>>10806071
I think a bigger concern is getting the advancement tables for the first few ranks of each caste/career made.

Bonding meaning?

>>10806110
Tau ritual. "Blood Brothers."

Repeating from other thread since it died of sage: Should Fire Warriors get a Perception bonus, since they (IIRC) are descended from hunting stock?

>>10806110
groups of Tau can go through a ritual called the Ta'lissera, which is pretty much the Tau equivalent to marriage. Bonded groups become loyal to each other, and there is possible mysticism at play in the ritual.

>>10806143
Increased willpower when in the presence of blood-brothers?

>>10806107
Your right, I can start working on stuff for one caste, if other people want to tackle the rest

Do we really need bonding for everyone? Is there a fluff reason?

I'd say let the Fire Caste be the only guys with bonding.

It creates a brotherhood feel, and it will create a gap between Fire Caste and the other Castes.

Remember, Fire Caste are considered... odd because they are eager to fight, compared to the other Castes.

>Fire caste drive grav tanks and have operate as gunners on Tau Starships.
>citation needed


Delivered.

>>10806164
So different stat modifiers based on caste? Like homeworld selections?

>>10806170
Nevermind what I said.

I thought it was some kind of oath, like those rituals for soldiers to swear on the flag or whatnot.

>>10806228
Any caste can be bonded, but we were thinking about possibly having inter-caste bonding taking place in game

What are the rules on mind control and forced sterilization?

>>10806327
They don't exist, because that was a stupid bit of fluff added onto DoW, which we agreed to completely ignore while making this supplement.

>>10806228
>>10806287

As he said, any caste can be bonded - it's not stated that these bonding ceremonies are occur only within ones caste or not. Most commonly those who undertake the ceremony are members of the Fire and Earth castes.

Bonded: Gives PC an addition character to control. PC is obliged to do everything to save his bondbro's life. In the event his bondbro is killed, the PC is obliged to take responsibility to look after his bondbro's family as his own.

>>10806243
Hmm. Fine, I retract that point, but are the tanks driven by them too?
As I've said in the old thread, I've exaggerated on purpose.

Other stuff I think we should consider, not in order of importance:
-Suits(not only battlesuits really)
-Bonding
-Enemies
-Career Paths
-The non-Tau
-Deviance/Thoughtcrime(personally I'd prefer Dissatisfaction or Disillusionment, maybe also Cultural Shock)
-Gear(DRONES FUCK YEAH)
-Our little Inquisitau(I'd stick with Exalted's idea)

>>10806408
... so basically its a fanfiction splatbook where your perfect alien sex objects act out mary sue fantasies. Gotcha.

>>10806408
>>10806327

Yep. Pretty much.

But don't worry. The Ethereals can still be considered scheming overlords...

Hell, if you play your cards right as a Fire Warrior, you can become a rogue-agent working for O'Shovah.

>>10806464
0/10
Also, the wiki page:http://1d4chan.org/wiki/Tau_Dark_Heresy

>>10806439
the tanks themselves are piloted by the Air cast.
I'm currently working on the Fire career paths, first naming them, and then figuring out the advancements they can take.

>>10806464
No one said the Tau political system is all happy joy joy and rose-scented farts.

Shit is looking very... grimdark. Even without the forced sterilisation.

Man, I can't wait to play a racist Tau, send out by Tau-First ethereals to quell cult activity, Enduring Freedom style.

http://eatatau.smackjeeves.com/comics/

Ok, so here's a work in progress of the Fire Cast career paths

Saal (Trainee, might drop) -> Shas'la
After Shas'la, splits into one of three, Shas'Ui, Pathfinder, or Gunner
*Shas'Ui -> Crisis -> Leader -> Shas'O
*Pathfinder -> Stealth -> Assassin -> M'yen
*Gunner -> Broadside -> Destroyer -> Or'es

>>10806547
A Tau Dubya suspects the Imperium possessed WMD and luanches a pre-empitve war against them.
You get to be the Tau version of Navy SEALS sent in to assassinate their Emprah Gulliman on Ultramar.

Some ideas that I've had:

-not only the Fire Caste get their battlesuits: There could be colossal exoskeletons fit for industrial labour and extreme working conditions for the Earth Caste, armoured hulks to protect the Water diplomats on dangerous missions, or weird contraptions made to provide comfort for Air pilots in non-zero-gravity environments, which would look like a Tauified hybrid of Unreal Tournament III's Scavenger and the chamber housing Edrik in Dune Messiah. The suits would be of course a late game option.

-Drones: Would vary from simply servo-skulls equivalent to a viable combat option for the Earth Caste

-New Skill: Programming. Kinda self-explanatory I guess.

>>10806638
Visual, for those who find it simpler.

>>10806731
Ooh, like the power-loader?

>>10806753
THIS, A 1000 TIMES THIS!

Read up on bonding.

I guess it would add a bonus to working together in the same place.

It would work from the PC's point of view.

Like if there are four uncorrupted Tau, one Tau with some anti-authority thing from Corruption.
The four normal Tau get bonding for a group of five bonded Tau.
However, the bonding won't work anymore for the guy who thinks the Greater Good is bullshit. So he has no more bonding benefit, while he still counts as bonding.

That could to nasty situations in stressful games, where players would suddenly find out that the group is falling together. Corrupted players would begin refusing orders and such, and the bonding benefits would be lost to all.

>>10806868
Sounds good, now we just need to bring it down to numbers.

Also, filled up the Corruption table, somewhat hastily. I originally had an entry called "Defeatist" which would lower Fel and Wp by 1d5 each, but thought it too similar to World Weary.

Here's the Characteristic Advancements for the Fire Caste
Characteristic/Simple/Intermediate/Trained/Expert
WS /250/500/750/1000
BS /100/250/500/750
S /100/250/500/750
T /250/500/750/1000
Ag /100/250/500/750
Int /500/750/1000/2500
Per /250/500/750/1000
WP /500/750/1000/2500
Fel /500/750/1000/2500

>>10806969
I'd swap S and T. Also, I feel the statlines on the wiki page need to get updated. 25 BS on Air Caste seems just...wrong.

>>10806663
>A Tau Dubya suspects the Imperium possessed WMD

Well no shit

Hang on, let me see if I have this right:

Fire = Military
Earth = Technical
Air = Pilot/Diplomat
Water = Economic/Mercantile

Is this right?

>>10807027
I agree with the Air caste BS thing, I'd say drop it to 20, and boost Fel to 20. And then boost Fire BS to 25

>>10807061
Diplomats are Water, Air is Pilot/Messenger

>>10807077
Ah. Thanks.

It seems like Gue'vesa need to be acknowledged more. The core rulebook gives their homeworld traits, but shouldn't they also have traits that apply to how other members of the Tau Empire view them, or otherwise? Something along the lines of them being an outsider, or, dare I say it, a stranger in a strange land.

Well, on the matter of bonding: It could be done by some twist on the Assistance rule from DH core rulebook. Like, bonded characters can assist each other from a greater distance, or can assist each other while fighting. The downside would be they gotta pass Willpower tests or something when the other one's in danger not use up a reaction and jump out of cover to protect them etc. All sorts of delicious drama could occur.

Well, while working on the Skill and Talent advances for Fire Caste, I'm realizing how many talents just don't work for Tau. Does anyone want to try and come up with some Tau talents to compensate for this?

>>10807133
I see two paths of making a Gue'vasa: one from the Imperium, who would be obviously less trusted and such, but would be closer to a DH Acolyte and invaluable in some situations, or a Gue'vasa born into the Empire, with a more Tau-like profile and less "Imperialism".

>>10807325
List the ones not working first, we might just adapt them.

so do tau have a low starting ws/bs/i compared to humans?

This is the best thing since Ad Eva!! damn /tg/ gets shit done!

what sort of roles can humans occupy in tau society? are there fire gue water gue? or are they just gue, gue?
a shas'gue'la sounds like a cool title to me.

>>10807325
It seems like most could do with a simple re-name. The Tech-Priest specific ones obviously don't work. Is the problem their actual function or how well they fit Tau tactics and battle behavior?

So this is still on the go? Guy who made initial race stats here (although I see they were changed on the 1d4chan page), dropped out around Deviancy - which more or less seems to fit my suggestions of emphasising Insanity over Corruption and making Insanity Tau-specific. What's the talking point now?

>>10807550
>>10807325
The advances are going to be a massive undertaking, I feel we should look at a forum or chat where we can talk this out.

>>10807470
There was the conception that 'Fire' 'Water' 'Earth' and 'Air' would be general 'paths' that any race could follow, with the Tau following a specific track. So a combatitve Gue'vesa would be on the 'Fire' path and a diplomatic attaché on the 'Water' one.

However, there was some discord. I previously supported it but am currently against it. Kroot, Demiurg, Humans and so on should get their own options.

>>10807629
Bonding.

It seems like sticking together will be a big element of the game...

...making anti-authority corruption even nastier.

I think an unspoken difficulty is adequately distinguishing the skills of Earth, Air and Water. One is more social and fast and the other is more social and mercantile. Short of playing vehicle-heavy games, I'm finding it hard to imagine an interesting balance.

For those of you who were not in the last thread, and would like to see what we have done, heres a link to the wiki page: http://1d4chan.org/wiki/Tau_Dark_Heresy

>>10807381
Here's the talents that I don't think will work.
Autosanguine, Chem Geld, everything that requires a Psy rating, All Techpriest Talents, Logis Implant, Orthoproxy, and Prosanguine

Air Caste are not social, they are the least sociable of all Castes. Hence their Fel penalty. Right now they've been seriously shafted though, because someone decided a net -5 penalty wasn't enough.

The Earth Caste are the field experts. Experimenters, scientists and innovators. A mix of Adept and Tech Priest. The Water Caste are the faces and negiotiators. The Air Caste... I see them as being the 'eyes' of the group. They should gain some Scum-like talents and enough support to be passable gunfighters, but their real skills should be in perception, orientation and piloting. Look at the Void-Master Rogue Trader class for ideas.

>>10807720
Previously I proposed two methods of bonding. Caste bonding, restricted solely to Tau, and organisation bonding (The 'Section 13' bonds it's members) which would be accessible to all operatives. Caste bonding would differ by Caste, and Group bonding would have a uniform benefit.

Group bonding is a source of much controversy.

>>10807765
We should figure out Caste traits first.

Last time I supported the trait that allowed Earth Caste to test Security on Int based on the lock, and proposed allowing the Air Caste to reroll a type of test based on their net -5 stat penalty (which has now become a -10 for some reason, while the Fire Caste now have a net +5).

Well, I have to leave for a bit, but I'll be back later to check on the thread's progress

Kroot Trait Ideas (Based off of Wikipedia entry):

Carnivorous: WP or something like that to try to force themselves to eat anything other than fresh meat.
Scaly Hide: Small armor bonus, potentially combined with Agi loss.
Blindsight or Thermal Sight: +/- to Per, depending on what is being done (Tracking enemies gets a bonus, reading text gets a penalty, or might even be impossible, etc).
Efficient Digestion: Kroot don't urinate or defecate, apparently, so something to do with how much energy they can get from consumption, maybe relating to how much rest they need compared to other races.
Pheremones: Probably adjusts Fel, depending on the Kroot's opinion of someone.
Rapid Mutation: Increases the amount on the die roll for Mutations, or perhaps lets the Kroot player modify it by a small amount, if they wish.
Tribal History: Modifies how they interact with other Kroot, or just gives them some basic starting proficiencies.

They should probably also have higher S, T, and perhaps some size benefits for being the size of a Space Marine (Aprox. 7 ft, minimum.)

>>10807731
Air: good with vehicles, very agile
Water: social fellows, might be good con-men
Earth: Tech-priest equivalent

>>10807813
>The Air Caste... I see them as being the 'eyes' of the group.

Suggesting allowing Air caste skills that promote/access to the

*Pathfinder -> Stealth -> Assassin -> M'yen

career path as a cross-over with Fire. The lightweight, fast and stealthy scouts and information gatherers.

>>10807887
>Kroot Trait Ideas
Anyone know what the Kroot language situation is? They polyglots?

>>10807971
According to Wikipedia, the pheromones they exude play a part in it.

Oh, what's this, a table top game of Marathon OP, I just love that mid-90's shooter!

>>10807990
So I'm not the only one who gets confused. I fucking love Marathon too. I'm running AE aboard the Marathon, as a matter of fact.

>>10807971
Kroot have their own language, but according to the Ciaphas Cain books, they can speak broken Gothic. I assume they can speak Tau as well.

>>10807765
Aut- and Prosanguine, Chem Geld, Orthoproxy and Logis Implant can just be refluffed as Tau experimental augmentations. I'd say the Logis Implant would be a popular choice among Pathfinders and Air Caste, just change its name. Psy Traits are just unavailable, since there are no sanctioned psykers in here. Nascents and sorcerers can't take it anyway. As for the techpriest talents, we gotta rewrite them fully. Drone control anyone?

>>10807887
I think we're going to handle Kroot later because right now their racial traits include Unnatural Strength (x2) and Perception (x2), which throws off the game a little bit. My statline is certainly not adequate for them.

For Kroot advances, I suggest a mix of Kroot-specific skills and talents (Shaping, Carnivorous, Alien Biology), ones that suited a mercenary role, some melee support, and ones that suited a predatory, tracker role.

Being able to use more types of guard would be cool. Like from different worlds and stuff.

>>10808017
Absolutely, Tau need new advancements suited to their own tech. I'm not sure about keeping Chem Geld.

>>10808017
Maybe Psy Rating 1 or just cantrip-level Psy abilities could be a rare mutation? Maybe after a character becomes intimate with the Warp, or is "touched" by a daemon. It seems like it might annoy some people to cut them out altogether. I guess those people can just play Gue, but still.

>>10808127
Nah, the Tau are a race of blunts. Including psychic abilities makes me rage, and I'm kind of a fluff liberal. They should be accessible.

...which is not to say that a tech advance ("Electromagnetic Pulse Disruptor" or your personal flavour of bullshit science) might not duplicate the effects of Weapon Jinx, or something. That was what Inquisition did with Archaeotech, after all.

>>10808062
In the tabletop game Tau can take upgrades like Multitrackers/Target Lock/Drone Controller as implants. That should be implemented.

Also, one of the fluff pieces for the "gets hot" rail rifles was that the experimental targeting implants for those guns would sometimes fry the brains of the firer.

>>10808163
That's probably a better idea than what I had. Still... no Tau Jedi for me.

>>10808165
That's the awesome thing about PnP. We can modify that and say something like '2d10 energy damage to the head, ignoring armour' on a roll of 96+

Or 96+, then...

1-25: Weapon breaks, shot is fired.
26-50: Weapon breaks.
51-00: BRAIN FREEZE.

>>10808163
>They should be accessible.
Should NOT, sorry. And INQUISITOR, not Inquisition.

>>10808127
You know, playing a human Psyker in a Tau game is like screaming "Rape my ass now!" in a gay bar.

It'll be fun to add, but it would be stupid to pick.

Maybe add it as a random chance to get, when you roll for human creation.

A Tau-allied human isn't going to find out he's a psyker until a Bloodletter bursts out of is skull.

I'm randomly throwing another vote in for Tau NOT having any psyker-like abilities at all.

I'd really like to see them rely heavily on technology, with even fire warriors being able to take targeting/rapid fire/auto-aiming "implants" or whatever.


maybe things could be split so that air caste guys are real good with battlefield control/disruption technologies. Conversely, earth caste dominate the passive technological applications like hacking, security, etc.

Also, air caste are pilots right? Would it be feasible that they "pilot" drones via remote control?
The idea of an Earth caste building a fuckawesome combat drone for his air caste pilot is awesome. Think of it like modern military aircraft, you have the pilot, but the plane "belongs" to the crew chief, and god help the pilot if he puts even a scratch on that thing.

>>10808334
A proposed trait for all Earth Caste was that Security (which covers hacking and so on) be made Int based, not Ag based, on any technological lock. The idea is more like The Doctor pulling out his gadget and zapping the lock than messing around with wires and cutters.

Piloting drones is a neat idea, but I don't see why the Air Caste would be the ones doing it. And if the Tau could have that level of Drone control, why even use operatives?

>>10808334
Maybe the Tau, or at least the Earth caste, have some inherent possessiveness or protectiveness of their technology? Could be cool to RP. Plus, if they take to one another (The Tau and the Drone), you basically have a Tau version of Bao-Dur.

>>10808295
>A Tau-allied human isn't going to find out he's a psyker until a Bloodletter bursts out of is skull.

I don't they'll catch on then either.

"Gary, your brain is turning into a bloody carnivore. Stop that!"

Ok, I'm back. Currently working on the Shas'Ui rank advancements, and then I'll work my way up that path, before moving on to another.

>>10808425
>I don't see why the Air Caste would be the ones doing it.
Mostly just because they are the "pilot" caste. I was thinking if pilot/drive ability was linked to it, air caste would be your go-to guys. Maybe rolls for the drone in combat could be shared between earth and air caste. This promotes the concept of working together for a greater good, and allows two non-combat classes to participate in combat. Air caste rolls for manuevers/cover/flanking/charge/retreat/whatever. Earth rolls for . . . . . something. Damage or to hit or something. I don't know.

>if the Tau could have that level of Drone control, why even use operatives?
Well, drones would be highly specialized and customized to a specific role. So while the Tau might be able to build a gundrone that can rape a bloodletter from 1000 meters, they can't build a gun drone that will contact informants, pick locks, make snap-judgments and reactions to changing circumstances under fire, etc etc.

>>10808631
I don't think splitting rolls between two players is a good idea. And I don't think we'll have a problem working the Earth Caste into a combat situation. They are more durable than the other Castes and they get lots of nice toys - there should be no problem making them fun to play in a firefight.

Good point about the Drones. The possibility of an Air Caste manipulating a Drone by remote is one to consider, I guess. It feels sort of redundant though - like an excuse not to give them a proper niche, just let them sub for a real character.

>>10808445
>Maybe the Tau, or at least the Earth caste, have some inherent possessiveness or protectiveness of their technology?

I would offer this up as a basic Tau trait. Allowing Tau technology to be turned against the greater good would be tantamount to heresy against the greater good.
Earth caste would be especially paranoid about their technology falling into xeno hands, as it could (potentially) be traced back to them.
And the Ethereals are always watching.

Regarding Caste traits, I remember reading something involving the Air caste having thin, membranous wings. We could possibly incorporate this by having them take reduced fall damage with greater distances, and if they fall from far enough, they wont take any damage at all.

>>10808694
But we can see in the fluff that there is not a restriction on technology among the Tau. I don't agree with this at all, technological advancement and upgrades should be a token of all classes. The Earth Caste should be differentiated by their gadgets, individual work and experimental technology, not by some faux-Mechanicus protectivity.

Gue'vesa get Tau weapons and Spyrer suits are cribbed from Tau technology. I don't feel conservativism is warranted in the most technologically progressive and liberal faction in the 40k universe.

>>10808668
>I don't think splitting rolls between two players is a good idea.

after posting I decided it was an idea that will probably lead to more meta party conflict than anything else. It's kind of a cool concept, but I don't think it would be practical.

>an excuse not to give them a proper niche, just let them sub for a real character.
I see your point. I was thinking primarily combat drones. I figure since the air caste is so physically fragile their kind of going to be shoehorned into a scout/sniper role anyway. This would basically be the same concept, except instead of lolrailgun sniper rifle, you have lolgundrone.

>>10808719
I've been talking over the Air Caste with Wolenz on the 1d4chan webpage. You might want to check out the discussion, ideas very welcome.

>>10808773
It's certainly not a bad idea. Some kind of direct control drone handled by the superior reflexes of the Air Caste seems like it could totally work - just not as an integral part, rather as a bonus upon the drone framework which will be accessible to all classes.

>>10808773
Air caste could possibly have boosted WS, because of their agile nature. Just a thought as to a way to give them a niche

>>10808755
hmm, let me restate my point:

Technology within the Tau empire is a free flowing commodity. Amongst the different castes and subjugated races, there's no issues.

I'm specifically talking about sharing Tau technology with species/characters that exist outside the Tau empire. If the pc's have to visit some mercenary Kroot ship to canvas the local bar for information, they are going to want to keep their toys hidden, for example.

I am making the assumption here that pc's would be interacting with entities outside of Tau society and empire. If not, it's kind of a moot point anyway.

>>10808823
>Boosted WS
>Encouraging CC
>Lower Strength and Toughness

I can't condone this. One of the reasons close combat is inferior in default DH is that it's multi stat, the others are the lack of damage, attacks and multipliers.

The Air Caste shouldn't be filling the melee niche. That should be handled by the Fire Caste and the Kroot.

>>10808755
I mean protectiveness as in, "Did you break it? I spent 5 weeks building that!" type protectiveness, like a doting father unto a child. Not "We have the technology and you can't have it" type protectiveness.

A bigger question is fuck tau.

>>10808898
Oh, you.

>>10808852
I understood this was at least part of your point and indeed we can see in the fluff how willing Tau are to deal out technology to their allies. Gue'vesa, Kroot, Vespid... they even let spacefaring races hitch rides on their bigger ships.

Even then, the protectivity was mentioned in the context of the Earth Caste's in-game niche. This to me implied it would be a way to differentiate them from the other races - which didn't seem appropriate. As you say, among subjects it's not a problem. As a fluff perspective on Xenos, I have no problem with it. Hell, give the Earth Caste -5 Fel when they talk tech with a non-Tau if you want.

>>10808878
Oh yeah, then I can definitely see that. Especially with Drones.

Is that it for the day? I think we got a lot done.

Does anybody have a HQ larger version of that TAU banner at the top of the page>/?

>>10809063
Here. I admit it's a nice wall.

Maybe I should adopt a name for this project. Statanon works as well as any I suppose.

On the note of drones: We could extend them to the Demiurg allied race who are stated to use mining drones as attack craft.

Thank you kindly. Here is your payment <3

Um, if everyone's cool, I'd like to keep working on this as part of "the team" as well. I guess I'll be going by FF-Syk. It's my usual pseudonym.

If there's an admission fee, I'll gladly pay.

>>10809217
Yeah, I'm afraid you owe us all 20 dollars. So you know, chop chop. For the Greater Good and all that.

I'm going to go set up an IRC to hash out any further details anyone wants to talk over.

http://www.gamesurge.net/chat/

Then /join #TauDH if you want to talk it over.

Here's what I have so far of the Advance scheme for the Fire caste. This job is definitely a LOT of work, so any input whatsoever is welcome.

>>10809325
Well, we should decide on their default skills & talents first. They should get Pulse Training in pistols and basic for free, IMO. You also seem to have thrown a few higher-than-normal level talents in there.

>>10809325
I like the start off with Survival and Tracking, like they're learning basic survival skills first. Frenzy seems distinctly un-Tau, though.

>>10809350
So, I could change the weapon trainings to SP.
And what do you mean by higher level talents?

>>10809421
Deadeye Shot, for instance.

Add Swim, Melee Weapon Training (Primitive) and Sound Constitution (possibly x2) for starters I would say. Remove Deadeye Shot. Double Team is nice and thematic, but I'd say shift Peer (Fire Caste) up a rank or two.

>>10808869
>Tau
>Melee

*facepalm*

So is Exalted back with uhhh... whatevertauheresywascalledbefore 2.0?

.>>10808425
>A proposed trait for all Earth Caste was that Security (which covers hacking and so on)

If you read the skill descriptions "hacking" is actually handled by Tech-Use. The Security skill is specifically physical.

>>10806071


Some one should sue GW for stealing bungies Covenant.

That way they can't make Tau any more :3

>>10809623
Doh. I feel the gadget Int trick should still stand, it's a lacking niche.

>>10809582
Ethereal Dawn.

>>10810473

That is a creepy smile.

Holy shit, /tg/, we're getting shit done, despite the summerfags.

Everyone who contributed, pic related.

>>10811925
>Holy shit, /tg/, we're getting shit done
You mean the same shit we did last year?

>>10811990
This seems more focused on the mechanics. The last time we did something like this it got bogged down in the fluff and the the creator got all insecure because some people though thought it was a silly idea. This seems a lot more focused, and how often to we actually work on mechanics as a collective? Fluff we can do, but that's easy. This is a stage that we hardly ever get to in our projects and we dove in at it for the VERY FIRST THING.

Also, I don't know about the last project, but this seems far more likely to get me tooling around in a crisis suit, gunning people and light armor down with massive firepower. I like that. Or I could play a Kroot. That's been high on my list of goals for a while now.