting into "make it up as a I go along" territory. In order to simplify conversions between Personal/Hireling scale, both will use Traits. In Personal Scale these are things like A Friendly Face (+ to social interaction) or Handy with a Blade (+ with bladed weapons) and Not Welcome Here (- to interaction in an area, be it a town or country).

Hirelings would get a watered-down version of Traits which would encompass whole sets of skills and abilities. For example, Conscripts are the generic, cheap fighting unit; they get low Characteristics and Traits like Poorly Trained (bad combat skills) and Cowardly (horrible morale). Ideally this would let you convert your PC to a Hireling-scale for wargame scenarios. And vice versa if you add a new player and decide he/she comes from the ranks of the caravan.

Let's assume that we are the laborers that are cracking open this vault. I assume that the radiation would be completely contained by the layers and layers of defenses, but once we break those down what happens? Nuclear waste is sealed in oil drums and stacked in old mine shafts, right? So we would have to open up the cans in order to get the radiation out? And presuming we do, how long do we have to live? It takes, what, 50,000 rads to kill you instantly, IIRC.

>>11598623
I'm betting there will be some ambient radiation from leakage by the time the vault is breached, from decay if not the way we open up the place.

If we just went in, looked around and got out? We'd probably live. But going in and handling things and opening them? Quality of life is going to drop fast.

>>11598623
at Chernobyl the liquidators wore lead armor and only went up on the roof to clear debris for 10 seconds apiece. Within a year a third were dead

>>11598880
But that was a still-hot (radioactive-wise) reactor, not a site filled with sealed and processed waste. Also there's issues of Chernobyl workers tampering with their meters so they can work longer and earn more.

For now I'm running with a d100/d10 system. Should make conversion easier between scales. Hirelings have 4 Tiers for now too.
-Unskilled: 0 Positive Traits, 1 Negative Trait
-Rookie: 1 Positive Trait
-Skilled: 2 Positive Trait
-Veteran:3 Positive Trait
-Expert: 4 Positive Trait

Hirelings can also take extra Negatives, but not sure if they'd give bonus traits or what yet.

Hirelings are also divided into Combat and Support categories. The first one's obvious; the second one covers things like craftsmen, doctors and drivers. They may be able to fight, but not well.

bump

>>11598623

Dying instantly of radiation, in any case, is comparatively rare and not very well understood. People have received obscene doses (some magnitudes in excess of "instantly lethal" doses) of radiation to the upper body and survived for days in some cases.

Oh. Eh. I just found this during my research.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radioactive_waste_dumping_by_the_%27Ndrangheta

Yes. It's as bad as it sounds.

>>11601145
Only case I can think of that's close is the firemen who responded to the Chernobyl explosion. They all received fatal doses in minutes and died in days.

There's not many ways to get an instantly fatal dose of radiation without dying of secondary effects (like say an explosion) first.

>>11601338
Oh wow. It's like something out of Captain Planet.

>>11601339

I'm positive I read an article in a scientific journal; a worker was exposed to something around 100,000 - 200,000 rem to the head and upper body and survived for a few days. Back in the sixties, I think. (Had to be back a while, nobody really uses rem anymore)
Can't remember any names, though.

>>11601379
Oh wow indeed.

>>11601420

there's also a russian scientist, head of faculty, in one of the universities who slipped and stuck their head in the path of some similar insanely high radiation field, and survived.

Found it:
Anatoli Bugorski

2,000-3000 rads equivalent to the head.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anatoli_Bugorski

lucky, lucky bastard.

>>11601494
Reportedly, he saw a flash "brighter than a thousand suns", but did not feel any pain. The beam measured about 2,000 gray when it entered Bugorski's skull, and about 3,000 gray when it exited after colliding with the inside of his head.

After the accident The left half of Bugorski's face swelled up beyond recognition, and over the next several days started peeling off, showing the path that the proton beam (moving near the speed of light) had burned through parts of his face, his bone, and the brain tissue underneath. As it was believed that about 5 to 6 grays is enough to kill a person, Bugorski was taken to a clinic in Moscow where the doctors could observe his expected demise. However, Bugorski survived and even completed his Ph.D. There was virtually no damage to his intellectual capacity, but the fatigue of mental work increased markedly. Bugorski completely lost hearing in the left ear and only a constant, unpleasant internal noise remained. The left half of his face was paralyzed, due to the destruction of nerves. He is able to function perfectly well, save the fact that he has occasional absence seizures and rare tonic-clonic seizures.

fffffffuck.

>>11601559
I wonder if that flash thing was his nerves melting or just the cherenkov effect in his eyeballs.

>>11601494
>>11601559

I think the reason he survived was that a particle beam is EXTREMELY narrow. So it sort of went through his head, completely wrecked everything in his narrow path - but nothing else, and didn't cause the widespread FUCK ALL YOUR ORGANS AT THE SAME TIME syndrome radiation damage really likes to do.

>>11601647
a proton scalpel... hrm. now there's an image.

>>11601751
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Proton_Beam_Therapy

>>11601779
>>11601751

...you know, they could get the same result with less radiation if they did, like, three low-power beams that intersected and had powerful but extremely local radiation at the site of the tumor.

Like x, y, and z-axis beams

>>11603372
That would increase the spread to three beams entering the body instead of one. IIRC, the body handles high localized doses far better than when they're spread out.