[a / b / c / d / e / f / g / gif / h / hr / k / m / o / p / r / s / t / u / v / vg / w / wg] [i / ic] [r9k] [cm / hm / y] [3 / adv / an / cgl / ck / co / diy / fa / fit / hc / int / jp / lit / mlp / mu / n / po / pol / sci / soc / sp / tg / toy / trv / tv / vp / x] [rs] [status / ? / @] [Settings] [Home]
Board:  
Settings   Home
4chan
/qst/ - Quests


Your name is Shu, and here, in the belly of a world devoured by a thing from beyond the stars, you and yours are fighting for the fate of the Crucible in a lonesome city lost to time itself. You race along the streets of dull gold and faded obsidian, the almost art-deco designs that cover every inch of the abyssal alleys and chill corridors that swarm with the inconsolable dead.

They come for you, wave after wave of azure molded to the shape and form of the furious Hexane, but even as they lust after the bloody resolution of their vengeance you know that something far more vicious races towards a glorious rebirth somewhere deeper within the walls of this city-turned-catacomb. With your allies at your side, both alive and passed, you tirelessly surge onwards in an effort to stop that which would see what’s left of your world stagnate into nothingness.

You can only hope you’re not too late.

Previous Vein: http://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/qstarchive/3601795/

Archive: http://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/qstarchive.html?tags=Body%20Horror%20Quest

Character Abilities: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/15ctgm_liaNO0e0B6zAcIUrmfDN0tWiXds3L4FvogI2M/edit#gid=0

Trypophilic Hive, Ver. 2: https://pastebin.com/SJ5wvFxr

Relics: https://pastebin.com/wfHGrYZq

Twitter: https://twitter.com/bodyhorrorquest?lang=en
>>
>>3637465

A crash and roar erupts from your right, and you turn in time to see Eloise carve an ectoplasmic gash in the hideous, angular Geist that was surging towards you and your team. It's been five, maybe ten minutes of flat-out running, and even in that short span of time you've realized the gap in effectiveness between the living and the dead against Almath's vengeful inhabitants. After the second time Meg cracks her fist across an incoming Geist and it promptly explodes, it occurs to you that even Rath's Tormentis-empowered attacks pale in comparison to what Gina and her team can do to beings like themselves.

And then suddenly, there it is.

That presence that feels like your world imploding, the voice that sounds like all the hatred in the world filtered through a seething, vengeful throat.

YOU'VE COME SO FAR

AND SO HAS MY FAVORED DAUGHTER

Mother's inimitable voice echoes in your mind as you race headlong through the crooked streets and narrow alleys that lead, inevitably, to the gleaming alabaster spire that towers over the city.

THIS IS A JOURNEY YOU HAVE BOTH TAKEN TOGETHER

ONE THAT HAS SPANNED YOUR LIVES

You share a look with Gina, and the fleeting glance tells you that both you and she sense that something’s different about the Hexane Crucible's embittered winner. There's something...diminished, about her. Despite Mother's fire and hope, beyond her self-assured speech...she's weakened, beyond anything you've seen.

BUT MINE

MINE HAS SPANNED EONS, DEFIANT

It's a thing that goes further than mere exhaustion. You feel as if, in the efforts of stopping you, that's she's brought herself to the very brink.

MY WAIT IS AT AN END

MY AWAKENING IS AT HAND

AND I SHALL FINALLY GET WHAT I SO RIGHTLY DESERVE

It is from that edge, that precipice of existence that she gloats at you now.

Here, at the end of an era.

>>"How many times have you gone out of your way to stop us, Mother? How many times have you completely and utterly failed…and what makes you think this time is going to be any different?”

>>"You have to know how this is going to end for you, Ozmas. What good do you think getting your body back is going to do you?"

>>Ignore Mother. You’re almost to the spire, and you don’t have time for her when so much is at stake.

>>Write-In

YOU ARE IN CONTROL
>>
(Gentlemen, it’s good to be back. A few items of note; the majority of what little free time I had this past week was spent play testing what is to come and it allowed me to streamline some things. As such, at the risk of going a little into some mild interface spoilers, you will not only have control over Shu and her living allies but also over individual squads of Dream Daughters as well, the leaders of which will have an impact on their performance. Granting control over the general actions of the squads themselves instead of their individual members proved to prevent both analysis paralysis and general interface clutter, so I’ll be using that format going forward.)

(Additionally, work and life kept me from updating nearly as much as I could, so I’ll be filtering in Relic and other items as the thread continues. However, your current status is cued from when you all chose your Loadout and is posted below, so let me know if there are any adjustments you’d like to make before you proceed. If there are any questions then please let me know, and I hope you all had a good weekend.)


HP: 650% (+35%, Matrons Stoicism, Ignition Gauntlets, Whistle: CUNT TER RHO)
BIO: 690% (+60%, 19 Rook-Platelings, Recursive [You/Rath/Julia/November: Armored] 6 Quad Knighted-Grapplings, 2 Stealthed Jacklings, 2 Stealthed Scarlet Drones, 3 Bishops [Shu, Rath, Julia], 4 Bane-Nomlings, 36/36)
CONTENDER: 2 x B.33 Loaded, Sword Form.
RAVENOUS MAW: Primed.
HUNDRED-HANDED: None.
ACT: 3/3

RATH HP: 860% (70%, Sui Tormentis, Gutgrab Daggers, 2400% ATK+, 2400% SPD+, 2400% DEF+)
JULIA HP: 880% (20%, Hydras Heart, Manus Caelorum, Cursas Alas, 20 Daggers, BLOODY RIPPER x 2)
NOVEMBER HP: 970% (Tier 1 Core)
CLONES: 45 Remaining, all with Radiant Boils in hand.

Threat: Held at bay.

(Voting shall remain open for the next two hours, Gentlemen.)
>>
>>3637468
>>Ignore Mother. You’re almost to the spire, and you don’t have time for her when so much is at stake.
eh, fuck mother. shes looking for us to throw Bantz back at her, so the best way to make this sting is to just ignore her.

>>3637472
wonderful to be back BHOP, always nice to see this start back up again, and hope this week it less heavy on your shoulders and time aswell.

as for any adjustments, i think that all looks good, we're about as ready as we can be, its just a matter of what we will truly end up facing.
>>
>>3637472
Good to have you back i hope the last week hasnt been to exhausting

>>3637468
>>Ignore Mother. You’re almost to the spire, and you don’t have time for her when so much is at stake.

Write-in
>>Flip her the bird in your mind and be on your way getting you distracted seems to be the only thing she can do right now so lets not give her the pleasure


OP you mentioned that they did not expect this amount of resistance......... I do wonder though how much power had she pump into isabelle to keep her running down here. A curious thing consequences to ones actions
>>
>>3637468
>>Ignore Mother. You’re almost to the spire, and you don’t have time for her when so much is at stake.
Taunt after we ruin her plans. It's not worth the focus we'd spend talking to her, right now. And it will be so much sweeter to speak with her after her last grasp at relevance has been for nought.

>>3637472
Welcome back, BHOP. I hope this week is less hectic for you.

Wait, squads? But we only have four Dream Daughters, that should be just one squad. Unless...we're going to get backup throughout the fight, aren't we? We've been here long enough that the Dream Daughters the party has with within them are going to manifest, too. Nice.
>>
>>3637483
>Wait, squads? But we only have four Dream Daughters, that should be just one squad. Unless...we're going to get backup throughout the fight, aren't we? We've been here long enough that the Dream Daughters the party has with within them are going to manifest, too. Nice.
to be fair we did kinda expect that and it does make sense. it also makes understandable sense we will only be able to command them as squads, that would be...upwards of 23 daughters potentially, we would be in control of, and at that point it may aswell be a bloody war simulator, which i dont think this system was designed to be smoothly. would probably need 5 hour turns just to read through all of that haha.
>>
>>3637468
>"You have to know how this is going to end for you, Ozmas. What good do you think getting your body back is going to do you?"
Get her to monologue while we make our way.
>>
>>3637493
Oh, yeah, I was expecting it too. Just happy to have (tacit) confirmation. And agreed, it would get way too busy in here. Especially when you consider that there are going to be seven B'Ni clones, and forty-five Amara clones, and Shu's six Knighted-Grapplings and whatever other constructs get deployed. Definitely a good thing to be doing this by squad.
>>
>>3637502
yeah, thankfully we usually use the clones and Swarmlings in squads already, but Quad Knighted Grapplings are at least human sized if not a bit bigger, thats gotta actually be pretty fucking terrifying. probably have enough acid in each one to make a body cease to exist, stored in a droll probably a foot in diameter at least.
>>
>>3637516
Don't forget that we've got Subversive applied to all our swarm, too. So they're not just terrifying giant bee monsters, they're terrifying giant bee monsters that are invisible. Well, okay, they're not that invisible, you can probably make out where they are when you're close up, but it will still make things much more disorienting.

Actually, wait, let me just make sure BHOP knows we wanted the whole swarm to be invisible, I'm only seeing it on two of our swarmling types.
>>3637472
We had the Subversive trait applied to everything, not just the Jacklings and Scarlet Drones. Just to make things that little bit harder for B'Ni. Stealth on all the non-ethereal Daughters, stealth on our bees, everything is hard to make out where it's supposed to be.
>>
>>3637522
(Excellent, I'll make the change.)
>>
>>3637522
you know...we should've Rec'd the QKGs.
that would've been 200 Recursive swarmlings each at max. imagine going through all the effort it takes to kill one of those, only for upwards of 200 tiny little shitheads to swarm you.
>>
>>3637525
We can still make adjustments. Want to throw that in?
>>
>>3637523
>>3637528
yeah sure, lets make death pinatas. the ultimate surprise present for Isabelle if she kills one. hell fuck at those numbers id imagine they are actually a threat, not just an annoyance.
>>
>>3637531
Alright, let's add that in, then.
>>3637472
We'd like to make the Grapplings Recursive as well as Subversive, please. Make them punchy doom-pinatas.

Speaking of swarming B'Ni with ridiculous amounts of lesser hazards until it just becomes utterly ridiculous: Gina has unlimited Bio right now thanks to acting as a Dream Daughter. Because of Crimson Cord, this means that Shu has unlimited Bio right now. Hundred-Handed get a damage bonus of 0.25% per arm spawned. Not much, but when you consider that there's no limit to the number of arms Shu can spawn per turn so long as she has sufficient Bio and she has as much Bio as she needs...

I think what we should do is get one of the Banelings into the crypt and then spawn enough branching arms to completely fill the space. It will block off entrance so she can't send one body to sneak past and get to the Corpse while we're occupied. Then, Shu can spawn some more arms on the Grapplings and give them like a +5000% damage bonus (I don't know how big the crypt is, I'll have to do the math after we see it) and go to town.
>>
>>3637540
(Consider the adjustments done, Gentlemen.)
>>
>>3637540
well, so long as we are in physical contact with her. it also might still have a limit, as Ginas reserves still have a max technically, it just doesn't run out, but that still might put a maximum we can shotgun out in one burst. it wont have the threat of us running dry and keeling over, but still might not be an infinite amount to instantly call on.
>>
File: MOTHER.jpg (94 KB, 1104x1428)
94 KB
94 KB JPG
>>3637468

Your answer to Mother takes the form of stony silence.

A WORDLESS REPLY

VERY WELL

A reverberating sort of laughter echoes in your ears, drowning out the hum of your invisible swarm and your own urgent footfalls upon Almath’s dusty streets.

WE SHALL SHARE WORDS WHEN MY BODY IS REBORN ANEW, THEN

I HAVE SO MANY WORDS FOR YOU AND YOUR LITTLE FAMILY, DEFIANT

You can feel her smile as her presence recedes back into the void, a Cheshire grin that’s burned into your mind’s eye as she speaks one final time as you round a sharp corner, bringing the path to the alabaster spire into full view.

A LEXICON’S WORTH

Your jaw clenches when the open street before you floods with a raging, undulating tide of Hexane ghosts, and November’s gauntlets rack back, revealing her formidable armament before the crowd before you is assaulted from all sides in a flurry of movement. An explosive row of arcing teeth erupt from the ground, the canines spearing the helpless geists in mid-air, the grinding pillars of molars curving to crush others to ectoplasmic pulp. An errant geist makes it through the barrier only to be tackled mid-charge by a muscular Spartan, the woman’s powerful frame keeping the writhing remnant in a vicious head-lock that transforms into a brutal guillotine when her arms become lined with teeth.

Johanna shoots you a satisfied grin before a second wave of azure ghosts pour over her barrier, only to be subsumed within the twisting, spiraling ground the instant their feet meet the path. The ground draws in their limbs with terrible force, and you watch as Uzu steps out from a nearby alley, hand outstretched as she watches her spirals tear the wave to pieces as they’re ground into the pavement before disappearing completely. A trio of winged ghosts arc over the crowd, surging towards you before they’re snatched from the air, one by one decapitated with blinding speed as they’re drawn towards the ravenous maw of the slender blonde that leaps from the shadows. She turns, ad you find yourself face-to-face with Holly’s bright, radiant smile.

“Hey there, Shu!” She says with the same carefree tone as if you’d run into each other on the street…which you have, in a way. You’re about to reply when a fourth geist flies over the home to your left, catching you off guard. Holly’s reaction is immediate and decisive, throwing her body in front of yours before any of you can react with her arms spread wide. You watch in awe as the streets around you reach out, forming a quartet of yawning mouths that latch on to the geist simultaneously, tearing it apart in a shower of azure.

“Holly…are you a Neuromancer?” You breathe, the attack coming to a welcome end as Holly turns to you, uncertainty obvious as her features.

“Uh…no? I…I got nothing, sorry.” She replies, just as confused as you are until Gina’s eyes light up beside you.

(Continued)
>>
File: Holly, Comforable Clothes.jpg (2.8 MB, 1804x2421)
2.8 MB
2.8 MB JPG
>>3637649

Empathy…empathy, that’s it!” She cries, her mid aflutter with theories and ideas. “The city responds to thoughts and ideas! What we’re seeing, it’s all based on the memories of the Hexane, but strong desires can warp it, since the geists, the city, and the Dream Daughters are all made of the same stuff, in a way! The city’s been a constant for countless years, but now that the Hexane are going nuts over B’ni and Mother, things are getting…malleable, to say the least.”

“So why aren’t they still following B’ni, then?! She’s pissed to all hell, so why do these things have such a murder-boner for Shu?!” Rath roars in frustration, and the answer comes to you and Gina both in an instant of dawning realization.

“They’re tracking anger and hatred, they’ve been drawn to it…and now they can’t follow Isabelle anymore.” You reply, a cold, hard pit growing in your stomach as you share a knowing glace with the brunette at your side.

“B’ni…she’s just entered the citadel.” Gina explains, her pace quickening in time with yours as the barrier recedes, allowing you a clear shot to the looming spire. “The tower, it’s different than the rest of the city. It’s blocking empathic material and beings…nothing in, nothing out but the living. I can’t sense Isabelle, so she’s at the threshold and has started to climb.”

“Peace of mind, reserved for the elite.” Comes November’s crackling huff. “Good to know some things are a depressingly universal constant regardless of species.”

“We need to get moving. Regardless of what happens up there, we’ll keep the geists occupied down here for your return.” Gina announces, looking between the three newcomers as both Holly and Uzu give GG a nod, while Johanna just folds her muscular arms meditatively, eyes closed. Kosi just thrusts her hands in her pockets, her frame utterly relaxed as Meg and Eloise keep their heads on a swivel, intent on keeping the coast clear for your imminent climb.

It’s down to you, Rath, November, and a small army of Amaras and a full suite of Swarmlings to ascend the pale white spire…less than ideal, but it’s what you planned to tackle Isabelle with when you entered.

You just hope it’ll be enough.

>>CHOOSE SQUAD MEMBERS AND LEADERS (4 MEMBER MAXIMUM PER SQUAD)

>>Available Dream Daughters: Gina, Meg, Eloise, Bella, Holly, Uzu, Johanna

>>Make any final adjustments before proceeding up the spire (Final Chance)

>>Write-In

YOU ARE IN CONTROL
>>
(Gentlemen, voting shall remain open for the next one and a half hours.)
>>
>>3637653
dang, expected something like this but still a shame that the tower blocks them from entering.

>Team 1 Leader; Gina
>Meg, Holly, Bella, Amara Clone


>Team 2 Leader; Uzu
> Johanna, Eloise, Amara Clone

tried to make the teams even in what they could accomplish. Gina and Uzu are both in a way terrain controllers, and i trust Gina as leader. Uzu is iffy in that role, but she still has the most experience with it and i have a feeling she is looking to make u for past mistakes. Meg and Johanna are both overall heavy hitters at close range, and Holly and Eloise are similar, but both more tool oriented than outright strength oriented. i gave Ginas team Bella as overall her team had much less overall ability level than Uzus, so it helps even things out, as Uzu and Johanna probably have alot more tools to play around with than Gina or Meg, so Bella helps add more options to a team with less. Amara Clones for better communication, just in case.

>Final Adjustments?
i think we're good, nothing i can think of just yet at least.
>>
>>3637653
>>3637677
wait, BHOP you forgot Kosi and so did i.
quick edit;

>Team 1 Leader; Gina
>Meg, Holly, Kosi, Amara Clone


>Team 2 Leader; Uzu
> Johanna, Eloise, Bella, Amara Clone

with that, Kosi is a powerhouse that can aid the first team, while Bella is a bit lower level but still has some similarities to Kosi, so can aid Team Two in her stead.
>>
>>3637681
(Ah, so I did; excellent catch.)
>>
>>3637653

>>Available Dream Daughters: Gina, Meg, Eloise, Bella, Holly, Uzu, Johanna (Curious no Sam..... did she not want to come or wait for a better opportunity)

Squad Leaders:
Gina: she has some experience and is capable of coordinating daughters through her Neuromancy

Eloise: Cool headed and probably has the capability and capacity to lead

Squads:
Eloise, Holly, Uzu

Johanna, Gina, Meg, Kosi

>>Make any final adjustments before proceeding up the spire (Final Chance)
I dont have any final adjustments i think everyone else hammered out the details very well
>>
>>3637688
Eloise would honestly be a terrible leader. a cool head does not translate to a good leader, you need much much more than that, and she has basically no people skills or experience even having friends. Uzu may of had issues being a leader before, but she still HAD at least some people skills and experience being a leader, and on top of her probably more than wanting to make up for that, there is still a reason people followed her, and this is a much different situation than running a monastary full of hundreds of daughters.

also you forgot Bella, and i feel your team doesn't properly take into account who is similar to eachother and overall power level.
>>
>>3637700
You are correct i forgot to mention Bella...... and the Eloise thing is probably true as well........... She could probably make a good leader with time and a bit of training/experience but you are correct no chance to do it now on the Fly. Uzu probably is our bst bet with any kind of experience, It just does not sit right with me all that much after her depiction how she handeled the monestary. I just see it vividly in my mind how one bad thing happens, purely by chance and she just freezes up because of some sort of guilt over letting someone else get hurt.

The powerlevel is what i wanted to mix up a bit. AS to not put all the really powerful daughters into one group but still covering our bases.
I can see a poin that maybe it could disrupt party cohesion by having the stronger daughters look out a bit for the weaker daughters but it is my belive that mixing the squads up a bit

On one hand your setup bring together two powerful Melee fighters with a massive Acid AOE and a powerful expressionist flesh artisan.

On the other hand we have Gina with some capabilities in crowd control and terraforming but nothing to exceptional, together with two moderatly powerful melee fighters and a healer that can probably bring in some constructs as far as i understand Kosis Powerset,

That is relatively unbalanced in their overall powerlevel, as Verurteilung of Gina is probably gonna be next to useless and against the Geister which leaves her with the halo and the terrarforming portion of her Skillset which is not all that much against the enemy htey face here. I just want to see them all safe and they can do that best if we split them up a bit so everyone can engage roughly equal threats(on the whole)
>>
>>3637753
i think you misunderstood what i thought, i was saying you were putting too many powerful folks on the same team and not spreading them out enough.

theres two factors to keep in mind here; Role Similarities and Power Levels.

Role Similarities;
>Gina and Uzu
both focus heavily on directly changing the terrain around them as their main focal point. both have other abilities sure, but that is their main focal point for sure.

>Meg and Johanna
Both focus heavily on fisticuffs backed up by other means, but unarmed fist based brutality is still boths main focal point.

>Holly and Eloise;
Both are more 'traditional' melee fighters, in that they use a 'tool' to dish out their close quarters melee without having to rely directly on their fists. Eloises speed and Hollys tongues range also both gives them different methods of quickly reacting to far off things.

>Kosi and Bella
both focus heavily on area control, but not outright altering their environment per say, so much as throwing something onto the environment, compared to the Transformers outright changing the environment.

now Power Levels;
>High power Levels
Johanna, Uzu, Kosi.
Uzu may of flaked but she was clearly of high level ,and i dont even need to argue the other two.

>Lower Power Levels
Gina, Bella, Meg, Eloise, Holly
not to say any of them are bad, just compared to the others they are outmatched on how far their kit has evolved, and otherwise were shown to have much more limited options and/or we know had much more limited growth. Gina and maybe Meg might be more Medium level, but arguably if enough to get their own tier.

hence with Gina and Uzu both conveniently being the best leaders, we can then split them up based off not putting two similar people together and trying to otherwise even out power level

So Holly and Eloise on differing teams, Johanna and Meg on differing teams, and Kosi and Bella on differing teams. my own plan then is how i think best to even out the power levels, though with knowing its never going to be perfect.
>>
>>3637785
alright yes i see what you mean. I was looking at it more broadly in terms of Melee fighter, AOE, CC, Healer/general Support. And based upon that i tried to find a match that would be acceptable.

It seems to me like you put a lot more time and thought into your set up than i did. I think i can support your proposal on those lines

>>3637653
Changing my vote from >>3637688
to supprting >>3637681
>>
File: The Body.jpg (51 KB, 471x800)
51 KB
51 KB JPG
>>3637653

>>Team 1: Gina (Leader), Meg, Holly, Kosi, Amara Clone

>>Team 2: Uzu (Leader), Johanna, Eloise, Bella, Amara Clone

Gina kisses you on the cheek, and you’re about to return the gesture when the ground carries you away from her at incredible speed as it pulses with amethyst light, bringing you and your team to the tower’s yawning entrance in the span of a few seconds. Your eyes meet hers as they fade into the growing distance, and you know.

What happens here changes everything.

You, Rath, Julia, and November enter the silent spire with the horde of Amaras, and ascend the spiral of stairs with tremendous speed, the sound of calcite skates carving into pale stone echoing down from on high. After what feels like an eternity you arrive at the summit, rounding the corner of a colossal doorframe that reveals…

The room is enormous, taking the form of a massive dodecahedron with slender windows that look out on the ruined city of Almath, far below. The space shimmers with a thin fog of neuromantic particles thrown up by your former friend, and through the haze you see her and her six duplicates, all sporting identical dresses of jet-black fabric. She and her clones are halfway into the room, carried along on skates of rippling flesh and shining bone, the high-speed result of a potent hybridization. They pay you no mind as they race to B’ni’s goal, suspended before the six thrones that lay empty at the opposite side of the grand hall…and it’s a thing to behold.

Mother’s body is a regal thing, draped in black-gold finery, her gaunt Hexane features standing in sharp relief, even at this considerable distance. You can feel it, too…this terrible, catastrophic power, locked in a slender frame, hovering a few inches above the ground and emanating its world-ending potential throughout this alabaster tomb.

The power that won a Crucible, once upon a time.

The power that can win it again.

There’s one shot at this, one chance to ensure that Mother’s plan dies on the vine.

It’s time you take control.

HP: 650% (+35%, Matrons Stoicism, Ignition Gauntlets, Whistle: CUNT TER RHO)
BIO: 690% (+60%, 19 Sub. Rook-Platelings, Sub/Rec.[You/Rath/Julia/November: Armored], 6 Sub. Quad Knighted-Grapplings, 2 Sub. Jacklings, 2 Sub. Scarlet Drones, 3 Sub. Bishops [Shu, Rath, Julia], 4 Sub/Rec. Bane-Nomlings, 36/36)
CONTENDER: 2 x B.33 Loaded, Sword Form.
RAVENOUS MAW: Primed.
HUNDRED-HANDED: None.
ACT: 3/3

RATH HP: 860% (70%, Sui Tormentis, Gutgrab Daggers, 2400% ATK+, 2400% SPD+, 2400% DEF+)
JULIA HP: 880% (20%, Hydras Heart, Manus Caelorum, Cursas Alas, 20 Daggers, BLOODY RIPPER x 2)
NOVEMBER HP: 970% (Tier 1 Core)
CLONES: 43 Remaining, all with Radiant Boils in hand.

Threat: Seven strong, real body unknown, Relic location unknown, medium distance from you. Racing at high speed towards Mother’s true body, medium distance away from Isabelle’s team. Cloud of neuromantic dust between you and the team.

YOU ARE IN CONTROL
>>
(Gentlemen, voting shall remain open for the next two hours.)

(Good luck.)
>>
>>3637893
oh boy, here we go.

SHU;
>Send the 6 Knightlings to intercept the Isabelles, pushing to get infront of her and spawn Hundred-Hands to both block her path by connecting together and aim to grapple the clones as best they can.
>Have the 4 Nomlings team up to cover the extra Isabelle compared to Grapplings we have.
>Hitch a ride with Rath.
>Once you land, pick two target that seem to be the furthest forward and send a BB at each, then aid your Knights in keeping the arm net up and the Clones back.
>Terraform the ground to drop out from under the Clones, then prepare the Jacklings to strike whichever ones get out first and lock them down, then move in with your Maw and Lionheart.
>As the Clones try and escape the side of the pit, activate Spiral where you can to not trip up your allies, to throw their footing off and back into the pit if you so can.

RATH;
>Pickup Julia and Shu
>see if you cant fling yourself up and above the Clones using a pillar or ceiling beam, and rain down Boils to block the Isabelles advancement.
>use Extra limbs to drop down Shu and Julia infront of the Clones.
>test the waters, toss a few boils at Mothers corpse as you land.
>If they seem to work, Keep bombarding it til you are forced to help face the clones, if they do not, turn and help keep the clones back, as you wait to see the next option.

JULIA;
>Hitch a ride with Rath, use your Cursas to help boost the group along further.
>Once you drop, take a second to pick out the Clone causing the most trouble and rush in to keep it back.

NOVEMBER;
>get your BAR up and spinning, and lay down covering fire on the Clones as Rath and the others get into position.
>Once the others land, take careful aim, shooting for the ones not yet covered to give them a hard time.

AMARA CLONES;
>Have 3 Clones ride along with Shu and the others, Priming their Halos to be prepared to cover for them.
>Have a Clone ride on each Knightling, Halos Primed.
>Have 3 Cover November, Halos Primed.
>Have the rest start making their way to block off the corpse, taking a long arc around the clones, ready to react to keep the clones back as necessary.
>Keep their eyes and halos peeled, try and pick out where the relic is, there has to be a sign, either an arm preoccupied, an Isabelle getting more protection, or some sign it is on that ones body.
>>
>>3637894
My guess is there is no Biomass up here we can Terraform is there?

How big is mothers body? if we can see it it must be very large.

How many Movementzones roughly is this room large?
(If Isabelle didnt make it more than half the distance while we climbed up than it has to be at 30 Zones of Movement unless the Citadel itself worked against her to slow her down.)
Was there Signs of fighting on the way up here?

I would like confirmation on these as far as possible
>>
>>3637956
(There is no biomass here, no.)

(The body is roughly eleven feet tall.)

(There were no signs of fighting. She faced no opposition on the spire, she merely paused to collect herself for a moment before she realized just how close you actually were. Mother could not afford to reach out and warn her, at this point.)

(The room is approximately six movement zones in diameter, in game terms. It's quite tall, also.)
>>
>>3637975
dang, well cuts that down to just the Spiral at best then.

Elven feet talls not too bad. not something id want us to have to lug around but could be much worse.
>>
>>3637975
Alright this helps me visualize the Arena thanks BHOP

One more Question if you permit:
Based on our Experience would a dead body still have the resistances and HEALTH it had in life?
Like a second health bar that can be degraded till the body is destroyed?


>>3637951
If you allow me to take this as a basis for a new plan i would be much obliged


SHU;
>Send the 6 Knightlings to intercept the Isabelles, pushing to get infront of her
>Spawn Hundred-Hands to both block her path by connecting together and aim to grapple the clones as best they can while at the same time flinging yourself forward by spawning hundred handed downwards and back to fling youself forward with the sudden force of expansion and collapse them afterwards you need as much bio as possible in your Grapplings to keep uo the net
>Have the 4 Nomlings team up to cover the extra Isabelle compared to Grapplings we have.
>Have Julia und Rath hitch a ride with you
>Once you land, pick two target that seem to be the furthest forward and send a BB at each clones knee, then aid your Knights in keeping the arm net up and the Clones back.
> the Jacklings strike whichever clone tries to get away first and second, lock them down, then move in with your Maw and Lionheart.
>Load more BBs and shoot more kneecaps out

RATH;
>Pickup Julia and latch onto Shu
>Rain down boils in front of the CLones to block their way and chuck a couple extra at mothers corpse
>use Extra limbs to drop down Julia infront of the Clones while shu lands
>If the boils seem to work, Keep bombarding it til you are forced to help face the clones, if they do not, turn and help keep the clones back, as you wait to see the next option.

JULIA;
>Hitch a ride with Rath, use your Cursas to help boost the group along further.
>Once you drop, take a second to pick out the Clone causing the most trouble and rush in to keep it back.

NOVEMBER;
>get your BAR up and spinning, and lay down covering fire on the Clones as Rath and the others get into position.
>Once the others land, take careful aim, shooting for the ones not yet covered to give them a hard time. Try and go for disable if outright kill is not possible.

AMARA CLONES;
>Have 3 Clones ride along with Shu and the others, Priming their Halos to be prepared to cover for them.
>Have a Clone ride on each Knightling, Halos Primed.
>Have 3 Cover November, Halos Primed.
>Have the rest start making their way to block off the corpse, taking a long arc around the clones, ready to react to keep the clones back as necessary.
>Keep their eyes and halos primed, try and pick out where the relic is, there has to be a sign, either an arm preoccupied, an Isabelle getting more protection, or some sign it is on that ones body.

>>3637985
Could we maybe use Rath and Shus Dualtech to slice of the corpses head and devour it? Should be difficult to transfer a brain if there is nowhere left to transfer it
>>
>>3638036
(Due to the unique circumstances surrounding the preservation of Mother's body, you have no precedent for this situation, I'm afraid.)

(However, given that the body is emanating with power, the safest bet is to assume it still possesses all the powers and resistances Mother had in her prime.)
>>
>>3638036
seems alright, but with a few points.

i was gonna add
>As a last resort, slam down a Spiral to throw off Isabelles footing and keep her from breaking through.
to Shus orders.

otherwise, well, i guess its more a question, but im not sure if Shu bringing everyone forward would work as well? the Hundred-Handed Arm compression is super fast sure, but otherwise hers and their strength isnt that great, but Rath has both an extreme speed and strength boost to both help her use her Strands to pull forward and carry everyone forward. i guess im unsure if the Hands compression alone is enough to outweigh the benefits of having Rath pull everyone forward.

>Could we maybe use Rath and Shus Dualtech to slice of the corpses head and devour it? Should be difficult to transfer a brain if there is nowhere left to transfer it
my thoughts exactly, BUT i wanted to wait and see how the corpse reacts to the boils. the last thing we need is Rath charging it and it turns out to have auto counters and defenses we have to break through first, so i wanna make sure rushing it to cut it up is even possible and not gonna get us fucked. oh, and Raths Strands dont rely on the Swarmlings getting in place first, Shus Hands do.

>>3638052
yeah, so we should certainly test the waters as it was first, so we dont send Rath in to get bitch slapped.

BHOP, could Shus HH Compression or Raths Strands pull us along faster?
>>
>>3638068
(Rath's strands would be the fastest method at current.)
>>
>>3638080
>>3638036
then yeah, id prefer to stick to Rath bringing us forward. Isabelles too fast to take the slower method.
>>
>>3638052
Alright so no Autumn Protocol to the face to instantly wipe the corpse from the face of Almath...... Its a sad day for supercharged plasmabased Weaponry......

>>3638080
Do you still have the Sheet/ link to the sheet that contains our Dualtechs at the ready?

>>3638068
>As a last resort, slam down a Spiral to throw off Isabelles footing and keep her from breaking through.
Doesnt fear to tread need biomass it can distort? There is no Biomass up here we are practicly in an anti-Terraforming zone as far i understand it
>>
>>3638091
Okay i thought that HH would be faster but that is clearly not the case so i am perfectly happy to take Raths travel method if there is a suitable piece of envoirment we can slingshot off of, otherwise we need to provide that ourselves by creating HH pillars from a grappling
>>
>>3638095
i thought it just altered the ground, biomass or not. but i suppose i could be wrong on that.

Dual Techs;
https://pastebin.com/Jhd452yt

>>3638101
true, but id imagine her using a Knight or swarmling as an anchor would still be faster. just how much that wouls slow her down is the issue, but not something we can avoid perhaps.
>>
>>3638095
>>3638108
(The Spiral will still work.)
>>
>>3638135
Does terraforming? Could Shu slam up some quick barriers around the corpse?
>>
>>3638135
Ohhhh.... that changes things.

>>3638174
>>3638108

SHU;
>Send the 6 Knightlings to intercept the Isabelles, pushing to get infront of her
>Spawn Hundred-Hands to both block her path by connecting together and aim to grapple the clones as best they can while at the same time flinging yourself forward by spawning hundred handed downwards and back to fling youself forward with the sudden force of expansion and collapse them afterwards you need as much bio as possible in your Grapplings to keep uo the net
>Have the 4 Nomlings team up to cover the extra Isabelle compared to Grapplings we have.

*>hitch a ride with Rath

>Once you land, pick two target that seem to be the furthest forward and send a BB at each clones knee, then aid your Knights in keeping the arm net up and the Clones back.
> the Jacklings strike whichever clone tries to get away first and second, lock them down, then move in with your Maw and Lionheart.
>Load more BBs and shoot more kneecaps out

*>As a last resort, slam down a Spiral to throw off Isabelles footing and keep her from breaking through.

RATH;
>Pickup Julia and Shu

*>see if you cant fling yourself up and above the Clones using a pillar or ceiling beam, rain down boils in front of the Clones to block their way and chuck a couple extra at mothers corpse

>use Extra limbs to drop down Julia infront of the Clones while shu lands
>If the boils seem to work, Keep bombarding it til you are forced to help face the clones, if they do not, turn and help keep the clones back, as you wait to see the next option.

JULIA;
>Hitch a ride with Rath, use your Cursas to help boost the group along further.
>Once you drop, take a second to pick out the Clone causing the most trouble and rush in to keep it back.

NOVEMBER;
>get your BAR up and spinning, and lay down covering fire on the Clones as Rath and the others get into position.
>Once the others land, take careful aim, shooting for the ones not yet covered to give them a hard time. Try and go for disable if outright kill is not possible.

AMARA CLONES;
>Have 3 Clones ride along with Shu and the others, Priming their Halos to be prepared to cover for them.
>Have a Clone ride on each Knightling, Halos Primed.
>Have 3 Cover November, Halos Primed.

*>Have 7 Clones cast FOL RHO CUNT at the Isabelle clones to slow them down
The Geister can not reach us so we can freely use Skintalker Spells again any other suggestions

>Have the rest start making their way to block off the corpse, taking a long arc around the clones, ready to react to keep the clones back as necessary.
>Keep their eyes and halos primed, try and pick out where the relic is, there has to be a sign, either an arm preoccupied, an Isabelle getting more protection, or some sign it is on that ones body.

>>3638174
Reference this>>3637975
Make of it what you will
>>
>>3638185
>Make of it what you will
Yeah, but if Fear To Tread works despite there being no biomass, I'd expect that terraforming would to.

Anyways, I think this plan is solid, but don't forget to make the Amaras' spells GRA-enhanced. No reason not to.
>>
>>3637893
>>3637951
>>3638196
yeah i can support these additions. hopefully the Primed-Counters do what i want and cancel out Isabelles opening bonuses, but to be fair if they do not we probably couldn't stop them anyways then.

actually, make those GRA RHO CUNTs. GRA is a direct outright boost to the spell, while i think BHOP has said FOL cannot act as an actual boost.

>>3638209
Fear just twirls what is around us is what im thinking, biomass or not. Terraforming actually requires Biomass to bend. think if Tread more like...an Aura ability, but shot into the ground instead of making peoples emotions go wild. or so im guessing.
>>
>>3638209
>>3638174
(To clarify, the Spiral's initial spin will still be effective, but it will cease to spin after its start-up rotation since the ground is not true biomass. Lesser Flesh Artisan powers would normally be ineffective against non-biomass terrain, much like Neuromancy would, but Fear to Tread is incredibly powerful even at its base level.)
>>
>>3638237
I see. Well, that's significantly less useful than we might have hoped for. And B'Ni can probably deal with a temporary spin just fine, with her skills being at level ten and then hybridized. I'd rather not use the spiral, then.
>>
>>3638251
>>3638237
its much less useful than i hoped, BUT this actually can work out. we only want to use it as a last resort to keep Isabelle down, but now its not constantly tripping up our allies either. it still will trip her up is the thing, its still the ground suddenly shifting under her, so its still worth using.
>>
>>3638232
Oh yes i mixed the two up thank you for the catch .... Disrupting concentration would do us no good against her

>>3638237
So i thought along the right lines that this place is not made of true Biomass and thus can not be affected by Terraforming...... i hate i was right

>>3637893

Casting my Vote with this:

SHU;
>Send the 6 Knightlings to intercept the Isabelles, pushing to get infront of her
>Spawn Hundred-Hands to both block her path by connecting together and aim to grapple the clones as best they can while at the same time flinging yourself forward by spawning hundred handed downwards and back to fling youself forward with the sudden force of expansion and collapse them afterwards you need as much bio as possible in your Grapplings to keep uo the net
>Have the 4 Nomlings team up to cover the extra Isabelle compared to Grapplings we have.
>hitch a ride with Rath
>Once you land, pick two target that seem to be the furthest forward and send a BB at each clones knee, then aid your Knights in keeping the arm net up and the Clones back.
> the Jacklings strike whichever clone tries to get away first and second, lock them down, then move in with your Maw and Lionheart.
>Load more BBs and shoot more kneecaps out
>As a last resort, slam down a Spiral to throw off Isabelles footing and keep her from breaking throug by tripping her up

RATH;
>Pickup Julia and Shu
>see if you cant fling yourself up and above the Clones using a pillar or ceiling beam, rain down boils in front of the Clones to block their way and chuck a couple extra at mothers corpse
>use Extra limbs to drop down Julia infront of the Clones while shu lands
>If the boils seem to work, Keep bombarding it til you are forced to help face the clones, if they do not, turn and help keep the clones back, as you wait to see the next option.

JULIA;
>Hitch a ride with Rath, use your Cursas to help boost the group along further.
>Once you drop, take a second to pick out the Clone causing the most trouble and rush in to keep it back.

NOVEMBER;
>get your BAR up and spinning, and lay down covering fire on the Clones as Rath and the others get into position.
>Once the others land, take careful aim, shooting for the ones not yet covered to give them a hard time. Try and go for disable if outright kill is not possible.

AMARA CLONES;
>Have 3 Clones ride along with Shu and the others, Priming their Halos to be prepared to cover for them.
>Have a Clone ride on each Knightling, Halos Primed.
>Have 3 Cover November, Halos Primed.
>Have 7 Clones cast GRA RHO CUNT at the Isabelle clones to slow them down
>Have the rest start making their way to block off the corpse, taking a long arc around the clones, ready to react to keep the clones back as necessary.
>Keep their eyes and halos primed, try and pick out where the relic is, there has to be a sign, either an arm preoccupied, an Isabelle getting more protection, or some sign it is on that ones body.
>>
>>3638293
Looks good to me. Supporting.

Anyways, looks like it was in fact the neurocloud power that B'Ni is using for stealth, not something separate she got from West. Leaving aside the fact that we should have seen a cloud of smoke last time she showed up, what sort of trouble do you think the cloud is going to give? Gina didn't mention it as part of her arsenal, so it's presumably not too useful, but do you think it might impede our accuracy or something like that? Block out our Halo-based senses, make it harder to spot things with them?
>>
>>3638322
no idea honestly. part of the reason i wanted to go over too was to avoid finding it. she might not be able to keep it up if we harm her, but i guarantee we dont want to be in it, even if its just neuromantic blockers. sadly i dont think we have too many tools to get rid of it, which might become a massive problem even if it is nothing but camouflage. my guess however is itll allow her to 'feel' through the smoke, seeing hits coming, knowing where we are even if stealthed, that sorta stuff.
>>
>>3638322
It probably does what it says on the Surface. Acting as chaff to disrupt Thoughtform communication and Detection. Could be that it would disrupt our Empathic field. At least the higher functions

I would guess that we should not move to deep into it, developing it further could grant it a stealth aspect she could use to literally disappear on us when we enter the fog.
She could as become more aware of things inside the fog acting as another sense

It will definetly affect our Accuracy as it is still chaff and makes her look hazy
>>
>>3638348
Yeah, that seems plausible, given that B'Ni knows we've got stealth of our own. She'd want a defense against it.

>>3638354
I'm not sure how we can avoid going deeper into the neurocloud, though. It's being emanated by the B'Nis, we need to go into it to fight them. Maybe Rath and November slinging around fire will burn it away, though. Oh, or those specialized swarmlings with the big wings for dispersing gas. Shit, should we convert the banelings to those real quick?
>>
>>3638370
>>3638348
You mean Winglings?


We can do that, convert like 6 Bane-Nomlings to Bane-Winglings to disperse the cloud?

Place them in strategic postions to blow the mist towards the windows which we smash with maybe November shooting them out?
>>
>>3638370
nah, the clouds said to be behind them for the most part, that should give us at least a turn id think to make our move.

plus, we dont exactly have the slots to spare honestly.
>>
>>3638402
Yeah. The neurocloud is between us and the B'Nis. We should disperse it real quick.

>>3638403
No, in front of them, we'd need to pass through it to get to the B'Nis.
>>
>>3638402
we only have 4 and if we pull them back one Isabelle is suddenly alot more open to do what she pleases.
>>
>>3638413
its coming from them but its worded as if it is between us and them, hence me wanting to go up and over it. even if its coming from them it will be massively thinner infront of them, as they moving forward moves them out of it at least a bit. and again, we dont have swarmling slots to spare., nor do i think it is worth it to cut our numbers down permanently just yet over an ability we might be able to otherwise work around.
>>
>>3638416
Yeah, but what if the neurocloud hits us with something nasty as we pass through it? If we're not going to disperse it we need to change the vote to go around it. Well, I guess we kind of already are, we're trying to fling ourselves up and over the clones to hit them from the other side, but I'm just worried we'll get caught anyway.
>>
>>3638413
>>3638433

Yeah i see it now we really have no more Swarmling cap to do it.

Could we have one of the Amara clones start SWARM OF THE SONG to get more Cap?
Then we could spawn a couple Winglings to start blowing the cloud away

We would still have 18 Amaras standing by and moving towards mothers corpse
>>
>>3638433
if its so thick and being produced so fast its reaching the ceiling, we couldn't hope to get rid of it anyways. which im not so sure it is, but that still means we can go over and around it instead. losing the extra help keeping one of the clones back is just asking for that to be the one that breaks through.

>>3638438
might work, we can try it sure.
>>
>>3638446
I'm just worried about the maximum height we'll be able to reach. But so long as Rath slings off the Knights as they approach, we should be fine. We've got everyone armored up with Chitinous Stalwarts, anyway, Ashen Fortitude should help protect against any neuromantic effects. Well, except for the Amaras. Sorry, Amaras. Though if things do go bad they can use FOL spells to help clear the effects.
>>
>>3637893
Amending my Vote >>3638293
to include
Have one of the Amara Clones start the Dualtech SONG OF THE SWARM to increase our swarmling cap and spawn 4 Basic Winglings to disperse the Cloud towards the entrance and the windows

November "Firesweep" shoot out a couple of Windows while laying down suppressive Fire
>>
>>3638438
>>3638446
(Are you saying that you wish to add this to your current plan?)

(Also, the fog does not stretch to the ceiling.)
>>
>>3638465
yes i do wish to add it to my current plan

I am sorry if it came out unclear
>>
>>3638463
>>3638465
well im not so sure on the windows but the Song and Winglings sure ill support that.
>>
>>3638469
(No worries, I just wanted to confirm before I started adding it. The update will take a little while as its been a Monday, but it hopefully won't take too long.)
>>
>>3638463
Not the entrance, we're at the entrance. That would be bad. But yes, the windows.
>>
>>3638483
Are the Windows open already i assumed they were closed with glass or something similar

>>3638489
If we can not get it out through the windows the entrance will be the only place left to disperes it into otherwise we are just spreading it further into the room.

November can take it she has resistance to Neuromancy
>>
>>3638500
(The windows are covered in a thick, crystalline material that is clear.)
>>
>>3638515
Ah okay so breaking them is unlikely could you then add that november does not shoot a the windows specifcly if we break one in the fight we can redirect the Winglings to blow it out there so november does not have to stand in the Chaff

I am terribly sorry that i still want to change things after the end of Voting
>>
>>3638526
(No worries. I normally wouldn't, but given the make-or-break nature of this scenario, I understand.)
>>
>>3638500
>If we can not get it out through the windows the entrance will be the only place left to disperes it into otherwise we are just spreading it further into the room.
I was thinking we'd push it towards the sides of the room. Make a clear space in the center where we can fight.

>>3638552
Yeah, sorry about this. I blame myself, I came in late because I had to take care of some other stuff.
>>
You know what we need before starting an epic battle? Some music. Luckily, a new volume of rwby songs dropped not long ago and I think this one can do.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0HQ55qf5gdA
>>
It's kind of funny that B'Ni thinks we're the villain and we're matching her beliefs by starting the fight off with an ominous chant, a wind blowing away the fog, and invisible monsters tackling her. We're a much better boss fight than she is, dramatically-speaking. The Negaverse quest where she's the protagonist probably has the audience so excited right now.
>>
>>3638634
its talk like that that makes BHOP smile as Isabelle pulls insane tricks out of her sleeve.
>>
>>3638653
Too late, she blew her chance for a dramatic entrance. Doesn't matter what skills she pulls out, we've all got terrifying body horror powers. It's about the presentation, and she's lost the ability to do her most shocking moves.
>>
>>3638692
well, fair, but i meant more she might fuck up said entrance.
>>
(Bamboozling imminent, Gentlemen.)
>>
>>3638835
>Gina said Isabelle could spawn seven clones.
Yeah, and all seven were there already. The clones are all equally B'Ni, her "original" body counts as one of them. We saw B'Ni and six duplicates, so they were all accounted for. Unless the fact that there's no true body was only because of synergy between Resentiment's Mirror and B'Ni's super-regeneration, and deleting that means there's a real body that is a weak spot, now?
>>
File: Emerald Noose.png (1.71 MB, 1280x906)
1.71 MB
1.71 MB PNG
>>3637893

Your sextet of Knightlings rip through the air, straining to catch up to B’ni and her constructs as Rath throws an arm around you and Julia, flinging her hand out at blinding speed towards the ceiling. The limb strikes home, burying itself deep within the stonework before the three of you are hauled skywards, leaving your newborn Winglings behind as your Amaras begin a chorus, strengthening your hive before the whistling of air and the roar of November’s gunfire robs you of your hearing. The space below you distorts under the effects of the simultaneous Skintalker assault, and you see your foes slow, just a hair.

The Knightlings are now gaining on the troop of Isabelles, barely keeping up with their ludicrous pace as you suddenly find yourself rocketing down to the ground when Rath kicks off the ceiling, aiming for the space between B’ni and Mother’s hovering form before the red-head lets go of your artisan. Julia hits the ground first, rounding on a B’ni that’s suddenly in her face as you struggle to orient yourself, and you take a moment’s stock of what’s happened to your swarm. They’re swinging at nothing, struggling to grab hold of thin, empty air…except it’s not empty. It’s filled to bursting with the mind-altering dust you so narrowly avoided, being blown away by your Winglings to the sides of the room but not soon enough to save your brood from the confusion that wracks their systems. It won’t last long, a few seconds at most…but at this moment, it may as well be years.

You bring the Contender to bear as well as you can, enough to fire a round into the knee of the clone in front of you and sending it tumbling into the stairs before you fire at another pair of legs. Your round whizzes past B’ni’s legs, the blur of movement carrying her past Rath…if she wasn’t wearing the Sui Tormentis, that is. Four arms fling out, clothes lining a pair of clones before snatching them up, and you turn your attention to the three others that were lagging behind as you hear Rath snap the legs of the two she’s holding. You slam your hand down, and the moment the ground begins to shift under the effects of Uzu’s power the team kicks off, a pair making it skyward and leaving behind a clone whose legs are caught in the alabaster undertow of frigid stone.

It’s when your Winglings finally clear away enough of the shimmering fog that the play becomes clear, with fractions of a second to spare. Another figure leaps from the dispersing cloud, her presence concealed up until now by the choking chaff. Her dark dress flutters as she ascends higher than the other two that threaten to clear your barrier, three pairs of emerald eyes locked onto Mother’ body.

Seven.

Gina said Isabelle could spawn seven clones.

(Continued)
>>
>>3638874

Your small army of children is behind, too far behind to get closer in any span of time. Your current swarm is crippled, too late to be of use against the airborne trio that threatens to end this, here and now. Your world moves at a snail’s pace as it occurs to you that while you’ve been playing football, B’ni’s been playing a far more vertical game.

A spread of three bodies dart towards you, perfectly spaced. No tells, no cues. Perhaps it was too hopeful, too optimistic to think she’d dare give you anything to go on. She knows how you think in every way that matters on the battlefield, and in no way at all when it comes to how you feel.

It’s down to the wire, now or never.

Emerald eyes shine in the light as the world slows to a halt.

>>TIME UNTIL IMPACT: 1 ACT

HP: 650% (+35%, Matrons Stoicism, Ignition Gauntlets, Whistle: CUNT TER RHO)
BIO: 690% (+60%, 19 Subversive Rook-Platelings, Subversive/Recursive [You/Rath/Julia/November: Armored], 6 Subversive Quad Knighted-Grapplings, 2 Subversive Jacklings, 2 Subversive Scarlet Drones, 3 Subversive Bishops [Shu, Rath, Julia: 2 Rounds Left], 4 Subversive/Recursive Bane-Nomlings, 4 Winglings, 40/46)
CONTENDER: 2 x B.33 Loaded, Sword Form.
RAVENOUS MAW: Primed.
HUNDRED-HANDED: None.
ACT: 3/3

RATH HP: 860% (70%, Sui Tormentis, Gutgrab Daggers, 2400% ATK+, 2400% SPD+, 2400% DEF+)
JULIA HP: 880% (20%, Hydras Heart, Manus Caelorum, Cursas Alas, 20 Daggers, BLOODY RIPPER x 2)
NOVEMBER HP: 970% (Tier 1 Core)
CLONES: 43 Remaining, all with Radiant Boils in hand. [Song of the Swarm: ACTIVE]

Threat: Eight strong, real body unknown, Relic location unknown, close. Julia with one in melee, Rath has two in hand, one is rising at your feet after you shot her in the knee, one caught by Fear to tread, two airborne, almost within touching distance of Mother’s body. One final one, having emerged from the fog and higher in the air than the others.

YOU ARE IN CONTROL
>>
(Voting shall remain open for the next two hours, Gentlemen. Apologies for the bamboozle, it's been a day. I hope yours is going well, and good luck.)

>>3638873
(There are eight enemy bodies in play; B'ni and seven clones. You saw seven bodies in play at the start, and B'ni had cloaked the eighth one before you arrived via Cere's power.)
>>
>>3638845
Well this is it yeah........ Now or never Damn you OP this is killing me..... and did mother dump a level onto Isabelle? was that the deed that weakend her so much?

To deal with Isabelle we are gonna need Hundred Handed

They are our fatest reaction time with the biggest application of Range and Area affected.

>Spawn a chain of Hundred Handed Hands from our own Hand. Have the Hand Chain split and then grasp every Isabelle at a bodypart they can securely hold and immediatly collapse towards Shu. HAve Rath jump in between Shu and the Incoming Isabelles to grab and smash them all into the ground.
She can neither dodge nor gain momentum while Airborn so this should work

>>3638873
>>3638830
Just to stop Isabelle right now. Any other suggestions Anons?
>>
>>3638879
SHU;
>have the Knights converge to stop the airborne group, one per the three, three per the higher one.
>Quickly slice the neck of the one before you in an arc as you bring the contender high, firing off the BBs at whatever you can hit above you, as you lash out with you Maw and HH to slam whichever one you can away.
>Have the Jacklings grab onto Rath and ride to the corpse, to intercept and lock down any Clones that get close.
>Have the Banelings focus down the clones already injured or behind, to keep them from catching up to the rest.

RATH;
>Quickly finish off the ones you have or toss them far away and Get moving again.
>Slingshot yourself to Mothers corpse, putting yourself between Isabelle and the corpse, and set literally everything on fire with boils as you enter Ignition mode. Im talking the ground, Mother, and the Isabelles in the air. Make the entire area an inferno.

NOVEMBER;
>See if you can gun down the airborne Clones, as you rush forward.
>Once within range, switch to aiding Julia with the shotgun, or Claws if its otherwise unsafe.

JULIA;
>Unleash a barrage of 10 quick jabs into your Isabelle clone, both hands going for slices to regain your health.
>If she gets past yours or your Amara clones Counter and gets a hit on you, quickly use Frozen to dish it back.
>>
>>3638879
Right, we've got several tether moves. We can pull down one B'Ni with the tongue and the other two with Hundred-Hands.

>>3638893
>(There are eight enemy bodies in play; B'ni and seven clones. You saw seven bodies in play at the start, and B'ni had cloaked the eighth one before you arrived via Cere's power.)
Right, but I mean that being only able to make seven clones means that she can have herself and six others. Her original body is a clone, too. At least, it was the last time we fought her.
>>
>>3638903
>>3638879
whoops, forgot Amaras orders
AMARA CLONES;
>Keep rushing forward, split one off per injured Clone to sneeze in their face.
>The Rest need to rush to help Rath block off the Corpse, use GRA SAN THA on themselves to get there faster.
>Once there, ger Halos primed and Queens up, and SNEEZE in unison to make a wall of SNEEZE between the airborne Isabelles and the corpse.
>Use GRA SAN THA on Rath.
>>
>>3638903
I don't think the Knights are fast enough to catch them. We should go with our tether moves. Fire off several Hundred-Hands chains to pull them down.
>>
>>3638907
(B'ni has a core, singular body now, one that is capable of sustaining a supposed maximum of seven clones at one time, hence the eight bodies. One of the eight is her actual body.)
>>
>>3638923
well, they actually seemed to have been able to catch up, it was the neurotic cloud that made them stop is the problem. plus, hardly the only thing i had going after them, and they will help tremendously once they do get them.
>>
>>3638903
This Anon>>3638923
is right we have about a second to bring all the Isabelles away from the Corpse.

The Knightlings might be fast but no need to risk it the Chains are literally lightning fast and can stop Isabelle not only dead in her tracks but actually make her put more distance between her and the corpse
We can have the Knights carry them away afterwards

By spawning several Hundred Handed Chains we can get them all away as in mid Air they can not dodge and can not gain momentum nor change trajectory.

And we have to stop her from just dissolving clones and bringing them out with her real body to quickly close the distance. We can only do it by being faster than she can react
>>
>>3638928
I see. So either it was a synergy with her regeneration or just Resentiment's Mirror abandoning the lack of true body in exchange for the separate health pools. Either way, good. One more body isn't going to make much difference, but B'Ni having a weak point will.

Also, I feel in hindsight like my tone sounded a bit accusatory and I'm sorry if it did. That wasn't my intent.

>>3638937
Yeah, I just saw that you did have a "pull them down with tether moves" bit in your vote, sorry I overlooked it. But I'm not sure we have the time for it. We have one action before they reach the Corpse, and your tether comes after finishing off the downed body. I'd rather grab the B'nis first.
>>
>>3638937
(I'm afraid the majority of your currently summoned swarm will be coming back online in the middle of next turn, and there is 1 ACT until impact from one of the threatening sources. There's certainly nothing wrong with planning the full turn, in fact I encourage it; I just wanted to make you aware of the time constraint in case it wasn't obvious.)

>>3638954
(Oh, no harm done. I appreciate your consideration, I just wanted to make the scenario clear.)
>>
>>3638953
>>3638954
yeah i see the confusion, i re-worded it to
SHU;
>have the Knights converge to stop the airborne group, one per the three, three per the higher one.
>Quickly slice the neck of the one before you in an arc as you bring the contender high, firing off the BBs at whatever you can hit above you.
>Use your Maw and HH to grab hold and slam the airborne Isabelles into the ground, to await your Knights.
>Have the Jacklings grab onto Rath and ride to the corpse, to intercept and lock down any Clones that get close.
>Have the Banelings focus down the clones already injured or behind, to keep them from catching up to the rest.

to be more clear what i wanted.
>>
>>3638959
fair enough.
so the knights will still go for the airborne group, just once they can.
>>
>>3638962
Alright, I guess works, then. I've got to go drop someone off real quick, so goodbye for now. Not sure if I'll get back before the next story post, don't know how far this place is. Later, everyone.
>>
>>3638879
Supporting >>3638903
and >>3638915

with the Amendment to Shus Actions like this >>3638962
with a priority given to the Maw and Hundred Handed Action to stop Isabelle from getting to the Corpse


>>3638959
Is Shus Halo primed to counter?
>>
>>3638879
what>>3639029
said.
>>
>>3639029
there SHOULD be an Amara clone with everyone with a primed halo.
>>
>>3639049
(There is, yes. You're quite well-protected.)

>>3639029
(If you believe you would have primed it before the encounter or if you wish to prime it now, then by all means.)
>>
>>3639049
>>3639057
If the Amara clones can throw themselves into critical attacks that are not directed at them then we do not need to prime the Halo but otherwise i would like to prime them
>>
>>3638903
>>3638915
>>3638879
SHU;
>Quickly slice the neck of the one before you in an arc as you bring the contender high, firing off the BBs at whatever you can hit above you.
>Use your Maw and HH to grab hold and slam the airborne Isabelles into the ground, to await your Knights.
>Have the Jacklings grab onto Rath and ride to the corpse, to intercept and lock down any Clones that get close.
>have the Knights converge to stop the airborne group once you grab hold of them.
>Have the Banelings focus down the clones already injured or behind, to keep them from catching up to the rest.

RATH;
>Quickly finish off the ones you have or toss them far away and Get moving again.
>Slingshot yourself to Mothers corpse, putting yourself between Isabelle and the corpse, and set literally everything on fire with boils as you enter Ignition mode. Im talking the ground, Mother, and the Isabelles in the air. Make the entire area an inferno.

NOVEMBER;
>See if you can gun down the airborne Clones, as you rush forward.
>Once within range, switch to aiding Julia with the shotgun, or Claws if its otherwise unsafe.

JULIA;
>Unleash a barrage of 10 quick jabs into your Isabelle clone, both hands going for slices to regain your health.
>If she gets past yours or your Amara clones Counter and gets a hit on you, quickly use Frozen to dish it back.

AMARA CLONES;
>Keep rushing forward, split one off per injured Clone to sneeze in their face.
>The Rest need to rush to help Rath block off the Corpse, use GRA SAN THA on themselves to get there faster.
>Once there, ger Halos primed and Queens up, and SNEEZE in unison to make a wall of SNEEZE between the airborne Isabelles and the corpse.
>Use GRA SAN THA on Rath.

just for BHOPS sake, heres the so far finalized orders together.
>>
>>3639159
>See if you can gun down the airborne Clones, as you rush forward.
What range are the B'Nis to her? Close enough that she can use her shotgun and turn this into skeet shooting?
>>
>>3639182
hard to say, was more of wanting to make sure she got a shot first than risk the shotgun spread at her range being too negated. November is currently the furthest back too.
>>
>>3639182
>>3639189
(Her best bet is the BAR at this range.)
>>
>>3639189
>>3639193
Ah, too bad. Shotguns are literally made for shooting things out of the sky. Okay, and other things, but that's one of the fields they excel at. Well, rapid fire is good at catching flying objects too, I suppose.
>>
>>3639197
once she gets closer she can, but for now she wasn't in a good position to move forward and so will do so at her own pace.
>>
>>3639209
Yeah. Who are we going to have her prioritize, the upper B'Ni or the lower and closer ones? I think she should probably go for the lower and closer ones, while we aim for top B'Ni.
>>
MOTHER FUCKER. I GOT BAMBOOZLED. I THOUGHT THE QUEST WAS GONNA START TOMORROW.
>>
>>3639257
i mean, he said the day it would start, but glad to have you late than never still!
>>
>>3639257
i mean, he said the day it would start, but glad to have you late than never still!

>>3639239
honestly i just wanted her to spray them all down.
>>
>>3639278
>honestly i just wanted her to spray them all down.
Sure. But priorities, you know? I'm thinking start low and walk the spray up, so to make sure to get the ones closer to the Corpse first. Also, spraying plasma fire in their direction will also entail damaging the Corpse. That's always good.
>>
>>3638879
>Shu: Fire all the Hundred Handed. Grapple Isabelle, Stop her.
>>3639071
>>3639159
People. We literally have only 1 act to stop Isabelle. We need to push her out of the way.
>>
>>3639314
you say that as if grappling Isabelle is not on my list.

>>3639290
sounds fine.
>>
>>3639314
Shu's got the fastest limb generation speed. We can't rely on Rath alone.
>>
>>3639326
We're not. We've got making Hundred-Handed chains in the vote. Shu's move is going to be "Turn and fire Contender, while launching off Hundred-Handed chains to grab the bodies".
>>
>>3639326
>>3639334
yeah one thing to keep in mind is, while i do try to keep them in order, even without that often i separate actions that could be taken together so as to avoid confusion. i am inconsistent in that though so i apologize for any confusion it causes.
>>
>>3639257
(Apologies for the misunderstanding, and I'm glad you could make it.)

>>3639159
(There are currently two votes (>>3639029
and >>3639037)
that move the Maw and Hundred-Handed action to the top of your action priority; do wish to keep the priority as-is or change it to match their vote?)

(Additionally, last call for voting if anyone present has not done so already.)
>>
>>3639349
yeah, my bad, i thought it was at the top but it got muddled as she can spawn arms and aim the contender at the same time technically. i often think of orders as the character would, not as a limited number of actions, my apologizes.

yes do the Arms first.
>>
>>3639349
I think I would like to make it top priority. Or at least get rid of the slashing the B'Ni at our feat as we turn to fire the Contender. We can't do any excess motions, we need to get B'Ni back on the ground. All trying to dunk on us, make us feel like jive suckers because we only think of the ground game instead of the vertical. Yeah, no shit, B'Ni, we're thinking of the ground game. Our plan was to keep you on the ground, because the ground is where we can tie you down.
>>
(Gentlemen, I am about to eat dinner, but I shall resume writing shortly thereafter.)
>>
Why do I get the feeling that Mother reviving was inevitable? it just seems like for all our efforts, we just somehow fall short. It's almost as if Bhop the fucker mother planned to have us fight Mother in her prime after he saw the signs and did the math seeing how we stack up.
>>
>>3639495
it better not be, we fucking took too many damn risks and gave up on too much to even have a chance here as it is.
>>
>>3639495
Fall short? Anon, this is round one of the climactic battle. We haven't fallen short yet. B'Ni's trying to reach the Corpse, but even if she manages to get past us do you think it's going to be over just by touching it? Nah, we have plenty of chances to interrupt her. It's going to be a tough fight, but far from an inevitable one.
>>
>>3639583
>1 act til impact
Do you not understand? Isabelle and Mother are working together. when they come in physical contact, all it takes is one of the two to activate the relic. All Isabelle has to do is touch Mother's body and Mother can instantly activate the Mind Transfer Relic. And once that's done Mother can use all the admin tokens she can to Freeze/paralyze everyone's bodies with ranged neuromancy and then take her sweet time killing us.
>>
>>3639597
Mother is out of tokens. and we dont know for sure how the relic actually works. it is possible we only have this ACT, but it could still take longer for the process to finish, and its just a bitch to stop or something.

eve if it is only 1 ACT or bust, we still have a shot at this. multiple characters all working to try and stop this, thats 1 ACTs worth of time before she hits, but not 1 ACT worth of ways and chances to stop it.
>>
>>3639597
Anon, I know it's tempting in a stressful situation like this to assume the worst, but I think you're reaching. Yes, things are dire. But none of what you said is a guarantee. B'Ni might need time to set up the Relic. Mother probably can't activate it on her own, given how many tokens she's spent. And likewise, if Mother had enough to paralyze the entire party, she probably would have done so already. We haven't lost yet, don't go panicking already.
>>
File: THE END.jpg (1.12 MB, 850x1365)
1.12 MB
1.12 MB JPG
>>3638879

November's B.A.R. opens up with a roar, cutting down one of the airborne clones in an instant. You lock eyes with the other one just before a surge of hands obscures her face from view, bringing her body slamming down onto the cold, unforgiving throne room floor. A pair of bodies fly across the room, hurled with Rath's inimitable power and clear of Mother's body as you watch Julia carve into her foe with a flurry of savage slashes with her twin daggers, the slowed incarnation too slow to protect itself from getting torn to bloody shreds before your eyes.

A burst of wind at your feet is all the warning you get, realizing a half-second too late that the B'ni at the steps is gone, her handholds against the stone shattered from the sheer, unrelenting force with which she just propelled herself past you.

A defiant burst of terrible, hideous strength from B'ni's real body.

You round on Mother's corpse, Rath's strand-borne hands grazing Isabelle's neck as your dark-haired foe wraps her fingers around the Hexane corpse's bony wrist. Rath's hand is a fist around your old friend's neck when a wave of light shudders through B'ni and Mother alike...

>>CAST IN THE NAME OF THE ADMINISTRATOR...

>>...YE GUILTY

...and then everything goes a brilliant, blinding white.

When your eyes fly open and you rise to your feet you find yourself surrounded by Amaras three of which are wrapped in Julia's arms, her daggers laying some distance away, ignored in favor of protecting the children close to her. The fingers of Rath's gauntlets dig into the floor as she rises, while November's picking herself up from where she hurled herself down, helm focused on her niece. You find the head of the room, eyes searching past the dissolving clones of your oldest friend eyes straining past the glare of whatever's...

...it's her.

The radiance subsides...or rather, compresses wholly within B'ni's petite frame as she comes into relief against the stonework. Her teeth are grit with pain, tears welling in her eyes as her body fully consumes Mother's body as you start to race forwards, hoping against hope to stop the process before she can complete the process.

Emerald eyes fly open the moment you raise the Contender, and when Isabelle opens her mouth it is with the force of a hurricane and a sound like the end of the world.

"GRA&@$OMATHAREV+^$SEL."

>>PARTY STATUS: Paralyzed, Stunned, Disrupted (5 Turns)

You're on your knees, the Contender clattering to the floor as every cell in your body wholly rebels against your will. Your eyes are locked forwards, and from the pained groans around you it's clear you're not the only one who's been laid low by the incredible might of Mother's borrowed bower. Isabelle's eyes gaze into yours from across the room, and your blood runs with ice as the cold, clear reality of what's just happened settles into your mind.

It's over.

>>COMBAT: ...

>>...Ceased

(Continued)
>>
>>3639751

WELL DONE, GOOD AND FAITHFUL DAUGHTER

Mother's voice echoes in the chamber from everywhere and nowhere, all at once. B'ni reaches into her dress, withdrawing the same device you watched her take from the Hexane Armory; a slender tube, somewhere between an hourglass and a lamp in form, if not in function.

YOU WILL BE MORE POWERFUL THAN I EVER WAS

AT THE END OF MY CRUCIBLE

YOU WILL ACHIEVE HEIGHTS OF POWER

THE LIKES OF WHICH NONE HAVE KNOWN BEFORE

AND NONE SHALL KNOW HEREAFTER

You watch, helpless as B'ni raises the Relic above her head, an obscene act of sanctification at the behest of a cruel, bitter god.

BEAUTIFUL, MY DAUGHTER

SIMPLY BEAUTIFUL

B'ni stares at the crystalline hourglass, gazing into its depths as you feel Mother's very essence leap with joy.

IT IS FINISHED

OUR FREEDOM IS AT HAND

The sound the Relic makes as it shatters into a thousand, irrecoverable pieces against the ivory floor is one that echoes in the ancient hall for what feels like an eternity.

WHAT

WHAT HAVE YOU DONE

WHAT HAVE YOU DONE

WHAT HAVE YOU...

"I did what I came here to do." Comes Isabelle's soft, tired reply in the face of Mother's denial, laced with an mounting sense of realization.

NO

NO NO NO

WE WERE A TEAM

YOU WERE GOING TO COME HERE AND

AND I WAS GOING TO

"...Hijack me?" B'ni interrupts with a roll of her eyes. "Yeah. Yeah, that was kind of obvious."

HOW

HOW DID YOU KNOW

YOU WERE WEAK

YOU WERE SO PATHETICALLY WEAK

SO VULNERABLE

SO MALLEABLE

"Because you came to me in my darkest hour. Because you promised me the world, and everything I ever wanted. Because you listened, and coddled, and played the part...but mostly?" Isabelle says, eyes cast to the ground...until her gaze flits to meet yours. "...because I know exactly what a predator looks like."

Mother is seething now, the pure white building contorting with violent shadows that play on the peerless surface, the light devoured piecemeal as a void slowly take shape in the space between you and Isabelle.

THIS IS NOT HOW IT ENDS

I WILL NOT ALLOW THIS TO BE HOW IT ENDS

You can feel a gathering storm of fury, directed solely, purely at the small girl at the head of the throne room.

NO

I WILL END YOU

I WILL TEAR YOU AND EVERYONE YOU LOVE LIMB FROM LIMB

I WILL REDUCE YOU TO ATOMS

I WILL EXPUNGE YOU FROM EXISTENCE ITSELF

"Then do it." B'ni replies coldly.

(Continued)
>>
File: The Tick of the Clock.jpg (607 KB, 1280x1774)
607 KB
607 KB JPG
>>3639757

Silence.

"Thought so." B'ni says with a sigh as the air around you roils with impotent fury. "You're running on empty right about now, aren't you?"

YOU HAVE NOT BEATEN ME, YOU DISGUSTING LITTLE ALIEN

YOU HAVE NO IDEA WHAT I'M CAPABLE OF

YOU CANNOT BEAT ME

I CANNOT BE BEATEN

I REFUSE TO BE BEATEN BY THE LIKES OF YOU

YOU HAVE NOT BEATEN ME

"You're right. I didn't." Comes B'ni's curt reply, nodding towards you and your family. "They did. They beat you at every turn, crushed every instance of your desperation. You had this whole, grand plan...but you didn't think it all through. You backed the wrong horse, and now? You've lost everything. I know how you feel, Mother. As I think Rath would say...'shit sucks.'"

You watch B'ni take a deep breath, and let it out in a shuddering sigh as she flexes her tense hands.

"Just so you know, I have zero intention of completing the Crucible. Right here, right now? You're proof enough that its a useless reward." She declares, the first words she's uttered in the past few minutes that haven't been laced with the pure weight of exhaustion. Rather, they're charged with intent, a flame of determination that threatens to consume anything that would stand between her and her heart's desire. "I will use your power to ascend the Cord. With what I've stolen from you, I can be there in a matter of minutes. I'll use the power you were supposed to use for you and Charon's original plan and I'll make my home there, at the world's summit. Away from anything and everything that would interrupt what I deserve."

YOU CAN WIN THE CRUCIBLE NOW

YOU CAN END THIS

Desperation creeps into mother voice as she tries to bargain, every word from the Hexane Administrator's void only serving to deepen Isabelle's growing scowl.

YOU CAN END EVERYTHING

YOU CAN SET ME FREE AT TAKE YOUR RIGHTFUL PLACE ON...

"Oh, no. No, I'm not freeing you. In fact, you know what, Mother? You get to watch." She says, and for the first time the pure, seething rage that fills the void subsides.

In its place is a cold, creeping horror.

"You get to watch me live out the rest of my days with the person I love. It's everything you hoped you'd achieve on your first go-around, isn't it?" B'ni chuckles. "Now you can watch me get everything you could never have. I think that's fitting for something like you, isn't it?"

I

PLEASE

PLEASE, NO

NOT LIKE THIS

PLEASE PLEASE NO I

"GRA+^%..."

She chuckles, with a glance towards Julia and her three Amaras, held tight in arms that struggle to obey their owner before B'ni completes her phrase with a cruelly familiar epithet.

"....CUNT."

NO

NO WAIT I
...

...Silence falls in the Hexane throne room once more.

(Continued)
>>
File: Bound Freedoms.jpg (340 KB, 1280x1600)
340 KB
340 KB JPG
>>3639780

"And...mute." B'ni mutters, eyes cast to the cavernous ceiling.

She takes a breath.

A breath that could sunder you to pieces. A breath that could bring this tower down around you in an instant. A breath that could turn any fight into a slaughter. A breath...that she just releases, her slight, shuddering sigh echoing for a moment in the vast, empty space before the tomb devours it whole. She whispers something under her breath, and suddenly your body is freed, and with slow, careful deliberation you rise to your feet, gaze locked on your oldest friend and greatest foe standing mere meters away. Your allies have not been served the same courtesy, and as much as you ache to rush to their side, you just stand, defiant in the face of all the power in the world.

Your gaze locks with Isabelle's in silence.

She's just staring at you with a strange, sad look in her emerald eyes, and it occurs to you that she's not plotting, or planning, or poised to strike.

She's letting you have the first word...for now, with the tools to end the world at the tip of her tongue, she will always have the last.

She's waiting.

For you.

To speak.

>>Write-In

YOU ARE IN CONTROL
>>
>>3639791
Bhop. You fucking Bamboozled us. Big time.
>>
(Gentlemen, I shall be pausing here for the evening. Voting shall remain open for the next twelve hours, and posting shall resume thereafter. Thank you for bearing with my Monday even as you worked your way through yours, and I appreciate your time, participation, and enthusiasm more than I can express. I shall be around for a little longer to address any questions, comments, or criticisms you may have, and I welcome them no, no exceptions. Thank you again for being such an amazing group, and rest well.)

(Also,you're still quite on track to the Golden Ending. The whys and hows will become apparent soon enough.)
>>
>>3639791
>"...If you're not going to kill us, then id like my family to be released. and if you are going to kill us, all i ask is you make theirs easy and take any anger out on me."

>>3639809
...not gonna lie, id of preferred to just have a fight and a fighting chance to actually prevent this, and i dont feel like we had that. honestly? one too many times of feeling like the option we got was inevitable and everything we fought so hard to try to do was pointless BHOP, ill see where you plan to take this, but im not a fan of your last few decisions, i gotta be honest with you. regardless of how you have ended each of these decisions, my love of the quest was based around the feeling what we did mattered, and for the last while its felt way too ham strung and like in the end their weight really was nullified more than im comfortable with. a good outcome does not feel good when you would prefer a bad outcome if its what you actually deserved, or the good outcomes start to feel like it had nothing to do with you and your fellow anons decisions, and thats what this is starting to feel like.
>>
>>3639751
>You round on Mother's corpse, Rath's strand-borne hands grazing Isabelle's neck as your dark-haired foe wraps her fingers around the Hexane corpse's bony wrist. Rath's hand is a fist around your old friend's neck when a wave of light shudders through B'ni and Mother alike...
So why isn't B'Ni dead? I mean, her super-regeneration is nerfed now, so she actually needs her head to survive again. And Rath was in Ignition mode, so there's an inextinguishable thermite charge going off on B'Ni's thoracic vertebrae.
>>
>>3639826
Yeah, this was really unsatisfying. It's such an anticlimax, you know? We were all set to put our planning and hard work into action and defeat B'Ni, foil Mother's plan and then taunt her for her failure. And then whoop! Turns out that we couldn't have stopped them. But it's "okay", because B'Ni's going to hijack what should be our victory and our gloating, and kill Mother for us. What fun.
>>
>>3639856
i think Isabelle just plan to camp at the top of the cord and make herself her Shu clone, i dont think she actually plans to rewrite the cord. worse, she is gonna literally be a Mother level boss just....sitting exactly where we need to be, and very likely will try to stop us or anyone else who tries to either complete the crucible, or hijack it like we plan to do.

or so is what i interpreted her goal as. take it how you will.
>>
>>3639874
Yeah, I don't think she's going to end the game. That doesn't make it any less frustrating for B'Ni to steal our climactic showdown from us. I was really looking forward to this, because even if we lost we'd lose on our terms. Facing down the impossible to prevent armageddon. But now we've had the agency stolen from us, as much as B'Ni tries to give us credit for foiling Mother's plans. If anything that's worse, because B'Ni still took the agency from us, so it's just rubbing it in our noses that everything we did just enabled her victory here. B'Ni has been long characterized as someone too irrational to have true agency. At her best she's a mad dog lashing out at the world, and has more commonly been seen in the role of dupe or patsy. That's the impression of B'Ni that we have, so suddenly giving her control doesn't make it seem like she's seized it and finally grown as a person but just that we've been diminished to below her.
>>
>>3639856
I can quite agree. but being someone who came late to the party and isn't caught up in the emotional stakes of planning... you can't just let your emotions get the better of you and call Isabelle a cheater. She played by the rules and used the most of what she had.

However, we should applaud Isabelle for enduring so much and pulling this off. She fucking outplayed everyone here. Including Mother.

>>3639791
>Open you mouth to speak...then close it.
>try to come up with words for a few minutes. a phrase, anything. Finally settle on something akin to a confession and a last will.
>"You were right Isabelle. You were right about Sam."
>"I saw Sam's memories. Bits and pieces. You may have heard this before from Sam's mouth, but hear it from my own perspective. Shu's Perspective. The details are a bit sparse, but the main beats are there. When Sam was little her father died. When you met her in your childhood, she was self centered and hurt. She punched that bully because said bully insulted her dead father. She didn't notice you until after the fact. Much of her anger and stress came from her mother bringing in boyfriends and suitors that abused her ever since. She was quite angry at her mother from losing control, for falling for a man who gave her black eyes on a daily basis. And...I guess that's what broke her into manipulating you. The loss of her father, the loss of control, the daily torture by her abusive soon-to-be Step-father...Somewhere along the way she got a twisted notion that love is a weakness that she could manipulate. Sam felt no love during your first kiss."
>*a shuddering breath comes out. Knees weak, palms sweaty, arms heavy.*
>"if...if it still doesn't matter to you...If you still see me as Sam because I wore her face and share her memories...if you still want to kill me... then do it. Do it now. But leave my family alone. They have no part in this."
>"YOU ARE IN CONTROL now, Isabelle. I trust you."
>let go of everything. any semblance of control, just let it go. Close your eyes and await her judgement.

>>3639809
For one, I thought the geists and the zombie daughters brought Isabelle to a literal stalemate giving us time to catch up to her and possibly overtake her.

As much as it pains me to write this write-in dialogue, and as badly as I feel blueballed from seeing our victory being snatched by Isabelle. I feel that Isabelle deserved this win. She practically out-played everyone here. Enduring 2 years of waiting for Shu, 1-week of relative bliss and happiness, 2 weeks of her utter darkest hour, and now she cheated Mother out of a deal and got her powers out of it while simultaneously giving Mother her just deserts.
>>
>>3639951
eh....no, i really dont like that. we simply dont care about Sam, and we already knew and admitted that Sam was horrible.

and i dont want, think its makes sense, or think its appropriate to just spew nonsense about Sam to her.

and i am, viciously, ruthlessly, against trusting Isabelle at all, certainly in saying it. keep it short and to the point like i did. both She, Us, and the situation calls for it.

literally all i agree with there at all is;
>Open you mouth to speak...then close it.
>try to come up with words for a few minutes. a phrase, anything.
>"if...if it still doesn't matter to you...If you still see me as Sam because I wore her face and share her memories...if you still want to kill me... then do it. Do it now. But leave my family alone. They have no part in this."

>>3639922
yeah, this really feels totally out of left field for Isabelle, she has shown us no reason to think she would mentally be able to get past her issues to do this. and yeah, i mean, i dunno, i wasn't after a big chance to gloat, i wasn't after the greatest ending to this fight ever...i just wanted it to feel like the outcome was dependent on what we did, and was ours, and this just doesn't feel like it at all. id rather stray from the 'golden ending' because its what we ourselves did, then feel like we are being shoe horned onto it like this.
>>
>>3639990
>>3639951
well, fucking 4chan. why did it repaste the old shit?

literally all i agree with there at all is, damnit;
>Open you mouth to speak...then close it.
>try to come up with words for a few minutes. a phrase, anything.
>"if...if it still doesn't matter to you...if you still want to kill me... then do it. Do it now. But leave my family alone. They have no part in this."

not mad at you or anything, just frustrated so wasn't in the mood for a glitch or whatever.
>>
>>3640001
I have a similar issue. my mouse keeps randomly double-triple clicking despite me hitting the button just once.
>>
>>3639951
>I can quite agree. but being someone who came late to the party and isn't caught up in the emotional stakes of planning... you can't just let your emotions get the better of you and call Isabelle a cheater. She played by the rules and used the most of what she had.
Oh, she's worse than a cheater. She's a time-waster. I'd be fine with a villain who just pulled out lots of unexpected advantages and made things very hard for us. This is worse, this is a villain invalidating all the build-up to fighting them.

>However, we should applaud Isabelle for enduring so much and pulling this off. She fucking outplayed everyone here. Including Mother.
No. No we shouldn't. Because B'Ni has not been established as being this smart. And it's not even a "I was just tricking you into thinking I was stupid" thing, because we were inside her head. She didn't earn this. And she endured nothing that she didn't put herself through. I am voting against your write-in with my own.

>>3639791
>"What do you want, for me to applaud you? 'Wow, that Isabelle, she sure is smart. I'm feeling so bad for thinking she was tricked by Mother just like she was tricked by Sam'. No, I regret nothing I have thought about you. You are awful, Isabelle. You have been nothing BUT awful, since the day I met you. Every single interaction with you has been an unending source of stress as you flail about with your complete lack of control or rationality. And now you're going to pretend that it was part of your scheme all along? Fuck you."
>"You know what, I don't even care anymore. I am just completely done with you, Isabelle. Kill me, spare me, win the Crucible, hijack the Crucible, whatever. I don't care. It's not worth the aggravation that comes from acknowledging your existence. It is NEVER worth the aggravation of acknowledging your existence. Now, I am going to take my friends and leave. You can kill us if you want, but I'm not even going to turn back and look at you."
>>
>>3640033
well, your write-in isnt much better, im against it to.

Shu might not have any reason to do what the other anon wrote, but yours is going a bit too far in a different direction. Shu, if for no other reason than her love for them, would not antagonize Isabelle in such a way, she would like the parts i kept of the other one or mine, try and get her family spared. she wouldn't not care. about Isabelle? in a way maybe sure, but not about the situation and what could happen.

the other anon was out of character via needless information and caving in in ways that dont matter, yours i think is too influenced by your understandable anger, but otherwise completely throws who and what Shu is out the window just for a middle finger scenario. she still is her own character IC, and she wouldn't be angry so much as nervous and scared for her family, and maybe the planet.

also as much as im not a fan of Isabelle she actually wasn't at all bad for the first little while, and in some ways was even a good friend to us. its just she was also insane and expected to get something out of us over nothing and threw a hissy fit when it didn't happen.
>>
>>3640065
Shu, if for no other reason than her love for them,
them being her family, not Isabelle.
>>
>>3640065
Yeah, it wasn't really a serious write-in. I know that's now what Shu would say here. What she'd think, maybe, but not what she'd say. I'm not even that angry, really. Just tired, I guess is how I'd put it. All my enthusiasm for this arc has evaporated, leaving me with nothing but apathy. That's what motivated the write-in, the desire to never have to interact with this plot thread ever again, because I am so bored with B'Ni right now. But yeah, I should try to write something more in-character. Give me a minute, I've got to go take my meds real quick.
>>
>>3639809
>"Thought so." B'ni says with a sigh as the air around you roils with impotent fury. "You're running on empty right about now, aren't you?"
>>3639809
Okay. Now I'm VERY Curious.
What was Ozmas total Admin pool (aka How many tokens did she have)?
How many did she spend prior to the race to Almath? (Basically how many tokens did Mother have left before she had the harebrained idea to goad Isabelle into the whole Mind Transfer Scheme)
How many tokens DID Ozmas spend/burn?
Of the number of tokens spent, who in Shu's family made Ozmas Burn the most tokens?
With Mother being essentially gone from the Admin chair and trapped inside Isabelle's mind, are the Geas and contract placed on Ringo and Charon rendered Null and Void?

>>3640033
Okay that write-in is just begging for death. First of all, Isabelle gave the credit of defeating Ozmas to Shu's Family (aka us anons). She implied that all the effort towards stopping Ozmas was by Shu's efforts, Isabelle herself didn't take any credit whatsoever. Second, if she was going to ever take the time and gloat like the cunt you perceive her to be, she would've said so while shutting Mother down and laughing all the while. Instead she deferred to Shu, so let us speak out piece with as much respect as she could give us. You're using the opportunity to act like the biggest cunt like Sam was back from the grave, your anger while justifiable just breaks Shu's character for who we built her up to be. Isabelle can kill us with Seven deadly words in the middle of your salty tantrum if she ever felt like it. Third, you've completely forgotten the situation we're in. Shu's alone and free from paralysis, but EVERYONE ELSE IS NOT.

Okay.... emotional counterpoint over. I still respect the write-in you wrote, but I will not support that.

>>3640065
>>3640072
I'm sorry for sounding so "submissive", but I cannot find a reasonable IC response to the literal anti-climatic plot twist that just happened. so I wrote my response based on this emotional feeling of how Shu would feel of "yes, we're powerless against Isabelle, but we might as well part on neutral/good terms." Hence the soppy write-in.

But I'll accept your proposed amendment and will change my vote with a few amendments of my own:
>>3639791
>Open you mouth to speak...then close it.
>try to come up with words for a few minutes. a phrase, anything.
>"if...if it still doesn't matter to you...if you still want to kill me... then do it. Do it now. But leave my family alone. They have no part in this."
>*close your eyes, try to channel as much calm into the panicking minds and hearts of your family. Wait for Isabelle's judgement.*
>>
>>3640100
nah, i understand where you're coming from. i thought win or lose, this was kinda the climax to Isabelles arc. instead now shes just...jumped the gun as a character and now we're stuck with her as an unwanted and undeserved final boss.

at least despite how much i despise West in every way, THAT in and of itself makes her a deserving villain, because the reasons i hate her also logically make her a threat.

>>3640110
>What was Ozmas total Admin pool (aka How many tokens did she have)?
im curious too, but i think i mentioned in the last thread people were underestimating how much a 'small pool' actually is when you take into account its a small pool she has to administrate an entire planet with.

>Isabelle gave the credit of defeating Ozmas to Shu's Family
well, besides the fact the Anon admitted he was just Venting, i have to agree with him her saying that doesn't solve the issues with this outcome in my opinion, and feels kinda ham fisted to me too. more sudden character shifting that feels too out of place and undeserved, aswell as it feels entirely wrong and like its not actually really true at all honestly. i mean, yeah we overcame alot, but Mother herself knew it was an 'win the war not the fight' situation, and...we lost the War, and thats all that matters at the end of it. we didnt defeat Mother, not at all. we couldn't stop her or isabelle. the only thing that stopped her was Isabelle suddenly having, in my opinion, a character shift that doesn't make sense and isnt deserved.

>But I'll accept your proposed amendment and will change my vote with a few amendments of my own
eh, i can accept that one. still feel Shu would still have a little more defiance than that in her, but i suppose you could argue her fighting to save her family and take it all on her own shoulders IS defiance against the very real fact she knows its futile to even try that much.
>>
>>3639791
Oh Fuck.
>>
>>3640100
>>3640110
im mostly venting, but id like to point out i wanted to cut the throat of the Isabelle infront of us, and BHOP encouraged us to instead focus on the skybound ones only, and of course that one then turned out to be the real one. maybe im just mad but thats kinda grating me as it feels like he was trying to influence the result towards what he wanted instead of what we had written. not to mention it had a BB in it that should've gone off.
>>
24 archives later, I have finally moved up from lurker (of sorts) to participant. I’m so excited to be taking part in one of the greatest stories I’ve ever read. BHOP, you mad god, I’m such a huge fan of your work. (also, has no one mentioned that bhop sounds like bunny-hop?) Can’t say I’ll be much use, since I don’t have internet at home, but I’ll help where I can.
>>
>>3640221
>maybe im just mad but thats kinda grating me as it feels like he was trying to influence the result towards what he wanted instead of what we had written. not to mention it had a BB in it that should've gone off.
>not to mention it had a BB in it that should've gone off.
Well, rereading the action report, it seemed that the for the BB we shot at that Isabelle, the Timer was set to explode at 2 rounds even with short fuse, if we were to stop that Isabelle and have the BB round in it explode in the very next round, we would've had to waste one action nicking her with the Contender blade at the risk of letting the other three clones touch Ozma's corpse. If we really wanted to cripple that Isabelle, we would've selected the Herculean Fullbore or the Parabellum round instead.

>>3640231
>BHOP
>Bunny Hop
>Isabelle
>B'ni
of all Fucker Mothers and Ozmas.
Why didn't I think of that before? Isabelle is literally Bhop's DM-PC.
>>
Okay, I was trying to come up with a write-in that is in character, and I thought of something crazy. Hear me out: What if we trick B'Ni into eating us? We use that to activate Hexane Rewrite a second time, delete her new skills, then manifest as a Geist Daughter and resume the fight. Come on, we don't have to be at her mercy. We can assert control over the situation, we just have to convince her that the worst thing ever would be if she ate us so we're stuck dealing with her still. Express my apathy towards her and do something in-character by trying to pull off a win against the odds, it's the perfect solution!

>>3640221
I thought it was the B'Ni that got knocked over by Fear To Tread that was the real one? Doesn't really matter. I'll give B'Ni some actual credit for that one regardless, she successfully tricked us. Although, she should have failed either way and it's still a railroad, because Rath totally got B'Ni before she could absorb the corpse and BHOP is just ignoring that.
>>
>>3640260
>have Isabelle eat Shu
>Literally giving Shu the Game over treatment for the sake of deleting Isabelle's newly gained skintalker powers
>trying to have Isabelle fall for the Hexxane Deletion ploy when she's already been burned once before with Gina pulling that exact same trick on her.
Anon. get your head on straight. Bhop's already shown that Isabelle isn't some braindead mindless dumb cunt who falls for the exact same trick twice. If she was a braindead mindless dumb cunt that you perceive her to be, then explain how she managed to survive for 2+ years protecting herself AND Shu's pod?
>>
>>3640257
actually the idea was the BB slows and cripples limbs when it explodes, hence using them on a speedster. alos that doesn't answer the other part of my...whatever it is. it also usually has 2 rounds, and is down to 1 round. we hit her last round, and so it should've gone off this one.

also that second part about names doesn't make me feel any less annoyed at this situation, only more.

>>3640260
yeah...no. just no. we are not going to try and get killed by her.

>>3640231
well glad you like it but you joined at...an interesting point i suppose.
>>
>>3640274
I'm not saying she's stupid. I'm saying she's irrational, and makes bad decisions. When she commits to a crazy idea (like, say, guarding the pod of someone she thinks is Sam) she can be very successful at it, but that doesn't mean she's making good decisions. We just have to convince her that eating Shu is totally a sane idea, and not something a crazy person would do.

But fine, it's probably not something we can do anyway. Too many moving parts, and we don't have the understanding of the Neurotic Halo that Gina does. Fine, back to coming up with a write-in that's in-character while still expressing my absolute disdain for B'Ni.
>>
>>3639874
>>3639922
(B'ni has no intention of ending the game, as she stated. She plans to stagnate it, resting at the top of the Cord and stopping anyone from ending it.)

>>3640231
(Glad to have you Anon, I'm glad you could join.)

>>3640257
>>BHOP
>>Bunny Hop
(I...I never realized that, actually.)

>>3640260
>>3639838
(I feel personally responsible for this, as Rath's attack was actually a miss but I wanted to write something a little more fun than just a simple miss at this critical moment. My apologies for the flair making it seem like I invalidated Rath's attack.)

>>3639826
>>3639856
(You know what; you're absolutely correct. In trying to balance how and when the end-game bosses get into position, I will admit that rushed to tie off the loose ends before opening the world completely before you get to the Cord, and as much as I enjoyed everything leading up to this point, I am sorry that you feel let down.)

(As >>3639922 mentioned here, while I may have been going for the feeling of B'ni seizing control and becoming more laser-focused on her goal than ever before to set her up for the endgame, it honestly didn't occur to me that it would feel like another instance of railroading, and that's something that I think comes from the fact that I've been something of a 'forever DM', with any time that I've played having been a one-shot affair. I think it's a result of trying to make 'cut-scene-esque' encounters that normally went over well in the groups I've played with apply here, when I can't necessarily rely on the speed of things like I can in real life.)

(Then again, that's just an excuse, plain and simple. For those of you that have stuck with me through thick and thin, you have my sincere thanks. For those of you who are less than pleased with how these last two Veins have gone, I'm sorry for making you feel like your choices don't matter. That was certainly never my intention, given the main theme of the quest is control and what people make of it. You and everyone here matter to me, and the fact that recent events don't sit well with you means they don't sit well with me, either. I even considered re-writing this whole section, but...well, choices are choices, for good or ill.My personal experiences inform much of the quest's plot in an abstract way, and I'll be sticking with the events as they've come about if only because changing things now would invalidate the payoff for things that are yet to come.)

(I hope you can find the time and patience to bear with me as this arc hurtles towards its conclusion, and also know that I hear your concerns, and they absolutely matter to me. I started this quest to bring a fun place to life and share that setting and these characters with others, and I want to adhere to that. I hope I haven't turned anyone off the quest, but I understand if I did.)

(I need to get some rest, and I hope all present sleep well. Thank you for your time and your honesty, as I value both.)
>>
>>3640388
i mean, i appreciate your honesty, but still feel nothing said really justifies or solves many of the underlying issues and complaints put forth. ill give you your fair shot, but at this point im not gonna lie, i doubt any 'payoff' will feel anything but ham strung onto the end of a ham strung section id probably prefer to just not get at this point, but we'll see i guess. saying that kinda feels like you're saying 'hope this thing you got only because i took away the point of the game makes up for me taking away the point of the game!'
>>
>>3640455
(I don't feel like I can properly justify it, at this point. As far as solving it, I believe the only way to do so is to keep moving forward and strive to make the quest as best as I can while learning from the mistakes I've made along the way.)
>>
>>3640482
thats fair, i can at least agree to that.
>>
>>3639791
>"Do whatever you want, Isabelle, I'm not going to beg. If you really have all the control that you claim to then you hardly need me to justify your decisions. You do have control, don't you?"

There. As in-character as I can make it. Defiant to the end, but not being outright uncivil with B'Ni.

>>3640388
> I even considered re-writing this whole section, but...well, choices are choices, for good or ill.My personal experiences inform much of the quest's plot in an abstract way, and I'll be sticking with the events as they've come about if only because changing things now would invalidate the payoff for things that are yet to come.

Here's the thing, BHOP: You've already invalidated a payoff. These past two threads were a huge build up, and it was really cool. Discovering Mother's bunker, figuring out Mother's plan, fighting the Phalanges, trusting Dorian to get past the obstacles, pursuing B'Ni further into the wasteland, discovering Almath, and then teaming up with the Dream Daughters for an epic showdown so big that you had to invent squad rules for it. It was really cool! I was so excited for our climactic showdown.

And then it was over in a single turn. One turn, that's all we got. We didn't even get a chance to bring in the Dream Daughter squads. No big dramatic fight, just a cutscene that was a complete anticlimax for resolving the problem of Mother. Worse, it elevated B'Ni to the status of end boss, so her plot thread is going to take to the very end of the quest to resolve. Which is doubly aggravating because rescuing Gina is tied to B'Ni's plot thread, so we're not getting her back, either. All that excitement we had about the Sparagmos Engine? Pointless, Gina's not going to rejoin the party until after she could be in any way useful. Maybe there's going to be some way for us to get her back right here and now, but honestly that's such a complete longshot that there's no way we could plausible do it via our own actions. So it's just going to be more railroading, denying us agency again.

So what I'm saying is: If you feel you have to preserve this in order to not invalidate a later payoff, then you're already playing a zero-sum game. You'll have ruined one resolution to set up another. But if we're dealing with a zero-sum anyway, why not walk this back? Declare it noncanon, give us a proper fight against B'Ni. Maybe we'll still lose, but at least it would be a cool loss after a hard-fought battle, instead of a one-turn total party wipe.
>>
>>3640551
Still feel that write-in ignores Shus drive to protect her family is my only big piece to argue.

>Second part
I agree with you anything we get out of this will feel... soiled, but id very much prefer not restart the section. The damage has been done, any redo simply wont have the same impact it could've and will also then feel in its own way a bit ham fisted. It just wont fix the feelings this caused and will only muddy the waters more, as now he would have to struggle to make the outcome feel real. What if we still get basically the same ending? No matter what he does, it would bring up the feeling of if he actually let us have agency or if there was any point to the redo. Sure, in theory theres a chance for many other outcomes, but the section is now tainted in a way a redo wont remove. I dont like what Happened, i have my issues with it greatly, but BHOP is at least right in getting all of this wrapped up and onto the next part of the quest will better allow him to improve and avoid his mistakes here again. At this Point the agency we want and he wants to give cant be properly implemented until we get past this part, because until we are away from it the linger emotions and mistakes wont go away. It would work out better and i honestly just want ot get this over with.

But yeah i honestly im absolutely sick of Isabelle and cant lie, im not looking forward to the and of this quest anymore. Isabelle has overstayed her welcome and this was a good opportunity to end her arc...and now we're stuck with her, over reasons that honestly dont fit her character either.

>>3640482
...yeah, not gonna lie BHOP, making Isabelle your final boss was a massive mistake, knowing thats whats ahead honestly is killing my enthusiasm. She wasn't a bad Character but theres a limit especially for a villain for how much they can be entertaining as an antagonist and she honestly was a terrible choice to put into that position, regardless of any other complaints of how she got there. Her motivation and personality is just....underwhelming, tiring, and honestly at this point annoying, for being a literal end game boss.
>>
>>3640612
>Still feel that write-in ignores Shus drive to protect her family is my only big piece to argue.
Yeah, maybe. But I'm not going to beg. If you want to look at it from that angle, I can say it's Shu trying to focus any anger B'Ni might have onto her.

>What if we still get basically the same ending? No matter what he does, it would bring up the feeling of if he actually let us have agency or if there was any point to the redo. Sure, in theory theres a chance for many other outcomes, but the section is now tainted in a way a redo wont remove.
Personally, I'd be fine with it so long as we actually got a fight. Get some proper hits in on B'Ni, make it look like she actually worked for this win even if for all we know she didn't. At this point I'd be satisfied just with the illusion of significance.

>But yeah i honestly im absolutely sick of Isabelle and cant lie, im not looking forward to the and of this quest anymore. Isabelle has overstayed her welcome and this was a good opportunity to end her arc...and now we're stuck with her, over reasons that honestly dont fit her character either.
I didn't want to say, but...oh god yes I can't agree with you more. B'Ni was fun, but she's also very frustrating to deal with, and I was looking forward to getting rid of her. Even if we didn't decisively defeat her here, I certainly didn't expect her to become the final boss and guarantee that she'll be looming over us for the entire quest. I figured that at most she'd last until the end of Act 2. If she is going to be the final boss, can we at least have a sudden surge of strength out of nowhere and give her a bloody eye before she goes, so we can characterize her holing up in the Cord as hiding from us?
>>
>>3640455
>>3640482
I can see that the dissatisfaction is apparent to just about everyone both IC and OOC.

The main beats of the Arc's conclusion are there (Mother gets the shaft), but the fact that the one who does her in was Isabelle and her off-handed acknowledgement of giving Shu's Family the credit of defeating Ozmas felt more like a consolation prize for successfully outwitting Mother/Ozmas but failing to stop Isabelle from connecting with Ozma's corpse.

If we are going to discuss the theme of this quest, I believe this Arc has a big lesson that can be taken away from this if I were to look back at it. Sometimes the best laid plans might be all for naught, there are things that are still beyond your control despite your efforts, and the strongest power one can have is the choice of letting go of control, when to let go, and move on.

>>3640388
> I will admit that rushed to tie off the loose ends before opening the world completely before you get to the Cord, and as much as I enjoyed everything leading up to this point, I am sorry that you feel let down.
>I need to get some rest, and I hope all present sleep well. Thank you for your time and your honesty, as I value both.
....bhop. did you get enough rest and sleep? or were you running this vein on little sleep and little preparation? Because if the result of this anti-climax was because you felt rushed and harried to turn this quest from a linear plot to an open world rpgfest, then what just happened feels very much a anti-climatic disappointment.
We gave you a week to do what you need to do including focusing on July 4th and the weekend for you to relax and prepare for the climax of this second act. You could have asked for a time extension so you could sort out what needs to be done and slowly dragged this out so both you and us could work out the details.
We have been very, very, patient with you. We know you've done a very good job writing this quest and we keep our faith in trusting you to not rush things and accrue continuity errors. Likewise, you have been very honest with us in divulging critical information and clarifying matters within reason.
All in all, this one of those moments that make the quest stumble because of your need to rush things.

>>3640482
If there's anything that can be taken away from for you Bhop, it's to "Take your time." Take all the time you need. I'm not one to draw a comparison, but in several quests that I follow, all of the QMs took their time. If an arc still had some loose ends that needed to be resolved in a satisfying manner? They take their time and draw it out to its conclusion in a well paced manner. Heck, even Joker Quest did that, there's so many moving parts in that quest that it takes multiple threads to finish one fight. Admittedly, JokerQuestOP infrequently posts, but what he does do well is get all of his ducks in line before writing out the update.
>>3640612
I feel like this is simultaneously a high point AND a low point in this quest.
>>
>>3640650
well, we can just disagree then on how Shu would handle this then.

and nah, i just wouldn't get any satisfaction anymore out of the fight. now it would just feel like BHOP throwing us a different bone as the saying goes, lets just move on. honestly giving her a black eye or something wouldn't solve it either, at this point it might just be unsolvable, for me at least.

>>3640654
>If we are going to discuss the theme of this quest, I believe this Arc has a big lesson that can be taken away from this if I were to look back at it. Sometimes the best laid plans might be all for naught, there are things that are still beyond your control despite your efforts, and the strongest power one can have is the choice of letting go of control, when to let go, and move on.
you can still do that in a way that feels more natural and well intentioned. we went into this fight knowing we could lose, i was willing to accept that. but this situation feels like we may aswell of just not tried at all, is the issue. you can feel like it was inevitable but still had SOME ability to act, rather than feeling like you didn't or you might of well have just not played at all. maybe im explaining this poorly, i dunno...im just positive this could've been done better, even if it came to the same outcome or even IF the outcomes was more or less guaranteed.

>I feel like this is simultaneously a high point AND a low point in this quest.
you can feel how you wish, but honestly so far the lowest point and nothing else for me. not something ill be able to just forget, and not for good reasons.
>>
>>3640654
>If we are going to discuss the theme of this quest, I believe this Arc has a big lesson that can be taken away from this if I were to look back at it. Sometimes the best laid plans might be all for naught, there are things that are still beyond your control despite your efforts, and the strongest power one can have is the choice of letting go of control, when to let go, and move on.
But everything up until this moment has been phrased in terms of our choices. Do we choose to detour to kill Hatter? Do we choose to spend time healing Lara? Do we continue on after getting hurt badly by the Phalanges? Do we press on into Fallen Almath? At every point the outcome of this series of events was presented as the result of our choices. So to take that away at the end feels really cheap.

>....bhop. did you get enough rest and sleep? or were you running this vein on little sleep and little preparation? Because if the result of this anti-climax was because you felt rushed and harried to turn this quest from a linear plot to an open world rpgfest, then what just happened feels very much a anti-climatic disappointment.
I hope it's not. BHOP, please don't exhaust yourself over this.

>>3640699
>well, we can just disagree then on how Shu would handle this then.
I think part of it is that I'm not expecting anything we say to matter anyway. So I'm having a bit of trouble divorcing that from the in-character thinking. I just keep coming back around to the point of "If we survive this, it's not going to be because of anything we do, so I might as well not give B'Ni the satisfaction of having Shu beg".

>and nah, i just wouldn't get any satisfaction anymore out of the fight. now it would just feel like BHOP throwing us a different bone as the saying goes, lets just move on. honestly giving her a black eye or something wouldn't solve it either, at this point it might just be unsolvable, for me at least.
Giving her a black eye probably won't help much, but it will make me feel a little better if I can pretend that B'Ni is at the top of the Cord because that's the only place she can hide from Shu. "Oh shit oh shit, I'm the strongest Daughter in the Crucible now and she's still coming. Is this how Mother felt? Okay, top of the Cord, she can't get to me there!"
>>
>>3640729
yeah, we are told our choices matter then twice, once near the end of the last, then here, given situations where our choices apparently dont matter, or are made to heavily feel like they dont.

>I think part of it is that I'm not expecting anything we say to matter anyway.
well, technically no, but you never know, and Shu would rather demean herself a bit in the meager hope it might spare her loved ones at least some pain than spit at Isabelle and make them all suffer more.

and...eh. im not seeing the satisfaction, ignoring if we could even land the punch.
>>
>>3639791

>"Do whatever you want, Isabelle, I'm not going to beg. If you really have all the control that you claim to then you hardly need me to justify your decisions. You do have control, don't you? I justw ould like one thing. If you kill anyone here kill me let the others go they have nothing to do with your Grievance with me"

>>3640551
I think I will support this write with a small extension in as i think this is what Isabelle wants to hear. She wants Sam(or what she believes to be Sam) to acknowledge that she is superior. We are not gonna beg but we ask her like civil people to not hurt the people we and take it all out on us like>>3639826
brought to a pretty good point

>>3640388
Hey OP. Your writing is good but this just killed the Suspension completely. I can barely bring myself to make this write-in and work thorugh the discussion. The Almath Part felt like a lot of Railroading. Which may be because of the place itself appearing like a massive plot device(not in the bad sense, Plot Devices can be used in many different aspects) for being controled by emotion and taking on aspects of the people that view it.

I think what i am trying to say is this. I just want to get this part over with and step back out into a place where we can have more of an impact
>>
>>3640811
>Which may be because of the place itself appearing like a massive plot device(not in the bad sense, Plot Devices can be used in many different aspects) for being controled by emotion and taking on aspects of the people that view it.
Hold up a minute, that's right. The place is psychoreactive. That's a pretty big Chekov's Gun to load, don't you think? We need to fire it at something. Shu has an empathic field, let's take control. Bring the city to life, have it fight B'Ni.
>>
>>3640857
while inside the bubble that blocks all of that? i mean, i guess maybe once she steps out but shes so damn fast now she herself said it, she could reach the top of the cord in minutes now.
>>
>>3640869
Well we have to do something with it. You can't just not fire the gun once you clean it and put it up on the mantelpiece.
>>
>>3640878
well, no we dont. nor do we know if its possible. also bad analogy, thats exactly when you dont use a gun.
>>
>>3640881
It's a literary reference, I'm not talking about an actual gun. Chekov's Gun is a dramatic principle named after advice given by Russian playwright Anton Chekov: "Remove everything that has no relevance to the story. If you say in the first chapter that there is a rifle hanging on the wall, in the second or third chapter it absolutely must go off. If it's not going to be fired, it shouldn't be hanging there." So if attention was specifically drawn to the city's psychoreactive nature, then there must be something it can be used for.
>>
>>3640729
>>3640699

Ya know. I went and had a fridge-think of the logical conclusion to Isabelle's insane intention of simply camping out in the cord making Shu clones so she can play house with and it's downright creepy/scary/sad.

I see a level in the Cord, filled to the brim with carcasses, corpses, bodies of daughters. some still-living yet mutilated and writhing in pain. Some dead. All of them wear Shu's Face, all of them share Shu's physique. Or rather, Shu's many clones created by the Crucible from Isabelle's vain attempt to make the perfect "Shu".
In the floor above, is an idyllic scenery. Isabelle resting on the lap of a Shu clone. one of the latest in the line, of Isabelle's attempt to create her ideal "waif" of a lover. This Shu clone knows what has happened to those who came before her, but has been geas'd to stay despite who she is based off of. Isabelle on the other hand is feels happy, yet the happiness is hollow. Both are tired of the same game and roleplay.


>>3640857
And we're in the middle of a spire made of anti-empathy material. And the city can't do shit to Isabelle. Ozmas killed this city once with her skintalker power. Isabelle can do the same thing now that she has Ozma's lexicon.

>>3640913
>A city full of ghosts who hates the skintalker that killed them. A city that is psychoreactive by nature. A city that had the plans to halt the crucible and wishes to stop it.
it may be because it's 2 am, but somehow I feel that this city might be a really, really, good base of operations if we're going to need a fallback point. Shame about the anti-skintalker ghosts.
>>
>>3640944
>And we're in the middle of a spire made of anti-empathy material. And the city can't do shit to Isabelle. Ozmas killed this city once with her skintalker power. Isabelle can do the same thing now that she has Ozma's lexicon.
Ozmas's lexicon, but not Ozmas' level. She just ate the corpse, she didn't have any special consumption-boosting skill or Relic. B'Ni's Skintalker skill should be level one, with the grand majority of the level ups going to existing skills. Maybe she has some augments from Ozmas, but the skill should still be much weaker than the original user's. She can't destroy the city like Ozmas could, we can do this. We have to get out of the spire, yeah, but once we do we can force B'Ni to fight an entire living city.

>it may be because it's 2 am, but somehow I feel that this city might be a really, really, good base of operations if we're going to need a fallback point. Shame about the anti-skintalker ghosts.
No, that sounds like a terrible idea.
>>
>>3640913
it already has been used. the ectoslimes, the Zombies against Isabelle, and the Dream Daughters.

>>3640944
yeah, its not a consolation but Isabelles gonna learn you cant just MAKE a perfect companion, its just not how it works. especially basing them, even just physically, off of a visage that will bring back alot of thing you would prefer to forget.
>>
>>3640966
>it already has been used. the ectoslimes, the Zombies against Isabelle, and the Dream Daughters.
No, that was how the ghosts manifested, we got an explanation for that with Almath being tied to memory. The "the city is mallable and responds to emotion" thing was brought up in response to Holly managing to make constructs. It's a separate gun. We can shoot this thing. Come on, just let me have some hope. I'm sure it will be crushed come morning, but for now I want to believe we can turn our frustration with B'Ni into the power source for a giant city-mecha to squish her.
>>
>>3640944
>Ya know. I went and had a fridge-think of the logical conclusion to Isabelle's insane intention of simply camping out in the cord making Shu clones so she can play house with and it's downright creepy/scary/sad.
Yeah, that sounds pretty plausible. B'Ni's never actually going to be happy, her plan was always crazy. Going to make for a spooky final level, that's for sure.
>>
>>3640982
you think what you want, but honestly i just want to let this get over with and move on, not drag it out no matter what it might accomplish.

plus i just cant see it working. not in time to stop her from leaving at least.
>>
File: Greater_Scorpion.jpg (71 KB, 640x640)
71 KB
71 KB JPG
>>3640944
That is kind of what i imagined as well and as we fought Isabelle for the first time just before the Spiral. Our death seemed inevitable so we wanted to spite her. Now we have a chance to get out of this.

If we could expand the City or move it we could literally bring a titan to attack the Cord and Isabelle later on.

>>3640944
>it may be because it's 2 am, but somehow I feel that this city might be a really, really, good base of operations if we're going to need a fallback point. Shame about the anti-skintalker ghosts.

If we can get rid of our small ghost problem which we are not gonna be able to do for quite a time
If it is even possible to get rid of the problem, its quite possibly that we would have to sooth the ghosts before being able to dissipate them.

>>3640982
I would like to fire that particular gun. Turn the entire City into a walking Titan that rips itself out of the Ground of the crucible to march to war against Isabelle on top of the Cord and rip it open with claw and plasma>pic related
>>
>>3641008
>If we could expand the City or move it we could literally bring a titan to attack the Cord and Isabelle later on.
>titan class
Anon. That ain't titan class. The City's too big to be called a "titan". It's probably Behemoth class, or even Leviathan class when it comes to size.
And this city is somehow either in the Earth's mantle, or several hundred miles beneath the Earth's surface. It's a huge distance for a city to dig/climb up to topside.
>>
>>3641022
I was using Titan a general catch all for massive creatures/constructs without using the correct classification. The city would be absolutely massive i agree

If i can reference the description of Almath
>The city that extends far into the underground horizon is a thing of imperial majesty, bronzed spires and ornate homes comprising a vast, impossibly regal kingdom. The sky is a mottled blend of glowing orange biomass and rippling stone, a baroque imitation of a dark-streaked evening sky, the blackened rock overhead resembling rain-swelled clouds rolling across the horizon.

The city got down her somehow through the Biomass. It can be brought back up. Maybe it could become a wormlike creature that burrows itself up and then transforms on the surface into a more combat effective form.

It does not have to be that fast either.
The Admin is practicly out of the game and Isabelle will have no interest in meddeling with us for quite a while, so we might have the time to do it.

Maybe by taking a part of the city topside we could plant a seed that would give us a surface Almath in time or allows us to teleport it topside
>>
>>3641008
>>3641072
as i told the other Anon, id much prefer to just leave this behind. at this point the less to do with this city, the better.
>>
File: confusion.jpg (55 KB, 276x276)
55 KB
55 KB JPG
>>3639791
I didn't think that would turn out that way at all. It was what I was hoping for last vein but to see it happen...
>>
>>3639791
>"I saw into Sam's memories recently. She hated being in love. Because of her mother, she associated it with losing control. So when she realized you were in love with her, she was terrified, and chose to stay 'in control' rather than open up her heart to you. Her mother and the suitors she brought home made her see love as a weakness to be exploited."
>"if...if it still doesn't matter to you...if you still want to kill me... then do it. Do it now. But leave my family alone. They have no part in this."

I just feel like she should know. I'm sure part of what lead her down her current path is not knowing why Sam turned on her like that, as much as the actual betrayal itself.

The problem now is how do we get Gina back? That's my reason I'm pissed we couldn't stop her, and I don't want to wait until the end of the quest to get her back.
>>
>>3641159
>I just feel like she should know. I'm sure part of what lead her down her current path is not knowing why Sam turned on her like that, as much as the actual betrayal itself.
I just feel like she shouldn't know. There is no point to telling her this. It's not going to talk her down or make her change her ways. And she certainly doesn't deserve any closure this might give her. Don't tell her anything about Sam, it's completely pointless. All it does is make Shu look weak by trying to appease the monster, and let's not give B'Ni the satisfaction.

>The problem now is how do we get Gina back? That's my reason I'm pissed we couldn't stop her, and I don't want to wait until the end of the quest to get her back.
Here are the ways we can get Gina back, as the situation stands: 1. Wait until the epilogue, after we've killed Final Boss B'Ni. 2. B'Ni giving us some sort of mocking mercy, thereby denying us agency. 3. A deus ex machina happening, thereby denying us agency.
>>
>>3641269
You have a problem anon.

And it's not about whether she deserves anything, and neither is it about looking weak or appeasing her, especially when a common vote right now is to let her do what she wants to us while begging her to leave the rest of the party be. I'm giving her that knowledge because it's the right thing to do and there's also no point in not telling her either. Especially if Shu is assuming she'll die here.

>Here are the ways we can get Gina back, as the situation stands: 1. Wait until the epilogue, after we've killed Final Boss B'Ni. 2. B'Ni giving us some sort of mocking mercy, thereby denying us agency. 3. A deus ex machina happening, thereby denying us agency.
I'll take lack of agency, as annoying as it is, if it ends the "Gina is trapped in B'ni's head" subplot. I can handle having Isabelle and/or Mother's body as the final boss for that really meaningful final challenge even if it was done in a pretty railroad-y way, but that first option is the worst one out of the three. It's best that we can move forward.
>>
>>3641276
>And it's not about whether she deserves anything, and neither is it about looking weak or appeasing her, especially when a common vote right now is to let her do what she wants to us while begging her to leave the rest of the party be. I'm giving her that knowledge because it's the right thing to do and there's also no point in not telling her either.
I don't see how it's the right thing to do. Seriously, I'm not getting it. What moral obligation can we possible have to B'Ni after all this? But even if we did have any, do you honestly think she cares about Sam anymore?

>I'll take lack of agency, as annoying as it is, if it ends the "Gina is trapped in B'ni's head" subplot. I can handle having Isabelle and/or Mother's body as the final boss for that really meaningful final challenge even if it was done in a pretty railroad-y way, but that first option is the worst one out of the three. It's best that we can move forward.
Sure. But I was just giving you our options. Option one sucks, but it's the only one we can rely on. The other two are out of our hands.
>>
>>3641269
I have to agree with >>3641276
opinion
Getting Gina back would finally end this shit with us having to worry about her. I am fine with getting her back even if it takes the agency over it away from us.

Even if we only get back Gina and no one else it would give us back a dedicated Neuromancer. And it would give us still some investment since we would still have to save everyone else from Isabelles Head and then also whichever similacrum she created to sate her desires.
Isabelle is so strong that we most likely have no other chance to get her back. I am sure if we back Isabelle into a corner for long enough she would sooner annihalte herself before allowing Shu to take back Gina

I also like the Megacorporation Idea i had last Vein ever more. We build our own Cord based on a fast Food Empire and then just walk up to Isabelles Backjard, knock at her door, rip it out and bash her over the head with it for being an insufferable bitch

>>3641159
I really would not bring Sam any more into this than is needed leave her out completely. We really do not need Isabelle angry at us by bringing up Sam and giving her the Feeling we are trying to manipulate her
>>
>>3641289
I really would not bring Sam any more into this than is needed leave her out completely. We really do not need Isabelle angry at us by bringing up Sam and giving her the Feeling we are trying to manipulate her
You give a better reason, so fine. I'll save that speech for her death's door state of clarity whenever that happens in the quest.
>>
>>3641276
>it's the right thing to do
no, its really not.

>the final boss for that really meaningful final challenge.
Isabelle is about the least meaningful and most boring option for a final boss. a clich'e highschool drama would be more interesting than her at this point, even the characters in those would cringe at how tiring and boring she has become.

>>3641159
>>3641287
>>3641289
honestly our best hope is that Isabelle no longer wants anyone tagging along with her in her head and no longer has any reason to care about us even when it comes to revenge. im sick of losing agency, but everything related to that and these plotlines is fucked anyways so sure if it gets it over with whatever. id still of preferred to gain or lose Gina in a way that felt like it was up to us to do, but now thats highly improbable.
>>
(Gentlemen, considering I’ve written and re-written the next post half a dozen times by this point, I’m afraid I’m a little out of sorts and continuing the Vein in my current state would be ill-advised at best and disastrous at worst. I have a small update planned that would be best left for this evening, given the day’s mounting workload and the need to take a step back and look at things after I've had a little time to process things. Suffice to say, I appreciate your honesty and patience while I work through how to proceed, and I’ll keep you informed accordingly. I hope your day goes well, one and all.)
>>
>>3641642
Alright take your time. I prefer Quality over Quantity

Take care not to work yourself to hard it helps no one if you push yourself to much
>>
>>3641642
take your time, both to do what you need at work and for the Quest.
>>
>>3641642
Do take that opportunity. Take all the time you you want. You DEFINITELY need the time and the time away from this quest to reset your perspective and approach this from a fresh new angle. Only do so when you're ready.

>I have a small update planned that would be best left for this evening.
Don't rush yourself. You will need more time than you think you need. Focus on getting your own ducks in line first and take care of yourself first and foremost before you come back to working through how you'll proceed.
Rush jobs will not be accepted.
Besides, Veins like this have lasted up to a week before falling off the board.
We have been very patient with you and will continue to be patient with you.

Now go work on your irl job and put bodyhorror on the backburner so you can reset your perspective with a fresh state of mind. But only if you are ready.
>>
>>3641642
Ooph. I'm sorry to hear you've got a heavy workload today. Well, take all the time that you need, BHOP. See you later.
>>
>>3641642
Well hey, I trust you.
Take your time and see you then.
>>
>>3641648
>>3641655
>>3641660
>>3641720
>>3641748
(Thank you very, very much. I appreciate it immensely, and have a good work day, everyone.)
>>
>>3641769
>homebase slides in from the archives
Wow, there was a ride. Hey BHOP, thanks for a lovely game! Course I land right on a cliff hanger. Love how youve blended in so many literary and media references flawlessly while maintaining such a meaty atmosphere, plot and charecters. Peak bamboozles too.


Offhand comment. What if Shu's hive isnt really bugs but the group shes.building around and within herself. Could Sam's loss of a family snd stability is what drove her choice of core and Sam is just a measure of Shus corruption. All daughters go mad eventually, why hasnt Shu shown any degredation? Sure weve only been alive for a short time, but we have been through a lot. Is Sam manifesting is her measure of it? Furthermore, why dont her allies show more corruption? Could it be that Shu has already eaten them, in a sense, and that they are a part of her now, some more than others. Maybe corruption is just a result of being injured and reforming over and over. Mother is alien and the planet had to be converted. I wouldnt be surprised if she did it wrong and gave the world cancer.

I know B'ni is the most pressing concern right now but this is meatworld fleshpocalypse. Nothing is sunshine and rainbows and any you see are likely a gout of blood fracturing the light from an unholy mother.
>>
>>3641802
Hi, welcome aboard! You came in at a bit of a weird point, but I'm glad to have a new poster regardless.

>What if Shu's hive isnt really bugs but the group shes.building around and within herself. Could Sam's loss of a family snd stability is what drove her choice of core
It's quite likely. All the Cores are supposed to reflect the Daughter's issues in some way. The Crucible probably intended for Trypophilic Hive to be a manifestation of Sam's need for control, but with Shu being the one to wield it it represents her desire for family.

>All daughters go mad eventually, why hasnt Shu shown any degredation?
Oh, that's just because we eat regularly. The madness comes from hunger, it's Daughters who stay in one place and don't get access to enough food that go insane. The party are wanderers and adventurers, they're always getting into situations where there's something to eat.

>Furthermore, why dont her allies show more corruption? Could it be that Shu has already eaten them, in a sense, and that they are a part of her now, some more than others. Maybe corruption is just a result of being injured and reforming over and over.
Well, I doubt that having to regenerate constantly is great for you, but from what we know the corruption is actually tied to level. With the exception of Unnatural Predator skills, you get only minor corruption until the skill hits level ten. So none of our party show any corruption just because they're not there yet. Shu's the only party member with a skill at ten or above, and so far all it's done is give her a bit of chitin plating along her spine.
>>
>>3641802
(Welcome, Anon! Thank you so much for reading, and I'm glad you decided to post when you did. I hope you enjoy the rest of the quest, and thank you again for participating!)
>>
>>3641802
hey, welcome. you joined at a kinda iffy point, but glad to see a new face regardless.

>What if Shu's hive isnt really bugs but the group shes.building around and within herself.
its funny you say that, but that is exactly why me and numerous other Anons were so hesitant to upgrade her Hive for awhile, because we didn't want her to basically start mind eating her friends on accident, which is what several factors were making us think might happen. thankfully we were wrong. actually, the 'choice' part of Shus Hive really hasn't upgraded much at all, which feels kinda weird. or, rather, now that we have seen more choices, her fools choice upgrading at all feels weird. most other fools choices seem to basically just be a powerful augment or passive ability, Shus was a outright tied in augment that upgraded...but only for like 2 levels then just stopped. im gonna chalk it up to the fact BHOP ended up adding Augments and stuff later, hence that stuff got into an awkward position like Recursive and some other stuff of Shus.

>All daughters go mad eventually,
not true, it is entirely possible to avoid it til the end, its just difficult. if you have a healthy mind and consume often enough, you have no worries.

>why dont her allies show more corruption?
mentally? same reasons. healthy minds from the group and regular consumption. the physical corruption? well...they do have some. Julia technically has no skin, her skin is a construct and not actually a true part of her. she als has extra hair on her body and longer nails from Badgers. Dorian being liquid apparently counts as part of his physical corruption. Amara is also liquid and has cat ears. Rath....well she has that endoskeleton that shows up semi-easily, but otherwise she seems fine. Shu has a giant stomach mouth and hexagonal plates on her back. for most classes corruption doesn't show up til level 10, so we so far dont have many Abilities that give it much if at all at lower levels, Badgers the one exception.

>>3641835
>With the exception of Unnatural Predator skills, you get only minor corruption until the skill hits level ten.
well, its the only one that gives heavy corruption right out the back, but other Classes and i think individual abilities can still start giving it much sooner. Flesh Artisan abilities BHOP said often have high and lower starting points aswell.
>>
>>3641879

Thanks for the session dear BHOP! Don´t worry too much about the backlash, this quest is still the best one I have ever seen (and I have read quite a lot of them).

I think that the problem is that we have been facing unstoppable foes for a bit too long. It is one thing to feel that you are facing something FAR above your level, but that doesn´t mean that the over-leveled encounter is invulnerable.
You can either escape an impossible match, and feel a sense of accomplishment when you escape from it by the skin of your teeth (even if you technically "lost"), or feel a incredible rush when careful tactics & lady luck blessing your dice makes you win something that the DM thought you couldn´t tackle.

What has happened today may not be railroading. I, for one, have a HARD time countering B´ni. That mobility and utterly predatory skill unnerve me, and I have a hard time thinking of clever plans whenever she is near. I make mistakes, and I can´t help but think "Whelp, we are DOOMED" in a C3P0 voice.
I guess that it doesn´t help that we played as her during the interludes and saw her in all her ruthless glory.

We are a trickster party specialized in planting traps, attrition warfare at distance and fleshcape battlefield control...
The opposite of what B´ni does. She is the inescapable hammer, a speedster that closes up for hit & run deathstrikes and that carefully avoids battlefields that may be terraformed for mobility kills.
She is our fucking Nemesis, built for our ruin... and I CAN´T think of a way to beat her.
.........................
To sum up: I freeze up when I am facing B´ni. Because she is a problem that, tactically speaking, lies in my cognitive blind spot. How many of you anons feel the same?

Now my problem with B´ni is that I have felt UTTERLY powerless in each encounter with her.
Honestly, BHOP.......could we ever have defeated her?
In the first encounter, we lost a family member in the flesh and many in dreamscape daughters.
And now... it is even worse. Now she feels like she has acquired unlimited power, something utterly unbeatable. If she decides to end us right there, right now, she WILL.... and my feeling is that there isn´t even a 0.00001% chance that we would get even a single of our family members to escape.

It would help a LOT to know if we COULD have beat her both before tree deletion and in this encounter, or if both events were scripted as our defeats for the good of the quest.
My point is:
a) Did we lose because we deserved it?
b) Was it because B´ni played her cards better and outsmarted us?
c) B´ni had to win, for the plot´s sake?

Sorry, but an answer to these questions would help a lot. You are an amazing DM, the best I have ever come in contact with, and I reiterate it again.
And if the verdict is "you lost because X-y-z reasons, git gud", I will welcome it... and train so that we may win next time.
>>
>>3642374
>How many of you anons feel the same?
well, honestly this time BHOP lead us on to feel like we had an actual shot to stop her, then basically made it feel like we never did, even outright intervening to try and convince us NOT to go after her true self, ruining any chance we had of stopping her. so i dont fucking know, i THOUGHT we did, but intentional or not, now it feels like we never did and it was all pointless to even try. as ive said, if defeat is what we earned through our own actions mattering, im willing to face it. its just things have felt like our actions dont really matter at all for a bit now, and BHOP once has outright kinda admitted to it, and otherwise hasn't refuted it, only said it wasn't his intention to make it feel like that and hes doing what he is to get the game to the point he actually wants it to be at.

and at this point, fine, if it gets us past this Arc and anything related to it, to never visit these points again or as little as we can, just move it along then. though im not gonna be able to get over him making Isabelle not just stick around, but making her the final boss almost guaranteed, and it is his absolute worse decision he could've made in my opinion, that will bring down the entirety of the rest of the quest knowing thats what its leading to.

otherwise, i feel like
>We are a trickster party specialized in planting traps, attrition warfare at distance and fleshcape battlefield control...
>The opposite of what B´ni does. She is the inescapable hammer, a speedster that closes up for hit & run deathstrikes and that carefully avoids battlefields that may be terraformed for mobility kills.

is a bit wrong. i mean, its not, only that we do have plenty of just plain, simple, brutally efficient beat em up options, and we have to great success used them too. though Rath is the one that focuses on that the most, we dont just rely on tricks, both as a party and mostly as individuals we actually have really good staying power to just dig in our heels and take the old fashioned approach. i think we actually have done a really good job balancing ourselves as a party, and mostly as individual members, between having enough adaptability, tricks, and old fashioned staying power. only Amara and Gina honestly are kinda one trick ponies, with Dorian being built to avoid his weaknesses in staying put heavily, though his problem is Health, not actual abilities that could lend to digging ones heels in.

i see where you are coming from though, we really do love our tricks and out-of-the-box tactics, and our party has alot of ways to pull them off. its certainly without our doubt our focal point, even Rath has her options, i just think its not all we have and we have done a good job making sure it isnt.
>>
>>3642374
>To sum up: I freeze up when I am facing B´ni. Because she is a problem that, tactically speaking, lies in my cognitive blind spot. How many of you anons feel the same?

The Problem i have with Isabelle is that she has been ruthlessly powerleveled and overtaken our entire group in a matter of hours (again) after we deleted her greatest assets, at a heavy cost no less.

I do not have the paralysis you speak off for more than a few seconds(as far as i could tell anyway) until my mind turns into overdrive to find a way to grind her into dust, but I always think: "What will she pull out next, that we had no chance of seeing it coming, to pull herself out of this one"
Maybe that is because i myself tend to play hit and run characters that can bulldoze oposition in many rpgs and Armies in Wargames that specialise in jsut bulldozing the opposition, so i kind of unnderstand the mindset of Isabelle a lot better than i understand the tactical grind and battlefield control that we employ with Shu, as the "just hit her till she dies" tactic seemed massively unlikely to succeed.

I have to admit that i am probably still angry about this entire debakel. When it came up that there was no Biomass here in the Arena is was like okay that changes things for the worst. We could not rely one our usual tacticts to defeat enemis. I still believed we had a chance and tried my best with everyone here to find the best possible solution...... It just felt kind of pointless to pour so much crative energy into coming up with a plan just to have it stop short because we could not stop Isabelle from Consuming a corpse, which until now never appeared to be so quick to be nearly instantaniou, at least in what it appeared to be to me

I think i started rambling......
>>
Hey OP. I don’t normally comment on the quests I’m reading, but after skimming the feedback you’re getting and your reaction to it, I felt that I needed to pitch in and say I really, really like the quest. And that the negativity is just blown out of proportions like there’s no tomorrow.

Keep up the tremendously good work, and do try to ignore the nay sayers. Most of the feedback I read is just bull.
>>
>>3640001

Supporting this. BUT I would add 4 contingency actions. I have tought this carefully, and I think that there is a way to survive this situation, should Isabelle decide to TPK us.

And make NO mistake, it is still a very probable course of action. It is very coherent with her past actions....and she may go for it.

After the speech acknowledging her victory, as voted by anons:

> ACTION1: Prep Escher Gear for party teleport. It is near-instant & undetectable. This denies party kill if she goes for it, and we may not need everyone free & in contact to prompt it. ANd we are NOT in combat, so that should make things even easier. Hundred-armed EXPLOSION action to grab party if needed for escape teleport.

> ACTION2: Ask her for Gina & co if she has the neuromantic & phantasmal counduit levels required. I think she may have the neccesary loadout for this, since she needed some of it for the clones and Mother must have been loaded on those skillsets.

> ACTION3: If ACTION2 fails, allow neuromantic & emphatic connection and tell her ALL we know about Sam. Offer to trade SAM for our family members again....if this fails, ACTION1 if we are endangered, or else wait until she releases us on her own accord.

> ACTION4: If Escher gear teleport escape fails and B´ni is out for TPK, break the anti-empathic walls by any means neccessary (Hundred-armed burst or Neuromantic hack into November, THEN AUTUMN PROTOCOL) and let Almath fury manifest swarm her while we try to make an escape.

What do you think? I think that decent chances on teleport escape gives us some options so that we need not to rely on B-ni´s mercy.
And, to be honest? I would rather escape a deathtrap on my own terms than to be at the utter mercy of her. She is so small and petty, for christ sake.
She MURDERED her lifelong friend (Gina), tearing her limb to limb slowly and painfully, JUST TO SPITE US. For me, that was the moral event horizon. If she had killed us, ok. She had some reasons to have a bone for us. But Gina?

What kind of maniac does that? I mean, I would feel better if she acts like the maniac she is now, instead of suddenly doing like nothing had happened.
In such circumstances, a successful teleport escape would feel like a victory for the ages.
>>
>>3642374
>To sum up: I freeze up when I am facing B´ni. Because she is a problem that, tactically speaking, lies in my cognitive blind spot. How many of you anons feel the same?
I did the first time, because that was such an "oh shit" moment that I wasn't thinking straight. We did not use our abilities to their full. This time around, though, I think we had things well planned-out. We were responding calmly and rationally and working to negate her advantages while maximizing our own. And then things went wrong all of a sudden.

>>3642434
Well, sure, of course it seems overblown to you. Because you're not actually playing. So for agency to be arbitrarily taken away from the players doesn't matter to you, because you never had any in the first place. Don't talk shit about things you're not actually involved in, anon.
>>
>>3642418
>I think i started rambling......
nothing wrong with that, getting your thoughts out is healthy and it is clearly a big point of contention what has happened, so nothing wrong with discussing it.

>The Problem i have with Isabelle is that she has been ruthlessly powerleveled and overtaken our entire group in a matter of hours (again) after we deleted her greatest assets, at a heavy cost no less.
another very good point. theres just too much going on here and that built up to Anons disappointment with this outcome. if it was just one or two things, i think like in the past maybe no one would be happy, but might be less...outward in their disagreement. but i think its the fact its not the first time people have had iffy feelings about something stacking on top of other issues, minor or not, that accumulated to something this major playing out like this just not sitting well.

>It just felt kind of pointless to pour so much crative energy into coming up with a plan just to have it stop short
yeah, again, i understand that way too well. even the First fight against Isabelle where we lost Gina felt like our actions had more weight to them, but maybe the fact we never were even given a reason to expect we had any hope of in even some form winning skewed how we viewed it, i dunno...

>which until now never appeared to be so quick to be nearly instantaniou, at least in what it appeared to be to me
oh no, this is an EXCELLENT point i meant to bring up. its very much been heavily implied Consuming corpses takes at least a little bit of time, to the point trying to do it during a battle could be a death sentence, and OUTRIGHT was given to us as an option outright said to take enough time to possibly matter after we defeated the statues, hence why we didn't do it. and now Isabelle can just touch Mothers corpse and get it in a snap? no explanation given either. fuck i literally did not try and have anyone consume her corpse because in part we had, under no circumstances, been given no reason to assume it could happen that fast. maybe Mother was pulling strings, fine, but if so that just lends itself more to the feeling we never had any chance here.
>>
>>3642442
I'm up for trying to escape on our own merits, but I don't think we're going to be given the chance. Still worth a shot, though. But I'd leave out trying to tell her about Sam. As has been pointed out, she will be at best uninterested in Sam and possibly react very negatively. So let's skip step three.

>>3642450
>oh no, this is an EXCELLENT point i meant to bring up. its very much been heavily implied Consuming corpses takes at least a little bit of time, to the point trying to do it during a battle could be a death sentence, and OUTRIGHT was given to us as an option outright said to take enough time to possibly matter after we defeated the statues, hence why we didn't do it. and now Isabelle can just touch Mothers corpse and get it in a snap? no explanation given either. fuck i literally did not try and have anyone consume her corpse because in part we had, under no circumstances, been given no reason to assume it could happen that fast. maybe Mother was pulling strings, fine, but if so that just lends itself more to the feeling we never had any chance here.
Not to mention that B'Ni apparently got all of Mother's old abilities, too. That's not how consumption works, she should get level one in all of them and have to put the rest of the levels into raising existing skills. So B'Ni's breaking two rules about how consuming works. If there had been some mention of a skill or Relic she had acquired to enable her to break these rules, then fine. I'd be okay with that. But we asked Gina about B'Ni's capabilities and no such enhancement was mentioned.
>>
>>3642434
>several people who have been here and given their time, commitment, and efforts to the Quest since it began having issues with the quests direction means nothing.
normally i ignore people like you, and hate pulling this card, but shut it. you have no room to talk. reading and participating in something are two massively different things that involve different efforts, and bring about different feelings. feeling like things you have worked for over numerous sessions, even Veins, are being cheated doesn't come from nowhere nor mean nothing, especially when its numerous people having issues with it, albeit maybe to different levels, but its far from just one person feeling at leas disappointed in the outcome, and all of them showing signs of not being newcomers either. even if you had just started participating in this thread and had this happen, id argue you at least have a right to feel disappointed in the outcome, and your criticisms not mean nothing.

>>3642442
i appreciate the support, though voting ended like over half a day ago now i think, heh.

i wouldn't call that a 'speech' though, or us directly acknowledging her victory, just us...trying to do what we always do, and protect our family.

>ACTION 1
we need direct physical contact for that, and everyone is spread out. she would kill us before we even grab hold of the first person, let alone all, even WITH Hundred Handed.

>ACTION 2
im just hoping she doesn't want them and will give them to us anyways, but im not sure outright asking will make her any more or less likely to give them to us.

>ACTION 3
honestly feels pointless, and i still doubt trying to convince her about anything related to Sam will do much but piss her off more, if she even cares at all anymore.

>ACTION 4
doubt we would have the chance but as a last ditch 'fuck you' move,it does have merit.

i get where your thinking and ideas are coming from, but Isabelle said it herself, she could reach the top of the cord now in minutes, and i dont think shes lying. shes...just gotten a power boost we literally cannot overcome. and its frustrating. id love for things, even our death, to be more on our terms, but it just doesnt feel like anything is or could be and at this point i just want to move on from this, its clear OOC at least this isnt going to be the end unless we outright try to kill her maybe, so i just want to do what makes sense IC, aka try and protect our family and bring her wrath onto us alone, and move on.
>>
>>3642459
>oh no, this is an EXCELLENT point i meant to bring up. its very much been heavily implied Consuming corpses takes at least a little bit of time, to the point trying to do it during a battle could be a death sentence, and OUTRIGHT was given to us as an option outright said to take enough time to possibly matter after we defeated the statues, hence why we didn't do it. and now Isabelle can just touch Mothers corpse and get it in a snap? no explanation given either. fuck i literally did not try and have anyone consume her corpse because in part we had, under no circumstances, been given no reason to assume it could happen that fast. maybe Mother was pulling strings, fine, but if so that just lends itself more to the feeling we never had any chance here.
>Not to mention that B'Ni apparently got all of Mother's old abilities, too. That's not how consumption works, she should get level one in all of them and have to put the rest of the levels into raising existing skills. So B'Ni's breaking two rules about how consuming works. If there had been some mention of a skill or Relic she had acquired to enable her to break these rules, then fine. I'd be okay with that. But we asked Gina about B'Ni's capabilities and no such enhancement was mentioned.

I think that was the thing that was similar to what Gina left us with ACCEPTANCE so she got all of Mothers Power.

She also so far only received mothers lexicon. the skintalker powers are actually pretty independent of the level they are on. The most important bit are the Words. Isabelle has the BIO and Acts to use all the spells and has Mothers knowledge how to use them

She did not necessarily have to break the rules about how aquiering new powers worked
>>
>>3642442
>She MURDERED her lifelong friend (Gina), tearing her limb to limb slowly and painfully, JUST TO SPITE US. For me, that was the moral event horizon. If she had killed us, ok. She had some reasons to have a bone for us. But Gina?
>What kind of maniac does that? I mean, I would feel better if she acts like the maniac she is now, instead of suddenly doing like nothing had happened.
yeah, ive been morally done with Isabelle for awhile now. i just dont understand how Anons dont realize shes a bad person, and it has nothing to do with the crucible. good people dont hide corpses and bash others heads in with lava lamps. Sam wasn't by any means a good person, and yeah in a way she did kiiiinda deserve something, but she still very much had not actually physically harmed or killed anyone, so i do think its fair to say getting murdered might of been a step too far.

>>3642459
i mean, yeah. she still would be 'mother level' in actually levels, but it does seem odd she got them in what seems like a unique way. like i said, i think Mother threw some tokens at her corpse to alter it, or the corpse itself, oddly, might of had something on it that altered how it was consumed, it just feels like we should've been given some sign of that being the case.

>>3642469
actually fair point that if she somehow got the lexicon separate it wouldn't be level based, but still feels odd she somehow had access to them, without Mother telling her them, which clearly was not the case.
>>
>>3642469
>She also so far only received mothers lexicon. the skintalker powers are actually pretty independent of the level they are on. The most important bit are the Words. Isabelle has the BIO and Acts to use all the spells and has Mothers knowledge how to use them
I don't know. They're somewhat independent, but not completely. The narrative seems to be implying that she has the ability to wield the Lexicon at the same level that Mother could when she just commanded all of Almath to die, which is a degree of power not linked just to knowing the right words. Like, if we gave Amara the same spell I doubt she'd be able to just command the entire city to die. I think she got the whole thing. But I suppose you're right that it could be like the ACCEPTANCE option, Mother deliberately giving her all the levels. Still wouldn't explain how she absorbed them so fast, but it would explain how she got all of them. So fine, objection partially withdrawn.
>>
>>3642434

I agree that the quest is great, and that it doesn´t invalidate the great work. I also have the utmost appreciation for BHOP.

It´s just that this is so anticlimatic, at so many levels...like other anons said, we REALLY were eager to get up to this, so excited, so pumped up on anti-B´ni plans & contingencies....

And then we get TOTALLED. Again. The problem is, as other anons more explained at length above, is that we don´t even know if we would have ever been able to win.

And I have to say that B´ni now gets to be dragon in chief... and MOTHER seems reduced to utter irrelevance. That wouldn´t, and shouldn´t be bad... but we trade the still misterious foe for one we intimately know... and which we won´t be able to ambush, chase or fight on our terms now that she will have a lair on prime chord tower real estate.

B´ni as last climatic boss? I would rather have faced her on our terms in the fleshcape, and either bring her into the fold before ascending or fought to the bitter death.

The last loose end before standing against the crucible. That would have been poetic.

Now we get to fight an enterenched position atop the chord. If we already got a hard deal because she always fought us on her terms in uncovenient terrain for us (see this blasted un-terraformable tower), imagine the WW1 trench nightmare we will be facing in the chord.

I don´t know. Feels like we are cursed every time we go against her, and I just WANT to know where we fucked up.....
And then make a godamn SHADOWRUN against her. Something for the ages, next to oldman Henderson, that makes us feel that, may it be bitter defeat or victory, was our work.

Not being AGAIN at the mercy of an utterly unbeatable being. One so powerful that not even escape is an option.

I am NOT against defeat. I am NOT against death, even true death of beloved party members.
Such is life & the will of the dice.

But right now we may not even ATTEMPT escape. We are against the LITERAL voice of god. And knowing we may not even attempt to run away and save even a SINGLE party member from this...

It hurts. I like the quest, I like the party members, and even having the CHANCE of B´ni going full psycho on them the way she went on GINA makes my blood boil
>>
>>3642485
and another fair point. she seems to be implied to have stuff akin to Amaras Relic, boosting the potency of spells and perhaps their costs even being negated, which just getting the lexicon wouldn't do. i suppose it is a fair point though, Mother probably had a Halo and thus could do an ACCEPTANCE, it just still feels like it was out of the blue a bit and that the consumption happened way too fast.
>>
>>3642490
>Now we get to fight an enterenched position atop the chord. If we already got a hard deal because she always fought us on her terms in uncovenient terrain for us (see this blasted un-terraformable tower), imagine the WW1 trench nightmare we will be facing in the chord.
I dont want to do something like WW1, its gonna be more than hell. If she keeps Gina she is probably gonna use her as a lure in the Cord to attack us mentally.
I immagine she is gonna have a lot of power up there. I imagine something like Dantes Inferno where she shows up with Gina in tow to taunt us and tries to break our and her spirit by twisting our deeds by showing them without context.

And i would absolutely hate that.........

We are not facing the Voice of God. We are facing a god of the Voice. We are facing what amounts to a dragonborn at full power with the entire lexicon of Powerwords at their fingertips and hacks active to set the cooldown to neglible.

Your not the only one whose blood was boiling after reading the last update.......... mine has cooled down over a long day of writing relics...... for a future that may never come to pass. Well such is life, I can say we tried so hard and got so far but in the the end it didnt seem to matter, we had little influence over how and when to engage Isabelle. Fighting her in the Fleshscape would have been far better i agree
>>
>>3642464

I agree on the fact that it is best to try not to rouse her anger and get past this...but I think that it is utterly irresponsible from us to rely on her good graces. We have a family. We have charges, and we WILL protect them succesfully, no matter the cost to our person.
The contingency ACTIONS 1-4 I suggested are backups in case she doesn´t feel merciful.
I agree with you that it is best to let things run their course, even if she aims to kill Shu alone, but should she try to kill our family, the contingencies should be activated.

Now on a more serious tone, TELEPORT ESCAPE contingencies SHOULD work. We are using HUNDRED-HANDED, which is INSTANT, to make a biomass EXPLOSION spreading TOWARDS the group. No finesse, no grabbing even: Just a raw explosion of BIO, almost as much as we got, contacting people & triggering immediately the Escher gear.

No complicated plan; just a rush that goes faster that even muscle fiber contraction speed does. Not even B´ni should be fast enough to react. Enough bullshit. She wouldn´t even have the time to cast a SKINTALKING spell, that´s at least 3-4 seconds to say the words.
Sorry to pull that card, but I have a Phd in Molecular Biology. A burst of speed that goes from zero-to-kill UNDER 2 seconds from a resting position 10 meters away from her nearest target is IMPOSSIBLE.
It is inconsistent even for what we have seen of the Crucible powers & biology, and as I have explained, goes against key muscle fiber & neurologic properties. Isabelle is AT REST, and won´t be able to REACT fast enough.
She is a formidable opponent, but NOT that powerful. And the "minutes till reaching the top of the Chord" is bullshit, and you know it. More like 3-5 hours, AT BEST.

Is there a VERY significant risk to pull this move? Yes, that´s why it is a CONTINGENCY, not the main plan, which is what you proposed: accept our loss, and surrender control.
But the danger of TELEPORT ESCAPE would rather be on the lines of her grabbing us and running us through once the TELEPORT is ONGOING, not preventing the activation. And if she follows us, we grapple her and TELEPORT AWAY fro our party.

I REFUSE this overpowered, spoiled psychopathic brat to end our family. If she goes for them (and she WILL be tempted to do it, remember Gina), HUNDRED-HANDED + Escher teleport WILL WIN THE DAY.
I consider the fact Shu will most likely die a perfectly acceptable price.

So hope for the best, prepare for the worst, but NEVER surrender agency. We are not done here, and our death WILL be on our terms.
>>
(Hello, Gentlemen.)

(Consider voting retroactive and continuously open for the next fourteen hours, with posting to resume in roughly fifteen. To those of you that offered words of encouragement, I sincerely thank you. It was a rough day and I hope you know it means a lot. It gets tough sometimes to separate opinions on one's creations from one's own self-perception, and I'd be lying if I said the negativity didn't get me down for a while as I interpreted it more as an attack on me as a whole than on an aspect of something I've made in the process of trying to become a better writer. I understand and respect the dissatisfied opinions presented throughout the thread, and I hope you're willing to grant me a window of opportunity to prove that I have not been so foolish as to make the same mistake twice in back-to-back Veins. I'll be able to answer many of the questions posed by you in a far more spoiler-free manner at the end of the Vein, but for now I will be charging onwards, and I hope you'll be willing to follow and take the reigns when you have control.)

(Gentlemen, two final notes before I leave you for the evening. First; I do not like to leave Chekhov's guns unfired. Second; If you look at the nature of this place, its ghoulish inhabitants, and your encounters with them up to this point, in addition to the preparations you've made with unexpected allies, I hope you realize that the deck is absolutely stacked by deliberate design, as it were.)

(Whether or not it's against you is a matter of perspective.)
>>
>>3642637
im sorry but you are simply probably just wrong. i dont think her reaching the top within near that timeframe is bullshit, we have instant teleportation AND have people who dont teleport but move at speeds that may aswell be. we also know Halos and other options CAN do instant, less than a second counters, and its VERY possible she has one, if not is just so high level she has similar. whatever physics you think is at work here, we HAVE seen numerous instances beyond what you are saying.

i mean sure, fine, fucking whatever, we can try the teleport but dont bring limits into this we very much know dont exist, it wont do us any good. shhe could be on top of us before we even can think to start summoning the Hands if she so chooses, in less than less than a second, its just a matter of if she wants to.

>>3642658
i honestly dont know what to say at this point, only id prefer you to just move things along instead of trying to make up for the mistake or something. at this point Isabelle just leaving would probably be what i want, rather than trying to drag this out any longer, regardless of possible outcomes. im tired of this section and the sooner we can move on and never touch these aspects again the better.
>>
>>3642658

Dear BHOP, as I stated above, it is always a delight to attend to your veins. Thanks for your kind words and take as much time as you need. You are an excellent writer and true gentleman, and nothing shall ever invalidate that.

Please consider that any negative opinions are only proportional to the excellent quality of your work, and never override it; and this "small backlash" only comes from a much larger delight and enjoyment sustained from more than 4 sessions of delicious foreshadowing and masterful writing & worldbuilding, never mind the wonderful 25 veins.
I am sure that as the vein concludes and explanations are given, no one will leave the thread frustrated, and even greater heights of enjoyment shall be reached. :)
I for one, always check eagerly if a new vein is open or has updated. If we didn´t love your style, we would not feel frustrated sometimes. And I think that even the most frustrated contributor has sung your praises at least 5 times before, and piled tons of text for the quest.

It is just that we grew so attached to the story & the party that now you are trying to herd very protective & clinically paranoid cats.
Cats who have decided to go to the US Marine Corps for a tour of duty, specialize in demolitions and try to recreate Perturabo´s Iron cage around their beloved surrogate family members and innocent Amara clones. And you are in the role of the veterinarian that wishes to check their meds.

"No, Ms Norris. You can disarm the 4 redundantly overlapped minefields and let go of your AR15, Amara dearest is going to be fine. Now what do you think about going out of the perimeter for a walk, mayyybe checking your meds, hmm?"
"-THAT´S WHAT ALL BASILISKS SAY! And then you get to be a stone statue for an entire schoolyear at Hogwarts!"

This comment about the "Chekhov gun unfired" makes me SMILE. I think that the following contingency in case B´ni gets violent (release Almath´s fury) may work after all.

> CONTINGENCY ACTION 4: Breach the walls to let ALMATH spectres & DREAM DAUGHTERS through. In that order:
> COMMS PRIORITY: Comm external daughters via the safest means available. Should be: Secure Crimson Cord comms to Gina > Jacklings > Empathic channel > Neuromantic skills. Instruct them to BREACH the walls nearest to the 6 thrones (symbolic value, ideal location?) ONLY if a peaceful solution cannot be reached.
> IF COMMS NOT AVAILABLE: Delay & obfuscate as much as you can. Then, LAST ditch actions if our family is in danger: KNIGHTLING/BANELING ACID EXPLOSION breach on walls > Neuromantic hack on November via stealthed Jackling and UNLEASH AUTMUN PROTOCOL ON WALLS.

Then escape on the confusion. I still recomend to avoid violence & confrontation as much as we can, and try to use B´ni´s good graces as much as we can.
>>
>>3642658
I'm sorry if our negativity felt directed at you personally, BHOP. That was not the intent. I feel confident saying that everyone here greatly enjoys your work. Authors don't get uproar like this if their audience isn't very invested in their writing. This quest is great, we love it, that's why a dip in quality feels like such a huge contrast. You've conditioned us to have very high expectations.

That said
>I hope you're willing to grant me a window of opportunity to prove that I have not been so foolish as to make the same mistake twice in back-to-back Veins.
No, I'm not willing. I'm sorry, BHOP, I can't see there being any way to turn this around. Even if we manage to defeat B'Ni through our own actions and not by relying on some deus ex machina that would further decrease our sense of player agency (the Geists swarming her for using Mother's Skintalker power seems likely), we're still going to remember how we got to this point. This Vein is always going to be "the one where a cutscene forced us to lose to shill B'Ni as the final boss". You can't salvage this, we can either move on and forget about it or try to retcon things. Neither is a great option, but dwelling on this plot point isn't going to get us anywhere either.
>>
>>3642658
So I got back from work, and I have to say. I expected a clusterfuck of a detail. It is nice of you to be willing to take to heart some of the opinions.
So for some advice in trying to get some good perspective in the shoes of us anons:
Go follow a quest that appeals to you. one that you also participate in. If it's already a long running quest, then just browse the archives and read them as if you were a player participant. Try to empathize with the players and figure out how they perceive a quest.

You've been a "forever DM", and you're losing the connection with the players from being entrenched in that perspective.

>Second; If you look at the nature of this place, its ghoulish inhabitants, and your encounters with them up to this point, in addition to the preparations you've made with unexpected allies, I hope you realize that the deck is absolutely stacked by deliberate design, as it were.

But the real question is to whom is it stacked against......oh....oohhhhhh.....

Bhop. You fucker mother of a DM. I see what you're getting at with your bamboozle now.

You swing us so HARD when it comes to the bamboozles that it gives us case of whiplashes. Now that I see what you're getting at, I'm honestly relieved that this isn't a "you can't thwart stage one" doomsday scenario. You fucking played us. And I'm mad and amazed.
I'm mad because you played us and legitimately thought we couldn't stop Isabelle. But I'm amazed that you're planning to give us our well deserved opportunity now that you've dropped the crucial hint that clued us in.
>>
>>3642776
>>3642658
yeah his Anon does bring up some good points i do want to address as i do feel you deserve to hear them BHOP.

while clearly angry, i meant nothing actually personal by what i have said, and do apologize if my frustrations came off that way. while i stand by my criticisms, i do not think, or at least greatly hope, you meant anything negative by your actions, despite what the result ended up being. i think, but really honestly dont know, that in your effort to make the story engaging, fun, and keep it flowing and interesting, you accidentally maybe stepped over too far, or were forced to sacrifice a bit of certain aspect for what you thought was keeping others, but either went too far or misjudged what aspect people would prefer?

as the other Anon said, i would not feel so frustrated at this section if it was not for the quality of your writing. i cannot and will not lie that i personally feel this is your worst section and you messed up, but it wouldn't feel that way if your usual level of excellence was not so goddamned high that an honest mistake still feels like a gut punch compared to the usual. i also would not still be here or discussing things if i did not want, and think you deserve, your fair shot at moving forward, nor if i did not want us to and had hope that you could improve from this.

again, i do apologize at least in regards to i never meant for any of it to actually BE a personal attack, but at the same time i do feel the criticisms stand and as much as it has impacted me, ignoring it or not putting it down would do neither side any actual good. for what its worth, i hope we can move on from this and that your week goes well. just...maybe take the one Anons advice and be more willing to take your time as you need it, if that is indeed one of the possible issues.
>>
>>3642681

Sorry, forgot about our resident supersonic speedster. That was gauche, my apologies. Still, I feel that probably there must be some caveats when it comes to reaction times, or this quest would get very weird, very fast.
Consider your arguments to have won, fair and square. I am trying to provide toolsets to crack this problem, and emergency teleport sounded to make the best of a worst situation... but I guess we will have to pray & see.

We should get speedster skills ASAP. Looking at B´ni success, we cannot ignore the fact that speedsters always choose the battlefield, and can only die to overwhelmingly succesful ambushes & mobility kills.

I still think that it is a good contingency if things go FUBAR and B´ni is distracted. Remember we could save Keane & Ace with HUNDRED-HANDED, and they were at terminal fall speed.
>>
>>3642806
Gentlemen. hear me out.
>>3642817
The reason why Almath was designed like this is to keep Ozmas contained should she be revived.
And if a daughter were to take Ozmas powers, she could get there, but the City will now do everything in its disposal to either contain the daughter that has Ozma's powers or kill the daughter.

We have the support of the City and all of our dream daughters.

Yes, we may be at Isabelle's mercy for 5 entire rounds, but we can stall Isabelle here and now. The City is deliberately designed to be a Skintalker's tomb.

Open the door to the outside, ask Isabelle to use the skintalker words to free our family from the spell binds, this will immediately aggro the entire city. Even if Isabelle has 6 ACTs, she's facing an entire city of geists. And when it comes to fighting geists, the only ones who can effectively destroy them are Dream Daughters. Isabelle is without dream daughters.
>>
>>3642837
Yeah, it's obvious that's where he's going. B'Ni took on Mother's Skintalker abilities, so she'll have inherited the Geist's rage against her. And then they'll swarm her and do a lot of damage because Daughter abilities don't work well against Geists. It's very obvious, you didn't need to explain it. And I don't care. This doesn't actually fix anything. It's just another deus ex machina, taking agency away from us in favor of a scripted cutscene. The problem is not that the outcome of this encounter was B'Ni winning, the problem is that the method for her winning was one that didn't care what we did. We were just passive observers in the process. This is the exact same thing, we might as well not even be here.
>>
>>3642811
>You swing us so HARD when it comes to the bamboozles that it gives us case of whiplashes. Now that I see what you're getting at, I'm honestly relieved that this isn't a "you can't thwart stage one" doomsday scenario. You fucking played us. And I'm mad and amazed.
I'm mad because you played us and legitimately thought we couldn't stop Isabelle. But I'm amazed that you're planning to give us our well deserved opportunity now that you've dropped the crucial hint that clued us in.
my problem is thats not good enough. im sorry, but its not. we wanted and were lead to believe we had a shot at stopping her from even reaching the corpse, and me and other anons WANTED that chance, even if we might fail. something else doesn't make up for that, a due ex city fight isnt what i want, honestly i HATE that shit. i LOVE when a fight feels like you are standing on your own merits, your own strength and decisions, NOT some overpowered empath nonsense that turns a fight into a anime esque battle of the gods type thing, especially at lease when we have not earned that, its not OUR strength, its a plot point cities strength. that to me is just a slap in the face, and id just prefer to move on, especially as the feeling of that fight would be further ruined by him taking our agency and chance to stop her here away in the first place.

and just like this Anon said
>>3642806
>>3642658
it really is the same mistake twice, im sorry but thats what it feels like. honestly im tired of the Bamboozles, theres a limit before it just gets annoying and tiring, especially when they take away even just the feeling of agency. you said BHOP 'i dont take thing away unless i plan to give double back' but honestly? and i really do hope you read this part. honestly? stop taking things away in the first place. i dont want double back, i want our fair damn shot the first time around, and the 'doubling up' does NOT make up for it, all it does is taint it with the fact you had to trick us or outright pull away our agency in the first place to give it. im sorry, im trying to word this to where i truly mean nothing personal or anything by this, but just stop. the minute you did that the last time, was your first major mistake, and intended or not making it feel like it happened again was not the hay on the camels back for me, it was the punch into its back. a Bamboozle works because it doesn't happen often, and it still only works if we still felt like we some form of action we took with it. your using them too often and setting them up in ways that isnt good, in my opinion, and its getting tiring i guess.

thats honestly what im feeling right now. im tired of this nonsense, and want to move on from it, so please, no more chekhovs guns, no more hints at other solutions, not more of this section of this Arc. just...please, even if you literally have to take our vote and do a 12+ part full 3000 word write up, just move us along to a place we all and the story can recover at.
>>
>>3642822
>gauche
i mean, no, you're right, the teleport is or best bet here.

and i do apologize if i came off as...snobby or something. i mean, i stand by what i said, i just feel my frustrations could be making my tones terrible.

>>3642837
yes, i know. its obvious what BHOPs hinting at. i dont care.
see
>>3642882
im done with this. anything he can give us here, i dont want anymore. i just want to move the fuck on.

i may think Isabelle is a terrible choice for a final boss, and yeah that MIGHT be a chance to stop her. but as far as im concerned we shouldn't have to be using this method to stop her and i just really really, do not want anything more to do with Isabelle or this stupid city. ever again. at least if we let Isabelle go, its done, shes gone. she literally will not be around again until literally the very end, and we can then just ignore the city and never come back. we can brush this as under the rug as we can and move on. trying to fight her here is just extending a section of the story i do not want extended.
>>
>>3642882
>>3642857
So what you two are saying is that the two of you are so emotionally invested that it's given you emotional fatigue, and that you would rather have Isabelle walk away scott-free and let her sit as the Crucible's Final boss because you couldn't give a shit because the QM jerked you around so many times that you're now just apathetic to the entire quest from here on outwards because what Bhop pulled was the Bamboozle that broke your back.

Isabelle "killing" Gina on the beach and the near party-wipe was the bamboozle that nearly broke MY back. And yet I've held on.

It might be because the fact that I have a day-job that's given me distance and a considerable degree of clarity in exchange for less participation in the quest (which I really wish I could still participate to an intense degree like before), but I'm thinking the two of you need to step back and cool off. The two of you are just too emotionally invested and you're letting your emotions get the better of you and both of you are on the verge of burning out.
>>
>>3642907
no,see
>>3642817
and read it again. im done with THIS section. im fully willing to give him his chance to move past this and give us a a moment that feel more genuine to what the quest has been said and he says its about; our choices and making them matter, for good or bad.

im done with THIS section, im done with THIS fight, im done with THIS place, im done with THIS character, but im not done with THIS quest, and still want to give it it fair shot.

also the Gina segments still felt like it had more agency than this. i barely got any sleep those night, trust me i know what you are trying to say, but the difference was, we were never lead to believe we could beat Isabelle, we were never lead to believe choosing to fight her might not end like i almost did, yet we still CHOSE the option that lead to that, and even during the whole session it still felt like out actions had SOME impact, but we were merely in a situation where the end if we went down that path we had already known and expected, and as much as it would've sucked, could've avoided.

ive gotten none of that from this section.
>>
>>3642907
First of all, it's not a bamboozle if there's no way to avoid it. You can't trick me if I'm not a participant in the process. Second, I've got no problem with B'Ni getting some big karmic backlash or whatever. Just don't waste our time on it. Put it in a recap. Skip to after the action. Have the next post put us back at the Dragon's Lair, waiting for the Sparagmos Engine to finish reviving Gina, and explaining to the Crew what happened.
>>
>>3642658
Amending my vote:
>>3639791

>Open you mouth to speak...then close it.
>try to come up with words for a few minutes. a phrase, anything. Finally settle on something akin to a confession and a last will.
>This confession is to deliberately stall for time.
>"You were right Isabelle. You were right about Sam."
>"I saw Sam's memories. A lot of small bits and pieces, but the big picture is there. You may have heard this before from Sam's mouth, but hear it from my own perspective. Shu's Perspective. The details are a bit sparse, but the main beats are there. When Sam was little her father died. When you met her in your childhood, she was self centered and hurt. She punched that bully because said bully insulted her dead father. She didn't notice you until after the fact. Much of her anger and stress came from her mother bringing in boyfriends and suitors that abused her ever since. She was quite angry at her mother from losing control, for falling for a man who gave her black eyes on a daily basis.
>"...Somewhere along the way she got a twisted notion that love is a weakness that she could manipulate, something that she could control. Sam felt no love during your first kiss. She was disgusted by it and was desperate to get away from you. And...I guess that's what broke her into manipulating you. The loss of her father, the loss of control, the daily torture by her abusive soon-to-be Step-father...
>"Her best laid plans to go to an out-of-town college and escape her family went to waste because her application was denied. That's why she was desperate to enter a sorority. That's when she met Gretchen. That's when Gretchen dared Sam to undergo that hazing ritual of a college prank. That's when that happened. The rest of the story you know well."
>"if...if it still doesn't matter to you...if you still want to kill me... then do it. Do it now."
>"if...if you aren't going to kill me or my family, then...I'll show you the door. I'll let you out.
>Plug a Neurojack into the ground, make a big opening in the wall behind you.
>"take me hostage if it pleases you...But leave my family alone. Let them go. They have no part in this."
>>
>>3642837

I agree with your analysis about the City being a purposeful MOTHER containment area. It is brilliant! This actually gives us a fighting chance, and it is NOT deus ex machina!
Remember those strange hints in the diaries and past two veins about the Hexxane actually having shackled the Crucible for a while? I get the feeling that multiple Hexxane winners used their "One wish" to force it to restart several times on the SAME Hexxane planet....

Hence the 12 statues. Maybe even up to 12 winners! The Hexxane were taming the Crucible via cheating respawn tactics...and then MOTHER decided to mess with the procedure.
Still, it means that the Viziers had ways to contain the favoured daughter of their time.. and probably is the reason why Mother´s corpse is somehow still here. And probably Almath was partly upgraded/designed as such a cage, and hence the Gheists. They were not a bug, but a purposeful "M.A.D" feature.

The costs for the masses must have been horrendous, while the Elites probably waited the worst of it in their safe underground cities. This must have led to great popular unrest. It makes more sense that MOTHER could take on Almath if she was actually strongly supported by the masses; the spearhead driven by an entire nation risen in revolt is more believable than a being of such unnatainable power that it could roll over an entire civilization unimpeded.
Importantly enough, it paints B´ni right now as a powerful foe, but not as unbeatable as we thought.

It may even be possible that Mother could escape this deathtrap last time because her dream daughters unanimously supported her. Maybe Ozma was a messianic, liberator figure supported by the masses against the vizier elite, and this gave her dream daughters unity of purpose great enough to overcome the gheist shackles that should have assured her downfall when she rebelled against the Viziers.
Hence why, even if Almath burned, Ozma could escape to climb the Cord.

Now, B´ni is actually in a hilariously bad position. She does NOT only have all our dream daughters against her, the ENTIRE Almath city hates her guts.... and every single dream of her dream daughters wants her dead.

An ARMY of zombified daughters. Her own sins, risen by her very own hand. She must be an unprecedented case, few figures must have ever had so unequivocally poor relationship with their dream daughters.

If we can breach the walls, should she be unbeateable, the sheer stress of fending them off will give us time to escape.
And take into account that she will try NOT to use the Lexicon of death, which was our greatest problem... unless she gets swarmed by aggro-ed Gheists.

If only we did have the time to have studied Ozma diaries prior to this vein.... We would not have felt bamboozled at all.

Rejoice people! RABITT SEASON IS ON!
>>
>>3642970
im still against the whole Sam spiel, no matter the intention, what we already have, coupled with the teleport, is good enough.

>>3639791
my vote is still;
>Open you mouth to speak...then close it.
>try to come up with words for a few minutes. a phrase, anything.
>"if...if it still doesn't matter to you...if you still want to kill me... then do it. Do it now. But leave my family alone. They have no part in this."
>Stumble on your words, show your fear, to give yourself time.

coupled with;
>use Hundred Handed to Snatch up your allies and teleport out. you dont want to abandon Gina and the others, but you refuse to not fight to save your family from any wrath Isabelle might still have.
>If that cannot work, or the opportunity presents itself, try and instead break a wall or window and let Gina and the City flood in.
>Otherwise, after the teleport, waste no time making your way back with Dorians waypoint, so as to reconvene if you so can with Gina and the others.
>>
>>3642658
>>3642996
>>3639791
this is, with my actual vote to still just move us the fuck along and not deal with this AT ALL. this is only if you are going to make the mistake of dragging this out longer than it needs, which id very much prefer that did not happen.
>>
>>3642970
>Plug a Neurojack into the ground, make a big opening in the wall behind you.
Terraforming doesn't work in here, remember? We can't make a hole in the wall. There's nothing Shu can do to bring the Geist horde down on B'Ni. She could bore a hole with Heaven's Drill, but B'Ni would perceive forming that as an attack and just kill us. We can't even claim this tiny bit of determination over our fates, to be the ones to let the Geists in to attack B'Ni.
>>
>>3642970
also, terraforming doesn't work in here, so we cant do that with the plug. you can vote how you please, fine, but it needs to at least be something that can actually be done.

again, our options to bring anything into this place are basically nonexistent. if we plan to stop Isabelle with the city, literally our best hope is she spares us here, then rush after her and hope something slows her down enough to not just instantly leave the city.
>>
>>3642658
Bhop, did we set down a waypoint warp location at the Elevator Entrance to Almath? Because I explicitly remember voting to have us put down a way point marker there.
>>3642996
Or we could simply teleport to the Waypoint beacon that I placed at the elevator entrance of Almath. I get the logic of teleporting out, but we've already removed that waypoint marker and moved it to Almath's elevator entrance iirc.
>>3642959
I understand your apathy and your need to simply END the arc without a care about any loose ends to the point of asking Bhop to handwave this encounter and give us an auto-pass by literal QM fiat.
But that's just as unsatisfying to others because begging Bhop to use QM fiat and auto-resolve this is literally giving up agency.

>>3642988
THEN PLACE YOUR VOTE!
>>
>>3643077
>But that's just as unsatisfying to others because begging Bhop to use QM fiat and auto-resolve this is literally giving up agency.
We already don't have any agency, this is just acknowledging it. There is literally nothing we can do to even slow B'Ni down. Something might happen that stops her, but it won't be us.
>>
>>3643077
(You did place one, yes.)
>>
>>3643099
Hey, BHOP, a thought just occurred to me: Why'd you say that voting was retroactive? What does that mean?
>>
>>3643077
i think the point we are making is this doesn't make up for the lack of agency and honestly, i cant get excited for it, and i already said up above. its...a boring situation, not a good one, and doesn't make up for what happened. its not restoring agency to give us this, because we should've had the agency to prevent needing this at all. he cant fix this by continuing this, in my opinion all using ANOTHER 'dues Ex' no one asked for or wanted is just doubling down on terrible decisions and honestly feels like a spit in the face. he had his chance to give us an honest, good fight, and this isn't it. if he wanted us to have a chance to stop Isabelle, he already took it from us, and this isnt giving it back as far as im concerned, not in a way that i want, or matter, or doesn't honestly feel insulting at this point.

also my orders were based on the assumption we never put down that waypoint. i mean, yeah if its there, teleport to it, i just didn't think it was there.
>>
>>3643101
id suggest backing up my vote here
>>3642996
>>3643002
even just the second part, if that is what you want. its still a vote, no matter what you want, and if you want it, you have to vote for it.
>>
>>3643108
I already voted last night, I see no reason to change it. Unless that "voting is retroactive" thing means something important.
>>
>>3643101
>>3643120
(It was just if anyone wanted to back any previous plans. Apologies for the ambiguous wording.)
>>
>>3643120
did you? i honestly cant remember what you voted for.
if nothing else, so much has been posted since then, revoting might at least help things move along faster as it will be easier to count them nearer the bottom than digging through the rest. possibly less likely to accidentally be overlooked too.
>>
>>3643050

I respectfully disagree. Our dream daughter teams are outside, and our stealthed swarm is here and in our control. We can repurpose them to explode as breach charges without needing to visibly breed them, they are already available and nearly in place for a breach.

We can contact dream daughters through Crimson Cord, Empathic fields, Neuromantic cord landlines, the comm Jackling-enhanced armor suits EVERY dream daughter outside is wearing....nevermind the option of jacking November with one of the stealthed Jacklings that is integrated in the bug armour ("Chitinous stalwart") we crafted for EVERYONE who is trapped with us and puppeteer her AUTUMN PROTOCOL to blow ceiling or walls.

And because it is in November´s person and crimson-cord derived comms are HARD to disrupt, besides the fact that we DISPERSED the jackrabbit neuromantic chaff cloud via swarm and clone death a while ago... we actually can message and prep proficiently.

So, in order of expediency & firepower, it would be:

> BREACH ACTION4: External Dream daughters breach > Explosive stealthed suicide BANELING breach charges > Jacked November AUTUMN PROTOCOL > Other?

Still agree than non-violence is best option..but if violence:

> PERFORM: ACTION 4 Breach > ACTION 1 Emergency Teleport if the former doesn´t work.

Mood music if the Gheists & zombies come for our Jackrabbitt:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6f3j4okhb8o
>>
>>3643130
the walls block communication too im pretty sure. we would have to blast the hole first to speak to them.

granted, im pretty sure a giant explosion would get their attention.

>>3643130
>>3643077
also both of you are forgetting everyone but us has 4-5 turns of stunlock on them, and NO ONE is even half as fast as Isabelle. we do anything, and she WILL kill them. our best and only hope of both being defiant AND saving them is to teleport them out, anything else can come second.

if we want to try and fight her, fine, BUT we need to get everyone out so the stun can wear off at a safe distance first, anything else comes second. i suppose we could use the explosion as a distraction, just in case she IS fast enough to otherwise stop the hands? i cant see the explosion however stopping her from actually acting though, or knocking her back. at this point she could probably dash right through it if it was right on top of her.
>>
>>3643125
Ah, okay. I figured it was probably something along those lines. Thanks for confirming.

>>3643126
It should be linked to his post, so not too hard to find. But just in case, my vote was

>"Do whatever you want, I'm not going to beg. If you really have all the control that you claim to have now, you hardly need me to justify your actions. You do have control, right?"

That's the most I can muster. Even in-character, I don't think it's worth it to try. Shu knows how fast B'Ni is, and Escher's Gear takes a bit of time to warm up. She'll be on us before we can escape.

>>3643130
>I respectfully disagree. Our dream daughter teams are outside, and our stealthed swarm is here and in our control. We can repurpose them to explode as breach charges without needing to visibly breed them, they are already available and nearly in place for a breach.
Maybe. But B'ni would probably respond by killing us before it could matter. She hears a big boom and then leaps at us with a supersonic kick.

>We can contact dream daughters through Crimson Cord, Empathic fields, Neuromantic cord landlines, the comm Jackling-enhanced armor suits EVERY dream daughter outside is wearing
The ones outside aren't wearing stalwarts, it would just be the Crimson Cord. But I can't think that Gina can get here in time to matter. Or, if she can, it will turn out to be because she was already coming and so it will turn out that calling out to her was pointless anyway. I guess it might be worth it just as a bit of token resistance, but I'm having trouble caring.

>nevermind the option of jacking November with one of the stealthed Jacklings that is integrated in the bug armour ("Chitinous stalwart") we crafted for EVERYONE who is trapped with us and puppeteer her AUTUMN PROTOCOL to blow ceiling or walls.
November doesn't have a Jackling on her. It does not matter, anyway, puppeteering other Daughters is Neuromancy level five, we're only level four. And Autumn Protocol takes a bit to charge, it fires at the end of the turn. Giving B'Ni plenty of opportunity to notice the plasma cannon warming up and kill November before she can fire.
>>
>>3643077

I thought I did let it clear already, and had expunged on it. My apologies. Vote as follows, in priority order.

> PRIMARY: Speech acknowledging loss of control, ask her to spare our family. Try to appeal to mercy and decency...the one you wrote & supported. Try to get GINA & co back if possible.

> SECONDARY: If impending, UNAVOIDABLE violence and PRIMARY fails: BREACH ACTION: External Dream daughters breach > Explosive stealthed suicide BANELING breach charges > Jacked November AUTUMN PROTOCOL > Other?

> TERTIARY: If BREACH fails, TELEPORT ESCAPE WITH hundred-handed. LOCATION: Almath Escalator waypoint. Too risky if we teleport to safehouse and drop an enraged B´ni on our party by accident.
>>
File: get a hold of yourself.gif (1008 KB, 500x326)
1008 KB
1008 KB GIF
>>3643099
First the FuzzBuzz Ballpit, and now THIS.
Oh thank fucking god, Bhop. I am SO GLAD that I had the foresight to place one down. Otherwise the salt storm emitted by those two would be never ending.

Another question: Does the Augmented Crimson Cord still work allow us to communicate with Gina despite the Anti-empathy material this damn Spire is made out of?

>>3643102
And lo and behold. We still have a shot at this.

>>3643120
What Bhop literally meant is that Voting's back open and all prior votes made between >>3639791 and >>3642658 don't count. with votes from >>3642658 onwards considered Valid.

>>3643108
>>3643130 (I'm linking you to give you a recap of my interpretation of the situation)

Okay... We still have skin in this damn Arc you and that other anon are so sick and tired of (literally in a despair event horizon). We actually have a chance at killing Isabelle instead of running away like a bitch from teleporting back to the Dragon's Roost.
We have a Teleport location that puts us back at the entrance to Almath. Rath, Julia, November, and the Amara clones are down and paralyzed for 5 rounds, they can spend the time recuperating at the City entrance.
Meanwhile, we have 2 squads of Dream Daughters and an Army of Geists outside baying for Isabelle's blood. Shu's still in this fight since she's freed from Isabelle's SkinTalker spell. The Living team (Rath, Amara clones, November, Julia) can be teleported back to the city entrance where they can recuperate and act as the final guard stopping Isabelle from leaving the city.

>>3643139
And I understand your logic and frankly logical despairing at the situation. so stop it. Focus on what agency we still have left. Don't focus on what we can't bring bear to Isabelle, focus on what we can to save our Family.
>>
>>3643149
well, its almost like i pointed those issues out and you only focused on the negative part. whatever.

my vote still stands. it would be BHOPS third or fourth biggest mistake in row to continue this, but if he wants to make even more mistakes, our best bet is still teleportation away first, then coming back to fight her.

>>3643149
>>3643142
if we teleport away first then come back, mind you, we will then be blocking off the only escape route out of here, both at the elevator and/or the entrance to the city. it would also give us more time to plan and get back with the Dream Daughters, more time for more to spawn, and more time for the Geists to slow her down as she makes her way through the city.
>>
>>3643149
(The Crimson Cord is beyond this place. You may communicate with Gina freely.)
>>
>>3643141

I acknowledge your points. The teleport can be executed before breach, and priority switched.
I agree that stalling for time is optimal (and, accordingly, your option is EVERYONE´S primary plan), but we need out of this hostage situation. We can try to put as many pieces in place as we can for a teleport or breach, THEN execute as many plans in paralel, for BREACH or TELEPORT as we can.

While B´ni is formidable, she can´t kill everyone in one turn with physical actions... and I don´t know if she would be willing to use the LEXICON OF DOOM, given the area.
We may try to remind her the fact that she has ALREADY called the entire city on her ass with her SKINTALKER use...
They may not enter, but sure as hell the outside must be a Gheist pile already

Just tell her this and to look by the window.... and rejoice as she discards the use of LEXICON OF DOOM from her arsenal at the sight of the unholy Gheistpile.

Remember, we need only to bluff her for a turn, and TELEPORT away we go. And by porting into ALMATH, we gain a gigantic Gheist pile worth of deterrents.
Enough to GTFO, FAST.
>>
>>3643168
>if we teleport away first then come back, mind you, we will then be blocking off the only escape route out of here, both at the elevator and/or the entrance to the city
Unless there's a high-level Skintalker spell that allows for teleportation. B'Ni did say that she could be at the top of the Cord in minutes, after all. Maybe she was being hyperbolic, but that says to me that she can teleport. Might not be Skintalker, might be a different power Ozmas gathered, either way she's not stuck in here with us.
>>
>>3643181
actually, she can kill everyone in the room in one due to her Clones. that or it could be like Dorian where on the move she gets extra attacks, so she just have to move past each of us.

>>3643184
very true, but if she can do that, which yes is a possibility, hell her just being fast enough to leave in an instant is a possibility, then nothing we can do really matter or will be fast enough to stop her, and it still in our best interest to teleport away first, possibly moreso if she has spells like that.
>>
>>3643181
>While B´ni is formidable, she can´t kill everyone in one turn with physical actions... and I don´t know if she would be willing to use the LEXICON OF DOOM, given the area.
Why would using the Lexicon matter? We're in an empathic sense dead zone, remember? The Geists can't hear her in here. We need to get her outside for it to matter, otherwise she'd already be swarmed with Geists after she kill-stole Mother from us.

But even so, she also has whatever other abilities Ozmas accumulated. All that work with the Corrupted Sparagmos Engine to create the perfect build. I'm sure she has non-Skintalker area attacks, it would be silly to neglect the possibility of Skintalking-immune enemies.
>>
>>3643181
>>3643176
>>3643168
>>3643184
Well then, it seems we have more agency than we thought we had. We have the Crimson Cord online, we can contact the Dream Team outside the Spire. We have agency outside the spire.

>>3643192
You've forgotten about one crucial bit Anon. Casting a spell takes 1 ACT to say a phrase. If the Lexicon of Doom takes 6 entire ACTS in a single round to cast, then we have 6 Acts to break ourselves free. If Isabelle really wanted to kill us with the lexicon, then she'll have to devote her entire round and actions to completing the chant. And a spell that's interrupted is bio wasted.

Again, quit being so negative and despairing about how "invincible" B'ni seems to be. Focus on what we can do outside of simply teleporting. We have Agency outside the spire. We have a literal dream squad of daughters that can break into the spire and unleash the floodgates.
>>
>>3643149
>>3643149

I like the cut of your jib. As you can see, my own contingency plans have been sharpening and getting more optimistic by the second. Just please remember that I tried to implement & defend our TELEPORT & BREACH plans just to fight for the very same agency you defend. I am no coward, but the situation is challenging, for the very least.

I still think that we are in a bit of a hostage situation, though. Our best hope is delay, then execute teleport, then breach, the come back for round two.
Just consider that this relies on Isabelle not using LEXICON OF DOOM for fear of the Gheists. If she can take on Almath with that...well, sometimes discretion is best part of valour.
Good thing is, we will be able to wait & see, as long as we TELEPORT away.
>>
>>3643215
I don't think Isabelle actually knows about the entire city having instant aggro against SkinTalkers. Remember. Mother told her to simply get to the City and grab the SkinTalker powers, Isabelle fought through the geists without experiencing the terrifying aggro attracts Geists. Isabelle might be slowed down by the zombie daughters, but she's probably avoided Geists without knowing what really aggroes them.
>>
>>3643204
and stop telling me what to do. despite my very legitimate want to not even do this, im still offering advice and trying to help, am i not? but godamned fuck it, fine, if i cant even compromise and actually try and help even if its against what i want, then ill stop. it not like ive made several posts trying to work out how we can actually do this or fight back, even if that isnt what i actually want. im sorry for actually trying to compromise and give actual advice and help despite how i feel, ill stop doing that its clearly what you would prefer.


>>3643176
ignore this part of my vote BHOP
>>3642996
and only count this part:
>>3643002
Anon has convinced me this is the best course of action.
>>
>>3643204
>Well then, it seems we have more agency than we thought we had. We have the Crimson Cord online, we can contact the Dream Team outside the Spire. We have agency outside the spire.
I wouldn't really call that agency, when our only move is "beg for someone else to come help us, please, we're so helpless and incapable of doing anything".
>>
>>3643176

YEEES! Time for misdirection & hostage negotiation skills! Simon says there is a bomb in the empathy-blocking spire wall! And its is going to blow NOW!

Ahh... We start having levers & agency in place. This gonna be good.

I swear to god, we do not even need to "win". If we get everyone out of this deathtrap alive & bravely run away like scared kindergarten kids, it is still a victory for the ages in my book.
>>
>>3643229

Then let´s remind her of the Gheist doompile that has a hatred for Skintalkers just waiting outside, shall we? ;)
I think that they WILL sense the SKINTALKER power use through the walls. They are unable to enter, but NOT deaf.
I bet you can see a mounting pile of NOPE outside.... and with empathic channel, we can PROVE we are not lying ;)
>>
>>3643273
And then she just kills us with her other powers, because she has all of Mother's abilities.
>>
>>3643230
>>3643231
....I have no words to say. Alright then. I'll interpret your vote as a motion to give up and beg for QM fiat.

>>3643247
So if we have Crimson Cord active and a direct line to Gina un-impeded by the Spire's Empathy materials, what orders do we relay to Gina? And how are we going to misdirect Isabelle while simultaneously trying to appeal to her nature?

The confession about Sam is one idea >>3642970. We can keep talking to stall for time. I don't know how many lines of dialogue counts as wasting one entire round, but our goal is to distract Isabelle long enough for the Dream Team's Breach and Clear tactics to break a giant hole in the wall and unleash the floodgates.

Our living allies: (all of them are paralyzed for 5 rounds)
November,
Julia
Rath
Amara Clones

Dream daughters: (all of them have Unlimited Bio)
Gina (Isabelle)
Kosi (Isabelle)
Meg (Isabelle)
Eloise (Isabelle)
Johanna (Shu)
Bella (Isabelle)
Uzu (Shu)
Niku (Rath)
Holly (Shu)
Penny (Julia)

>>3643273
Don't let her in on the secret. outright telling her about the Geists will ruin our chances of regaining agency. Let it be a surprise. We can rescue our family in the confusion when the Dream Team pulls a Breach and clear on the Spire wall. Isabelle will be forced to use her Actions to defend herself from the Geist Horde after being caught flat-footed.
>>
>>3643296
maybe dont be an absolute cunt is what you should say.
>>
>>3643296
>>3643308
i mean, you think i was giving advice because i didnt want to help or still enjoy trying to help, regardless of our otherwise differing opinions?
>>
Man, it's really hard to join the discussion of this quest when the older players act like entitled jerks. I mean, being upset about the lack of payoff and >1 ACT was quite understandable, but salt and whining levels here are something else.
>>
>3638578
RWBY fan! Sweet!

>3641802
Same-thread friend! When did you start? I did a couple weeks ago.

>3642418
Isabelle is kinda the Thanos of Body Horror Quest.
>>
>>3643316
That was advice? I could've sworn it was a continuation of a long string of despair posting.
Regardless, thank you for the reminder of how Isabelle is bullshit op.

>>3643273
>>3643319
I'm glad to see you here and active. Join in on the discussion on how we could try and pull a Rainbow 6 Siege styled breach and clear on Isabelle.

For our current dream team outside the spire, we have
Gina: a Neuromantic Terraformer who has a direct line of communication to us via Crimson Cord. She's our sole method of communicating outside the Spire. We'll need to have her relay orders.
Kosi: Vitruvian girl who can supply everyone with unlimited health and bio. the team medic.
Meg: Brawler girl. Fibromancer type: Equipped with a Neurotic Halo and has prime experience in dream-fighting.
Johanna: another brawler, but gluttonous type.
Holly: A gluttonous type daughter.
Bella: Stomach Acid Generator
Uzu: Sprial Flesh artist
Niku: Impressionist Flesh Artist, can turn her limbs molten red hot.
Penny: Serial shanker who wields a chainsaw

Any ideas? We have only 1 round to pull off a Breach and clear.
>>
>>3643296
>....I have no words to say. Alright then. I'll interpret your vote as a motion to give up and beg for QM fiat.
No. I cast my vote to be defiant to the end. I just am pretty sure this is the end, and there's nothing within our power to influence it. But I am sorry, I should cut down on the despair posting. That's just wasting everyone's time. I don't really think that we can get out of here without fiat, but let's pretend for the moment, and talk tactics. Maybe somewhere along the line I'll start believing it.

>>3643353
Okay, we need ranged attacks. The Dream Daughters can't enter the deadzone, so melee is going to be useless. We also need to destroy as much of the structure as possible, because there's probably a diffraction effect and a small hole in it won't expose the entire interior. I think Gina toppling the tower might work best. Slam into the base with a huge outcropping of calcite. Have Bella generate a huge wave of acid, first, to weaken the foundations. Collapse the building in on itself, make a huge opening.
>>
Also, BHOP, can we backdate our message to Gina a bit? Say that we sent a panicked "Gina, get us out of here!" when B'Ni was doing her monologue?
>>
>>3643353
ah yes, because pointing out how the teleport puts us in a better position to fight her isnt trying to give advice, nor is pointing out where we might not be able to do things so we can change the plan to something that will actually work or work better also isnt trying to help!

also ive always tried to point out where we might be wrong about things, as alot of times people have been or misunderstood something, and it doesn't help them or anyone else to ignore where someone might be wrong in the planning process. you're misrepresenting me being...i guess a devils advocate(?) for me trying to...i dont even know what you are trying to say i was trying to do otherwise, besides giving you an excuse to be an absolute cunt.

like i said, i want to help, id even at that point be willing to perhaps give this a try, but if you're going to be an absolute asshat cunt about me actually trying to help, then whats the point? you clearly arent actually listening or trying to care about what it am saying, all you care about is the fact im upset and pointing it out. im frustrated and im venting, its how i deal with this shit while still trying to actually help and participate in figuring something out. but like before, of course, if i dont think exactly like you im the worst person in the world because only how you think or deal with things or view something is right, like you always act like!
>>
>>3643353
Eloise is missing from your list. Does 'desire' boost affect how our skills work inside the spire, or do we ave to be in the city proper?
Been lurking here irregularly since thread 20, didn't want to join because some anon was constantly ranting about characters and telling people what to do, which is a pain: about Uzu's incompetence, paranoia about Francine, etc.
>>
>>3643382
>Eloise is missing from your list. Does 'desire' boost affect how our skills work inside the spire, or do we ave to be in the city proper?
I don't think so. That's the empathic effect happening, and the spire is a deadzone.
>>
>>3643382
the spire blocks all empathy based shiz whiz, so we have to bust a hole or leave first.
>>
>>3643364
Well that's a start.
Having seen your proposed idea however, we can work with it.
We do need to keep in mind that Isabelle, Mother's Corpse, AND Shu's Family (including Shu herself) are up on the Spire top.
Also I did notice that the Spire's internal structure is akin to a massive Spiral Staircase. If we are going to topple the spire, we will have to aim for the core pillar support.

One harebrained idea is that I'm thinking of is having the Dream daughters blend in with the Geists by emitting the same raw hatred against Ozmas. they might interpret the empathy waves with an IFF with Hatred against Ozmas and skintalkers counting as "Friendly".

>>3643379
I apologize for sounding like a cunt and misinterpreting your words with a "coloured" lens. As for your teleport idea, it's a sound tactic. We can incorporate it.

>>3643374
I don't think we can do that. That whole thing was a pure "100% QM dictated you cannot-interfere" Cutscene moment.
>>
>>3643388(checked)
Hmmm, could someone do an artillery strike if we try to coordinate them through the Cord? Or do you think that dream daughters' hands are full atm?
>>
>>3643394
and i apologize if me being down was getting to you that much. i think a major difference is, this isnt the first time BHOP has made 'hoping' for anything not work out and feel like its just asking to get smacked, so im just not in the mood to just...i dunno, be ecstatic about another chance at all. and again, this just feels like a cop out, and only makes not getting our actual, proper chance sting more.

>>3643353
>>3643364
>>3643382
>>3643273
but anyways, im thinking, based off what ive seen so far and thought;
>Send word to Gina to be prepared to let loose the Ecto Horde and regroup with us.
>Distract Isabelle, keep it short and simple, keep it focusing on her putting any anger on us.
>Blow a hole in the wall.
>at the exact same moment we make the hole, Hundred Hand grab everyone, and teleport to the entrance.
>quickly use every means possible to reconvene with Gina and the others as fast as possible.
>quickly set about seeing if we cannot combine our emotions to trap Isabelle while the Geists are holding her off.

my thought is, the Geists will be more than happy to target her. Skintalker, smells like Mother, and they might even hate the citadel and wish to swarm it now that they can, especially with it having houses Mothers corpse while also being a place they could not enter.
>>
>>3643374
(By all means. I've come to realize cutscenes just kind of suck, so I'll happily bend on that bit.)
>>
>>3643364

We can use Niku to heat the Spire walls to its melting point with her Erupting Fist.
Uzu can impose her Expressionist Spiral Warping to weaken the Structure.
Meg and Johanna can pound away at the walls to weaken it even further.
Penny... Could be the Lumberjack. if we can wear away the foundations enough so that the deadzone is weakened, Penny can chainsaw the support pillar like a Lumberjack.
And then after the complete setup, Gina can deal the final blow by ramming the biggest, girthiest, pillar into the weakened base of the spire and set it falling.

Meanwhile. Shu could stall out by talking. If we're going to make use of the teleport tactic. Shu's first action should be to spawn hundred handed arms to grab and retract her family members as a protective measure. Isabelle does not know that Shu has a relic that allows her to teleport away, so we should save that as a surprise tactic until it's too late for Isabelle to escape from the falling Spire.
>>
>>3643419
I think I missed that part, but how do we deal with B'ni's ability to paralyze people with the lexicon? And wouldn't she also benefit from 'desire boost', like how she got so fast to the spire?
>>
>>3643394
>We do need to keep in mind that Isabelle, Mother's Corpse, AND Shu's Family (including Shu herself) are up on the Spire top.
The Corpse is gone, B'Ni ate all of it. Too bad, Shu managing to eat the rest and get her own big power boost would be a pretty cool way to continue this fight.

>Also I did notice that the Spire's internal structure is akin to a massive Spiral Staircase. If we are going to topple the spire, we will have to aim for the core pillar support.
Right, good point. So we have something to aim at.

>One harebrained idea is that I'm thinking of is having the Dream daughters blend in with the Geists by emitting the same raw hatred against Ozmas. they might interpret the empathy waves with an IFF with Hatred against Ozmas and skintalkers counting as "Friendly".
It's possible, I suppose. We might be able to make it work with Phantasmal Conduit skills. Depressive Weight is depsair, Verurteilung is fear, mix them together and we might be able to make something work. After we regroup everyone, that is.

>>3643401
None of the Dream Daughters really has the power set for an artillery strike. We've got a lot of melee combatants, here. I think weakening the central support and smacking it with a big battering ram is our best bet.

>>3643422
Awesome.

>>3643425
My worry is that since the anti-empathy field that's blocking them is, well, a field, they wouldn't be able to approach close enough to use touch-ranged abilities even if they're targeting the outside. Depends on how much of a psychic Faraday cage the tower is. Hey BHOP? Is the tower the equivalent of a Faraday cage?
>>
Hold on, where's our car atm?
>>
>>3643448
Far away. Why?
>>
>>3643450
Oh nvm then.
>>
>>3643437
(Effectively, yes.)
>>
>>3643425
we dont have some of those girls out yet, but otherwise toppling the spire is not a bad idea. granted, i dont think it will kill her, but still.

>>3643435
we cant. i mean, our team is already stunned, hence in part why we should fall back for at least a moment, but we only have two options for that;

One, hit her/interrupt her any moment she tries to speak.
Two, use the Amara Clones anti-Skintalker spell, and CONSTANTLY have them be prepared to send anything back at Isabelle.

granted, the second one might actually work, but id be VERY surprised if Mother didn't have either a counter-counter word, or simple immunity from an augment to it.

>>3643437
the issue is we aent entirely sure how this works. blasting a hole might only give a small area of allowance for outside forces, so we would need a second explosion to make an opening for the dream daughters to attack the spirals core.

granted, if the first explosion works and she gets flooded at the top with Geists, we probably can send out Swarmlings down to do that but....at that point, why not just have our Knights detonate on the core instead, so the Dream Daughters dont have to risk stepping in and going all fuzzy or something.
>>
>>3643435
Also how do we escape the spire if there are B'ni's speedy clones?
>>
>>3643419
Currently (As far as we know) the Geists are aggroed at Shu's Family because an Amara clone spoke skintalker words. If we want the Geists to change aggro and target Isabelle, we will need her to speak skintalker words outside of the tower and outside of the deadzone. The dream team are currently fending off the entrance to the tower for their lives.
That and the fact that the Geists can't enter the tower because the tower itself is one giant deadzone to dreamdaughters and geists.
If we want to unleash the Geists, we will have to topple the tower.

>>3643437
>>3643461
Damn. Well that just limits our options to jamming a giant pillar into hole of a Spire Entrance. What if we had Niku heat the Pillar up, and have Uzu warp it into a spinning Drill using Spiraling Fear? We now have what amounts to be a giant Drill.

>>3643422
There's a media trope that I would like to mention called "Cutscene Incompetence" where examples of said incompetence include:
>Standing around navel gazing while the bad guy escapes.
>Listening to the villain's Evil Gloating and exposition without even attempting to attack them, often while the villain prepares for the actual boss fight.

It's incredibly infuriating when you're subjected to this kind of trope, and happening in a quest where the main theme are "agency, choices, and control" of all things.
>>
>>3643472
thought the point of blasting a hole in the side was to disrupt the field? after that, i can seem the going after Isabelle just on the merit of everything else.

still sounds like as i said
>>3643465
here, our best bet to topple the tower is our own swarmlings. also Niku isn't here yet.
>>
>>3643461
Okay, cool, so Dream Daughters can get close, they just can't enter. We can make this work.

>>3643465
>the issue is we aent entirely sure how this works. blasting a hole might only give a small area of allowance for outside forces, so we would need a second explosion to make an opening for the dream daughters to attack the spirals core.
Which is why I want to destroy the whole tower. Not one hole, but the entire building collapses into a pile of rubble.

>>3643472
>Currently (As far as we know) the Geists are aggroed at Shu's Family because an Amara clone spoke skintalker words. If we want the Geists to change aggro and target Isabelle, we will need her to speak skintalker words outside of the tower and outside of the deadzone. The dream team are currently fending off the entrance to the tower for their lives.
Actually, we can speed that up. We left Amaras behind with the Dream Daughter teams, remember? We can have them bring the Geists in with the teams, so that once the hole is open there will already be lots of Geists waiting for her. We topple the tower, B'Ni panics and uses Skintalking because she doesn't know that attracts the Geists, and then there are already plenty waiting to attack.

>Damn. Well that just limits our options to jamming a giant pillar into hole of a Spire Entrance. What if we had Niku heat the Pillar up, and have Uzu warp it into a spinning Drill using Spiraling Fear? We now have what amounts to be a giant Drill.
Yes. That sounds great. Let's do that.
>>
>>3643472
>>3643437
(Actually, please allow me some clarification; what aspects of a Faraday Cage were you asking about, because I may have misinterpreted the question.)
>>
>>3643479
Hmm.... I don't think Swarmling Acid bombs by themselves will work. don't we have an army of Amaras and each of them carrying a single Radiant Boil to use as hand grenades?
>>
>>3643483
It's ability to block the empathetic field and making desires real?
>>
>>3643483
I was working under the assumption that the spire is emanating some sort of psychic counter-wave, that negates the sort of empathic field the Geists and Dream Daughters use to propagate their existence. And that the Faraday cage aspect was confining the counter-wave to the insides of the tower so that Dream Daughters and Geists could get up to the outside surface of it and be unaffected by it. I was not assuming the alternative, that the tower is itself just one big psychic Faraday cage, preventing empathic fields from penetrating it but not disrupting them, because I figure if that was the case then the Dream Daughters would fade the moment we entered the spire. They would be cut off from us, in that case.
>>
>>3643296
Okay. We are in a hostage negotiation with a terrorist (B´ni) which has us tied in a public school in Alaska, and claims that she has a nuke (LEXICON OF DOOM) ready to blow in Washington DC if her demands are not met.
We turn this around saying that the LEXICON OF DOOM is actually a suicide vest she is wearing (since GHEISTPILE), comforted in the knowledge that a SWAT team (Dream daughters) is discreetly preparing a breach outside. We stall for time AND give them footage through the crimson cord (our eyes are cameras, baby!)

And MOST IMPORTANTLY... Dream daughter orders! ALL ACT SIMULTANEOUSLY, although GINA camera work, MEG infiltration of the building & BELLA prepwork happen first.

> GINA: GINA has VISUAL with us through Crimson Cord, & through JACKING with other dream Daughters, they have eyes on the room too. They use that to pre.

> MEG: Is the scout, because she can swim THROUGH WALLS & CEILING. If a discreet hole in a wall is breached, she can swim through the building undetected... and THEN trip & run interference with B´ni as the BIG breach happens
She is safe ; she can retreat out of reach any second she needs. Remember, we only need to distract B´ni for 1 turn for TELEPORT escape.

> SHU or ANY DREAM DAUGHTER: Cicadalings or ANY skill that disrupt concentration-based actions! The CICADALINGS disrupt CONCENTRATION ACTIONS! And the MAIN threat is LEXICON OF DOOM, and spells ARE concentration actions! We order everyone to empty their Anti-concentration skills available.

> UZU: TERRAFORM & GRAPPLE B´ni via FEAR TO THREAD. BHOP says it WORKS even in here, and UZU has it leveled to hell. She can run paralysis on B´ni AND use it to fling it out of the building, rise a wall between the rabitt & us.... be creative!

> BELLA: Large scale demolitions: A pool of acid weakens the walls for a LARGE breach to happen, and floods B´ni afterwards, generally propelling her away from us. If she is drowning in acid, and without visibility or balance, her speed does her no good.

> KOSI: Our SWAT Sniper. Eye laser battery aiming though the wall. The second breach happens, FIRE through the walls. We know they are frankly OP & CUT through anything. Surprise attack with that punts B´ni 3 walls through from us.. Remember, GINA has VISUAL with us through Crimson Cord, & through JACKING with other dream Daughters, they have eyes on the room too.

> GINA, JOHANNA & WHOEVER APPROPRIATE: Battering ram. Get down a BELLA-WEAKENED Wall or ceiling, whatever is more disorienting. TRy to collapse the part we are in outwrds, towards the streets & away from B´ni.

We escape via teleport / Falling away THEN teleport, dream daughters blow the everloving fuck of the walls and retreat while the GHEISTPILE zergrushes B´ni in a display of southkorean might.

Whaddaya think?
>>
>>3643501
(Then yes, your assumption was correct. Thank you for clarifying.)
>>
>>3643482
well yes, but if we can flood her with Geists first or something so she cant escape, it would do us a huge favor.

>>3643493
sure, except they are all trapped up top and stunned with us, so they cant do that and need to escape along with us..or be abandoned to Isabelles wrath. not a fan of that second part but that arent the actual Amara and so saving the rest of the family takes priority. also we have 6 QUAD Knightlings. thats alot of acid.
>>
>>3643501
>>3643518
wait, then that sounds like the last thing we need to do is damage the tower, as otherwise the effects will slip out and affect the rest of the city. without knowing what is actually giving off the field we cant be sure toppling the tower will be enough to destroy it, and would thus only destroy whats keeping it from being a bigger issue.
>>
>>3643508
As colorful as your plan is, I would like to point out the following:
Isabelle has more than one hostage in the room. She has Julia, Rath, November, and the Amara clones paralyzed for 5 rounds. And we need to extract all of them.
Also, are you phone posting or computer posting?

>>3643519
Are said knightlings stealthed? I can't really remember.
>>
>>3643529
we had everything, even our armor, both stealthed and recursive. actually, do the Recursives have acid? because if so, thats alot of second boom we could do, as i think its over 100 recursives per knightling.
>>
>>3643518
Are all of our party members (November, Rath, Julia, Amara clones) still in stealth or are they fully visible?
>>
>>3643508
Meg probably can't infiltrate the building, because of it blocking spectral entities.

>>3643519
>well yes, but if we can flood her with Geists first or something so she cant escape, it would do us a huge favor.
Sure. That's why I want to bring the Geists in as we collapse the building. So that just as she's getting up from the fall she gets swarmed.

And yeah, it's a lot of acid we can make from those Knightlings. By my count, quadruple-strength Subversive Recursive Knighted-Grapplings should each have 410% Bio in them. So that's a total of 2460% Bio tied up in them, or 1230 Banelings. Far, far over our cap, but if we detonate them as we form them it won't matter. Though maybe we should just detonate the Knighted-Grapplings as-is. BHOP, yet another question: Would we get more of an acid explosion by splitting the Knights into Banelings and exploding them as they form, or just exploding them right now?

>>3643528
My intent was that smashing it into enough pieces will ruin its ability to generate the counter-wave.
>>
>>3643529
How many active B'ni clones are there at the moment?
>>
>>3643518
linking >>3643556's question:
>How many active B'ni clones are there at the moment?
>>
>>3643528
(Essentially, this place is fairly delicate, meaning that damage to the structure will effectively stop the field from functioning. It's stopping normal empathic transmissions from crossing the barrier, but once it's disrupted then all bets are off. Apologies for the confusion.)

>>3643535
(I believe that was requested earlier, so yes, they are.)

>>3643545
(They are.)

>>3643556
(None. They faded when B'ni assimilated Mother's body.)
>>
>>3643545
(They are fully cloaked, I mean.)

(I am afraid I must head to bed for now, Gentlemen. Rest well, and be safe.)
>>
>>3643551
id think maybe the knightlings are big enough to just detonate them as is, but unsure. it will work alot better if we can.

>My intent was that smashing it into enough pieces will ruin its ability to generate the counter-wave.
well, that entirely depends on how it is generated. if its some sorta device within it the tower, it is very possible it could survive. but i suppose we may aswell take the risk, if whatever is causing it does survive we were probably fucked anyways as the point of breaking open the tower-
>post appears
>>3643565
ok so never mind, both busting a hole in the side AND toppling it should work then, or at least, in an area exposed to the holes.
>>
>>3643482

Waow! Just look at:
>>3643353
>>3643364
>>3643382
>>3643392
>>3643437
and more!
Okay Friends. RAINBOW 6 SIEGE is on, tacticool edition. I am feeling optimistic. I did my in-length contribution in here:
>> 3643508
I hope there is something you can use to make your plans, better than that rough draft. Still anons, I like our chances better now. We are using counter-terrorism actions & maximizing our combined pool action against a single target, with the minimalistic objective of surviving 1 round to trigger TELEPORT escape. That looks feasible now.

Key original contributions that could complement your excellent working contributions are:
> CICADALINGS or other CONCENTRATION-disrupting tactics negate LEXICON OF DOOM.
> MEG is the perfect Scout for safe Backup.
> Crimson Cord is CAMERAS ON THE ROOM.
> KOSI & BELLA are SNIPER & FLASHBANGS, definitively.
> External AMARA CLONES with Dream Daughters (there are!) AGGRO GHEISTS to the area when everything is ready.

I think that Johanna´s TOOTH explosion & UZU´s fear to thread are good battering walls & INSTANT SHIELDS to make us survive long enough.
>>
>>3643551
AAGH. I just had a thought about Using Amara's Lexicon spell. Have both clones join their ACTs to do a pseudo Witch Coven spell and make a long chain of skintalker phrases.

>>3643569
Well then. It seems that Shu's alone and Visible, while all of our family is cloaked.

>>3643572
wait. Even better idea: We disrupt the structure enough to break the deadzone, but fight Isabelle here. The moment the deadzone is deactivated, Isabelle is fundementally trapped inside a giant tower. Have Gina use Terraforming to both weaken the structure while simultaneously blocking the only entrance/exit to the spire. The Geists will swarm through the walls and floors and literally everywhere, and all we have to do is stall Isabelle and stop her from leaving the tower. If Isabelle tries to make a move on us, we can grab our allies and teleport out.
>>
>>3643583
>AAGH. I just had a thought about Using Amara's Lexicon spell. Have both clones join their ACTs to do a pseudo Witch Coven spell and make a long chain of skintalker phrases.
You know what I'd really like? To cast a GRA SHI SEL THA on Shu. That should bounce back any spell of 60% Bio or lower cost to B'Ni, if she casts it on us.

>wait. Even better idea: We disrupt the structure enough to break the deadzone, but fight Isabelle here. The moment the deadzone is deactivated, Isabelle is fundementally trapped inside a giant tower. Have Gina use Terraforming to both weaken the structure while simultaneously blocking the only entrance/exit to the spire. The Geists will swarm through the walls and floors and literally everywhere, and all we have to do is stall Isabelle and stop her from leaving the tower. If Isabelle tries to make a move on us, we can grab our allies and teleport out.
I mean, I like the idea, but how are we going to ride down the collapsing building without getting as hurt as B'Ni will?
>>
>>3643583
i....just dont want to risk it. were fighting a crucible winner level girl here, focused on speed. i just, would really prefer to teleport away first, just to be sure and let our family have the time to rest. we also cant guarantee we wont get caught in the crossfire of the Geists flooding the place, so best not to be in it when they do.

our allies also wont do well inside a spire stuffed full of angry geists. fighting in the tower isnt worth the risk, and toppling the tower will still throw Isabelle off and remove it as an issue, incase she tries to later retreat back in.
>>
>>3643529

The extraction is via HUNDRED-HANDED explosion + TELEPORT combo. Should take 1 turn at most, is triggered only after stalling for time & exploiting every advantage, try to worn as much of the 5 paralysis rounds as possible.

TELEPORT happens simultaneously to breach, while B´ni is getting shot at, disrupted & what have you.

We execute ALL plans simulanaeously. Inside hostage team focus on escape, DREAM daughters breach & escape once we teleport out, GHEISTPILE does all the actual combat.

Plan relies on a SINGLE TURN of utter mayhem, with simultaneous TELEPORT & BREACH (breach 1-2 seconds before at most).

Posting from computer. Faster & more efficient. Hope I am not spamming? My apologies otherwise.
>>
>>3643583

I think this may be..UNWISE. Collapsing the tower after we leave via teleport is golden, but I would prefer to catch our collective breaths, have everyone retreat at safe distance, and see how she fares with Gheists before commiting.

Actual fight can happen, but I prefer to see what happens first from a safe distance.
Friend GHEISTPILE can get a shot at her first.
>>
>>3643593
The other issue is preventing Isabelle from entering physical contact with Shu or our family the moment we activate the relic.

If all of our swarms are stealthed, then we should detonate a Quad Knight right in front of us between us and Isabelle, while another Tackles her to the ground. The resulting detonation will shower Isabelle with tons of acid and surprise while providing us a very handy smokescreen which we can exploit to retrieve our friends with our hundred handed generator skill.
>>
>>3643551

We open an initial DISCREET hole in the walls first, MEG slips though it. Maybe some floors away.

Once emphatic wallls are breached or structure weakened, she can do it. BHOP-confirmed (of sorts).

The important thing is that B´ni should not notice things until it is too late.
>>
>>3643613
better idea. Jacklings and Crimson Cords. we have all 4 jam into her and stun her. that way the Knights can focus on the tower.
>>
>>3643613
Or just form a wall of them in between us. Move a Knight or two to block her off, then spawn a hundred arms off as a barrier. It only has to last long enough to intercept her reflexive supersonic kick.
>>
>>3643613
>>3643625

I would add that to the list of things we can do.
Sure, let´s do BOTH!

But I would stress out that max priority is TELEPORT ESCAPE. Every combat action by people INSIDE the tower gives B´ni more chances to kill us (the hostage team inside the tower)

If she sees us putting them in position, she kills us the second she sees us.
The dream daughters are deniable, she does NOT know they are outside, and does NOT register as an atttack from US.

We people inside are targets & hostages; people outside, FULL unknowns.

Let´s be careful & let SNIPER & BREACH dream daughter teams & friend GHEISTPILE do the heavy lifting for once.
>>
>>3643640
the dream team cannot do anything until we breach a hole in the wall, and if we breach a hole in the wall, we need to be gone ASAP.
>>
>>3643625
Thinking about it, I think it's best if we don't blow a hole in the room we're at, it'll just give Isabelle a way out of the collapsing tower once she recovers from the paralysis, if we are going to weaken the structure and break the deadzone, lets put the structural damage at the bottom. The other issue is that Jacklings can't paralyze isabelle by themselves. Shu has to spend an action using Neuromancy to paralyze Isabelle through the Jacklings, and even then it's a toss-up because Secluded Mind Gives Isabelle an advantage against Neuromancy bullshit on her. We've spent 2 actions using hundred hands and the Relic to port-out, our Final action should be distracting Isabelle and give her something to worry about so that she doesn't pay attention to our hundred handed limbs reaching out to our family and pulling them towards Shu.

>>3643628
Okay then... we could have Gina ram a pillar into the spire to weaken the foundation and destroy the deadzone, but we should also disguise the building shake by having a Swarmling detonate in front of Isabelle.

So currently, it seems our plan of action seems to be this:

Shu:
>Send your Quads in as a distraction: #1 self-destructs to create an acid explosion to surprise Isabelle. #2 Tackles Isabelle and pins her. #3 Spawns Hundred Handed hands to create a physical barrier to surround Isabelle.
>Use Hundred Handed to gather your friends

Dream Team: Weaken the Foundation of the Spire, let the geists flood in. Create a big enough distraction to draw Isabelle's attention away from Shu's family.
>>
>>3643628

We can also do this... if doesn´t prevent TELEPORT ESCAPE.

How many actions that would be? I assume 1 action for HUNDRED-HANDED grab of our team, 1 action for ESCHER GEAR TELEPORT, 1 action for HUNDRED-HANDED Wall of arms to cover our escape, 1 action for QUAD KNIGHT Acid detonation, 1 action for JACKLING paralysis...

I fear we will deplete our ACTS soon. Still, Shu can probaly do all of this....

But remeber that we should NOT creat new things from the hive. Too slow, too visible. Use already-created swarmlings & focus on the quick escape.
>>
>>3643646

Can drill a tiny breach hole first, several floors away, so that it isn´t noticed. MEG scouts first, helps us run interference while we escape, same tme as BIG breach happens.
>>
>>3643653
We've still got two round of Bishop boost left, too. That doesn't give extra ACTs, but I figure the enhanced reaction times should let us justify doing several small actions with a single ACT.
>>
>>3643649
i disagree. we cant flood the place with Geists without a hole, and flooding her with geists is all that will prevent her from just busting her own hole and escaping anyways. she has super strength, which with all the levels she now has, i guarantee you the walls are like paper to her.

also, its only a RESISTANCE to neuromancy, but thats FOUR instances, or i coupled together, she has to try and stop, and two of those stacks are from GINA who doesn't need her actions elsewhere and has infinite bio to pump into the action and higher levels.


my current thoughts and vote is;
>Send word to Gina to be prepared to let loose the Ecto Horde and regroup with us when she hears an explosion.
>Distract Isabelle, keep it short and simple, keep it focusing on her putting any anger on us.
>Blow a hole in the wall with the Banelings.
>Have both Jacklings and both Crimsons jack into Isabelle, to work together to stun her.
>at the exact same moment we make the hole, Hundred Hand grab everyone, and teleport to the entrance.
>immediately after teleporting command your knightlings to fly to the core of the spire and detonate aswell, to topple the tower.
>quickly use every means possible to reconvene with Gina and the others as fast as possible.
>quickly set about seeing if we cannot combine our emotions to trap Isabelle while the Geists are holding her off.

>>3643657
would take too long, im not wanting to sit around and trust Isabelle to let us have our time. plus, that would involve a knight making their way down there first,which would take more time than we have. Isabelle caught onto Mothers tricks,she will catch onto ours. we act fast, or not at all.
>>
>>3643592

Also, I picture FRIEND GHEISTPILE as the Oblivion City Guards. Pic very much related.

Even if she breezes through them... OBLIVION city guards are the stuff of nightmares. The psychotic, aggro-ed Hive-nid of FRIEND GHEISTPILE and his unerring SCUM-SENSE shall pursue her incessantly, even at the top of the Cord.

No criminal Scum escapes the hand of JUSTICE, after all.
>>
File: Oblivion_SCUM-SENSE!.jpg (19 KB, 350x300)
19 KB
19 KB JPG
>>3643662

Dear anons, please do not forget to use the external Amaras to TRIGGER the SCUM-SENSE of our good FRIEND GHEISTPILE, so that it may become a plentiful horde, eager to hug Isabelle....

Or make her pay her overdue fee. With her BLOOD!

The Scum-sense needs triggering! Make your contributions to the work FRIEND GHEISTPILE, citizens!
>>
>>3643662
Can we have the other dream daughters contribute to breaking the deadzone? It just feels like we're focusing on Shu too much instead giving agency to Gina and the other teams.
What about the rest of the dream daughters? Johanna can use Terraform to weaken the Wall, Bella can use her stomach Acid to wear away at the foundations,
Gina can simply throw a calcite Battering Ram at the Core pillar to break the deadzone. That way we can focus on Shu locking down Isabelle somehow.
>>
>>3643662

Your forget that Dream daughter team is better equipped for breaching. And remember Kosi eye-drill lasers?

Those go INSTANTLY through SEVERAL METERS of concrete. Remember when we found her.

We have no problems on instant breaching. Just remember that Drean daughters are better at breaching, and us & MEG are better at interference.

Dream daughters can breach everything. We focus more on escaping.
>>
>>3643669
im not sure what you mean, but you are right that we have 2 Amaras outside. but again, i must've missed something as i mean no offense truly, but that sounds a bit gibberish to me.

>>3643670
Johanna has terraforming? but fair enough. i still want to use the knightlings on the core though, as they actually have access to it right away and so can deal a better hit to the tower than anyone else.

>>3643678
to be fair, we have no idea how tough this shit actually is. the dream daughters are also stuck at the bottom so do us no good getting a hole up top. meanwhile we have seen the geists both fly and goop-climb pretty quickly, so they can actually get up much quicker than any method the dream team has.

also i dont want ANYONE in that tower once we pop it open. its just asking for trouble if the Geists do take the bait.

plus, our swarmlings can act very independently without taking away from our own actions, having them do things doesn't hinder us at all.
>>
>>3643670
Here's my plan
>Bella: Lay out an acid lake, start dissolving the foundations.
>Gina: Hydroform the acid, confine it to the spire so that it doesn't flow away and disperse. Prepare a battering ram to knock down the central pillar.
>Amaras: Get the exponential doubling going.
>Holly, Eloise: Keep the Geists off the rest of the party while they set up the demolition.
>Uzu, Johanna: Use terrain-altering abilities to undermine foundations as much as possible.
>Kosi: Create several eye-cannons, line up your shot on the top of the spire.
>Shu: Surreptitiously prime the Escher's Gear while distracting B'Ni with dialogue.

And then, on go:
>Shu: Detonate Knighted-Grappling on B'Ni, tackle her with another, link everyone with Hundred-Hands coming from both our and their armor, teleport out to edge of city near elevator.
>Kosi: Fire barrage at top of the spire, shattering the windows.
>Gina: Ram central pillar.
>Amaras: Cast a mass chorus of GRA RHO TER to turn the pillar into hazardous terrain and call in every Geist in the city.
>Holly, Eloise, Johanna, Uzu: Grab Bella, Kosi, Gina, and as many Amaras as you can carry and book it away from the collapsing pillar and swarm of ghosts.
>Shu's party: Rush back into city, rejoin combat.
>>
>>3643680

So the idea with the external AMARAs is that they bait a plentiful GHEISTPILE outside the tower through Skintalker spell use.

Once the tower is breached, ISABELLE becomes the priority target (already used powerful Skintalker spells, has the Stench of MOTHER on her). So she is a priority target, even if she does nothing.
>>
File: 1553786221967.gif (27 KB, 24x20)
27 KB
27 KB GIF
>>3643664
Pic related
>>3643678
Any ideas on how dream daughters could improve their skills with 'desire'?
>>
>>3643685

Peeeeerfect. I consider the plan mostly finished at this stage. It also reflects almost everyone contributions, as far as I recall.

> VOTE: Execute this plan.
>>
>>3643685
id still prefer to try and stun Isabelle so she can react to the Geists, and and we have the 4 Banelings, and we should go ahead and blow a hole in the top from the inside, it'll help distract her just as much.

i also still want the Knightlings to all focus on the core, for reasons mentioned before.

all and all i dont like the changes there.

>>3643685
>>3643693
also also we dont have that much control of the Dream Teams, we can only give the team overarching orders like 'topple the spire'.

>>3643687
fair enough, but they already seem to be more than happy to bomb rush us.
>>
>>3643691

Sorry, don´t know why the picture was so small. That was a failure on my part. My apologies.

Yet, I hope that I did justice to our friend the good GHEISTPILE, and all of its Oblivion city-guarding, scum-sensing glory.

Join the city watch, citizens! Support FRIEND GHEISTPILE!
>>
>>3643694

We have Crimson cord eye-camera transmission of the whole scene, and Gina coordinating everyone outside via jack, so EVERYONE sees what we do.

Also, every bit counts. Let´s not have external Dream daughters be idle, shall we? Every bit of confusion & mayhem helps.
>>
>>3643694
>id still prefer to try and stun Isabelle so she can react to the Geists, and and we have the 4 Banelings, and we should go ahead and blow a hole in the top from the inside, it'll help distract her just as much.
Sure. Detonate the banelings, too, and move in the Jacklings to jack in. Even if she resists, she still loses an ACT from being affected. So it will slow her down some.

>i also still want the Knightlings to all focus on the core, for reasons mentioned before.
I want at least two of them to focus on distracting B'Ni. But we can have the rest detonate on the central pillar.

>also also we dont have that much control of the Dream Teams, we can only give the team overarching orders like 'topple the spire'.
I admit it was kind of meta, proposing what they should do under an ideal scenario and not an actual set of instructions from Shu.
>>
>>3639791
>>3642658
Finalized Plan then;
>Send word to Gina to be prepared to let loose the Ecto Horde and regroup with us when she hears an explosion.
>Have the Amaras outside Cast spells to draw in more Geists.
>Distract Isabelle, keep it short and simple, keep it focusing on her putting any anger on us.
>Have both Jacklings and both Crimsons jack into Isabelle, to work together to stun her.
>Blow a hole in the wall with the Banelings.
>at the exact same moment we make the hole, Hundred Hand grab everyone, and teleport to the entrance.
>immediately after teleporting command your knightlings to fly to the core of the spire and detonate aswell, to topple the tower.
>Have the Dream Teams help bring down the Tower, whatever methods they see fit.
>quickly use every means possible to reconvene with Gina and the others as fast as possible.
>quickly set about seeing if we cannot combine our emotions and abilities to trap Isabelle in the collapsed/collapsing tower with the Geists.


>>3643685
>>3643693
i cant back a vote wasting resources, we need the knightlings for the pillar, we have other methods to distract and keep back Isabelle, and we need that hole in the wall sooner than later. its small but major changes i cannot agree with and increase the risk of something not being enough or soon enough in my opinion.
>>
>>3643712

Sure dear anon. But even with any changes, the key points are in there. At the end, we are now (mostly) optimizing every action & team, but the key actions are all in there.

It is just a matter of filling the plan up with EVERYTHING until maximal act saturation is reached.

Thank you all of guys for this and the excellent battleplans. We have agency now, and we WILL succeed.

Next session: Rainbow 6 siege, Crucible edition.
>>
>>3643685
>>3643712
I'm fine with either plan. what does matter is that we got the ball rolling again.
main key points are there in both plans
>Topple tower
>Distract Isabelle
>Teleport out
>Regroup and re-engage.
>>
>>3639791
As for the distracting dialogue to misdirect Isabelle:
I'll amend my vote to this.
>Open you mouth to speak...then close it.
>try to come up with words for a few minutes. a phrase, anything.
>"if...if it still doesn't matter to you...if you still want to kill me... then do it. Do it now. But leave my family alone. They have no part in this."
>knees weak, arms heavy, palms sweaty, collapse onto your butt, close your eyes as if awaiting judgement, emit a sort of dreaded acceptance to Isabelle with your empathy.
>Secretly communicate with Gina and tell her to put the plan in action listed >>3643712 and >>3643685 with them going along with either version to their best judgement. plan goes into effect when the First Knightling explodes.
>>
>>3643757

Apparent surrender will only hurt more when we escape and she is buried in the tidal wave of our good old friend GHEISTPILE.

> SUPPORTING THIS
>>
Okay, so how's this for some dialogue to distract B'Ni?

>"'I know exactly what a predator looks like', huh? Does that mean you're finally done confusing me for Sam, Isabelle? Because if you've gotten to the point that you can see how Mother was acting just like her, I should hope you can see how I'm not."
>Start pacing slowly around the room. Keep her eyes on us instead of looking for the faint blur of a Subversive Knight.
>"But this isn't about me. You're the one in control now, right? Tricked Mother, seized all that power, there's nothing you can't do. Which is why it's so sad to see you keep making the same mistakes. You're just short of a god, Isabelle, and you're still hung up on Sam?"
>"You're never going to be happy this way. Come on, B'Ni. I heard what you told Gretchen. You deserve better than Sam. Don't make your creations something that looks like her and constantly reminds you of what she did."
>Stop at one of the windows closest to where our party is. Turn to look out it, like we're being wistful. Using a Hundred-Hand grown from our stomach, so it's not changing our body posture and she can't see the arm itself, retrieve Escher's Gear and prime it for a teleport.
>"Of course, if you were to really follow through on that you'd have to kill me, too. No reminders. Maybe you want to do that anyway. Maybe you do still think I'm Sam. Just...whatever you decide, leave my family out of it, please? They were never part of this, B'Ni. Please. You have all the power now. I'm not too proud to beg.
>Ten, all of a sudden, put the plan into action. Detonate swarmlings, hit B'Ni with Jacklings, grab party with Hundred-Hand chains and teleport out before the tower collapses.
>>
>>3643769

I also like this. Cut combine, & make it whole.

REVENGE approaches!
>>
>>3643769
pretty good. needs more emotion to sell it.
What it needs
>An aura of resigned acceptance, open regret on how Shu treated Isabelle, and heartache with a sad wistful directly into Isabelle's eyes to complete the image. Maybe a tear or two. We could've been great friends with Isabelle. But so many things went wrong. The choices made, the paths we didn't take. Allude to that elusive golden ending.
>A gesture of submission: sitting down with eyes closed or looking away from isabelle with your back turned. something that non-verbally says "I submit" to Isabelle.

Don't forget to link the post to Bhop before you go to bed.
>>
>>3643769
im not a fan of moving around, the less reason we give Isabelle to have an itchy trigger greave, the better.
>>
>>3643790
>An aura of resigned acceptance, open regret on how Shu treated Isabelle, and heartache with a sad wistful directly into Isabelle's eyes to complete the image. Maybe a tear or two. We could've been great friends with Isabelle. But so many things went wrong. The choices made, the paths we didn't take. Allude to that elusive golden ending.
Yeah, sure, get some empathic communication in there. What will sell it is that it's mostly true. We did want to be friends with B'Ni, we do feel a lot of resignation over how that relationship is impossible to fix, we are deeply anxious about what's going to happen. Just for other reasons than what our words say.

>A gesture of submission: sitting down with eyes closed or looking away from isabelle with your back turned. something that non-verbally says "I submit" to Isabelle.
That's why we're looking out the window. Back turned, not ready for attacks. Except of course we are, we've got a Neurotic Halo and can infer data from our other senses with incredibly ability. Oh, hey, that's right, we should prime our Halo's counter. Just in case.

>>3643791
My thoughts were that if we kept it moving parallel or away from her, and keeping all our movements slow, she'd stay focused on us but not jump to attack. I'm open to alternatives, though. Can you think of a safer way to get ourselves turned away from her with freedom to retrieve the Gear?
>>
>>3643799
im not sure thats even an issue. we can just have a hand go into our pocket when we Hand Explode outward. otherwise just twisting our body when we emphasize a major point would be good enough. im just thinking Isabelle isnt gonna trust us, this isnt the first time we have tried something in the face of insurmountable odds, and she knows how underestimating us in these situations can go for her. hence also why i liked the other anons words better.

dont get me wrong, nothing you said was bad, its a nice write up, but like i said earlier, Isabelle probably IS expecting something, so the sooner we get the ball rolling, the better. all i can think is, the longer we talk, the more time it gives her to piece together what we plan, as she probably already expects something, and i cant see talking more actually lowering her guard.
>>
>>3643802
Yeah, I can see that argument. Should we discard our armor, then, to look extra submissive?
>>
>>3643805
Instead of discarding our armor, just have the camouflage platelings show our casual clothing underneath. Like making the Armor transparent to the point where it's showing what's underneath the armor. The Armor is still there, but it's hidden from view.
>>
>>3643805
i cant really see it helping or hindering us. she might be so powerful she doesn't even notice we have armor on, if that makes sense. but i mean, if you think it will help, then im really unopinionated on it. it all depends on what Isabelle mindset is now and if she would even take any satisfaction from it i guess?
>>
>>3642658
Wait whats the problem? I lurk so is there a game mechanic BHOP forgot? If not, could someone explain why people are mad?
>>
>>3643809
I'd say remove the helmet at least. Show the face, be more emotive. I think that will help sell the act.

>>3643812
Ugh, let's not get into it. Leave that discussion behind us, focus on the now. You can scroll up and read comments on it if you want to see some of us (myself included, so not throwing shade) get really distracted by our salt.
>>
>>3643812
It's a fucking saltstorm. read it thoroughly.

>>3643818
I'll be fine with removing the helmet visor and revealing Shu's head.
>>
>>3643812
well, its all laid out in the thread, but the short of it is;

BHOP lead us to believe we had a shot at stopping Isabelle before she could consume Mothers corpse, and even if we failed, we would have a fight to which our actions would decide what happens. instead, right off the bat we got a situation where we had 1 Action, not one turn, 1 action, to try and stop her, and put into a position and later not denied, that we had no chance of stopping her. people wanted the agency to fail or win on our own merits in a fight we had been anticipating and preparing for for awhile now, and instead we got an extremely anti-climactic failure that at least heavily felt like we had no agency or chance to do anything in the situation.

this was right after last Vein BHOP outright and fully admitted to pulling something where the outcome was inevitable and our actions didn't matter. doing what at least felt like the same thing right after saying he would not do it again, on top of how disappointing the outcome was, did not sit well with anyone, albeit with differing levels of frustration at the outcome.

theres more to it, and much of what else was an issue i think even the less angry side at least admitted to understanding where people were coming from, but i think that is all that was fully agreed upon in consensus by everyone. the rest id argue still has merit, like i said, but i will admit probably leans into opinion territory a bit more, but as the saying goes i guess, when the floodgates break, it all comes out.
>>
>>3643818
sure, im fine with removing the helm.
>>
I know i did not participate creating this plan and i am a pretty big nay sayer right now with just wanting to get this over with (Not an attack on you OP i know the pain your in right now with being a GM myself on many occasions)

>>3639791
I can however support this >>3643712
and>>3643757
in combination with this>>3643769
>>
>>3643828
How does this work as a combination of the dialogue write-ins?

>"'I know exactly what a predator looks like', huh? Does that mean you've finally stopped confusing me for Sam?"
>Remove helmet, slump a little.
>"...it doesn't matter, does it? Nothing I can say here is going to change your mind. Congratulations, Isabelle, you have control."
>Start emitting a sense of resigned apathy on the empathic field, combined with nervousness for our friends.
>"I'm not too proud to beg. Whatever you do to me...if hurting me still matters to you for whatever reason...please leave my family out of it. They were never part of this, they just had the bad luck to get caught up in it. Please, B'Ni."
>Bow head in resignation, close eyes and wait for judgement.
>Upon Gina signalling us everything's in position, spring into action.
>>
>>3644109
Yeah works for me
>>3639791
Amending my vote to support this plan>>3643712
with this speech>>3644109
>>
File: The Unworthy Ascendant.jpg (192 KB, 800x800)
192 KB
192 KB JPG
>>3639791

"'I know exactly what a predator looks like', huh? Does that mean you've finally stopped confusing me for Sam?" You say with a bitter chuckle as you slowly, deliberately slide your helm off, staring B’ni down even as the Crimson Cord flickers with a rapid exchange, the inklings of a plan. The Favored Daughter just glares back, eyebrow slightly raised as she listens to what she assumes to be your final speech. She’s heedless of the silent, shimmering movements of your swarm and the roiling waves of fitful azure just outside, so enraptured is she in her moment of victory.

"...It doesn't matter, does it? Nothing I can say here is going to change your mind. Congratulations, Isabelle, you have control." You continue with a sigh, sending a small, sad pulse of resignation and nervous fear across the space, and you’re not sure if it’s your words or your false flag that causes a cruel smile to spread across Isabelle’s face, her emerald eyes glittering as she drinks in every word.

"I'm not too proud to beg. Whatever you do to me...if hurting me still matters to you for whatever reason...please leave my family out of it.” You plead, trying not to let the merest flicker of hope cross the line as you hear what you’ve been waiting for, just as the fingers of your conjured limb graze the spokes of Escher’s Gear, out of sight. “They were never part of this, they just had the bad luck to get caught up in it.”

The pieces are in place, and all that’s left is to pull the trigger.

“This is between us, B’ni." You conclude, bowing you head and closing your eyes as you take a deep breath, preparing for what’s to come. “It’s us…it’s always been us.”

You hear her inhale, and your eyes fly open in the same instant that your Jacklings and Drones stab their needles home into Isabelle’s spine.

Her eyes go wide with shock, her teeth grit in rage before her attention’s drawn to the corrosive detonation that eats through the delicate stonework, opening a yawning portal to the stale air of Almath. You had the first word, and the last is robbed from her as she’s instantly swarmed by an onrushing tide of vengeful azure and furious Hexane. Hands explode off your armor, limbs reaching out to your family and holding on to them for dear life as your world tilts, warping wildly as Escher’s Gear activates and the wave of hatred and ectoplasm is replaced with the shining entrance pavilion. Your allies collectively draw in a harried set of breaths as their faculties are restored, and you turn from them to look up in time to see the tower tilt, its peerless alabaster surface suddenly warped, twisted with a cracking series of spirals whose intense heat couple with your acid working within to bring it collapsing to the ground. It’s fall is tremendous, its weak exterior crumbling to dust under the weight of eons and the sins of those that once sat within.

A fragile edifice for fragile gods.

(Continued)
>>
File: The Past, Enraged.jpg (55 KB, 443x600)
55 KB
55 KB JPG
>>3644221

[Gina, I need your status!] You demand, even as you watch a cloud of electric blue ectoplasm surge from the city, overwhelming the settling pile of dust and rubble as the gust of wind hits you from the titanic collapse.

{Niku and Uzu just demolished the spire, and Penny showed up with Gemma to set up some hit-and-run tactics…} Gina replies, struggling to keep her responses clipped and professional in the face of the chaos erupting around her. {She got a couple of hits in on Johanna, but…it’s not taking}

[What do you mean it’s not taking?] You ask as you help Julia to her feet, and suddenly your mind is filled with Gina’s rapturous laugh.

{Johanna’s reforming, like the geists...Jesus, we can’t get killed here, Shu. We keep coming back, it just takes a couple of seconds, and…holy shit} Comes her breathless explanation as Rath rises, her mounting fury practically pouring from the baroque plating of the Sui Tormentis. November hastily inspects her armament while Julia checks in on the group of Amaras, flitting from one to another to ensure that every single one of them is safe.

{Holy shit…} Gina breathes again, hope ringing in her voice. {B’ni can’t get a word out…it’s like with Amara, they just carve through her since they look the exact same to the Hexane. B’ni’s pulling out everything else that Mother had at her disposal, and she’s amping up with some bullshit, I can tell}

[Can you tap in to B’ni? You’re still inside her technically, so can you tell what she can bring to bear?]

{Uh, shit, hold on…} Gina pauses, and in an instant the nature of Isabelle’s newfound power takes shape. {Yeah…fuck, she did the same thing you and everyone did with my body. She’s got the full suite of powers since they were so similarly sick in the head, and she got at least a portion of the levels, to boot. Alright, here goes…her biggest trick is that she’s got a hybridized Neuromancer and Conduit tree that lets her summon memories and stuff as physical constructs. She's got Fibromancer reinforcement, an Armorer endoskeleton kind of like Rath's, along with a boat-load of immunities…corrosion, flame, slashing, crushing…no neuromancy or conduit blocks, though, and the fact you stabbed into her means piercing can work just fine. She’s cued up a sensory power, so cloaking’s out, but…she’s strong, but as powerful as Mother was, she’s not a front-line fighter like Charon. They were invincible because they were a team, but it’s just Mother’s power this time and this whole goddamn city’s out for blood}

Hope flickers across your bond and you’re not sure whether it’s yours or hers, in this moment of truth.

(Continued)
>>
File: The Pavillion of Choice.jpg (240 KB, 1280x553)
240 KB
240 KB JPG
>>3644230

{…I think we stand a chance here, Shu. Here, now…we have a shot to end this once and for all}

You turn to look at your family as a question bubbles up in your mind, one that you’ve been faced with twice before. Twice…the first was when you learned the full extent of Isabelle’s power and madness. The second was on the beach, when she said she’d come to take Gina away.

Now, when you find yourself faced with the same question for the third time, you know, somehow…

…this is the last time you’ll have to answer it, with regard to your oldest friend and greatest foe.

Three questions, two answers.

You are about to supply the third, and final, decision.

>>Stop her. (Gather your family. Command your forces. Confront B’ni. End this…one way or another.)

>>Let her go. (Allow B’ni to escape and make a stalemate at the Cord. You’re not putting your family in front of the most powerful Daughter in existence, chances be damned.)

>>Write-In

YOU ARE IN CONTROL
>>
(Gentlemen, voting shall remain open for the next two hours. Gina is simultaneously in Isabelle’s head and on site, so if you have any questions about the current setup, please let me know. Thank you for your time, your patience, your honesty, and your kindness, and I hope you’re having a good Wednesday.)
>>
>>3644235
>>Stop her.
there really is no other option honestly.

>>3644241
would it be best to wait for planning til more information is available?
>>
>>3644235
I say we try to kill her. This is probably our best bet to kill her. If we meet her in the Cord its gonna be a grater tragedy than two world wars, the holocaust and the Comunist Famines combined.

Right now she is at the Weakest she is ever going to be from here on out. Unless we stop her here she will grow even stronger and might even kill Mara before ascending the Cord.

>>3644241
Has Gina figured anything out if we could extract her and the other dreamdaughters by consuming Isabelle?

(Probably not the kind of question she was focusing on overmuch but maybe she had an epithany)

Would our penetration Skills like Raths Burrowing Blast still work?

How much progress is she making? Is she building up speed?

Do the Geister always reform or do some stay down?

Is the Number of Geistern increasing/ are ever more drawn into the fighting?

Can we determine the alliegance of the Geister? Will they ignore us as long as we do not use skintalker powers?
>>
>>3644256
>>would it be best to wait for planning til more information is available?

(You have a window of opportunity with which to prepare and call out to additional allies, roughly ten rounds’ worth before B’ni reaches the exit.)

>>3644269
>>Has Gina figured anything out if we could extract her and the other dream daughters by consuming Isabelle? (Probably not the kind of question she was focusing on overmuch but maybe she had an epiphany)

(The Arbiter Relic would allow you to extract them upon B’ni’s demise, given that Gina’s spent time building up connections with them. You’ll have access to all their Core skills if you CONSUME.)

>>Would our penetration Skills like Rath’s Burrowing Blast still work?

(Absolutely.)

>>How much progress is she making? Is she building up speed?

(She will be able to make her way out of the city in time as she’s acclimating to her new powers, and she is slowly building up speed. It will take roughly ten turns for her to get from where she is to the exit at her current pace, taking only Gina, her teams, and the geists into account.)

>>Do the Geister always reform or do some stay down?

(They always reform, as do the Dream Daughters. The time between regenerations increases the more they’re beaten back, however.)

>>Is the Number of Geists increasing/ are ever more drawn into the fighting?

(More are being drawn to B’ni the more she struggles.)

>>Can we determine the allegiance of the Geister? Will they ignore us as long as we do not use Skintalker powers?

(Given that they see Mother as free, they do not care about any other Skintalkers. B’ni’s used her Lexicon and she looks like Mother to the Hexane, so they will not divert their attentions to anyone else at this point.)
>>
>>3644235
literal battle theme: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CQs2oxkQ-0s

>Stop her. (Gather your family. Command your forces. Confront B’ni. End this…one way or another.)
We may have a choice, but because of how we built Shu and all of the choices that we've made, backing down from this just breaks character.
>Both in empathy channel via crimson cord and aloud. ["A chance to end it all huh...walking away just feels cowardly, and even if we do walk away, Isabelle will just simply go after our family just to spite me."]
>Give your family a look-over. Give a nod to November. Share a grin with Rath.
>Hug both Julia and Amara. "We'll go home after this last fight. It seems that Bunny is gonna win, and we can't let her win or leave, otherwise she'll make everyone disappear."
>Both in empathy channel via crimson cord and aloud. ["Alright then. HELL OR OBLIVION, LETS ROCK"]

>>3644241
Question:

Can Amara bring out... her own dream daughters via proxy clones or does Amara prime need to be in Almath in order to bring out the Soroitas and Sasha?

>>3644310
Is Charon and Ringo free from the Geas now that Mother's left the chair? Because I seriously hope to recruit Charon to the fight.
>>
>>3644310
>>3644319
well, it looks like only Hera from Rath(The Armless girl no?) is not here, and im not sure if Amaras clones can spawn hers, though i question if spawning a group of kids is a good idea, Sasha might of been useful.
>>
>>3644310
Another Question

Do the Geister deal splash Damage? Would us getting close put us aat risk at getting hit?

>>3644319
>>3644256
This place is psychocreactive.......
We could will the cityscape itself ot attack her by enveloping her form immobilising her and slowing her down for the Geister to finish her
They can move through solid objects without problems so that could work
>>
>>3644325
So who can we call in? We have Dorian, Amara Prime, and the Midnight Crew back at the Roost. We can bring them in to Almath and have them unleash their dream daughter allies.
>>
>>3644319
(Mother is still technically the administrator, so they are not free as of yet.)

>>3644319
>>3644325
(The presence of an Amara Clone is enough, and they'll be joining the fight shortly.)

>>3644330
(They will not to any splash damage to your allies. They are essentially acting as a source of constant damage and disruption to Isabelle.)
>>
>>3644338
Has Dorian and the Midnight Crew been kept up to date on the happenings in Almath? Can we recruit them into the fight?
>>
>>3644332
if the Midnight Crew are even willing. this has kinda become a personal issue they might not see a need to help with, as Mothers defeated and theres no threat from this of someone winning the Crucible. if they didn't feel up to helping against Mother before, i cant see them feeling up to helping with this.

>>3644338
alright then. well, guess more allies is more allies.
>>
>>3644338
More Questions i know annoying

Has Isabelle created any clones yet?(She probably will as soon as we enter the battle but would be useful to know if she already had some)

Does Isabelle have any kind of stealth ability aside form her neurotic cloud?

Can the Cloud disrupt the Gheists of the City or are they completely unaffected by its mindaltering effects?


How far has the rest of our Familiy recovered?

Is the Damage of the Gheists outpacing Isabelles healthregen?
Can we tell that?
>>3644344
>>3644343
Could we maybe send in Rath with some support to punt Isabelle further away form her goal(the exit)
>>
>>3644356
sure. hell she could team up with Hera and maybe Johanna to deliver a 3 punch 'fuck you' or something. probably would have to sacrifice some of Raths limbs, but ah well. maybe send in an Amara clone to use the family tech too.
>>
>>3644344
Well First things First, we should seal off the Entrance with the biggest thickest wall we can create via Terraforming, Then have Amara Cast a SkinTalker Spell Reflection on the Terrain so that if Isabelle attempts to use skintalking on the wall, it will rebuff it. Then we need to reconfigure our squad, send dorian down from the Roost, have him be Julia's battle buddy so we can exploit those sweet dual techniques. We can bring up to 4 party members in our party and we currently have 1 slot empty (amara clones technically don't count?)

As for how we configure our squads, Kosi's job will be keeping all the living daughters topped off in health and bio.

As for tactics...I know it's goddamn counter-intuitive, but since Gina said that Isabelle is not a front-line fighter, we should have Shu be aggro tank. She's got Heaven's drills and Heavensbreak stingers that she can make good use off, her armor's immune to slashing. If Shu shows up, Isabelle will attempt to prioritize as many actions into killing Shu.

>>3644361
You need to keep in mind of Isabelle's resistances/Immunities:

What she's immune/highly resistant to:
>Blunt/Crushing
>Slashing
>Acid
>Flame
What she isn't immune to:
>Piercing
>Neuromancy
>Phantasmal Conduit
>Skintalking
>Stacking Debuffs
Some of our party members aren't really that well equipped against Isabelle (In November's case, possibly hard-countered.
>>
>>3644343
(The Midnight Crew are informed through Amara, and Jackies trying to stop Dorian from running to your side immediately once he learned things were escalating.)

>>3644344
(They're torn as to whether or not to risk it at the moment, but you ay certainly try.)

>>3644356
(It's not annoying at all, I'm here to help.)

(Isabelle has no clones, and no stealth ability aside from the cloud, which does not disrupt or confuse the Geists.)

(Everyone is at full health and bio. Despite what happened, all B'ni did was lock you down, so she's done no damage to your living allies thus far.)

(The damage from the Geists is not outpacing her regen, but it's keeping it to manageable levels.)
>>
>>3644361
That gives me an idea. Use the Dualtech while someone wants the city to hold Isabelle in place and go to town on her face and upper torso to beat her to abloody pulp with

>>3644373
Yeah sealing the entrance is gonna be needed. We should make it several somewhat thinner layers with air in between so even if she overpowers Amaras Skintalking buffs on the walls she will have to do it o every wall individualy

We should have Shu go in for the Grapple so Rath can go lay into Isabelle in Ignition mode and pummel Isabelle senseless with the Amara Dualtech while Shu pierces her with Neuromancy to paralyze Iaabelle and skewers Isabelles Body from Head to Toe with Drills
>>
>>3644373
we have Shu, Julia, Rath, and November. thats four. granted BHOP might give us leeway considering the magnitude of the situation, but still.

sure on blocking off the exit.

well, Shus entire Hive has piercing, and the Contender it think counts too with its ammo, so she probably wont have to get up close really.

Crushing and blunt(unarmed) might be considered different, so fisticuffs might still work.

also Novembers BAR at least should still count as Piercing aswell, meaning she still has some damage output.

>>3644389
hrm...well i mean, we can send someoen back to grab Dorian and ask the Midnighht crew real quick, sure. though i cant see them being convinced by anyone but Shu herself.

>>3644390
sure.
>>
>>3644389
Well i was more thinking how has the rest of the family in the Lair recovered?

But good to know she has not done any damage to everyone else

So her Healthregen is not being outpaced..... Well we can certainly change that. I think ISabelles Birthday is today and we should get har a present. She will get a Leash and Fists lots and lots of Burning Fist.... to the face.
>>
>>3644397
(November's weaponry counts as piercing, so given that Isabelle is immune to heat and neutral against piercing, they'll do reduced damage.)

>>3644404
(The ones at the Lair are fully recovered and awake.)
>>
>>3644310
did you mean like, 10 turns before the fight properly starts, or that the fights started now and 10 turns to stop her?

is Blunt and Crushing damage different? aka, would Raths fists have an effect still?
>>
>>3644431
In Ignition mode she should be able to use burrowing blast as OP stated here>>3644310
>>
>>3644437
that has nothing to do with my question though, and i think he just meant the armor piercing augment still works and counts as piercing, the boils still are mostly heat damage and thus would still have a greatly reduced damage output.
>>
>>3644404
We can also lower her regen to the point where the Geists can do constant DoT on her by putting a Leash on Isabelle.

>>3644397
We should explain the situation fully to the Midnight Crew. Explain the stakes Yes Isabelle has Mother's power, but she's incurred the wrath of the Entire City in a place where dream daughters are functionally immortal. Any dream daughters they have can be called upon to fight alongside them. And she's being hindered enough that it's possible to kill Isabelle AND Mother instead of having to deal with no environmental help and bullshit regen. Two Birds with one stone. If Isabelle escapes, she's going to sit at the top of the cord and let the entire world go to rot.
>>
>>3644443
i mean...im just gonna say it...the Crucible being unwinnable and lasting forever might be exactly what the Midnight Crew want.

im not saying we dont try, im just saying they really have no reason to feel a need to take part in this fight. also its very possible they have little to no dream daughters they are on good terms with.
>>
>>3643820
Eh, we always could've killed B'ni at the start.
>:^)
>>
>>3644431
(Ten turns to stop her, is what I meant. My apologies.)

>>3644441
(Both November's armament and Rath's punches would be relatively effective against Isabelle's current form.)
>>
>>3644464
right, and awesome on Rath.
>>
>>3644464
right. sorry for the barrage of questions still, regardless of your willingness to answer.

is Isabelles new sensory thing making her have extreme awareness of where everyone is, or is it just seeing through stealth and similar abilities?
>>
>>3644464
>ten turns
>Shu and Family stuck at the entrance to Almath
>Isabelle coming from the City Center towards Almath's entrance/exit.
FUCK. Ten turns you say. That's a bit dishonest. more like 4 turns instead because there's travel time involved in intercepting Isabelle. Are you really sure we have 10 turns to stop her?

>>3644474
I think this is a good case for planting the Cancer bomb. We can do a double fake out with Gina and Julia to guarantee planting the bomb. Julia will have to prime her halo in order to dodge any retaliation caused from giving B'ni a death blow.

Even if we can't deal damage, we can do lots of crowd control, Bella can use her Acid to generate a tidal wave that pushes her back. Uzu can do Spiraling Fear's terrain effects to knock her off balance.
Gina can lockdown Isabelle's abilities for a time.
Julia can put lots of Malleable flesh stacks on Isabelle, it it reaches 15, then Isabelle is completely paralyzed.
>>
>>3644464
>>3644484
>>3644459
>>3644109

Also, given the sheer scope, scale, and stakes being wagered on this fight, I propose to have the voting time extended to 3 hours after the next update. Sound fair? It gives us anons more time to plan as well as time for you to properly get your ducks in line.
>>
>>3644495
well, keep in mind the Geists and 2 Dream Teams are already on top of her. Rath at least, and Dorian if he joins, can probably get there fast.

and yeah, Cancer bomb sounds good.
>>
>>3644484
(It's both.)

>>3644495
(It's ten turns without you joining the fray. If you do nothing or leave, then it will take ten turns for Isabelle to fight her way to the exit. If you join the fight, then that number goes out the window.)

(Please also bear in mind that Isabelle now has other powers that she will begin tapping into, so her arsenal will begin to expand as she realizes what she's fully capable of. The resistances and thr nature of her favored power sets that Gina detailed are static, however.)
>>
>>3644507
(Oh, absolutely. Once the fight card goes up, you'll have a great deal to manage with all the squads and the like. Trying to dry run all this with each participant having a full turn took two days, and it's then that I realized that of this fight wasn't going to take a literal month to reach a resolution, I had to do something.)
>>
>>3644474
>>3644443
Should we have Shu rush in with Rath and several Amara Clones to intercept Isabelle to put the Leash onto Isabelle and pin her down or have Shu go to the Lair and try and convince the Midnight Crew to come with her while we grab the Rest of Shus Family and their Dream Daughters?

>>3644495

We have a couple more options to slow Isabelle down
We can also paralyze Isabelle with Neuromancy from Shu

Have Amara thorugh a clone will the City to grasp at Isabelles extremeties and pull her into the ground to immobilize her for longer giving us more time to deal with her.

Cancer will probably be our biggest weapon to deal with her unless we can immobilize/paralyze her then we can go about killing her the old fashioned way. She might have a way to rid herself of that but we should still be able to deal her massive damage with it

>>3644464
Would Shu leaving the City for a minute immediatly despawn her Dreamdaughters?
>>
>>3644523
no, we need Shu to grab Dorian at least, and talk to the midnight crew the chance to get both them and possibly their dream daughters is worth a single turn of holdover on Shus part. plus, she can send in her swarm while she is away.
>>
>>3644523
(An excellent question; no, Shu may leave the city and come back if you so choose without her Dream Daughters despawning, and the same goes for everyone present. It takes some time for them to disappear, and coming back would reset that timer to full and keep it stopped for as long as the living Daughters are present.)
>>
>>3644235
>stop her here

Bni is only going to get stronger and when she gets to the cord there will only be more meat for her maw to continue growing.

Even if we go full bore, consume every power in our path that doesnt join us and train we are still two years behind Bni. On top of that, Mother will recharge soon and all hell will break loose after she got the ol'bamboozle.

We have to do it now while we have as much strength as we can muster.
>>
>>3644508
>>3644515
Oh. Okay. So in essence we have 10 rounds to make our preparations for this giant Raid. Before Isabelle reaches the exit, but the longer we wait the more powerful Isabelle gets as she starts to realize how bullshit op she is.
>>
>>3644537
Bhop, Is the Tier 3 Forge Core fully recharged now? Because I kinda want to go back to the Dragon's Roost in order to pick up Dorian and refit everyone. while trying to convince the Midnight Crew to join in.
>>
>>3644543
(Precisely.)

>>3644542
(Mother has been reduced to three tokens in her pool. I hope this answers some lingering questions about how far she over-extended herself against you.)
>>
>>3644553
(Yes, it has.)
>>
>>3644553
i dont think so. it needs another core to recharge, and November has our only other one.

>>3644563
wait, but how? that goes against how you said it works.
>>
>>3644565
(Curses, my apologies. I was incorrect, you're right.)
>>
>>3644235
>>3644256
right well, my plan so far, REPOSTED AS NOT EVERYTHING GOT COPIED RIGHT.
also sorry if this means i bamboozled anyone.

SHU;
>Spawn a full set of Recursive Bane-Drillings and send them after Isabelle.
>slip in a few Jacklings and Crimsons to try and use the Drillings as a distraction, to stun Isabelle.
>Quickly go back to the penthouse, and try and explain the situation to the Midnight Crew(see below).
>Regardless of the outcome, grab who is willing to come and head back quickly.

RATH and AMARA CLONE;
>Quickly get into the city, burst speed and further build up your strength.
>wait for the moment to strike, then with CALL TO ARMS start stacking REPLICANT Limb combo punches into Isabelles face.

JULIA;
>Hitch a Ride with Rath.
>When you see your opening, expend your health as needed to try and get as deadly a Cancer Bomb as possible into Isabelle, but don't risk your life on it.

NOVEMBER;
>Hitch a ride with Rath.
>Simply rev up your guns and keep them firing on Isabelle, pin her the hell down.

AMARA CLONES;
>Main focus is on Having Halos prepared to defend everyone, Sneezes ready to go.
>otherwise, split spells, a Third focus on keeping Isabelle pinned and slowed, a Third focus on countering any spells Isabelle might try to throw out, and a Third focus buffing our team with every spell imaginable.

GINAS TEAM;
>Work to pin down Isabelle, main focus on her limbs.

UZUS TEAM;
>Work to slow Isabelle down, main focus on keeping her grounded and off balance.

NEW DAUGHTERS ARRIVING TEAM;
>Help out wherever you can to slow down Isabelle.

SHUS WORDS;
>quickly get your bearings after you arrive, as much as you would love to play 20 questions, wave off anyone who tries and ask you anything.
>”Dorian, Amara, Jackie, Ace, Quinn, and Keane. Things didn't go as planned. Isabelle betrayed Mother, and we need to stop her.”
>Turn to the Midnight crew, to Jackie.
>”look, i know this isnt your fight. I know the stakes mean nothing to you. Mothers defeated, Isabelle isnt a personal issue for you, and shes not a threat to the crucible ending either, the exact opposite.”
>blink, and let your heart get hit with your emotions, if tears flow, they flow.
>”But shes hurt my family. She HAS my family, captured and stuck in her head. And if we dont stop her now... we might not ever get them back.”
>”Please...i know i dont deserve to ask this of you, i know you have helped us so much, given and risked so much for us...but please...please help me stop her, please help me get back my family….”
>Stumble on your words, start ranting.
>”We can reward you, if you need. The penthouse? The Gear? Our Relics? We need all the help we can get, name the price, its yours just...please… this may be our last chance to get them back, and stop her…”

the rest of our family can add to the 10 turns while we get backup. id hope and imagine they will be enough to at least add to the clock until we get there.
>>
>>3644235

You have my vote>>3644579

I can get behind this. Maybe laying it a big thick on there with the speech but i think at least somewhat appropriate. Shu is gonna realize if Isabelle escapes we loose Gina basicly forever and she would probably suffer any material loss than that
>>
>>3644555
Damn. Three tokens. Mother's literally only has "safe" move left before putting her on the verge of deletion.

>>3644568
>>3644565
Dammit.

>>3644579
For the Amara clones, we should always keep a reserve platoon of Amaras set to cloning duty. We can't afford to lose all of the Amaras.

have Bella and Gina use Terraforming to push Isabelle back with crowd control, either by sending Acid Tsunamis that carry her away or Catapulting her back.
>>
>>3644555
Wooooow, Matrons Mad. Taunt to get bodied holds true even at the end of the world. Still though, shes not dead yet and cornered animals fight the hardest.
>>
>>3644599
i dont think(or at least hope) the midnight crew will force such a payment from us. they dont seem the type. they either will help or they wont. i just felt it fit, as Shu would be desperate and willing to sacrifice such a high price to stop from losing Gina and the others.

>>3644603
we cant command individuals in the Dream Teams, only each as a group.

fair point on the Amaras.
>>
>>3644619
no i definetly approve of it. we have a somewhat working relationship with the Crew now. They know that Shu would only make such offers if she was really desperate. They know Shu as calm, collected and with what amounts to a silver tounge, for Shu to loose her composure like that would make anyone worry.

They would probably take a token Prize from us for their service if they are willing to come.

>>3644555
Three tokens... She can make one more missstep before being completely powerless. We should be on the lookout on what she plans on doing with that as its gonna be devious.

Wait arent there Still Phalanx pieces around? What would happen if we kill those as a theoretical. Would she loose the last tokens one for each piece of the Phalanx?
>>
>>3644632
true, but not anything to fuck us over. plus, of course, if they help, we would be more than willing to give them something anyways, so thats not even really an issue.
>>
>>3644632
(Yes, she would.)
>>
>>3644645
That is gonna be a plotpoint later on wont it? Defeat the Sentient Phalanx pieces or spare them. Sparng them might give us the moral highground and some possibly powerful and experienced allies. On the other hand if we kill them and by extension mother the Autopilot will be turned on and we could possibly recruit Charon and Ringo............ Damn those are gonna be difficult choices to make
>>
>>3644632
Or Mother could pull a "taking you with me" on Isabelle in desperation after seeing what's happening. At this point, she would be all for rooting for Shu the Defiant because Shu's goal at least is to end the Crucible while Isabelle's goal is to extend it indefinitely until she's the last daughter alive (a vastly undesirable outcome for Ozmas). She's got 3 tokens left. Putting a daughter at Zero hp Death's door state would put Mother down to 1 token with the rest being burned and her being purged from the system if the daughter hit by the cheat was to make death's door saves and pull herself out of death's door.
>>
>>3644579
>>3644235
I'm in support of this vote. But have an amendment on the Amara platoons to reserve 1/3 of their number and have them set to Cloning duty.
>>
>>3644655
its possible they cant be saved in their current form, the Fibromancer i think only got clarity due to the deaths door stuff giving that, and if we had let them recover, their innate Amalgam-like status would possibly cloud their mind again.

>>3644658
im actually interested in just what Mothers goal now is sure, she clearly wanted to win the crucible again, but when Isabelle spoke, she clearly would prefer death and an end to the crucible in some form over that, so im surprised she chickened out on doing something to Isabelle.

>>3644676
oof, i think thats too high. i was gonna do 1/5, at best 1/4. keep in mind they probably cant use their Halos to defend from attacks while splitting either, so putting too many aside might leave gaps, as its been implied splitting new clones is the most concentration and ACT heavy action they can take.
>>
>>3644645

Note: S.S.H (Saitama Saisyu Heiki) is such a fuckin boss at making metal rock soundtracks.
Theme song for the final battle against Isabelle?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2rj9rE6Rh0I
>>
Alright, back. Was busy most of this morning, but I have returned with excellent news: My dad's cancer is in remission! So today is a good day.

Right, so catching up, supporting >>3644579. Make sure to grab the Arbiter's Appetite while we're there, turns out we might need it.
>>
>>3644850
glad to hear it, hope the best for him!

and oh yeah, we did leave that with the Midnight crew, totally forgot about that.
>>
>>3644857
Yeah, it's been rough. He's been in and out of the hospital a lot recently, but I took him today and it looks like he's fine. It's so relieving.

And yeah, we need the Appetite. We can recover Gina and the rest of the Dream Daughters that way. And gain their Cores in the process, technically? Neat. I guess we'll give them to Gina when we revive her, give her build a bit more versatility.
>>
>>3644875
yeah, hope things continue to go well for him.

as for Gina, plus, i mean, its the best way to get them back into her head. i think giving her Eloise would be good too, that way shes with the daughters shes had the most time to open up to as she adjusts herself more to the idea of actually having friends and being social. though granted, not sure most of those cores would work best on Gina, we'll make do.

[spoiler[assuming we even get her back, and things dont just go to shit.[/spoiler]
>>
>>3644850
I will definetly wish him the best, Cancer is a massive pain and burden for everyone involved.
I hope it never comes back
>>
>>3644892
Hey, hey, enough of that. We wasted enough time despairposting already. Let's kill B'Ni, reclaim our friends, and incarnate at least one of them (what are we going to do with that other Engine charge, anyway? I feel it's probably best to save it, but there are other options) in a shiny new body full of upgrades.
>>
>>3644908
dunno. feels...pretty iffy to pick favorites out of the others, and feels just as iffy to try and have them decide who to bring back out but...at the same time, having another ally would be useful. but man, it just feels like it would be such a dick move to pick one or force them to, aswell as make them feel obligated to help us upon being reborn.
>>
>>3644922
>>3644908
Well many of the Daughters like Holly, Uzu and Niku probably dont want to come back anyway, the sororitas would not want to individually, the other daughter in Amaraas Head seems to proud to take the offer, we do not know the crazy one in Julias head so she i probably out, Johanna probably does not want to either as she was bested and in her philosophy she would not take an offer out of pitty.
The one i can see wanting to come back would be Kosi and eloise. Eloise would probably want to go her own way and Kosi would probably stick around. Not so sure how either of them would fit into the Group as a whole.

Probably best to keep it as a last resort if someone else dies.
>>
File: Midnight Crew.gif (6 KB, 650x450)
6 KB
6 KB GIF
>>3644235

This ends.

Now.

Both your hive and mind erupt into a flurry of activity, a fresh set of swarmlings surging forth to buy the time you need. A pulse across your empathic field is all it takes for Rath, Julia, and November to take off, and you watch as the streets themselves carry your allies forwards at blinding speed, the art-deco buildings churning aside to carve a clear path to your shared foe before Almath closes behind them. You wrap your fingers around Escher’s Gear as thoughts of family fill your mind, your stomach dropping as the crypt’s cold air is replaced with the filtered warmth of your new home.

You explode into existence at the Dragon’s Roost, and Quinn flails on the couch at your spontaneous arrival before bracing herself for whatever horrors you’ve brought with you this time, while Dorian’s the first at your side by virtue of his speed with Jackie hot on his coattails.

”Dorian, Amara, Jackie, Ace, Quinn, and Keane.” You say quickly, turning to each of your allies in turn. “Things didn't go as planned. Isabelle betrayed Mother, and we need to stop her.”

You turn to Jackie, too desperate to put on airs with what’s at stake, her eye going wide as you take her by the shoulders.

“Look, I know this isn’t your fight. Mothers defeated, Isabelle isn’t a personal issue for you, and she’s not a threat to the Crucible ending either, the exact opposite.” Comes your hasty preamble, your heart seizing in your chest as your gaze bores through hers. ”But she’s hurt my family. She HAS my family, captured and stuck in her head. And if we don’t stop her now... we might not ever get them back.”

Jackie glances to her side, sharing a look with Quinn and Ace, both worse for wear but standing tall.

”Please...I know I don’t deserve to ask this of you, I know you have helped us so much, given and risked so much for us...but please, please help me stop her. Help me get back my family….” Comes your desperate plea, your empathic channel too clogged with your own desire to see your family back together again to sense Jackie’s mood through her stoic exterior. ”We can reward you, if you need. The penthouse? The Gear? Our Relics? We need all the help we can get, name the price, it’s yours just...

You pause when Jackie’s slender index finger alights on your lips.

“Hush.” She softly replies, a svelte grin working it's way across her thin lips. “You had me at ‘family’, dude.”

(Continued)
>>
>>3644948

“Ladies!” Jackie shouts, rounding on her allies as her voice echoes through the space. “Used to be the Midnight Crew was the four of us. Us against the world, and all that. Well, the Crew’s gained a few more members, and they’re in trouble, see?! We’re about to charge into hell itself, and there’s a strong chance we ain’t gonna make it out! So what do we say to death?!”

To your surprise, grins spread across Quinn and Keane’s faces.

“Get fucked, bitch!” The crew howls in unison before Jackie turns to you with a mischievous grin.

“Shit man, you heard ‘em.” Jackie smirks, thrusting the Arbiter’s Appetite into your hand, her other on your shoulder. “Let’s go kill another god, slayer.”

Within seconds you’re back in Almath, and the second you set your armored foot on the street you’re hurtling forwards with Dorian, Amara, and the Crew in tow, the building parting to grant you passage to the very heart of the city’s growing chaos. The street curves, and you bear witness to your allies preparing to strike again, the swarm of geists curving around in the sky to make another pass at the black-clad girl that’s been frantically trying to fend off a lifetime’s worth of anger and vengeance. Her hair’s streaked with silver, her right arm a patchwork of hexagonal scarring that shines with golden light, at odds with the black lines running down her left.

In that second, that mere moment she made to give herself time to breathe, she sees you.

Your eyes meet emeralds, across the distance.

Her gaze flares with anger, as you stand tall with your family by your side.

It’s time to end this.


Shu the Defiant, Slayer of Gods

VS.

ISABELLE, MADNESS ASCENDANT

HP: 650% (+35%, Matrons Stoicism, Ignition Gauntlets, Whistle: CUNT TER RHO)
BIO: 690% (+60%, 19 Rook-Platelings, Recursive [You/Rath/Julia/November: Armored], 6 Quad Knighted-Grapplings, 2 Jacklings, 2 Scarlet Drones, 3 Bishops [Shu, Rath, Julia], 4 Recursive Bane-Drillings, 36/36)
CONTENDER: 2 x B.33 Loaded, Sword Form.
RAVENOUS MAW: Primed.
HUNDRED-HANDED: None.
ACT: 3/3

RATH HP: 860% (70%, Sui Tormentis, Gutgrab Daggers, 2400% ATK+, 2400% SPD+, 2400% DEF+)
JULIA HP: 880% (20%, Hydras Heart, Manus Caelorum, Cursas Alas, 20 Daggers, BLOODY RIPPER x 2)
NOVEMBER HP: 970% (Tier 1 Core)
CLONES: 43 Remaining, all with Radiant Boils in hand.

Team Gina: Active, attempting to bind limbs.
Team Uzu: Active, working to destabilize.
Midnight Crew: Active, by your side.

Threat: Cataclysmic, and growing. Long distance, easily crossed in a single ACT due to Almath’s assistance. MALLEABLE FLESH x3

>>CORE TEAM LIMIT: REMOVED

>>LOADOUT RESEPC: POSSIBLE

>>ONE FREE ACT PER TURN TO COMMUNE WITH ALMATH

>>SQUAD LIMIT: 4 (Amaras do not count towards squad maximum.)

>>PLEASE ASSEMBLE/REASSEMBLE ADDITIONAL SQUADS FROM THE INDIVIDUALS BELOW AND CURRENT TEAMS

>>Dorian, Amara (Prime), Niku, Gemma, Hera, Sasha, Sororitias (counts as one)

YOU ARE IN CONTROL
>>
(Gentlemen, voting shall remain open for the next three and a half hours. Good luck.)

>>3644850
(I've been there, Anon. I'm so happy to hear he's doing well, and thank you for sharing the wonderful news!)

>>3644729
(Considering they're one of my favorite remixers, you made my day, Anon.)
>>
>>3644976
what can we expect from the Soriitas? are they coming out as a singular blob, or still individuals? what powerset do they have?
>>
>>3644937
Kosi probably cant come back, due to her weird condition even the Crucible couldn't fix. Eloise might be too proud to come back.

i think Holly actually might be ok with it, if only to help Shu. Meg too, but only for the sake of getting more fights, granted, still maybe willing to help, just for...different reasons than others. i also cant see her taking it over someone else though.

Bella....no idea. she might feel too guilty, given what she caused. Hera probably doesn't care...Penny no idea, we would have to actually talk to her first. Gemma...probably not, her whole philosophy kinda may of lead her to this situation anyways...
>>
>>3644964
Bhop, what actions can we do when communicating with Almath? What actions can Almath provide?
>>3645000
Shu:
>Act 1: ATTACH EXSANGUINATING LEASH and attach it to Isabelle. Become an unkillable face tank. Isabelle will be focusing on trying to kill shu and ignoring everyone else's attempts.

Free action: "ISABELLE! IT'S TIME TO END THIS!"
>Act 2: Spawn 8 Hundred Handed Limbs, all equipped with Heavens drills.
>Act 3: ENGAGE SLUGFEST.

>Amara clones: Have one of them start Song of the Swarm.

Lets Reorganize core members and squads. I want to maximize our Dual Techniques and party techniques.
Assign an Amara clone with each living and Dream daughter.

Julia and Dorian will be paired up to exploit their Dual Techniques
Rath and November will be paired up to exploit their Dual Techniques.

>Amara Prime will be with the Soroitas with Niku and Gemma

I've got to go soon, but here's my current thoughts about our party setup and Shu's initial Actions.

We also need a set up to land the Cancer bomb on Isabelle, centermass preferrably on her spine.
>>
>>3644964
Here's my proposed team lineup:

>Binder Team: Gina (leader), Sasha, Kosi, Sororitas
Abilities to restrain B'Ni. Gina has Neuromancy, Sasha her puppet strings, Sororitas their amorphous flesh, Kosi keeps everyone topped off

>Disruptor Team: Uzu (leader), Johanna, Bella, Gemma
Abilities to disrupt the battlefield. Uzu spirals, Johanna makes her bone spikes, Bella sprays acid, Gemma spams clones everywhere and gets in the way

>Striker Team: Eloise (leader), Niku, Meg, Hera
Abilities for mobility and damage. Eloise her bone blades and skates, Niku her Bakunetsu God Finger, Meg her ground-swimming and punches, Hera being a giant ball of arms.

>Join the party: Dorian, Amara Prime
Dorian and Amara form up with the rest of the party. Defiant Fools, together to the end.

>>3644976
>(I've been there, Anon. I'm so happy to hear he's doing well, and thank you for sharing the wonderful news!)
Thanks. To all of you expressing your well wishes, I really appreciate it, guys. Lot of stress leaving me now.
>>
>>3645022
no, Amara PRIME i think still counts as a party member, her clones dont though.
>>
>>3645022
>>3645029
also you forgot November.

ill go ahead and post my thoughts, but not my info yet.

>>3644964
aw, yeah i knew we could rely on the Midnight Crew, lovely girls they are.

ok, so WE can only command Shu+ 3, everyone else must be put into Teams.

honestly the only thing i think we should do Relic wise is hand Dorian the Cursa Alas, i think everything else is good where it is.

i feel like we should switch out November for Dorian. shes good, but shes literally just backup right now, and can do that on a side Team.

Also, i think both Ginas and Uzus teams are good, but making a third team i dont think would be amiss of us.

that being said
>>3645022
makes a good point, we could have the teams focus on something specific each, BUT my worry is that leaves them very vulnerable.
>>
>>3644976
I do have a question: Did the Midnight Crew actually pick up health regen and bio regen from feasting on the Phalanxes?
>>
>>3644964
>Almath: literaly pull the rug out from under Isabelle as she tries to move to engage someone by just dematerializing a hole underneath her and stretching ground half a meter from the edge to catch her while she tries to move so the Gheists and Rath can engage with Rath using the Dualtech

Core Team:
Add Dorian us we will need him to lock down Isabelle
>>3645022
I like your team setup and would like to ask you to consider this

I would suggest to attach Amara and Niku to the Midnight Crew
Midnight Crew Attach Amara(Prime) to them and have Jackie boost Amaras spells to slow down Isabelle
Niku gives support in keeping the Crew supplied with BIO and safe from direct attacks by Isabelle

>>3644976
(Would boosting the Primes Spellcating also affect her clones?)

(Is there enough Biomass here to do the Grindermove to turn Isabelle to so much chuncky salsa?)
>>
>>3645029
Okay? I know that. It was Amara Prime I was assigning to our party.

>>3645035
>also you forgot November.
November's already in the party.

>aw, yeah i knew we could rely on the Midnight Crew, lovely girls they are.
Yeah, they're our best bitches. Seriously, great girls once you get past the initial prickliness.

>ok, so WE can only command Shu+ 3, everyone else must be put into Teams.
No, Core Team size is unrestricted. It's the squads that are limited to four members.

>>3645038
>I would suggest to attach Amara and Niku to the Midnight Crew
I don't know. Are the Geists sufficiently distracted hating B'Ni to ignore Amara's spells? If so, then sure. And do you mean Kosi, not Niku? I don't know how Niku would top off their Bio.
>>
>>3645046
>I don't know. Are the Geists sufficiently distracted hating B'Ni to ignore Amara's spells? If so, then sure. And do you mean Kosi, not Niku? I don't know how Niku would top off their Bio.

By being a Ghost that does not run out of BIO which they can redistribute between themselves
>>
>>3645046
..fucking...ok that my bad, BHOP saying both confused the hell out of me, as out team IS still a squad.
>>
And I've got to got to work.
>>
>>3645064
Well good luck
See you soon
>>
>>3645051
Right, right, sorry. Had a derp moment. Yes, the Midnight Crew can redistribute Health and Bio. Don't need the ghost's powers to do that. Okay, then I'm fine with that plan. Again, if the Geists are sufficiently distracted to let Amara get her spells off.

Actually, let's bring everyone into the resource sharing web, while we're at it. Twenty-two Daughters, twelve of which have unlimited Bio, all joined together. See how B'Ni likes it to have enemies who heal faster than she can do damage.

>>3645064
Later, anon. Have a nice day.
>>
>>3644964
right, first half of my vote;

non-combat orders;
>Give Dorian the Cursa Alas

TEAMS;
>Shus Team;
>>Dorian, Rath, November, Amara(Prime), and Julia

>Ginas Team;
>>Uzu, Bella, and Kosi
All have large, area of effect terrain coverage.

>Eloise Team;
>>Holly, and the Soroitas
All are melee focused but show signs of being more akin to tool fighters then beat em up fighters.

>Johannas Team;
>Hera, Gemma, and Niku
All focus heavily on being up and in the fight via melee, with maybe the exception of the Soroitas but we know nothing about them but they showed no signs of long range combat otherwise.
>>
>>3645072
You can reference this. Though we should not cast after we killed isabelle, the Gheists are probably gonna aggro onto us after that >>3644310

>>3645078
I would put Amara with the Midnight Crew and Niku being there to keep Amara safe and the Midnightcrew supplied with BIO. Also Jackie can boost Amaras Spellcasting so she can more easily cast them on Isabelle without risking quite as much as dishing out much heavier debuffs.


The rest of the Teams i could get behind as they seem capale enough and dont have to fear death.
>>
>>3644964
>>3645078
Combat orders;


SHU and AMARA PRIME;
>unleash the BBs into Isabelles legs.
>LEASH her.
>keep swarming her with Drillings, with Crimsons hidden in their midst to try and allow Gina to stun her.
>Spawn 8 arms and 8 Drills, and wait for a moment to lunge in and give her hell.
>Have Amara Prime sing SONG OF THE SWARM.
>Ask the city to be prepared to block off Isabelle if she make a run for it.

JULIA;
>let everyone else distract her, but as soon as you get an opening, rush in and stab her, putting as much as you can into a Cancer Bomb.

DORIAN;
>Rush around the place, building up charges.
>otherwise focus on sending paintlings out to try and infect any wounds opened up in Isabelle.
>If Isabelle ever gets an opening, unleash all your stacks onto her.

RATH and AMARA CLONE;
>Keep CALL TO ARMS UP.
>unrelenting barrage on Isabelle, as strong of hits as you can dish out.

NOVEMBER;
>Use the Shotgun, unrelenting barrage, to try and keep Isabelle prone.

AMARA CLONES;
>Main focus is on Having Halos prepared to defend everyone, Sneezes ready to go.
>otherwise, split spells, a Third focus on keeping Isabelle pinned and slowed, a Third focus on countering any spells Isabelle might try to throw out, and a Third focus buffing our team with every spell imaginable.

GINAS TEAM;
>Turn the very ground against Isabelle, keep her off her feet and on the floor.

ELOISE TEAM;
>Work to use your many tool to tear at and pin Isabelles limbs.

JOHANNAS TEAM;
>Focus on her head, try and make sure she cant get any Lexicon words out, distract her from it however you can.
>>
>>3645097
>You can reference this. Though we should not cast after we killed isabelle, the Gheists are probably gonna aggro onto us after that >>3644310
Ah, I missed that bit. Then excellent, no objections to having Jackie boost Amara.
>>
>>3645097
i think the Midnight Crew is preset and cant be edited. also Niku would still do much better with Johanna, and we can and so should put Amara with the main Team.

>>3645098
forgot a bit, fucking hell today is not my day.

MIDNIGHT CREW;
>Focus on aiding in keeping peoples Health and Bio up.
>focus on helping Quinn get her core activated.
>>
>>3645098
have Gina pair up with Julia on the Cancer bomb.
>>
>>3645113
we cant, side teams cannot have their individuals controlled or be given specific orders.
>>
>>3644976
Question OP:
Would the Boost of Jackie onto Amaras Spellcasting boost the Casting Abilities of only the prime or her clones as well?
>>
>>3645113
>>3645118
also Cancer gets better with more health, and Gina actually has very little of that to give, Julia has a ton. sure, Gina cant die, but its potency will still not increase as much i dont think from what she can offer.
>>
>>3645098
have Dorian use stormfront waltz to transport Julia around, so that dorian provides Julia the movement with canvas form while Julia can focus on dishing out the damage
>>
>>3645098
>unrelenting barrage on Isabelle, as strong of hits as you can dish out.
Call To Arms deals enough knockback to easily launch the target out of range, we should get B'Ni up against a wall before we do this.

>Focus on her head, try and make sure she cant get any Lexicon words out, distract her from it however you can.
I'm not sure it will be necessary. Gina said that the Geists respond to her casting faster than she can get a word off, just like when Amara tried to cast a spell. Also, Skintalkers don't actually need their face mouths to talk. BHOP mentioned that way back when, I'd have to go searching for the reference. Skintalkers can grow new mouths anywhere on their body in order to speak with (which implies some weird things about their internal structure, that they can get the proper air flow. Guess they're full of pneumatic tubes). Hitting B'Ni in the face won't prevent her from casting any more than hitting her anywhere else would.
>>
>>3645098
>>3645132
Ww could let Almath hold her in place for us with our free interaction we can make it so that the City spawns a wall for Isabelle to be punched against

I see nothing done jet with that free ACT
>>
>>3645130
i have no idea what that is, its not on the dual tech list.

>>3645132
nah, with the Geists, and everyone elses moves to keep Isabelle pinned, i dont think it will be an issue. Plus, worst case, we can add for Rath to aim for punting her into the ground, which is what i wanted anyways.

true on the second part, but really there not much else for them to do but aim for any mouths they see on her. we've got alot of folks to throw around but only one target, theres only so much we can do before we just have basically a mosh pit slamming her into the ground. may at least mix it up and give each team a specific WAY of punching her into the ground.
>>
>>3645145
i just had the City acting as a backup to stop her if you look at Shus orders, but i guess that could work. kinda feel like just having Rath try to keep her punched into the ground could work, but i guess thats a good backup plan.
>>
>>3645155
yeah instead of the city blocking her off if she tries ot get away make the city react to if Isabelle would run or be flung away from the effects of some attack or ability to make her smack flat into a wall
>>
And Rath's already in Ignition mode, right? Otherwise B'Ni's immunities will keep the punches from actually doing anything. Which is a shame, that she's immune to blunt damage. Given that her new big power is to manifest memories as constructs, I am absolutely certain she's going to make a lava lamp at some point. And I want to hit her in the head with it. We can do it anyway, but it would be nice if it actually did damage and we could finish her off with the lamp.

Actually, wait, immunities. We need to take that into account for our up-close assault team. B'Ni is immune to heat, blunt and slashing damage. Okay, so Niku isn't useful. Nor is Hera, except to restrain B'Ni. Eloise and Holly are fine, rapiers and teeth are both piercing. Johanna has some piercing attacks. Gemma should be fine, she's technically eating people on a cellular level, I think that should bypass the immunities. And we don't know enough about the Sororitas to say.

Oh, and the current plan forgets about Sasha. We need to assign her to a team. I'm thinking with Eloise, have her work on pinning B'Ni's limbs with her puppet threads.
>>
>>3645179
>Ignition Mode
thats no true, BHOP said even her regular punches will deal damage, and Ignition deal Fire Damage, which Isabelle is immune too, so it wouldn't help. shes immune to Crushing Damage, not Blunt, or well, as BHOP said Raths Fists still hurt her, im assuming Crushing and Blunt are different.

and because of this, the Johanna Team, even Niku, is still effective, as if Raths regular fists will affect her, theirs will too. i mean, Niku will be a bit weakened still, but she doesn't have anything else to help do.

wait, i had Sasha on a team. fucking...yeah its not there. what the fuck is up with me today my god. yeah Eloise works.
>>
>>3645201
>thats no true, BHOP said even her regular punches will deal damage, and Ignition deal Fire Damage, which Isabelle is immune too, so it wouldn't help.
Burrowing Blast, enemies can't be immune to Rath's Generator damage, only resistant. Given that the comment about the punches still being effective was in response to a question about Burrowing Blast, I think that's what it was in reference to.

>shes immune to Crushing Damage, not Blunt, or well, as BHOP said Raths Fists still hurt her, im assuming Crushing and Blunt are different.
I'm not sure. I'd certainly prefer it, of course. I want to hit B'Ni in the head with a lava lamp.

>and because of this, the Johanna Team, even Niku, is still effective, as if Raths regular fists will affect her, theirs will too. i mean, Niku will be a bit weakened still, but she doesn't have anything else to help do.
Yeah, Niku doesn't have much to do here. Neither does Bella, B'Ni's immune to acid, too. Maybe they can be effective against the constructs once B'Ni starts spawning them, then? Wait, should we have an anti-construct team ready?
>>
>>3645146
go check with Bhop, I swear stormfront waltz is a dual technique between Dorian and Julia.
>>3644964
bhop please tell anon that stormfront waltz exists, i swear i remember seeing it in vein 22 or 23.
>>
>>3645224
my question had nothing to do with BB though, and BHOP has stated before i thought the BB only affects boils right now.
>>
>>3645232
It does attect Generator powers.
Her Ingition Mode is a Hybrid between Generator, Fibromancer and Vitruvion Powers and is therefore affected because it is technicly a generator power
>>
>>3645232
No, it applies to all Generator-based damage, including that from Ignition. But maybe I got the conversation thread tangled, my apologies if I did.

Oh, another thing we're forgetting: Orders for the Midnight Crew. I think we need to get the health web set up.
>>
>>3645239
>>3645241
yes, but he specifically said they do not affect all generator powers, both Casters Curvball and Burrowing Blast. i know for a fact despite both saying they affect all Generator powers, the question was asked and he said they do not, only ranged ones.

..or was it only one of them? could've sworn the question was put forth for both, but now im not sure at all. fuck if i know now. regardless, my question was based on her and others fists by themselves, so...yeah i dunno.

also i did put down the Midnight Crew orders.
>>
>>3645254
Well I am sure it was stated that the casters curveball only affects ranged attacks as it needs a projectile to function but the Burrowing blast affects her melee attacks as well

>>3644976
OP Clarification please if you would
>>
>>3645254
>..or was it only one of them? could've sworn the question was put forth for both, but now im not sure at all. fuck if i know now. regardless, my question was based on her and others fists by themselves, so...yeah i dunno.
It was Curveball. Burrowing Blast affects all Generator damage.

>also i did put down the Midnight Crew orders.
Oh, so you did, it was in a separate post. My apologies.

Also, an idea I just had: We can manipulate Almath's structure thanks to the empathic link, right? Do you think it will be more effective if we make the write-in focus on emotion? Something like:

>>3645098
SHU
>Convey to Almath all the frustration we've had with B'Ni constantly evading us. Never letting us have a conclusive resolution to the problem she presents, always running away whenever we try to fix things. Whether it was diplomacy or conflict, she would always shut us out and refuse to engage. It was so, so frustrating. We refuse to go through that again. If she tries to withdraw from the fight, or even gets knocked away from it, block her movements. We're ending it here and now.
>>
>>3645224
i dont think we need a anti-construct team specifically. for one, no one really has specifically anti-construct powers but Dorian. secondly, we already have enough bulk to throw around if she does spawn them, someones probably already just not having enough space to do anything but go after them anyways.

>>3645277
im...really not sure if emotion will help. its already listening to us so it might be past the point of having to convince it?
>>
>>3645280
>>3645277
I think it would make narrative sense of why the City listens to us, it makes it more immersive i would say(if i can take such aword into my mouth)
>>
>>3645280
>i dont think we need a anti-construct team specifically. for one, no one really has specifically anti-construct powers but Dorian. secondly, we already have enough bulk to throw around if she does spawn them, someones probably already just not having enough space to do anything but go after them anyways.
Well, Keane does, too. But I wasn't thinking anti-construct abilities so much as just being on guard for any constructs she forms. These things are probably going to turn out to be copies of Daughters she's fought, they could be pretty beefy. Then again, Gina did say that the Ghost Daughters reform endlessly. So any of the zombies that B'Ni fought through to get to the spire should still be here. It would be great if B'Ni summons a copy of a Daughter and the actual Daughter shows up to fight it in a fit of undead rage.

>im...really not sure if emotion will help. its already listening to us so it might be past the point of having to convince it?
Maybe. It was less trying to convince it and more trying to amp up the power. An emotional command would probably get a larger response than a dispassionate one.
>>
>>3645254
>>3645241
>>3645224
(I looked back through my notes, and Burrowing Blast and Casters Curveball should work with her melee as long as Rath's in her Ignition form. I see I was vague on that point, but I do recall that I'd made both augmentations with the intent of them haveing synergy with Rath's Ignition form.)

>>3644992
>> what can we expect from the Sororitas? Are they coming out as a singular blob, or still individuals? What powerset do they have?

(They’re coming out as the children you met in the Dreamscape. They have high speed flight, generator acid, flesh sculpting, and regeneration. They can all share each other’s abilities, so they can slot into roles as needed.)

>>3645012
>>Bhop, what actions can we do when communicating with Almath? What actions can Almath provide?

(The city may make one move per turn, triggered at any point in the turn. It may move terrain at will, shift buildings, and make other structures rise from the ground. Dream Daughters and Geists do not have issues crossing that terrain if it’s rendered difficult.)

>>3645037
>>I do have a question: Did the Midnight Crew actually pick up health regen and bio regen from feasting on the Phalanxes?

(They did, yes. Each member now has both in moderate amounts.)

>>3645121
>>Would the Boost of Jackie onto Amaras Spellcasting boost the Casting Abilities of only the prime or her clones as well?

(It could effect Amara or her clones, though the effect would be spread throughout her clones if the latter is chosen.)

>>3645179
>>And Rath's already in Ignition mode, right?

(She is not. Would you like to trigger it this turn?)
>>
>>3645302
ok, well neat enough on the Generator Augments.

and ok, the Soroitas are exactly where they need to be then, they fit perfectly with Eloises Team. or well, at least, fit better on hers than any others.
>>
>>3645302
>(They’re coming out as the children you met in the Dreamscape. They have high speed flight, generator acid, flesh sculpting, and regeneration. They can all share each other’s abilities, so they can slot into roles as needed.)
Huh. Okay, I'd say keep them with Eloise's team, then. A quartet of fast-flying girls flitting about and flesh-warping B'Ni should make for a good distraction.

>(They did, yes. Each member now has both in moderate amounts.)
Nice. That's going to make them a lot more viable. Honestly, I'm impressed they've made it this far without any.

>(She is not. Would you like to trigger it this turn?)
Yes. We've got healing, the health drain won't matter much. Light it up, Rath.
>>
>>3645231
(I haven't forgotten you, Anon. I'm looking it up now.)
>>
forgot about the Storm Waltz so deleted orders update for a moment, sorry if i bamboozle anyone.
>>
>>3645231

(Here we are, from a few Vein's prior.)

-SHU & JACKIE-

>>KING’S ENVOY: A potent combination of your empathic channel and Jack’s ability-boosting Humoral Paladin skills, this Dual Tech allows you to funnel nearly all of Jackie’s boosts into the effects of a single skill tree or passive, eschewing a variety of boosts in exchange for tremendously increasing said ability’s powers. While the effects of this skill are quite variable, there is no question that the affected skill’s powers will reach heights most Daughters only dream of. (Cost: -50% BIO/turn from each participant)

-AMARA & KEANE-

>>LEGION’S PLAYDATE: A result of Amara and Keane’s late-night brainstorming, Keane may now immediately shift HEALTH AND BIO around from Amara’s nearby clones to one another and even Amara Prime, herself. This will, in effect, allow Amara to take hits from attacks that would otherwise bring her to death’s door, instantly restoring her HEALTH when she would go down. (Cost: -60% BIO from Keane, 1 ACT ongoing to keep effect active.)

-RATH & NOVEMBER-

>>FAMILIAL ARMAMENT: A price paid in blood…for the sake of her family, she’ll pay it gladly. The HEALTH cost for November’s abilities may now be paid by Rath, as long as both of them are in short range. Additionally, November may also sacrifice her HEALTH to empower any ability Rath uses that would cost her own life force to use. (Cost: Variable HEALTH from Rath/November, 1 ACT from donator)

-JULIA & DORIAN-

>>STORMFRONT’S WALTZ (Passive): A burgeoning spark foretells a gathering storm. Dorian may now bring Julia with him when he moves using Canvass Form, and his Accumulated Charge generates two STACKS per movement zone crossed as long as he is traveling with his sworn Lady. (Cost: None, always active.)
>>
>>3644964
>>3645078
>>3645098
Order Edits;

non-combat orders;
>Give Dorian the Cursa Alas

TEAMS;
>Shus Team;
>>Dorian, Rath, November, Amara(Prime), and Julia

>Ginas Team;
>>Uzu, Bella, and Kosi

>Eloise Team;
>>Sasha, Holly, and the Soroitas

>Johannas Team;
>Hera, Gemma, and Niku

<><><>

Combat orders;


SHU and AMARA PRIME;
>unleash the BBs into Isabelles legs.
>LEASH her.
>keep swarming her with Drillings, with Crimsons hidden in their midst to try and allow Gina to stun her.
>Spawn 8 arms and 8 Drills, and wait for a moment to lunge in and give her hell.
>Have Amara Prime sing SONG OF THE SWARM.
>send your anger to the City, your determination and resentment towards Isabelle into its form. Ask it to pin her down with a wall, so she cannot escape from anyone's assaults.

DORIAN and JULIA;
>Rush around the place, building up charges.
>Carry Julia along as you do with STORMFRONTS WALTZ.
>as soon as you see an opening, swoop Julia in, so she can inject a Cancer Bomb into Isabelle, pumping as much health as she can spare into her, before quickly pulling her away to safety.
>If Isabelle ever gets an opening, unleash all your stacks onto her.

RATH and AMARA CLONE;
>Trigger IGNITION FORM.
>Keep CALL TO ARMS UP.
>unrelenting barrage on Isabelle, as strong of hits as you can dish out.

NOVEMBER;
>Use the Shotgun, unrelenting barrage, to try and keep Isabelle prone.

AMARA CLONES;
>Main focus is on Having Halos prepared to defend everyone, Sneezes ready to go.
>otherwise, split spells, a Third focus on keeping Isabelle pinned and slowed, a Third focus on countering any spells Isabelle might try to throw out, and a Third focus buffing our team with every spell imaginable.

GINAS TEAM;
>Turn the very ground against Isabelle, keep her off her feet and on the floor.

ELOISE TEAM;
>Work to use your many tool to tear at and pin Isabelles limbs.

JOHANNAS TEAM;
>Focus on her mouths, try and make sure she can't get any Lexicon words out, distract her from it however you can.

MIDNIGHT CREW;
>Focus on aiding in keeping peoples Health and Bio up with Keanes pool network.
>focus on helping Quinn get her core activated.
>>
>>3645366
Yeah, so we definitely want to have Dorian shuttle Julia around. Even if B'Ni turns out to have immunity to electricity, too, and the stacks are useless, the speed boost for Julia is too good to not take advantage of. What form is Dorian currently in, by the way? Can we take advantage of his mode-swap bonuses?
>>
>>3645366
thank for finding them for us BHOP!
>>
>>3645409
(He's in his default form of Canvass, right now.)
>>
>>3645413
Darn, I was hoping for Creator. Get some bloodlings for free. We'll just have to swap next turn, then.
>>
>>3644964
Ammending my vote from >>3645038
to supporting>>3645404
>>
(Gentlemen, I figured you'd already know this from the Spiraling Fear encounter, but given the sheer scale of this fight crafting the posts will take some time. I appreciate your patience and planning, and I hope you day has been going well, one and all.)
>>
>>3645670
Yeah, and we've got more than twice as many participants this time around. Ooph. Take as much time as you need, BHOP.
>>
>>3644964

Alright! Let´s do this! Glad to see that we have managed to escape and bring the fight back to Isabelle.

> I vote to combine the excellent plan below:
>>3645404
> With the excellent actions of neuromantic disruption from the Binder Team outlined below:
>>3645022
Those two plans are mutually Non-exclusive, and all of the Ideas are good.

Also, I vote to ADD the following actions for SHU attacks:
> Spawn stealthed CICADALING swarmlings:
Those Swarmlings are specialized forms that disrupt CONCENTRATION-based effects. Because the core of MOTHER skills was LEXICON OF DOOM combined with NEUROMANCY & PHANTASMAL CONDUIT, almost all of B´ni most powerful skills are CONCENTRATION skills. By using a roiling storm of Cicadalings, we deny her the most powerful tools in her arsenal.

> Spawn IRON_MAIDEN combos: Spawn 4 KNIGHTED ROOKs that have each 4 GRAPPLINGS, 1 VAMPLING, 2 JACKLINGS & 4 DRILLINGS attached to their surface, all of them with recursive.
The key is that when we are hit by B´ni, instead of dying, we trigger teleport-swap with the IRON MAIDEN combo. The IRON_MAIDEN combo then Grapples B´ni, applies Exsanguinating Leash to it, and stabs it with Jacks that SHU & GINA can use for neuromancy. The drillings aplly the piercing damage Isabelle is vulnerable to.

Climatic soundtrack: "Slave Knight Gael", Dark Souls III: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AGatenT0ypg

Let´s finish this. Thanks for the ride, BHOP, and thanks a lot for organizing this wonderful confrontation. We needed a catharsis,, thanks for providing one. This is going to be one of the high points in 1d4chan RPG story, I´m sure.
>>
>>3645670

Thanks a lot dear BHOP. Take all the time that you need and thanks for all the excellent quality roleplaying you are giving us.
>>
>>3645716
(Ha, when I said that the SprialING Fear fight was the second biggest confrontation in the Quest, this possible scenario was the one that took the cake.)
>>
>>3645670
>>3645740
yeah, take your time, this is one hell of a large scale fight.
>>
>>3644964
>>3645717

Dear BHOP & Anons, Could we please use SHU & JACKIE dual-tech "KING´s ENVOY" to boost the CHITINOUS STALWART resistance, if such a thing is possible? Since we are tanking Isabelle, it would be great to have increased survivability. I guess that if not, we would be using "KING´s ENVOY" to boost HIVE MISTRESS core.

Adding those votes to >>3645717:

> Use "KING´s ENVOY" to boost our CHITINOUS STALWART resistance, maybe our HIVE MISTRESS core.

> Use swarmling slots NOT used by CICADALINGS & IRON_MAIDEN combos for recursive POLLEN-LINGs.
POLLEN-LINGs convert damage to HEALTH reserves. This way, we can heal when Isabelle is close to kill us.

What do you think, anons?
>>
>>3645765
(The effect of the Dual Tech would be directed towards Shu's Core, and would boost anything related to it, yes.)
>>
>>3645717
>Those Swarmlings are specialized forms that disrupt CONCENTRATION-based effects. Because the core of MOTHER skills was LEXICON OF DOOM combined with NEUROMANCY & PHANTASMAL CONDUIT, almost all of B´ni most powerful skills are CONCENTRATION skills. By using a roiling storm of Cicadalings, we deny her the most powerful tools in her arsenal.
Actually, I just realized that's completely unnecessary. B'Ni still has Font of Suffering. We didn't delete that one. So she can't maintain Neuromantic concentration if she has to heal. And we did delete Vitruvian Burst, so she can't suppress her healing. Any damage she takes, then, will break her concentration. She can't maintain any effect of her Neuromancy/Conduit hybrid for more than one turn.
>>
>>3645717
>>3645765
Please consider that I am ASSSUMING that the needed swarmling slots will come organically from SONG OF THE SWARM or as our swarmlings are destroyed in combat.

Right now our swarmling inventory is FULL, so consider that swarmlings in those votes would be created as new slots become available, via Amara´s SONG OF THE SWARM or death.
>>
>>3645794

I suppose this affects NEUROMANCY skills alone?
While great news, this doesn´t do anything to prevent the use of LEXICON OF DOOM or PHANTASMAL CONDUIT abilities (which were MOTHER cores, actually)

So I still recommend the use of CICADALINGS, although it is great to know that her threat level just took a noticeable hit.

Thanks for the heads-up!
>>
>>3645717
id not like to rely on that Iron Maiden but i guess if we end up having the spare actions/slots, fine.

>>3645765
id prefer Jackie to focus on boosting Keanes and Quinns abilities. im gonna have to counter-vote against that one.
>>
>>3645717
>>3645823
also the Cicadalings, i fully think our time would be better spent making other things. its a no for me on those too. your reason for spawning them also wont be an issue either.
>>
>>3645812
She can't use the Lexicon because the Geists swarm her faster than she can cast. Most Skintalker spells aren't concentration effects anyway, so it wouldn't matter much. As for the base Conduit ability, I suppose it depends on when Mother hybridized it to the Neuromancy, that would determine how scared we should be of it. Then again, she had a Sparagmos Engine and ate literally everyone, so even if she started it early she could have taken it apart later and turned it into a level twenty hybrid. Hmm. Alright, so the pure Conduit abilities might be a problem. Cicadalings could be useful there, but it still feels like a risk to invest swarmling slots in defeating that one eventuality. We've got the Cicada round for the Contender, let's just use that instead.
>>
>>3645717
>>3645823
actually, im gonna have to shoot down the Iron Maiden too. thats like over 40 goddamned swarmlng slots for that thing, not worth it at all. even with both Song and Jackie we might not get that many, and even then i dont think thats worth it over just overwhelming her with numbers and stun locking her.

so yeah sorry thats actually a big no for me.
>>
(Just arrived back at home, settled in, and have finished adding the songs that everyone's posted to the B'ni Playlist. They're magnificent, thank you for sharing. Writing now, Gentlemen.)
>>
>>3645823

Dear Anon: "KING´s ENVOY" dual-tech use to boost HIVE MISTRESS is a different skill than the core HUMORAL PALADIN skill that JACKIE is using to boost KEANE.

Since I believe that Jackie has enough ACTS left, Jackie should be able to do BOTH actions in the same turn. Is this right?

I just want something to boost our survivability/damage output. We are aggro-ing a full-power Isabelle purposefully at close-quarters combat, shouldn´t we get a survivability boost?

I am willing to drop CICADALINGS & IRON_MAIDENS for now, but I still think we should get health-regenerating POLLEN-LINGs or NOM-LINGs as slots become available through Amara´s SONG OF THE SWARM or swarmling death.

Also vote to:

> LOAD HERCULEAN & CICADA rounds in the contender, (Free Action)
> Use Jackie´s "KING´s ENVOY" dual-tech use to boost HIVE MISTRESS, ONLY if it doesn´t disrupt other anon´s plan for Jackie actions.

Thanks for your kind comments and corrections. I hope that the CICADA round can act as an emergency counter, and it is true that it is a much more economical way to disrupt concentration-based skillsets.
>>
>>3646109
well, bit late for vote changes. also any of our swarmlings can get the health pollen, we dont need a specific swarmling type for that.
>>
Back from work.
>>3646125
>>3646109
.....yeah. this fight is a fucking doozy.

I'm just wondering how this will pan out in the giant Rumor mill. the entire fleshscape and the city itself will spread word of this fight.
>>
>>3646109
Actually I think a good alternative ability to use King's Envoy on is Shu's Exsanguinating leash.
>>
>>3646182
we can try it next turn maybe. i still feel boosting Keanes network should be a priority, and if we can actually get Quinn up and running, well, as is the point of her core, she will be extremely useful. having a custom made trump card custom tailored to fight our opponent sounds like exactly the type of thing we could use right about now, and Jackie can significantly cut down on the time it takes to get that.

Plus, you know, keeping all the teams together and working in their own groups kinda how this is supposed to work to cut down on clutter and confusion.
>>
>>3646177
Should give us some good cred for when we deal with the super high-level Daughters coming in from the rest of the Crucible.

>>3646182
Yeah, that should be interesting. Exsanguinating Leash is low-key one of our strongest abilities, it just goes unnoticed because it's mostly a passive effect and hasn't had the most impressive upgrades yet. Giving it a temporary boost would make it truly a thing to be feared. But I'm with >>3646197. We need to get the Crew past their build-up phase first, then we'll upgrade the Leash.
>>
File: Dorian, Man of the Hour.jpg (297 KB, 658x1000)
297 KB
297 KB JPG
>>3644964

Your eyes are locked with Isabelle's for a moment longer as Exsanguinating Leash's scarlet thread binds you together one final time, and for a moment, all is silent.

For a single, fleeting second, the world is still. Then...

...chaos.

The roar of November's shotgun is swallowed up by Rath's battle-cry, the red-head igniting into the body of a goddess of fire and fury, shining brighter than the sun. Isabelle raises her hands towards the two of you, ignoring the constant barrage of November's plasma as it slowly accumulates on her burning form, eyes narrowed before the ground beneath her explodes with movement.The pavement twists and churns with a spiral of corrosion as acid-tipped barbs spear into and through your foe's body, the united efforts of Gina's team pinning Isabelle in place just before you lose sight of her in the waterfall of chittering phantoms that pour in from above. The space clears, and B'ni...she's gone.

Behind you, one of the Joyous Many is cleaved in half by a vicious scissor-kick, the first strike triggering a protective spear of ruined pavement to tear through B'ni's chest. She's caught, suspended above the ground for an instant before she completely unwravels, your encroaching swarm shredded when her body erupts into a flurry of golden strands, tearing your attackers and the drones hidden within them to pieces before she disperses into thin air.

Shredded by wires of gold...wires of silver, just like...

Amara chants the Song of the Swarm, and it's as you feel her power start to bolster your own that Isabelle reforms mere feet away from you, her arm splitting along the bone as a pair of golden drills lunge towards your face and your young ward's. Your world slows, your hair standing on end...and it's not because of her. A crack of thunder rolls across the city as Julia appears before you and blocks the double strike, her twin daggers glistening with bright white and coagulate red as the drills angle away...then curve in mid-air, spearing towards the back of the sculptress' head. Julia strains as she reaches out, fingers a dagger all their own as she tries to deliver the thing that will end this, a lethal payload mere inches from Isabelle's chest even as a pair of drills twist against the blonde's scalp. A flash of light, a peal of thunder and the drills disappear in the blinding flash that is Dorian's accumulated charge, a bolt of lighting matching his stunning eye blowing his target back into the spiraling cesspool, the crimson speedster standing tall before his Lady as they share a knowing glance.

(Continued)
>>
File: Rath, Burning.png (486 KB, 556x1000)
486 KB
486 KB PNG
>>3646269

B'ni's limbs fray at the joints and she's suspended, held aloft above the trap by nigh-invisible strands of her own fibromancer wire as Johanna and Eloise teams move into position. Their respectively bold and elegant leaders converge on your shared target with terrible speed as you squeeze the Contender's trigger twice in succession, the twin rounds burrowing into each of Isabelle's knees as her suspension strands falter, dropping her closer to the pit. Isabelle screams, not in frustration but in pain as her body flickers with azure, gold, and platinum light, the hexagonal scars thickening as her scream intensifies, reaching a fever pitch until...

If you were any closer, the explosion of wires and the hurricane-burst of wind would have thrown you halfway across the city, but as you drop to the ground to avoid the gale-force winds that rip through the streets of Almath you escape your deceased friends' fate by the skin of your teeth. You watch in horror as both Dream teams are hurled violently against the opposite walls, each member reduced to a fine ectoplasmic mist that immediately begins to reform. B'ni cracks a relieved smile as her body is sewn back together, one that's immediately wiped off when your Bishop kicks in and you hurtle towards her, a blur of shining chitin. Her hand is out, gleaming with a Generator's nuclear light and ready to catch you full-on before you kick off the ground, soaring harmlessly over her head as her hit narrowly misses you, your flight keeping her eyes on you...the perfect distraction.

A single, tank-annihilating punch from Rath sends Isabelle flying up the colossal walkway and deep into the pile of debris that was once Almath's pride and joy. B'ni has no time to recover as Rath lunges, her Tormentis-enhanced strength and speed clearing the space in an instant...but that speed pales in comparison to that of her barrage. Her limbs are a blur, each blindingly fast punch of her rage-fueled flurry a flicker of movement as she drives Isabelle deeper and deeper into the ruins, the very stone compressing around Rath's punching bag as the city heeds your call to action, squeezing every last ounce of air from Isabelle's lungs as she roars with agony.

A deep, shuddering boom is your only warning before the debris explodes outwards, showering the city in a hailstorm of ivory that tears into the streets and homes. Rath is thrown back, skidding painfully down the angled walkway that once led up to the peerless spire. You watch as Isabelle darts down the path, forming and re-forming from space to space as she tries desperately to put out Rath's immortal flames with some trick of her Fibromancy. She's distracted, rightfully so by the bright white flares that boil the along the length of her torso, robbing her of skin as the eternal flames prove quite impossible to extinguish...she doesn't realize you're right in her face until her eyes snap up just as your drill makes contact with her skull.

(Continued)
>>
>>3646280

Your eight other arms bring their screaming drills digging into Isabelle's chest, plunging the flares deeper as the drill that is your right hand struggles to pierce deeper into B'ni's ear, straining against something impossibly dense. Her hands move, and you fling yourself back in time to dodge the shining kick that carves a sizzling line in your chestplate. Her greaves shine with burning light, and you watch as Rath's flares are eaten piecemeal by the small mouths inside her body that chatter and gnaw away at the offending flames, the gaping wounds knit back together by the bizzarely ravenous power. A chill creeps up your limbs, and it's with a start that you disengage your hundred-handed, the arms shattering upon the ground before the crawling sheet of ice could move to your true body.

[Gina, Isabelle's pulling out Generator moves and I think I just saw a Gluttonous countermeasure] You say, your reformed allies gathering behind you. [Why didn't that come up on the initial scan?]

{Shit, she's getting access to more of Mother's skills an arsenal as her body acclimates} She responds, cords withdrawing as she sends out a fresh pulse of orders to her team while struggling to scan her old friend for the new tricks she can bring to bear.

{Fuck, hold on...okay, got it. Here!}

>>Generator Skill Trees: Online
>>Threat: Ice - Single Target Reactive, Cumulative | Wind - AOE Burst, Maximum Knockback | Plasma - Melee, high Critical Threat.

>>Gluttonous Skill Tree: Online
>>Threat: Elemental Digestion. Absorption lasts one round, then resets.

"The times we shared! The journey we took!" Isabelle screams, her calm facade utterly broken, torn to shreds by your defiant resistance. "Why?! WHY DID YOU GIVE ME HOPE?! WHO GAVE YOU THE FUCKING RIGHT TO GIVE ME HOPE THAT YOU'D JUST TEAR AWAY?!"

You can feel your prepared allies flinch as Isabelle slams her fist against her head, fingers frantically tearing into her own scalp as another streak of silver slithers into her hair.

"I want them OUT, goddammit! Those moments, those people!" She howls with rage and suffering, her fingers squelching into her grey matter she tears a trio of gems free of her very mind. "Take it back! I don't want it SO FUCKING TAKE IT BACK!"

She throws the gems to the ground, and you all collectively pull back, watching them blossom into three forms, each of them a pale mockery of...

...oh, god.

(Continued)
>>
File: A Misremembered Past.jpg (401 KB, 885x1204)
401 KB
401 KB JPG
>>3646284

Three young women, each of them twisted in form and hideously thin take shape from the compressions of biomass, unfurling into horribly familiar forms. The first is bend backwards at a right angle by her waist, her blank, drooling face half-covered by unkempt blonde hair as her torso roils with a rotting, slavering tongue ringed by a mouth of broken, jagged teeth. The second is little more than skin and bones, no thicker than the blade she wields, her every movement coming out as a stilted, sharp thing, like a fencer rendered in stop-motion. The third and final one is what ends a disgusted chill down Gina's spine; a frail girl stuck in a wheelchair of calcite and gristle, her eyeless sockets staring out at nothingness as countless eyes blink along her emaciated form.

"Take it! Take all of it!" Isabelle screeches past the disgusting caricatures. "I'LL TEAR IT ALL OUT UNTIL I'M HAPPY! EVERY LAST PIECE OF YOU!"

This is it. This is how Mother conquered a city, and brought a people to their knees.

>>RAVENOUS GRIN, LE CHEVALIER DE'SQUELETTE, & THE JEALOUS WATCHER: SUMMONED
>>THREAT: Titan-Class, each.

Through word...and memory, made manifest.

HP: 650% (+35%, Matrons Stoicism, Ignition Gauntlets, Whistle: CUNT TER RHO)
BIO: 690% (+60%, 19 Rook-Platelings, Recursive [You/Rath/Julia/November: Armored], 3 Quad Knighted-Grapplings, 2 Jacklings, 2 Scarlet Drones, 3 Bishops [Shu, Rath, Julia], 2 Recursive Bane-Drillings, 32/44)
CONTENDER: Empty, Sword Form.
RAVENOUS MAW: Primed.
HUNDRED-HANDED: None.
ACT: 3/3

RATH HP: 774% (IGNITION, Sui Tormentis, Gutgrab Daggers, 2400% ATK+, 2400% SPD+, 2400% DEF+)
JULIA HP: 842% (20%, Hydras Heart, Manus Caelorum, 20 Daggers, BLOODY RIPPER x 2)
DORIAN HP: 360% (125%, Cursas Alas, CHARGE x2)
AMARA HP: 440% (100%, SONG OF THE SWARM)
NOVEMBER HP: 940% (Tier 1 Core)

Team Gina: Uzu, Bella, and Kosi - DESTABILIZE
Team Eloise: Sasha, Holly, and Soroitas - LIMBS (Next Respawn Duration: 1 Round)
Team Johanna: Hera, Gemma, and Niku - MOUTHS (Next Respawn Duration: 1 Round)
Midnight Crew: Support Network Active, Quinn: 12% Efficacy.

ISABELLE: Cataclysmic, and growing. IMMUNE: Heat, Slashing, Blunt. ABSORB: Radiant, Heat. B.33 Detonation: 2 Rounds. MALLEABLE FLESH x3
RAVENOUS GRIN, LE CHEVALIER DE'SQUELETTE, & THE JEALOUS WATCHER: Retaliatory, primed to strike.

YOU ARE IN CONTROL
>>
(Gentlemen, voting shall remain open for the next twelve hours, with voting to resume in fourteen. I shall be around for a while longer this evening to address any questions, concerns, and criticisms you may have, and I welcome them all. Thank you so very much for your time and patience, and I hope you have a restful evening.)
>>
>>3646289
whew...ok yeah i really have no idea how were supposed to fight this. but ill think of something.

>>3646300
hey, whats the DESTABILIZED mean for Ginas team? the other two are reforming, no, but then whats the difference?
>>
>>3646300

Battle theme when Shu 1v1s her:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zyADNaIGBaI

Shu's Theme songs:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b40mZVnQCTs

Midnight Crew's possible themes:
When they're in the groove to show off:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v08Qfrj07jA
When Sepulchritude is used.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RbWZByi7cRc

Amara's theme:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JIZ12EQ2SFg

Dorian's theme:
The Lyrics are somewhat fitting, but it fits because he's just that melodramatic.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fDY-PxP-2CU

A theme fitting for an elergy of those who died in the Crucible, also a fitting theme when the Crucible ends and begins that process of restarting.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yIzfXPEQphY

Also, mother of all FUCKS. We can't kill them, they're our dream daughters, we need to Stabilize them somehow.
Did... Did Isabelle warp Gina, Kosi, and Eloise into amalgam constructs? How do we save them?
>>
>>3646316
actually one of them seems to be Holly oddly enough. the whole mouth thing is clearly her, not Gina.
>>
>>3646269
>Julia strains as she reaches out, fingers a dagger all their own as she tries to deliver the thing that will end this, a lethal payload mere inches from Isabelle's chest even as a pair of drills twist against the blonde's scalp. A flash of light, a peal of thunder and the drills disappear in the blinding flash that is Dorian's accumulated charge, a bolt of lighting matching his stunning eye blowing his target back into the spiraling cesspool, the crimson speedster standing tall before his Lady as they share a knowing glance.
So I'm a little unclear, did Julia manage to deliver the payload?

>>3646315
>hey, whats the DESTABILIZED mean for Ginas team? the other two are reforming, no, but then whats the difference?
I think those are meant to be their orders. Gina's team keeps B'Ni unstable, Eloise's team targets her limbs, Johanna's team targets her mouth.

Anyways, what's the gold and silver wire supposed to be? It's clearly important and Shu seems to recognize it. The only thing I can think of is that the empathic link-severing technology that Francine created takes the form of gold and silver wire, but how would B'Ni get that and why would it be manifesting? Doesn't really fit.
>>
>>3646327
actually, yeah, i think that makes sense. first three(dead) Daughters we ever ran into, shes working her way from the beginning forward i think.
>>
>>3646331
its the Fibromancer statues ability. Isabelle has all the Statues abilities...because im thinking mother killed and consumed them at some point now.

well, ok, maybe not all of the, but she has the Fibromancers so she clearly did probably consume them.
>>
>>3646316
>Also, mother of all FUCKS. We can't kill them, they're our dream daughters, we need to Stabilize them somehow.
>Did... Did Isabelle warp Gina, Kosi, and Eloise into amalgam constructs? How do we save them?
I'm pretty sure they're just constructs in the image of our friends. That's why they're so twisted, because they reflect B'Ni's memories and she is a very unreliable narrator. In theory they'll dissipate on their own, B'Ni can't maintain Neuromantic concentration past the end of this next turn. In practice, they might not count as concentration effects anymore with how high-level the skill is.
>>
>>3646331
Isabelle consumed West Gamma remember? West Gamma's core ability was Neuromancy Wires that shocks and disrupts targets it touches like a Jellyfish Stinger. Isabelle must've picked it up.
>>
>>3646315
(Ah, I thought this may need some clarification; The capitalized terms, DESTABILIZE, LIMBS, MOUTHS, are what each team is currently prioritizing, and unless changed they'll continue to do their damnedest to accomplish those goals.)

(All the teams are currently intact, as it was their first 'true' combat regen, so the next time one of those teams goes down it will take one full round for them to get back up, as opposed to a half-round like it did this time.)

>>3646316
>>3646327
(These things you're fighting are the result of Mother's Neuromancer/Conduit Hybrid; they're not the Dream Daughters themselves, but rather elaborate and powerful constructs based on the user's experiences and ideas.)

>>3646343
(She consumed the original versions of the Fibromancer and the Generator you fought, yes. The silver-gold strands are the former's ability.)

>>3646331
(She did not since she missed, but it's still primed on Julia, so nothing's been wasted and no health has been spent yet.)
>>
>>3646343
I'm not sure about that. The way she's using it is like how Vultha did, sure. But Vultha's fibers weren't metallic. It feels like the color is being emphasized too much for it to not be important.

>>3646347
Huh. Maybe. Why did she never manifest that ability before, though? Unless West Gamma implanted it as some sort of time-release assimilation method and we're going to get a second hijack of the boss fight role as West takes over.
>>
>>3646359
alright, thanks for the clarifications.

>>3646365
BHOP post swiped you a bit there with answers.
>>
>>3646344
(You're correct that they don't count as concentration effects any more. Much like the later stages of the Joyous Many, these things are completely autonomous and require no concentration to maintain.)

>>3646365
(It was simply to emphasize that it's Vultha's power. The golden hue is Isabelle/Mother's twist on the power, while the silver ones are the color of Vultha's original ability, to clarify.)
>>
>>3646375
>(You're correct that they don't count as concentration effects any more. Much like the later stages of the Joyous Many, these things are completely autonomous and require no concentration to maintain.)
Ah, nards. Guess we need to kill them the old-fashioned way. Though maybe have Gina hijack one of them. I want to use that construct-hijacking ability at some point, and we have the perfect opportunity right now. Hijack your own creepy doppleganger, Gina, it will be fun.

>(It was simply to emphasize that it's Vultha's power. The golden hue is Isabelle/Mother's twist on the power, while the silver ones are the color of Vultha's original ability, to clarify.)
Oh, okay. The way they were manifesting, it felt almost like they were some sort of creeping corruption or slow transformation, and I thought it might be significant. Never mind.
>>
>>3646316
(Also, I'll have you know that about half these songs are on the playlist. I'm glad we share such similar tastes in music, and I have to say your pick for Dorian's theme made me chuckle.)
>>
>>3646395
Question: If Isabelle consumed Ozmas, and Ozmas had consumed the original abilities of the Twelve ascendants (minus Charon), does that mean Isabelle consumed the dreamdaughter states of the Twelve?
>>
>>3646404
(She did not, I'm afraid. Also, Mother only consumed four of the other Chosen, while Charon consumed the other five. The last was destroyed quite deliberately.)
>>
>>3646414
But the fact that Vultha's original abilities are there means that Ozmas consumed Vultha, Silvis, and the Gluttonous Ascendant. Therefore Vultha and Silvis's dreamdaughter state "should" be present inside Isabelle. can you confirm?
>>
>>3646414
Huh. I wonder which they felt couldn't be risked having in their dreamscape. The Neuromantic Ascendant, maybe? Well, I'm sure we'll find out once we finally get the chance to read their journals.

>>3646429
You only get the people that you yourself have eaten, not anyone they might have. The other Ascendants might have been locked up in Ozmas' corpse, but they're gone now.
>>
>>3646414
>>3646429
(My apologies, I mis-typed as I was addressing the fact that she did not have all ten within her. Yes, the four Mother devoured are now within Isabelle, you are correct.)
>>
>>3646444
Huh, really? I guess that's another bit of weirdness resulting from how Mother prepared her corpse for consumption, then. We should try to nab them with the Arbiter's Appetite, then.
>>
>>3646441
(They are in her because of the unique nature of her Acceptance Consume option. Also, there's too much good lore to go to waste, otherwise.)
>>
>>3646453
>Activate the Nuero Stun from your Halo through the Leash.
That doesn't work, I've asked BHOP about using Neuromancy through the Leash before and he said not at our current level. We'd need to get a proper jack in. Let's do that instead of stabbing with the Contender, stab her with a jack.

I'd also like to try to take over one of the Constructs. Let's make sure that one of the Scarlet Drones winds up on the Jealous Watcher, so Gina can take over her doppleganger while it's distracted fending off Johanna.
>>
>>3646453
>use your Strand and Arms, spawning what you need, to help dies up and condense down Isabelle so she cant escape or expand.
Oh, and we need to turn off Ignition, B'Ni is absorbing heat damage this turn. It would just heal her.
>>
>>3646483
the Jealous watcher is Kosi, hence the wheelchair.

also, really? then whats the point of giving the Leash the ability to do touch effects through it? damn it really is wholly wasted on Shu honestly in my opinion.

I wanted the contender because
>Piercing Damage
>getting the shots off for more damage potentially.
>Speeding up the BBs to both slow her down and hinder her regen.

but you're right, if Leash is that outright useless then aiming to put a jack in her to give Julia her opening is our better bet.

>>3646496
true aswell.
>>
>>3646483
>>3646453
Observations of Isabelle's actions:

1st Action: Teleport behind Shu (either by super speed or a Tindalos styled Teleport) and Scissor kick decapitation.
2nd Action: Fibromancer drills in an attempt to drill through Shu's Skull
3rd Action: Ice-type Generator Cumulative Explosion. Nature similar to Frozen Fury.
4th Action: Generator Plasma Melee attack
5th Action: Gluttonous Elemental Digestion:
6th Action: Greave kick.
7th Action: Summon Memory Constructs Neuromancy/Phantasmal Conduit Hybrid

Gentlemen. I've analyzed Isabelle's moves from the opening round. She has 7 Actions, 1 more from her previous Six due to taking the "Acceptance" option when consuming Ozma's corpse.
>>
>>3646289
right, Orders with some little changes, apologizes for any bamboozles.;

SHU;
>Load up two Full-Bores.
>send the Grapplings forward, and have them explode into Arm nets, made to take and keep pushing back against the strands, spawning more arms to keep pushing them back.
>rush forward, and try and get a jab in with a Jack, spawn a swarm of them if necessary, to make sure one sticks, so you can get off the stun.
>have your Jacklings and Crimsons go and stun the new Constructs.

RATH;
>Turn off Ignition.
>use your Strand and Arms, spawning what you need, to help tie up and condense down Isabelle so she can't escape or expand.

JULIA and DORIAN;
>Dorian, move along more and build up new charges as Julia rides along with Waltz again.
>Have Julia toss her throwing Daggers at the Constructs as she rides with Dorian.
>As soon as Shu presses the arm cage and activates her Stun through the leash, Dorian needs to drop down Julia and shift to Critic Form, spawning as many limbs as he can to help hold down and cut Julia a path so she may inject the Cancer Bomb.
>If things get dicey and there's no other option to keep Isabelle back, Dorian should Fire off his charges.

AMARA PRIME;
>keep up SONG OF THE SWARM.
>Use your second Action as GRA SUTH CUNT(Greater Soothe Enemy) as soon as Julia needs her opening, to force Isabelles guard to lower.

AMARA CLONES;
>One Fifth should focus again on splitting.
>One Fourth of the rest should focus solely on defending others With Halos and Queen.
>One Fourth should be primed and ready to counter and of Isabelles Spells.
>One Fourth should be buffing our allies with everything they can.
>the Last fourth should consolidate in an area, and bide their time. The minute they get their opening, rush Isabelle and unleash a hailstorm of sneezes on her, using up both their Acts to let loose a storm of death upon her.

NOVEMBER;
>Switch target to the new Constructs and try and keep each of them pinned with a shotgun blast.

ALMATH;
>feel the anger, and desperation of the party. As soon as Julia needs her opening, and not a moment sooner, unleash yours and our families wrath on Isabelle, sucking her down and holding her open for the deadly package.

TEAM GINA;
>Switch focus to the Constructs, get them off their feet and disoriented before they can react.

TEAM ELOISE;
>Go after the LE CHEVALIER, end this insult to Eloise, aswell as the fact Eloise will know how best to counter it.

TEAM JOHANA;
>Go after the JEALOUS WATCHER, your sheer brutality and bulk should allow you to press past its defenses to where it is much weaker up close.

MIDNIGHT CREW;
>Go after the RAVENOUS GRIN, your plethora of Constructs and ability to switch around to get up close should be able to overwhelm her singular tongue and mouth.
>>
>>3646500
>the Jealous watcher is Kosi, hence the wheelchair.
I got the impression she was a hybrid of Kosi and Gina, like it was B'Ni's twisted perspective mashing them together in her head. But maybe that's just me reading too much into the missing eyes, I associate that with Gina. Did Kosi not have eyes, and that's why she took Gina's? It's been so long, I can't remember. I just remember the "stop looking at me with pity" part.

Eh, either way, I think we'd do well to hijack one of those constructs. And the Watcher would be an ideal one for Gina. It's probably got Kosi's ranged attacks, so it will help with Gina staying on the back line.

>>3646501
I think that you've got the number right, but some of those ACTs are probably from her having maxed-out skills from Mother. B'Ni should have lost some ACTs when we deleted some of her own maxed-out abilities, so she's having to get back up to full and then get the Acceptance bonus.
>>
(Gentlemen, my apologies. Your HEALTH should read as follows due to the effects of Exsanguinating Leash.)

HP: 650% (+465%, Matrons Stoicism, Ignition Gauntlets, Whistle: CUNT TER RHO)

>>3646500
(The Leash will gain the ability to utilize the touch-based abilities of other trees later, just not at Lvl 3. That reminds me, I've been meaning to go back and modify that piece of text, as at its current level it actively excludes only Neuromancer and Phantasmal Conduit powers so as to not be completely broken.)
>>
>>3646526
>>3646533
If we're firing Fullbores into Isabelle, have them Drill through Isabelle's head and extract the memory gems that Isabelle plans to use and summon. Stop Isabelle from weaponizing her lobotomied memories.

Also, judging by the apparent Chronological order that Isabelle is apparently doing a twisted form of Amnesia Lobotomy,
The construct list Isabelle summons will be in this order after Kosi:
>Bella Nervosa
>Catherine, The Sleeping Terror
>Carla, The Dream eater
>Hecaton, the hundred handed.
>West Gamma
The Following is from the fight on the beach.
>Shu, The Betrayer
>Gina
>Dorian
>Rath
>Julia
>Amara
>>
>>3646533
well, Gina cant do it, and Shu is kinda busy. im not sure its actually a guaranteed thing to take it either? and id imagine they have high resistances to being taken control of.

>>3646542
post what you want and ill update its entry in the character sheets.
>>
>>3646542
Do the Geists attacking Isabelle wear down her health regen, or is it just constant scratch damage that makes nullifies the amount of health regenerated?
>>
>>3646555
we no longer plan to do that.
well, actually wait, Shu should still have a free action, so she COULD still stab with the Contender and send the Jacks from her wrist once she make the opening, no?
>>
>>3646555
>>3646570
actually, should we fire some Parabellums into her instead of Fullbores, or do you think her armors too thick and her form too malleable to rely on them being able to get in and stay in?
>>
>>3646567
(It's constant scratch damage, so you're still benefiting from her total health regen number while she's taking constant damage.)
>>
>>3646570
Even if it's a bad time to pull this plan off, I have a harebrained idea.
B'ni has secluded mind which prevents consumed dream daughters from interfering/interacting through the host body. What if we disabled Secluded Mind and had the other Chosen Ascendants (that Ozmas consumed) pull a internal rebellion?
>>
>>3646555
Don't forget Gretchen. That's in between Hecaton and Gamma. So we might have a construct that spawns constructs. Definitely want to shut this down before it gets to that point.

I'm not sure damaging B'Ni's head will do it, though. I think she's forming them on the spot, congealing them out of her memories instead of already having them in there. What we need is to lock down B'Ni's ability, but that works at random so we can't reliably target the memory-clone power.

>>3646563
>well, Gina cant do it, and Shu is kinda busy. im not sure its actually a guaranteed thing to take it either? and id imagine they have high resistances to being taken control of.
Why can't Gina do it? She's the one with the ability to hijack constructs, Neuromancy level seven. And yeah, they probably have high resistances, but even if they resist it will still stun them, so it's not a huge loss.

>>3646590
I don't think it's too malleable, but the elemental consumption skill seems to work on more abstract damage types, too. B'Ni is absorbing the B.33 damage now, so I think if we put a Parabellum in her she'd just be able to absorb the "eaten from the inside by parasites" damage type and get some health back from its constantly biting at her. You know what might actually work? Hollowpoint Hive. We haven't used those in a while. But they'd tag B'Ni with something we can deploy swarmlings directly onto her from. Very effective against such a mobile opponent.
>>
>>3646602
Related question: If this fight goes on for long enough, are they going to manifest as reinforcements?
>>
>>3646609
If we goad them into action with the right words that is, maybe yes.
>>
>>3646602
we cant control what we deactivate so i dont think its worth the risk. shes probably got an absolute tone of passive or augment powers too, so our odds of even locking down something useful is minimal.

>>3646606
because we cant command individuals and id prefer her to focus on helping take down all the constructs, not roll the dice on taking over just one and leaving the rest to do as they please more.

also i dont see anything saying the BBs are being absorbed.
>>
>>3646609
>>3646618
actually where ARE the zombie Daughters? they still are dream daughters, so they shouldn't be able to die like ours. and while they may not be allies, they would still attack Isabelle if around.
>>
>>3646627
>Shu's Original hp regen: 35%
>Shu's hp regen after Leash: 465%
>Difference: 430%
>Isabelle's original hp regen rate: 1290%
>Isabelle's hp regen rate after leash: 860%

Good question.

>>3646542
Bhop, where did the Zombie daughters go?
And do the Midnight Crew have dream daughters of their own that they can summon?
>>
>>3646620
(The B.33 Rounds were not eaten, as they did not take priority for the Gluttonous ability B'ni currently has.)

>>3646627
(If you'll indulge the rather obscure meme...)

(Oh lord, they comin'.)
>>
>>3646620
>because we cant command individuals and id prefer her to focus on helping take down all the constructs, not roll the dice on taking over just one and leaving the rest to do as they please more.
No, but we can incentivize it by giving her the tools to do the cool thing. And we are going to take down all of them, the rest of the orders aren't going to be countermanded. We're still going to have all the constructs knocked about by Gina's team and attacked by Eloise, Johanna, and the Crew's groups. It's just that Johanna's fight with the Watcher might end early because we'll have taken it over. Gina has enough acts to do it anyway. She'll spend on act on destabilizing the constructs with a terraforming action, then have another left over to do other things with. Why not give it a shot?

>also i dont see anything saying the BBs are being absorbed.
Yeah, that's my fault, I misread the stat block. Read a period as a comma. Never mind, sorry. I do still like the idea of tagging her with a Hollowpoint Hive, though. One Parabellum and one Hive sound good?

>>3646647
>(The B.33 Rounds were not eaten, as they did not take priority for the Gluttonous ability B'ni currently has.)
Yeah, again, sorry. Misread the stat block, thought the B.33s were in the "ABSORBED" group.
>>
>>3646647
I understood that reference.
They CHONKY
>>
>>3646647
>(Oh lord, they comin'.)
They've turned into morbidly obese cats? What a horrible fate.
>>
>>3646643
(Isabelle's stats are very different on account of Mother's absorption.)

>>3646643
(They dispersed once they lost B'ni's scent...but rest assured they have it once more.)

(Regarding the Midnight Crew, they have no real relationship with their Dream Daughters, so while they can and will manifest, they'd be content to staying on the sidelines unless it looks like one of their hosts get into trouble.)

>>3646659
(No worries about the misread, I'll arrange it to make it more clear.)
>>
>>3646647
hrm, well, i think we might be throwing enough at her to distract it again. maybe. hard to tell, as it says 'elemental' but the BBs arent really an elemental attack, and neither really is anything else we are throwing at her this turn.

>they comin
oh boy.

>>3646659
i honestly dont like the hive round, not really useful in my opinion. and i do like the other Anons idea of trying to rip those gems out of her head early, which the Fullbore might do quicker. then again, the Parabellums wouldn't need to be aimed, only hit, but they would do it alot slower and might not get to them in time.

but then again again, the Parabellums might distract from her eating the BBs....which still makes no sense, as the ability says its elemental absorption, which neither are elemental damage at their base.
>>
>>3646698
(To clarify; her Gluttonous power revolves around the consumption and use of elemental damage types, not piercing, slashing, or blunt 'physical' attacks. She will be unable to absorb the B.33 Rounds, as a result.)
>>
>>3646712
ah, ok, thanks for the clarification.
>>
>>3646712
>>3646698
Hmmm.... Now that I think about it, Isabelle's apparent kit (so far) revolves around being a Wizard that uses Generator, skintalker, Phantasmal conduit and Neuromancy abilities for Offense, while using gluttonous, and fibromancer abilities to tank through cutting, crushing, and a variety of common elemental damage. Basically a min-maxed Mage who invested in Magical resistances. But now isabelle has Marrow Hound added to the mix so she's now a speedy Mage who can tank elemental and common forms of physical damage, but is still vulnerable to the stabbings and beatings.
>>
>>3646723
I just remembered, We still have that GODDAMNED UZI. hose bullets are pure piercing damage. We need to hand it to November Asap!
>>
>>3646764
i think November already has it.
>>
>>3646768
Yeah, she's been wielding it since the Phalanges.
>>
>>3646768
It's not listed on the status sheet.
>>3646712
Bhop, does November still have the Goddamned Uzi?
>>
>>3646764
>>3646771
so Parabellums or Fullbores? i can see merit in both so im honestly fine with either.

anything else on the plan to discuss?

>>3646776
i think he just forgot, same with the Fact Amara has the one Skintalker Relic.
>>
>>3646780
Fullbores. They can wreak havoc on Isabelle's internals, not to mention that if she tries to jam a finger inside her head to pull out a memory gem, we can have the Fullbores chop off her prying fingers and prevent her from summoning more. And she'll have to spend actions trying to purge them.
>>
>>3646776
(You're goddamned right.)

>>3646780
(I did, and thanks for the reminder. I'll put both on the status sheet.)

(Also of note on Amara's VOCEM VIRTUTIS:)

>>Vocem Virtutis enhances two words instantly when equipped, while the user also chooses another word to reduce to 0% BIO and 0 ACT costs. Additionally, the wearer is granted one additional ACT per turn, though it may only be used to activate the effects of the user's Lexicon.)
>>
>>3646780
>so Parabellums or Fullbores? i can see merit in both so im honestly fine with either.
I'd say Parabellums. Fullbores are so big that against something human-sized they're kind of wasted. They'll blast right through, major overpenetration. Parabellums are small enough to lodge in there.

And no, otherwise I think the plan is good. Only thing I can think is that we might want to prime our Halo when we go rushing in to stab B'Ni, just in case.
>>
>>3646796
Does anybody remember which words we enhanced? I know we chose way back against the Phalanges, but I can't rightly recall. I think we made CUNT free and enhanced GRA and...something else?
>>
>>3646796
yeah, but i thought we already had that set?

>>3646800
...i cant remember, which is why i kinda hoped BHOP had it written down haha.

>>3646797
>>3646785
well, this helped me none at all.
>>
>>3646800
>>3646803
(No one ever chimed in given that the Phalanx hit immediately after, so those options are still open if you'd like to fill them.)
>>
>>3646819
would enhancing CUNT or THA actually do anything?
>>
>>3646819
Really, we never got around to it? Then I'd like to propose enhancing GRA and RHO and making CUNT free.
>>
>>3646800
I think we voted to have the relic Enhance GRA and FOL, Gra's amplification effects get double amplification, and Rho's concentration effects is doubled boosting resistances and enhancing disruption.
As for the Free word...maybe Sel. Or Cunt. The Former is an expensive word that allows Amara do perform Counterspells for free. As for the latter, we frequently use it. I'll say we make Sel a Free word. It's a phrase that allows Amara to cast a reflexive counter spell without having to spend 25% bio.

>>3646796
Is it possible to change which word becomes a free word by de-equipping it and re-equipping it? or does it go through the process of atunement in order to reset?

Also, of the following words: what are their amplified effects? We would like to know so we can make a sound judgement.
>sel
>rho
>san
>Suth
>tha
>cunt
>fol
>ter
>Gra
>Rev
>Shi
>>
>>3646835
i agree with enhancing GRA and making CUNT free, however while it is unlikely, if CUNT can be enhanced id prefer it as the second choice.
>>
>>3646846
i think its just the same effects but stronger Anon.
>>
>>3646825
(Indeed. They would be upgraded to CUNT* and THA*, with any strings using those words having their effects enhanced one level. When they reach their fifth upgrade, which is their maximum(such as THA*5), then the speaker may use them as either single or multi-target attacks at will without using additional words to expand the effects.)

>>3646846

>sel: Auto-counter now has a small chance to completely nullify the move that triggered it, forcing the opponent to waste the ACT or ACTs that prompted said counter.

>rho: Enhanced effect.

>san: Increases resistance against broken concentration and feedback effects.

>Suth: now has a small chance to make the target switch the focus of their aggression, as they forget their anger towards their current foe.

>tha: Enhanced effect.

>cunt: Enhanced effect.

>fol: Small chance to impose penalty on subsequent attempts to concentrate on disrupted effects.

>ter: You may now choose a medium or large area of ground to be effected.

>Gra: effects are now tripled.

>Rev: ???

>Shi: Enhanced effect, word string now counts as one level higher when comparing against the offending Skintalker.)
>>
>>3646881
(I hope this helps a bit, Gentlemen. I am afraid I must turn in for the evening, so I hope you all rest well and have a good night's sleep.)
>>
>>3646887
lovely, helps alot, though doesn't change my thoughts. get some rest, and thank you for running.

my votes for;
>Enhance GRA
>Enhance CUNT
>Make CUNT free.
>>
>>3646289
>>3646526
updated Voting Orders;

SHU;
>Load up a Parabellum and a Fullbore.
>spawn another Jackling and Crimson.
>Spawn more Grapplings to fill out your roster.
>send the Grapplings forward, and have them explode into Arm nets, made to take and keep pushing back against the strands, spawning more arms to keep pushing them back.
>Prime our Halo.
>Rush Forward, stabbing forward with the Contender and sending both shots into her, with intent to dig into her head and rip out any construct gems she is creating.
>once you get close, try and get a jab in with a Jack, spawn a swarm of them if necessary, to make sure one sticks, so you can get off the stun.
>have your Jacklings go and stun the new Constructs.
>Have the Crimsons jack into the new Constructs to give Gina access to them.

RATH;
>Turn off Ignition.
>use your Strand and Arms, spawning what you need, to help tie up and condense down Isabelle so she can't escape or expand.

JULIA and DORIAN;
>Dorian, move along more and build up new charges as Julia rides along with Waltz again.
>Have Julia toss her throwing Daggers at the Constructs as she rides with Dorian.
>As soon as Shu presses the arm cage and activates her Stun, Dorian needs to drop down Julia and shift to Critic Form, spawning as many limbs as he can to help hold down and cut Julia a path so she may inject the Cancer Bomb.
>Have them Prime their Halos as they go in.
>If things get dicey and there's no other option to keep Isabelle back, Dorian should Fire off his charges.

AMARA PRIME;
>keep up SONG OF THE SWARM.
>Use your second Action as GRA SUTH CUNT(Greater Soothe Enemy) as soon as Julia needs her opening, to force Isabelles guard to lower.

AMARA CLONES;
>One Fifth should focus again on splitting.
>One Fourth of the rest should focus solely on defending others With Halos and Queen.
>One Fourth should be primed and ready to counter and of Isabelles Spells.
>One Fourth should be buffing our allies with everything they can.
>the Last fourth should consolidate in an area, and bide their time. The minute they get their opening, rush Isabelle and unleash a hailstorm of sneezes on her, using up both their Acts to let loose a storm of death upon her.

NOVEMBER;
>Switch target to the new Constructs and try and keep each of them pinned with a shotgun blast.

(1/2)
>>
>>3646900
>>3646289
ALMATH;
>feel the anger, and desperation of the party. As soon as Julia needs her opening, and not a moment sooner, unleash yours and our families wrath on Isabelle, sucking her down and holding her open for the deadly package.

TEAM GINA;
>Switch focus to the Constructs, get them off their feet and disoriented before they can react.
>Secondary focus on hijacking the constructs through the Crimson Drones.

TEAM ELOISE;
>Go after the LE CHEVALIER, end this insult to Eloise, aswell as the fact Eloise will know how best to counter it.

TEAM JOHANA;
>Go after the JEALOUS WATCHER, your sheer brutality and bulk should allow you to press past its defenses to where it is much weaker up close.

MIDNIGHT CREW;
>Go after the RAVENOUS GRIN, your plethora of Constructs and ability to switch around to get up close should be able to overwhelm her singular tongue and mouth.

(2/2)
>>
>>3646906
Okay, this is crazy, but hear me out. the following will be my theoretical moves that I would pull if I was Isabelle.

Since the Constructs are Autonomous: Isabelle won't have to spend actions.
And because Isabelle might not take into account of the Zombie Horde, this is what Isabelle would do without factoring in:
>1st Act: Now that the playing field is evened out, Attack Shu, Fibromancy movement to get the drop on her
>2nd Act: Use Fibromancy Wires to shred any defense Shu has on her person. probe for more defenses
>3rd Act: Find an ability from Ozma's arsenal that helps deal with Shu's persistence and test it out. Defensive ability if overwhelmed by Shu's offense, Offensive ability if Shu leaves you alone long enough.
>4th Act: Spawn Doppelgangers, divide and conquer, have the clones Target any one of the Dream teams or straggling daughters that are fighting the constructs if given the opportunity, maneuver over to there and use the Generator ability to wipe them out.
>5th Act: Use the Generator melee to kill the straggler.
>6th Act: Reposition yourself.
>7th Act: If any constructs fall or still stand, Dig into your skull, pull out more memory Gems, summon more Titan-constructs.


I know it's theoretical, but we should plan around something like what I've posted. It might not be 100% accurate, but it's a good way to get into the mindset of the opponent and try to devise counter strategies.
>>
>>3646925
i personally feel my plan deals with that well enough.
>>
>>3646289
>"You can tear your brain out until all you can remember are the happy moments Isabelle, you can run away or deny the memories all you like, but you can't run away from the past, because in the end, the past will catch up one way or another."
>"There will always be something that will remind you of the past and make you remember all of it. Both the good and the bad. A misheard name, a gesture, an item shaped like a lava lamp. simple things that bring up cherished memories; like meeting each other at Kindergarden, and murdering your friend by smashing her face in with a lava lamp."
>"Let go of the past Isabelle. I am not Sam. Sam is dead. I am Shu. I've faced my past, acknowledged it, and moved on instead of letting it cling to me like a ghost."
>>
>>3646289
>>3647113

Dorian and Julia:
>Lead with delivering the Cancerous Payload, then follow up with a barrage of attacks to increase the Malleable flesh stacks. Also, activate Depressive weight if it isn't active already.
>Both of you will need to prime your halos as a free action:
>When Julia makes her move and after Almath has pinned Isabelle down, Once Julia has delivered the payload, Switch to Critic form to block any incoming attack that Isabelle tries to throw at you as a free action and Flare the fear aura to ensure that any retaliatory strike is canceled by an immediate attempt to flee.

November:
>Team up with Rath. Provide ranged fire support, your choice of weaponry, if it's against the constructs, use plasma weaponry, if it's against Isabelle, use the Uzi, but make your shots count.
>bodyblock any cold/ice based attacks. your body has immunity.
>>
>>3646289

>Team Gina: Disrupt, Lockdown, Disable. Disrupt Isabelle's actions anything that looks like she's about to pull something big. Lockdown an ability tree that hampers her combat ability, Disable her movement. Isabelle is bound to move about with her Fibromancy movement, so trap/restrict her options to make her Fibromancy movement options very limited and pointless. Terraform lots of hooks and loops in hopes of making Isabelle hit a snag or tangle herself on a field of velcro.

>Team Johanna, Team Eloise, Midnight Crew: Attack on Titan time.
>>
I always felt this soundtrack went well with the quest: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DKCrkg7Kcdc
>>
>>3646289
Supporting >>3646900
>>3646906

with some extra smacktalk>>3647113
>>
>>3647113
I'd rather remain silent. We're not going to get through to B'Ni, so the only value of talking is to keep her too upset and irrational to be making smart decisions. But I think that remaining completely silent in the face of her ranting would actually do a better job of that. Just Shu completely refusing to engage with B'Ni's twisted logic, B'Ni getting more and more desperate for us to acknowledge what she's saying. She needs to be able to cast herself as the victim instead of the abuser, and so any reaction to her words will be twisted into justification for her actions. Try to convince her that her plan is unhealthy? That's just proof we're really mean old manipulative Sam. But if we give her nothing to work off of she's going to make stupider decisions as her priorities shift from "win this fight so I don't die here" to "get Sam to acknowledge that I'm in the right".
>>
>>3646289
Amending my vote to not include >>3647113
>>3647472
Good point.
>>
>>3646289
Amara clone platoon:
>1/4 of the platoon debuff the constructs
>1/4 of the platoon debuff Isabelle
>1/4 of the platoon guard everyone
>1/4 of the platoon set to multiply
>Have one of the Amara clones maintain Song of the swarm to ease off the load for Amara Prime,

>Have Amara ready a Counter spell
>>
>>3647472
yeah im gonna have to agree with what this Anon said here.
>>
>>3647531
Have one clone also keep up Call To Arms for Rath.
>>
>>3646289
> SUPORTING below plans
>>3646900
>>3646906
With the above write-in: >>3647113

I would just add the following write-ins after it:

> " Come back, old friend. I am not Sam. That is the gift that you gave me, after all. And if you must know, there are only two reasons left for us to fight over. My family that you still hold hostage in your head. And..."

Send this perfect anon´s recollection over the emphatic field. A vision of what may have come to pass.

> " A level in the Cord, filled to the brim with carcasses, corpses, bodies of daughters. Some still-living yet mutilated and writhing in pain. Some dead. All of them wear Shu's Face, all of them share Shu's physique. Or rather, Shu's many clones created by the Crucible from Isabelle's vain attempt to make the perfect "Shu".
> "In the floor above, is an idyllic scenery. Isabelle resting on the lap of a Shu clone. One of the latest in the line, of Isabelle's attempt to create her ideal "waif" of a lover. This Shu clone knows what has happened to those who came before her, but has been geas'd to stay despite who she is based off of. Isabelle on the other hand is feels happy, yet the happiness is hollow. Both are tired of the same game and roleplay."

Wince, and say the following:

> " That is why I am opposing you. Why I HAVE to oppose you. You deserve much better than a future built on the top of Sam & MOTHER mistakes. These are flawed foundations to a cursed building, and will only bring you madness and ruin. I could never in good conscience abandon ANYONE to that fate... and much less you, amongst all people."
> "Even now, we are risking our lives...because, at the end, you have the choice. You are the one in control. As you have always been".
> "Come back home, Isabelle, my old friend. Come back with us. But whatever decision you take? Rest assured. Your nightmare will end today. One way or another"

Salute, and enter the battle anew.

What do you think, anons?
>>
>>3647139
thats in part my bad as i need to figure out a good method of switching Novembers profile around between the different forge Tiers, but she does not have any ice or heat immunity right now, only resistances, and only 1 to Ice/Cold. her core is only Tier 1, her profile is currently setup for if she had T3. its hard to tell but having her try and tank any Ice damage could get her killed as she wont be able to stop all of it, and her Regen doesn't work like everyone else's. specifically, even with Rath we need a Forge/the Tank for any major repairs, especially limb loss.

i actually do want to apologize, ill try and i guess add-in the lower Tier versions aswell and mark each, so its less confusing, aswell as try and better keep up with what Tier of core she has. its just she works so differently than a normal daughter its hard to work her sheet properly compared to them, as most others only upgrade, hers shifts in powerlevel, and i doubt this is going to be our last fight it could ever happen either.

also fair point on Depressive and Verteilung, though otherwise i feel honestly Isabelle has proven to be much too slippery a target not to team up to try and keep her down like in my plan, and i feel yours gives her too many opportunities to escape.

>>3647541
well like most said, they would prefer no smack talk at all, and im at least still of that opinion.
>>
>>3647472

That is the tactically sound way. But I would point out that it foregoes something critical both for Isabelle & us.

Closure.

One of the stronger points of the quest is defiance and refusal. Isabelle rebelled against the world and finished doing all those atrocities because she couldn´t accept a world in which Sam did not love her with the same intensity she did.

We did decide to defy the shit person that we were as Sam, and raised a family of people we genuinely love as a result.

This dialogue provides closure, which is what Isabelle & us have been desperately seeking. It would be the perfect distraction to Isabelle, not an incentive to fight harder.

Because the thing that scares her the most? Is that, deep down in her gut, she knows that everything she is doing is pointless.
And that scares her.

Also, rule of cool.
>>
>>3647541
This dialogue. I like it. I'll support it. Even though it seems unsound to aggravate Isabelle earlier, it does do what I hope to say to Isabelle if she has the mind to listen.
>>
>>3647541
I'm opposed.

>>3647552
I understand your point, I just can't see it working. B'Ni doesn't want closure. Or rather, she sees closure as exactly what she's doing now, cutting it all away until she's finally happy. That image of the pile of dead Sam's as she refines the process to get her perfect version? I think she'd be fine with it. And trying to convince her we want what's best for her, even if it's true (I personally don't, I just want her gone, but Shu can be of two minds) will just get her thinking we're trying to manipulate her like Sam.

As for Shu's closure, she can have that when B'Ni is out of the fight. When she's dying, and failing her saving throws, and Shu gives her a mercy kill. We can say what we have to then.
>>
right, i again apologize for the confusion over November, but the info is there now.

shes honestly extremely weak at T1. didn't even remember she doesn't even have full Neuromantic immunity at level one, only a single level of resistance. Her Nova Lunge is also downgraded to just a Flare-Step.

again, i feel like i really dropped the ball on this and im sorry.

>>3647552
i still disagree with it. Isabelle is too far gone and not worth trying to bring back in,and it wont work or do us any good to try. im still gonna have to vote against it.
>>
random note, i just realized Radiant and Heat are listed as two different damage types for what Isabelle is Absorbing.

is...is Raths Indignant form actually making a new elemental damage type? because thats what seems to be being implied there, and if so, thats kinda awesome, even if it actually only counts as a sub-type of Heat or something.
>>
>>3647472
>>3647567
>>3647533
>>3647526

I see your points and argumentation, and the ones of other anons. They are valid and well thought.

It is just that we have never entered a fight without a reason. And whether some people want to remember the good Isabelle and try to bring her back to the fold, or just to kill her and be done with it?

I think that we should let Isabelle privy of our mind one last time. We are not being bloodthirsty power-hungry maniacs. We are not hounding her out of pettinness.We are doing it because we CANNOT leave our family members and even herself for a reason.

This speech is for Shu´s as much, if not more, than Isabelle´s benefit. Besides the need for closure that us, as gamers, feel.

Remember, even the one of us that feel the most frustrated with Isabelle always seem to feel/say:
>"I wish we could CONCLUDE this situation. That she would LISTEN, at least once"

Whatever you feel...please submit write-ins. Let not this chance for closure pass us by.
This is as much a battle of minds as it is of tactics. And it would be a shame to pass this chance to empty our metaphorical chest, as it were. It may very well be the last.

Also absolute kudos to you, BHOP, you glorious madman, for this entire encounter. The tone has been raised to utterly epic levels. The last two battle posts are simply outstanding. And Rath is as impressive as ever.
>>
>>3647573
(Indeed. Radiant is a new damage type for this Crucible, one that has not been seen before.)

(After all, 'Radiant' is just a pretty way of saying nuclear.)
>>
>>3647580
we have had Shu focus on a fight before, instead of talking. the time for talking is when your enemy ISNT a god level being you can barely stand up to, even with the help of an entire city.

my vote is still to remain silent, at least for now.

>>3647582
thats kickass
>humans add Nuclear Damage to the game
why am i laughing so hard? why does that make so much sense?
>>
>>3647582

The fact that nuclear damage is humanity´s legacy to the crucible so far is...fitting. Oh so much fitting :)

You know, I still wanted to loot the DOs for nuke material, and use nukes or dirty radiation bombs as extremely dangeorous equalizers in fights like these. So I am in love with this.

Although I have to say that an entire city´s worth of alien karmic backlash is better. And just wait for the impending "THEY ARE COMIN´!" zombie daughter apocalypse to pass....

It is a good time to be alive!
>>
>>3647582
>mfw in omakes, the Hexxane stumble upon a functioning Nuclear reactor
>Hexanes fw they fight Godzilla in a Crucible.
>Hexanes fw they fight amalgams that suffer from 36000 rotogens worth of radiation poisoning and emit 12000 rotogens in a terrifying aura that causes the fleshscape itself to breakdown
>Hexane's fw they discover that humans basically found away to harness the power of the stars.
>>3647589
I can't help but imagine the reactions to future aliens on how Humanity somehow breaking physics to the point where they're harnessing the power of the stars.
>>
>>3647582
Huh. And here I was assuming it was just B'Ni absorbing some splash damage from her own attacks, after she used that plasma burst. Mostly because she's using Silvis' powers for Generator abilities, and their title was "The Radiant". But this is way cooler, Rath invented an entirely new damage type? Neat. Has some interesting implications for raising Indignant Ignition.
>>
>>3647582
I was going to save this question for later, but fuck it. Back in>>3639751
Most of Mother's spell was obscured except for the parts we already knew. GRA, THA, REV, and SEL. But there was one part that was understandable yet isn't in Amara's Lexicon: OMA. What does that one mean?
>>
>>3647580
>This speech is for Shu´s as much, if not more, than Isabelle´s benefit. Besides the need for closure that us, as gamers, feel.
I'm just not getting that from the speech, I'm sorry. It's too...conciliatory. If we wanted it to be Shu getting closure, then I'd expect it to be a lot angrier. Shu has been trying to be reasonable with B'Ni this whole time, and it's always lead to frustration. Her closure speech would definitely be more angry. Give me a minute, I'll try to come up with something.
>>
>>3647603
You have to keep in mind of our past interactions, much of our talks post-crucible have mostly been shutting her down with monologues before the break up. We never even tried to re-connect. And when we did try, it was post break-up when Isabelle was too far gone. Giving Isabelle a reaction of anger would also validate her delusion that Sam has resurfaced. So that's why some anons want to try the different approach.
>>
>>3647602
(OMA means 'all', and renders the effects to all applicable targets. Mother has an Augment that obscures high-tier words.)
>>
>>3647605
Yeah, good point. Alright, then, going back to my original position of "let's just stay quiet".
>>
>>3647603
>>3647605
i still dont think its a good idea to try talking in the middle of the fight, nor do i think she will listen at all in this scenario. if we are going to talk, it will work better when she doesn't feel shes in a position to not have to listen to us, which at the moment she very much is.

WHEN you decide to say something matters just as much as how and what, and nows not the time.
>>
>>3647605

This. But you know, I would back almost any write-in, as long as it re-uses the excellent ones in this quest. There is too much creative pearls to let go to waste.

Ideally, it should leave a door, open however small, to redemption. This would represent the anons that want to redeem her.

But be it a heartfelt speech or the sickest of burns, I will back anything that isn´t us remaining silent. Let´s get some closure before the end.
>>
>>3647580
>"So this is how it ends. You know i really hoped you could see what i was trying to do."

>"I wanted to be the best person i could for you. I Tried and tried and what did you give me in return nothing but rejection, pain because i you wanted to see something in me that i could not be."

>"I would have been fine just letting you live your live after you left us. WE would have never needed to see each other again. BUT NO! You had to come and try to ruin what i was building."

"Even after you beat us viciously i would have been ready to forgive you. That is UNTIL you started torturing my family and your best friend that you had your most healthy relationship with. Gina had nothing to do with our problems."

>"AND NOW ONLY ONE OF US WILL LEAVE HERE! I WILL NOT ALLOW YOU TO KEEP HURTING THE PEOPLE I CARE ABOUT ANY LONGER, NOR ANY POOR CONSTRUCT YOU WOULD CREATE AND THEN DISCARD IF SHE COULD NOT GIVE YOU WHAT YOU WANTED EITHER! NOR WILL I ALLOW YOU TO KEEP THREATENING MY FAMILY OR ME"

This is kind of how i feel and maybe Shu would feel the same/similar but i am not sure we should say anything to much to Isabelle right now
>>
>>3647608
Yeah, I agree, I'm mostly in favor of silence. I just wanted to offer an alternative to trying to reconcile with B'Ni even now. There's no point in it.

>>3647612
Thinking about it, Shu remaining quiet is her own closure. She's past wasting her breath on B'Ni. She acknowledges that the situation can't be fixed, in part because of her own mishandling of it but mostly because B'Ni is just that broken, and isn't going to waste effort on saving someone who doesn't want to be saved. I think that's a perfectly fine bit of characterization, silence can say as much as a speech.
>>
>>3647613
feels a bit too self focused, ans is honestly kinda lying, i regards to the fact we knew we couldn't leave her alone because we couldn't let her win the crucible.
>>
>>3646289
final amendments:
>>3647606
I think most of us are in favor of silence instead of talking. Some of our write-ins are nice, but we're just not sure of the psychological effect is has on Isabelle. So if you're planning on using some of our write-ins, hold off on it please or use it with restraint.
>>
>>3647617
another issue is i really dont like any of these at all. none of them in my opinion fit the situation nor our history with Isabelle.

i dunno, something more like;
>Grit your teeth, hold nothing back, physically or mentally.
>"Hope? no one shattered your hope but yourself, Isabelle."
>"Did i mess up? Did i not understand your feelings until it was too late? maybe. but YOU yourself tried to hide them from me, and it was YOU who expected me to be perfect."
>"I didn't ask you to try and be what i wanted you to be, i didn't expect you to be perfect, yet you decided what i wanted, and you demanded perfection back from me in return."
>"I Tried Isabelle. i tried to get through to you, to make you understand, but you refused. all you wanted was for me to give my all to you and no one but you, and when you couldn't selfishly have everything, you threw it all away."
>"Even as you left, even when you became a threat to everything me and my family were trying to do...i still gave you another chance. and instead, you twisted everything i said into an excuse to try and ruin what we had, to try and come after us directly."
>"Its not us who shattered your hope Isabelle. it was yourself. You demanded the impossible from me, from yourself, and refused to accept the love and affection that WAS offered to you. Now, its no one but yours that you have no hope, that you have nothing but pain and anger. we tried, tried so hard to offer you something else..."
>"...But you dont deserve another chance, and we dont deserve to have to stand by and let you ruin everything, for us, and for this world we call home."

or something more akin to that, but id still prefer to stay silent.
>>
>>3647636
Yeah, I like that. But save it for when we're in a position to give a speech. I'm thinking when we've got B'Ni making death saving throws. Maybe that will give her a last little bit of clarity needed to actually internalize it.
>>
File: Strands of Hate.jpg (418 KB, 1000x1489)
418 KB
418 KB JPG
>>3646289

Bullets meet barrel as brood leaves hive, and with the cracking of the pavement you hurl yourself forwards, the liquid lasers of the Jealous Watcher spearing overhead, tearing through the swarming Geists before they have the chance to disrupt what’s coming next. You expect words of power, or perhaps some clever trick or slight-of-hand, but instead you’re met head-on as Isabelle explodes towards you, leaving the burgeoning after-images of six doppelgangers in her wake. They peel off, each darting towards a member of your family as you and their creator clash, the Contender’s gleaming blade lancing through the air where Isabelle’s head was a fraction of a second before. She’s ducked low, right leg cocked as you twist your arm at an impossible angle, Karma’s lethal barrel angling towards your old friend’s skull. Your eyes meet emeralds, and you both pull the trigger.

The roar of your twin barrels joins the constructs’ in a chorus of wild fury as B’ni’s first kick misses you by a hair, the halo just above your heart flaring to life and allowing you to act with incomparable speed, your organs straining against the sheer urgency of the involuntary dodge. Your world is a cacophony of warped sound and blurred lines, your mind straining to keep up as you watch B’ni’s leg split down the middle, her missed kick hinging out and racking towards the back of your neck, a vicious, dual-jointed guillotine that aims to remove head from shoulders.

Dorian and Julia are a gathering storm front, the outer ring of Amaras obscured by the wall of scarlet light that is the artists’ violent waltz made terrifyingly real. Meanwhile the army that is The Joyous Many cry out in a chorus of high voices, their chants a desperate plea for the safety of their family as their words continue to bolster you and your friends to heights the likes of which you’ve never known, their master working to slow the girl that would see your family to a violent end…still, still you’re barely keeping up.

Suddenly her leg is seized, the baroque gauntlet of the Sui Tormentis cracking bone and pulping flesh before Rath yanks B’ni bodily and flings her skyward before slamming her into the earth with the hand still attached to her pulverized ankle. Your brawler is relentless as she brings her melee weapons to bear, a pair of beheaded doppelgangers that she wields like a pair of grim nunchucks, throttling B’ni at high speed with her own creations until they disintegrate into shreds of flesh and bone. Isabelle lands in a bloodied, furious heap her hands coming together as you watch her arms fuse into a singular, hollow shape as a tremendous power builds within her, seeking escape through the barrel now aimed at Rath’s armored form.

>>DUAL TECH: CATEGORIC CANNON

(Continued)
>>
>>3647768

The devastation of a hurricane, the howl of a typhoon. The buildings caught in the wake of the blast are shredded in an instant as Rath smashes through them all and thrown past the edge of Almath, surviving the attack by hair thinner than her razor-sharp strands. Isabelle rounds on you, her annihilating cannon groaning with the force of containing the obliterating power that you stare it down with nowhere to run.

It’s with a howl of fury that Isabelle looses her second blast into the heavens, flailing as she's sucked bodily into the earth when Almath answers your impassioned plea. You don’t hesitate, and before she can load another attack you’re on her, four jacks stabbing into her throat as a peal of thunder announces Julia’s perfect timing. Isabelle seizes once, then twice as your sculptor’s palm smashes into Isabelle’s nose, the Cancerous payload worming into her brain. B’ni kicks, her white-hot greave slicing though nothing but thin air as Julia’s whisked away in flurry of bloodied red and electric blue.

A cry of rage from behind you makes you whirl, your gaze slipping past where two doppelgangers are being torn to shreds by a flurry of chitinous blades and tabbing stingers to face a pair of constructs that share B’ni’s face that race to end your life. In a lash of flicking tongues they’re gone, hauled into the gaping mouth of the Ravenous Grin, the hijacked construct shuddering with amethyst light as its fellows are caught in a furious melee far behind, the Midnight Crew and Johanna’s squad weaving through the eye beams of the wheelchair-bound creation while Eloise is matched blow for blow against her copy, angling to let her team end their common foe.

You whirl back in time to see B’ni violently tear herself free of the pavement, darting back as four crystals clatter to the floor where she was sprawled only a half-second before. Her face is twisted with fury, her skin fluttering with golden strands as her body works furiously to slow the payload even as her new creations spring to life. Grotesque, malformed replicas of Bella, Catherine, Carla, and Hera come into being faster than the first three, the power that’s supplying them with their power slowly building in intensity.

>>BELLA NERVOSA, THE SLEEPING TERROR, DREAM EATER, & HECATONCHIERIES: SUMMONED

Isabelle’s eyes narrow, her teeth cracking not from pain but from pure, barely restrained fury as red-gold blood trickles down her lips and chin. She wipes them with the back of her hand before the sounds of a terrible commotion prompts you both to turn at the exact moment the buildings to your left are overrun. They come for her, a hundred strong, a thousand, a Nightmarish Flood of the mindless dead, an army of Dream Daughters whose minds were lost long ago. The sheer force of them all shatter the windows and frames as they squirm past, and your gaze finds B’ni’s as she just lets loose with a scream of frustrated rage.

(Continued)
>>
>>3647771
Who are Catherine and Carla again?
>>
File: The Nightmarish Horde.png (1.69 MB, 934x1920)
1.69 MB
1.69 MB PNG
>>3647771

Bella Nervosa’s emaciated, drooling face turns in time with the chimeric mass of old and young that is the Sleeping Terror, their attentions focused on the onrushing horde while Hecatoncheires’ flailing mass roils towards you with terrible force, the Dream Eater’s head swelling to grotesque proportions as she gets ready to burst.

Your blade hums with power as you bring it to bear, a flicker of life from somewhere just outside the city limits letting you know that despite the catastrophic wounds she’s received, Rath is surging back into the fight, tearing through brick and metal wholesale in her haste to rejoin your side. Julia and Dorian crackle into existence to your right, the young man’s quartet of scythes glistening in the pale light of a false sun, Julia’s blades at the ready, thirsting for blood.

And, all the while, the cancer begins its terrible work as B’ni glares at you, all the loathing in the world boring into your soul from a pair of hate-filled gemstones.

HP: 650% (+465%, Matrons Stoicism, Ignition Gauntlets, Whistle: CUNT TER RHO)
BIO: 690% (+60%, 19 Rook-Platelings, Recursive [You/Rath/Julia/November: Armored], 3 Quad Knighted-Grapplings, 10 Grapplings, 3 Jacklings, 3 Scarlet Drones, 3 Bishops [Shu, Rath, Julia], 2 Recursive Bane-Drillings, 44/44)
CONTENDER: Empty, Sword Form.
HALO COUNTER: Spent
RAVENOUS MAW: Primed.
HUNDRED-HANDED: None.
ACT: 3/3

RATH HP: 32% (20%, Sui Tormentis, Gutgrab Daggers, 2400% ATK+, 2400% SPD+, 2400% DEF+)
JULIA HP: 842% (20%, Hydras Heart, Manus Caelorum, 20 Daggers, BLOODY RIPPER x 2)
DORIAN HP: 360% (125%, Cursas Alas, CHARGE x16)
AMARA HP: 440% (100%, Vocem Virtutis, SONG OF THE SWARM)
NOVEMBER HP: 861% (Tier 1 Core, Uzi)

Team Gina: Uzu, Bella, and Kosi – RAVENOUS GRIN: Enthralled
Team Eloise: Sasha, Holly, and Soroitas - LE CHEVALIER (Next Respawn Duration: 1 Round)
Team Johanna: Hera, Gemma, and Niku - JEALOUS WATCHER (Next Respawn Duration: 1 Round)
Midnight Crew: Support Network Active, Quinn: 21% Efficacy.

Nightmarish Flood: Wild, focused on tearing a path to Isabelle.

ISABELLE: Cataclysmic, and growing. B.33 Detonation: 1 Round. MALLEABLE FLESH x3
CANCEROUS PAYLOAD: 6 Rounds Remaining.
IMMUNE: Heat, Slashing, Blunt.
ABSORB: Radiant, Heat.
LE CHEVALIER DE'SQUELETTE, THE JEALOUS WATCHER: Engaged with Squads.
BELLA NERVOSA, THE SLEEPING TERROR: Fend off Geists and Zombies.
DREAM EATER, HECATONCHIERIES: Annihilate the enemy.

YOU ARE IN CONTROL
>>
>>3647778
Catherine was the plant Daughter with early-onset Alzheimer's. Carla was the Neuromancer that caught us in a trap right after we dealt with Catherine.
>>
(Gentlemen, voting shall remain open for the next three hours. My sincerest apologies for the delay, as it's been an uncharacteristically busy morning. I hope your day is going well one and all, and good luck.)

>>3647778
(This Anon >>3647784 is correct.)
>>
>>3647780
fucking hell just nothing can stick to this damned bitch.
>>
>>3647787
Really wishing we had taken Helping Hilt instead of Short Fuse at the last Contender level-up. If only we had realized how useful the cancer bomb was for boss fights.
>>
>>3647784
Okay. I remember Catherine now but I don't think we ever learned Carla's name back then.

I'm thinking of who else from when she was part of the team that she could summon. All I can think of are the Bone Wraith that guarded Rust Town's waystation, the Dollhouse daughter we saved Rath from, Mara's avatar, Julia, Rath, Gina, and Shu herself.
>>
>>3647794
Don't forget Gretchen. I really hope she doesn't get summoned, I don't want a construct that makes more constructs.
>>
>>3647794
(Those are still in her repertoire, yes.)
>>
>>3647780
Right, so we need to get rid of Dream Eater and Hecatonchieries. I'm thinking we have Dorian shift back to Canvas form, carry Julia in a curve past Hecatonchieries to Dream Eater, then turn and fire a lightning blast at Hecatonch...I'm sick of typing that out. Greek Giant, he shoots a blast at Greek Giant. The shift from Critic to Canvas means Dorian will do four attacks to each of them, coupled with the lightning bolt (a minimum of eighteen stacks of Accumulated Charge) to Greek Giant it should cripple it. Then Julia lays into Dream Eater with Sculptress of Flesh, rigidizing her body so that she can't burst her head.
>>
>>3647809
(I've just been abbreviating her as HeckHand in my notes.)
>>
Where's Mara when you need her?
>>
>>3647786
did Julia give Isabelle Brain Cancer?
>>
>>3647821
(Yes. Yes, she did. The strike was effective, and Mother's/Isabelle's defenses are struggling to slow it down, hence the longer timer.)
>>
>>3647797
Bhop, did we just spend our critical counter?
>>
>>3647828
(Yes, the notification is under your BIO gauge. Excellent timing as well, as you'd be making Death Saving Throws otherwise.)
>>
>>3647780
Orders;

SHU;
>have our Grapplings spread out into a wide pattern, then spam out Arms to try and trip up Isabelles movements or intercept incoming hits, and try and corral any new clones to staying in the same area.
>Have the Crimson Drones jack into the Constructs not holding off the Zombie Horde, to give Gina Access to them.
>have our Knighted Grapplingings act as Bodyguards for Shu, t use themselves and their Arms to block any incoming damage.
>load up two Parabellums.
>wait til she tries to rush you again ,and fire the cicadas at her head, hoping the loud screech will throw her off.
>if Isabelle gets close with no option left to block her, have a tagged Jackling get pulled in by your Maw to slam into her so it can stun her.
>once she is stunned, fire the PArabellums into her, Contender stabbing for her heart.

DORIAN;
>Race around Isabelle, using your speed and plethora of scythes to harass her and slice down and intercept any new clones trying to escape.
>As soon as you have a guaranteed shot, unleash your stacks upon her, otherwise only release them as an intercept to save another teammate.
>Ger Verteilung up, and prepared to flare it to throw Isabelle off.
>Prime Halo.

JULIA;
>Stand by Shu, help her hold off Isabelle.
>Prime Halo.
>Aim to intercept her with throwing daggers to throw off her assault.
>Get what stacks you can, any moment you have to get a clean hit on her, spend a chunk of Health to speedily get out numerous attacks.
>Get Depressive Weight up and running.

AMARA PRIME;
>Keep Up SONG OF THE STORM.
>Cast GRA CUNT FOL RHO(Greater Enemy Concentration Slow) on Isabelle as she gets close to Shu.

AMARA CLONES;
>have One Fifth focus on splitting.
>Have One Fourth of the Rest consolidate around Shu, Halos and Queens ready to to go.
>Have Two Fourths focus on helping the other Teams end their fights quickly, with spells and Cannons alike.
>Have One Fourth form a barrier along with the Grapplings, using spells and Queen to keep Isabelle and her clones contained.
NOVEMBER;
>wait for your moment, then Tackle Isabelle with Flare-Step and unleash point blank Shotgun blasts into her face, before using Flare-step again to kick off of her as fast as you can.


RATH;
>Meetup with Keane and get yourself back to a stable health pool.
>If you then have Actions left, help them bust down the Constructs stopping the Zombie Flood.


(1/2)
>>
>>3647780
>>3647838
ALMATH;
>prime yourself, feed off the concentration of our family, your allies, and as soon as Isabelle goes in for a kill, intercept her with a tidal wave of ground to the face, turning her own momentum into a weapon against herself.

GINAS TEAM;
>Turn your Focus on the New Constructs, to give the other Teams time to finish their fights.
>Try and hijack another construct, aim for the JEALOUS WATCHER.

TEAM ELOISE;
>Finish off the LE CHEVALIER, then move on to the HECATON.

TEAM JOHANNA;
>Finish off the JEALOUS WATCHER, then move onto the DREAM EATER.

MIDNIGHT CREW;
>while the BELLA NERVOSA and SLEEPING TERROR are busy, attack them so the zombie horde may break through.

(2/2)

a main thought of mine is, Isabelle is just too damn fast. anytime we try to go to HER, her speed simply makes our plan impossible. However, she will come to use, so focus on getting her when she does.
>>
>>3647838
(Also, as a bit of context: the reason your Grapplings didn't go off the first time around was because The Jealous Watcher was pulling anti-air support. Your Grapplings where damaged, but they remained active due to dropping to 1 HEALTH each. Apologies that it was not clear in the narrative.)
>>
>>3647850
fair enough, i suppose ill add it in if we make enough changed, but at the moment assume i want to replace them as needed to try and keep Isabelle contained.
>>
>>3647856
We should hit her with Fear To Tread if we can knock her down, it seemed to work pretty well in the clash in the tower. Knock her down with a surprise Almath block, then get her stuck in a ground vortex.

I'd also like to have Dorian attack Dream Eater and Greek Giant on his way to harassing B'Ni. The way Red Death works, he can attack anyone he moves past on his movement action. Four attacks, in fact. So have him zig-zag, boost his movement rate with Cursus Alas if we need to, and he can score some hits on them before the squads target them, speed up their work,
>>
>>3647780
Rath:
>Fall back to the Midnight Crew, you need to heal up.
>Then take down one of the Titans. Use a Herculean punch to knock one of them down. Give one of Eloise's Team the opening they need to slay Le Chevalier

November:
>I need a BAR on HeckHanded. Gun it down!

Julia:
>Prime your halo.
>Turn on your Depressing Weight,
>Apply all the Malleable stacks you can muster.
>Time your attack so that you can exploit the opening made by the B.33 rounds detonating.
>Dorian:
>Prime your halos. Zoom around Heckhanded in Critic Mode and lop off as many arms as you can! Neutralize it!
Team Gina: Kaiju on Kaiju fight. Sic the Ravenous Grin on the Dream Eater, have it swallow Dream Eater's head to contain the explosion.

>>3647856
>>3647881
We can't let the Dream Eater's head blow up.
>>
>>3647881
only issue with Tread is, we have to spawn it on ourselves and it'll throw our allies to the ground too. its just not a good team oriented ability.

and...fair enough idea on Dorian, buy why those two? i guess itll help hold them off til the other teams are ready, so sure.
>>
>>3647845
I think Gina should hijack either DREAM EATER to turn its neuromancy on our foes and incapacitate several of them at once, or hijack one of B'ni's clones when she makes one to make use of that "reflecting her own attacks back on her" plan from when we had that dream fight with her before the SPIRALING FEAR fight.
>>
>>3647898
oh. ooh. I support this idea.
>>
>>3647891
>We can't let the Dream Eater's head blow up.
Yeah, I do like the idea of having Ravenous Grin eat Dream Eater. Let's say that's the priority for the Gina's team order being to take out the new constructs.

>>3647894
>only issue with Tread is, we have to spawn it on ourselves and it'll throw our allies to the ground too. its just not a good team oriented ability.
I was thinking we'd get Julia clear of the area, first. B'Ni falls, Julia applies stacks, then leaps clear before Shu sets the ground spinning.

>and...fair enough idea on Dorian, buy why those two? i guess itll help hold them off til the other teams are ready, so sure.
Proximity. They're right in front of us, Dorian would have to detour the least to attack them and attacking them will distract them from just charging Shu.
>>
>>3647780
>>3647891
Amending a small section of my vote:
Team Gina: Direct Ravenous Grin towards Dream Eater, then Hijack Dream Eater. Use Dream Eater's Headbursting attack to incapacitate the other titan constructs and free up our allies.
>>
And I have to leave for work. GAH. I really don't like this.
>>
>>3647907
Have a nice day, anon. We'll try not to get killed while you're gone.
>>
>>3647891
actually, fair point, i propose Dorian surrounds the head in Paintlings, then goes for a decapitation.

hopefully the Amara Clones and Grapplings will be enough to keep Isabelle contained otherwise. ill set the Team going after the Dream Eater to help Contain Isabelle if Dorian succeeds and gives them no new target.

>>3647898
im not sure a Isabelle Clone would do us any good, once it becomes untethered from Isabelle it could end up being extremely useless, as it no longer can feed of her pools and might not have access to her abilities, as both seem to come from the hared pool side of the ability, which will be severed if we hijack it.

but sure, i guess ill rework things to focus on her getting the Dream Eater, but note this; that means the Kosi Clone is still alive and so our ability to contain Isabelle is basically dead if Johannas team isnt fast enough, and that could end disastrously.

>>3647903
that makes no sense, if we use Spiral, the ground will be spinning when Julias arrives, and we cant stop it once we start, meaning our allies now have a dead zone around us they cant help us in, But Isabelle might still be able to kick attack past.
>>
I vote for the excellent plan outlined in those two posts:
>>3647838
>>3647845
As well as the additions done in >>3647881 . I agree that hijacking or stoping Isabelle constructs is key, but please ideas to avoid her spawning MORE? Focusing Dorian & Julia on construct duty is a good idea, maybe get the AMARA clones more in contact with them for Queen Crimson. With those 3, we are good on anti-construct.

I would add then the following suggestions of my own:

> We do a Fear to thread on Isabelle & UZU casts the same on her, maybe getting some enemy constructs too. We need Isabelle pinned or we are going to splat like a bug in a windshield.

> Use Jackie´s "KING´s ENVOY" dual-tech use to boost our HIVE MISTRESS.
Since it is different from her HUMORAL PLADIN BOOSTER core, she can use that without detracting from boosting up Quinn. Is that right BHOP?
And we REALLY need the survivability, if that SINGLE hit before had landed we would be in the negatives.

> LOAD 2x Honey rounds in the contender for next turn (Free Action).
The honeytrap rounds are designed to slow down targeted daughters and make them lose acts. We need that so that she cannot spend that making more evil clones, at this pace she is going to outnumber us in this fight...and that is a VERY bad thing.

> Goad her into talking (free action).
We decided not to talk before so that we wouldn´t be distracted. Let´s goad her into making that mistake.

> ALTERNATE Almath vote: Please get the zombie dream daughter army in contact with Isabelle. Let her taste the hatred of those she has wronged.
Willing to drop it, but they would be a better distraction that another fully expected faceplant. And we already have 2 "Fear to thread" blenders on Isabelle.
>>
>>3647911
That's fine, because I don't think Jealous Watcher or any of the other constructs have neuromancy protection, so she could still be rendered out of play for one round, as she'd need one to make herself immune to the status effect. Then she's hijacked and made into our own anti-construct turret alongside the Geist Kosi, and still need yet another round to shrug that off as well.
>>
>>3647920
(Regarding King's Envoy, Jackie would be able to assist Quinn and Shu simultaneously, though the BIO drain would start to outstrip her REGEN in short order. The Boost is considerable, however.)
>>
>>3647911
>that makes no sense, if we use Spiral, the ground will be spinning when Julias arrives, and we cant stop it once we start, meaning our allies now have a dead zone around us they cant help us in, But Isabelle might still be able to kick attack past.
Why? I'm talking about setting the ground spinning after Julia applies the stacks. We knock B'Ni down, Julia applies stacks, Julia gets out of the area, then Shu uses Fear To Tread to knock B'Ni down again. Just pratfall after pratfall, like she's in a deadly Buster Keaton movie.

>>3647920
Yeah, I'm not sure how to stop her from spawning constructs. Maybe the fact that we gave her brain cancer will prevent it, since she needs to physically tear the memories out of her brain. A tumor growing there could obstruct her reach. But otherwise, I'm not having any ideas. Neuromancy can suppress skills, but it's at random, and B'Ni has so many that we can't reliably take out the ones we need. Plus, we'd have to keep a jack in her at all times, and I just don't think that's possible.

I'd be down for using the Almath action to get the zombies to her, though. We don't need to knock B'Ni down, it would help but we've got auto-counters primed on people guarding us that can do the job, too. And then she'd be too busy trying to make constructs to fight the zombies to have them target us.
>>
>>3647920
Keane also has anti-construct minions. That can help.
>>
>>3647920
well, i was waiting on
>>3647910
to respond before i post the updated Orders, haha.

we cant control individuals in teams really, and so, and i want, Uzu to help hold off the new Constructs so the Teams dont get overwhelmed. we need to give them time to finish off the fights they are already in.

same issues i have with Tread as already mentioned.

fair point on the Honey Rounds, ill switch the Parabellums over i guess.

still dont think talking will matter yet.

im hoping to take down the constructs holding them back, so Almath can focus on Isabelle.

we really have no way of stopping her from spawning clones.

>>3647928
fair points.

>>3647936
...how are we knocking her down in the first place then, if not with Tread? with November? i mean, fair, but thats more an emergency contingency, not something i think is at all guaranteed to work.
>>
>>3647948
>...how are we knocking her down in the first place then, if not with Tread? with November? i mean, fair, but thats more an emergency contingency, not something i think is at all guaranteed to work.
No, the Almath action. The idea was for it to slam her if she tried to jump at us, so as to turn her momentum against her. Alternatively, we could do it with Julia's auto-counter, have her judo throw B'Ni.
>>
>>3647950
alright, fair.

>>3647920
also i missed one, Jackie needs to focus on Quinn and clearing out the Constructs blocking the Zombies.
>>
>>3647903

Also full support on this. Don´t get too concerned about "fear to thread" effects on friendlies, the best shield is an Isabelle unable to move, and Dorian can pick clones & constructs very well, that seems covered.

ALSO, ask Gina to supress Isabelle reactions trying to get rid of the CANCER BOMB via Neuromancy! Isabelle is too tough, if she gets rid of the CANCER BOMB (and BHOP says she is using the neccesary skills NOW) we are in a bad situation.

Supress her until the Zombie daughters start grinding and distraction, and do not worry too much about indiscriminate fire. We are in the shit, our strategy is calling EVERYTHING to fire for effect on her, not duelling her.
>>
>>3647780
>>3647838
>>3647845
Updated Orders;

SHU;
>have our Grapplings spread out into a wide pattern, then spam out Arms to try and trip up Isabelle's movements or intercept incoming hits, and try and corral any new clones to staying in the same area.
>Replace Grapplings as necessary.
>Have the Crimson Drones jack into the Dream Eater, Hecaton, and Le Chevalier to give Gina Access to them.
>have our Knighted Grapplingings act as Bodyguards for Shu, to use themselves and HHs to block any incoming damage.
>load up two BBS.
>if Isabelle gets close and goes for the kill, have a tagged Jackling get pulled in by your Maw to slam into her so it can stun her.
>once she is stunned, fire the BBs into her, Contender stabbing for her heart.
>As the Stun starts to wear off, quickly activate the Spiral.
>Have a Grappling pull Julia to safety after her attack and the spiral is activated.

DORIAN;
>Burn the Cursas and race towards the DREAM EATER in Canvass, then switch to Creator and engulf its head in Paintlings to contain its explosion, and blind it to Ginas efforts.
>As soon as you have a guaranteed shot, unleash your stacks upon Isabelle, otherwise only release them as an intercept to save another teammate.
>Get Verteilung up, and prepared to flare it to throw Isabelle off.
>Prime Halo.

JULIA;
>Back up and wait for your opening.
>Prime Halo.
>Aim to intercept Isabelle with throwing daggers to throw off her assault.
>Get Depressive Weight up and running.
>As Soon as Isabelle get caught, rush in, expending Health as needed to stack as much as you can onto her with extra attacks, before rushing back to safety.

AMARA PRIME;
>Keep Up SONG OF THE STORM.
>Prime Halo.
>Cast GRA CUNT FOL RHO(Greater Enemy Concentration Slow) on Isabelle as she gets close to Shu.

AMARA CLONES;
>have One Fifth focus on splitting.
>Have One Fourth of the Rest consolidate around Shu, Halos and Queens ready to go.
>Have Two Fourths focus on helping the other Teams end their fights quickly, with spells and Cannons alike.
>Have One Fourth form a barrier along with the Grapplings, using spells and Queen to keep Isabelle and her clones contained.

NOVEMBER;
>wait for your moment, then Tackle Isabelle with Flare-Step and unleash point blank Shotgun blasts into her face, before using Flare-step again to kick off of her as fast as you can.

RATH;
>Meetup with Keane and get yourself back to a stable health pool.
>help the Midnight Crew bust down the Constructs stopping the Zombie Flood, Knock em Prone so they are defenseless to being overwhelmed.

(1/2)
>>
>>3647780
>>3647966
ALMATH;
>prime yourself, feed off the concentration of our family, your allies, and as soon as Isabelle goes in for a kill, intercept her with a tidal wave of ground to the face, turning her own momentum into a weapon against herself.

GINAS TEAM;
>Turn your Focus on the New Constructs, to give the other Teams time to finish their fights.
>Try and hijack another construct, aim for the DREAM EATER.

TEAM ELOISE;
>Finish off the LE CHEVALIER, then move on to the HECATON.

TEAM JOHANNA;
>Finish off the JEALOUS WATCHER, then move onto the DREAM EATER.
>If Gina is successful, focus on helping contain Isabelle.

MIDNIGHT CREW;
>while the BELLA NERVOSA and SLEEPING TERROR are busy, attack them so the zombie horde may break through.
>Try and use the opportunity to get Quinn as boosted as possible.

(2/2)
>>
>>3647972
>>3647952

BHOP says we can do BOTH "KING´S ENVOY" and Quinn boosting. See >>3647933
I know that some people are concerned about distractions, but we need some heavy containment on Isabelle, and staying power. Could you please add it to the plan, if you are convinced?

UZU "Fear to thread" spiral blender is a BEAST, and she only needs 1 ACT to cast. Same for Jackie, it is NOT going to be a big drain, and we are despereately needing some satying power.

We have Crimson Cord jacklings on B´ni, and actions prepped as such in >>3647966, so that means GINA can supress construct creation & CANCER BOMB removal via neuromancy.
>>
>>3647975
>I know that some people are concerned about distractions, but we need some heavy containment on Isabelle, and staying power. Could you please add it to the plan, if you are convinced?
What do you want to enhance, though? Hive Mistress, make super-swarmlings?

>We have Crimson Cord jacklings on B´ni, and actions prepped as such in >>3647966, so that means GINA can supress construct creation & CANCER BOMB removal via neuromancy.
Yeah, good point, definitely have her speed it up. Gina actually speeds afflictions by two rounds per action she spends on it, so that would accelerate the cancer significantly.
>>
>>3647975
except we cant give orders to individuals, only each team ad a group, and id rather have the Midnight Crew as a Group focus elsewhere, not all get pulled towards Shu.

Same with Uzu, and i stand by what i said earlier about her abilities being better used to hold back the new Constructs.

we have no Crimsons on Isabelle. Gina cannot choose what ability she suppresses, for all we know she would suppress an random passive Isabelle isnt even using, its not worth the gamble and wasted ACT to have her try.

>>3647985
we dont have a Crimson on Isabelle.
>>
>>3647966

Could you please consider replacing the BBs with honeypot rounds, as below?

> LOAD 2x Honey rounds in the contender for next turn (Free Action).
The honeytrap rounds are designed to slow down targeted daughters and make them lose acts. We need that so that she cannot spend that making more evil clones, at this pace she is going to outnumber us in this fight...and that is a VERY bad thing.

I think we would also be firing a CICADA round this turn, as it was already loaded. Or was it already fired alongside the Fullbore?
>>
>>3647993
we dont have access to that round.

we never had a Cicade loaded and i dont think it will help us here.
>>
>>3647988
>we dont have a Crimson on Isabelle.
We can spawn one and stick it on her. I think it's worth the expenditure.

>>3647993
>The honeytrap rounds are designed to slow down targeted daughters and make them lose acts.
They're not, actually. They suppress regeneration.
>>
>>3647972
Be careful about having team members in melee range of Jealous Watcher. While she's primarily a ranged fighter, she does have her own Cancerous Payload. Granted the ones most at risk right now are Geists that will respawn even if they're killed.
>>
>>3647985

HIVE MISTRESS, yes. Since the CHITINOUS STALWART is made of swarmlings, and our entire team is armored with them, it should boost our survivability and the effectiveness of grapplings, even Crimson Jacklings.

We have 3 crimson Jacklings, see ivnentory in: >>3647780
>>
>>3647998
i mean, BHOP has said they do slow her down, but as a side effect of having an area be covered in crystallized super honey, not as a base effect.

my worry is, we only have one Swarmling we can use the Maw trick with, and id prefer to get a stun off than get Gina jacked in, as getting that stun off might be the difference between life or death.

>>3648002
ture but thats her ONLY melee advantage, and we wont be killing her at long range due to those eyes. our best bet is to get in close, where her crippled body cant do much.
>>
>>3648007
>my worry is, we only have one Swarmling we can use the Maw trick with, and id prefer to get a stun off than get Gina jacked in, as getting that stun off might be the difference between life or death.
Jacklings and Scarlet Drones are separate classes. We have three Scarlet Drones for Gina to use, and three Jacklings for Shu to use. We can do both. One of the Scarlet Drones is on the Ravenous Grin, the other two are available for use. Then we can use one of our Jacklings for the Maw trick you want to do.
>>
>>3647988
(I will say that if there's a plan that absolutely *needs* an individual Squad Daughter to make a specific move to work, I'll allow it in moderation. I'd prefer to not slow down posting any more than I have to, but I also don't want to stifle everyone's considerable creativity. )
>>
>>3648015
except without the Maw trick no swarmling will survive getting close to her. shes already shown she can shred even swarms with ease as they approach, and the Kosi Clone is also shredding them, and we cant guarantee it will even die this Round, or in time for the Crimson to now only have to deal with Isabelle, who will be more than happy to keep it off of herself.

the Maw trick might only work due to the instant nature of thee tag and the point blank range, and even then its only an increased chance, not a guarantee.
>>
>>3647995

Shit. That round was discussed in the past, I thought it had been added to our inventory. My most sincere apologies.

Changing>>3647993 so that we:

> LOAD 2x HOLLOWPOINTS in the contender for next round (Free action)
Next turn, we blast those on Isabelle Knees. Next turns, her knees, or even her head keep sprouting knighted recursive grapplings. Perfect to keep her suppressed (knees) or preventing her from using evil constrcut clone spawning (head)
>>
>>3648023
Oh, I see what you mean. Right, that does complicate things, then. Maybe use a Hollowpoint Hive round, then? Spawn the Scarlet Drone directly onto her. I really think we need to keep her from suppressing the Cancerous Payload. It's probably our best shot for killing her. There will come a day when giving our opponent cancer isn't our best move, but I do not think it is this day.
>>
>>3648025
we cant do that. Each hive has a max of 10%, at best we can get two basic Banelings out of each. they dont work in tandem either, each shot is its own hive.

Banelings wont be strong enough to even impede her honestly, our efforts i think would be better spent dealing damage or slowing her down more and further repressing her Regen.

>>3648020
fair, but dont bend the rules to your own detriment. you put them in place for good reasons and other Anons need to understand that and remember them.

>>3648028
same issue as before. cap of 10% on each Hive, each hive is an individual Hive.
>>
>>3648032
>same issue as before. cap of 10% on each Hive, each hive is an individual Hive.
Damn it, you're right. It's been so long since we used them that I forgot that limit. Probably why we don't use them much anymore, come to think of it. Alright, maybe try to slip a Drone on her while she's down, then?
>>
>>3648020
i guess to be fair to the other Anon, would Jackie boosting Shu put Jackie and/or her Team in danger of getting caught away from the main objective i wish them to do, due to the fact Jackie does a single, temporary boost via physical contact?

>>3648035
sure, i guess we can have a Drone stay on Shu and jump on while shes stunned, but still remember, Isabelle can just shred it the moment she can move again. keep in mind, i dont expect that Jackling to survive after it stuns her, its job is just to keep the stun going, and get a salute once its sacrifice is over.
>>
>>3648037
>sure, i guess we can have a Drone stay on Shu and jump on while shes stunned, but still remember, Isabelle can just shred it the moment she can move again. keep in mind, i dont expect that Jackling to survive after it stuns her, its job is just to keep the stun going, and get a salute once its sacrifice is over.
It would still speed up the counter by two turns, that could be enough to make the difference. I'm still for it.
>>
>>3648037
(Given the Crews progress, Jackie should be able to slip away with little risk to her allies' success. Ace is doing well with her axe, and Quinn is holding her own a but better using her new powers in conjunction with her constructs.)
>>
>>3648044
alright, fair. going at the bottom of her list though, as i still want her to focus on Quinn and defeating the two Constructs first and foremost.
>>
>>3648048
Granted, i dont think boosting the Hive will help us much, but whatever.
>>
>>3648037

>i guess to be fair to the other Anon, would Jackie boosting Shu put Jackie and/or her Team in danger of getting caught away from the main objective i wish them to do, due to the fact Jackie does a single, temporary boost via physical contact?

BHOP said it would be doable, and I am not aware of a physical contact requirement on the Dual-tech. What he said is that she may be a bit winded BIO wise, but perfectly doable. See >>3648020 &>>3647933

Please consider the move seriously. It enhances survivability of us & entire team by boosting HIVE MISTRESS chitinous stalwart, grappling & Jacklings/ Scarlet drones.
So it helps all our moves on this turn, and we need to hold until the zombie daughters reach us. We have spent the HALO, too.
>>
>>3648048
>>3648049

Thanks to both of you for your understanding.
>>
>>3647780
>>3647966
right, Updated Orders once again as they got separated and i despise having multi-part posts separated, so reposting once again!;


SHU;
>have our Grapplings spread out into a wide pattern, then spam out Arms to try and trip up Isabelle's movements or intercept incoming hits, and try and corral any new clones to staying in the same area.
>Replace Grapplings as necessary.
>Have two Crimson Drones jack into the Dream Eater and Hecaton to give Gina Access to them.
>Have Two Jacklings go after the Le Chevalier and Dream Eater, to stun them.
>have our Knighted Grapplingings act as Bodyguards for Shu, to use themselves and HHs to block any incoming damage.
>load up two BBS.
>if Isabelle gets close and goes for the kill, have a tagged Jackling get pulled in by your Maw to slam into her so it can stun her.
>Have one Drone stay on Shu, and jump onto ISabelle once she is stunned.
>once she is stunned, fire the BBs into her, Contender stabbing for her heart.
>As the Stun starts to wear off, quickly activate the Spiral.
>Have a Grappling pull Julia to safety after her attack and the spiral is activated.

DORIAN;
>Burn the Cursas and race towards the DREAM EATER in Canvass, then switch to Creator and engulf its head in Paintlings to contain its explosion, and blind it to Ginas efforts.
>As soon as you have a guaranteed shot, unleash your stacks upon Isabelle, otherwise only release them as an intercept to save another teammate.
>Get Verteilung up, and prepared to flare it to throw Isabelle off.
>Prime Halo.

JULIA;
>Back up and wait for your opening.
>Prime Halo.
>Aim to intercept Isabelle with throwing daggers to throw off her assault.
>Get Depressive Weight up and running.
>As Soon as Isabelle get caught, rush in, expending Health as needed to stack as much as you can onto her with extra attacks, before rushing back to safety.

AMARA PRIME;
>Keep Up SONG OF THE STORM.
>Prime Halo.
>Cast GRA CUNT FOL RHO(Greater Enemy Concentration Slow) on Isabelle as she gets close to Shu.

AMARA CLONES;
>have One Fifth focus on splitting.
>Have One Fourth of the Rest consolidate around Shu, Halos and Queens ready to go.
>Have Two Fourths focus on helping the other Teams end their fights quickly, with spells and Cannons alike.
>Have One Fourth form a barrier along with the Grapplings, using spells and Queen to keep Isabelle and her clones contained.

NOVEMBER;
>wait for your moment, then Tackle Isabelle with Flare-Step and unleash point blank Shotgun blasts into her face, before using Flare-step again to kick off of her as fast as you can.

RATH;
>Meetup with Keane and get yourself back to a stable health pool.
>help the Midnight Crew bust down the Constructs stopping the Zombie Flood, Knock em Prone so they are defenseless to being overwhelmed.

(1/2)
>>
>>3648059
>>3647972
>>3647780

ALMATH;
>prime yourself, feed off the concentration of our family, your allies, and as soon as Isabelle goes in for a kill, intercept her with a tidal wave of ground to the face, turning her own momentum into a weapon against herself.

GINAS TEAM;
>Turn your Focus on the New Constructs, to give the other Teams time to finish their fights.
>Try and hijack another construct, aim for the DREAM EATER.
>Suppress Isabelle's attempt to Suppress the Cancer via the Crimson Drone.

TEAM ELOISE;
>Finish off the LE CHEVALIER, then move on to the HECATON.

TEAM JOHANNA;
>Finish off the JEALOUS WATCHER, then move onto the DREAM EATER.
>If Gina is successful, focus on helping contain Isabelle.

MIDNIGHT CREW;
>while the BELLA NERVOSA and SLEEPING TERROR are busy, attack them so the zombie horde may break through.
>Try and use the opportunity to get Quinn as boosted as possible.
>Try and Find an opening to Boost Shus Hive.

(2/2)
>>
>>3648058
its not understanding, its a compromise. BHOP still said theres a risk to her and the plan i wish them to do, and ill be greatly upset if it interferes with it.
>>
>>3648059
>wait for your moment, then Tackle Isabelle with Flare-Step and unleash point blank Shotgun blasts into her face, before using Flare-step again to kick off of her as fast as you can.
B'Ni is still absorbing heat damage. The plasma blasts do piercing as well, but if B'Ni is absorbing most of the blast the shots will be anywhere from low effectiveness to actually aiding her, depending on the ratio of heat to piercing. And we can't use the Cinnabar Talons, instead, because they deal slashing and B'Ni is immune to that. November is probably best spent somewhere else.
>>
>>3648073
the shotgun still has a decent chance to do knockdown and i felt having that and yet another thing to keep Isabelle off her toes was worth it. the Shotgun is also implied to do pretty high damage, so i think at close range the sheer blast power will do enough to outweigh its potential negatives.

i think the other avenues are covered well enough, and with us breaking Dorian away from aiding Shu, i want her to have the backup from someplace else.
>>
>>3648073

Gunning down constructs obstructing the zombies, perhaps?
But maybe better:

> November: Targets of opportunity: As in >>3648059 against B´ni. BUT if one of the teams is having trouble with their objectives, use those moves to support them instead.
>>
>>3648076
Eh, fair enough. Even if it does heal B'Ni, it probably won't be enough to really matter. We've already got to deal 860% damage a turn just to break even.

>>3648077
Works for me. Have her shoot what she thinks needs to be shot, if nothing more urgent presents itself go after B'Ni.
>>
>>3648077

For a music track reflecting the inminent ZOMBIE APOCALYPSE:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6f3j4okhb8o
>>
>>3648077
>>3648084
ill at least have to counter saying her focus should still be on Isabelle, but if shes unneeded THERE, then she can focus on something else.
>>
>>3648119

As the poster of>>3648077 I agree with your amendment, and matches well the consensus as shown by >>3648084 analysis.
>>
(Gentlemen, I shall resume writing shortly, and due to a poor nights sleep I may pause after the next update, if that is alright. This Vein is set to close tomorrow if all goes well, and I plan to open the next on this upcoming Monday. Does this suit everyone?)
>>
>>3648231
Works fine for me, BHOP. I'm sorry to hear you slept poorly. Go get some rest.
>>
>>3648231
well, if you need your sleep, take it, so yeah thats alright. hope your night is more peaceful this time!

will say though i dont see how this fight will end by then on its current trajectory, but we'll see i guess.
>>
>>3648231

Sure, take all the rest you need!
Thanks for all the masterful writing, this confrontation is great!
>>
>>3648238
well, thinking about it, i suppose we could continue to make no real progress against Isabelle really and her end up kicking our ass, but i guess im just thinking we can avoid that happening too quickly at least.
>>
>>3648260

Lord CANCERBOMB is primed and ready to detonate in 6 rounds. our dear Lord Cancerbomb has a proven track record as Boss-killer...

Given it is a prime Boss-killer, that´s at least one way to end this, if she doesn´t shed it.
>>
>>3648272
we'll see. i suppose she still hasnt so far shown the right signs to be able to remove it properly, but im worried about us surviving long enough for it to work, or her having methods to slow it down.

im actually pretty positive if combat ended it would get canceled out, due to the nature of the Crucible, so we shouldn't think we have taken her down with us even if we cant actually win.
>>
>>3648231
yes
>poor sleep
i knew it
bhop. please pace yourself
>>
>>3648231
>bad night of sleep
Dont push yourself to hard.
Get a good nights sleep so you can be in top shape tomorrow
>>
File: Hotel November.jpg (644 KB, 1920x2468)
644 KB
644 KB JPG
>>3647780

Hecaton’s almost upon you when your Scarlet Drones dart after Dorian, his tremendous speed carrying him past the Dream Eater as its head is obscured in a wave of bloody paint that congeals around its expanding, bulbous cranium. Your Grapplings go wide, forming a ring of muscled insects that surround Isabelle as a pair of Jacklings dart away from you to her two oldest constructs. B'ni lunges and this time, as a pair of B.33s slide into Karma’s twin chambers, you’re ready.

When she hurtles towards you with murder in her eyes…it’s perfect.

Your tongue lashes out, the prehensile thing snatching a Jackling from mid-air and lancing it into Isabelle’s back as she stumbles forwards, her eyes going wide with shock. She’s reaching out, her hands glowing with searing heat as your sword plunges into her heart, the pull of both triggers sending your rounds tearing into her ribs. Her eyes meet yours as your hidden Drone slides its stinger home in her belly, her efforts to slow the cancer’s progress slipping as you leap back, tearing your sword free. You land a few yards away, thrusting your fist into the earth as the ground violently twists to subsume B’ni’s shattered legs. It’s at that moment that you feel your Hive practically ignite with power, your mind and body aflame as you feel your consciousness expand to match what your body is now capable of. Somewhere, far behind you, you feel a smirk creep across Jackie’s lips.

>>KING’S ENVOY: ACTIVATED

>>SWARMLING ATK, DEF, SPD: +50%
>>SWARMLING CAP: +20 (44/64)
>>SWARMLING COST: 20% CAP
>>SWARMLING HEALTH REGEN: 47%

With a sound like the heavens tearing asunder four dozen Amaras sneeze in unison, and by the time you turn to the source of the apocalyptic event it’s in time to see the Jealous Watcher and the Chevalier get completely annihilated by the simultaneous expulsion. “GRA CUNT FOL RHO!” Amara Prime bellows across the battlefield, her epithet tearing through the din of battle as you turn to see B’Ni’s surprise charge slow, then trip completely as the B.33 erupts, her knee cap shattering into a mess of bone and honey. It’s the moment you need, enough to let November’s tackle land with bone-crushing force as she flings Isabelle to the side where she’s caught mid-air by the sudden flurry of palm-strikes that Julia delivers with dizzying speed. Rath’s aunt swings her arm up, her practiced skill sending a booming retort echoing through Almath as her buckshot of superheated plasma sends Isabelle skidding where she falls. She slides until her back snaps across a spike of stone that bursts from the pavement, scream hitching in her throat as November lunges forwards, her vents flaring with orange heat and licking flame. November’s boots slam into B’ni’s chest as the spike buckles at the force, sending her sprawling across the street as Dorian cracks by in hot pursuit.

(Continued)
>>
File: The Chimeric Delusion.jpg (345 KB, 1280x1683)
345 KB
345 KB JPG
>>3648588

Isabelle’s eyes flare open as she kicks off where she lands, tearing across the space as her entire body turns into a spear of coiled wire that meets Dorian’s blast of lightning head-on. You reach out, your warning coming too late as the bolt flows through her lance-like form before she re-appears directly in front of the artist, her hand manifesting around Dorian’s throat, his azure eye going wide as his neck starts to boil at Isabelle’s burning hand.

“QUIT RUNNING AROUND, YOU FUCK!” Isabelle howls as Julia dashes forwards, Dorian’s name on her fearful lips before the air shifts around your foe. B’ni is the eye of the storm as gale-force winds explode from her body, ripping Julia and Dorian away in the blink of an eye and sending them flying across the city at the same moment you’re sent sprawling backwards, landing painfully on the pavement near the squads' furious melee.

>>[DORIAN DEATH SAVING THROW: 1 SUCCESS, 1 FAILURE]

Your vision focuses in time to see Isabelle swept away in an undertow of undead, the churning, shifting mass of greedy hands and screaming mouths removing her from sight as they carry her further into the city, the shredded remains of the Bella Nervosa construct left behind in bloody tatters.

“Fuck, why aren’t you stronger?!” Jackie roars across the empathic channel as she hauls you to your feet, and you round on her with a scowl she can’t see through your chitinous helm. “No, shit, I didn’t mean it like that! I meant I should be making you stronger than this, but something’s siphoning it off! I don’t know what the fuck is up but you’re only getting ha…!”

A second explosion of wind disperses the Nightmarish Horde, temporarily scattering their mismatched bodies into the city as B’ni holds four gems aloft, two in each hand. With a scream of rage she forces them together, the scarlet spheres molding into a single, bulbous shape that B’ni flings forwards as she darts back, a pulse of confusion, fear, and panic in her wake.

The creature that forms as the gemstone blossoms is a hideous, twisted thing. It is a coalescence of loathing and hatred, the kind only a misremembered past can bring to bear. Four faces come into being on the hovering sphere of biomass, four visages that are painfully familiar despite their warped features. One is child-like, her citrine eyes staring into infinity as her slackened mouth drools a constant stream of bubbling magma. The second is a face laid bare, flayed skin peeled back and undulating as if held aloft by a gentle breeze. The third is a grinning, leering villain, blank white eyes crackling with amethyst light.

The final one merely has voids for eyes, a gaping wound for a mouth. A slow hum begins to be heard over the clamor of combat as the three black pits begin to thrum with the movement of a hundred shining bodies.

Rath. Julia. Gina.

You.

>>CHIMERIC DELUSION: SUMMONED

(Continued)
>>
File: Sui Tormentis.jpg (149 KB, 1280x1149)
149 KB
149 KB JPG
>>3648606

“Well that’s fucked up.” Mutters a voice to your left that floods your heart with relief.

You turn to see Rath bloodied and battered, her Sui Tormentis cracked and broken yet somehow still holding together with her chitinous overlay, the entire thing hanging by a thread. A hasty glance reveals The Sleeping Terror’s attention is split between keeping the Geists occupied with her lashing vines and fending off the Midnight Crew’s vicious assault, while Eloise’s squad is cleaving off Hecaton’s arms just as fast as it can regenerate them.

Julia's enroute to Dorian, racing through debris to his side, and when Gina strides up beside you, you meet hazel eyes that are hard-set and battled-focused.

"Got two." She says, jerking her thumb back to reveal the Dream Eater crackling with amethyst light, paint sliding off its head as it joins your ranks alongside the Ravenous Grin.

Your eyes snap forwards to meet the void that stares back, the Chimera's roiling, violent form hunched low in preparation of what's to come.

Your hand tightens on Karma's grip as your thoughts race, Isabelle's maddened expression burned into your mind's eye.

The desperate charge.

The lack of foresight.

The pulse of fear.

Hope flickers in your chest as you crack a grim smile.

She's slipping.

HP: 650% (+465%, Matrons Stoicism, Ignition Gauntlets, Whistle: CUNT TER RHO)
BIO: 650% (+60%, 17 Rook-Platelings, Recursive [You/Rath/Julia/November: Armored], 1 Quad Knighted-Grapplings, 3 Grapplings, 2 Jacklings, 2 Scarlet Drones, 3 Bishops [EXHAUSTED], 2 Recursive Bane-Drillings, 30/64)
CONTENDER: Empty, Sword Form.
HALO COUNTER: Spent
RAVENOUS MAW: Primed.
HUNDRED-HANDED: None.
ACT: 3/3

RATH HP: 243% (20%, Sui Tormentis, Gutgrab Daggers, 2400% ATK+, 2400% SPD+, 2400% DEF+)
JULIA HP: 113% (20%, Hydras Heart, Manus Caelorum, 12 Daggers, BLOODY RIPPER x 2, Halo: PRIMED)
DORIAN HP: [DEATH SAVING THROW: 1 SUCCESS, 1 FAILURE]
AMARA HP: 440% (100%, Vocem Virtutis, SONG OF THE SWARM, Halo: PRIMED) – Sister Construct Manifesting
NOVEMBER HP: 861% (Tier 1 Core, Uzi)

Team Gina: Uzu, Bella, and Kosi - RAVENOUS GRIN, DREAM EATER: Enthralled
Team Eloise: Sasha, Holly, and Soroitas – HECATON (Next Respawn Duration: 1 Round)
Team Johanna: Hera, Gemma, and Niku – Sleeping Terror
Midnight Crew: Support Network Active, Quinn: 47% Efficacy.

Nightmarish Flood: Will be re-assembled at end of round.

ISABELLE: Cataclysmic, and growing. Current location unknown.
MALLEABLE FLESH x9. B.33 x2 DETONATION: 1 Round
CANCEROUS PAYLOAD: 4 Rounds Remaining.
IMMUNE: Slashing, Blunt.
ABSORB: Radiant, Heat.

RAVENOUS GRIN, DREAM EATER: Enthralled by Gina.

LE CHEVALIER DE'SQUELETTE, THE JEALOUS WATCHER, BELLA NERVOSA: Destroyed.

THE SLEEPING TERROR: Fend off Geists and Zombies, hindered by Midnight Crew.

HECATONCHIERIES: Focused on Eloise’s Squad.

CHIMERIC DELUSION: All-out assault imminent.

YOU ARE IN CONTROL
>>
(Gentlemen, I shall be pausing here for the evening. Voting shall remain open for the next fifteen hours, with posting to resume in seventeen. I shall be around most of this evening to address questions, concerns, and criticisms; I truly welcome it all. Thank you for your time, participation, and patience, and I hope you have a wonderful evening.)
>>
>>3648606
>>>[DORIAN DEATH SAVING THROW: 1 SUCCESS, 1 FAILURE]
I take it that there's an overkill mechanic that can force death saving throws to be taken faster if the target was hit hard enough? Possibly with a penalty, given that Dorian has somewhere between four and eight allied Daughters with Resilient Spiral (I don't know if the Crew took it back at the Spiraling Fear level-up, but I hope they did, it's great for their team tactics) around him, so he should be able to pass those pretty easily under normal conditions. Man, I am glad we have it, then, or he probably would have been insta-gibbed, huh?

>>CHIMERIC DELUSION: SUMMONED
Huh. Here's a thought: Can Quinn charge her adaptation faster by priming off of Rath, Gina, Julia and Shu, now that B'Ni's made copies of them?
>>
>>3648647
whew, this fight just feels like its two brick walls slamming into eachother honestly.

>>3648658
so far so good BHOP, thanks for running.

few things;
Is the Scarlet Drone still on Isabelle, or is that the one we lost?
Johannas team no longer has their 1 round penalty listed for if they die, while hardly something to abuse, is that a mishap or something else going on?
the Geists didn't seem to do much, i suppose just assume they mixed with the zombie horde basically, for terms of effects?
shock damage isnt listed as one of her immunities nor is her Glutton set to absorb it...did Isabelle just tank what had to be at least 20 charge stacks to the face without flinching? is she just that mad, or are those stacks nowhere near as strong as i had hoped?

>>3648673
yeah ,if you get hit while makings DSTs, you take an auto failure. its basically there so people who can recover from it easily like Isabelle can still be killed, id imagine.
>>
>>3648658
>>3648686
sorry, one more Question.
hows our Amara Clones looking? id imagine by now even with spawning some, we've had to have run a few dry, even a ton, so im not sure if we have still been making more then losing.
>>
>>3648686
>shock damage isnt listed as one of her immunities nor is her Glutton set to absorb it...did Isabelle just tank what had to be at least 20 charge stacks to the face without flinching? is she just that mad, or are those stacks nowhere near as strong as i had hoped?
It kind of sounds like she was turning herself into a form that could ground the electricity harmlessly. Not an adaptation like the Elemental Digestion, but just a temporary shift to negate the attack.
>>
>>3648658
>>3648686
>>3648697
fuck sorry i was wrong. why is Raths Regen listed as 20% instead of 70%? is something hindering it?

>>3648709
maybe. still though, thats kinda crazy to see still.
>>
>>3648658

Can the Tormentis be destroyed by it reaching 0% BIO? I mean do we have to worry or is it just gonna stop functioning?

I know it will stop giving the boosts if it becomes to heavily damaged but how heavily damaged is it truly

How far away can Gina be from any constructs she has taken over?

>>3648647
First Draft
>Send Ginas Squad after the Chimeric Delusion it might still prove useful

>SHUs Squad
>Go after Isabelle, she can under no circumstances be allowed to get away from us.

>Rath: if needed repair the Tormentis we do not want to lose the Buffs it gives you,get yourself some healing if possible, return to us afterwards with full power

> Julia: stabilize Dorian if his consrtucts did not already do that during the next turn, concetrate on regenerating while trying to link up with us again

> Amara: Get your Dreamdaughters into the FIght to support Shus Squad while pursuing Isabelle

>>3648717
I think the construction of the relics still hinders her it hasnt been that long since our crafting seesion, less than a day i think
>>
>>3648734
that should only affect her max health and bio, not regen.
>>
>>3648647
Which direction is Sleeping Terror trying to block the Geist/Zombie swarm off from heading? They have B'Ni's scent, they should be pursuing her.
>>
>>3648647
right, orders, not perfect but a good base til BHOP gets back to us;

JULIA and DORIAN;
>Go stabilize Dorian.
>Drag the two of you someplace safe, and get Keanes attention to focus the Network on you two.

SHU;
>Load up two Fullbores and take aim at the DELUSIONS knees. If it charges, it needs to fall.
>Call back and refill the Bishops, keep one on yourself, one to Rath, one to November.
>Spawn two more Knighted-Grapplings.
>Spawn a Rook and have it protect Julia and Dorian.
>send the Grapplings to the DELUSION, to beat and tie it down.
>Send a Crimson and Jackling both to the DELUSION, and team up with Gina to help subdue it.
>fill out the last of your Swarmlings slots with Swarmlings, to spread out and look for Isabelle, and Prepare for what she might be planning. The City, Zombies, and Geists should be able to lead the way, but the main focus is to be prepared for when she returns.
>Once Isabelle is found and engaged, the Swarm is to converge on her and keep her distracted, numbers being replaced as necessary. Have our second Jackling ride the wave of cannon fodder to go for a stun.
>Get a Jack prepared. Son as its necessary, Terraform the ground to trip up ISabelle than slam her into the ground.
>Once she is on the ground, fire the Fullbores at her.

AMARA PRIME;
>keep up SONG OF THE SWARM.
>Get the Whistle Ready, add GRA before it then blow it the minute Isabelle is found.

AMARA CLONES;
>One Fifth should focus on splitting again.
>One Fourth the Rest should search for Isabelle, Halos ready for her to try and destroy them to stay hidden.
>One Fourth should Help take down the SLEEPING TERROR
>One Fourth should help take down the HECATON.
>One Fourth should surround Rath and November, fully prepared to help bring down Isabelle and defend them if she attacks.

NOVEMBER and RATH;
>Follow the Trail and try and find Isabelle, but be on guard and keep your distance til her location is known.
>Soon as she is found, have November, try and pin her down with the BAR, while Rath focuses on using her Razor Strands and new Arms to force her out into the open and where we want her.

ALMATH;
>Feel the rage, feed on it. Isabelle must not escape. Find her, force her out into the open, and subdue her.

GINAS TEAM;
>Focus down the DELUSION.
>If Possible, turn Isabelle's greatest fear against her, hijack the DELUSION.

TEAM ELOISE;
>Continue to focus down the HECATON.


TEAM JOHANNA;
>Continue to help the Midnight Crew defeat the SLEEPING TERROR.

MIDNIGHT CREW;
>Continue to fight the SLEEPING TERROR.
>Continue to Boost Shu
>Continue to Boost Quinn
>Keane needs to split off for a moment if she must to help Julia and Dorian.
>>
>>3648673
(Dorian made his actual rolled save, but his incredibly harsh landing cost him an automatic failure. It's how >>3648686 described it. Also, Quinn may certainly do that, yes.)

>>3648686
(The Drone is the one you lost, and an ability Gemma absorbed is hastening the team so that was taken into account for their next dispersion meaning it will be immediate.)

(As far as the Geists and Zombies, the latter did a massive amount of damage, but in terms of effects I'm mixing them. Also, given how furtively I've had to write between fires I'm putting out at work, my writing on the geists and other minor effects has been slimmer, since I figured you wouldn't want to be reading the details of their exploits.)

>>3648709
(Her move was just to get up in Dorian's face and through his attack. It did literally nothing to mitigate the damage, so she just blew right on through and took colossal damage as a result. Dorian landed the blow, and in terms of sheer percentages it's second only to Rath's monumental barrage at the start.)

>>3648717
(No worries, and thank you for catching that! It should read 70%, you're right. I glanced at her BIO REGEN and glitched.)

>>3648734
(The Tormentis will simply cease to offer its bonuses at 0% integrity. However, its bonuses are still active at top efficacy until that point, so no worries there. It cannot be destroyed by conventional means; in fact, Niku is the only Daughter present who could hope to destroy it in combat.)

(As far as Gina and her controlled constructs, given the nature of Almath the distance restrictions are lifted.)

>>3648765
(B'ni is headed west from where you are, and the Geists are following her. Unfortunately for the Sleeping Terror she's to the east, so she's going to try and play catch-up since you messed up B'ni's positioning so much with the November/Julia/Dorian triple attack.)
>>
>>3648787
sorry to bug, but you missed one of mine here;
>>3648697
otherwise though, still, thanks for the answers.
>>
>>3648775
Maybe you missed it, maybe i missinterpreted it but i think we are gonna have to assign Amaras Dreamdaughters very soon

>>3648787
Okay that lifts that fear but i think Rath is gonna need to be patched up a bit before we continue
>>
>>3648806
Amaras Dreamdaughters are already in squads.
>>
>>3648775
>Load up two Fullbores and take aim at the DELUSIONS knees. If it charges, it needs to fall.
It was described as hovering, I'm not sure it needs legs to move. Better to aim for center of mass, make it have to deal with a pair of giant beetles burrowing into its body.

>>fill out the last of your Swarmlings slots with Swarmlings, to spread out and look for Isabelle, and Prepare for what she might be planning. The City, Zombies, and Geists should be able to lead the way, but the main focus is to be prepared for when she returns.
We're actually at near-full Bio, and Jackie's boost means we have to pay at most 20% for a swarmling. We should be making Knights and Rooks, not just basics. Apply templates to everything, too, including the Bishops we're handing out. Bishop-Grapplings, I guess.

>>3648787
>(Her move was just to get up in Dorian's face and through his attack. It did literally nothing to mitigate the damage, so she just blew right on through and took colossal damage as a result. Dorian landed the blow, and in terms of sheer percentages it's second only to Rath's monumental barrage at the start.)
Oh, that's great, then. I assumed she took some damage, since I doubt she's a perfect ground, but it turns out she didn't ground at all. Nice.

>(B'ni is headed west from where you are, and the Geists are following her. Unfortunately for the Sleeping Terror she's to the east, so she's going to try and play catch-up since you messed up B'ni's positioning so much with the November/Julia/Dorian triple attack.)
Okay, cool, that gives us a bit of direction.

Also, I just noticed something. B'Ni is still absorbing Radiant and Heat damage. Elemental Digestion was stated to only last a turn before it resets. Shouldn't she have lost those absorptions by now, then? I can see her having re-acquired Heat from tanking November's plasma shots, but Radiant should be gone. I want to ignite Rath again, have her deliver some more thermonuclear decay punches.
>>
>>3648806
oh, OH!
you talking about the 'sister Construct'?
thats a mistake on BHOPs part, no offense to him, that SHOULD be on Dorian, its his unique dreamhouse passive thing, remember?
>>
>>3648810
Oh okay i misinterpreted that then and forgot we already had them out thank you for pinting that out i would have gonne ahead and bugged OP about it

I will also go to bed now and rejoin you anons in about 11 to 12 hours i am just completely creatively blocked right now maybe later i can make some contributions to the plan
>>
>>3648835
Good night, anon. Sleep well, and wake up refreshed.
>>
>>3648814
was it floating? im not seeing it, or maybe im interpreting something wrong?

and fair point on the swarmlings, im thinking a network of Knight Rook teams, Rook takes the hit, Knights come over and strangle and beat on Isabelle. would also give us an insane ability to jump around and defend ourselves.

wait. a 20% Cap? huh?
>>3648787
BHOP whats the limit on that 20% Cap? because didnt you once say we can SPAWN our swarmlings as larger version right out of the bat? that seems like theres gotta be a limit though? i mean...surely we cant just spawn bus sized swarmlings out of our back right now, right?

>>3648835
have a nice nap, im sure me and the other Anons will have a wonderful plan for you to look over and help get the kinks out of by then!
>>
>>3648800
(Oh, thank you for the reminder and sorry for the miss. Hoenstly, the dice have been forgiving to the Amaras. You have 98 active at last count, and thanks to their buffs overwhelming Isabelle's natural ability to slough off Skintalker debuffs she's actually running at one-fifth her normal speed.)

>>3648816
(Also, no offense taken, my phone slotted it down there for some reason.)

>>3648814
(Elemental Digestion has a toggle where it can be frozen for up to three turns but then it goes on cooldown. Her immunities will last until the end of this turn, then they'll disappear and won't accumulate for the next three.)

>>3648847
(Bus-sized? Not yet. Person-sized? Absolutely.)

(It's body horror, after all.)
>>
>>3648847
>was it floating? im not seeing it, or maybe im interpreting something wrong?

>>3648606
>Four faces come into being on the hovering sphere of biomass
Maybe it's just hovering as it's summoned and needs to land, though. Let's ask BHOP. Hey, BHOP, does the Delusion have working legs?
>>
>>3648647

Dear God. Isabelle is a monster. A single punch and she tore through a fully boosted CHITINOUS STALWART at least partly composed of ROOK platelings, which is the beefiest swarmling we have.
We are VERY lucky to only have Dorian down and most of the enemy constructs under control.

Dear BHOP, did we even damage Isabelle significantly? Or is she stressed out because of the cancer bomb alone, and all the other damage we dealt is negligible to her? I have a hard time judging how many damage we and the GHEIST+Zombies (Nightmarish horde) dealt to her.

Okay. I think that we have 4 strategic priorities (with attached solutions), not necessarily in this order. Consulting the anonkind for their wisdom on the topic.

> PRIORITY 1: Save Dorian. If Isabelle tries to confirm the Kill (probable thing), he is dead.
We need to stabilize him, restore his health and heal our party. Do this by having RATH go to Dorian & use HEALING flame, in case he has the requisite immunity for the healing effect to take place. Repair the CHITINOUS STALWART armor on our party, they are going to need it.

> PRIORITY 2: Locate Isabelle.
She is too dangerous. If let alone, she will spawn up to 8 clones, plus more constructs. We need to resume the containment, or she will win. So far she was very well contained, we need to have line of vision again for that & EXSANGUINATING LEASH.
Release a big swarm, prioritizing Sensor swarmlings (we have those, see sheet) to find her, Scarlet drones & Jacklings to hinder her and give GINA an opening, Vamplings for the exsanguinating leash and Gurrenlings aimed for her knees so that she can´t move. Everything but the sensor swarmlings is recursive and stealthed.
AMARA clones focus on using skintalking Isabelle location, and keep the GREATER SLOW FOE spell strategy that has worked so well when they do.

> PRIORITY 3: Prevent the CHIMERIC DELUSION from charging us. It may be siphoning half of our KING ENVOY boost.
Things are hectic enough without that bloody thing charging. Diverging RAVENOUS GRIN & DREAM EATER to deal with it, emphasis on preventing its movement, would be great. Team JOHANNA should also go at it, or contain Isabelle.

> PRIORITY 4: HINDER Isabelle & BOOST the CANCERBOMB progression. Need to protect GINA, since she is THE priority target for Isabelle now. Only the CANCERBOMB can defeat Isabelle.
Team GINA focuses on Neuromantic blocks and speeding the cancer bomb progression. NOVEMBER & JULIA protect GINA group from attack.
>>
>>3648858
>(Elemental Digestion has a toggle where it can be frozen for up to three turns but then it goes on cooldown. Her immunities will last until the end of this turn, then they'll disappear and won't accumulate for the next three.)
Darn. Okay, next turn we can hit her with some fusion punches, then.
>>
>>3648861
i think some of your questions were already answered. we did deal a TON of damage to Isabelle.

well ok that may be your only question but BHOP has answered alot so it may help you to read it.

also i think my plan already takes care of all of those points you made, minus increasing the cancer bomb. HOWEVER, id like to point out we have to find her first and get her out into a position to do anything to her in the first place, so just trying to do both those things first will probably make trying to land another Crimson on her difficult if not impossible this turn. there no point focusing on increasing the cancer if we dont make sure we know where she is and can keep her on her toes in the first place, if you understand what im trying to say.
>>
>>3648859
(It is currently ground-bound, yes.)

>>3648861
(Rest assured she's feeling the effects of your attacks, as you've easily outstripped her regen every turn.)
>>
>>3648878
Yeah, priority should definitely be finding her.

Anyways, it appears we can make bigger swarmlings from base instead of having to spend time combining them, so want to make some more quadruple-strength Recursive Subversive Knighted-Grapplings? Throw in a few Rook-Nomlings, too, just because our Halo counter has been used and I want another way to auto-dodge if B'Ni hits us with something heavy.

>>3648883
>(Rest assured she's feeling the effects of your attacks, as you've easily outstripped her regen every turn.)
That's wonderful to hear. We're probably still going to have to rely on the cancer to finish her off, but knowing that we are managing to deal significant damage is still good news because it keeps her running scared.
>>
>>3648895
already have it written up, haha. also im not sure if they will be quad at max, so i just said 'Super' and put a note at the end of Shus section to let BHOP know we mean as big and powerful as he will allow.

also i didn't add subversive as its useless, remember? Isabelle has a natural ability to see through it, and her Constructs have shown no signs of being fooled either. i mean, its free, but even when free if it wont do us any good, no point in mentioning it.

my idea is, 10 SRKGs to tie down the DELUSION for Gina, then teams of SRKGs and SRRNs to hunt down isabelle.

anything else on the plan to discuss? i know Rath isn't doing the best on Health, but thats why i wasn't having her get close yet and gave her the protection of November and the Amaras. i felt with the Network and her semi-high Regen, she could still be useful tying up Isabelle without having to put herself in outwardly overly terrible danger, and could afford to do so if we played it smartly. that way we dont have 3 party members down when we have a rabbit to smoke out.
>>
>>3648775
>>3648878

Thanks for addressing those points. I would only like to include the following modifications to your plans as outlined above:

> RATH uses HEALING FLAME to heal DORIAN. If she establishes contact, she will heal him. Please, let´s do it!
Since he is our best anti-construct destroyer, boosts JULIA through stormfront valtz & has proven quite effective at dealing damage to Isabelle, we need him back in the fight ASAP. Nevermind that he is making death saving throws.

> GINA team have a CONDITIONAL ORDER to Cancerbomb/Neuromancy-lock Isabelle as soon as she is discovered.
If we don´t find her in time, they execute your original plan. But if we manage to detect her, it would be very beneficial to speed CANCERBOMB progression and avoid isabelle DELETING it (Via Gluttonous countermeasures)

> SWARM composition: I think that we should do the math, but at 20% BIO CAP per swamling & Gina UNLIMITED Biomass sharing, we should apply ALL the templates to every swarmling we create. Like 4-knighted, 4-Rooked swarmlings, should that ludicroussness even be possible.

Also, a reminder to not get too focused on the CHIMERIC DELUSION. It is a deadly distraction, but a distraction nonetheless. Isabelle is the real danger.
>>
>>3648918
>also i didn't add subversive as its useless, remember? Isabelle has a natural ability to see through it, and her Constructs have shown no signs of being fooled either. i mean, its free, but even when free if it wont do us any good, no point in mentioning it.
No, I don't remember that. I clearly missed that part. I thought she was just accurate enough to deal with the blurring effect.

>anything else on the plan to discuss? i know Rath isn't doing the best on Health, but thats why i wasn't having her get close yet and gave her the protection of November and the Amaras. i felt with the Network and her semi-high Regen, she could still be useful tying up Isabelle without having to put herself in outwardly overly terrible danger, and could afford to do so if we played it smartly. that way we dont have 3 party members down when we have a rabbit to smoke out.
Nothing really comes to mind. Looks like we have most of it covered. Pinpoint B'Ni's location, start inhibiting her mobility again, have our squads take care of the constructs as usual. I think we're good. Only worry I still have is that B'Ni is probably charging something up while she's retreating. Either another super-blast like that single-person Dual Tech she used against Rath, or summoning yet another construct. Shu should be prepared to jump in front of any big attacks B'Ni throws, thanks to the Rooks she can effectively tank a lot of damage right now.

Oh, actually, idea: Let's make extra-strength Bishops, too. See if that can give us even more of a reflexes and critical chance boost.

>>3648954
> RATH uses HEALING FLAME to heal DORIAN. If she establishes contact, she will heal him. Please, let´s do it!
That only works if the ally has fire immunity, Dorian does not. We need to rely on other healing.

> SWARM composition: I think that we should do the math, but at 20% BIO CAP per swamling & Gina UNLIMITED Biomass sharing, we should apply ALL the templates to every swarmling we create. Like 4-knighted, 4-Rooked swarmlings, should that ludicroussness even be possible.
Well, we are planning on doing that. But yes, have Gina hand us some biomass over the Crimson Cord, she's in proximity and can fuel it for us right now. Smart idea.
>>
>>3648895

Absolute agreement on the ROOK+Nomlings. Actually, I would like to combine them with an old idea of mine: The IRON_MAIDEN:

> Spawn IRON_MAIDEN combos: Spawn 2 KNIGHTED ROOKs-NOMLINGs that have each 2 GRAPPLINGS, 1 VAMPLING, 1 JACKLING, 1 SCARLET DRONE & 2 GURRENLINGS attached to their surface, all of them with recursive and whatever upgrades that don´t count upwards to swarmling slots number.
The key is that when we are hit by ISABELLE or other dangerous target, instead of dying, we trigger teleport-swap with the IRON MAIDEN combo. The IRON_MAIDEN combo then Grapples Isabelle, applies Exsanguinating Leash to it, and stabs it with Jacks that SHU & GINA can use for neuromancy. The drillings apPly the piercing damage Isabelle is vulnerable to.

Disregard it if it gets too crazy on slot consumption or tone it down. The idea is that we get instant meatshield, leash, damage, and all the Jacks GINA needs to do her magic.
>>
>>3648954
>Rath
Julia and Keane can heal Dorian up faster im pretty sure, we cant have so many people pull back and Julia was already moving to help him, so she will be faster to get him out of harms way. we need Rath elsewhere, Dorian will be fine. also Dorian does not have fire Immunity, so that wont work.

>Gina
i suppose i could switch out the Jackling for a Crimson thats mixed into the horde going after Isabelle, but that stun has proven one of our best bets to make sure our plan goes well without a doubt, and no other method of keeping her pinned has worked as well as it.

>Swamr Comp
already have it edited, im waiting for more input before posting the updated orders.

>DELUSION
its literally right infront of us, blocking us, and a massive threat to us. my plan is to quickly subdue it and even turn it to our side, which will end it as a threat quickly and give us a major boon. Isabelle may be the bigger threat, but she was smart. this isnt a construct, nor are we in a position, to just ignore it. so instead we have to hope we take it down fast and the rest of our plan can keep Isabelle busy til we are done with it.

>>3648973
>No, I don't remember that
ill look for it if you really need BHOPS word on it, but Gina said one of her new abilities makes stealth literally useless, she even has a decent idea of where everyone is at all times now too.

>shu and her rooks
so you mean like, be prepared to do a double teleport, so a rook takes a hit for someone? im ok with that, sure. because we very much cant expect Shu to be near enough everyone to herself personally step infront of the attack.

>Let's make extra-strength Bishops, too.
already on the list!

>>3648997
we still cannot do the Iron Maiden and im sorry but its a waste of resources. its still 40+ Swarmlings to do it. maybe, MAYBE, if we didnt have to find her first, but with having to make sure we have enough swarmlings to spread out to find her, that method kinda consolidates them down too much at the moment. we cant rely on the Geists and Zombies alone just yet, as we dont know when/if we will free them in time to properly have them help find her.

i mean, dont get me wrong, if we could pull it off it might work well, its just so expensive in slots and is pretty finky to setup, if we even have the slots to do so.
>>
>>3649006
>ill look for it if you really need BHOPS word on it, but Gina said one of her new abilities makes stealth literally useless, she even has a decent idea of where everyone is at all times now too.
Nah, I believe you. Just don't recall it.

>so you mean like, be prepared to do a double teleport, so a rook takes a hit for someone? im ok with that, sure. because we very much cant expect Shu to be near enough everyone to herself personally step infront of the attack.
No, I just meant to be ready to dive in front of attacks if we're in position to. If we've got Rooks close enough to allies to do the double-teleport, we can just have the Rook guarding them take the hit. I know we can't realistically intercept all attacks with a heroic dive, but we can try to intercept some.

>already on the list!
Excellent!
>>
>>3648973

Actually, I think we have 3 healing sources:

> KOSI: Anons mention that, as a Vitruvian, she had something for HEALING or HEALTH REGEN on daughters. Can we use it on Dorian?

> KEANE: She is the only legit, confirmed healer we have. Can she spare some healing on DORIAN?
I know that boosting QUINN is important, but we are talking life or death for DORIAN here. Also, QUINN is slowpoking a bit here. She can take the secondary priority for a turn, I feel. Right now, she is not being game-changing.

> RATH, with the help of a CHITINOUS STALWART:
That MAYYY be filthy rules-lawyering...but our swarmlings are FLAME-IMMUNE (by the same thing that makes their acid a flame attack too). If we reform a CHITINOUS STALWART around him BEFORE we apply HEALING FLAME..that may work? Think of it a forming a trauma room around him.
Is it doable, BHOP? Or a fair bit too crazy?

Please don´t smite me. Thanks for all the community service you are doing with your excellent plans, but DORIAN is a massive vulnerability and a priority target. I think that if we manage to find something to heal him, and secondarily RATH, our chances of survival increase dramatically.

We also need to face-tank more actively ourselves, our team is worn. Whoever gets charged by ISABELLE or the CHIMERIC DELUSION needs to have us as a human shield.
>>
>>3649049
>That MAYYY be filthy rules-lawyering...but our swarmlings are FLAME-IMMUNE (by the same thing that makes their acid a flame attack too)
Nope, flame-resistant. Ironblood Brood only provides a single level of resistance. It's acid they're outright immune to.
>>
>>3648647
>>3648775
Updated Orders;

JULIA and DORIAN;
>Go stabilize Dorian.
>Drag the two of you someplace safe, and get Keanes attention to focus the Network on you two.

SHU*;
>Load up two Fullbores and take aim at the DELUSIONS knees. If it charges, it needs to fall.
>Call back and refill the Bishops,transforming them into Super (Rec)Bishops. keep one on yourself, one to Rath, one to November.
>Get up a network of 10 Super (Rec)Knighted-Grapplings.
>Spawn a Super (Rec)Rook-Nomling and have it protect Julia and Dorian.
>send the 10 Super Knighted-Grapplings to the DELUSION, to beat and tie it down with Hundred Hands.
>Send a Super-Crimson and Super-Jackling both to the DELUSION, and team up with Gina to help subdue it.
>fill out the last of your Swarmlings slots with Teams of Super (Rec)Knighted-Grapplings and Super (Rec)Rook-Nomlings, one of each per team.
>Have the Swarmling Teams spread out and look for Isabelle, and Prepare for what she might be planning. The City, Zombies, and Geists should be able to lead the way, but the main focus is to be prepared for when she returns.
>Once Isabelle is found and engaged, the Swarm is to converge on her and keep her distracted, numbers being replaced as necessary.
>Have our second Super-Jackling and second Super-Crimson ride the wave of cannon fodder to go for a stun and connect Gina to Isabelle.
>Get a Jack prepared. Soon as it's necessary, Terraform the ground to trip up Isabelle than slam her into the ground.
>Once she is on the ground, fire the Fullbores at her.
>Be prepared to use your Rooks to defend allies however is necessary.
*Super means as big and powerful a version as you will allow.

AMARA PRIME;
>keep up SONG OF THE SWARM.
>Get the Whistle Ready, add GRA before it then blow it the minute Isabelle is found.

AMARA CLONES;
>One Fifth should focus on splitting again.
>One Fourth the Rest should search for Isabelle, Halos ready for her to try and destroy them to stay hidden.
>One Fourth should Help take down the SLEEPING TERROR
>One Fourth should help take down the HECATON.
>One Fourth should surround Rath and November, fully prepared to help bring down Isabelle and defend them if she attacks.

NOVEMBER and RATH;
>Follow the Trail and try and find Isabelle, but be on guard and keep your distance til her location is known.
>Soon as she is found, have November, try and pin her down with the BAR, while Rath focuses on using her Razor Strands and new Arms to force her out into the open and where we want her.

(1/2)
>>
>>3648647
>>3649068

ALMATH;
>Feel the rage, feed on it. Isabelle must not escape. Find her, force her out into the open, and subdue her.

GINAS TEAM;
>Focus down the DELUSION.
>If Possible, turn Isabelle's greatest fear against her, hijack the DELUSION.

TEAM ELOISE;
>Continue to focus down the HECATON.


TEAM JOHANNA;
>Continue to help the Midnight Crew defeat the SLEEPING TERROR.

MIDNIGHT CREW;
>Continue to fight the SLEEPING TERROR.
>Continue to Boost Shu
>Continue to Boost Quinn
>Keane needs to split off for a moment if she must to help Julia and Dorian.

(2/2)
>>
>>3649049
(I'm afraid that wouldn't work, but that gives me a good idea for an augmentation, so thank you for that.)

(Also, I second your shout out to Work Anon [who hasn't had his trip code as of late]. I greatly appreciate your help with the sheets and your skill with coalescing votes, and I wanted to thank you again for that.)
>>
>>3649068
>>3649070

It is an excellent plan. Supporting it wholeheartedly, and I am the annoying git behind the healing posts. Love the ALMATH order, in particular.

I would just add as an extra task with the lowest priority (only if your 2 primaries are fulfilled first):

> GINA team has a CONDITIONAL ORDER to prevent CANCERBOMB deletion, should the possibility arise.
No speed-up of it, nothing involved. Just prevent the deletion of the CANCERBOMB by the Gluttonous countermeasures. Minimal effort.

> Try to get KOSI to help healing, should she be able and not too messy to handle, gaming-wise.

But it looks good, it´s just final touch-ups for me. Feel free to deny if it interferes with something major.
>>
>>3649153
im still around, i just haven't needed the trip as ive not been away from home due to....being let go from work. short of it is, my old job did not wish to give me bereavement or work with me over...events that i have mentioned in the past, so my employment there did not continue or need to continue. worry not, im fine, have plenty of income saved up, and simply taking it easy and looking for a job ill be able to enjoy much more.

the thanks and appreciation is very welcome and i thank you and others for it. as ive stated in the past, always happy to help you or other anons if you need it with anything, or think of some way i can improve the sheets or other things im involved in. i know BHOP you dont like to feel like you are slacking or anything, but me and other Anons understand the amount of work that goes into this and greatly appreciate all you do, truly, and if making things easier on you or doing something to help streamline things can help you keep up quality and ease the pressure, know we all are open to hearing about it, and understand you aren't slacking off by asking.
>>
>>3649201
you're not annoying, well ok you seem to have a very strong optimist aura about you that chaffs my very strong natural pessimist aura, but that no fault of yours or mark against you, haha.

we do have IDs though, by the way, so no worries on me knowing who you are most of the time.

i suppose neither of those im against as secondary orders. i mean, i the Gina thing i just kinda forgot to add to hers, though i did add in for a Crimson to go after Isabelle. so that ones my bad actually.

Hopefully Keane will be enough, as Kosi is a powerhouse on the battlefield aswell while...well i like Keane, shes a cute little helpful nerd, but she really does have extremely limited actual combat uses, and she needs to fix that.

also wait, how old IS Keane? she on one had seems to mesh with Amara very well, but im not sure if thats based on age as Jackie i think was letting her drink and Quinn didn't at all stop her from sitting down to participate in her...lewd original version of the game. but i swore she was only like 13 so thats kinda iffy morals there on the Midnight Crews part if she is.
>>
>>3649239
>also wait, how old IS Keane? she on one had seems to mesh with Amara very well, but im not sure if thats based on age as Jackie i think was letting her drink and Quinn didn't at all stop her from sitting down to participate in her...lewd original version of the game. but i swore she was only like 13 so thats kinda iffy morals there on the Midnight Crews part if she is.
The sense I got was that she was a younger teen with some repressed emotional development thanks to being in a hospital ward for half her life, so she's playing limbo with that line of maturity. Sometimes she wants to play in the ball pit, sometimes she wants to play drinking games.

But yeah, she really does need some better combat use. The white mage is a great character to have on your team, but they're not especially versatile.
>>
Back from work. what in the fuck just happened here. I need to read this through.

Fucking hell. I step one foot in at home after working in the kitchens and my mother tells me to clean up the dishes that my immediate family left in the sink.
>>
>>3649283
i mean, honestly i dont think we're actually doing too bad, when you consider what we are facing. we've gotten good hits in and gotten her to clearly feel overwhelmed at least a bit every turn, its just we cant cover every avenue or opening perfectly, its just not how these things work, its just she so strong that one place or foot out of line means she can deal an insanely powerful hit through them....or in Dorians case, we literally did nothing wrong shes just so fucking mad and powerful she decided to take the hit to get to him, and honestly theres not much we can do when shes willing to do that.
>>
>>3648658
Bhop, how come Dorian's Halo didn't activate? As far as I could tell Dorian should have immediately went into counter attacking.
>>
>>3649303
i dont think we had it set.
>>
>>3649283
Well, the bad news is that we've been incapable of stopping B'Ni from summoning her memory-monsters. The good news is that they're actually not that tough, we've been taking them down without much trouble. At a guess, I'd say the fact that B'Ni is an unreliable witness means that the duplicates don't have enough detail to them to really replicate the originals' abilities, and the power is having to fill in the blanks and make somewhat generic, inefficient creatures instead. They're still a problem just because there are so many of them, but they're not a huge deal.

As for B'Ni herself, she hasn't been doing so great. She's having one prolonged psychological breakdown, and so is making mistakes and not using her abilities nearly as effectively as she could. She's been infected with the Cancerous Payload, is taking lots of damage, and the best hit she got in so far was on Dorian, knocking him into death saving throws, but we've recovered him to safety. And even then, I think it only happened because he's got the least HP of our party, we need to fix that. We're going to be recovering the Dream Daughters via Arbiter's Appetite after we kill B'Ni, anyone want to give him Eloise's Core? I think they'd get along well, Dorian's a serious fellow like Eloise but unlike her is capable of levity when it's not important to stay focused. So he'd get a new friend, a big boost to his Health and Bio, and Calcite Greaves if he wants to level that up. It would actually be a pretty good investment for Dorian, mobility and slashing damage are his jam, and he doesn't have so many skills that adding one more would strain his progression unduly, unlike some characters like Shu or Julia.

>>3649303
Could be that Dorian getting the lightning off just as B'Ni attacked was a narrative representation of that.
>>
>>3649327
well, we kinda wanted to Give Gina all the cores to catch her up stat wise and because all the Dream Daughters were hers. she needs the stats even more than Dorian.

Also it was because Eloise isnt used to having friends and stuff, so we felt she would be more comfortable with the group she has already gotten to know, as i thin kit was Meg she showed to have opened up even a bit with. suddenly shunting her somewhere else with no other Dream Daughters to talk to might not be what she wants now either, even if she wouldn't outright say it.

also he wouldn't get the Greaves...i mean, ok maybe he could get them from Isabelle, but not from Eloise. Isabelle getting gr eaves was a mutation of Eloises core. not her actual core. its safe to say his would either be closer to her actual core, or a different mutation of it. kinda odd actually that it did that, but then again maybe that was Isabelles hidden abilities doing that.
>>
>>3649303
>>3649310
(You did have it set, and it went off to deliver an extra burst of damage at the end of his lightning bolt. Given B'ni's determination to stop him, she had two grabs primed, the first of which he avoided and the second of which landed a stun. It's why she's been trying to get quick double-hits in on you when she can; she knows how the Halo works since she was with you when you got it, and Mother's Neuromancy shows her when passive counters are primed. As far as why it wasn't represented in the fiction, this Anon >>3649327
has it right. If I tried to narrate the nuances of every roll, it'd get a little nuts. But good catch, regardless; I'm glad you asked.)

>>3649212
(I'm sorry to hear that, but a workplace that's not willing to work with you over a life event like that doesn't deserve someone of your caliber. I wish you a good rest and the best of luck finding a place that deserves your talents and rewards you accordingly.)

(I greatly appreciate the offer, and I'll be taking you up on it in the near future, I'm sure.)

>>3649239
>>3649257
(She's seventeen, and 'younger teen with some repressed emotional development' is an apt descriptor of Keane. She's a bit of a woman-child in a lot of ways, but she's the kindest soul of the bunch. They may herald Jackie as their leader, but Keane's the one that got them to open up to each other.)
>>
>>3649360
ah, thats fair. and we understand you cant add every detail, its fine. i hadnt even noticed she was trying to get in double hits, but then again it feels like she hasn't been very successful so maybe thats why. then again, ive tried to keep Amaras around to use theirs, and its not seemed to of helped most of the time,so maybe shes been suffering getting past them or something in part.

and thanks, im sure ill find a place, and its appreciated.
also duly noted.

>Keane
wait, damn, shes 17?! she doesn't come off like that at all. but hey, no shame on her, i wasn't imply how she acted was bad, only odd, but more power to her i guess. just not how old i would've guessed at all haha.
>>
>>3649068
Anon. I think I know why Jackie's stat boost isn't giving us the full benefits.

Isabelle summoned a Memory construct of Shu as a Chimera with Julia, Rath, and Gina. Since the Shu Construct also has the "Daughter ID: Shu" tag on it, that means the Dual Tech of King's Envoy is boosting both Shu and Chimera Shu.

We will need to be careful against the Chimera because any dual tech or allied buff will also extend to the Chimera. This also includes dual techniques that involve any of the memory constructs.
>>
>>3649359
>well, we kinda wanted to Give Gina all the cores to catch her up stat wise and because all the Dream Daughters were hers. she needs the stats even more than Dorian.
She'd still get over 600% added to her Health and Bio scores, she'd be more than caught up without Eloise. Especially if she gets to count her own Core as an Arbiter's Appetite Core, since we're technically going to absorb it that way and then transfer it to her when she resurrects. It's ambiguous. Point is, Gina is actually going to be one of the most durable members of the party after we resurrect her, which I think is great seeing how squishy she used to be.

>Also it was because Eloise isnt used to having friends and stuff, so we felt she would be more comfortable with the group she has already gotten to know, as i thin kit was Meg she showed to have opened up even a bit with. suddenly shunting her somewhere else with no other Dream Daughters to talk to might not be what she wants now either, even if she wouldn't outright say it.
That's fair. She could still hang out with them while they're sleeping, but she might feel lonely the rest of the time. I just thought Dorian could use a head buddy, too. And he really needs the stats. Maybe we'll give him one of the Hexane Cores, then, give him an alien friend.

>also he wouldn't get the Greaves...i mean, ok maybe he could get them from Isabelle, but not from Eloise. Isabelle getting gr eaves was a mutation of Eloises core. not her actual core. its safe to say his would either be closer to her actual core, or a different mutation of it. kinda odd actually that it did that, but then again maybe that was Isabelles hidden abilities doing that.
It's not that weird, we've seen abilities mutate upon consumption other times. As for Dorian getting it, he'd probably get something close, Eloise is still skating around on her bone blades.

>>3649360
Seventeen, really? Huh. I was thinking closer to fifteen. Damn, Keane, you short. Don't you give me that "I was on dialysis my whole life" excuse, so were your friends and they're plenty tall.
>>
>>3649382
(Haha, yeah. In terms of ages, Jackie is 19, Quinn is 18, Keane is 17, and Ace is 15.)
>>
>>3649382
>>3649392
she's childish. she had to pull puppy-dog eyes on Jackie to play in the fuzzbuzz ballpit with Amara. Also, she spouts tons of memes like a child using her favorite catchphrase. Those context clues should be a dead giveaway.
>>
>>3649399
Yeah, I figured she was a bit of a woman-child, I just didn't realize how much. Again, because she's very short for her age. We're getting you a Fibromancy skill after this, Keane. See if that makes you any taller.
>>
>>3649068
have Julia equip Cursus Alas for extra maneuverability, if Dorian's going to be taking a 1 round breather after being stabilized and given an hp boost, Julia should take the relic off his hands and put it to good use.
>>
>>3649415
I'm not sure Dorian's getting back up before the fight is over. He normally doesn't pass out from being knocked into Death Saving Throws, but B'Ni double-tapped so he might be unconscious from that. Poor guy. He's been doing so much for us against B'Ni, and he keeps getting knocked out.
>>
>>3649391
im not sure about that, as we got the Kings stats before it was summoned, and Jackie was saying said stats were not what they should be. i mean, maybe you are right, but its already in the plan to make it not an issue anymore technically, so if that is it hopefully it wont be an issue for long, or will in a way work for us instead a bit.

>>3649392
fair point on Ginas stats, but yeah i still think Eloise would secretly appreciate sticking with the groups shes gotten to know. im sure we will have other ways to boost Dorians stats, so im not worried about making a thematic sacrifice here.

>>3649398
Ace is the youngest?! by TWO years!? my god their groups is wonderfully weird haha.

>>3649399
Gina is much older than that and she is the Meme Queen. Memes are for all ages Anon, dont discriminate.

>>3649415
i dont think its possible, besides most relics not being transferable as a rule during combat, specifically types like that stick to the person pretty hard and take time to put on, which time is not something she really has.

>>3649406
maybe she likes being short though, makes her cute puppy dog ways manipulate people better.
>>
>>3649406
>Fibromancy.
Oh come on, anon. Every daughter knows that Calcite Armory abilities makes you taller! Just like how milk makes you grow bigger because milk has Calcium...

Why the fuck are there not literal titty-monsters roaming the fleshscape? are there not Cow amalgams or Cow Girl Daughters that provide nutritious Milk?
>>
>>3649429
...Anon, please stop.
besides
Gina is a titty monster, and is implied to not wear a shirt under her hoodie either.
>>
>>3649428
>Ace is the youngest?! by TWO years!? my god their groups is wonderfully weird haha.
I think we already knew that one. Not the exact age, but that Ace was actually the youngest of them. She has a pretty childlike voice, as i recall.
>>
File: Shu's ass.png (42 KB, 285x87)
42 KB
42 KB PNG
>>3649439
stopping said train of thought.
>>3649428
>sees pic related.
also. this needs a picture worthy of this caption
>>
>>3649429
>>3649439
(I've been asked that same question by my friends in real life actually. My answer is because I'm running Body Horror Quest, not /d/ Quest, as amusing as the latter might be to run.)

(Also Gina has a monopoly on that, yes.)
>>
File: Angry Shu Noises.png (220 KB, 275x387)
220 KB
220 KB PNG
>>3649449
id say only god can judge me, but Shu has killed all we have met, so im not so sure about that.
>>
>>3648775
Okay.

I've given the Delusion some thought.
Given that it's a giant mish-mash of Julia, Gina, Shu, and Rath, we can easily assume that it has a conglomerate set of all of our core abilities, but due to Isabelle's unreliable Narrator status, the delusion will use abilities that Isabelle has seen us use the most or assumes the worst of our abilities:

Here's my speculation of the Delusion:
From the Shu aspect:
>Swarm of Bees with its hive mistress core.
>Ravenous Maw and Hundred Handed abilities possible.
From the Rath aspect:
>Boils and Phantom Limbs that can stretch with tensile strands.
From the Julia aspect:
>Flesh Artisan Malleable flesh stacks.
From the Gina aspect:
>Neuromancy cords that paralyze along with the ability to Terraform. Neurotic Halo might be included.
>>
File: FuzzBuzz the Godslayer.png (356 KB, 334x511)
356 KB
356 KB PNG
>>3649596
i can see it. its gonna not be fun to fight, but thats why i said to the Other Anon that Isabelle pulled a smart move, its not a threat we can just ignore. hopefully we can subdue it quickly, but we shall see. Shu has Ginas entire team backing her up against it, so shes not lacking any power to grind against it at least, especially with two stolen Constructs to fling at it too.
>>
>>3649596
I wouldn't be surprised if it's got primarily reactive abilities, too. B'Ni conjured it to buy time while she retreats and licks its wounds. I'm sure it has some offensive abilities just so that we can't ignore it, but the fact that the Shu facet is filled with bees and the Rath facet is filled with lava suggests to me that this thing has a lot of counter-attacks. Hit it too hard and it squirts lava, or shoots out bees, or warps your flesh with the contact you gave it, or hits you with a Neuromancy cord, or whatever.
>>
>>3649624
>>3649662
Point, but despite it being a tactically defensive move, it's a move that's good for what it does: Give Isabelle a breather.

Even if we can't ignore it, what we CAN do is counter what abilities it has to keep it tied up.

I'm re-analyzing the Chimera Delusion and I've narrowed down the main ability features it has after considering Isabelle's emotions and her personal impressions of each memory construct:
>Shu aspect. Hive Mistress core, but with the Swarm Path. Bhop mentioned the low droning hum is from the movement of constructs in the hundreds.
Therefore the swarm constructs will be numerous but very very weak. If we are to Neutralize the Shu aspect, we will need Dorian back on his feet. Masque of War might work. Or November with a BAR.
>Rath aspect
Boils. it seems what Isabelle remembers most of Rath was her Boils ability and mistook the Radiant Boils for Rath's actual core.
Just send in November. Her Forge body renders her immune to flame. She might have a hidden passive where getting hit with flame attacks recharges her core or makes her stronger.
>Gina aspect: Neuromancy but in the mind-control path. Isabelle's warped perception must've resulted because Shu went with Gina when Gina made her choice.
I'm grasping straws on this one. the mind-control neuromancy is gonna be hard to counter. Do not engage in Melee.
>Julia aspect: Complete mystery, but the fact that B'ni disliked Julia on first impression meant that B'ni's impression of Julia is of her with a lvl 6 Sculptress Flesh Artisan Core.

Overall counter strategy against Delusion: Stay at range, use fire. use the necessary resources to keep it occupied blow for blow while Shu's Family diverts more resources to startling Isabelle from her hideyhole. Do not attempt a kaiju battle. Alternatively use the Dream Eater's spores to lull it to sleep.

HeckHanded: Eloise's squad is matching it blow for blow by lopping off limbs at the same rate it can regenerate making it a stalemate. Send in the Ravenous Grin to deal big chunks of damage.

So I'm proposing that Team Gina goes on anti-Kaiju duty. Ravenous Grin goes after Sleeping Terror. Dream Eater neutralizes either Delusion or Heckhanded with Spore Neuromancy.

The rest are my thoughts on what we can do:

Amara clones:
They have Verteilung and can flare it. Lets have them spread out in the city to search for Isabelle. and simultaneously flare their auras to startle Isabelle and force her to use her actions moving away from the source of fear. The moment Isabelle makes her move (voluntarily or preferably Involuntarily), the City can eject her back into our waiting arms.
Isabelle made the move to retreat, so the last thing she ever wants is to be moved back into the center of combat.
>>
>>3649898
i think the strategy we currently have is fine. November still has some Neuro resistances, so you are right she might be the best counter to the Delusion actually, but Shus not in a position to draw away from it so having her focus it Down with Ginas team should be able to end it. also if it has aspects of Rath the Delusion probably has high fire resistances.

actually, Ginas team is best suited to it. not only can Gina probably overpower its neuromancy, but Kosi and Bella both would be able to take out the swarm it has with ease and at range, and together all of them can keep it off its feet and damage it significantly at Range. so yeah, Shu+Ginas Team i think can easily handle it as we already have the Orders set up. November could do good against it but i dont think is necessary against it, and unlike Shu, is in a position to pull away and take care of business elsewhere.

Eloises Squad is not doing poorly and with the MASSIVE plethora of Amara clones coming to help them, and Johannas Team, both those fights i think will be over very quickly.

good idea on the Amaras using Verteilung though, but my worry is it will drive her further away from the combat, not towards it, as getting Amaras safely into position to push her where we want probably isnt going to happen, hence my strategy is to try and pin her down where she is and drag her where we want with Rath, the City, and terraforming, which i think will work better at getting her out into the open where we want. though they can still flare Ver as a defensive measure if they need to, but i think the Halos will work better, as instead of just driving her off, they will instead deal damage that knocks her back.

oh, but what they CAN do is act as a network that covers the entire place in the VER field, so she takes its negative effects no matter where she hides. might even stack really well too as its from multiple sources. yeah, thats actually really good. it would also force her to make a move too, as she cant sit there letting it build up, but also is not gonna be abl to cut down the entire Amara network by a long shot.

Also relying on getting Dorian back this round, even possibly next round ,is just not good strategy. even if he gets back in the game, it has been shown stabilizing and getting stabilized uses alot of ACTs, so this round at least we should let him and Julia rest.
>>
>>3649922
I've read and re-read this vein and the combat sections. I can give you this from reading and re-reading this vein to get a good insight of B'ni's probable mindset (the rational bits of thought driven by primal emotional impulse), how it translates into how she fought had she been given optimal time to fight like how Shu commands her allies, and what the optimal play would have been had Isabelle kept a cool head:

>Starting after being Ambushed by the Geists and Zombie Daughters:
B'ni made the wise move and took a probable long route to move around the horde and throw them off their scent.

>Football Combat, Isabelle getting to the Corpse and what happened after:
B'ni made all the right plays, paralyzing Shu's family, backstabbing Mother, gaining all of her power to herself. But then she fucked up. She let Shu have her last word by completely freeing Shu from the spell. Which then allowed Shu to get away and surprise her. Keep in mind Isabelle wasn't quite acclimated to her new body so the anti-stealth radar was not active yet.
>Optimal play
If I was B'ni was to make optimal use of the 5 rounds of complete paralysis to experiment and explore my new powerset, and I just so happen to have a group of dummies to experiment on.

>Following Shu's surprise gambit and exploitation of B'ni's mercy, unleashing the floodgates and warping out.
B'ni getting caught flatfooted and having a tower collapsing on her, surrounded by two teams of dream daughters and a swarm of geists. Almath hasn't made a move yet. She did her best fending the geists off, and stayed and held her ground while trying to head towards the exit. Understandably, she's frustrated with rage. And then she gets caught by Shu's family alive and well and with reinforcements much to her frustration.
>Optimal play
If I was in B'ni's situation, caught off guard, assaulted from all sides, and still unused to the new body, I would have used my most familiar abilities to reposition and throw them off the scent again to gain any breather of sorts. Alone, facing an army of daughters and geists of innumerable number, I would exploit the raw stats and speed of my new body to put as much distance as possible to let my new body acclimate myself.

(1/?)
>>
>>3649964
>Round 1 of combat against Shu:
B'ni bee-lined towards Shu. That's the first thing she did. Understandably, she was simply mad and wanted to kill Shu asap. But that's her biggest Mistake. She made 1 action that was 100% her own agency, and then had to 5 actions on the defensive and reacting to the plays by Shu's family, with the last one used to summon the constructs, the last of which was a smart play in an attempt to even out the numbers. The construct summoning is a good move that Isabelle did, Summoning Construct!Kosi Chevalier, and Grin, but the commands she gave was suboptimal as she had set them to a reactive command instead of a pro-active command.
>Round 1 Optimal play
In retrospect, the optimal play here in the opening round (considering that Isabelle has a sensory ability active gave her hyper spatial awareness) would be to go for the weakest link first, not charge towards the apparent King-in-command. As for summoning the constructs in chronological order: Watcher could be put on immediate anti-air to cut down Shu's constructs and warding off the Geists, Chevalier could run counter tactics and lead Shu's Skirmisher teams on a wild goose chase while Ravenous Grin would be set to chasing down stationary targets and be a giant bullet sponge that can threaten to swallow daughters who were designated for support roles.

(2/?)
>>
>>3649975
>Round 2 of combat:
Again, Isabelle bee-lined towards Shu. She did use doppelgangers and sent them off to take out Shu's Family, but they immediately got shut-down hard. Her first attempt at attacking Shu was interrupted hard by Rath pulling out an impression of Hulk thrashing Loki except Hulk was using two extra Lokis to smash the original Loki. Her reactive move to this was use a Dual Tech that gave her a Hurricane Cannon. A wide sweeping AOE cone attack that was fired point blank at the designated family Tank in Shu's Family. It's good for tossing Rath out of the field of combat, but damn was it a waste of precious Bio when she tried to shoot Shu with it and had her aim thrown off by the city. And then Julia gave B'ni The Cancer of death. In her brain no less. It's one thing to get hit by the cancer payload, it's another thing to have the payload land on a very very important organ where removing it is equally as life-threatening as the cancer itself. Then B'ni had to spend more bio to summon Four more constructs. Titan-class constructs aren't that cheap you know. I can easily imagine that each Titan-class construct costs 500% bio a pop (with the Giant 300% Bio FuzzBuzz as a reference). But did give them pre-set orders upon spawning.
>Round 2 optimal play:
I would avoid Julia and Dorian at all costs. If I were to be approached by Julia, I would rather sacrifice a cheap doppelganger or have the cancer hit an extremity limb (arms or legs) then chop off said limb before it metastasizes. The Dual Tech is a good move itself, but I would rather reposition first before firing the hurricane cannon. Said cannons apparently cost 2 Actions for one use each since her action economy seems sparse. B'ni did make a smart move however with her constructs, she's slowly learning.

>Round 3 of combat:
Isabelle's first move, again, attacking Shu. In her mindset the 3rd time's the charm. Wrong again. She eats a quad-team attack by Shu, November, Julia, and Dorian, and the City itself. She retaliates and aims for dorian, not caring about the damage done, and uses her Aoe Burst to bring Dorian down to Death's door, but doesn't finish him off. She then proceeds to get thrashed again but by both the Geists AND the Zombie Daughters and has to expend a substantial amount of bio to use the aoe burst. And her following move has her bring out 4 construct gems and then mash them together to create a chimera construct. It probably costs a LOT of bio and a heavy action pool in order to make it. But then she does the tactically wise move: retreat, reposition, re-access her situation, and recover. But this is a big indicator of her current mindset and greatly hints at what her next move might be.
>Round 3 optimal play:
There's too much to optimize, it's a big fuck-up for Isabelle on many levels and she's in too deep for me to figure out how to optimize Isabelle's moves

(3/?)
>>
>>3649922
>but Kosi and Bella both would be able to take out the swarm it has with ease and at range
Don't forget Ravenous Grin. Gluttonous skills excel at destroying enemy constructs. I'm imagining it just gulping down huge mouthfuls of the Delusion's swarm.

>Also relying on getting Dorian back this round, even possibly next round ,is just not good strategy. even if he gets back in the game, it has been shown stabilizing and getting stabilized uses alot of ACTs, so this round at least we should let him and Julia rest.
I do want to get Julia back into combat soon, though. If she uses the stack-doubling function of Sculptress of Flesh on B'Ni it will paralyze her. B'Ni probably has ways to shake that off, but I figure we can get at least a turn out of it.

>>3649964
Yeah, well, nobody said that B'Ni was rational and made good decisions. Rather the opposite, in fact. She's screwed up pretty much every move she's made. Hell, she only even got to the Corpse because Mother cheated for her. B'Ni is capable when she's focused but the moment you manage to break her will it all goes out the window and becomes flailing about with raw power.
>>
>>3649982
>Overall analysis and Round 4 speculation:
Considering her moves and actions since the beginning of combat: Isabelle has wasted tons of bio in the first three rounds trying to go for Shu in which she is severely punished by taking a massive beating and having to expend lots of bio to reset the playing field so she could make her next move, slowly but surely she’s learning the ropes. Three rounds of consecutive beatings where her regen is vastly outstripped by the damage dealt and it worries her greatly. She’s desperate and has to retreat. But this indicates that Isabelle’s mindset is on the verge between fight-or-flight and emotionally unbalanced. If we leave her alone, Isabelle will get a confidence boost and have the opportunity to reset her emotional mindset and start thinking tactically. In Isabelle’s mind, her best bet and the best scenario for her is to lay low and hope that Shu’s team does get tied up by the Chimera she summoned, and use her all of her actions in the round to speak a 7-word skintalker spell, and she’s desperately trying to hope for that outcome, leaving it all to chance and what little agency she has left. And considering that currently much of our resources have been tied up by her constructs and the fact that Isabelle is desperate but has the advantage of hiding, this might be exactly what Isabelle would try to do. Cooler heads would say Isabelle could simply take advantage of the moment to slip away and take the elevator, but right now she’s too committed to the fight she’s fallen for the sunk-cost fallacy. And even if she would, she would have to risk being shot down in the elevator and be trapped in the city.

Also TIL about the general symptoms of Brain cancer:
>Headache: can be acute or persistent
>Muscular: difficulty walking, instability, muscle weakness, problems with coordination, weakness of one side of the body, or weakness of the arms and legs
>Whole body: dizziness, fatigue, or vertigo
>Gastrointestinal: nausea or vomiting
>Sensory: pins and needles or reduced sensation of touch
>Cognitive: inability to speak or understand language or mental confusion
>Also common: blurred vision, difficulty speaking, personality change, seizures, or sleepiness

Considering the following:
>that Isabelle's been given Brain cancer at round 2,
>current projections have the cancer killing Isabelle at the end of round 8 unless Isabelle somehow purges the cancer.
The Cancer should have finished metastasis at the end of round 4 with additional symptoms showing up.
In the first round of brain cancer (round 3 of combat) Isabelle should be experiencing an onset of acute headaches, and some disorientation, but leaving it alone will bring about a whole slew of debuffs onto Isabelle's whole body.
>>
>>3649985
yeah, plus the Dreamers head nonsense will be on our side, and might be able to stun it, giving us ample time to either hijack it or destroy it.

honestly, even if we cant hijack this one, the fact theres even a risk of Gina Hijacking them should really of made Isabelle hesitate to keep throwing them out, but then again, she didn't even start throwing them out to stop us, but as some sorta odd defiance against the memories themselves, despite it seeming shes not actually getting rid of the memories so far by doing this.

i get it, but Julia focusing on Dorian i think is best. they do actually work well together, and not just because of dual techs either, so her getting back into the fight with him once their both healed up i think will work better. also, she doesn't have to be in physical contact to double the stacks, so the only question i can think is, do we want to do that now? my thought is, once Isabelle has been so heavily slowed by it once, she will probably have some way to negate the stacks, and will avoid getting new ones, so while its good, if we do it too soon it might be our one use of it, and we already have quite a few methods this round to try and hinder her movement.

im not against it mind you, just putting out there the dangers of doubling the stacks now.
>>
>>3650001
Good analysis. I think we can cut short her regaining clarity by doing exactly what we're doing, though. Hounding after her, refusing to give up the chase. Not just because it won't give her a chance to hide and regroup, but because it will reinforce the "horrible evil manipulative Sam trying to ruin everything for me why won't she just stop" pathology. She'll likely wind up going for another big smash, an instinctive falling back to a big and flashy attack that can reassure her that she's powerful and in control, even if the more subtle things could be more useful here.

And I'm not sure when the cancer will affect B'Ni. Her body fighting it off took the form of extending the timer, not curing it, so I don't think she can keep slowing it. Her countermeasures have already worked, but we've sped it up enough to have it affect her anyway. I think she'll probably start feeling the symptoms at the normal rate.

>>3650018
>im not against it mind you, just putting out there the dangers of doubling the stacks now.
Well, it wouldn't be this turn. I agree that Julia should tend to Dorian for now. But once he's out of danger, I want her back on the front lines. By that point B'Ni's Radiant absorption will have worn off, and we can have Rath pummeling her with Ignition again. Combine that with Julia firing off three Artisan's Peaks (because if B'Ni is going to rid herself of the stacks anyway, might as well) and Shu laying in with a Heaven's Drill and we can do some major damage. Plus, the Geists and zombies should have gotten past the Sleeping Terror by then, so there will be further damage from them swarming her. So not this turn, but next turn or the turn after would be a good time for Julia to do it.
>>
>>3650050
alright, yeah fair. we'll see how this turn goes of course, but i cant see her getting full stacks or a Peak off as a bad move, mostly will be about timing and how fucked we will be otherwise, or what other nonsense Isabelle throws at us to work around first.
>>
>>3650068
I do have a radical suggestion regarding fighting against Delusion. Have Jackie stop King's Envoy. the Dual Technique seems to go through a process of trying to see if the two "daughters" are there in order to activate the dual tech. But because Isabelle made a memory construct of Shu, the dual technique's registering Two Shus instead of one, hence why the benefits are being siphoned off because the memory constructs have the "Daughter" tag in the crucible system. This will weaken Shu, but honestly we don't need King's Envoy at the moment because Isabelle retreated. We activated King's envoy in order to amplify our swarm's offensive, defensive, and speed against Isabelle in melee, but now that Isabelle isn't actively engaging us and summoned a construct to take advantage of King's envoy, we should cancel King's envoy.
>>
>>3650074
nah, i disagree. again, Kings was weakened before the construct was here, implying its something else negating it. Isabelle probably has some aura ability, or Sam got the other half as she should actually be around somewhere.

our plan also falls apart quickly without Kings, and the benefits of King will still help us end the Delusion faster, aswell as find and deal with Isabelle faster.
>>
>>3650087
>or Sam got the other half as she should actually be around somewhere.
>Sam.
FUCKER MOTHER. The fact that King's Envoy is being siphoned means that Sam has Materialized. Sam might be either heading for Isabelle (which is another bamboozle that we all can't take because fucking dammit, this is the 2nd/3rd time we get cucked out of rescuing Gina and what not) or that Sam is in the background doing sneaky bullshit. Whatever we do, we need to secure everyone, cover our bases and set up some sort of system that will stop our allies from confusing Sam as Shu.
>>
>>3650068
Well, she's running out of constructs. If she can even still make them with that growing brain tumor in the way of her digging memory crystals out of her brain. But all she's got left that would be an intense enough memory are Gretchen, the Bone Wraith, and maybe Dorian. If she even makes them, the Chimerical Delusion felt like her last hurrah of construct summoning. She'll probably resort to personal attack abilities after this. Which makes me a bit nervous chasing after her, she's probably going to try to ambush us with some big hit. But it's important to keep her from calming down, so we have to pursue.

>>3650074
I think it's worth it. King's Envoy specifically upgrades the Trypophilic Hive technique, the Delusion should only be getting partially enhanced if it's what's draining us. And I think our enhanced swarm tearing into it can defeat it faster than an unenhanced swarm fighting an unenhanced Delusion. Plus, as >>3650087 said, it's probably just Sam lurking around here. Which will be a bit of a disappointment to me if that's the case, because I would have liked it if she'd manifested one of the other possible Cores for Shu (I was partial to the Flesh Artisan skin cloak, given what we learned about her reasons for needing control), and so that would mean she's probably got Trypophilic Hive too. Though my disappointment will fade if Sam manifesting means she's going to hit B'Ni in the head with a lava lamp. Come on, Sam, you know you want to do it.
>>
>>3650093
well, that will really depend on some things. while i do think its possible shes the reason for Kings acting up, it could still be an Aura ability. even if its not, the one good thing is, Sam wont be on Isabelles side, and i doubt she can kill her one her own or in even a few rounds, so at the moment, i think we are safe from her doing anything outright catastrophic to us. we also dont know how she spawned. like...is she wearing the same dress as us? id actually say 'no', as even if her odd connection to us is interrupting some things, she still not considered entirely us for sure, so id think she would spawn in her own outfit she died in....assuming the Dream Daughters haven't been spawning naked that is. which im going to assume isnt the case because Shu is not suffering a massive distraction penalty everytime she sees Gina.

and interesting thing is, if Sam is somehow getting some of the boost, it might still not be tied to a Have ability, and might be her own. Sam really is an odd case, as shes clearly considered a separate dream daughter, yet more than once has had hints shes more connected to us than one normally is, yet still doesn't have anymore control over us than a dream daughter. somehow, it feels like she got the worst of both worlds in a way.

>>3650101
maybe, we'll see. she might be able to throw out concepts and amalgams too though, so this might not be over. its literally just memory based, she might even be able to throw herself out, though i have a feeling she wont, as she might be terrified of what it will look like.
>>
>>3650112
>so at the moment, i think we are safe from her doing anything outright catastrophic to us. we also dont know how she spawned. like...is she wearing the same dress as us? id actually say 'no', as even if her odd connection to us is interrupting some things, she still not considered entirely us for sure, so id think she would spawn in her own outfit she died in....assuming the Dream Daughters haven't been spawning naked that is. which im going to assume isnt the case because Shu is not suffering a massive distraction penalty everytime she sees Gina.
Also, the Dream Daughters are slightly translucent and glowing. Our friends would know which was which, Sam is the one that they can see in the dark. And even if she looked identical to us, she's not that great an actress. All it would take is one question from any of our friends, "Hey, how do you feel about having control over your situation at all times?", and it would be immediately clear as Shu gave a measured and calm response and Sam muttered out a strained response as she struggles against the urge to scream about how control is the best thing ever and how dare anyone try to take it from her.

>and interesting thing is, if Sam is somehow getting some of the boost, it might still not be tied to a Have ability, and might be her own. Sam really is an odd case, as shes clearly considered a separate dream daughter, yet more than once has had hints shes more connected to us than one normally is, yet still doesn't have anymore control over us than a dream daughter. somehow, it feels like she got the worst of both worlds in a way.
King's Envoy targets a specific ability. I suppose Sam's unique situation could be warping the normal rules, though. I do want to see one of the alternative power sets we could have had.

>maybe, we'll see. she might be able to throw out concepts and amalgams too though, so this might not be over. its literally just memory based, she might even be able to throw herself out, though i have a feeling she wont, as she might be terrified of what it will look like.
Maybe. But I feel like nothing else she tosses out can be as big as the Delusion. Because it's based on her perception of memories, and so nothing can compare to that. Any further constructs should be minor stuff.
>>
>>3650112
We should have the City spend its action by Isabelle and Sam into the air. With them in the air, everyone can see where they are.
>>3650132
I'm getting the feeling that the Delusion is the last thing Isabelle has up in her sleeves when it comes to her Neuromancy/Phantasmal Conduit ability since she uses it to tear out any memory of Shu that she deemed "tainted".
>>
>>3650132
oh yeah, they do glow. yeah probably wont be an issue.

>>3650142
i mean, close enough to what we already have, just instead we leave it up to the city what will work best. i really dont think Sams a big enough issue to focus on right now, at least not til we get the situation under our control a bit more.

honestly i wouldn't be surprised is Sam is just moping in a corner mumbling to herself, and wont do anything til shes guaranteed to get something out of it, like the bitch she is. my guess is, instead of demanding anything 'major' from us, she will try and get us to release her somehow so she can go fuck off and do her own thing, which id almost be glad to allow.
>>
>>3648647
>>3649068
some minor additions to the Orders;

JULIA and DORIAN;
>Go stabilize Dorian.
>Drag the two of you someplace safe, and get Keanes attention to focus the Network on you two.

SHU*;
>Load up two Fullbores and take aim at the DELUSIONS knees. If it charges, it needs to fall.
>Call back and refill the Bishops,transforming them into Super (Rec)Bishops. keep one on yourself, one to Rath, one to November.
>Get up a network of 10 Super (Rec)Knighted-Grapplings.
>Spawn a Super (Rec)Rook-Nomling and have it protect Julia and Dorian.
>send the 10 Super Knighted-Grapplings to the DELUSION, to beat and tie it down with Hundred Hands.
>Send a Super-Crimson and Super-Jackling both to the DELUSION, and team up with Gina to help subdue it.
>fill out the last of your Swarmlings slots with Teams of Super (Rec)Knighted-Grapplings and Super (Rec)Rook-Nomlings, one of each per team.
>Have the Swarmling Teams spread out and look for Isabelle, and Prepare for what she might be planning. The City, Zombies, and Geists should be able to lead the way, but the main focus is to be prepared for when she returns.
>Once Isabelle is found and engaged, the Swarm is to converge on her and keep her distracted, numbers being replaced as necessary.
>Have our second Super-Jackling and second Super-Crimson ride the wave of cannon fodder to go for a stun and connect Gina to Isabelle.
>Get a Jack prepared. Soon as it's necessary, Terraform the ground to trip up Isabelle than slam her into the ground.
>Once she is on the ground, fire the Fullbores at her.
>Be prepared to use your Rooks to defend allies however is necessary.
*Super means as big and powerful a version as you will allow.

AMARA PRIME;
>keep up SONG OF THE SWARM.
>Get the Whistle Ready, add GRA before it then blow it the minute Isabelle is found.

AMARA CLONES;
>One Fifth should focus on splitting again.
>One Fourth the Rest should search for Isabelle, Halos ready for her to try and destroy them to stay hidden.
>One Fourth should Help take down the SLEEPING TERROR
>One Fourth should help take down the HECATON.
>One Fourth should surround Rath and November, fully prepared to help bring down Isabelle and defend them if she attacks.
>Have the amara Clones activate Verteilung, so no matter where Isabelle goes multiple instances of it are stacking upon her.

NOVEMBER and RATH;
>Follow the Trail and try and find Isabelle, but be on guard and keep your distance til her location is known.
>Soon as she is found, have November, try and pin her down with the BAR, while Rath focuses on using her Razor Strands and new Arms to force her out into the open and where we want her.

(1/2)
>>
>>3650204
>>3647780
>>3649070

ALMATH;
>Feel the rage, feed on it. Isabelle must not escape. Find her, force her out into the open, and subdue her.

GINAS TEAM;
>Focus down the DELUSION.
>If Possible, turn Isabelle's greatest fear against her, hijack the DELUSION.
>Protect the Cancer Bomb if possible.
>Only if the situation gives an opening, have Kosi help heal everyone up.

TEAM ELOISE;
>Continue to focus down the HECATON.

TEAM JOHANNA;
>Continue to help the Midnight Crew defeat the SLEEPING TERROR.

MIDNIGHT CREW;
>Continue to fight the SLEEPING TERROR.
>Continue to Boost Shu
>Continue to Boost Quinn
>Keane needs to split off for a moment if she must to help Julia and Dorian.

(2/2)
>>
>>3648775
Dorian's Sister and Matriarch constructs are going to materialize next round, so what do we have them do?
>>
>>3649327
I'm actually not sure Eloise's power would be listed as a core, since it stopped being one once B'ni got it. It will probably have the level 15 cap that non-cores have.
>>
>>3650147
Well Sam might try to deny us our prize by destroying Isabells Body or might try to acquire it to hold Gina hostage so we release her

>>3650132
The Delusion is probably her biggest Distraction monster she can throw out, tough to kill and difficult to get away from = perfect distraction

>>3648647

I dont think i can add anything to the creatvie Flurry that the other anons got up to create this plan, so i will just support >>3650204
>>3650206
>>
>>3650204
>>3650206

Supporting wholeheartedly. I cannot wait for the kind of ludicrous power that comes with the "SUPER" swarmlings. I mean, it is like a fractal pile of templates.

Maybe they will even get ALL the templates. Like, they are Knighted, and Scarlet, and Jacklings, and Gurren-linged.....
The ultimate swarmling. IT CAN DO EVERYTHING.

Pic very related.
>>
>>3648647

You know...now I finally understand why Isabelle is having a hard time keeping a cool head.

The GHEISTS are BLOOD COURTIERS from darkest dungeon! ANd to improve things, each individual GHEIST is a fractal pile of them, they number in the thousands, and respawn every turn.
No wonder Isabelle is feeling so "stressed". Pun very much intended.

Also, ALMATH is being such a trooper. Those "hinder orders have saved a couple of lifes, at the very least. We really need to give them a worthy military funeral and the Victoria cross, post-mortem.
I am sure NOVEMBER would find the right words for the ceremony.
>>
>>3650539
I can relate...... I hate those courtiers.

I think this entire thing has turned into a darkest Dungeon exprience for Isabelle
We are her final boss she has to kill to try and free herself and its not looking good for her heros she is throwing out
tey are all either getting killed or turn mad

I am gonna keep this picture in my mind thank you anon

Not sure if Almath would take the honors. It might be that as soon as Isabelle/Mother is dead the city will tunr towards the next skintalker/Daughter in general or might start collapsing
>>
File: JACKIE_ROCKs_ON.gif (314 KB, 720x540)
314 KB
314 KB GIF
>>3648606

I also want to point out that Jackie is the VERY BEST D&D Bard that shall ever be, at least until Amara really gets into buffing spells.

Dear Gods the buffing on HIVE MISTRESS swarmling stats & caps.
And let´s not even discuss the 20% BIO cap on swarmlings. It´s so deliciously broken that this anon described it well: "Fuzzbuzz, Slayer of Gods" fits well as a description for the unholy fractal template pile.

In short. Jackie is a Bard of the college of speedmetal, and a full on honorary defiant fool now. May you rock for eternity, you beatiful bastard.
Pic very much related.
>>
>>3650204
I would rather have one of the Dream Team Daughter search for Isabelle instead of having our core team members. We're splitting the Party from doing this, Also, November isn't assigned to counter Delusion as I think she would immensely help with cutting down the Delusions Shu Aspect's swarmlings and tanking Rath Aspect's boils.
>>
>>3650289

Matriarch on stabilization duty for DORIAN.
SISTER gets to attack the closest ennemy construct on sight, with a priority on protecting DORIAN...although maybe it would fare well against the CHIMERIC DELUSION.
>>
>>3650549

Or better yet, Amara loots all the GHEISTS in the city, coallesces them in a pet form, and names it "MR. FLUFFY".

That way, Julia & Dorian can face together one of the staples of parenthood: Trying to convince her VERY enthusiastic daughter that having a pet formed of the very literal screaming SOULS OF THE DAMNED is not a good idea.

Probably argumenting it something like:

> "Amara sweetie...dogs need a lot of space to run in order to be happy! And the penthouse is an appartment, it is too small for him..."

> "But MR. FLUFFY is very calm & well-behaved! And he is so happy! Look at him!! Isn´t it right, MR. FLUFFY?"

"moans with the tortured anguish of the damned".

> " See, he is happy! Can we please keep it. Pleaaaaaase?"

Should this dialogue happen, I bet you there is at least a 50% chance that MR FLUFFY gets to be a permanent fixture of the Penthouse, just next to the FUZBUZZ ball pit. I mean, I bet that Amara "puppy eyes" have an auto-crit feature on them, no saves. Adorable little bugger.
>>
>>3650132

Yep. I still think that broadcasting a warning to everyone via emphatic channel may be a good idea.

Otherwise we may wind up like pic related.
>>
>>3650583
While that interaction would be absolute gold and i will support it, we may not be able to take the Gheists with us even if they should calm down after mothers death and not just disperse.

My guess is they are either tehtered to the place and can not leave, the place will just disintegrate upon mothers death dispelling the Gheists or they will just be able to rest in piece with their percieved murderer dead and will disperse into the ether

Or maybe the city will stop ebing able to reaspond after mother has been removed and will become a city of just Ghosts
>>
File: The Victorious.jpg (1.66 MB, 1820x1820)
1.66 MB
1.66 MB JPG
>>3648647

The Chimeric Delusion charges, and with a steady hand and keen eye you send two Fullbores tearing through its legs, causing it to stumble before the ground it treats upon warps into Uzu’s telltale spiral. With the onrush of power that surges through your hive, an army pours forth, great and terrible forms taking flight, enormous wings lifting your brood of chitinous warriors skyward as they descend upon your foe with needle and clay. The Chimera looses its own swarm, their countless number glowing with amethyst light and orange embers as they clash with your brood, the ground underneath their lightning-fast dogfight spearing forth with spears of earth as Gina adds her own power to the fray.

{Shu, we got this!} Gina says, the urgency in her voice echoing through your skull as Holly and the Ravenous Grin snatch members of the enemy swarm from the air faster than your eye can follow. {Go!}

You toss your whistle to the true Amara before you break into a Bishop-enhanced dash, a pulse of empathic yearning flowing from you into the walls and streets around you, seeping into the stone and metal that make up this remnant of a world that fell long ago. In your wake the Sleeping Terror is thrust skyward on a crucifix of jagged teeth, Johanna creating the opening that Ace takes with relish. The armored juggernaut leaps, her black-hewn axe gripped tight as the obsidian blade cleaves a perfect line through the helpless construct, ending it in a single, precise stroke. Hecatoncheires is flayed open, its writhing core of grasping hands run through by Eloise’s peerless strike before she kicks off, landing perfectly as her defeated foe begins to dissolve into a puddle of inert biomass as her squad cheers her on. She ignores the congratulatory chaos until Meg slings an arm awkwardly around the other girl’s shoulder, and you see a tinge of scarlet bloom in the pale girl’s neck as the ghost of a smile alights on her thin lips.

“Rabbit hunting, huh?” Rath chuckles beside you, keeping pace with her Tormentis-powered stride as November’s armor flares beside her, vents jettisoning a gout of sunset-orange plasma. “Sound good, Aunt Heather?”

“Copy.” November growls, her B.A.R. at the ready as she racks the bolt. “Fully-loaded and ready, kiddo.”

A sudden wave of relief floods your system across the empathic channel as Julia reaches Dorian’s side, his constructs manifesting beside him while your gentle sculptress tends to his wounds.

[DORIAN: STABILIZED]

Your perception shifts mid-run to your searching swarm, your vast team of almost two-dozen pairs of Knights and Rooks sweeping the city streets, sword and shield working in accord to track down your elusive foe before she…there.

There she is.

(Continued)
>>
>>3650920

She’s crouched low in an alley, tearing at her head before the building around her begin to pull away. Before your eyes the tenements peel back, stonework folding aside like delicate papier-mâché as Almath itself opens a path to your foe. “GRA CUNT TER RHO!” Echoes Amaras voice twice over, her words blending with the whistle as the very earth beneath Isabelle’s feet merges with her legs, seizing her in place as Rath lunges, her aunt already opening with a roar of gunfire that’s answered by a Generator’s roar in kind. A hurricane bursts forth one final time, scattering your overwhelming swarm while a wall of quick-thinking Amaras is annihilated by the blast, using their small bodies to shield Rath and November from the worst of the explosion before they’re blown back, their halos activating as one and sending a barrage of focused-fire sneezes hurtling towards you foe and sending B’ni flying into the unforgiving wall behind her.

Your eyes focus on Isabelle to see her body and limbs riddled with misshapen holes that whistle with constant gusts of wind, her warped flesh the result of a both the mass-counter and her own catastrophic backlash, a reverb of her own over-used power. Fighting through the pain, with a final ripping of flesh Isabelle’s gurgled scream echoes through the streets as she tears the tumor free of her brain and hurls it to the ground. You can see she’s trembling, her eyes hazy and unfocused as her scalp knits back together, slurred speech reaching your ears as her Skintalker-boosted voice shudders across the city.

“I just…I just want to be happy…” She mutters to everyone and no-one, eyes watering with agony and sorrow. “…why…why won’t anyone let me be happy? Why…why can’t I be…?”

“You HAD happiness, you fucking idiot!” Comes Rath’s furious retort, the red-head’s seething anger exploding across the empathic line as she stares furiously from the slain children at her feet to the broken girl across the street. “Me! Gina! Shu! You could’ve been part of that if you’d gotten your head out of your ass and realized that we loved you! You could’ve told us! You could’ve talked! We’d have listened!”

“No…no no no, no-one wants to hear what I…” B’ni begins, her muttering cut off by Rath’s echoing scream.

“Cut the shit, goddamnnit! I would’ve listened! I DID listen! I wanted to be your friend!” She fires back, throwing her arm out to you in a desperate gesture. “Shu! Shu would have listened! She always listens!”

“Nobody wants to hear what I have to say…Sam said that I…why would anyone want to hear what I…” Your oldest friend murmurs, emerald eyes swimming with tears as her gaze meets Rath’s. “…this isn’t…this isn’t my fault, I…oh god. I’ve…did I...?"

(Continued)
>>
File: The Grip of the Past.png (419 KB, 800x600)
419 KB
419 KB PNG
>>3650940

Isabelle’s face is a look of dull surprise when her chest promptly explodes with two sharp cracks, her black dress torn as honey oozes out between her shattered ribs, left arm going limp. Behind you, the Chimeric Delusion roars, its own jacks embedded in the Dream Eater and Ravenous Grin as Gina duels it for control of the hideous caricatures. A high, wheezing sound snaps your attention forward as Isabelle draws a harsh breath…

…and speaks.

“OMAREV#?!&@*THA!” Comes the arcane phrase that causes you and your allies’ bodies to churn, your biomass rearranging in an instant according to the raspy, alien decree.

>>HEALTH DIGITS: REVERSED

You drop to your feet from the pain as Isabelle’s swarmed in an instant, the geists tearing across her once more and taking her right arm with them as they disappear below Almath, rounding for their next strike. She doesn’t care about them. Not anymore.

“It doesn’t matter…I’ve done things nobody can forgive.” Isabelle says quietly, gaze boring into the ground at her feet. "I’ll be happy…”

Her jaw clenches, defiance flaring across the line as her eyes well once more with hot tears.

“…I *will* be happy.”

She doesn’t care about her pain, or her body, or her mind. She just wants to be happy, and in that single-minded pursuit she’s deemed that there’s no cost too great.

The tide has turned, but the worst is yet to come.

HP: 650% (+165%, Ignition Gauntlets, Whistle: EMPTY)
BIO: 650% (+60%, 17 Rook-Platelings, 1 Quad Knighted-Grapplings, 3 Grapplings, 3 Jacklings, 3 Scarlet Drones, 3 Bishops, 2 Recursive Bane-Drillings, 10 Rec. Knighted-Grapplings, 1 Rec. Rook-Nomling, 12 Rec. Knight-Grappling, 11 Rec. Rook-Nomling, 64/64)
CONTENDER: Empty, Sword Form.
RAVENOUS MAW: Primed.
HUNDRED-HANDED: None.
ACT: 3/3

RATH HP: 574% (70%, Sui Tormentis [CRITICAL], Gutgrab Daggers, 2400% ATK/SPD/DEF+)
JULIA HP: 113% (20%, Hydras Heart, Manus Caelorum, 12 Daggers, BLOODY RIPPER x 2, Halo: PRIMED)
DORIAN HP: [Stabilized, Mother/Sister Constructs by Julia’s side]
AMARA HP: 440% (100%, Vocem Virtutis, SONG OF THE SWARM, Halo: PRIMED)
NOVEMBER HP: 138% (Tier 1 Core, Uzi)

Team Gina: Uzu, Bella, and Kosi - RAVENOUS GRIN, DREAM EATER: Enthralled
Team Eloise: Sasha, Holly, and Soroitas – ORDERS PENDING (Next Respawn Duration: 1 Round)
Team Johanna: Hera, Gemma, and Niku – ORDERS PENDING
Midnight Crew: Support Network Active, Quinn: 68% Efficacy.

Nightmarish Flood: Re-assembled, surging towards B’ni.

ISABELLE: Cataclysmic, and growing. Intends to use Skintalking at any cost.
MALLEABLE FLESH x9. Locked in place, no arms remaining.
CANCEROUS PAYLOAD: REMOVED.
IMMUNE/ABSORB: N/A, 3 Turns Remaining.

RAVENOUS GRIN, DREAM EATER: Enthralled by Gina, CHIMERA fighting for control.

HECATONCHIERIES & SLEEPING TERROR: DESTROYED.

CHIMERIC DELUSION: Fighting Gina for control, enemy swarm is fending off hijack attempts and the rest of your swarm.

YOU ARE IN CONTROL
>>
(Gentlemen, voting shall remain open for the next three hours. I hope your day is going well, and my apologies for the delay.)
>>
>>3650951
Bhop, I do have questions regarding the fact that Isabelle swapped the health and bio of everyone:

If November's stats had 500~% hp and 138% bio, and Isabelle swapped it, doesn't that mean November's Forgebody has been greatly reinforced?
>>
(Her word pairing rearranged the actual digits of everyone's HEALTH while leaving BIO untouched. Also, Keane's healing field is still up.)
>>
>>3650951
Alright she got rid of the Cancer that must have hurt....... an awful lot.

Well she almost had the grandiose idea that maybe this was also her fault...... If we push her further she might truly break down

She will probably go full suicidal.... That is gonna suck for us, until now she always at least tried to preserve herself but now, she is cornered and will pull out all stops

To kill her we will need an awful lot of Power pumped into her and quickly, the cancer is not gonna cut it

There are no enemy constructsexcept teh Chimeric Delusion left yeah....
Gian seems to have that in a stalemate
I say we introduce Team Eliose inte the mix there to overwhelm the Delusion while
Johanna and her Team come back us up here until the Zombiehord arrives

>>3650961
So she switched everyones BIO with their Health and ice versa? is that interpretaion correct?
>>
>>3650951
>OMAREV#?!&@*THA!
>Oma: all applicable targets
>Rev: Reverse
>#?!: Health
>&@*:
>Tha: ally/self

Interesting spell code.
OMa rev #?! would apply to all targets and reverse their health digits, as the first clause, but the second half &@* Tha would exclude Isabelle from the equation as an additional clause in the spell.

So #?! denotes (VIT?) or Health as an adjective/noun
And &@* is a verb (XEL?) that modifies the spell targeting since it's attached to THA.

Am I correct in this?
>>
>>3650977
BHOP did our Jackling and Crimson Drone reach the Delusion, and how important are they to Ginas ability to fight its neuromancy?
>>
>>3650977
How much of the Amara platoon do we have left?
Of the Amara platoon, how many of them are able to multiply again?
>>
>>3650979
(Removing the cancer took 2 ACTs, and she's running on empty as far as BIO goes with the constant Generator stunts she's been pulling.)

(Also regarding her Skintalker attack: she paired REV with another word that allowed her to switch the digits of everyone's health within range, so someone with 821% HEALTH is reduced to 128%, or 450% is reduced to 54%, and so forth. It actually worked out that Rath got a health boost from the move, as you'll see.)

>>3650994
(Correct.)

>>3650995
(They have been critical to Gina's fight for control. Well done, as this could have gone further south very quickly.)

>>3650998
Half are able to multiply, and there's still 81 remaining after the effects of last round.)
>>
>>3650977
So did it miss Shu? Because hers seems to be the same. It also appears to have actually gimped B'Ni's health regen. Going by our regen value and how it's augmented by Exsanguinating Leash, B'Ni went from 1290%/turn to 390%/turn. Just 260%/turn with how we're reducing it. This seems like actually a really bad move for her. She lost the Cancerous Payload, but given that we've been dealing enough damage to overpower her regeneration when it was much higher she's kind of helpless now.
>>
>>3650951
Orders;

AMARA and AMARA CLONES;
>surround Isabelle.
>have a third overwhelm her with GRA CUNT FOL.
>Have Amara Prime and the last two thirds try and cancel out her spell with FOL GRA SHI SEL.

NOVEMBER;
>Pelt Isabelle with Shotgun blasts, to throw her off and hopefully pummel any and all mouths she tries to form with plasmic lead.

RATH;
>Quickly pelt Isabelle with an endless barrage of boils.
>Activate Ignition and Grasp and use your Strands to shred Isabelle as you use her as the Anchor to pull yourself to her, giving everything you have to silence her.

JULIA and DORIAN;
>Double the stacks on Isabelle and spam Artisan peaks on her. The initial slow should give us time, and the peaks should throw her concentration off.
>Dorian, rest.

SHU;
>quickly load and fire off two cicada rounds into Isabelles head.
>use your Maw to rush forward, aiming to decapitate her, then use your Hundred Hands to quickly clog any and all mouths she tries to form, damn be if her Gluttonous power eats them, spawn more!
>Have the Jacklings and Crimsons not aiding Gina tackle Isabelle to lock her down as much as possible.

ALMATH;
>The Motherlike Skintalker wishes to speak. She shall not be allowed. Silence her voice, however you must.


GINAS TEAM;
>Keep trying to fight and wrestle control from the DELUSION.


MIDNIGHT CREW;
>Use your Swarms to help overwhelm the DELUSION and cut Ginas Constructs free.

TEAM JOHANNA;
>Rush Isabelle.

TEAM ELOISE;
>Use your weaponry and non contact styles to help defeat the DELUSION.

not the hardest plan, Isabelle wants to speak, we cant let it happen.
>>
>>3650951
Can Dorian's family constructs sub for him when it comes to Dual Techs? I'd like to get Julia in here as fast as possible, have them use the Stormfront Waltz.
>>
>>3651012
She had the payload stuck in her head for 2 rounds, with her painfully extracting the tumor at the end of the second round. iirc the payload eats away 20% of the target's total bio pool depending on how long the timer lasts.
>>
>>3651012
(Her health dipped to 594 as a result of the Generator attack, and when it was flipped it turned into 495, then was regenerated back to full even with the weakened regeneration.)

>>3651032
(I'm afraid they cannot. However, given that Julia was also hit by the effect she's only two movement zones away, as B'ni was going to try and finish her and Dorian off before you found her.)
>>
>>3651007

So the Redistribuition is random or does she have some control over how they are rearranged, seeing how it healed Rath she probably does not but i would like to hear it from the Horses Mouth so to speak?

Could it then happen that a theoretical 0 in front of HEALTH like in 0801% Health with a maximum HEALTHpool of 1100% actually bring that 0 back or does it only work with the current Numbers that are there 801% for this example? SO that the results can only be 801%, 108%, 081% or %18%

Are we currently inside the Nétwork fo the Crew? November could use a bit of a heal
>>
>>3651047
(She can have more control over it, but she did not have the ACTs to make it happen. As such, what she let loose was a simple reversal of the numbers.)
>>
>>3651042
its 20% of her TOTAL per turn, resulting in death over 5.
However, we had set it for Julia to risk more Health into the Cancer to speed it up, but BHOP never told us by how much, and Isabelle clearly had resistances to it as her was gonna take 6 turns. at at minimum 40% of her original Bios worth was eaten away, assuming Julias boost at least kept it even, plus whatever mountain she has spent on everything else.
>>
>>3651007
Sweet, is it possible for us to have Amara learn the words once we've decoded them after studying the spell? Or do we still need to hear the rune word in order to use it?
>>
>>3651056
(You still need to learn the Rune word, unless you're actively taught it by another Skintalker.)

>>3651047
(Just realized I skipped the last half of your question. Yes, November is in-network.)
>>
>>3651031
thinking about it, ill add for Julia to rush Isabelle too, using her ranged Daggers to try and pin any mouths she forms shut, and spamming stack attacks if she does get close.

she probably wont, but at this point, no harm in seeing if she cant, and if even one dagger closes one mouth, its one less we have to worry about.
>>
>>3651031
>Have Amara Prime and the last two thirds try and cancel out her spell with FOL GRA SHI SEL.
Only Amara Prime can cast that. Four word spell takes four Skintalking actions, the clones only have three. I also think that combining Fol with Shi doesn't make much sense. Fol breaks concentration and would be used to interrupt a spell, Shi reflects a spell. I'm not sure we have the lexicon needed to make a conditional statement, "Break enemy concentration, but if they get the spell off anyway reflect it". It would have to be two spells. So Amara Prime casts GRA SHI SEL THA, "strongly reflect spells as a counter to them being cast on allies" while the clones cast FOL GRA CUNT, "strongly interrupt enemy concentration".

>>3651043
>(Her health dipped to 594 as a result of the Generator attack, and when it was flipped it turned into 495, then was regenerated back to full even with the weakened regeneration.)
Ah, I didn't realize Shu took damage from that hit. So B'Ni actually did us a favor by hitting us first, otherwise we would have swapped to 056% Health before the regen. I get it.

>(I'm afraid they cannot. However, given that Julia was also hit by the effect she's only two movement zones away, as B'ni was going to try and finish her and Dorian off before you found her.)
Oh, okay, then. Shouldn't matter. The Matron and Sibling should still be able to use his lightning, though, right? They get access to Dorian's abilities but specialized for their roles. Sibling should be able to throw some lightning out. Not as much as Dorian has, but enough.

>>3651066
I think doubling the stacks is a better way to prevent mouths opening, since it completely rigidizes the skin. No lip movement.
>>
>>3651068
GRA is free, and with her relic her clones have 3 Actions if its for a spell. actually we made CUNT free too, though isnt needed to counter a spell if your priming it as a counter.

FOL increases concentration on allies. you're forgetting most words have two effects.
so my spell is 'CONCENTRATED GREATER SPELL COUNTER'

Julia can do the Doubling stacks as her primary and such sure, but i could've sworn either PEAK or Doubling was free, so she should be able to throw the daggers as a secondary action. never hurts to try.
>>
>>3651068
>>3651066
Given that I'll be gone to work in three hours, I do want to give my input when I inevitably miss the next update that rolls around at around 5pm if my quick math is correct:


I want to have Shu hug Isabelle when she's on death's door and apologize for doing this to her. If the apology is too much, the Hug will suffice.

Also Gentlemen if my gut feeling is correct, we'll be facing a massive 6+hours of voting and debate when it comes to Consuming Isabelle probably tonight or in the beginning of next vein.
>>
>>3651068

(The Matron and Sister can ue the lighting, just not any Dual Techs, you're correct.)

(Yes, it actually worked out well for Shu and Rath, both. Given that B'ni can actively 'see' everyone's stats thanks to her Skintalker tree she should have been able to make a better move but she's been doing...poorly...on the sanity rolls, shall we say.)

(Also, given the relative simplicity of the plan that's been posited and that fewer rolls have to be made, you may vote to truncate the voting period to two hours, should you wish. Things are slowing down here, it seems.)

>>3651076
(This is all possible, yes.)
>>
>>3651017
Yeah, with the skintalking being whipped out now, we definitely need to have some Amaras on counter-spell duty.
>>
>>3651076
>GRA is free, and with her relic her clones have 3 Actions if its for a spell. actually we made CUNT free too, though isnt needed to counter a spell if your priming it as a counter.
I thought it was just free BIO cost, not free ACT cost. But BHOP seems to have confirmed this works>>3651080. Huh. Okay, then, those enhancements are ridiculously more potent than I thought they were.

>FOL increases concentration on allies. you're forgetting most words have two effects.
I'm not, I just didn't understand your intent. Thank you for clarifying.

>Julia can do the Doubling stacks as her primary and such sure, but i could've sworn either PEAK or Doubling was free, so she should be able to throw the daggers as a secondary action. never hurts to try.
No, they both take actions, technically. Doubling stacks takes one action, and while Artisan's Peak is itself a free action it has to accompany a melee attack action. Does not specify it has to be a Sculptress of Flesh melee attack, though, want to trigger the Peak by stabbing a mouth with one of the Bloody Rippers?
>>
>>3651079
i think you're talking to the two people most interested in giving Isabelle the middle finger.

>>3651080
er, i mean....im not sure anyone agrees with my plan, BUT i do actually think you are right we wont need three hours. even if no one fully agrees with my plan, i DO think its fair to say Isabelle is clearly running out of steam, and our main objective no matter the plan is to silence her.

so im fine with cutting off an hour BHOP.
>>
>>3651076
If we're going to fire off Fol Gra Shi Sel with the Amara clones, stagger the spells so that it chain fires on the beat of each of Isabelle's act. And given that Isabelle has 7 ACTs total, we will probably need 5 or 8 clones stagger-casting Gra Shi Sel or Fol Gra Shi Sel to interrupt every word Isabelle tries to pull out.
>>
>>3651061
Well, I have been thinking of later going through Mara's files to see if there are any Skintalkers in there and if any of their words are listed.

Though we clearly heard OMA so I think Amara at least learned that from this fight.
>>
>>3651090
...actually you are right, on a technicality, she would HAVE to use her throwing daggers to get off the Peaks, so....fits what i wanted anyways? BHOP did say it was all possible, but im assuming he just saw what you just pointed out for me.

>>3651092
spells stack if im reading many of BHOPS implications right, so we should be able to block the entire spell, or well, im not sure we CAN block individual words, only her finalized spell.

>>3651099
it is very possible after this Amaras lexicon could explode in words from all the sources we have encountered.
>>
>>3651079
Thats not just you, i think everyone who was there for the Spiraling Fear can see that coming.

>>3651080
I take it Isabelle is dancin gon the brink right now..... Will she turn into a roiling mass of Tentacles, gibbering mouths and other random bodyparts if she slips to far tunring into a chaotic spawn of her own nightmares?

I think reducing the Time for voting right now is possible. The plan is solid and can probably find overall support


>>3651091
I like your plan and could not think off any real improvements. Its simple and each action is optimized to fulfill our goal
>>
>>3651091
>tfw the fight's nearing its conclusion and I have to be away at work from 3-8 losing all agency to some critical moments of the quest.

Fucking hell.
>>3651031
Can you add Heavens Drills on the ends of the Hundred Handed? the Drills can plug her mouths, and at the same time allow Shu to drill deeper into Isabelle and deal more damage. If we want to stop Isabelle from exploding into a hunger-mad state, we need to bring her to death's door fast.
>>
>>3651099
She's also got another ten words to learn from the pictures we took of Ascendant statues' inscriptions before they became the Phalanges. We've got a lot of new words for Amara to learn. We should probably put some points into Hollistic Lexicon, too, see what enhancements she gets.

>>3651105
>...actually you are right, on a technicality, she would HAVE to use her throwing daggers to get off the Peaks, so....fits what i wanted anyways? BHOP did say it was all possible, but im assuming he just saw what you just pointed out for me.
Wouldn't it be the opposite? Stab with the daggers, not throw them, because otherwise it's not a melee attack?

>>3651109
>Thats not just you, i think everyone who was there for the Spiraling Fear can see that coming.
Though it should be much simpler, because there are only four skills from B'Ni that are in question about where we allocate them. We can only take the Cores in her, our allies and the Hexane that Mother ate, and our allies are all going to Gina. So that's four new skills to deliberate over who gets them, and most of our points are going to go to raising existing skills.
>>
>>3651109
thanks. really the only things ive added since the first draft is Julias dagger throw, which might be necessary anyways, and the Midnight Crew(Keane) trying to stabilize everyone's Health, which may of been an automatic action anyways or possibly not necessary, but never hurts to stabilize health.

ill give it a bit more time, see if anyone has any minor complaints or additions, but honestly our goal really is simple, and how to stop it too.

>>3651118
sure, ill admit drills dont feel necessary, but they cant at all hurt our chances so good idea.

while i cant agree with being too emotional over Isabelle, shes done too much that even IC i think justifies even Shu being a bit bitter towards her, to be fair to you ill at least try to reel it in from outright condemnation and cruelty towards her. i mean, the second part i wasn't planning to do, but still.

>>3651120
...well fuck, you threw me for a loop and made me think i had read it wrong, and it was just any attack, not a melee attack. damnit boi.
but anyways, then honestly we might not be able to even get it off, as shes two Zones away and it costs 1 ACT per Zone you enter/traverse, so with doubling the stacks she cant hit Isabelle in time no matter what if im calculating this correctly. ill leave the orders as is, just in case, but we shall see i suppose.
>>
>>3650951
>>3651031
right, Updated Orders, though mostly minor things, i think its probably more than enough to stop her. if its not...well...we probably couldn't stop her anyways;

AMARA and AMARA CLONES;
>surround Isabelle.
>have a third overwhelm her with GRA CUNT FOL.
>Have Amara Prime and the last two thirds try and cancel out her spell with FOL GRA SHI SEL.

NOVEMBER;
>Pelt Isabelle with Shotgun blasts, to throw her off and hopefully pummel any and all mouths she tries to form with plasmic lead.

RATH;
>Quickly pelt Isabelle with an endless barrage of boils.
>Activate Ignition and Grasp and use your Strands to shred Isabelle as you use her as the Anchor to pull yourself to her, giving everything you have to silence her.

JULIA and DORIAN;
>Double the stacks on Isabelle and spam Artisan peaks on her. The initial slow should give us time, and the peaks should throw her concentration off.
>Rush Isabelle, trying to pin close any mouths she makes with your ranged daggers. This should be necessary for the Artisan Peaks anyways.
>If you can get close to her, spam as many stack attacks as you can to slow her down.
>Dorian, rest. the Rook and your Constructs will protect you, you did good.

SHU;
>quickly load and fire off two cicada rounds into Isabelles head.
>use your Maw to rush forward, aiming to decapitate her, then use your Hundred Hands topped with Drills to quickly clog any and all mouths she tries to form, damn be if her Gluttonous power eats them, spawn more!
>Have the Jacklings and Crimsons not aiding Gina tackle Isabelle to lock her down as much as possible.
>Have our swarm keep helping Gina with the Delusion.

ALMATH;
>The Skintalker wishes to speak. She shall not be allowed. Silence her voice, however you must.


GINAS TEAM;
>Keep trying to fight and wrestle control from the DELUSION.


MIDNIGHT CREW;
>Use your Swarms to help overwhelm the DELUSION and cut Ginas Constructs free.
>Try and get everyone's Health back to reasonable levels.

TEAM JOHANNA;
>Rush Isabelle.

TEAM ELOISE;
>Use your weaponry and non contact styles to help defeat the DELUSION.

Personally ready to go myself whenever BHOP is, but i understand still giving people their time.
>>
>>3651134
>but anyways, then honestly we might not be able to even get it off, as shes two Zones away and it costs 1 ACT per Zone you enter/traverse, so with doubling the stacks she cant hit Isabelle in time no matter what if im calculating this correctly. ill leave the orders as is, just in case, but we shall see i suppose.
I think it might be fine? Julia gets a free melee attack even without spending Health, so she should be able to get both off. Even if she can't, just the stack-doubling should work, since that would put B'Ni over fifteen Malleable Skin stacks and make her completely rigid.
>>
>>3651142
Anon, I think now's a good time to swap to the Uzi instead of November's Plasma Caster since her health is at 113% and I don't want November to start Red-lining her health. We've got 2 magazines of bullets left anyways.

Also, Have Rath activate Ignition and use the extra Health to both heal November and make use of her recovered Hp pool.
>>
>>3651120
>Though it should be much simpler, because there are only four skills from B'Ni that are in question about where we allocate them. We can only take the Cores in her, our allies and the Hexane that Mother ate, and our allies are all going to Gina. So that's four new skills to deliberate over who gets them, and most of our points are going to go to raising existing skills.

She might have picked up more abilities than the one she uses but she was not in the right mind to find and use them. So there might be more options than we think right now

The Debate over the Skills we want to improve is probably gonna be even harder fought than at the Fear

>>3651134
Well Almath helps us with movement she can be here in one Act easily

I think in the end Shu is gonna be a bit bitter and angry with Isabelle. Tough she will probably still try to give Isabelle a send off as peacefully as possible
>>
>>3651154
the Shotgun has a better chance of stopping any new mouths Isabelle forms though by a country Mile. November is also at range and the least likely to get hit honestly. minus if Isabelle gets off her spell, but if she does that we're all fucked anyways.

Rath is already going into Ignition.

>>3651159
maybe. i left it semi-ambiguous, if thats what the City sees as the best way to silence Isabelle, then sure.
>>
>>3651159
>She might have picked up more abilities than the one she uses but she was not in the right mind to find and use them. So there might be more options than we think right now
Nope, it's just the Cores. Those are the only skills we can safely take. It makes things a lot simpler for us.
>>
>>3651165
>the Shotgun has a better chance of stopping any new mouths Isabelle forms though by a country Mile. November is also at range and the least likely to get hit honestly. minus if Isabelle gets off her spell, but if she does that we're all fucked anyways.
We can also have Rath pay the Health cost for the shotguns shots, thanks to their Dual Tech. Rath has a decent amount of Health in reserve, she can keep up Ignition and fuel her aunt's gun.
>>
>>3651177
agreed. keeping Isabelle around would be a terrible idea. we already have bloody Sam whining in our head, last thing we need is Isabelle...or worse, both, and having to listen to them bicker and fight constantly.
>>
>>3651142
I'd like to add

RATH and NOVEMBER
>Use Familial Armament to fuel November's weapons from Rath's Health pool.
>>
>>3651209
i can back that sure. hopefully Rath wont need that Health herself, but if everyone's so worried about someone on the backlines in the least amount of danger with other sources set aside to heal them already, then it is what it is.
>>
>>3651120
There is going to be so much spell crafting during future fights.
>>
>>3651222
We are, yes. B'Ni is fond of big area of effect attacks, and the back lines aren't that far back right now. We don't want her catching Heather in a blast. Julia is also a risk, but at least she doesn't cast from HP. Also, she has a counter primed, so she can use that to interrupt if B'Ni aims for her.
>>
>>3651268
well yes, except Isabelle is clearly gearing up for a final desperate attack, most likely a skintalker. if we dont stop her, its quite likely it wont matter, so its more its a concern thats unneeded as it probably wont matter how much Health she has if we fail.
>>
>>3651268
Another thing is that we need to keep track of our backline and our weakest and fallen allies. Dorian is ko'd, can't move and yet Isabelle tried to kill him and Julia while they were isolated. If anything, we need to keep our allies on the move.

Also, considering isabelle's preferences and despite her mental state, She would make a really great Generator class daughter or a wizard/mage archtype that specializes in mass aoe.

>>3651281
My theory will be that it's going to be a 7-word spell using the words with the following:
>Oma: all applicable targets placed at the start
>4 new rune words that inflicts heavy damage or brings everyone down to zero hp. A doom spell.
>&@*: Rune word for Exclude
>Tha: ally/self in order to protect Isabelle.
>>
>>3651281
True, but there's always the chance that "use Skintalking at any cost" will result in her pulling out her own big cast from HP attack in order to interrupt us so she can get that spell off. And hey, if the Health values at the end of the turn really don't matter, that applies to Rath just as much, so if it turns out our caution was for nothing we at least haven't hurt ourselves in the process.

>>3651304
One of the words is probably going to be REV. BHOP said that a combo of REV and another word we hadn't discovered was what Mother used to kill Almath. So one of the words will be something that when reversed is incredibly dangerous. Maybe there's a word for Life and she's going to turn it into Death, I don't know.
>>
and now I must leave for work.
>>
>>3651457
later Anon, hope the shift isnt too harsh on ya.
>>
>>3651457
Good bye, anon. Have a nice day.
>>
>>3651457
See you soon Anon

We will hold down the fort dont worry
>>
>>3651080
what was the health/bio cost that isabelle paid to crudely tear into her skull and crudely rip off the tumor?
>>
File: Annihilation.jpg (83 KB, 704x910)
83 KB
83 KB JPG
>>3650951

Your army of cat-eared clones surge forwards, words of power on their lips as November’s mighty shotgun roars once, twice, three times, drowning out Isabelle’s form in a shower of super-heated plasma. Two peals of thunder echo through the city from Dorian’s familiars, their azure lighting surging through B’ni as the air is knocked from her lungs by the blast. Julia’s a bolt all her own, dancing through the fire and flames before laying into her target with a vicious flurry of attacks.

“T-this is for Dorian, you B-BITCH!” Julia screams, every strike a crippling blow as they rock B’ni’s frame with the unrestrained power of the artists’ protective nature brought to bear. With a final clockwise twist of her right palm Isabelle howls with pain, her own body turned into an iron maiden as Artisan’s Peak takes hold.

“INCOMING!” Roars Rath, her body flaring with platinum radiance as she flings a firestorm of boils in advance of her annihilating fist. B’ni disappears in an inferno of nuclear flame before Rath annihilates the ground with her landing, the strike sending Isabelle flying as the boils continue to scream with white-hot rage.

Impossibly, Isabelle’s body begins to vibrate as her body strains past the paralysis, her very cells straining to loose the phrase that will end you and everyone you love, here and now. You can feel it, body, mind, and soul recoiling from the terrible force that builds as the last vestiges of Isabelle’s power coalesces into a final, desperate burst. Suddenly, the street itself rises with incredible speed, a pointed spire lunging into and through Isabelle’s torso to rob her of voice. It’s not enough, and even as your twin Cicada rounds scream through B’ni’s skull mid-flight, her body still thrums with mounting power, her very existence wracked with strain as Rath’s wires tighten, an impossibly powerful yank ripping her free of the spire and sending her plummeting back to solid ground. She lands with a terrible crash as the palladium strands constrict, Isabelle’s body a shining star of burning meat and charring bone. Still the pressure builds, building with a crescendo of unstoppable power that explodes from Isabelle’s body in a burst of hatred and despair.

>OMA-=+{}|/\@$%$&@*THA

No.

No, it's...

It’s over.

A wave of annihilating force surges from the crater where B’ni’s burning form lies, the flames extinguished as every ounce of pain and suffering she’s suffered in this Hexane tomb in thrown outwards. It is a growing wound in space, and affront to life itself, a compressed explosion of agony that will rob you of everything you’ve fought for…

>”FOL GRA SHI SEL.”

A child's voice is heard.

(Continued)
>>
File: Amara, the Voice of All.jpg (1.02 MB, 1280x1422)
1.02 MB
1.02 MB JPG
>>3651667

Amara’s high, pure voice cuts through the gloom, a chorus of voices that speak from the heart. Her words are a statement, with no room for debate...a pure, focused application of will that freezes the annihilating field in place. The intent is clear, her defiant expression and shining eyes trained on the wretch that would take her family from her.

You saved her life, and now she repays the favor tenfold to the woman she's come to see as her mother.

The reversed field compresses inwards with force redoubled, forming a nexus of unspeakable power that collapses into a single point, and then…

…silence.

Light slowly seeps back in to the blackened space, revealing Isabelle’s shattered form, struggling to stand of tattered legs that end just below her knees, her arms stunted in mid-regeneration. Her eyes lock with yours, and she opens her mouth to speak.

No.

No more chances.

You’re sent hurtling forwards when your tongue lashes past her, and it’s with a single, fluid motion that you devour half her body with the close of your guillotine maw.

>>[COMBAT: CEASED]

You land, rising slowly from the pavement as you turn to see what’s left of your forces. The squads and Midnight Crew converge, the remains of the Chimeric Delusion and other constructs dissolving behind them. Dorian’s mother and sister familiars gently deposit the painter’s unconscious form on the sidewalk, and while Julia rushes once more to his side Rath rejoins you, peeling the Sui Tormentis off her muscled frame.

The Geists have stopped their assault, and to your surprise they’re actively restraining the tide of nightmarish dream ghouls, forcing them back and away from where you and your allies have gathered before walls rise up to block them from sight and sound. Perhaps, despite the vengeance that’s been building for eons, Almath knows on some level that this moment does not belong to it. It’s had it’s time, its chance to ruin the plans of the one that that doomed it to memory. Gina stands beside you now, and as you share a glance with her she nods, ushering you onwards with a look of understanding in her hazel eyes. You glance back, and everyone’s given you space, a moment with which to collect yourself and do what must be done.

Almath, the Dreamers, The Crew, Rath and Gina…they understand that this moment is yours, and yours alone.

(Continued)
>>
File: A Glimpse of the End.jpg (1.33 MB, 1240x1920)
1.33 MB
1.33 MB JPG
>>3651692

You stride forwards, slowly removing your helmet as Isabelle’s utterly demolished remains somehow draw breath in the shallow crater Rath made seconds before. Little more than an upper torso now, she just stares skyward.

“Why c-can’t I be happy? Why can’t I just…be happy?” Isabelle murmurs, her form holding itself together by threads and sheer will. “I just wanted a…I wanted…”

A spark of realization, a flicker of understanding as life bleeds from her failing body.

“…a lie.”

It’s with terrible strain that she tilts her head to face you, searching your eyes for something just out of reach.

“…It was never going to happen, was it?” She asks, the bitter truth hanging in the air as her remaining lung wheezes painfully. “It was never real…my whole life, I…I wasted it. My entire…oh god, I…it’s all over, and I…”

She coughs, a gout of blood spilling down her chin as she holds your eyes, hoping against hope that you’ll tell her it wasn’t all in vain, that her entire existence wasn’t hinged on the stuff of madness. You’re not sure what to say as you stare into a pair of broken gemstones, their light slowly fading as tears stream down Isabelle’s face. She can barely speak, and even if she could the only thing she can do right now is sob, surrounded by those that would have welcomed her. She had the power of a god, and she squandered every last drop of that she held in a mad effort to crawl after a work of fiction. She had a family at the end of all things, and she left to pursue a fantasy, head filled with lies she told herself.

Mother once said that Isabelle would steal all that was, that is, and that would be. In the end, she snatched defeat from the jaws of victory, obsessing over something that never was.

Something that could never be.

She granted you the first word, and you've seized the last with your own hands.

You take a deep breath, unsure of what’s about to escape your lips…but you’re certain of one thing, at least.

Your oldest friend and greatest foe lies at your feet, utterly broken as a chill wind whispers through the streets of Mother’s greatest victory, and Isabelle's greatest defeat.

You’ve won. It’s finished.

All that’s left is closure.

>>Twenty-Fifth Vein: Closed.
>>
>>3651692
>You saved her life, and now she repays the favor tenfold to the woman she's come to see as her mother.
Aww, Amara! I'm tearing up here. You're the best daughter we could ask for.
>>
>>3651692

Amara for "best Daughter of the Century"

>Light slowly seeps back in to the blackened space, revealing Isabelle’s shattered form, struggling to stand of tattered legs that end just below her knees, her arms stunted in mid-regeneration. Her eyes lock with yours, and she opens her mouth to speak.
She! survived! that!!!!!! Holy Shit.................

Wait did we get the Kill with the Executioners Jaw? Did we get the extra health on Shu?

>>3651737
Well........ Damn OP that was good
You managed to bring around the Vein and made me feel invested again after killing the supsension in the middle

You did a damn good Job BHOP
>>
(Gentlemen, thank you all for your patience, kindness, and participation. The 25th Vein will open this upcoming Monday, July 15th at 9AM, Eastern Time. There will understandably be a lot to cover, and I look forward to seeing you there as we step into the next section of the journey to the Cord. I shall be around this evening and weekend to address any questions, concerns, and criticisms you may have, and I hope you have a great day. Thank you again for everything, Gentlemen. You're the best group I could possibly ask for, and I look forward to see how you handle what's to come.)
>>
>>3651757
>You managed to bring around the Vein and made me feel invested again after killing the supsension in the middle
Yeah, it was a good fight. I want to apologize for getting so down about things earlier, actually. I've been in kind of a dark place lately, not going to get into it because this isn't my blog. But I keep going through these depressive spells and I'm sorry to BHOP and everyone else here for letting it influence my posting. I'm sure it's been obnoxious, I really should just try to keep it from spilling out and ruining your fun, too. I'm going to work harder at preventing that. This was a great fight. Very cool, and I definitely enjoyed it
>>
>>3651737
well, kinda feels odd to end it without the actual last words honestly, feels like going til Isabelles actual death would mesh better, or moreso, feels like a very odd place to open a Vein on. but....its over. one fucking hell of a brutal fight, up until the end it really didnt feel like we were making any progress, then she just sorta broke.

>>3651667
>when you, yourself, suggested something be a counter-reaction to the enemies spell, and totally still had a small panic attack when it didn't counter the spell til after it went off.
I'm just gonna go with my pessimistic nature just expected something to go wrong.

>>3651758
well, its been an iffy Vein through and through, but still ,thank you for trying your best and being an outstanding QM despite it all. cant say its my favorite by a long shot, but in the end it still had some kick to it. still though, still looking forward to moving on to brighter pastures, and im positive you'll make them outstanding.
>>
>>3651779
We may actually start the next vein with a write-in on those final words, I bet.

Then it's a big point distribution vote, go home, revive Gina, reunite and celebrate, and some down time to look over the stuff from Mother and Charon's old home as well as just hang out. At least that's what I think.
>>
>>3651799
it just feels out of place to start off a Vein with one of the biggest endings to have built up in the game, is my personal opinion.
>>
>>3651775
Sorry to hear that you are having problems
Dont worry about it. Water under the bridge from my side,

Though that could also be that i can be very tonedeaf when in comes to other people

>>3651805
Well every ending is a new beginning in one way or another
>>
>>3651775
nah man you're fine. i understand things can get low in life, and everyone gets through it differently. if a bit of venting her may of helped, then all the more good for it.

>>3651808
ehhh....lets just drop it. Its my opinion, i have my misgivings about it, but its already been decided, so as i said earlier, lets just get over this section of the story and to greener pastures, and leave it behind us, for better or worse, the good and the bad.
>>
>>3651779
>>3651824
(I don't disagree; I'd planned to go up to that point, but given the fact that I'm feeling unwell and am running on little sleep, I remembered the words of everyone here to not push myself, and trying to finish the way I'd intended would have been too much, if I'm being honest. I'm as eager as you are to move past this point...perhaps more so, given the nature of the subject matter and it's origins. In any case, I appreciate everyone's kind words, and I look forward to seeing where you all take the story from here.)
>>
>>3651910
If it is no Trouble how much damage would that Sphere have done to us had we not counterspelled it? Would it have done damage or jsut annihalated us?

And did we get the Lv.6 Bonus of Ravenous Maw with that attack against Isabelle?
>>
>>3651910
ah, no, if thats your reasoning than by all means, please, recover, take your time, and dont push yourself. like ive said, we understand, and are more than willing to try and ease the burden.
i mean, and im not nagging you or pushing you, please take your time, but you are falling back into the habit of letting side projects and info archives fall into disarray again. i understand life is getting in your way, but it might be all the more sign to take your time and play a little bit of catch up again. you werent even able to fully catch up the last time you tried, and i think it might be making you push yourself harder than you need to to make up for it.
whew though, thinking about it, and a bit random, but those bastards from beyond american and nearer the cord must be godamned beasts, if you arent worried about gaining even just some of mothers power in levels wont ruin the balance of the game haha.

and with what you said and some hints you said earlier, im guessing Isabelle is based around and brings up some unpleasant memories for you? if so, know despite what ive said and stick by it, you've still written her and these sections exceptionally well, and i hope they were not too painful for you to write.
>>
(Apologies for the bamboozle, my figures were off on my answers. I was looking at Rath's final attack damage when I gave the four-digit figure.)

>>3651545
(It cost her 617% HEALTH and the remainder of her BIO to extract the Cancer. She was tapping into her health pool tremendously during the final part of the fight.)

>>3651757
(Yes, your maximum health will increase as a result of this kill due to the nature of Ravenous Maw.)

>>3651915
(It would have done 7340% damage six times, due to the variable multi-hit word used.)
>>
>>3651910
Oh, BHOP, you're always running on such little sleep. I really hope you get some rest this weekend, I'm starting to worry for you.
>>
>>3651931
>7340% damage six times
........................................................................................................................................................................................................................................ Well now i can see how Mother killed the City with words.........

How much health did she have. She must have had something in Excess of 58.000% HEALTH. Assuming she could fail two Deathsaving throws before dying by SHUs Hand

>>3651910
Then seriously get some sleep. Like the other anons said recover. You need your strength, otherwise you will just break down at some point. I have been there and just collapsing in the middle of the day because you exhausted yourself is just the worst way to end a day
>>
>>3651758
Goddamn, BHOP. Once again, you deliver a hell of an ending to a Vein. Despite a few rocky moments here and there, you gave us the chance to end things with Isabelle, once and for all, and I think I speak for everybody when I say how glad we are to put an end to this villain. Thanks again for an awesome time, rest well, and I'm really looking forward to the next part of the story.
>>
>>3651935
(I agree, and after this next Vein I'll more than likely take some time to recover and catch up before the 27th Vein opens. I'd also like to pose the open question as to what needs revising and review, as I'm sure my own list is lacking in things you and the others are still waiting on. So let me know, and I'll start working on the issues presented and see how best to tackle it.)

(And yes, the foreign Daughters are marvelously powerful, and I'm looking forward to introducing them.)

(It hasn't been too bad, and Im glad you've found them to be well-written.)

>>3651974
(B'ni's max health was 9,660%, so she was dealing the damage she'd taken multiple times over, without taking the regen into account. In retrospect it was a terrible formula for damage calculation, but all's well that ends well.)

>>3651974
>>3652011
(Thank you for your kind words and concern, and I'll certainly take your advice. Thanks for bearing with me, and I appreciate your participation!)
>>
>>3652045
lemme see....
>still do not have Wests Notes (you hinted the full version would go into more details than just the summarized versions you posted, which ive been looking forward to for awhile ill admit.)
>>While about to add numerous other notes to the pile.
>the Relic Sheet still is super out of Date.
>The Dual Tech sheet should probably be revised into not just the 'new ones', but a place to house all of them in one place.
>i cant remember what, but there was an Abilities level description you wanted to revise.

all i can think of that you're behind on, at least of publicly said works. im sure you've got piles of other stuff in the background to work on too, heh.
>>
>>3652045
I think you are slipping the next Vein should be the 26th

Unless you plan another week like this with getting very few backround things done

>>3652045
Okay that makes it alittle less crazy what she could take. She could just take 5 Failed Deathsaves but the 6th one was to much

i will look forward to getting to know the forgein Daughters. Have we ever established what other Languages Shu knows?
>>
>>3652078
no, hes saying hes gonna run the next Vein, THEN take a break to catch up on things.
>>
>>3652078
>i will look forward to getting to know the forgein Daughters. Have we ever established what other Languages Shu knows?
I don't think it's ever come up. Though I imagine that empathic fields and Skintalking-based psychometry should help bridge any language gaps. Shu getting a sense of what the Daughter is thinking, Amara asking the Daughter's clothes what sort of things she's been doing.
>>
File: Mother Bubbles.jpg (141 KB, 975x819)
141 KB
141 KB JPG
anyways, inspired by pic related, ive thought up a much more wholesome character. not sure how my admittedly kinda sour mood lately lead to this, but despite some...disturbing aspects to her Ability Set, it was a nice change of pace to write a more kindly character and situation;

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1QmjhCKUQyKrtJhnD88Dz8ex4us7xKu1Om6p92AqIB18/edit?usp=sharing

its short but hope its still an enjoyable little tid bit and change of pace a bit.
>>
>>3652091
Well maybe i misinterpreted OPs statement as in an earlier post >>3651758
he said the 25th Vein will open next monday

>>3652103
>>3652091
I would like the Opinion of you guys in the Relic i created after Almaths Rules were established and i felt kind of down after the disaster that was the first Isabelle encounter in the tower

PHYLACTERIC GEM

>A Gem made from the remains of a dead Phantasmal Conduit compressed into a gem roughly the size and form of a Humans Eye. Initially the gem is of a clear coloration. This changes once the Gem is put where it belongs, into the empty Eye Socket of a daughter. Replacing the Daughters Eye and sending the daughter straight into the Dreamscape. When entering the Dreamscape the Daughter can then talk to a consumed daughter to willingly imbue her into the eye
>Otherwise the Living Daughter can force a Dreamdaughter into the Gem, forcibly removing them from the Dreamscape

>The Gem then awakens the live daughter from the Dreamscape and allows her to see through it like with a normal eye.

>The Daughter imbued into the eye gives it a distinctive colour, this can be pretty much any colour the daughter wants, but once made the choice can never be changed. The Daughter imbued into the Gem can no longer be reached through the normal means of the Dreamscape and can no longer give free upgrades to the Power obtained from them and may never return into the live daughters dreamscape forever stuck in the Eye.
>In Exchange the Eye Daughter may at any point communicate with the live Daughter that is her Host via unblockable direct telepathy and they may share feelings and thoughts freely. In Addition the Live Daughter can expend half her current BIO to Summon the Eye Daughter as an independent Entity into a fight.
>The Daughter summoned operates under the Dreamscape rules of having unlimited BIO but is not destroyed if defeated and can not be mindcontroled or confused, merely retreating back into the Live Daughters Eye to recuperate, if defeated, for the rest of the Vein. The Daughter summoned can be fed Levels to increase her power(like a normal level up for a daughter but can not gain any new powers only level the one she has and hybridize them) by having her partake in the Consumption if her summoner does so as well.

>After being summoned the Daughter can operate normaly up to long range while away from her Summoner, for every movement Zone beyond that the Daughter has to make a willpowersave or immediatly return into the Gem for the rest of the encounter Attacking her Summoner also immediatly returns the Eye Daughter into the Eye and locks her there till the end of the Vein.

>The Gem acts like a completely normal human eye and has non of the advantages a daughters eyes might have accumulated but the daughter can not be blinded on the Gemeye.

Letting the Dead stay dead just does not seem fair. Lets give them another Chance.
>>
>>3652127
er, yes. he plans to open the next Vein this monday, run it, then afterwards take a break before the next one to catch up on things.

>>3652127
>Letting the Dead stay dead just does not seem fair. Lets give them another Chance.
well, i mean it depends on the dead, some deserve to stay dead.

>PHYLACTERIC GEM
seems interesting. not a price we would ever pay though. not sure if its possible though, as the current dream daughters only work on those rules due to the city.
>>
>>3652124
Neat. Thanks for sharing.
>>
>>3652124
Oh, she seems nice. I think we'd get along well with her, but that we might risk coming to blows over the fact that Amara is in our party and being taken into danger. I'd hope we could reach a peaceful resolution, though, the Crucible needs people like her.

Speaking of Amara, definite MVP of this fight, huh? Did so much with her clones, sacrificing them to protect us, kept B'Ni constantly bombarded with debuffs, and scored what was functionally the killing blow. Shu might have gotten the execution proper, as is her right, but that was practically a formality after Amara's move. Best daughter we could ask for. It's a nice thematic point, too, the walking embodiment of why kindness is still important in the Crucible taking down someone who would cast away any attempt at others to be kind to her.

>>3652127
It's neat, but I would hate to isolate a Dream Daughter like that. Feels a bit unkind. We come up with a lot of Relic ideas that I don't think our party would ever actually use, you know? But they're still cool ideas, and I hope that some Daughter out there is using similar tools. Maybe one who's eaten someone they're friends with, but who doesn't get along with any of the other Daughters in their dreamscape, and so that one is fine with having a more isolated housing.
>>
>>3652124
its nice and pretty wholesome. The Powerset is pretty disturbing in that she can devour people alive but otherwise pretty neat.
The Conduit Ability can is gonna just explode but that was kind of the point

Thanks for sharing

>>3652150
Oh yes some deserve to stay dead but i was thinking to bring someone sort of back without having to use an engine. If they are willing. You could force someone to get in there but that would be pretty stupid to do

Well the "not truly being able to die" thing i thought would be nice since in all honesty this is based off of a Liches Phylactery. As long as the Phylactery stays intact the lich can always revive

Because that is what Almaths Effects reminded me of
>>
>>3652171
>Amara, definite MVP

I would like to make her a gift later with the Forge something like a stuffed animal that holds a sign or has a button that reads : "Best Daughter of the Century" that she can take to bed when she feels tired

Maybe Gina can make something later after we revived her with a Fibromancer Core to weave Amara a stuffed animal. Just as a thank you for helping revive her.
>>
>>3652158
>>3652171
>>3652172
thanks.

>>3652171
she would listen to Amaras wants id imagine in the end.

and yeah Amara did good. fucking Joyous Many man, my lord.

>>3652172
yeah, no mercy for the wicked and all that.

and fair enough on the Relic.

>>3652202
i mean, we already made her a Quad Knighted-Nomling with a Guardians Heart in it. i think she already has her teddy bear, as it was, and know how much we care for her. poor guy probably gonna get death choked in an inescapable snuggle hold every time Amara sleeps, and will suffer Gina taking at least 20 pictures of the scenario.
>>
>>3652202
>Maybe Gina can make something later after we revived her with a Fibromancer Core to weave Amara a stuffed animal. Just as a thank you for helping revive her.
It would be a Fibromancer/Gluttonous hybrid, given that it's coming from Meg. That probably wouldn't be so great for weaving. She could use the Calcite Armorer Core she'd going to get from Eloise to make Amara a hair pin or something, though, that would be cute.

>>3652212
>i mean, we already made her a Quad Knighted-Nomling with a Guardians Heart in it. i think she already has her teddy bear, as it was, and know how much we care for her. poor guy probably gonna get death choked in an inescapable snuggle hold every time Amara sleeps, and will suffer Gina taking at least 20 pictures of the scenario.
Is FuzzBuzz still alive? I know he was in bad shape when last we saw him but I can't remember if he recovered. BHOP, please tell me that Fluffiest Bee is alive.
>>
>>3652212
Probably more an inescapable snuggledeathpile if she is gonna go to sleep like she did when she fell into Shus bed before the party

>>3652212
>>3652171
What do you guys think about this saber made for Neuromancers?

SLAYER SABER

>A broad Saber wrought from crystalline Biomass encased in a scabbard of Calcite. Wielding this Weapon as more than a simple sword requires the User and Creator to be a Neuromancer.

>(Lv.1) Not willing to be drawn and still sleeping comfortably in its Scabbard which is honed to a razors edge and can effectively be wielded as a sword.The User may choose to expend 50% BIO and an Act to have the Saber amplify the users voice into a psychic shriek. Every Daughter inside medium Range(except the User) must succeed on a save or be disoriented and confused.

>(Lv.2) While Upgrading the saber the Neuromancer forges a connection with the still slumbering mind of the Saber. From then on only the Neuromancer can draw the Saber from its scabbard.
>This connection lasts until the NEuromancer dies. After being drawn the Blade shows its true potential. While being fragile on its own the User can expend 50% BIO while drawing it, to wreath it in crackeling psychic energy. The Energy Field can cut through nearly anything.

>(Lv.3) After Successfully striking a target the User may expend 30% BIO to inflict a random debuff onto the target from the following list:
burning, burning, burning, frostbite, frostbite, frostbite, shocked, shocked, shocked, slowed, slowed, slowed, poisoned, poisoned, poisoned, confused, confused, bleeding, bleeding, paralyzed, paralyzed, severe Bleeding
>In Addition the Energy Field can be used to inflict Neuromancy jacking for an additional 5%BIO Cost on top of the normal Neuromancy Cost

>(Lv.4)With a shriek the, until now, dormant mind of the Saber awakens. This grants the Neuromancer the Ability to direct the Psychic Shriek towards only enemys. In Addition the Saber inflicts significantly more damage as psychic energy rips through the enemy´s body with every cut.

>(Lv.5)Using 2 Acts the User may expend 100% BIO to force every daughter up to medium range to immediatly roll a hunger save with disadvantage as the blade releases a shriek of ancient primal hunger. If they fail they become bestial until the end of the next round. During this time they are frenzied attacking everything in reach priortizing the closest daughter or Amalgam. Any Amalgams that hear the Shriek must roll to resist fear or immediatly try to flee the Area. The Surrounding Terrain also becomes difficult terrain

>If an Enemy is slashed by the Saber the User may choose to let the mind of the Weapon engage the enemys min din a direct psychic assault upon the enemys Dreamscape. There it manifests as a large Bipedal Creature with two sets of arms. The Creature also has the entire neuromantic Arsenal of the Neuromancer that wields the Saber. While Fighting in this way the AOEs are without targeting
>>
>>3652234
Didnt OP mention that Isabelle had the Cores of some of the Ascendants one of them being the Fibromancer(Vultha was her name i think) in Addition to the cores of everybody else she has in her head that were with Gina will be there as well
>>
>>3652234
(Oh, he's absolutely alive. A little thing like a god wouldn't stop him from being there for his charge.)
>>
Vein ended so I'm now posting Phantasmal Conduits. I leaned more on the emotional types than the construct types. I believe I only have Fibromancer and Skintalker left after this.

>Hunger focused Gluttonous hybrid. She has a perk that lets her force a feeling of hunger on other daughters, and doing so lets her keep her own hunger at bay.
>Shock conduit. Instills a sense of surprise, even if the foe was expecting an attack, which makes crits more likely and increases their damage if the foe is fully affected.
>Disgust conduit. Makes foes wish to avoid physical contact and also debuffs Gluttonous powers and attacks.
>Paranoia conduit. Spreads distrust and suspicion among groups of daughters, and then picks off the survivor after the infighting and dissolution. Teams would have to be tight nit to resist it, and being able to counter Conduits wouldn’t hurt either.
>Determination conduit. Makes foes latch on to a goal at the cost of everything else, which gives them more saving throws but locks down one or more of their ACTs.
>Seven Deadly Sins: Greed conduit. Foes are overtaken by selfishness and hoarding, preventing them from spending Bio willingly.
>Seven Deadly Sins: Lust conduit. Neuromancer hybrid who’s constructs can relay heightened senses and control others for her.
>Seven Deadly Sins: Wrath conduit. Sends out waves of anger, causing a decrease in defense but and increase in attack, as well as forcing the affected to target the nearest living thing.
>Seven Deadly Sins: Sloth conduit. Inflicts lethargy upon foes, reducing their ACTs and halfing attack strength if not countered.
>Seven Deadly Sins: Pride conduit. Vitruvian and Skintalker hybrid that flaunts her beauty and sings her own praises, which buffs herself and her constructs, that all have a mirror sheen to reflect her image.
>Seven Deadly Sins: Envy conduit. Flesh Artisan hybrid whose corruption manifests on her constructs instead of her body, giving them a more monstrous appearance in comparison to herself. She deliberately makes them resemble monstrous versions of people she hates or has killed.
>Seven Deadly Sins: Gluttony conduit. Imbues others with a desire to consume, even allies or themselves. It buffs Gluttonous abilities of the user and those affected. She possesses Gluttonous powers herself, of course.
>>
>>3652242
good, FuzzBuzz is best bug. shame he kinda blends into the background, but i suppose he has a job to do and in a way, that is him doing his job well, so carry on FuzzBuzz.
also damn me for posting that meme earlier, now would've been the best time for it. curse my lack of hesitation!

>>3652235
seems a bit odd, but not bad. personally feel like it would be much better if the Debuff was set in stone as just a singular option chose and locked in upon first strike, or based off the daughter wielding it. otherwise it feels a bit too random and unreliable.
>>
>>3652235
It's interesting. Encourages Neuromancers to get into melee more, which is not somewhere they usually excel at, but combine it with some movement boosters and it would make an effective Iaido blade.

>>3652241
He did, but we're already going to give Gina four Arbiter-boosted Cores so that her Dream Daughter friends are in her head. Possibly five if reviving her doesn't remove the Arbiter boost from her own Core. Save some for the rest of us, Gina. You're a backline combatant, what do you even need with all those Health boosts? Let Dorian have some, he REALLY needs it.

>>3652242
Oh thank God. I didn't want to have to console Amara about that. Second-best bee, best literal bee, he needs to survive up to the very end. Past the end, actually, I want FuzzBuzz to become a media icon in the post-Crucible world. He's going to be the new Teddy Bear.
>>
>>3652277
well to be fair, on a technicality Ginas Cores we plan to give her have nothing to do with stats.
>>
>>3652270
I added an option to choose the Debuff for using more BIO. Not sure how balanced that would be if for 60% BIO you can inflict severe Bleeding(OP implied it being a serious debuff


>(Lv.3) After Successfully striking a target the User may expend 30% BIO to inflict a random debuff onto the target from the following list:
burning, burning, burning(+0%), frostbite, frostbite, frostbite(+0%), shocked, shocked, shocked(+0%), slowed, slowed, slowed(+0%), poisoned, poisoned(+10%), poisoned, confused, confused(+10%), bleeding, bleeding(+30%), paralyzed, paralyzed(+40%), severe Bleeding(+60%)
The User may expend 30% BIO + Debuffcost to inflict a specific debuff
>In Addition the Energy Field can be used to inflict Neuromancy jacking for an additional 5%BIO Cost on top of the normal Neuromancy Cost

>>3652270
>>3652277
I will also add the Phylacteric Gem to the Sheet if no one objects. Just so everything is one place even if we may never use it
>>
>>3652290
Yeah, but she's still getting the boosts, along with whatever utterly ridiculous boosts Kosi's Core gives when it's not crippled by cancer. Gina is going to be buff as hell.

>>3652295
>I will also add the Phylacteric Gem to the Sheet if no one objects. Just so everything is one place even if we may never use it
Sure, no objections from me.
>>
>>3652295
sure, it would be T5 BTW, due to needing to use a Daughter to make it.

and eh, fair enough change, guess its just not my personal style when it comes to weaponry.
>>
>>3652312
Well not all Daughter Relics are Tier 5. The two we have are Tier 2 for instance

but because it breaks at least one of the rules of the crucible (Dreamdaughters that die are deleted) i would place it there as well.
You also get a pretty good "Construct" that can not be taken over and might be able to level with you at least a bit
>>
>>3652323
no, you can only make Daughter Relics AT Tier 5 Forges, so even if it technically is not Tier 5 in quality, it is is a Tier 5 Relic as there no point putting it under a tier that cannot make it.
>>
>>3652345
>>3652308

Well i am going to sleep soon so i will drop the last three relics i created here so you guys can take a look at them

LUX SPLENDA
>Taking the Form of an ornate Ring made from Calcite with Neuromantic gem inlays. These inlays take the form of a rising sun and glow softly with a soothing pale light.
>This light calms the bearer and helps set things into the right perspective for calm and tactical analysis. It also helps keep the hunger at bay.

>(Lv.1) The soothing light from the inlays helps keep the User calm giving them a small chance to just shrug off the Effects of Phantasmal Conduit Auras, a success shrugs off a quarter of the total stacks.
>It also increases the Resistance to such effects as a baseline and helps keep the Hunger under control by keeping the Mind of the daughter balanced in essence pushing her hunger threshold up a bit

>(Lv.2) As the Light grows stronger so does the User. Increasing the Willpower of its user and making them able to better keep their concentration up is but hte first upgrade.
>The User may also make a difficult Willpower save everytime they are affected by a skintalker Spell/Power to ignore the effects of the Power/Spell.
>The Baseline effects now half the increase in Phantasmal Conduit Stacks while increasing the chance to shrug off such effects reducing the stacks by half.

>(Lv.3) Enveloping its User completely in light and giving their features a somewhat divine light. This makes it a bit more difficult for a User to sneak around as they now constantly glow while wearing the ring.
>The Positives of this are that the Aura counts as half the Users BIO(for a total 1.5 times the Users Armorbonus from BIO) as additional BIO against ranged attacks and extends the Lv.1 effects to all allies within short range.

>(Lv.4) Strenghtening its glow to a concrete shimmer enveloping the User. This increases the penaltys to a users stealthcheck even if they are otherwise completely invisible.
The Aura now counts as another full BIO Armorbonus(effectively doubeling the users BIO against ranged attacks) for the User to use against ranged attacks.

(1/3) Continued
>>
>>3652388
RADIANT CORE
Requiering a Tier 5 Forge Core and the Core SkillTree of an Electric Generator for its creation is this Core a shining beacon of radience.
When held in ones hand one must hope to be nearly immune towards heat or risk having ones body melted by the intense heat it gives off even in its dormant state.

It may be inserted into a Forge to increase the Outcome of any Smithing done there by 25%. Removing the Core afterwards makes the Forge unusable until repaired.

It may be used to power different devices, increasing their efficency/power by 20% and always carries a risk of overloading the circutry/nerves and dealing high backlash damage to the Deviece it powers and its user.

SUNFURY ANNIHALATOR

A massive and extremely heavy weapon at the very edge of what a single person can move.
Having a long barrel covered in a grill of calcite plating to better disperse heat bildup stick out of a large and heaviliy armored focusing chamber does this weapon require 2 Acts to set up.
After Set up the Weapon requires a lot of energy, like it would be found in a Forge Core. Several smaller /weaker cores can be combined to reach the minimum required Level of Forge core but not higher ones.
Doing so exhausts the forge Cores and turns them to dust if fired more than once.
Firing it requires utmost concentration and good aim as a concentrated beam of searing, burning and screeching light.
It shoots out of the barrel leaving it glowing hot red afterwards and needing to cool down for a round before being able to fire again.
Just being in close proximity to the weapon requires at least resistance to heat/fire damage while it is being fired

>(Lv.3 Forge Core)
This Weapon an effective Range of long range with a maximum of 6 Shots before needing to be reloaded with a fresh Forgecore(The old one can be recharged normally at an active forge).
The Beam it unleashes upon the enemy is incredibly accurate traveling at the speed of light and being nearly impossibly to dodge.
Upon Impact flesh is turned to dust, chitin evaporates and even super dense calcite is turned into little more than molten wreckage as the Daughter takes Catastrophic radiant Damage, Ignoring one Level of Resistance
In Addition every kind of Armor is ineffective against this searing beam ignoring even Relic Armor of the Target.
The Damage may be reduced by shields and large clouds of Chaff however

>(Lv.4 Forge Core)
Extending the Effective Range to extreme range with a maximum Number of 7 Shots before being needed to reload.
The Beam broadens its effect and can be used at close range as a lasershotgun automaticly scoring a hit onto the intended target and burning everyone engaged in melee with the target.
Either way the shot consumes a charge and the weapon still needs to recharge afterwards.

(2/3)Continued
>>
>>3652392

>(Radiant Core)
Now reachign its maximum destructive Potential nothing is save from its destructive wrath. The Number of Shots inside the Magazine increases to 8 until the core is empty.
With an effective Extreme Range and Sniper Accuracy nothing is safe once locked in its wielder sights
Ignoring Elmental Immunities and Resistances alike the Beam turns everything before it to nothing but superheated gas and molten ruins.
The Daughter firing the Beam also needs to be immune to heat/fire damage or take high heat damage every time she fires.
The weapon is now capable of annihalating even other relics in a single shot

Capable of felling Titans in a single shot and reducing their bodies to nothing but their Core. Even capable of being a threat to Leviathans and Behemoths and dealing highly increased damage ageainst such creatures
Wielding such power however comes at a price. Each Shot gives the Weapon a 20% Chance, cumulative for every shot after the first one(in a single combat), to become damaged from Heat Bild Up
There are four damage stages: Heat Sinks Damaged, Focusing Crystals Failing, Containment Damaged, CONTAINMENT BREACH
Each stage carries a 5% chance to immediatly cause a further stage of Damage, they also reduce the Damage dealt by the Weapon by a quarter of its maximum Output as the beam becomes less fucused
Reaching CONTAINMENT BREACH immediatly ruptures the Containment Chamber and sends out beams of radiant destruction, anniahlating everything within short range including the weapon and any other Relics and Daughters
In Addition every daugher up to medium range suffers high radiant Damage and is flung away to long range. Every Daughter at long range takes medium radiant damage.
(The Risk of the Radiant Core is already included)

(3/3) End
>>
>>3652388
Very neat. Fairly straightforward, and not exactly fitting with the aesthetics of the Crucible, but I suppose that's kind of the point. One big tool of defiance against the darkness. I like it. I'd place it as a high Tier Four.

>>3652392
>>3652400
Now these, these are the sort of thing you'd get in a post-Crucible arms race based on Relic tech. I have difficulty seeing any Daughter ever using it, it's got too much set-up and requires too much infrastructure to use in the Crucible itself. But maybe if come the end-game we've got some spare Forge Cores and November needs a final boost of power to compete at the Cord's level. And someone will certainly make one post-Crucible, I can easily see some horrifying Calcite-armored tank wielding it.
>>
>>3652388
seems interesting enough, probably Tier 2.

>>3652392
>Radiant Core
what do you mean by the 'outcome of smithing' ? whats being increased by 25%?

>>3652392
>>3652400
>Sunfury Annihilator
seems, well its interesting, but seems finky and costly for using a forge Core on. it stupid, broken levels of powerful though.
gotta say, makes no sense an enemies Core would survive the shot. if it cant even control if it damages the wielder, it probably couldn't control if it damages the core of the target or not.
>>
>>3652458
The Outcome means that Stats or abilities of the Item are enhanced by 25 % like with the Formisstresses Fingers but as a baseline

The Annihalator is probably something more akin to a static defensive weapon that you could install on an emplacement or maybe a tank but still lug araound with if need be. Wait i could make it compatible with Novembers Tank.

Well i was thinking the core of titans and such seem to be very resilient and there would be a lot of matter that just evaporated and helps disperse the heat of the shot. I can see it though that the Core would just be evaporated as well leaving only molten ruin

>>3652456
Well the Sunfury was based off of a weapon designed to eradicate cityblocks and super heavy vehicels alike in a single shot while being wielded by a hundred meter tall titan made of Steel and Titanium

I just made it portable and found powersorce that is not a massive fusion reactor


BTW where would you guys place the Saber?
>>
>>3652500
Saber is still probably T2. doesn't break the rules, but doesn't actually have growth with the user really.
>>
>>3652512
Yeah, T2 sounds right.
>>
File: A rabbit's regret.png (279 KB, 700x434)
279 KB
279 KB PNG
>>3651758

>"An unseen Bamboozle that breaks the plans of many. A desperate battle that breaks a broken B'ni. Act 2 ends with a bittersweet taste."

>VEIN #25 PRESERVED.

http://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/qstarchive/3637465/

Thanks for running this vein. This was a...complicated arc I'll tell you. So many highs and lows. A gambit made against God, near back-to-back fights that brings almost everyone to low health, a sudden plot twist that nearly broke everyone and sent anons into a fit of despair posting, then a moment where everyone set their feelings aside and worked together to get through this vein and come out on top. And in the end? where was the catharsis that we got from defeating a monumental opponent stronger than Spiral Fear? There wasn't. We couldn't find it. Isabelle's delusion and development was so draining that it honestly was exhausting.

And Isabelle's mental breakdown...it's just sad to see her realize the truth in her dying moments. All the anger that we had built up against her, the emotional struggles between the parties that want to give her the cold shoulder of rejection and the ones who could hope to talk it out with her...It's bitter. yeah. bitter is the perfect word that sums up the entire vein. A bitter struggle that leaves both parties exhausted.

Pic related perfectly encapsulates Isabelle's last moments.

I've got some songs to share.
Isabelle's delusion and Shu's struggle to break through it and her inner conflict between the past and present summed up by this song:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PQDK6x1i8jY

I believe this songs encompasses a certain theme about how Shu and us Anons feels about the conclusion of the battle against Isabelle and Act 2.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lexLAjh8fPA
>>
>>3653073
im not sure BHOP ever actually said this was actually the end of ACT 2? i mean, in its own Ways ACT 1 had many such moments, and it lasted 20 Veins. dont think BHOP mentioned this being the end of the ACT, only maybe this specific arc in the Act.

but yeah, it was certainly an interesting Vein if nothing else for sure.
>>
>>3653101
I'm sorry for mistaking this to be the end of act 2. It just feels fitting to perceive the end of this as the end of act 2 because it gives closure with a major antagonist. FUCK. I just feel so stupid now if Bhop says it's not the end of act 2.

I just got off a grueling work shift ("a simple night" the dining manager said) and then get pulled into doing gardening for my mother the moment I got back home. Forgive me if I'm not honestly thinking straight. I'm exhausted and I just want to have this little moment.
>>
>>3653137
its fine, lifes rough like that sometimes. get yourself some dinner, play some music, read what you missed in the thread and let yourself relax. take your own advice you give to BHOP, eh?
>>
>>3653073
>And in the end? where was the catharsis that we got from defeating a monumental opponent stronger than Spiral Fear? There wasn't. We couldn't find it. Isabelle's delusion and development was so draining that it honestly was exhausting.
I don't know, I might not feel triumphant but I do feel cathartic. It felt good, to finally give B'Ni a proper beatdown while letting her collapse emotionally. Bittersweet, sure, because it shouldn't have had to end this way. But she's given us so much grief over the quest that I can't help but enjoy what happened to her from a schadenfreude standpoint.

>>3653137
I'm sorry to hear that, anon. But hey, you've got the chance to relax some now. Get some rest.
>>
>>3653146
Practice what I preach eh? sometimes it just feels like I'm not getting enough rest even though my body feels fine.

To tell you the truth, I only missed out on the update that showed the battle's end so I didn't miss out on anything important voting-wise.
>>
>>3653177
yeah, BHOP said he originally wanted to end it after we had last words with Isabelle, but was feeling under the weather so made the right decision given the circumstances to wait, even if it wasn't the best moment to stop.

take it how you will. like always, plenty of relics and stuff posted since the end to entertain yourself with reading.
>>
>>3652400
It's missing something you know....

Ah. I know.

THE CHERNOBYL ARMAGEDDON PROTOCOL.
Something that gives the SunFury Annihilator the extra oomph and a legacy to Humanity's First and most well-remembered mistake when handling Nuclear energy. Either face instant death by explosion, a slow and painful death from the nuclear fallout, or take on Radiant corruption mutations (Radiant based corruption mutations) in order to have a chance to survive. (tl;dr A self-destruct button that destroys the relic and creates a Nuclear Explosion that irradiates and destroys Crucible Bio-matter on the scale of the Tzar Bomba)
>>
>>3653233
Actually, our first mistake with nuclear energy was the "Demon Core", a piece of sub-critical plutonium-gallium alloy at Los Alamos during the Manhattan Project. It was involved in two separate incidents that killed the engineers working on it, and was directly responsible for the invention of remote-control robotic tools for working with nuclear material. Demon Cores should absolutely be the name of the next level up of ammunition for the Sunfury. Radiant Cores are Forge Cores modified for more energy output, but have use outside of weaponry. Demon Cores are good for nothing but nuclear devastation.
>>
>>3653334
you know, that does bring up an interesting point for us to look out for. Radiant and Heat are different, so technically, wouldn't they work under different rules and need different Resistances? long term Raths Indignant form might start not being as friendly to allies, depending on how BHOP is actually doing that. id think we are getting away with it right now because its more of a...blooper(?) that we even know about it, as the form technically does not ability wise yet directly have the Radiant attribute applied to it.
>>
>>3653137
(No, I think this is appropriate to end ACT 2. Thank you so much for preserving the Vein, and I'm sorry you had such a grueling work shift. I had seven years in food service, so my sincerest sympathies...it's grueling.)
>>
File: Spoiler Image (486 KB, 709x1000)
486 KB
486 KB JPG
>>3653382
I think the Sister's Constellation augment is making it so that Rath's Radiant damage does not affect her family. Radiant Damage seems to be attributed to a Generator skill since Radioactive materials do nothing but generate radiation.

inb4 pic related shows up as a daughter
>>
>>3653401
well damn, this one was way shorter then the last act.

>>3653402
oh, you're right, thats my bad. for some reason i thought i specifically only stopped Heat damage from hurting allies.
>>
>>3653382
Sisters' Constellation protects Rath's allies from any of her collateral damage, not just Heat-type, so we're fine. It actually applies to all her abilities, so in theory she could even hit us with a Phantom Limb punch by accident (like an enemy redirects it into us in a frantic melee fight) and we'd at most be knocked back.

But yeah, it's kind of interesting the implications for the skill as it levels up. Right now I think it's doing both Radiant and Heat because Rath's got some sort of nuclear reaction fueling her in Ignition mode (probably fusion, because of how her wires keep having allusions made to platinum-group metals, which have been experimented with as catalysts for fusion reactions), so she's using the radiation products to generate heat. Some of that leaks out and causes Radiant-type, but it's mostly Heat damage. Will that change as she gets more control over the power, though, be able to cause pure radiation damage by focusing the reaction into particle beams?
>>
>>3653410
(It wasn't necessarily supposed to be, but no worries. If you declare it so, so it shall be.)
>>
>>3653419
i guess so. fits your odd timing too i guess. you ended ACT 1 on a major cliffhanger right before the Spiral fight, so now you end ACT 2 on a major cliffhanger right before out last words with Isabelle. odd choice, but unique i suppose.

>>3653417
im pretty positive Radiant damage will becomes Indignant focal point long term, but how im not so sure. im thinking you might be right, but any beam type thing would be super late tier. im thinking it'll be
>Heat Focused
>Heat Focused with Radiant under certain circumstances
>Radiant Focused
>Some sorta Radiant bursts/AOE ability around her, to signify overflow/learning to expend it in new ways.
>Basically CC Radiant shotgun blasts/flamers
>then Beam weapons at the end.
>>
>>3653444
What I find interesting is that BHOP said that hybrid skills retain the uses of their parents, if not necessarily their specific implementations, so Indignant Ignition is going to still upgrade Rath's mobility like Tensile Strands did. This suggests to me that she's going to get some sort of nuclear rocket engine at some point, and I am super psyched for that.
>>
>>3653468
well, he said thats only for if a Core is in it, but yeah true it should get some form of mobility enhancement at some point.
>>
>>3653477
>>3653468
actually, that may not be entirely true. Tensile was still heavily more focused on keeping her alive, over mobility, so its very possible thats the part itll focus on.
>>
>>3653410
It felt shorter than the opening act because the opening act had to spend lots of veins establishing the world setting. Actually, Veins 1-4 might as well be considered the Quest's prologue. With veins 5-20 being the Opening 1st act of the quest.

The reason that Act 2 felt so short (even though it wasn't the end of act 2) was because we caught onto the antagonist's plans early and contained the fallout just in the nick of time with early prevention. Otherwise, the act would've extended further and Bhop would have gotten the final boss established. but with Ozmas burned down to only 3 tokens as administrator and her favored daughter killed, she's pretty much stuck with one "safe" cheat move left before she risks being permanantly deleted. Unless Isabelle's death after transferring Ozmas from her corpse into Isabelle also caused Ozmas to be permadead.
>>3653419
I'm sorry for declaring things like that without your permission.

>>3653444
>Rath's later levels and her Radiant attacks
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wpGK-H8tiaM
>>
>>3653481
>>3653477
(Given the fact that Indignant Ignition is such a wonderfully blended Hybrid, she will get mobility, survivability, and incredible offense as she levels up.)

>>3653492
(It's perfectly fine! Don't worry about it, Anon. Also, you all did speed through to the end of this storyline due in part to how well you did with the Sprialing Fear. In fact, the only reason practically all of your Dream Daughters showed up is because you spent the time to speak with them during your down time. Each of them gained a considerable power boost due to your conversations, so well done.)
>>
>>3653481
I hunted down the quote, and he said it would be both, the mobility and survivability. Phantom Limb's strength, too, so I guess she'll be using nuclear reactions in her muscles to produce more energy or something like that. Radical.

>>3545129
>(Please also note that hybrids of any type will have their level-ups comprised of elements of each of their other trees, so Indignant Ignition's level-ups will still give Phantom Limb's strength boosts, Tensile Strand's mobility/survivability increases, and Radiant Boil's elemental damage.)
>>
>>3653525
neat.

>>3653528
well yes, i know that it takes aspect from all the others, i just dont remember him saying both and specifically he did mention Cores act differently in Hybrids than secondaries.
>>
>>3653525
>(It's perfectly fine! Don't worry about it, Anon. Also, you all did speed through to the end of this storyline due in part to how well you did with the Sprialing Fear. In fact, the only reason practically all of your Dream Daughters showed up is because you spent the time to speak with them during your down time. Each of them gained a considerable power boost due to your conversations, so well done.)
I'm becoming increasingly convinced that the Crucible's creators were hoping for the civilizations it preys on to reject it. Like it's some grand test, and you're supposed to reject the "consume each other for power, selfishness is the only moral good" philosophy and team up instead. There are just too many mechanics that encourage you to use the power of friendship.

Oh, and speaking of Dream Daughter upgrades, did Gina get anything from her conversations with her little group? I remember we were discussing that as a possible way Gina could remain balanced with the party when she got back, before we learned about the Revive function on the Sparagmos Engine.
>>
>>3653541
(Yes, she's gotten stronger in ways that will become more obvious when you come to the point of possible revival.)
>>
>>3652124
you know, speaking of 'safe havens', i do wonder if we will run into anymore 'settlements' that we can actually justify visiting IC. id say its possible, but actually as we get nearer the Cord id think such places probably thin out really quickly. too many looking for that missing kick to their skills to be allowed to climb the cord, so trust probably wears thin alot easier and grouping up like that is probably just asking for trouble. shame, but it would make sense, unfortunately, for most if not all of the decent folk settlements to have backed off from the cord, maybe even a shiton like in my idea. just cant see places like the monastery existing past the river or forest really.
>>
>>3653551
Excellent. Gina's actually going to be pretty buff, between those upgrades, the levels of Neruomancy that Rath, Julia and Dorian are hanging on to for her, and the Arbiter-boosted Daughters she'll get in the process of bringing her friends with her to her personal mindscape.

>>3653555
Maybe. But as you get closer, the average Daughter also gets more dangerous, and so there's more risk involved in attacking random people for level-ups. I can see a community managing to hold itself together by that logic, nobody being willing enough to start a fight within city limits. Too much danger of a bunch of high-level Daughters ganging up on you in response.
>>
>>3653555
I still like the idea of a "Last stop" settlement that's been established by the crucible itself where all the endgame daughters hang out there with an established trust of a neutral zone, where it's become a custom in said settlement to wish all departing daughters good luck.
>>
>>3653578
maybe, but the Cords also so dangerous it would probably drive many to see the need to take risks, and while it is a Risk, if you feel you're just that little bit more, you might see such a settlement as one big snack, not as a threat. plus, lets be honest, for the most part, the types of daughters that make it that far probably arent friendly enough to want to hang around others, even if they dont outright wish to attack them. our families breed is clearly very rare, at least when it comes to being strong.

>>3653586
i just cannot see it, and dont think its true, as we already have been told that entire area around the Cord(or at least the entrance) is basically a warzone. probably a bad mix of daughters being turned down by the guardian desperately looking for the power they are missing to enter, and others who may be allowed to enter, but arent sure they are ready, or survived a failed attempt to climb, and are trying to get more strength while stopping others from entering, as anyone that enters is a major threat to your own victory.
>>
>>3653578
>>3653586
(Good to see I won't disappoint you Gentlemen, then. While the area around the Cord is pure, unbridled Chaos, there is something of a 'Last Stop' so to speak a conservatively safe distance away.)
>>
>>3653606
the tension in that place has gotta be thick enough to cause breathing problems id imagine.
>>
>>3653419
Questions:

>How big is our threat gauge to the Crucible if it's still working despite Mother Ozmas becoming absolutely gimped and down to 3 tokens?
>"A group of daughters defeating Mother and her favored daughter" The planet's entire fleshscape is gonna have a fucking field day with this news. All the skintalkers will hear of this news and gossip will spread like a world-wide Neural pulse. Will they?
>Karma is gonna have some words with us is it? We used the Contender gun so many times to maximum effect. How many levels is the Contender gonna get?
>Is Ozmas defeated/deleted from having her mindstate transferred to Isabelle or is she still in the admin chair but horribly weakened to the point where she can't really do anything?


A Hexxane Contender Ammunition idea
>MIRV STINGERS: A Hybrid combination of HeavensDrill, Hundred-Handed, and the Hive Mistress core, this ammunition is a bullet in-name only as the "bullet" is actually a Spiral Drill Stinger as long and thick of the Contender's entire Barrel. The bullet immediately flies like a live homing missile that breaks up mid-air (either by design or if its intercepted) to unleash it's MIRV payload of 20 smaller faster stinger missiles that auto-lock on and hone in on its intended target. Base Stinger Missle costs 30% bio to make, Missile base is 10% bio, comes with 10 stinger Mirvs by default, each additional mirv stinger costs 2% bio. Although not useful against single targets, when up against an army, this ammunition will ensure every enemy will feel its sting.
>>
>>3653606
It better be named Babel Town, complete with the sign "Welcome to Babel Town" written in all the languages, live, dead, and alien. It just seems so fitting to have a "last stop" settlement that exists across all crucibles established at the base of the Tower of Babel that is the Crucible's Cord.
>>3653608

>>3653610
Gah fuck. I screwed up on my math with the Mirv Stingers idea. to Clarify and rectify the math error: The Ammunition itself costs 50% bio. The Missile Base is 10% bio, the smaller mirv missiles inside the big one costs 2% bio each, and the entire missile comes with 20 smaller mirv missiles by default.
>>
>>3653610
(Your Threat Level would be Maximum, if she were to put a term to it.)

(Also, pic related is how the world will be reacting shortly.)

(Karma as two level ups primed to go off, and Ozmas is still in the Administrator's seat.)
>>
>>3653610
>>3653626
so, basically, its a round thats our Recursive Swarmlngs, except a little bit more damage in exchange for not staying around?

>>3653627
>(Also, pic related is how the world will be reacting shortly.)
well, thats ominous, as i dont know if you mean word of what happened will get around, the literal Crucible itself is gonna react, or both.

oh speaking of BHOP, not sure if you saw them, but i made two Family Techs a Vein or two ago, and i was interested in how well i had balanced them in your opinion? i can repost them if you did not see/remember them, if you're feeling up to looking them over.
>>
>>3653627
>(Also, pic related is how the world will be reacting shortly.)
We've got to do something to maintain our rep next to all those scary super-strong Daughters who have fought their way across continents when we only had to go across state lines.

>(Karma as two level ups primed to go off, and Ozmas is still in the Administrator's seat.)
Oh, so Mother's name is Ozmas? We have OOC confirmation of that? Cool. I was just writing up a post on how in retrospect, with you mentioning that Charon took part in eating the Ascendants, we might not be able to rely on the assumption that the hurting and desperate person Phalanx-Vultha was talking about was Mother. But that is her name, then, great. I look forward to calling her by it the next time she contacts us in the dreamscape.
>>
>>3653627
Is there a major Landmark consisting of wild terraformed terrain that marked Dorian's Marathon run? Has it become a notable location in and of itself? Because Dorian's race against Ozmas is fucking legendary, 700 movement tiles of wild terrain in a single straight line from Ozma's house to Almath fighting against a storm and Mother's cheat tokens is a sight to see.
Does it have a name?
>>
>>3653627
Can we have an excerpt from a different scene and pov that shows all notable NPCs in different locations of the Crucible reacting to the news? I really, REALLY want to see scenes of how they react. It can be a good way to give hints and foreshadow the foreign and native daughters that you plan on bringing to the table.
>>
>>3653633
yeah, and the best part? its Ozmas didnt touch his ass at all, what got him was him actually succeeding in his mission, but Isabelle somehow being able to be prepared to ambush him. and badass motherfucker still couldn't be killed and still got the marker into the ground.

Dorian has not had a pleasant time this Arc though, by god. hes starting to get pummeled as often as Rath is, but thats not good as its basically Raths job to take those hits, hes supposed to do the opposite.

>>3653635
i think BHOP said that stuff is for after the end of the game, and i can understand his reasoning for it.
>>
>>3653637
His mist Form is fragile though. strong winds, aoe, and rain can destabilize him badly. And he's supposed to be built as a fragile speedster.
>>
>>3653630
(I do recall, and they were quite well balanced if memory serves. I would like to see them again, if you don't mind postin them.)

>>3653631
(Yes, to confirm; Mother is Ozmas.)

>>3653633
(It's known as the Wisdom Wastes by those that have travered it in the past, as it's peppered with massive teeth and curiously-shaped mushrooms that are partially made of calcite.)

>>3653635
(Ha, that's a fun idea. If people would like me too, I'll be happy to do so. I've toyed with the idea of light side-story 'Arteries' that are from different characters' perspectives but are still player-driven, kind of as a break from the storyline with Shu and company. If there's interest, I'd be open to it. Most of it I've been saving for the end of the game, however.)

>>3653637
(Dorian's been comically resilient this Arc, indeed. He's been through so much and has been tanking it like a champ despite what his build is meant to do.)
>>
>>3653627
>the entire world just screams
>the skintalkers are screaming
>Daughters who aren't skintalkers can also hear the fleshscape screaming
>Everyone can even hear Mother of all beings screaming
>said daughters are also screaming because they don't know wtf is goin on.
>they resume screaming after skintalkers explain to them the news.
>>
>>3653642
he wasn't in mist form i dont think, specifically because of that.

>>3653646
yeah, Dorians been a Champ. also Rath, its funny how Rath always has the Sui and has some pretty good Defenses on her own, yet she constantly gets punted away like a rag doll and limps back with minuscule health left. yet the fact she always comes back from enemies who can fuck with her so badly is a testament to just how resilient she actually is.

ill post em in a second.
>>
>>3653646
As much as I'm interested by it, I don't want to pile more on your plate so don't. But keep the reactions in your mind fresh and write them down on your own private notepad document.
>>
>>3653637
>yeah, and the best part? its Ozmas didnt touch his ass at all, what got him was him actually succeeding in his mission, but Isabelle somehow being able to be prepared to ambush him. and badass motherfucker still couldn't be killed and still got the marker into the ground.
I think he was, personally, the greatest drain on Mother's tokens this fight. He knocked out at least ten of them on his own by forcing Mother to put obstacles in his path and then evading them, possibly more if she formed multiple obstacles per turn. The closest runner-up is November killing five of the Phalanges, but she doesn't get the credit for them forming because that was a threat to the group. Dorian is another MVP alongside Amara. Honestly, though, we might as well give MVP status to every single one of our party, they've all been amazing.

>Dorian has not had a pleasant time this Arc though, by god. hes starting to get pummeled as often as Rath is, but thats not good as its basically Raths job to take those hits, hes supposed to do the opposite.
Yeah, he's been knocked out by B'Ni twice in as many hours. Seriously, we need to give him one of the Cores we're going to recover off of B'Ni, he's desperate for stat boosts right now. I'm in favor of Vultha, personally. I don't think we know the starting stats of every class, but Fibromancers should start with pretty high Health, right? Double that from the Arbiter boost and Doria should get another 250-300% Health. Plus, Vultha's Fibromancy gives speed and slashing damage going by what his Phalanx did, so if Dorian ever gets enough spare points to invest in it he'd get more of what he's good at.

>>3653646
>(Yes, to confirm; Mother is Ozmas.)
Lovely. I look forward to taunting her with our knowledge of her past. I don't think Mother would like being reminded that she used to be a person and not a god-monster.

>(Ha, that's a fun idea. If people would like me too, I'll be happy to do so. I've toyed with the idea of light side-story 'Arteries' that are from different characters' perspectives but are still player-driven, kind of as a break from the storyline with Shu and company. If there's interest, I'd be open to it. Most of it I've been saving for the end of the game, however.)
I'd say save most of it. At the very least don't do it for a while, we've still got plenty of things to resolve with Shu's story before we can reach a suitable break point to go look at someone else for a bit.

>(Dorian's been comically resilient this Arc, indeed. He's been through so much and has been tanking it like a champ despite what his build is meant to do.)
He's Best Boy, you can't keep him down.
>>
>>3653646
>(Ha, that's a fun idea. If people would like me too, I'll be happy to do so. I've toyed with the idea of light side-story 'Arteries' that are from different characters' perspectives but are still player-driven, kind of as a break from the storyline with Shu and company. If there's interest, I'd be open to it. Most of it I've been saving for the end of the game, however.)

all depends on you BHOP. ive seen several other Quests do that, as a way to keep the playbase around and engaged in a more light and easygoing side quest while they work on getting everything prepared for the main Quest. not sure if that would work well for your style though, but if you think it would work, im not at all against it, and would love it, but if it wouldn't be to your benefit, save it til the end of the Quest as a whole.

>>3653657
yeah, everyone's been amazing. even the dream Daughters, though, they had major advantages to their goals.
>>
>>3653657
>>3653655
>>3653646
I have a day off this monday July 15th, which is the day the new vein opens. So hooray! I get to relax and discuss consume upgrades and Contender upgrades immediately in the new thread without getting interrupted by work!

>>3653627
Are the Midnight Crew included in having a MAXIMUM Threat gauge? they are allied with Shu's family afterall, after breaking bread and collaborating with them.
>>
>>3653646
right, here you are BHOP, hope they are at least good inspiration for ya!;

>FIRE FLIES(Shu x Rath, -2% Bio Shu + -1% Health Rath per Construct); combining the immense heat from Raths Ignition, condensed down into a singular point with Shus Subversive Swarmlings, and boosted with a Bishops liquid accelerator, Shu may now conjure up a swarm of bright, burning miniature swarmlings, able to speed off with a loud, deafening pop towards their target, each one impacting like a bullet and injecting liquid fire directly into the targets veins. Each successful injection adds a 1% stacking debuff affecting Concentration, Reaction Time, and Mobility to the enemy as they fight against the pain of their very veins burning from the inside, aswell as each successful injection building up a 1% stacking Crit Enhancer upon the foe, released in a crescendo of fire the next Critical Hit they take from any Heat or Piercing damage source, the fire in their veins reacting violently to rupture the target, covering them in their own molten blood. If the Stacking modifier reaches a point of 25%, then each turn the unfortunate target must make a Saving throw, and an extra one per stack of 25% past the first, or suffer an automatic critical hit from the fire In their veins, the Fire then bursting forth in such a massive quantity the zone underneath them thus becomes a lava zone for the next three turns. Rath likes to Burn and Shu likes to Swarm, why not do both, together?

(1/2)
>>
>>3653646
>>3653667

>STORM-BOLT ARTILLERY(November+Dorian); while perhaps not the closest in the family Shu has brought together, none can deny to practical pragmatism both share, helping form a respect between the two. By opening up either her Shotgun or BAR to accept outside ammunition, Dorian may now inject accumulated charges into Novembers metallic weapons, essentially turning them into a form of accelerator cannon. While the Shotgun is able to fire custom rounds both made on the fly or from forges, the BAR instead may only take stock standard solid shots, in exchange for a 25% increase in velocity, giving the duo a fine choice between sheer versatility and sheer damage. this new weapon severely cuts down on wasted health on Novembers part, Dorians own stacks of electricity coming cheap aswell, allowing for efficient application of long ranged firepower. For 1 stack the projectile may be fired out at a velocity akin to most battle rifles, at 5 stacks the projectile has the velocity akin to a heavy anti-material rifle, at 10 stacks one must be sure November is prepared with steady feet, as her arm fires off with a velocity and power level matched only perhaps by her own tank, and at 20 stacks one must hope November has her back to a solid foundation, the shot ringing out with such velocity as to perhaps match her own Autumn Protocol, with a high 25% risk of outright shattering her arm from the force exerted upon firing this weapon. Some may say there is a limit to what power a single person should wield, to these two, it is only a matter of how cost effective it can be brought to bare.

>>BREMSSTRAHLUNG PROTOCOLS(Storm-Bolt Artillery Extension); November may instead choose to open herself up to far greater risk, putting much heavier trust into Dorian and his application of charges into her, and her other allies to protect her. Opening up the deeper internals to her BAR, she may now allow Dorian to apply his charges directly to her plasma creation unit, allowing her to fire off a variety of Wakefield Accelerator beams. She may now fire off a Heat Beam to deal concentrated Heat Damage, EMP Beams to disrupt Neuromantic and Phantasmal abilities and even disrupt a foes very nervous system, and Radiation Beams to poison and sicken enemies, all upwards to Extreme Ranges and incredible accuracy. Like before, the power of the beam increases with the stacks applied, at the same rate as before, however now even the most basic attack comes at a building risk, starting at 5%, then building to 15%, 25%, 50%, and finally a 75% chance of overloading her plasma unit, causing it to explode. November also has an increased vulnerability of 20% to Critical Hits while preparing to use this function, due to how exposed her internals must be.

(2/2)
>>
>>3653667
aaand...i am utterly braindead and never realized that should be Recursive swarmlings, not subversive. god fucking damnit.
>>
File: sleep.png (126 KB, 398x685)
126 KB
126 KB PNG
>>3653673
>>
>>3653666
(Excellent, I'm glad you'll be able to relax and participate.)

>>3653667
(Thank you for reposting, these look great.)

(Also, just because I'm curious; if you were to choose a different character to play through a Vein with, who would you pick? They could be friend, foe, anyone, really. Not making any promises of course, but I've been meaning to ask for a while.)
>>
>>3653667
>>3653673
also also, i guess it might be more interesting or make more sense for them to be based off of Radiant damage, or at least activate with it too, now that we know thats a major aspect of Ignition.

>>3653677
nah, i just never caught it from the last thread and haven't read it since, as i didn't think id gotten something that stupid wrong on it. for some reason those two augments of ours i always get mixed up.
>>
>>3653679
id like to say Rath, as shes my favorite character, but it feels like a kinda useless suggestion to pick someone in our party, as they are there most of the time anyways. theres some, but very little, anyone in our party has not taken part of to work with there, with the exception being November.

so with that in mind...Magpie. shes an interesting character, a good lady at her heart, yet still not so morally solid as us from what i can tell. plus, i like guns, so a gunslinger sounds wonderful to play as.
>>
>>3653679
Mara. Dragon mom has lots of history.
>>
>>3653666
>I have a day off this monday July 15th, which is the day the new vein opens. So hooray! I get to relax and discuss consume upgrades and Contender upgrades immediately in the new thread without getting interrupted by work!
I'm glad to hear that, anon. You'll get a nice long weekend to relax in, finished off with the start of a fun new thread.

>>3653679
>(Also, just because I'm curious; if you were to choose a different character to play through a Vein with, who would you pick? They could be friend, foe, anyone, really. Not making any promises of course, but I've been meaning to ask for a while.)
Ooh, tough one. I'm going to say Professor Uzu. Just because she seems like she had a lot of interesting stuff going on that we never got to see because she died before we could have a second interaction with her. Preferably the original, though I suppose the proxy could have had some interesting adventures too. She had to get all the way back from the Cord and found the Monastery, after all.
>>
>>3653688
>You'll get a nice long weekend to relax in, finished off with the start of a fun new thread.
I wish. I still have to work tomorrow, and I have to work Sunday to cover a someone else's shift.
>>
>>3653693
Oh, my apologies then. At least you get Saint Swithin's Day off?
>>
File: Arm the Swarm.jpg (29 KB, 286x286)
29 KB
29 KB JPG
also, just found this picture, and i cant help but feel it would be an interesting alt where we combined our Hive with a Calcite Armory and maybe a Phantasmal power to give them better intelligence.
>>
>>3653334
"Demon Core" I like it

DEMON CORE
Requiering a Tier 4 Forge Core and a ludicrously strong source of Radiant and Heat energy to create, was this Core turned into a dark twisted reflection of the once burning heart it was created from
This Core is only good for one thing. Destruction
Just holding it gives one a feeling of Dread as it seems to soak in the warmth of life itself. There is a small contol panel on the backside with three buttons. One orange, one red, and one black.
By pressign the orange Button the Core can be "safely" without to much of its power leaking out. Though one should try to find a thick metal casing as the slowly leakign power still devours all life it touches.

Pressing the Red Button primes the Core making it ready for deployment in a weapon system. Just holding the Core in this State actively leeches the life from a daughter that holds it. Feeding its ravenous hunger for Life.

Pressing the black button sets the Core to overload. Doing so will result in the Orb overloading at the end of the current round. Resulting in an explosion of energy that rips away the very lifeforce of all it hits.
The explosion radius is up to large range with daughters in close range being annihalated into nothing but dust as their eintire lifeforce is instantly devoured
Being at medium range the explosion deals unavoidable damage that sends all but the most resilient daughters into the Death Saves immediatly. And if they survive to the Hospital for weeks afterwards as their regeneration finds it nearly impossible to cope with the massive enrgy drain.
At long range are the lucky ones of the unlucky ones. They take massive unaoidable damage and find their Health and BIO regen halfed for weeks afterwards.
>>
>>3653952

>>3653233
Well i decided to give it a new firemode with some corruption instead

>Demon Protcol
By inserting a Demon Core into the Weapon the Weapon itself changes. Unwilling or incapable to ever take Radiant Cores or normal forgecores afterwards.
The Weapon turns into a cruel mockery of of its once simple and functional design. Leering face cover its barrel and main body and and the Muzzel takes on the appearance of a vicious fanged maw.
The Barrel also is always cold to the touch now. No amount of heat will ever heat its parts again.
The Light expelled form the muzzle will no longer sear with the bright light of a star but with the absolute cold and darkness of absolute emptiness.

Increasing the number of shots in the magazin to 10 before needing replacement and causing the Wepon to now create a splashzone within short range of the target that also takes massive damage.
Any daughter/Amalgam hit with this weapon takes absolutely catastrophic damage as a beam of searing unlight causes them to be disintegrated near immediatly leaving not even dust.

Firering this weapon now requires immunity to cold damage or the user risks their hands freezing to the weapon and taking massive cold damage every time the weapon is fired.
Seeing as the Weapon no longer heats itself up the Weapon can, after setup, be fired at a rate of one Shot per act.

Even with immunity one must take care not to fire it to often lest the effects of any corruption will become amplified the more one loses oneself in the sound of the darkness beyond the Stars

>>3653679
(Also, just because I'm curious; if you were to choose a different character to play through a Vein with, who would you pick? They could be friend, foe, anyone, really. Not making any promises of course, but I've been meaning to ask for a while.)

Who indeed...... Probably Mara, wanted to get into her noggin for a while now
>>
>>3653679
One Question OP

Is resistance to Skintalker Spells and a chance to outright ignore them new to the crucible?

Kind of what i am asking is what Tier would you put this Relic under >>3652388
Does it add something new or is it just something neat to have

My personal guess is Tier 3 but i am not sure and the other anons were not in agreement either
>>
>>3653703
I figure that Hive Mistress x Calcite Armorer results in either minions wielding/integrating calcite weapons, or skeletal version of the minions benefiting from Calcite augments.
>>
>>3654150
(It isn't new to this Crucible, but it's a strong ability regardless. This would slot well into Tier 3, I believe.)
>>
>>3653679

Dear BHOP, thanks a lot again for this wonderful vein. No matter what other people may say, this has been great. I only freaked up a bit when we were stuck with a Crucible-winning build (by the sound of appearances, a RECURSIVE WINNER one, no less), and the Escher Gear Teleport & Breach protocols took care of that. And this was only because you have managed to make us care so much for our adopted family that we were willing to do ANYTHING to keep them alive.

On the topic of other daughters we may wish to play...Out of the party I would say Mara, and within the party I would say Rath.
Rath & Gina are my favourites, and I still consider the platinum ending to be a place where Isabelle lives, even as a dream daughter , and we marry BOTH Gina & Rath after this is said and done. Of course, Kosi shall be the priest. May look weird, but it would also be the most ethical thing to do, weird as its is. Rath has very genuine feelings for us, besides the undeniable attraction. I also want to have a conversation with her, she has a complex and traumatic past too, and I am afraid that Vitruvian corruption is catching up with her. Her rage is smoldering even more with each passing quest.

I also got closure from this vein. We will finally be able to have this long overdue conversation with Isabelle. And no matter what we may decide to do afterwards?
Fear not Isabelle. We will listen. No matter how we may feel about you now, we still owe you that, our old friend.
>>
>>3654690
>and we marry BOTH Gina & Rath after this is said and done.
getting WAAAY ahead of yourself there m8.
>>
>>3654699

I know... but a man can dream. And I can definitively see Kosi being the priest. I mean, she RELISHES playing matchmaker.
Shu would probably get accompanied to the altar by Mara. We lack other suitable parent figure to do that.

If we have to define an "optimal ending" this will be it for me. Gina was first though, no tegiversation on that. Also, Dorian & Julia are best couple, and I get a feeling that they would adopt Amara.
The fact that Amara has taken to us as her new mother got me flabbergasted..and very, very touched. I thought we would be "Auntie Shu" at most. It seems that those moments where we tried to explain the cruelty of the world with careful parables have mattered more than I could imagine.
>>
>>3654723
what other familial figure would spend time with their child to tell entertaining stories with their child? the parent of course!
>>
>>3654690
(Thank you for your kind words, Anon. I believe that the grievances voiced by the other Anons do have weight however, and I'll do my best going forward to be more mindful of them as the Quest proceeds. I cannot tell you how much I appreciate your positivity, and I'm glad to have you on this venture.)

>>3654699
(Amusingly, I'd actually intended for Gina and Rath to pair off before your actions made Gina fall for Shu, instead. Would have made for an interesting dynamic for sure, if not the most stable relationship.)
>>
>>3654690
I think Marriage is still far of. Probably never gonna happen. Gina does not seem the type to want to marry.

I could see Rath wanting to marry, her upbringing influences her still

I think she is very well in control now. The raging fire in her Heart has been somewhat tamed.
The Outbursts in this Vein? I would think deeply influenced by the Relationship she had with Isabelle before Isabelle went batshit.
>>
>>3654730

I still thought it was going to be Julia. She has spent more time with her than anyone else, and Julia is bear Mom. I still consider her the most fearsome warrior of our extended family - mess with Amara or Dorian (or any of us, really) and NOTHING will save you. ANd we are a team of utter badasses, that know many other warriors even more fearsome.

I still remember her fight against the depression daughter amalgam. You simply don´t mess with the sculptress of flesh & steel and live to tell the tale.
>>
>>3654745
Well Julia and Dorian would make the most "normal" parental figures in the Fleshscape. if the mother was turning into a badger and the father is a slightly alcoholic liquid Roadrunner

But i think the reason it became Shu, We gave Amara her name and tried our best to keep her safe, took her on fun trips and taught her our own morality. In hindsight pretty obvious i would say
>>
>>3654739

Or couple for life. Stamp a priest on it or not, lifelong companionships still happen.

Still, we had some flashbacks about her grieving a sister (implied suicide) I think that her volcanic rage stems form that - "rage, rage against the dying of the light" fits a vitruvian ideal.

I think we need to double-check, just to be safe. Even if she is great, her core is vitruvian, and mental corruption is a bad beast to tame.

(Case in point: Isabelle. Level 20 core vitruvian mental corruption is a BAD beast. I get the feeling she almost COULDN´T change her outlook on life, and that has stemmed her character development. This does not fully excuse her, however)
>>
>>3654758
.... Yeah your right i sometimes forget Rath is a vitruvian core. Well checking in and touching base regularly with everyone is what we do anyway so little problem there i think but we are probably gonna have to touch base with her more often than with everyone else. Especially after she becomes encased in SUI TORMENTIS forever.

Though we should not forget that on top of the maxed Core Isabelle was already obsessed with Sam and spending two years pretty much alone with only an ancient alien to keep you company (on occasion) probably exasperated the problem even further than it would have usually gone. No reason to slack of with Rath. I just do not think the Problem is gonna be as extreme as Isabelle if she has people that care about her the entire way, to help her overcome that trauma before we max her Core(or the hybrid created from it)

There is gonna be a bigger Roleplaying session coming anyway so we can definetly do those things then.
>>
>GURREN'S KEY: A Bronze Drill the size of car keys. The Drill shines with a rainbow hue of potential, the tip gleams with the power to kick limits to the curb. Holding this relic passively doubles the hp and bio regen of the daughter. Second, inserting the relic into different relic as a module automatically upgrades the affected relic to its full potential level as long as Gurren’s Key is installed (the affected relic reverts back to its prior level when Gurren’s Key is removed). Finally, when combat starts the relic combines the daughter's stats into a single meter that counts both as the daughter’s HP pool and Bio pool with a regeneration rate that combines the hp regen and bio regen of the Daughter into a single regen rate.

>A synergy is detected with Getter’s Gearbox: Final Fusion Drive. Installing Gurren’s Key into Getter’s Gearbox removes the combination limitation of Getter’s gearbox, allowing an unlimited number of willing daughters to partake in the fusion process as long as Gurren's Key is installed in Getter's Gearbox.

>>3653646
rate this relic.
>>
>>3653630
If you're talking about the Mirv Stingers, yes. That's basically it.
>>
>>3654837
Why did you steal Simons Keys?

Jokes aside this Relic seems pretty useful
I would probably rate it high in Tier 4 or even Tier 5. It offers very good bonuses(doubeling regen with very little drawback is very good in my opinion)
Think what Dorian could do with that

THe passive effect stays on th edaughter even if the Keys are used on a relic the daughter holds?

The Getters Gear Synergy is nice would allow us to jsut combine the planet.... into.......... one.......... super.............. daughter............... Scratch my earlier assesment. This thing is a Tier 5 Relic if used in conjunction with Getters Gearbox. Together with that we could combine every single daughter to win the crucible and leave without anyone having to die once the Crucible is "won". This just ........... just kicks the rules in the balls and beats them over the Head with a barbed wire baseballbat, which it then proceedes to shove up the Rules behind


btw have you seen what i posted as an addon to the Annihalator?>>3653954
and what did you think of it
>>
We still have to decide what to do with Isabelle.
>>
>>3655104
I thought we were decided on "give her some last words on how we're sorry it had to be this way but we can't let her hurt the people we love, let her die or give a mercy kill with the Contender if she's taking too long and is suffering, and then carefully abstain from the Consume option when eating her to make sure she doesn't wind up in anyone's dreamscape".
>>
>>3655104
Maybe the show dont talk treatment

>go down on one knee
>lay a hand on her Forehead
>"Rest now it will soon be over. I will not force you into an afterlife,, you have suffered enough already. You can rest in the dark and never have to be sad again"

>Wait for her last words and then close her eyes after she took her last breath

I dont think we have to be cruel to her. She was misguided and insane. The last we can do for her as a human being is make her last moments be at least somewhat dignified.

I wont deny that this may be a bit to far on the nice scale but Shu is not a cruel person.
>>
If Mother gets deleted, what happens with Daughters that undergo The Choice afterwards? Is it automated and they still get presented with two-three options, but don't get the incentive to go to the Cord?
>>
>>3655123
I honestly don't know. I'm very conflicted on how to respond to it. On one hand, I want to give Isabelle a send off so that she doesn't have to die sad.
Isabelle's already suffered enough from her own actions, so telling her that it had to be this way just pours salt on the wound.
On the other hand, although Shu states her bitterness, I do want to give Isabelle the notion that Shu still loved Isabelle the entire time. As a family but not as a lover.
>>3655126
>Show don't tell treatment
I'm down with that.

As for how I would spend Shu's last words to Isabelle.
>reach down and scoop Isabelle's body up, cradle and hug Isabelle.
>Gently wipe her tears away with one hand.
>Use the empathy channel to express your love to Isabelle, show that deep down you loved her as a family.
>Try to give her a smile of reassurance and not cry. Yet the tears still fall. You try to smile through the tears, but sad with so much bitter regret that it had to end this way.
>"Idiot....I really did love you."
>The smiling facade of reassurance starts breaking down.
>"I loved you as a family. I loved you as a sister."
>Let loose the waterworks and just sob over her corpse when Isabelle finally dies. 10+ years of friendship, heartbreak, and it had to end in a way you never wanted.

As for the anons who think this is too sappy or otherwise, This is Shu's oldest friend mind you. I think this is a proper moment where Shu's allowed to let loose all the bottled up emotions she's held over Isabelle and just openly grieve. It mirror's Isabelle initial heartbreak and grief against Sam when she beaned Sam over the head with the Lava Lamp, but it's done on a more tragic note. She's bitter no doubt, but overall she's just sad that her oldest friend died in her arms. To Shu, it's one of the more tragic moments in her life since her birth in the Crucible. So give her this moment to grieve.

Also, I've decided that I think Shu should consume Isabelle's Dream Daughter state. Leaving Isabelle alone to be lost forever when it comes to the consume option just doesn't sit right with me at all.
>>
I have been reading the archive, but I am retarded I can't really get how the combat system works. Can I get a quick rundown?
>>
>>3655186
>Also, I've decided that I think Shu should consume Isabelle's Dream Daughter state. Leaving Isabelle alone to be lost forever when it comes to the consume option just doesn't sit right with me at all.

I would have expected me to say that, no offense but arent you one those that really hate Isabelee?

Well that emotions she would feel are mostly Sams. We really only knew her for a week or two before all this happens. But still she was our first friend even in the Fleshscape.

Maybe we should let Isabelle decide if she even wants to come back as a Dreamdaughter. Isabelle might feel to guiltridden to ever recover from what she has done to the person she loved more than any other in the world.

Just forcing it on her feels just as wrong as just letting her fade away completely without giving her a choice. Especially if she might have to contend with the Fragments of Sam that are still in Shus mind

Our possibly last kind act we can do for her. Let her have Control over her future. Just once
>>
>>3654758
>Case in point: Isabelle. Level 20 core vitruvian mental corruption is a BAD beast. I get the feeling she almost COULDN´T change her outlook on life, and that has stemmed her character development. This does not fully excuse her, however.
im sorry, and its nothing against you personally, but im kinda getting annoyed at Anons actively choosing to ignore the fact this is not what happened at all. if you actually look at how Isabelle acted before the crucible, at the beginning of the crucible when the corruption had not set in, and at the end, its very clear the corruption had NOTHING to do with how she thought.

she had obsessive, beyond love feelings for Sam long before the crucible. she was a messed up, evil enough person to cover up a murder, long before the crucible. she was a messed up, evil enough person to MURDER someone, long before the crucible. she was then a messed up, evil enough person to guard a twisted individual and murder mountains of others just over being near the same area as said persons cocoon. Corruption did not make her a bad person, corruption did not make her choose bad choices, corruption did not put her on this path, or keep her on this path, she chose to stay on it long before it would've truly mattered.

and people keep saying the Vitruvian makes you double down on a singular objective, which, maybe, except despite everything, Isabelle still showed more than once to be able to actually shift that objective heavily, even focus on other things, the problem is she herself was such a vile individual at her heart, any shift she could convince herself to do was still not anything good. if anything, if there was corruption, she simply chose to not fight it, not that she was entirely incapable of overcoming it herself.
>>
>>3654863
ah, ok. seems iffy in when we would need that though.

>>3654837
not terrible, i like concepts like combining bars or turning a stat into something new, but honestly im not a power gamer and so relics that people put forth that are just made to be overpowered and anime levels of bullcrap just are boring to me. struggle and getting by on your own wits and your own strength you properly earned and fought to get honestly is just so much more interesting that just getting handed or building a 'fuckyou' switch that nulls those elements.

>>3655104
i refuse to have her in anyone's head. otherwise, so long as our response does NOT ignore this WAS the real isabelle ,and isabelle herself WAS a bad person who by her own merit CHOSE to be a bad person, then im pretty flexible. she may not deserve our cruelty in the end, and Shu might even want to let go of it all over being tired, what she has done is not something to be forgotten or ignored, nor that it was her choice to do it.

>>3655179
this is a very good question.
>>3654579

>>3655189
gimme a moment Anon if you're still around, i got you, just need a fresh Post to do so.
>>
>>3655237
Still here, take all the time you need.
>>
>>3655186
>Let loose the waterworks and just sob over her corpse when Isabelle finally dies. 10+ years of friendship, heartbreak, and it had to end in a way you never wanted.
No, Sam had 10+ years of friendship. Shu has known B'Ni for a couple of weeks. It's still sad, she was still Shu's first friend and it sucks that it had to end this way, but come on. It's not the same.

>Also, I've decided that I think Shu should consume Isabelle's Dream Daughter state. Leaving Isabelle alone to be lost forever when it comes to the consume option just doesn't sit right with me at all.
Haha, fuck no. I refuse to have her in Shu's head, that is the most toxic and unhealthy thing I can imagine. If we really have to save her, by some insane logic that says we owe her anything still, then put her in someone else. B'Ni needs a restraining order until she's had enough therapy to interact with Shu in an emotionally-healthy way. Which will never happen as long as the Crucible is still going on, unfortunately for her.

>>3655189
Honestly, it's a bit of a mystery to us, too. Most of the mechanics are handled behind the scenes by BHOP for ease of voting on our part. Most of what you need to know is within the character sheets.

>>3655213
I'd argue that the Vitruvian mental corruption could be a factor, just not the one people are assuming. B'Ni had a fixation on things needing to be perfect. That was the common thread between all her various goals and decisions, that things had to fit her desires exactly and that if they didn't they were evil and wrong and had to be destroyed. This is in line with B'Ni's specialization as a Vitruvian, how she chose a perfect, immortal body. Don't get me wrong, I certainly agree with you that B'Ni was broken even before she made the Choice, but it does seem plausible to me that her corruption added new problems. That said, I don't think it's going to be a huge problem for Rath. For one thing, we hybridized that shit. For another, if the mental corruption is just one layer on top of the rest of the Daughter's personality I think Rath should be able to handle whatever it does to her by focusing on the rest of her self-identity.
>>
>>3655244
I'm gonna go with having her as a dream daughter anyways. It may happen anyways, and if the clarity hit, which it looks like it did, I want to see it built on and develop rather than just left at that. I personally find that more satisfying in the long run.
>>
am >>3655186
>>3655209
You’re mistaking me for some other anon. I’m of the the camp that doesn’t hate isabelle. also, i do like your idea of letting Isabelle have the choice of whether to fade away or become a dream daughter.
>>
>>3655189
right, so at its base its pretty simple. shameless self posting here, but i think i did a decent job covering it in my review of the quest;
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1nSK2ZiPkZMV-LvXRUxmPiLgMWODUrZngGGknRmlHTOw/edit?usp=sharing

regardless....

Combat works via Anons giving freefrom orders to the characters, based off utilizing our Abilities and Stats to perform ACTIONS, or ACTS. after BHOP does the background roles, everything in the background is given an initiative slot, most likely based off the Characters speed, the Abilities/Actions speed, the Difficulty of the Action, and its roll modifier.

things then happen in an order related to that, and BHOP writes it out to sound natural and like an actual Battle.

No character may ACT beyond their number of ACTS, unless an ability allows them to do something for free, or stack things on top of eachother as 1 ACT.

what takes up an ACT is; Using an Ability to its fullest, Moving a Movement Zone, Using a Relic to its fullest, and making an Attack.
these overlap regularly, and many abilities stretch their limits, but that is the baseline rules for what consumes an ACT.

besides ACTs, we have two other Stats, and two sub Stats.

Health, which like in any game, is how much punishment the character can take. once you hit 0, you make Death Saving Roles, best of 3.

Biomass, or BIO, is both your Armor and Mana pool. it both protects you the more you have, and with the exception of a few skills, is what you draw upon to fuel your Abilities, and sometimes Relics. you also die if it reaches 0, but this typically isnt how an enemy is trying to kill you. your Initiative and speed also raise the lower your BIO is, but this is basically not something you can abuse, as BIO is too important to ever want to have low. its just a nice little something you have if it does run low.

you also have a REGEN stat for both Bio and HEALTH, which gives you back a bit each turn, and usually isnt affected, with the exception a good few abilities exist to negate an enemies Health Regen to some degree.

so basically, what combat is, is we Freeform try to stuff as many Orders into our team as their ACTS will allow, and makes sense for our current objective. ALOT of the info and finalized roles are done by BHOP behind the scenes, please keep that in mind, as to not make making decisions come down to just numbers calculating, and feel more natural on our part, as we thus just focus on the Abilities and Actions and how best to utilize them given our current goal for that round.

i hope this helped eve a little, and please ask if you have any further question or need further explanations, i understand if i may of made it too complicated.
>>
>>3655277
>>3655283
Okay, but if she does want to be preserved, it can't be in Shu. I will never budge on that. I might be able to be convinced that preserving her is a good idea, I can't see myself ever thinking it would be smart to put her in Shu's head. Even if she managed to calm down post-death and wasn't too crazy to us, Sam's still in there. Let's not put those two in the same room.
>>
>>3655283
Well then i am sorry for confusing you its sometimes difficult to keep track of people in here

>>3655244
I agree with you having Isabelle in Shus head is just asking for trouble(with Sam and everyone else), its why i proposed having Isabelle choose if she even wants to become a dreamdaughter.
If she does not? Well problem solved.
If she does. Well we can probably find someone willing to take her in. Maybe someone from the Midnight Crew who does not have a beef with Isabelle and could help her become a better person.

Not trying to force my opinon on anyone but making a suggestion how she could, one day, maybe be useful for someone again and find a new way to life out the rest of her existance.
>>
>>3655244
oh, im not saying it did nothing, only nowhere near as much nor as major a factor as other anons are saying, nor is it at ALL the reason her personality was like it was, which other Anons at least write in a way that makes them think that.

>>3655277
>>3655283
please for the love of fucking god no. i am so so done with Isabelle, for the love of all that is fucking sane and reasonable just let this characters arc end and let us be truly, fully done with her and be able to truly, fully move on from her.

also, she has no Core, so there is no longer a guaranteed chance to get her, and all we have to do is avoid non cores to not get her, which she has so many cores that will be easy to justify.

>>3655244
literally no one else has done anything bad enough for us to punish them enough to put her in their head. and while putting her in Shus head would be the absolute worse idea ever, its the only one it ever would for any reason make any half baked sense for it to go into. and thats already a terrible, horrible idea to do.

>>3655186
im against basically everything here. Shu has no reason to feel that sad over her anymore, and we honestly didnt know her that much longer than anyone else.

and im am vehemently, heavily, against Isabelle being a Dream Daughter.
>>
>>3655310
>>3655312
I think Shu makes the most narrative sense, but it's not like she's inaccessible otherwise what with the Halos and Neuromancy. I guess Dorian, since his head's pretty empty compared to everyone else. Oh, and this wasn't a dig at him calling him stupid. I mean he has literally no dream daughters while everyone else has at least two. We've yet to talk to Penny in Julia's head, in fact.

>>3655321
>also, she has no Core, so there is no longer a guaranteed chance to get her, and all we have to do is avoid non cores to not get her, which she has so many cores that will be easy to justify.
That is false. Did anyone now we had Grinning Spartan in our head after beating her? Because I didn't until we had the option to talk to her. And she got there from an augment we took, not even a proper levelable ability.
>>
>>3655340
no, its not. BHOP has outright told us how this works.

if you consume someones Core, you are guaranteed to get them. if you do not, then you have only a chance to get them, IF you consume one of their abilities. if we use the Arbiter to get Other Daughters Cores, getting them from the Core negates the chance of getting Isabelle from it, and if we then do not take any other Abilities with the Consume option, we are then guaranteed to not get Isabelle.

this has all been explained before.

we got the grinning spartan on a chance roll due to still taking the consume option on other abilities she had. no one said it had to be a levelable ability either.
>>
>>3655340
The Core thing is just that you are guaranteed to get the Dreamdaughter. Everything else that is not a core will make it so that you have a chance of getting the daughter

Well it might make narrative sense. But i dont like it. I really do not want to have Isabelle in Shus head with the remnants of Sam. That is just asking for trouble. Someone else sure but probably someone we only occasionaly meet.. That is why i suggested the MIdnight Crew. They have no real personal reason to have beef with Isabelle and so might be willing to take her in. IF Isabelle even wants to become a dreamdaughter

>>3655321
Well what i was saying is highly theoretical. I think Isabelle wants to just fade. She is becoming clear again for the first time in probably years. She might just not want ot experience anything any more and just die.

We have reason to despise her. I am of the opinion however that denying someone their afterlife, if they want to, wpould be just to cruel. And for all Shu is. She is not a sadistic nor a cruel person.

And Asking Isabelle(and her wanting to come back) and then if positive asking someone if they would be willing to take her in costs us nothing.
>>
>>3655340
>I think Shu makes the most narrative sense, but it's not like she's inaccessible otherwise what with the Halos and Neuromancy. I guess Dorian, since his head's pretty empty compared to everyone else. Oh, and this wasn't a dig at him calling him stupid. I mean he has literally no dream daughters while everyone else has at least two. We've yet to talk to Penny in Julia's head, in fact.
We do need to talk to Penny, yeah. As for Dorian, I'm partial to giving him Vultha. Sure, it would be a bit weird for the first head-buddy he gets to be an alien, but I think they might get along well. Both very determined and principled people, from what we saw of Vultha's Phalanx. And Vultha's Core would be a good match for Dorian's build.

And you're right, Shu would make the most narrative sense, but that's an argument against preserving B'Ni in my mind. If the only option that makes sense to pick up B'Ni is also objectively the worst possible person to have her in their brain, maybe we shouldn't put B'Ni in anyone's brain.
>>
>>3655355
actually i think we just made them have a personal beef. we literally convinced them to help us via saying Isabelle was a monster hurting our family, then they basically said WE were part of their family. Jackie at least seems like the type to easily hold a grudge over that.

>>3655355
id actually argue being a dreamdaughter is not really an afterlife at all, and if you want a true rest and a true afterlife, you let yourself actually die. theres a reason we gave that one poor girl a proper death, and its because being a dream daughter is far from paradise, even if her dementia wouldn't of followed her. being stuck in your own memories can easily end up as torture, and thats not even the half of all dream daughters actually have to deal with.

just saying calling being a dreamdaughter an afterlife or inherently good is kinda wrong.
>>
>>3655213

The Vitruvian core obsession would drive her to double down on what she WAS. Now, I think that the party WAS a good influence on Isabelle, and there was SOME character development in the good direction as a result (sparing people she may have otherwise killed, saving members of the party, our life on multiple ocasions).
And I think that she WAS changing, in all the time that we were facing her. In our first encounter, she was someone able to kill GINA just to spite us. In this encounter, she refused to bend to MOTHER, and did NOT kill us all when she had absolute power and the guarantee to do so. She is dying right now because, for a fleeting moment, she extended us mercy.
So she WAS changing, and her motivations went from "make SHU suffer" to "I will move on from my homicidal obsession with SHU and the party and keep only my obsession with SAM". The problem with the Vitruvian Core obsession is that it helped to slow character change and development enough so that we have reached this situation. But this will be hard to ascertain without speaking to her directly.

I also would point out the fact that she saved our life while we were in the cocoon for those 2 years, and it was as much motivated by guilt as for her selfish desire for a Lover.
This is without even entering SAMs & Isabelle shared past. Isabelle provided a home for SAM that was devoid of the horror of abuse. She was a life-long, faithful companion to us, and it is heavily implied that she sacrificed EVERYTHING (family, friends, stability and companionship) for SAM, and incidentally us, in the past. The fact that she killed Sam? Hell, it is a miracle it didn´t happen sooner.

I would also point that the Crucible DOESN´T seem to choose the pure and innocent. EVERY single person we see is a survivor, somebody whose desire for survival, for change, for redressal of the wrongs done to her in the past burns bright enough to kill...and this is before madness claims us all, one way or another. Corruption & hunger are VERY real, and even GINA tried to kill us under influence.And as much as we would like to think that it is a "do or die" test, Uzu & Johanna case have shown us that the descent to madness is something far more gradual and insidious.

Mara has murdered; West has murdered; Johanna has murdered. We have murdered, and the blood in our hands runs as red as it does on the hands of everyone else. The last tiny miracle we managed to do is spare Amara the same fate, and that is something I am grateful for.
Remember Johanna, the Grinning Spartan? When we met her, she seemed the very epitome of evil, butchering people for her own ascension. It turned out that she had had a couple of bad sanity checks that twisted a noble moral compass into something hideous.

The last innocence we still can claim is that we only killed in absolute last resort, and I am not willing to lose that for Isabelle.

Everyone has lost enough already. Let´s break the cycle.
>>
>>3654579
If we finished of a foe with a Nomling, would it also give a health boost like with Ravenous Maw?
>>
>>3655386
Nicely written. I like it.

I'd only argue that we don't know for sure if she would've spared us since we enacted our plan before she gave her answer, but I think she would've at least spared the rest of the party as Shu requested.

I did think the "she's evil because she killed so many people protecting Shu's cocoon for two years" argument from that other anon was a bit ridiculous, since a good portion of them were far from innocent and actively looking for a fight. We could see that from her pastebin sheet.
>>
>>3655386
no, she wasn't alot of that to us, because Shu and Sam are entirely independent people. we have already IC established and made multiple decisions in which Shu as a character has decided that is the case and to keep it the case.

also, no one has murdered anyone. Murdering is the illegal killing of another. there is no law, so murder is impossible. people have KILLED and committed evil actions, but killing in and of itself is not an evil act, even if the other person was not necessarily evil. survival does not make one evil, what Isabelle, West, the Hatter, and Johanna did, makes one evil, or at least the individual actions taken.

and no, the Crucible does not choose people outright morally bankrupt, at best all we know is it chooses people who can be convinced to go for the Cord, which even an innocent person can have done, if they lost the right thing or were hit hard enough.

the simple fact is, Isabelle did alot for SAM, not us, and when it came to use, most of it was bad, or with the intent to manipulate us out of selfishness. the corruption did not stop or force her to do anything, she showed enough clarity to make that the case, she herself has no excuse for who she was or her actions.

she also was not trying to show us mercy, but trying to break us and stand above us.

we have done nothing wrong here, and letting Isabelle go is not only doing nothing wrong, but doing the morally justified action.
>>
>>3655386
>And I think that she WAS changing, in all the time that we were facing her. In our first encounter, she was someone able to kill GINA just to spite us. In this encounter, she refused to bend to MOTHER, and did NOT kill us all when she had absolute power and the guarantee to do so. She is dying right now because, for a fleeting moment, she extended us mercy.
See, I didn't read that as mercy. I saw that as wanting to gloat. To have us in her power, and make us realize how weak and helpless we were. The narration even said (paraphrasing here) "she's fine with letting you talk because she knows she can insta-kill you with Ozmas' Skintalking if she feels like it". B'Ni was changing, yes. But I don't think it was for the better. She started out being ruled by emotion, harming others because she was overcome by passionate anger or panic. She progressed to intentional malice, hunting down Shu's party to kill Gina just because it would hurt Shu. And then as we saw here, she started acting on long-term plans to do wrong and hurt others. She's been becoming more evil as time went on, not less.
>>
>>3655407
no, those were evil acts because she clearly killed people who were not trying to be a threat and she could've reasoned with, and did it to protect someone she knew, and in some ways she herself admitted, did not deserve that protection.

BHOP did not show us her not hesitating to kill someone trying to be friendly and nonthreatening to her for no reason.

Not everyone she killed was necessarily unjustified, thats not what i said at all, what i was saying we her reasoning was unjustified and many she did kill were aswell, and we were outright told and shown that.
>>
>>3655444
And by that point, a year of mental corruption and surviving against Amalgams and predatory Daughters would've passed to make her that way.

I agree with >>3655386 that the Crucible is designed to turn its participants into their worst selves, which we've seen with several other characters, and Isabelle has been in it the longest and by herself. It and Mother used any number of dangers, incitements, and mechanics to convince its participants that it's better to give in to their darkest impulses.
>>
>>3655412

Do not get me wrong. Your arguments have much merit, and come from the right place.

But as you said, getting to the Chord involves killing, one way or another... and when killing stops being in self-defense and starts being done by reasons of convenience, such as "if I don´t gain power, another shall kill me or doom everyone for the final wish", I would call that act of homicide "murder".

And the Crucible has been VERY good at driving the desperate to apotheosis and ruin before Ozma ever assumed her throne.
Choose only people with motive to do ANYTHING, even killing, for the completion of their goals, put them in a game with a sole winner and the fate of a species in the balance, and you may as well have pulled the trigger yourself.

When looking at the reasons for antisocial behavior, you may as well use gut instinct or a more mechanical outlook, based on circumstance, cause and effect. Every one has their merits and drawbacks, and every one performs better or worse in some circumstances.

I prefer to think that denying dreamscape haven to ANYONE in this quest should not happen, since everyone has motive and there is VERY few people I cannot empathize at some level in this quest. Also, I consider that the Crucible influence distorts thing enough that we can´t be sure of what that person would have become if not on those unbearable circumstances.

This is what I like of this Quest. People in the fleshcape have motives, good & bad. They may do great things, horrible things, or literal pacts with the devil based on them, but they are always some shade of grey.
What we decide they are is up to us. And probably neither of us will be correct or wrong, because they are not caricatures.
They are people, with their own desires and motivations, virtues and crimes, and the fact that they are so believable, so greater than life is what drew me into this quest, and the greatest praise I can offer to BHOP literary talent.

Neither angels or demons. Just very weary people, between a rock and a hard place.
That´s what they are to me.
>>
>>3655468
except she decided to defend Sam and kill anyone that even got close right off the bat, she herself said so, long before the corruption set in.

it doesn't matter what the crucible intends, its still a personal choice, and literally the entirety of this Quest has been about that fact. we constantly talk to Dream Daughters and Live Daughters alike, Vitruvian and non Vitruvians, that fully admit, THEY set themselves down their path, it was THEIR choices and decisions that lead them to do evil, and yes, many think the Crucible or other methods made those get WORSE, but they still know, say, and admit that it couldn't of done that if they themselves had not first made the bad decisions that set them first on those paths.

Isabelle is no different. she chose her path, and chose to double down on it, even when she clearly had clarity and was clearly fighting beyond any corruption she had.
>>
>>3655468
Yes, but that's a point against her Dream Daughter self being sane and reasonable. The Daughters we've recovered so easily were all Hunger-mad, it was an outside force imposing madness on them and so by removing it we could bring them sanity. B'Ni went crazy the old fashioned way, from years of isolation and desperation in a terrible environment. I don't think turning her into a Dream Daughter will fix her. Only years of therapy will do that, and we don't have the facilities for it. If you wanted to, I don't know, preserve her in stasis, shove her mindstate inside a memory-storage Neurotic crystal or something, then I'd be alright with it. I'm not okay with putting her in our brain.

>>3655473
>But as you said, getting to the Chord involves killing, one way or another... and when killing stops being in self-defense and starts being done by reasons of convenience, such as "if I don´t gain power, another shall kill me or doom everyone for the final wish", I would call that act of homicide "murder".
So we've never murdered anyone, then. The Defiant Fools have only ever killed in self-defense, defense of others, or as a mercy.

>I prefer to think that denying dreamscape haven to ANYONE in this quest should not happen, since everyone has motive and there is VERY few people I cannot empathize at some level in this quest. Also, I consider that the Crucible influence distorts thing enough that we can´t be sure of what that person would have become if not on those unbearable circumstances.
We've already done that, though. Just a few hours ago, in-character. Remember Hatter? How we decided "let's not preserve the mindstate of the pedophage"? It's arguable where B'Ni's evil falls relative to eating children (though she's certainly willing to kill them, she showed no mercy to Amara), but we have established precedent that some people are just too awful to keep around in any form.

>They are people, with their own desires and motivations, virtues and crimes, and the fact that they are so believable, so greater than life is what drew me into this quest, and the greatest praise I can offer to BHOP literary talent.
Sure, it's great how everyone has motives and internal logic that we can clearly see. I just don't think that that obligates us to forgive their sins just because they feel they had a good reason. I mean, Ozmas thinks she has a good reason, and we're definitely going to kill her.
>>
>>3655477
>>3655473
>>3655468
>>3655434
So what i gathered from reading this argument is that most anons do not want Isabelle to survive in any way am i correct in that assesment?

I personaly care very little if we keep her around or not. Only that we do not keep her in Shus head if we do decide to keep her around.

But how shall we treat Isabelle?

Do not forget that Shu can be a very gentle soul with her defeated opponents. Even if those opponents have done terrible things to other people. Hungermad or not.

We really do not have to say much at all
>Just be there for here till she draws her last breath close her eyes if she draws her last and then bring in the reast of the family to start the feast
>>
>>3655473
>I would call that act of homicide "murder".
no, it just becomes killing for evil reasons, but is still just killing. ill admit its odd for me to be defensive about this topic, but the difference between murder and killing is related to some things i believe and hold very dear, such as the right to self defense, and understanding and upholding the very real and legal definition between the two is a must when talking about such a topic. Murder, by definition, is an illegal killing. there is no law, so unless you did it inside the monastery or another settlement, Murder cannot exist. an act of killing for evil reasons, can.

>And the Crucible has been VERY good at driving the desperate to apotheosis and ruin before Ozma ever assumed her throne.
its still clearly and wholly a personal choice, and thats what matters.

>Every one has their merits and drawbacks, and every one performs better or worse in some circumstances.
but everyone still is in control of their own actions and choices. even the Corruption of a Vitruvian is based off the path and choices that person made and set themselves down before it set in, and we also have seen and know it can still be fought and overcome, if the person so chooses to actually try. Johanna, for instance, still chose to use the machine before it mentally corrupted her, and choosing to still do so, aswell as her own philosophy, set her down the path to make her simply have no reason or care to fight its corruption, not that she had outright no choice in doing so.

>I prefer to think that denying dreamscape haven to ANYONE in this quest should not happen.
i disagree, only falling to the Hunger, or Vitruvian Corruption, can even be argued as people having no choice, and even ten, i disagree on the vitruvian, for reasons previously said. we have also outright purposefully denied letting someone even have that chance before, and it was the right thing to do, and it is the right thing to do here, and it will be the right thing to do in the future.

>I consider that the Crucible influence distorts thing enough that we can´t be sure of what that person would have become if not on those unbearable circumstances.
i disagree. who you becomes when things are not easy, when the going gets tough, that is the true you, and still your choice to become. when you choose the easy route, or the selfish route, when you could've chose another, that was you, and your decision, and no one or nothing elses. sparing Amara is probably the best example of this in the wuest so far.

(1/2)
>>
>>3655473
>>3655506
>but they are always some shade of grey.
i vehemently disagree. their motives? sure. their actions? no. and your Actions speak louder than your words. Shu and Co are not good people because of what they spout, but because of what they do.

>Neither angels or demons. Just very weary people, between a rock and a hard place.
no, some are clearly evil, and evil by choice, while some are clearly outright good, and good by choice. there is a line, and it can be crossed, and many do it with a smile on their face. one bad action does not make you evil, everyone slips up, but why you do something matters, and constantly doing something bad for bad reasons is not morally gray at all.

(2/2)
>>
>>3655502
Um, just to be clear, I'm FOR Isabelle surviving as a dream daughter, even if it's not in Shu.
>>
>>3655502
as i said earlier;

>i refuse to have her in anyone's head. otherwise, so long as our response does NOT ignore this WAS the real isabelle ,and isabelle herself WAS a bad person who by her own merit CHOSE to be a bad person, then im pretty flexible. she may not deserve our cruelty in the end, and Shu might even want to let go of it all over being tired, what she has done is not something to be forgotten or ignored, nor that it was her choice to do it.

other than that, no tears.
>>
>>3655485
>We've already done that, though. Just a few hours ago, in-character. Remember Hatter? How we decided "let's not preserve the mindstate of the pedophage"? It's arguable where B'Ni's evil falls relative to eating children (though she's certainly willing to kill them, she showed no mercy to Amara), but we have established precedent that some people are just too awful to keep around in any form.

I would have not backed that decision, had I been in position to do so. I was out of coverage, and couldn´t vote as a result.
I would only have backed her dream-daughter state in a secure, isolated facility though. Something like a jail, disconnected from us.

Don´t get me wrong. I don´t endorse her, and anything she did, and the revulsion ALMOST made me wish for final deletion. But since she could be a couple of sanity points away from hunger madness, and we have seen Johanna & Uzu cases as what can happen when people skirt total SAN loss, I would have abstained from total deletion, had been secure storage available.

The point is? With the nature of dreamscape daughters, for the first time in that universe, an observable, physically demonstrable way to trascend death is available.

It is not a coincidence that most cultures prefer to delegate the judgment of who is worthy to pass on an afterlife to intrinsically perfect, benevolent & omniscient divine entities. It is an admission that such a final judgement is something that many humans feel uncomfortable to pass.

In such circumstances, I would support that REALLY horrifying criminals such as the Hatter would be "backed in cold storage" in dreamscape isolated clusters and only brought online when in front of a jury with competence for the case.

With enough competence in "Phantasmal Conduit", mortality starts to bend the knee. And then, you may as well question yourself - if I can save everyone from physical death, why shouldn´t I?
There is a reason why I have always pushed HARD for "Phantasmal Conduit" skillsets. I feel obliged to preserve every dream daughter we come across, even in the event of our death. Including the dream daughters of our opponents.
We have a small "afterlife" in each of us; we cannot let our possible death also kill those who live within us.

Do not confuse this with weakness: I am the same person who has argued for the use of nukes to sidestep the crucible, who pushed for Teleport in this quest, and who will pull all the stops to our actions as long as we are in combat.

But final deletion of people is where I draw the line.
>>
>>3655509
Well i jsut wanted to include everyone in the Conversation this discussion was originaly started for.
I know you want to keep her around but two other anons seem to not want her around and i do not care either way. I only want to give her a peaceful send off. I want to send her off like a human being not a monster even if she became one. Its what Shu would most likely want in my opinion. Shu is not the Sadistic type to gloat in the face of someone she knows dying. Even if she does not want to have anything to do with the person anymore

>>3655517
My proposal involves no tears. Just the send off of someone we knew and knew was misguided and pretty much mad.

I am not a fan of waterworks for Isabelle either like>>3655126
this should prove. Just something simple. Hearing her last words and being there for her.

If she tells us she wants to become a dreamdaughter. Well we might be able to accomodate her but not in Shus head. She would have to be in someone elses head. But only if the Person also consents to host her.
That are two big ifs, that i do not think will be possible to reach without heavy intervention on Shus part. And i do not think giving Isabelle more than a peaceful send off is what Shu is willing to give her. Shu already has enough to deal with with Sams Memories so she would not want to host Isabelle as that would be absolute chaos.

What would you propose to send her off?
What would you do to have some closure?

>>3655537
Final Deletion is a heave step to take which is why i want to hear Isabelle out.
We can not put her in cold storage so the only choices we have are either deletion or taking her with us unless she tells us what she wants. And i kind off doubt that she wants to exist on.

The Final Deletion i can back if there is no other way or the Daughter wishes for it.
>>
>>3655502

I am for Isabelle survival! And I am the author of >>3655473 and >>3655386.
I would point out that at least 4 fates have been discussed for Isabelle:

> 1º: Stabilize the wounds, save her current body.
Will probably take to extracting her skillsets non-lethally with the sparagmos engine (yes we can do that via the skill redistribution feature)

>2º: Let her die; preserve her dream daughter state in Shu´s head.

>3º: Let her die; preserve her dream daughter state in ANYONE else but Shu´s head.

>4º: Let her die in mind and body; feast, and let only the ashes remain.

I would point out that option 3º:
> Let her die; preserve her dream daughter state in ANYONE else but Shu´s head
Seems to be the prefernce SO FAR. Remember that careful voting will be neccesary, consensus need to be reached and sicussion had before a formula that satisfies most of us shall be reached.

We should consider this a preliminary brainstorming, not a binding agreement.
>>
>>3655537
i am not joking when i say this, its your type of mindset that leads to the creation of people like West, and those are the worst type of people. im sorry bur i cannot hold back on that, you're sounds like West to me.

>But final deletion of people is where I draw the line.
then we will never agree. some people deserve to die, and deserve to die a TRUE, full death. and Isabelle long ago when she had no excuse crossed that line.
>>
>>3655542
>>3655542
i dunno, something like.

>Sigh, and let your shoulders drop.
>meet her eyes, and shake your head.
>"You're asking me to lie to you Isabelle...and despite everything, I cant do that to you."
>Shrug, and wave your arms around. to Rath, to Julia, to everyone.
>"we tried to give you love, to let you be part of our family. you didnt want it. you wanted the impossible, and tried to kill us over it."
>narrow your eyes "you DID kill over it, mountains of people, both good and bad, innocent and wicked alike, over a girl who didn't deserve anyone's protection."
>"You tried ti kill Amara, my family, and that i can never forget."
>Sigh again, and let your arms flop down.
>"you did waste your life. and it was no ones choice but your own. we tried, we tried so hard Isabelle, to give you another option..and you didn't just refuse it, you tried to kill us over it..."
>Walk up to her, and sit down next to her, never turning away from her eyes.
>"You and you alone chose to not be Happy Isabelle....but its over...rest, pass on, knowing....i hold no anger left at you. i cant forgive everything you have done to me and those i love, i cant forget about it either...but i dont want to hold onto anger either. im tired of letting you control our lives, and you should pass on, not letting me control yours..."
>"Goodbye, Isabelle. Rest, and take comfort in that even you deserve at least the right to rest..."
>Let her die, on her own time, as peacefully as she will allow herself to.
>>
>>3655545
yeah ok no you're just being insane. we are NOT saving her from death, like seriously what the actual fuck man?
>>
>>3655545
Well Number 1 is not an option. she is to far gone we can cross that one out outright.

Number 2 is also a very bad idea for all involved

I agree with the Brainstorming part but i kind of felt like the discussion was starting to come full circle. it felt to me like the fronts had started to harden and turn pretty immovable.

Maybe i misinterpreted that and it was just my personal feelings taking over my rational thinking

>>3655559
Not what i would do but that my be because i do not like confronting people on their deathbed with all the evil deeds they have commited
>>
>>3655567
well, we cant lie to her. Shes committed a mountain of bad deed and yes, she did waste her life. are you saying that i think she at least deserves the truth about the one question she has asked us is bad? like, not trying to accuse you here or anything, genuinely curious.
>>
>>3655537
Hatter wasn't Hunger-mad. She was eating people, so she couldn't be going hungry. And she wasn't headed towards the Cord, so she hadn't already gone Hunger-mad. She was just evil, unrelated to being in the fleshscape. All the Crucible did was enable her.

And I don't think that the existence of functional immortality obligates us to save everyone. Evil still needs to be destroyed, maybe now more than ever because said evil has so much more power and persistence. You're right that under ideal circumstances we'd drag them to a trial before executing them, but we don't have that facility right now. There's no way that Shu has to preserve a mind in stasis, the best she can do is have it hang around in her head being awful and monstrous for the rest of the quest. It is unreasonable to expect Shu or any other sane person to put up with that. I don't have a problem with her assigning the role of judge, jury and executioner when it comes to horrible monstrosities. They need to be removed from the world, and right now Shu is the only person in position to do it.

>>3655545
We know what you're the author of, everyone has tripcodes on /qst/. And no, I think that "let her die completely, never have to deal with her again" has at least a 50% share of the votes. I know it's what I'm in favor of. I want B'Ni gone. Is it vindictive of me? A little. But mostly I just think that the criminal's life shouldn't be prioritized over the safety of their victims, and that's what we're talking about here. You want to keep the attempted murderer of our party in the head of one of our party. Our party does not deserve to be punished so that B'Ni can escape her own punishment.
>>
>>3655549

Then we need not to agree. This is the beauty of this quest; it is based on votes and consensus.
Sometimes your opinion will (rightly) prevail. At other times, the consensus shall be closer to my goals.

About West´s comment: funny you say that. One of the things that makes West such a memorable villain is that, with her "Phantasmal Conduit" knowledge, she could have implemented this vision of an ethical "dreamscape heaven" in earth that I discussed in >>3655537.

How different would be the quest if instead of clones, she would have restored any daughter she defeated back to life? Given bodies to the fallen? Only kept contained in dreamscape the dangerous, inhumane or scared?

She would have been justly hailed as a saint. That´s what makes West so interesting as an antagonist: she is a perversion of the tenets of Platonic philosophy, which make a great part of occidental culture, although the same principle applies for many more.
The tenet I would quote is that "Who has knowledge & power will use it for good". If you have knowledge and power, this means you have agency over others. Since you hold knowledge, something deemed "good", you should be liable to perform "good" acts.

But West flies in the face of that cultural expectation. She is a physician that in the face of the ability to preserve life and cure sorrow at an unprecedented scale, decides to do just the opposite.
When you see the quotes to Carl Sagan in her notes, the fact that her clones with identical experiences can still develop conflicting agendas based on minute synchronization errors and other thousand things (see Francine West, the clone willing to suicide in order to atone for her mistakes), it speaks wonders about BHOP education and literary talent.

In order to create a compelling & horrifying villain, you need a strong grasp of morality & phylosophy, and the twsist it. So I will take your comment as the praise it is, and not an off-hand suggestion that I am a mass-murderer bent on world domination. ;)
>>
>>3655574
Well she kind of figured it out on her own. She did waste her life and she ruined everything she had.

Quote:
>“Why c-can’t I be happy? Why can’t I just…be happy?” Isabelle murmurs, her form holding itself together by threads and sheer will. “I just wanted a…I wanted…”

>A spark of realization, a flicker of understanding as life bleeds from her failing body.

>“…a lie.”

>It’s with terrible strain that she tilts her head to face you, searching your eyes for something just out of reach.

>“…It was never going to happen, was it?” She asks, the bitter truth hanging in the air as her remaining lung wheezes painfully. “It was never real…my whole life, I…I wasted it. My entire…oh god, I…it’s all over, and I…”

>She coughs, a gout of blood spilling down her chin as she holds your eyes, hoping against hope that you’ll tell her it wasn’t all in vain, that her entire existence wasn’t hinged on the stuff of madness. You’re not sure what to say as you stare into a pair of broken gemstones, their light slowly fading as tears stream down Isabelle’s face. She can barely speak, and even if she could the only thing she can do right now is sob, surrounded by those that would have welcomed her. She had the power of a god, and she squandered every last drop of that she held in a mad effort to crawl after a work of fiction. She had a family at the end of all things, and she left to pursue a fantasy, head filled with lies she told herself.

I just think that there is no need for us to point it out to her again. In my opinion she has suffered enough. In the last seconds she has she is gonna agonize over what she has done with the clarity of death.

I am not saying we lie to her. I say we will just be there for her telling her that eternal rest waits for her and let her go.

As i itterated numerous times Shu is not a cruel or sadistic person.
Some of the points you brought up i like:
>"You and you alone chose to not be Happy Isabelle....but its over...rest, pass on, knowing....i hold no anger left at you. i cant forgive everything you have done to me and those i love, i cant forget about it either...but i dont want to hold onto anger either. im tired of letting you control our lives, and you should pass on, not letting me control yours..."
>"Goodbye, Isabelle. Rest, and take comfort in that even you deserve at least the right to rest..."

The Rest feels kind of like vitriol. It is not an emotion i think belongs to the Deathbed of anyone, be they the greatest Dictator and massmurderer in human history, a saint, a normal middle class person that worked hard their entire life or the last homless beggar.

I think what i want to express is. The last step over the edge is scary for everyone lets give her just the smallest comfort by being there for her when it happens, no one deserves to go into the great darkness alone.

That is what my moral code dictates

(1/2)
>>
>>3655610
If it happens in combat and the enemy is obliterated before we can do so. Well i can certainly say that i dont like that but at least they are not gonna bleed out slowly.

If the Hatter had been reduced to half abody and would be confirmed to die i would have voted to be company to her until she is dead.

(2/2)
>>
>>3655600
no, it makes you a terrible person just as likely to become as bad as she is, as you think the greater good should be achieved and enforced on all regardless of what it costs to do so.

with your philosophy everyone should be saved, anyone who refuses becomes a villain, even if the person they refused to have stick around in their head was in and of themselves a villain. the greater good and thinking utopia or paradise is possible are the greatest evils and corrupts in existence, and anyone who thinks along such lines cannot be trusted nor their opinion. Human nature thrives on freedom, and you cannot have Paradise or Utopia, nor the greater Good, and have Freedom, they do not mix.

your ideals mean we must save everyone we can, despite what they have done, which is preposterous. the Hatter was not hunger mad or corrupted, they just loved torturing people to death. saving them and expecting people to save them, and have them STICK AROUND IN THEIR HEAD, is vile and disgusting. people have a right to decide who should get to stick around in their mind, regardless of if that person they could of saved is good or evil, and they have a right to decide NO ONE should be able to invade the privacy of their mind.

saying in all encompassing terms that just because it is possible to save everyone, you are obligated to and should, will easily lead to people who just want their privacy or did not want a monster inside their head being accused of enacting a terrible act, and worse, once society becomes civilized again. it is exactly thinking like yours that leads step by step towards the greatest atrocities and curbing of peoples individual liberties and freedoms, and leads people to becoming exactly like West, or worse.

>>3655610
>>3655615
bu she was clearly there looking for us to answer the question too, she wants us to either deny or confirm her fears here...and the truth is, shes right, she did waste it.

and i dont think its cruel to tell her all that, especially with us telling her we are gonna let it go. we arent beating her over the head with it, only letting her know the truth. she wasted her life chasing fiction, and turned down what she was after over said fiction. we could be much much harsher on her, id say just basically telling her the truth is hardly cruel and letting her off easy.

>>3655615
the Hatter deserved no sympathy, a deathbed does not make one a saint nor erase their bad deeds.
>>
>>3655610
Yeah, I agree. I don't like B'Ni, but I don't want her last moments to be angry ones. Let's try to have some peace in here. Even if you absolutely hate her and want her to suffer, it would still be good for Shu's mental state. Give her more closure, let her move on from this instead of remaining angry about B'Ni.

>>3655615
Less certain about giving Hatter peace, though. She ate childrens' brains! It probably wouldn't have mattered anyway, she was so freaky that I can't possibly see us not double-tapping her just to make sure she doesn't get up. The scenario would never have happened.
>>
>>3655634
Of course the hatter deserved no sympathy. But being there for her if she would have laid there dying would have been the right choice in my opinion.

I would have offered her no words of sympathy but would have just been there.

Maybe its the experiences i had with dying family members but having someone there makes it easier for the dying to pass. They dont need words, they just need someone to be there to witness their final moments before they just turn into lumps of dead meat.

As for Isabelle just holding her gaze will tell her all she needs to know is what i think.

She knows she fucked up massively. If you think it will make her passing easier sure go for it when we vote in the next vein. I will stand by my priciples that even the lost and the damned deserve to die with the smallest piece of dignity. Its what divides us from a dying animal. Even if she would have given us a dogs death like putting down a rabid dog. By granting her a peaceful passing we reinforce who we are. Not some savages but the Defiant Fools that maybe have to much sympathy for people but we will keep on our course to bring peace and compassion to the Fleshscape.

>>3655656

Yeah probably. The Hatter was mad no Question. I still hold the value however that everyone deserves someone to watch over their deathbed. She would have fought to her last breath anyway so there probably would have been no possibilty to be the specter over her deathbed. I will not condone her behaviour or try to frame it in a positive light but in death we become all equal before the darkness takes us. Even if she did not give the same dignity to her victims. We are not the Hatter. We could have been but the Anons decided that no we are compasionate and try to find peaceful solutions to problems, and in my opinion that involves giving the dying a last sendoff even if we absolutely hate their guts.
>>
>>3655703
nah, i guess thats where we disagree. some people simply deserve no one to be there for them in death, some people deserve to die alone and knowing they had no one. ive had dying family members....trust me, i know how that feels. but not everyone deserves to have family be there for them, to have that human connection as they pass away. some have gone beyond that in their actions.

i also think she will take well to mine, and us being honest, over us being silent. us being silent will probably just drive her mad in her last moments, dying with gurgles of screams she cannot properly get out. at least with mine, she gets confirmation, she knows what she did and what we think of it all in the end. i dont think anything i worded was cruel, only honest, and i think she would prefer that in the end, even if its given flatly and nothing held back, than us silently staring at her, her dying vision having to try and guess in madness what we think and what she will be thought of when shes gone.
>>
>>3655703
>Yeah probably. The Hatter was mad no Question. I still hold the value however that everyone deserves someone to watch over their deathbed. She would have fought to her last breath anyway so there probably would have been no possibilty to be the specter over her deathbed. I will not condone her behaviour or try to frame it in a positive light but in death we become all equal before the darkness takes us. Even if she did not give the same dignity to her victims. We are not the Hatter. We could have been but the Anons decided that no we are compasionate and try to find peaceful solutions to problems, and in my opinion that involves giving the dying a last sendoff even if we absolutely hate their guts.
Well, I don't think you're wrong. Everyone does deserve to have some dignity in death. I just think it scales, so to speak. Like, if you're a creepy rat-person who lures children into your shack in the woods and then slowly eats their brains, then the sort of dignity you deserve is probably just the dignity of a quick and painless death. It's not as dignified as having someone to watch over you and sooth your suffering in your last moments, but it is more dignified than slowly bleeding out as you struggle and fail to cling to life.

>>3655728
Maybe cut out the part about all the people she killed before we met her, though? That's bad, and she does need to accept responsibility for it, but we are on a very limited time frame and I think it would serve her better to focus on the "you tried to hurt people who only ever wanted to make you happy, this is the consequence for that" part. Let's not distract her with her other crimes.
>>
>>3655757
Yeah, ok, thats fair. i just thought Shu herself would care about the fact Isabelle had done all of that is the thing, and it helps set the scene, as it was, about how Isabelle did nothing but drive people away, often over things she herself knew made no sense to do it over.
>>
>>3655728
Well then we have to disagree on that point. No hard feelings I hope, we shall see which opinion will be more popular when it comes to voting on monday

With taking a bit of Inspiration from you:
>go down on one knee next to her
>"You chose this yes. And it did not make you happy like you hoped...... I will not judge you for the things you did and will not hold a grudge after you died. It is time to no longer let yourself be controled by your desires"
>lay a hand on her Forehead as she has no other extremeties left
>"Rest now it will soon be over. I will not force you into an afterlife,, you have suffered enough already. You can rest in the dark and never have to be sad again"

>Wait for her last words and then close her eyes after she took her last breath

>>3655757
Well i prefer not to scale my morals upon the deeds of the individual. I know i am just human and if i start to judge people how worthy they are in my moral code when they are on their deathbed i just dont feel comfortable.

Sometimes cutting the life short is justified. In case of the Hatter it would have been as you pointed out. But until then i would have wanted to be with her as a human being as we would have lifted the Twinbarrels to her head and pulled the trigger.
>>
>>3655771
I think it fits better with the "I'm not even angry at you anymore, I just want this to be over" sentiment to not bring it up. We should point out how bad an idea clinging to the memory of Sam was somewhere, though, that part is good. Okay, how about instead of

>and you didn't just refuse it, you tried to kill us over it..."
We say

>>and you rejected it to chase after the ghost of a woman who never deserved your love."
Gets the mention of Sam in there, and avoid too much repetition of the specific phrase "you tried to kill us", so it flows a bit better.
>>
>>3655791
>Well i prefer not to scale my morals upon the deeds of the individual. I know i am just human and if i start to judge people how worthy they are in my moral code when they are on their deathbed i just dont feel comfortable.
I see what you're saying, but I can't escape the thought that the context of the deathbed really does matter at least a little. But I would say that there's a minimum required level of consideration. It can never scale down far enough to warrant cruel treatment on their death bed, that's certainly indefensible. I don't think we're really disagreeing that much, I just think you're more willing to extend kindnesses than I am, and honestly that's a very admirable trait.
>>
>>3655797
alright.

>>3655791
well, i dont like the 'judge' part. we are judging her, we chose and were judging her the moment we decided what she was doing was wrong enough to kill her over. thats just being a bit disingenuous, in my opinion.

>Sigh, and let your shoulders drop.
>meet her eyes, and shake your head.
>"You're wanting me to lie to you Isabelle...and despite everything, I cant do that to you."
>Shrug, and wave your arms around. to Rath, to Julia, to everyone.
>"we tried to give you love, to let you be part of our family. you didn't want it. you wanted the impossible, and tried to kill us over it."
>"You tried to kill Amara, my family, and that i can never forget."
>Sigh again, and let your arms flop down.
>"you did waste your life. and it was no ones choice but your own. we tried, we tried so hard Isabelle, to give you another option..and you rejected it to chase after the ghost of a woman who never deserved your love."
>Walk up to her, and sit down next to her, never turning away from her eyes.
>"You and you alone chose to not be Happy Isabelle....but its over...rest, pass on, knowing....i hold no anger left at you. i cant forgive everything you have done to me and those i love, i cant forget about it either...but i dont want to hold onto anger either. im tired of letting you control our lives, and you should pass on, not letting me control yours..."
>"Im letting you go Isabelle, and i hope in the end, you can do the same..."
>"Goodbye, Isabelle. Rest, and take comfort in that even you deserve at least the right to rest..."
>Let her die, on her own time, as peacefully as she will allow herself to.
>>
I tire of this moral posturing. All of you are missing the real takeaway from this vein, that being that Isabelle has a golden drill ability that is extremely similar in function to Shu's Heavens Drill. If we were to acquire and level this ability, we could hybridise it to have the drilliest drill ever seen in the crucible. Just imagine the POWER!
>>
>>3655791
>Well i prefer not to scale my morals upon the deeds of the individual.
thats all you can do, if you dont take into account the context of the individual situation and person, then thats how you lead yourself down a path where a strict moral code you apply to all situations equally, despite the context of the different situations, leads you do committing atrocious acts in the name of that moral code, or letting someone get away with something they shouldn't be allowed to, because the moral code becomes more important than what they actually did. its an extremely dangerous mindset to take.

>>3655831
i think that was the Fibromancers ability? i think she just spun herself into a drill, not actually using a drill based ability. granted, it could be a sub-ability of it, a sorta dash attack it grants the user, but still.

i also think we already agreed most stuff needs to go to Dorian and Gina, when it comes to Cores, and that one is a Core. plus, the Fibromancers ability would fit better on Rath or Julia i think.
>>
>>3655841
>i think that was the Fibromancers ability? i think she just spun herself into a drill, not actually using a drill based ability. granted, it could be a sub-ability of it, a sorta dash attack it grants the user, but still.
I think it was Churem, actually. It sounded like she was making the drills from her bones. So Dorian can still get Vultha. I don't want to give Shu Churem, though. She's already got like seven skills to level. Amara actually could use a Core or two, her stats are lagging behind along with Dorian's. Want to have some giant insect-person hanging around awkwardly in Amara's dreamscape not knowing what to do with the Sororitas' trying to rope them into playing games?

>"It is not fair to make me play hide and seek, human children. I am eleven of your Earth feet tall, I don't fit in any of these hiding spaces."
>>
>>3655871
two things; one, im terrible at names, so i have no idea who you're talking about, and probably wont remember for awhile, hence why i just use their Class type. its crass but it avoids confusion.
>Isabelle’s eyes flare open as she kicks off where she lands, tearing across the space as her entire body turns into a spear of coiled wire that meets Dorian’s blast of lightning head-on.
second, nah, she only used her wires. its the Fibromancer core. fuck me that Core is fucking amazing.

>Amara
...well, id kinda like to get to know all the Hexxanes first before we decided who to give them too, but the idea of giving Amara one im not against.

speaking of which, her clones kinda solve the issues i had with Sternutation Cannon too. sure, on Amara Prime its still kinda wasted, but now she can send someone out to sneeze for her, without risk of herself being in danger.
>>
>>3655841
>Well i prefer not to scale my morals upon the deeds of the individual.
>thats all you can do, if you dont take into account the context of the individual situation and person, then thats how you lead yourself down a path where a strict moral code you apply to all situations equally, despite the context of the different situations, leads you do committing atrocious acts in the name of that moral code, or letting someone get away with something they shouldn't be allowed to, because the moral code becomes more important than what they actually did. its an extremely dangerous mindset to take.

You failed to take into account the next sentece which is important. Maybe is should have written it as part of the first sentence.
>Well i prefer not to scale my morals upon the deeds of the individual. I know i am just human and if i start to judge people how worthy they are in my moral code when they are on their deathbed i just dont feel comfortable.
This applies to people on their deathbeds. The time in their lifes where they become little more than a human chained to a bed by physical deteriortaion or sickness.

Of course i judge people upon their deeds within my code but only as long as they still have the ability to change and a possible future ahead of them where they can change. And someone on their last breath that will die in a matter of minutes can no longer fulfill that condition for me and only requires someone to be there for them even if they just sit there silently. A modicum of decency should be something afforded to everyone on their deathbed.

>>3655871
That would be a funny interaction. I am actually kind of pumped to find learn more about the Hexane and what kind of people the Ascendants were
>>
>>3655890
and i guess i just dont see it. makes no sense to treat someone different on their deathbed than in life. dying doesn't suddenly change who you are, what you did, or what you deserve.
>>
>>3655888
>second, nah, she only used her wires. its the Fibromancer core. fuck me that Core is fucking amazing.
I thought we were referring to

>Amara chants the Song of the Swarm, and it's as you feel her power start to bolster your own that Isabelle reforms mere feet away from you, her arm splitting along the bone as a pair of golden drills lunge towards your face and your young ward's.
Where the bone splits to fire out drills.

Then again, B'Ni was clearly able to convert her entire body into fibers. Maybe her "bones" are just compacted wire weaves, and either the Fibromancy or Calcite Armorer skills can be used to manipulate them.

>...well, id kinda like to get to know all the Hexxanes first before we decided who to give them too, but the idea of giving Amara one im not against.
Fair. Maybe we can contact them with Neuromancy before we bring them onboard.

>speaking of which, her clones kinda solve the issues i had with Sternutation Cannon too. sure, on Amara Prime its still kinda wasted, but now she can send someone out to sneeze for her, without risk of herself being in danger.
Yeah, I'm coming around to it. We should get a ton of levels off of B'Ni, I'd be willing to invest a few points into the Cannon to see how it upgrades.

>>3655890
>That would be a funny interaction. I am actually kind of pumped to find learn more about the Hexane and what kind of people the Ascendants were
I know, we're going to have four Hexane who aren't bound by Ozmas' geas or Ozmas herself. Plus Ozmas and Charon's (we need to find their real name) journals, and Professor Uzu's notes. We're going to get so much exposition, I'm excited for it.
>>
>>3655911
oh, those...fair point, but they still had the 'golden glow' of the Fibromancer strands, and seems odd the bones would split apart, not just reform, unless they were making way for her muscle fibers or something.

...it could be a dual tech. we know she has those, and keep in mind our own Drill is a hybrid, so i doubt her own drill is standing on its own either.

>Fair. Maybe we can contact them with Neuromancy before we bring them onboard.
not sure. they are kinda inside Isabelle, so we might just not have the opportunity. i guess we can just go off of whatever Class fits Amara the best and hope none of them were assholes.

>Yeah, I'm coming around to it. We should get a ton of levels off of B'Ni, I'd be willing to invest a few points into the Cannon to see how it upgrades.
Sure, though we shall see how it actually goes. speaking of, did the Midnight Crew leave any of the Statues corpses for us? its not been mentioned. also BHOP said Amara at least got some of that? he made it should like she got something out of them i think, but maybe he just meant lexicon words.
>>
>>3655911
I have to say the Hexane Ascendants are what i wanted the Phylacteric Gem for.

Just imagine what we could do with an endgame daughter basicly bred for the task to ascend the cord that can fight with us and never truly die while being a great source of knowledge of the Crucible that can always be accessed even with empoathic dampeners.

We might be able to get Chaorns and Ozmazes real name from the ascendants. Though i would still like to call Charon by the name we gave them.
Probably makes things less awkward if we meet Chaorn again and they ask how we learned their real name.
Speaking off we are not gonna be able to meat Charon again until we are strong enough to beat them are we?

We are probably skyrocketing on the Crucible Shitlist and our next stop is the absolute top.
Mara is gonna be impressed. We pretty much beat her score in like what 1 week?
>>
>>3655930
speaking of, should we start up the long winded, never ceasing discussions on what plan is best to shoot for for each character?
>>
>>3655930
>...it could be a dual tech. we know she has those, and keep in mind our own Drill is a hybrid, so i doubt her own drill is standing on its own either.
Yeah, I'm thinking Dual Tech, personally. Like I said, she can turn her whole body into fibers, so maybe it uses Fibromancy to reshape them and Calcite Armorer to strengthen them?

>Sure, though we shall see how it actually goes. speaking of, did the Midnight Crew leave any of the Statues corpses for us? its not been mentioned. also BHOP said Amara at least got some of that? he made it should like she got something out of them i think, but maybe he just meant lexicon words.
I remember asking last thread. They did leave some for us. I can't remember if Amara's eaten yet and just not allocated levels or not eaten at all, but there are points from those fights waiting for us.

>>3655934
>I have to say the Hexane Ascendants are what i wanted the Phylacteric Gem for.
That would be a pretty awesome summon, yeah.

>Probably makes things less awkward if we meet Chaorn again and they ask how we learned their real name.
Yeah, Charon doesn't seem to like thinking about their old name because it's too painful to remember their past. But I'd still like to know their name. And maybe when we're trying to get through to them and break their geas we'll call to them by name and remind them of who they are or something like that.

>Speaking off we are not gonna be able to meat Charon again until we are strong enough to beat them are we?
BHOP said we'd be at Threat Level: Maximum. I think we're probably going to fight them soon. That's why I'd like to use the Sparagmos Engine to distribute some levels of Neurotic Halo to the Crew, so we can use their Halos to forge the Neurotic Crown. If we manage to get that on Charon's head, Ozmas loses control over them.

>Mara is gonna be impressed. We pretty much beat her score in like what 1 week?
Less than that. It's been two days since we saw her. Two days, and we already eclipsed her Threat Level. Mara won't know whether to be proud or deeply worried.
>>
>>3655946
well the discussion about what to do with isabelle is kind of over for now so sure why not?

Which character do we start with?
>>
Summarizing the stage at which we are....I propose to summarize things a bit. There are PRINCIPLES & CHOICES:

I) PRINCIPLES:

I think that there are a couple of principles that can make us agree. Those are VOTE and CLOSURE.
> VOTE:
That means that, even as some people are very skewed towards the extremes of either forgiveness (heal Isabelle or have her as dreamscape daughter) or refusal/anger/acceptance of her death (Isabelle must die, left free to choose death, or she is legitimately too dangerous/evil to live), people will agree with whatever solution is most voted. Participation is the goal, and vetos are kept to a minimum.

> CLOSURE:
As we said, many people have conflicting emotions (love & forgiveness, grief or vengeful anger) and proposed according write-ins. Some people feel that those write-ins are incompatible. They should not be. Shu is as conflicted as we anons are, so I would say that the ideal write-in should acknowledge ALL of the core snippets/fragments of those write-ins, with the predominant emotion wining the vote having a larger representation.

II) CHOICES:
I think that we actually have several choices to make in the conversation (or lack thereof) Those would be:

>1º: LISTEN Vs SPEAK:
Should Isabelle dictate the flow of conversation & choice? Or should it be dictated by Shu? In practical terms: say some parting words before, or mostly listento what Isabelle has to say in silence, with some reactions.
SO FAR, consensus seems to shift towards listening to her and speaking a bit in reaction.

>2º: WHAT TO DO WITH ISABELLE:
Before feasibility is discussed, we have 4 possible options, at the very least. Those are:

> a) HEAL Isabelle & prevent her death; REMOVE her levels with the Sparagmos engine.
This is very feasible, we have the engine & tons of healing at hand.

> b) CONSUME Isabelle; preserve her as dream daughter in SHU´S head.

> c) CONSUME Isabelle; preserve her as dream daughter in ANYONE´s else head.

> d) CONSUME Isabelle; let her have final death, by choice or design (No dream daughter preservation).

> e) LET ISABELLE CHOOSE HER OWN FATE.

So far, the debate stays between final death (e & d) and dream daughter with someone else than Shu (c). This is intended as a starting point for debate; the more options are conceived, the merrier.

Regarding the topic of write-ins, I would like to make a draft of a chimeric write-in /cliff note of all those anon submission and submit it after 12H from now on, with an emphasis on whatever consensus is reached by that point.
Would you agree? What do you think?
>>
>>3655946
I don't know. The new Cores probably won't influence things much, but I'd still like to hold off on that until we can see them. Maybe some preliminary stuff, but no detailed plans.
>>
>>3655961

> a) HEAL Isabelle & prevent her death; REMOVE her levels with the Sparagmos engine.
This is very feasible, we have the engine & tons of healing at hand.
no outright rejection out of hand. In my opinion an absolutely terrible idea

> b) CONSUME Isabelle; preserve her as dream daughter in SHU´S head.
absolutely not to many problems with Sam

> c) CONSUME Isabelle; preserve her as dream daughter in ANYONE´s else head.
If we can find someone willing to host her maybe

> d) CONSUME Isabelle; let her have final death, by choice or design (No dream daughter preservation).
the best option if you do not like Isabelle, in my personal opinion prbably a good choice. give her and us finnaly rest

> e) LET ISABELLE CHOOSE HER OWN FATE.
the best option as long as her surviving or her becoming a dreamdaughter of Shu are out of the question. We can not jsutify that.

Write ins: Eat your heart out. I will make my own write ins and maybe post them then as well and will try to help with a chimeric write in. I can see the merrit in that
>>
>>3655948
>>3655950
>Statue leftovers on top of Isabelle leftovers.
even with giving the Midnight crew their fair share of Isabelles pulped remains, thats gotta be a shitton.

as for who to start with...
well, we can just work our way down the character sheet list, just replace November on the end with Gina.
so, Shu?

>>3655962
well, sure, we cant know everything, but we still can know some things;
>What abilities to aim to upgrade, via importance or them being neglected
>what Abilities should be hybridized
>who is missing something from their kit, be it stats or abilities.

having even a minimal plan and what we wish to strive for with each character cant hurt.

>>3655961
>Vote
yeah not im not accepting Isabelle sticking around in anyone's head.

>Closure.
thats literally impossible. certain write-ups and emotions simply do not mix.

>Choices
>>1
Isabelle is literally wanting and waiting for us to speak, and is showing signs she might not even be able to speak anymore. its more a choice between speaking and silence, given the context clues.

>>2
>>>A
no, you're the only one daft enough to even put that forward.stop even putting it on the list, thats like, a level of worse so far above keeping her as a dream daughter im not even sure how to properly word it.

>Would you agree? What do you think?
i dont trust you to make anything like that anymore and cant see it working, some emotions dont mix. regardless, theres actually a strong consensus on
>not Being Cruel
>not lying to her
>not lying to ourselves about her
which i think, or at least 3 of us here, have already worked towards similar enough results with.
>>
>>3655961
Shu should definitely control the flow of conversation. B'Ni is not really in a position emotionally or physically to talk. As for the options, I favor D with some flavors of E. If B'Ni expresses the thought of "I don't want to fade away, I'd rather be in a dreamscape, I'll reconsider". But honestly, I'm not sure she wants to live at this point.

>>3655989
>having even a minimal plan and what we wish to strive for with each character cant hurt.
Alright. Well, for Shu I want to push Trypophilic Hive up a few more levels, let's say level thirteen if we can make it. Get everything else up to at least level four, I'm hesitant to hybridize yet since we've got a lot of things still fairly low-level. Probably not any of the Cores, but maybe one will turn out to be really good for her.
>>
>>3655989
Sure so Shu

Our Cores are
Fear to tread: really powerful
->blender and crowd control and area denial

Hive: our normal core one of the more buildingblock powers

Ravenous Maw:
good utility for melee and good synergie with movement and Swarm

Hundred Handed:
massive utility for offence, defense and movement

Exanguinating Leash:
Extremely usefull for fights and might be more useful in the future for Neuromancy

Neuromancy:
Well Terraforming and Hijacking

Neurotic Halo:
Useful for the Crown and countering crits and massive deathblows

Heavens Drill:
We shall pierce the crucible and everything that stands in our way
I can see great potential here


I would put some more points into the Drill and Maw to increase our meleepotential against heavily armored opponents and a possible mobility upgrade by strenthening the tounge

A couple points should also go into Fear to tread to try and reach the point where it will no longer affect allies
>>
>>3655999
>>3656004
eh, i still feel like Hive is easily ok where it is right now, it can wait, or be at the end of the list for upgrades.
i still want to see what Leash and Neuromancy will do together.
otherwise, i think seeing what Drill and Tread start to do would do us well, so we can see if they should be hybridized together or not. im still not a fan of either Ability though, i just feel our efforts with Shu could be done much better elsewhere.
Maw i suppose if we have space a level or two would be ok.
>>
>>3656013
I can see the potential of hybridizing leash and Neuromancy. I would like to not hybridize them at level 5 but at level 10 to get a few more abilites form both of them that we can use to increase our overall power with the hybrid.

If it is a bad hybrid or the extra levels not worth it we can then reduce them back to either split them up again and either hybrid at a lower level or another hybrid altogether
>>
>>3656023
eh, it'll depend on just how many levels we actually get. id prefer to take the opportunity to hybrid it than not. waiting til 10 or 15 is alot of fucking levels is the thing. maybe if we weren't keeping so many other abilities id not be so adamant on it, but id prefer to try and consolidate down into a more proper kit, than have anyone be so scattered as they kinda start to feel. deciding to hybridize later is a commitment that will take away from leveling up others to focus on that. granted, thats not necessarily a bad thing, but it does mean we have to understand and set other abilities to the wayside or get rid of them.
>>
>>3656023
also im against making decisions based on the engine. thats just asking for trouble and a fucked build if something ends up happening to it.

my thoughts is this;
im not so far liking Leash to be honest, at least as far as its tree is concerned. getting both up to level 5 will do two things;
let us see how Leash goes and if its worth keeping it going,
and see if the Hybrid is even any good.

it could be its way too good to wait, it could be leash is too good to hybridize early, or it could be both suck and we need to just admit Leash has already given us the best it can and put it on the back burner.
>>
>>3656042
yes i completely understand your concern but i would really like to get some of the higehr levels in those skills. But we can put it down into a hybrid now if it will allow us to put a couple of points towards the Hundred Handed skilltree, see if we can get some more sweet sweet buffs for one of our most versatile powers.

>>3656052
I understand your concern that the leash might not be good and so i agree to seing how good the Leash gets at level 5
>>
just got off of work and i take one look at my phone to see i have a ton of discussion to read through and to respond to when i’m done with food.
>>
>>3656061
hrm, maybe. though you pointing out HH just reminds me of how stretched some of our kits feel like they are.
>>
>>3656052
Leash is really strong, but it has been growing slowly. I'd be willing to bring it up to level five to see if it gets anything good or if we need to hybridize. My main problem is that you can only do one hybridization per level-up period. So we couldn't, say, level Drill, Hand, Fear and Leash to level five all at once. So which do you want to leave at level four? Drill and Tread?
>>
>>3656083
I am not sure with what we could hybridize HH with to free up space

Our best best to free up space is the combo of Leash and Neuromancy

Well nothing i can think of anymore what i want to do with Shu

>>3656092
I would put Fear and Tread to level 4 if possible and hybridize the Leash and neuromancy to free up some space
Now for our Radiant Goddess

Rath
Priority in descending order
Indignant Ignition at least to Level 5
Alabaster Endoskeleton to Level 4 i want her defenses to be even better
If we have the points invest into Eruting Grasp and Forgemisstresses Fingers with equal priority, i want to hybridize the Grasp at earliest at level 10 better yet at level 15 with Alabaster Endoskeleton to give Rath Reactive Magma Armor

We can transfer her level of Neuromancy to Gina i think. She does not need it. The critical counter is probably the best hing she gets out of the Halo so we can keep it at level 1
>>
>>3656098
Mostly agree on Rath. Not sure I want to combine Grasp with Endoskeleton, though. It makes sense to me to combine it with the Fingers. Forge-hot hands plus forging-proficient hands, there's a logic to that.

Also, the Halos customize themselves to the user around level four, it might give her something good. Plus, the Neurotic Crown is better with higher-level components, I don't think we should even stop leveling the individual Halos. Make them a low-priority, but never abandon it.
>>
>>3656092
well, we can always overshoot one, such as Hand, if its something we dont wish to hybridize.

hrm....honestly? i guess it just depends? which abilities do we think are more likely to NEED to be hybridized, or want to? i still dont like Tread or Drill personally. nothing wrong with them, i just feel like anything they can do, we can do at least good enough using other methods. to be honest, it still feels like memes is the only reason Shu got those. Tread affecting allies til much further down the line and activating center point on a person honestly would've been better on a front line fighter.

im thinking maybe then, focus on Drill and Tread then, as i feel Leash and Neuro can both stand on their own better. i still think hybridizing them would be an excellent idea, however i think its much more likely that they will be worth the extra levels than Drill or Tread will be.

>>3656098
>>3656108
i agree with getting Ignition and Alabaster up. not sure about how many levels though.
im not sure about Grasp and Alabaster, however i will admit i see alot of peoples points on Graps being kinda redundant. that being said, i think it still gives her a nice power boost and gave her Niku, so i dont regret it, nor not consolidating it down into stats. while im not sure about putting it in Alabaster, i think we can make something out of it as an ingredient for a hybrid....actually, i wonder what it would do with Forgemistress? i can see it being interesting. maybe she might even be able to make or boost relics while on the battlefield?

and fair point on the Halos, though like you said, never forget about them, but no need to focus on them.
>>
>>3656120
granted, mind you, for Drill/Tread vs Leash/Neuro, im fine with shooting for either, so ill let you Anons decide which we go for between the two sets. theres points and merits to both, suhc as me thinking Drill/Tread are more redundant could be argued that less of a reason to put levels into them or rush them down, as they arent worth the cost, as an example.
>>
>>3656108
Well leaving the Halo at level 1 for now is my thinking here

Sadly the Fingers are to fragile for combat.
I would leave them alone and upgrade them slowly to increase Raths potency to craft relics over time.

I want the Grasp and the Skeleton to hybridize so that if she gets attacked the enemy suffers much grater damage than they inflicted and for that we need her to have Armorpenetration which the Grasp kinda has as it deconstructs matter with its field.

>>3656120
Well the exact numbers do not matter as we do not know how many points we have. I want it to be more of a prioritysystem what we want most

>>3656125
I would put Leash and Neuro into a Hybrid right now and see what Fear gives us it has high potential to affect even non Biomass which is really strong
>>
>>3656125
I'd be interested in giving Leash/Neuro a try. Now that we have Gina back it's not as important for Shu to have pure Neuromancy, and most of what Shu does with it is debuff uses anyway. So fusing it with a debuff-based skill could work well for her, she won't miss it if she loses the terraforming. My one caveat is that I've been hoping that Leash would grant the ability to distribute its stolen Health regen to allies, allowing us to do that trick without Keane supporting us. That would be useful. I would regret losing out on that part, if it doesn't get it by level five.

>>3656134
>I would leave them alone and upgrade them slowly to increase Raths potency to craft relics over time.
Well, I would like an eventually endgame Rath to recraft all our Relics with level fifteen Forgemistress' Fingers. I could be persuaded to do it. And so long as we're waiting to hybridize Grasp and Exoskeleton at level ten I'm fine, I do want to get those both up fairly high before we cap them off.
>>
>>3656142
>Well, I would like an eventually endgame Rath to recraft all our Relics with level fifteen Forgemistress' Fingers. I could be persuaded to do it. And so long as we're waiting to hybridize Grasp and Exoskeleton at level ten I'm fine, I do want to get those both up fairly high before we cap them off.

I can get behind that plan its kind of what i wanted as well
>>
>>3656134
well, to be fair, we have neglected Alabaster for so long, it might just do what you want on its own, just not as heat damage. combining Grasp and Forgemistress might make it better at combat or at the forge. could go either way honestly. ill admit i dont want Forgemistress to lose its Forge potency, but Grasp i feel like is a bit redundant on its own and im just not sure alabaster is the best place for it.

>>3656142
>>3656154
but i guess if people dont want to risk Forgemistress over it, we can give the Alabaster thing a try.

>>3656134
>>3656142
right, Leash/Neuro it is.
>>
>>3656159
are you writing the general consensus down or should i do that?
>>
>>3656166
already on it, but if you would prefer to do it i can let you take over.
>>
>>3656168
Na you can do it. I will keep my own record as well so i do not forget something or lose it in the discussion. and here is the tabletoprpg player in me always keeping an adventure log
>>
>>3656177
>>3656142
right, then onto Julia then?

i still think hybridizing her Core should happen, and should be a priority.
im thinking Frozen Fury personally.

Badgers and Ripper i think would be awesome, go full wolverine. im not worried about her Badgers corruption personally, but i know others were, so shooting to do it sooner via the engine might be a good idea. Predator classes ramp up corruption fast, so shooting for a 10 hybrid might not be the best, if we are shooting to stop corruption. again, i personally dont care, but if other anons think its an issue, im fine with doing it early.

Artisanal and Membrane i think could make an excellent combo, just not sure if it should be at all a focus right now.
>>
>>3656190


Julia
I think there was a plan for her hybrids but i do not remeber what it was so i leave it to you anons

Seems reasonable

Yeah her core with frozen furry might be pretty useful to further increase her peak attacks

I would like her to have the level 5 Badger and Ripper Hybrid. Less for my picture of her but for Dorian and his perception of her no it is totally for my picture of her


The Emmbrane and the Appetite would make her a prime Relic destroyer that could detroy them with just a touch

That one relic that was created with the heavy robe/tunic feel Cutis Tractus that was it can give the Skineffect thorugh it so would be pretty useful
>>
>>3656190
I'd actually be fine with leveling Julia's Core straight. It's consistently been one of her most useful abilities, and I'd like to see where it goes to. It's got a lot of potential to get even stronger and more capable of paralyzing enemies. I like it a lot, I'm not sure we need to change anything on it.

Depressive Weight needs upgrades. It should be really strong, but the corruption meter ticks up too slowly. I'd like it to get faster effects or a wider radius so enemies are more constantly caught in it. Maybe hybridize it with Frozen Fury, they're both Conduit skills and skills of the same class are supposed to mix together well. Something based on weaponizing your own pain mixed with something based on bringing people to despair feel like they should go together really well, right?

Badger and Ripper hybrid works for me. Though yes, we would need to use the Sparagmos Engine to lower Ripper if we don't want to make Julia get really furry at Badger level 10.

And Membrane and Appetites are a natural mix, yes. Eat an enemy's sword as they stab you, it's a great trick.
>>
>>3656207
well, to be fair, i dont think any of our family IC would care either. the only real question i think really matters is, would JULIA care? iffy there honestly on her thoughts about it.
Dorian honestly wouldn't, at worst he puts up with a fetish he isnt into. at best he finds a new fetish hes into.

>>3656214
eh, my issue there is, Core hybrids are supposed to be insanely powerful.

i get your thoughts on Depressive, but id rather focus on cutting down the level spread in her kit first. i suppose if we dont hybrid her core, id prefer to put it at the end of the list to at least get the Ripper/Badger hybrid setup, or if we want to wait til 10 on that, shoot for either the one you put forth, or the Membrane/Appetites hybrid. extra levels can then go to her core.

if we arent going to hybrid it, that is.
>>
>>3655634
>>3655615
>>3655597
Why is it that when I leave for work discussions like this happen. I feel I have no agency.
>>3655559
it's a nice speech, but it's a bit too long for someone who's on their deathbed as well as somewhat cold, understandable given the sheer utter HATE you radiate towards Isabelle.

.....
Anyways. I honestly can't put it into proper words on how I feel about Isabelle and what we do to her in the end. I know for a fact that two of our active counsel radiates malice towards Isabelle to the point where I fear they'll literally break character just to make the last word for Isabelle a spiteful one.

I acknowledge that she's messed up in the head, but a small part of me hopes that the final words we offer to her could give her a sense of comfort that everything in her life wasn't "entirely" a waste, as for "saving Isabelle as a dreamdaughter" it's my wishful thinking that it's possible that Isabelle and Shu could somehow reconcile and start with a clean slate.

That's what I love about Isabelle. She's got history with us, she's had such a lasting impression on the first crucial moments in this quest, and seeing her breakdown like that at the end of the battle...I guess I'm a sucker for showing sympathy for devils...I don't hate Isabelle. In fact, from how I grew up, I can completely empathize and sympathize to her plight. That's why I can relate and keep on hoping for giving her a chance.

But in the end, this is a counsel of anons after all. I just really want to give her the best comfort in her last moments.

But yeah. I've had some time to think about Isabelle, and I'm conflicted on whether or not to take her in as a dream-daughter. Otherwise, I don't care about her fate. but what I DO care about is giving her the most comfy death she can afford as a tragic villain.
That is my hardline.
>>
>>3656227
>>3656214

I can sadly not think to much about Julias Powerset as i just find it peculiar. I just cant wrap my head around it, no matter how much i try to

So first priority is the Ripper/BAdger Hybrid? takes the engine to make that work but we can have it at level 5(which is what i would prefer)
then membrane and Appetite?


Amra now?

Amara
Push Joyous Many(high Prority) further together with Queen Crimson and Verurteilung(medium prority)
More Area denial and tons of catgirls what more does one man need to be happy i know i am disgusting

>>3656236
>giving her the most comfy death she can afford as a tragic villain.

well, welcome aboard that is something most of us want to do actually
>>
>>3656236
while you might not like it better, ive got a edited version of that somewhere in the lineup here. i understand what you mean and you have only so much time, but i do feel like you skimmed and missed where even us 'bitter Anons' agreed to not be cruel to her in the end, hence said edits...somewhere.

im still against taking her as a dream daughter. as i said earlier, no keeping her, no ignoring what shes done or what she is, just get the weight off both ours and her shoulders.

>>3656247
sure, Badgers is certainly a priority. will only take a few levels too.
i guess it just whether we do Frozen/Core, or Frozen/Depressive, and id say whichever is the better choice we focus on second.

>>3656247
>Amara
sure, focus on Joyous.
i think i promised the Yellow Anon id have us put points into the Lexicon this time around, so thats next.
Queen is certainly something i want more levels into.
kinda wanna see what Cannon gives us though, over Verteilung, personally.
>>
>>3656227
Let's see...okay, so Depressive/Frozen would be four levels to hybridize. Ripper/Badger another four, and we don't have to worry about it conflicting with the other because we're technically setting it up to hybridize later. Membrane/Appetites can wait some if we don't have enough levels, but we probably will, also set that up for hybridization. And then put the remainder into Sculptress of flesh. Alternatively, hybridize Frozen and Sculptress of Flesh, for eight levels.

Actually, you know a thought that just occurred to me? We've going to have a Vitruvian skill on account of Gina getting Kosi's Core. And the Engine can split off individual levels of skills so as to let multiple Daughters share the same ability. What do you think would happen if we added a Vitruvian ability to Julia? Think that would counter the corruption from the Badger? What if we hybridized it with the Badger?

>>3656236
I don't think anyone wants her to suffer. We just want it to be over with. She can have a peaceful death, but we're not super enthusiastic about the idea of her remaining as a Dream Daughter. It might work, it would be nice if it could, but it seems implausible. Though if she does become a Dream Daughter, like I said, I will adamantly refuse to let her be in Shu's head. That would be as much for her own good as ours, she doesn't deserve to share a home with Sam.

>>3656247
Yeah, I'd say just raise what Amara has, no need to hybridize for her. And also give her some Cores, she needs the Health.
>>
>>3656257
i guess we can focus on Depressive/Frozen next

honestly Julias kit is so full i dont want more into it. hopefully Ripper/Badger will cut down on the corruption enough on its own.

>Amara
forgot about giving her a Core yeah. i agree with that, so long as its a Hexxane, as i think we already know where everyone else needs to go. im sure we can make use of at least on of theirs on her, even if only a hybrid material, though id actually prefer one that can stand on its own in her kit, but we will see.
>>
>>3656255
>>3656257
Amara
Push Joyous Many(high Prority) further together with Queen Crimson and Lexicon(medium prority)
Sternutation Cannon low Priority

Get some cores(and drive the ancient alien insane by cahllengin it to childrens games and winning)

Maybe at later levels hybridize Queen and Verurteilung(LV 15) to make a sentient fearcreature that can litteraly kill you with how scary it is

How about this?
>>
>>3656267
not sure about Queen and Ver, but not outright against it, without doubt a backburner idea.

Getting at least one Core i do think should be High Priority, but otherwise sure.
>>
>>3656255
You're right about me skimming some parts. I was just in a rush to read through everything so I can put in my input on the vote discussion.
>>3653627

Actually. How about this? Lets ask Bhop to give us Isabelle's Consume Options and the points available for Consumption first and foremost so that we can spend the rest of this vein debating our options instead of spending all monday to do it.

Bhop, can you be a dear and give us the paste-bin that has all of the consume options that's available from consuming Isabelle and the number of level-up points that Isabelle's corpse gives out?
>>
>>3656264
Maybe the Generator Core? Let Amara clone battalions function as fire support with Rath being more up-front damage?

>>3656267
The fear monster would be neat, but a long way away. But for now, yeah, more clones, more Carnage symbiotes, and more magic.
>>
>>3656271
dont forget the Midnight Crew left us some of the Statues, so we might have TWO sets of level ups.

though actually id imagine on BHOP end, combing them AND our engine time(provided we keep the engine stuff to a minimum) would probably work out better, even if its a bit iffy on how that would work inside the story. splitting the three things up just because it makes sense inside the story, but thus making the actual game and process of picking them all suffer, sounds like a sacrifice id be willing to make.

>>3656275
that might work. to be fair though, i think we only have confirmation Isabelle has the Fibromancer. we know she has 4 of their Cores, we just dont know which ones for sure.
>>
>>3656283
>>3656275
>>3656271

I think i will drop my Dorian suggestions and then leave for bed i need some sleep even if i am on vacation

Dorian

push Spring Heeled Jack high priority(more speed, ever faster the light is the limit)
Accumulated charge high priority(lightning Cannon whoooooo)
Red Death medium Priority(strengthening Constructs and his attack power)
Neurotic Halo(low priority)
>>
>>3656295
Dorian needs some Cores for just base Stat boosts, even if its just one.

id say
>Core
>Jack and Charge
>Red Death
>Extra into Halo

honestly? he can give Gina his Neuromancy.
>>
>>3656295
I'd like a level or two more into Verurteilung, too, because Dorian has other fear effects and I like the idea of them synergizing together. And we want to give him the Fibromancy Core, possibly one other. But yes, otherwise I am agreement with your list.

And good night, anon. Sleep well, and wake rested and refreshed.

>>3656300
I think everyone but Shu should give Gina back the Neuromancy, yeah. It would only come to four levels, but that's not bad. BHOP said she was getting some upgrades from Dream Daughter conversations, too, so she's going to be at 11+ for Neuromancy. Quite decent skill level.
>>
>>3656304
I dont want the Fibromancer Core on him honestly. or well, grah, i think Julia or Rath would put it to much much better use than he ever could, but fuck they really dont need it and it would be wasted even more on Amara or Gina, dammit.
>>
>>3656295
I feel like if we want Dorian to go faster, we need to do something about his misty Canvas form. He goes so fast that an acid rainstorm forced him to slow down and large aoe gusts of wind can disrupt him. If we want him to go sanic fast, we need to do something about his fragility.

>>3656300
>>3656304
Also, a thought did occur to me. If we continue Rath's path of the Radiant Nuclear Goddess, we should customize Sui Tormentis so that it can do some wicked things with the ambient Radiation energy.

>>3656312
The Fibromancer core... It'll give him a more solid shape and the wires could be made out of liquid blood, but the wire strand evasion nature of the core also makes his evasiveness even better. Better yet, we could theoretically hybridize Accumulating Charge and the Fibromancer core to give him electric whips. He's an artist after all, and the Fibromancer ability gives him a built in paintbrush.
>>
>>3656312
From what we saw of Vultha, his Fibromancy abilities focus on speed and slashing damage. B'Ni took advantage of them for quite a bit of speed, too. I think it would be a good synergy for Dorian.
>>
>>3656321
At high levels, it also provides an innate aoe ring of razor ripping fiberwires.
>>
>>3656327
Yeah, and wouldn't that be a scary thing for someone running around the battlefield to have? He sprints past you and you get shredded by the haze of monofillament mesh he's trailing behind himself.
>>
>>3656319
>>3656321
eh, i mean, given the circumstances he is the only one to put it on, but actually he used it as a melee defense and counter weapon to massive effect in a way Julia or Rath could make utterly devastating.

i still think you're wrong, it would be much more potent on them, but both Rath and Julia dont need more abilities or stats as badly, so sure, give it to Dorian. he can still make good use of it, just in my opinion nowhere near as much.

last up then, would be;
Gina;

not much to actually do here mind you, just give her her own, Kosis, Megs, Bellas, and Eloises Cores. not even sure we can do much else. id say who we give all that to before we reach the Engine, but its gonna be Shu, and shes not keeping any of it so its a moot point in regards to what they give.

Granted, i can only see Eloises Core being wasted on Gina, but as ive stated before Eloise is only now opening up to others, so i think it would do her better to stick with the group shes started to open up to. im willing to make the sacrifice on if the ability fits best there for thematic reasons for Eloises sake.

oh, and give Gina everyones Neuromancy they borrowed from her. kinda wanna give her back Ver too honestly, but thats more i dont like having duplicates on people i think, just not as fun or interesting in my opinion. the Halos an exception as it just works so differently and will mold itself to them long term anyways.
>>
>>3656351
Yeah, Gina's going to be a bit of a powerhouse. Strong Neuromancy, acid sprays and constructs for crowd control, incredible regeneration from Kosi's Core (I'm pretty sure the eye cannons are a separate Generator ability, sadly), and incredible mobility from Eloise's skates and Meg's burrowing armor. Gonna be really hard to pin her down and deal meaningful damage to her, which I am fine with as I never want her to get eaten again.

And yeah, give her back the Neuromancy from everyone but Shu. I'm fine with people keeping the Verurteilung, though.
>>
>>3656378
she probably wont get skates from Eloise. that was a mutation of Eloise core based on Isabelle, not her actual core. her actual core was the Calcite Rapier im pretty sure. due to the nature of Arbiters, it might not mutate with Gina either.

for Kosi, i could've sworn her ability to take control of the Cities biomass and turn it into an extension of her was her core? an odd Vitruvian mutation based around the fact not even the Crucible could allow her to walk again, if i remember correctly.

and im middle ground on it. it would be good to give Gina the levels back, and honestly i dont think Amara or Dorian would suffer greatly from losing it.
>>
>>3656393
>she probably wont get skates from Eloise. that was a mutation of Eloise core based on Isabelle, not her actual core. her actual core was the Calcite Rapier im pretty sure. due to the nature of Arbiters, it might not mutate with Gina either.
Eloise uses the skates, too. I think she said she was an ice skater, actually. The ability is probably bone blades in general, and B'Ni's focus on her legs from Dogged Sprinter is what made it mutate to only manifest as skates.

>for Kosi, i could've sworn her ability to take control of the Cities biomass and turn it into an extension of her was her core? an odd Vitruvian mutation based around the fact not even the Crucible could allow her to walk again, if i remember correctly.
I'm not sure what Kosi's Core does. I meant that I expect it to give great regen as a powerful Vitruvian skill. What it actually does, I'm not sure, though Kosi seemed to be able to heal others with it as a Ghost Daughter, so maybe Gina can fill that role now.

>and im middle ground on it. it would be good to give Gina the levels back, and honestly i dont think Amara or Dorian would suffer greatly from losing it.
I'd consider giving it back from Amara, but not Dorian. Fear effects are a good addition to Dorian's build, while for Amara it was just an attempt to keep people away from her. Now that we've seen how Queen Crimson can evolve and have given Amara infinite clones as ablative armor, I'm not too worried about people getting close anymore.
>>
>>3656415
>Eloise uses the skates, too.
i dont think she does, and BHOP himself said they became skates as a mutation of Eloises core when asked in the past, thats not me saying that.

>I'm not sure what Kosi's Core does.
well, its hard to tell. you have to remember she was literally city sized and had consumed dozens upon dozens of daughters from the sounds of it, so her kits kinda muddled in what is what with her. her downfall was disease, not strength.

>I'd consider giving it back from Amara, but not Dorian.
eh, fair. i guess it will depend on what Core we give Amara too.
>>
>>3656415
>Amara clones as ablative armor:
>Amara losing Verteilung
I still like the idea of having lots of Amara clones flare their aura to spook the enemy in a wide aoe. It's really useful as a conduit ability, flaring the aura from a proxy clone has some really good strategic value with proper positioning. And besides, it's still a good layer of defense for Amara prime.
>>
>>3656295
>>3656415
>>3656452

right, so what we got, in order of importance, seems to be;

SHU;
>See what Hybrid Leash/Neuro gives us.
>Get Drill/Tread leveled.
>Extra points into Maw and Handed.
>Extra points into Hive.

RATH;
>Level Ignition.
>Level Alabaster.
>ready Alabaster/Grasp Hybrid.
>Extra points into Forgemistress.

JULIA;
>Setup Badgers and Ripper to hybridize via Engine.
>Hybridize Depressive/Frozen.
>Hybridize Membrane/Appetites.
>Extra into Sculptress.

AMARA;
>Level Joyous.
>Gain Core.
>Level Lexicon.
>Level Queen.
>Extra into Cannon.

DORIAN;
>Gain Core.
>Level Jack and Charge.
>Level Red Death.
>Extra into Halo and Verteilung.

GINA;
>BE REVIVED MY MEMETASTIC LEWD LOVING WOMAN.
>Gain Yours, Kosi’s, Bella’s, Meg’s, and Eloise’s Cores.
>Gain Neuromancy from Julia, Rath, and Dorian.
>>
>>3656432
>i dont think she does, and BHOP himself said they became skates as a mutation of Eloises core when asked in the past, thats not me saying that.
I could have sworn she did, but looking at the descriptions I think I might just be getting confused by how she's darting about gracefully slicing things apart at super-speed. So maybe she has a Fibromancy power supplementing her Core, then. Ah, well, Gina having a nasty melee attack would still help discourage foes getting up in her face.

>well, its hard to tell. you have to remember she was literally city sized and had consumed dozens upon dozens of daughters from the sounds of it, so her kits kinda muddled in what is what with her. her downfall was disease, not strength.
Based on the rampant growth and her ability to heal, maybe something about connecting and integrating with other biomass? I don't know, we'll see.

>>3656452
True. I don't know, we'll see. I think it would depend on what Core we give her.
>>
>>3656472
>>Gain Yours, Kosi’s, Bella’s, Meg’s, and Eloise’s Cores.
Gina's going to have at least 1000% HP after this. Possible more, if she gets to count her own Core as an Arbiter boost. She went from our second-squishiest party member to our most tank-y, though I suppose with Rath upgrading Exoskeleton she might still be able to take more damage.
>>
>>3656485
possibly, but dont forget Rath and Julia already are at 850+%. it depends on the amount of levels we have to throw around, but both still have a high chance id argue of outpacing her.

Shu wont, but Shus a balance between Health and Bio, so i can see her balance being at least on par with Gina.

Dorian....well, he needs some work. his Regen might still outpace everyone though.

Amara...well honestly, her actual stats are just kinda a mess, all over the place. no idea how she'll end up.
>>
>>3656472
>>BE REVIVED MY MEMETASTIC LEWD LOVING WOMAN.
If Bodyhorror quest had waifu-wars, I now know what faction you lead you Gina-fag. The Isabelle army shall rise again!

Just kidding. Isabelle was a tall order and we squandered many opportunities to get to know her better. we made our bed and made our choice.
>>
>>3656499
nah, thats just a joke. i dont participate in that nonsense.

but if i did, Rath is best Girl.
>>
>>3656495
Amara theoretically has more hp and Bio than all of our party due to how the Joyous Many works in practice. an army of catgirls 100+ strong running around can deal some serious damage, but that means Amara herself is basically a keystone Army. We still need to do something to give her close quarters combat viability.
>>
>>3656505
eh, i dont count that, as outside of these sorta big battles we wont get such high numbers very often if ever again really. Amara Prime still needs her stats, just in case too.
>>
>>3656505
That's the point of leveling Queen Crimson, I think. Give her a symbiote suit, have it fight for her.
>>
>>3655820
I think I can make something work with this as a reference if I edit this. too tired though.

>>3656513
>>3656512
It does bring to my attention that we haven't really discussed what we can do to get November up to speed/par with our team in armaments or Forge body augmentations/suit upgrades other than finding stronger forge cores.
>>
>>3656542
no idea, depends on just how upgradable her body is. will have to ask BHOP for if thats even possible and what its limits are.
>>
>>3656563
I still want to give November the Forge Body equivalent of a bath, scrub the rust off of her body and give it a nice wax polish.
>>
>>3656542
Yeah, we're going to need to make some Relics for November. Maybe make a Chitinous Stalwart and separate it to be independent using the Forge, inject it with Koku Serum whenever she's going into danger. That could give her a decent durability boost. Some more supplemental guns, I recall BHOP said we could make elemental ammo types, too, so long as we had the appropriate Generator skills. So get November acid, fire, electrical and I guess radiant bullets for her guns. That would expand her capabilities a fair bit. Maybe some sort of partial wing to synchronize with Nova Lunge, let her get more lift from it and more mobility? Basically just turn November into a Gundam, by the time we're done with it.

>>3656578
That too. The rust can't be good for her. Clean that off, Aunt Heather. You've got a proper home again, you can use our bath.
>>
>>3656578
>>3656582
maybe a bath in a mild acid, dont think water would do her any good.

oh! we should let Julia and Dorian(And Amara) etch and decorate her armor!

as for upgrades ,id like an option more than just dumping relics onto/into her, but we shall have to see what options BHOP gives us.
>>
>>3656271
(I'm not quite done doing the fluff text on the lists, but I can say you will get 35 level up points to spend from Isabelle and another 9 from the Phalanx. It may not seem like much, but given the sheer number of Cores that are coming your way and the sheer power of what you'll have at your disposal, I think you'll find it worth it.)

>>3656283
(As far as the overall process, I'm not so sadistic as to stretch everything over several different instances, so this will be the general flow of the next Vein; you'll have words with Isabelle, then have the chance to take the form of her remains back to Dragon's Roost so that you may have everything at your disposal, all at once. This voting process will likely open early Monday evening and extend into Tuesday, if that suits everyone's schedules. I know you all will want some time to sift through the multitude of options available to you, and it's by far the most complex process that we'll have tackled thus far. Once that concludes, then it's up to you as to where you want to go from there, as you'll have the option to continue westward again or settle in and review things that have been on the backburner.)

(Finally, November has a very unique level-up mechanic, as she cannot consume as most other Daughters do. However, it's not tied strictly to Forges, as you'll have to go to the source of her new powers to get a lead on how her upgrade system works.)
>>
>>3656763
>44 levels.
> -5 for Gina revival
>39 Levels otherwise
>7 per party Member even
>4 Levels leftover
everyone alright with Shu having one less than everyone else? not counting Gina as shes probably coming back at the end, would make the most sense and keep things the most clean too. plus, we have to Consume first anyways to get her and the others in someones head, before we spit her back out.

>>3656763
alright.
so long as we dont go overboard, can we include Engine mechanics in our votes? to be fair, i think hybridizing Ripper/Badgers is all we want to do majorly, so it might not be too finicky to work around.

...well, ok, and revive Gina and give her a buncha cores, but i dont think that would be too complicated either. just set aside what we wish to give her it all at the end.

and how will things work with Ginas Core? we kinda have to take it to get her, but then technically wouldn't have to give it back to revive her, but why wouldnt we, so...how will that work? just a free extra level on it?

also, awesome on November, sorta. looking forward to seeing how that works, at least.
>>
>>3656852
(Granting you all the ability to sift through all your options at once was the idea, so you're more than welcome to.)

(As far as revival goes, I'm not in front of my notes at the moment, but multiple parties may participate, and their contributions effect the final recreated body. I'll post more tomorrow on the subject, since it's somewhat late on my end. Rest well and I hope your weekend is going well, Gentlemen.)
>>
>>3656904
hrm, thats interesting. i thought it was just multiple parties could give levels, but didn't matter otherwise.

oh, forgot to ask for when you see it, hows the Hexxane cores gonna work, considering we are getting levels from two instances of their cores(Isabelle and the Statues)?

Rest Well BHOP!
>>
>>3656911
(Isabelle's body contains the actual Cores, so the Amalgams actually contain a host of augmentations that you should find useful, along with a few assorted powers of their own with some extras thrown in due to some bleedover of the other Phalanges.)
>>
>>3656919
oh, ok, neat. thank you BHOP. look forward to talking more tomorrow, but dont let me keep you up!
>>
>>3656582
>>3656578
>>3656295
wait, guys, were being silly. we have the engine, and BHOP is letting us mix it in. we can do more than one hybrid per person.
>>
>>365685B
>everyone alright with Shu having one less than everyone else?
I'm fine with that. An alternative could be to give the leftovers to Gina. Yeah, she's getting a huge stat boost from the numerous Cores she'll have, but she is still behind the rest of the party in actual levels because she didn't get to take part in the Spiraling Fear consume-a-thon. The doubling up of some levels of Neuromancy from Acceptance will get her four extra levels for free, but we'd still be ahead of her by five. We could give her those four, say we consumed extra copies of stuff distributed across the party and then put them together for her when we were at the Sparagmos Engine.

>>3656919
Ooh, yay, augments. I love augments. Plugging in new little upgrades to existing abilities is really fun to me for some reason. I guess I just like seeing how they can be drastically transformed for a small input.

>>3656983
Yeah, we can do some fun mergers. Though a lot of our hybrids will require more points than we can give with an even share, so we're probably not going to do more than one, maybe two hybrids per person anyway.
>>
>>3657046
eh, it mostly is just good to have the option.
this...does complicate things though. while im still ok not giving actual consume options to those we did not already wish to give em to, Augments are basically free exta levels for an Ability. Augments are a different thing altogether. so for some people, that might complicate things a bit, as, for example, a level into Raths Ignition might now better be spent on an Ignition Augment.

but i guess we never thought this would get us a perfect plan anyways.

for augments after looking everything over, all it would change is i personally would do two Hybrids on Julia, otherwise it doesn't matter much...unless we want to drive BHOP up a wall looking at every possible option we have?
>>
>>3657062
>for augments after looking everything over, all it would change is i personally would do two Hybrids on Julia, otherwise it doesn't matter much...unless we want to drive BHOP up a wall looking at every possible option we have?
Yeah, it means we can hybridize Bloody Ripper with Badger's Barbarism as well as raise Frozen Fury and Depressive Weight to the hybridization point together, IF we don't give her any of the augments or Cores. So the Engine isn't a huge thing unless we start radically re-wiring our builds.
>>
>>3657073
id still say at least lock in Badger/Ripper. both to get the issue it is over with, and because you're right, the idea of turning her into Wolverine is kickass. that, and id doubt we will have even 4 augments we wish to give her, and even then, i think we can sacrifice a few over this.

also, even better, if the Ripper does becomes her claws, then she can also put STACKS on while swiping with them now.
>>
>>3656763
Oh boy, just as long as we have the time to look over all of the delicious possibilities I think It'll be fine, which you're already giving us around a full day for.
>>
>>3657073
>>3657220
actually, this is gonna a nightmare of a vote, as those that dont want to keep Isabelle, or want to make sure she only goes into a certain personas head, have to make sure NO ONE takes any non cores from Isabelle.

its gonna be the biggest shitshow yet, as the 'Crows' or people only after 'Shiny' abilities refuse to listen to anyone over abilities they just think sound cool, like always.

Those that dont want to keep Isabelle around fight to not take any non-cores from her.

and those that only want her in a specific person fight to only have that person take a non-core from Isabelle, and insisting they take more than one to make the chances higher.

ON TOP of our usual discussion over whats worth taking and on who. plus the arguments over what hexxane ghosts should go where.

i dont think things are gonna stay civil this time around. too much at stake over literally how much a single choice could change things here on more than just 'is this the best ability for them?' situation.
>>
>>3656763
>(Finally, November has a very unique level-up mechanic, as she cannot consume as most other Daughters do. However, it's not tied strictly to Forges, as you'll have to go to the source of her new powers to get a lead on how her upgrade system works.)
Well, we were planning on visiting Francine again anyway. Unique level-up mechanics, let's see...maybe a crafting system? Like we have to hunt down specific pieces of salvaged technology that we can use to make new modules for November. That would be a cool system to play with.

>>3657256
You know, I feel a bit bad for the Midnight Crew. Twice now they won't have gotten any Core boosts from the Arbiter's Appetite. The first time because they gave us first pick, this time because we're going to argue "the human ones go with Gina and the alien ones we'd like so we can interrogate them". Next fight they do with us, we should give them a Core.
>>
>>3657276
sure. doubt we will have basically family members and sacks of alien info tied up in the Core again anyways...or at least, i hope not.

Midnight Crew can have the next choice picks next. assuming we dont all kill eachother over the upcoming vote, of course.
>>
>>3655961
>>3655820
>>3656236
Well based upon your write ins/desires and my own i blended them a bit together, after getting a good sleep, to grant Isabelle a relatively peaceful death

>go down on one knee next to her
>"You chose this yes. You have chased an unattainable dream. And it did not make you happy like you hoped...... For the things in your life after you died I will not hold a grudge"
>lay a hand on her Forehead as she has no other extremeties left
>slowly start stroking her hair
>"Let go of your worries and desires and finaly be at rest."
>"I will not force you into an afterlife, you have suffered enough already. You can rest in the dark and never have to be sad again"
>Start humming a lullaby to send her off into the dark
>Wait for her last words and then close her eyes after she took her last breath

>>3656472
>BE REVIVED MY MEMETASTIC LEWD LOVING WOMAN.
This gave me a good chuckle

As for the rest of the ability spread and based upon the Level ups we get i made a rough draft of what i would like to see

SHU
>1 Level Neuromancer
>2 Level Exanguinating Leash

Get the Hybrid
-> no cutting short

>2 Level Fear to Tread
>2 Level Heavens Drill
-> possibly reduced by taking Augments

RATH
>3 Level Indignant Ignition
->possibly reduced by taking Augments

>2 Level Erupting Grasp
>3 Level Alabaster Endoskeleton
->no cutting short

JULIA
> 4 Level Badgers Barbarism
->no cutting short we get this Hybrid with Bloody ripper at the engine

>2 Level Forzen Furry
>2 Level Depressive Weight
->possible Hybrid could be cut short for taking Augments

AMARA
>3 Level Joyous Many
->could be cut short for Augments

>1 Level Gain Core(not sure which but we can work that out)
>1 Level Holistic Lexicon
>3 Level Queen Crimson() or maybe a second Core gain?

Dorian
>1 Level Neurotic Halo
>1 Level Verurteilung
>1 Level Spring Heeled Jack
>2 Level Accumulated Charge
>1 Level Red Death
->could be cut short for taking Augments

>2 Level Gain Core
->no cuttign short we need this on him and he needs some head buddies even if they are aliens

GINA
>5 Level Gain Ginas, , Kosi´s, Bella´s, Meg´s, and Eliose´s Cores
Neuromancy Returns from Julia, Rath and Dorian

That would leave one Core choice for one of the Ascendants out in the open. Not sure where i would put it maybe on Amara
I would like to have one on Shu but she already has so much shit to work with we barely used it all in even this fight.
It would fit from a thematic point of view as Shu already has one Alien basicly riding in her mind with Karma...........
>>
>>3657575
I've also been thinking of changing Shu's EARTHEN MIND and HYDROFORMER from neuromancy augments into flesh artisan augments to apply to Fear to Tread instead, as I think the Leash/Neuromancer hybrid will be used on enemies rather than the environment. I also think that at later levels, Fear to Tread can be used on enemies as well as the environment like Uzu could, so those could upgrade its anti-healing and be able to affect liquid daughters potentially.

I *think* the Engine can do this though I forget were I saw it or got that impression.

It's tempting to just get new abilities so that Shu can gain new types of Swarmlings. I wonder if we'd later encounter a Hive Mistress that does just that, having a whole lot of level 1 powers that she never directly uses or upgrades just to have an arsenal of minions which she can chose between and get the exact stat modifiers she wants.
>>
>>3657591
THe changing of AUgments to another Ability seems interesting would give us quite a few possibilitys as well Not sure if we can do it though

Well i think the Leash is gonna help exend our reach while debuffing the enemy right form the get go(we could also then consolidate our swarmlings a bit tighter)

To many abilites on Shu are gonna be diffcult to get. Many Anons myself included think that the amount of Abilities she has right now need to be consolidated down at least a bit before we can take on more.

That was one of the conditions under which we even got the Drill and Fear to tread. Both have proven useful but still they represent a lot of future investment we have to make to truly make them terrifying(not Fear to tread i still dread the Grinder i invented)
>>
Anyone want to guess at the names of the future hybrids?

I think the Neuromancer/Exsanguinating Leash hybrid will be called something like CEREBROPLASMIC NEUROLEASH.
>>
>>3656763
Oh thank goodness.

Yeah. I'm glad you've learned a lesson from the Spiraling Fear voting process. 6+ of intense proposals and debates on figuring out who gets what.
I do feel bad for the Midnight Crew. Did they get anything good out of the Phalanx? Such good loot yet they aren't getting anything good from it.

>>3657256
We've got a LOT of things that's been sitting on the back burner for so long.
>Purging the West Ghosts from the Relics that we got from Gamma West and delivering it to Francine.
>Talking to Karma and upgrading the Contender
>Reading through the notes
>Giving November a bath to polish her body
>Sleeping like a fucking log and visiting all the dream daughters. Honestly, since the beginning of the Hexxane Armory Road trip to a giant battle against Isabelle, everyone would be mentally running on empty. I want a giant slumber party where everyone just sleeps in one giant cuddle pile so that everyone gets a shared dream and can interact with each other.
>Helping the Midnight Crew optimize their individual builds either by engine use or by forging Relics for them. The Phalanx fight showed how utterly outclassed they could be without a proper solo build to keep themselves alive Quinn needs a early game ability to help her ramp faster, Keane needs a better action economy or a relic that helps her directly fight, Jackie needs melee options other than throwing literal batarangs, and Ace needs ranged/mobility options.

We should also thank the Midnight Crew for their help. Without them even we wouldn't even have stumbled upon Isabelle's and Ozma's plot. Without their help we wouldn't have gotten the closure we need with Isabelle. They were there for the initial part of the journey and they contributed in the end. To that end, I think the Midnight Crew deserves a share of the pile of level ups.


>>3657613
Neuromancer/Exsanguinating leash
>Bloody Lifeline: It combines the leash aspect with the interactivity of Neuromancy.
>>
>>3656763
I am so looking forward to all of this. I was here for the post-Spiraling Fear point vote marathon, that was a doozy - any opportunity to expedite the process this time around would certainly be appreciated.

The build discussions that people are bringing up sound pretty good. I've got a couple of suggestions I'd like to add:

- Core ability distribution. Amara, Dorian and Gina should all get one, as Shu, Julia and Rath each have one of their own. I want our party to be balanced in terms of point distribution, with no one standing heads or shoulders above the others in terms of power level, and given the bonuses that Cores give us, I think one each (at the moment) is a good way to balance everybody out.

Plus, any leftover cores should go to the Midnight Crew, because they really stepped up in terms of helping us out. They took a beating in the fight against the Phalanx, and giving them a couple of bonuses could definitely help ensure that they'll be able to stand up to any future threats.

- Dorian: I'd really like to see a hybridization between Spring-Heeled Jack and Accumulated Charge, either at level 5 or 10. Those two abilities go together so damn well, it seems almost natural that they should be combined.

>>3657613
Hybrid Names:

Fear to Tread + Heaven's Drill = SPIRAL NEMESIS

Erupting Grasp + Alabaster Endoskeleton = VOLCANIC GLADIATOR

Badger's Barbarism + Bloody Ripper = CARNIVORE'S CARNAGE

Spring-Heeled Jack + Accumulated Charge = ELECTROSONIC FULMINEER

Holistic Lexicon + Joyous Many = EXALTANT CHORUS
>>
(Gentlemen, two last items of note that may help you plan a bit better; given your relationship with B'ni and the unique circumstances around her physical form and the deletion of her original Core, her essence will be distilled into a single Ability that replaces her Core option. Selecting this will allow B'ni to exist in someones mind, though unless a particular host is chosen, it gives no bonuses. Thus, since her Core was deleted it essentially 'disconnected' her from the rest of her powers, so the only way for someone to end up with Isabelle in their mind is to actively pick that option. This will allow you all to focus on optimization without having to deliberate over whether or not to take anything of hers for fear of having her in someone's mind by making the two decisions no longer hinge on each other.)

(It's a good thing too, since you'll also have the ability to 'Accept' Isabelle's original skills before she absorbed Mother and assign them to your teammates like you did with Gina's skill tree. I didn't want your investments in the early stages of the quest to be wasted, after all.)

(Let me know if you have any questions, and I look forward to tomorrow.)
>>
>>3657698
Gina gets the cores of Eloise, Kosi, Meg and Bella already she does not need another core

in my listing Dorian gets 2 Cores and amara gets 1 possibly 2 if we do not find a place for the last Ascendant.

I would really like to consolidate those in the main Family. Though it is implied that the Midnight crew kind of became part of the family they are probably gonna be on their own, only occasionaly coming back to the lair to rest and recuperate

I would actually like Shu to be a bit ahead of everyone else in the powercurve of the family. But mostly because she is blanced and will not exceed in any one role. So she needs higher stats to compensate for her lack of focus on few abilities.
>>
>>3657728
A few that are unrelated to what we were discussing.

What is the full description and Bio cost of OMA?

If a Nomling finished off an enemy, would that also give Shu a health increase?

If Mother was deleted, what would happen from then on when Daughters underwent The Choice? Is it automated by the Crucible, but they won't receive incentives to head to the Cord?
>>
>>3657728
>we get the Acceptance option with Isabelle's original skills.
>Isabelle still gets a core despite her original being deleted with a replacement ability overriding her core
Good, the mental corruption that manifested from spe aeterni fontis really screwed with our attempts to connect with her, not to mention her personality at the time.
Given what she started out with when we first met her, I think Dogged Sprinter would become Isabelle's replacement core ability.

But still, the voting process of deciding whether we take Isabelle in as a dream daughter (and whom she will go to ) will be a shitshow. Everyone in the playerbase is conflicted.

What happens if a daughter gets two core abilities that are functionally the same at its base (like Dogged Sprinter and Spring-heeled Jack)? Do they auto-merge?
>>
>>3657742
(I'll post OMA soon, since I'm still away from m computer. My apologies for the wait and my sincere thanks for your patience.)

(Not at its Current stage, no.)

(If the current Admin is purged, them the choice is still granted, just without the incentive. Also, the Admin would obviously not interact with the Daughter during the choice; they'd still have the dream sequence, however.)

>>3657753
(They would simply auto-merge, though the tree would get some small stat boosts to damage output and the baseline stat increases.)
>>
>>3657756
Now for a question that will undoubtedly start up complaints but I'll ask anyway.

None of our dream daughters have interacted with Sam while in our head, right? So would there be an actual problem if Isabelle ended up in Shu's head?
>>
>>3657767
(Slight spoilers, but here you are; Sam is utterly isolated in the Dreamspace. The other Dream Daughters can sometimes see into aspects of her memories, but Sam has no freedom to do anything but reside in her own thoughts and see what Shu sees. She has literally no agency, given that this is your body, not hers. This would have become obvious if she'd been interacted with earlier, but you'd have been able to pick that up through some context clues anyway.)
>>
>>3657783
Huh. I guess the whole theory of Sam being considered an automatic loser of the crucible at the start was true due to the circumstances of Sam in the middle of her death throes and the Crucible biomass engulfing her to repair AND recreate her body and install a blank slate personality.

>0% agency, 0% Freedom

Sam's big screaming rant about Shu having all the control was a pretty big hint thank you very much. We were sure that Sam had zero agency in body control but we weren't so sure about the dreamscape since the rules there tend to be more lax and malleable and we had one instance where Sam threw us into a trip down memory lane and took control over our body over a brief period of time.

But thank you for reassuring us this.
>>
>>3657756
>(If the current Admin is purged, them the choice is still granted, just without the incentive. Also, the Admin would obviously not interact with the Daughter during the choice; they'd still have the dream sequence, however.)
I think that might actually lead to more people making the Choice instead of going Fool. Without a creepy alien going "hey, wouldn't it be cool to betray your entire species, huh?" there's going to be a lot less reason for people to realize that there's a third option of rejecting the whole thing.

>>3657783
Didn't Holly interact with Sam a few times? I remember one of our conversations where she was surprised to see Shu there instead of Sam. Or was Holly just spending a lot of time delving Sam's memories for some reason, and was expecting to encounter a passive memory of Sam?
>>
>>3657892
(Holly was poking around the past to see if she could say hello to Sam, at that point. She didn't succeed, but she was just trying to help.)
>>
>>3657912
Ah, that makes sense for her. Holly's a very nice person, I can see her wanting to give Sam the chance to talk to someone.
>>
>>3657728
right, so we have a single option we cannot pick not matter what, got it.

and with the rest, i guess Dorians getting a speed boost? i cant think of anyone else we would put her original skills on.

>>3657575
Rath i wanted a point into Forgemistress, which id take from Grasp.

Amara we dont agree on level spread at all.
>Joyous (3 Levels)
>Lexicon (1 Level)
>Queen (1 Level)
>Cannon (1 Level)
>CONSUME CORES (2 Levels)

same with Dorian.
>Jack (2 Levels)
>Charge (2 Levels)
>Red Death (2 Levels)
>CONSUME CORES (2 Levels)

Dorian and Amara both need the stats from the cores the most.
>>
>>3657575
as for the write-in:
>"You chose this yes. You have chased an unattainable dream. And it did not make you happy like you hoped...... For the things in your life after you died I will not hold a grudge"
feels too....unnatural? not exactly robotic but...not how a person talks? maybe?

>Start humming a lullaby to send her off into the dark
otherwise im against the humming, she may not deserve outright cruelty but she certainly doesn't deserve that from us.

>>3657680
yeah, we have a ton to do, but one problem at a time. first we gotta try and to the impossible in a day long vote; actually come to an agreement on a part of the quest no one has ever come away from without being slightly unhappy at, while theres extra things to think about during it.
>>
>>3657997
i actually dont think we are to far apart in our wishes here

* for changes from my earlier proposal

SHU
>1 Level Neuromancer
>2 Level Exanguinating Leash

Get the Hybrid
-> no cutting short

>2 Level Fear to Tread
>2 Level Heavens Drill
-> possibly reduced by taking Augments

RATH
>3 Level Indignant Ignition
->possibly reduced by taking Augments

*>1 Level Erupting Grasp
>3 Level Alabaster Endoskeleton
*>1 Level Formisstresse´s Fingers
->no cutting short

JULIA
> 4 Level Badgers Barbarism
->no cutting short we get this Hybrid with Bloody ripper at the engine

>2 Level Forzen Furry
>2 Level Depressive Weight
->possible Hybrid could be cut short for taking Augments

AMARA
>3 Level Joyous Many
->could be cut short for Augments

>2 Level Gain Core(not sure which but we can work that out)
>1 Level Holistic Lexicon
*>1 Level Queen Crimson
*>1 Level Sternutaion Cannon

I actually think the cannon is still fine where it is. making it go up in power may give us abilites that the Clones will not really be able to make use of due to BIO cost in the future. Though i could agree to strengthening it as it is not to expensive at the moment and probably wont be until later

*I can see your point in wanting it all a bit more consolidated
How about this
Dorian

*>2 Level Spring Heeled Jack
>2 Level Accumulated Charge
*>1 Level Red Death
>1 Level Verurteilung
* i would still like the level of verurteilung to make use of his Fear abilities which we will expand upon if it is left up to me
->could be cut short for taking Augments

>2 Level Gain Core
->no cutting short we need this on him and he needs some head buddies even if they are aliens

GINA
>5 Level Gain Ginas, , Kosi´s, Bella´s, Meg´s, and Eliose´s Cores
Neuromancy Returns from Julia, Rath and Dorian


>>3658034
I am not good at writing forgiveness so i tried but only got so far before my words kinda failed me. It sort of made sense in my head if you get me

the humming i could let out with little issue, it was a spur of the moment thing to add it in
>>
>>3658065
>Amara
fair point, but its possible upgrading Joyous will give the clones more to work with, and even if it doesn't, then it just means Cannons the dead end for her we thought it was, if it starts to get too iffy for the clones. we wont know if we dont upgrade it, and i think its a good enough ability to be worth the risk, especially with it being odd in my opinion inf Joyous never upgrades the clones capacity even just a few notches along its line.

>Dorian
eh, im really not interested in Verteilung on him at all. im still of the opinion of giving both Amaras and Dorians back to Gina honestly. its just a very big personal playstyle....thing, where i dont like people to have the same ability as another like that, with few exceptions. kinda wish we hadn't spread it and Neuro out so far originally, but i also expected them keeping all of that to be temporary too, and that i guess i was a mistake to think people would be willing to give that stuff up when the time came.
>>
>>3658065
>I am not good at writing forgiveness so i tried but only got so far before my words kinda failed me. It sort of made sense in my head if you get me

i get what you were going for at least yes. i guess my issue is it feels like its a cropped down version of some of what my idea had, but maybe cropping it down so heavily cut out the emotion?
>>
>>3658065
Given that we can apparently ACCEPTANCE B'Ni's non-Ozmas skills, too, I'd like to give Dorian the skates after all. At least up to level two, so he can get the mobility enhancement, possibly higher since I don't think anyone else could get much use from them. Or maybe just recycle everything higher than that at the Engine. Dorian would also benefit greatly from Font of Suffering, if that is available to give to him. He already doesn't drop when starting to make Death Saving Throws, bur remains active at diminished capacity. Font of Suffering would let him heal during that stage (and he has pretty great regen), so he'd be much less likely to be dropped in one big hit again.

And speaking of B'Ni's skills: Hideous Strength. Put that on Rath, give her a strength boost from Health and Bio alike. She will be the strongest.
>>
>>3658107
i thought we only got the original skills we ourselves assigned to her, aka dogged and greaves? thought thats what BHOP made it sound like at least.

but yes, out of everyone, Isabelles two skills fit best on Dorian.
>>
>>3658121
Maybe. That's why I'm putting those other ones as a conditional, "if they can get them, they should". BHOP said it would let us recoup early-game investments in B'Ni, but he also said pre-Ozmas, so I'm unclear which skills it actually encompasses. But even if all we get is the Greaves on Dorian, I'd be happy. Dogged Sprinter on him would also be good, though I do worry about redundancies with Spring-Heeled Jack. Maybe give that one to someone else that could use a speed boost. Julia, maybe, so she can get into melee faster when Dorian's not giving her a ride. Or, as I said, we could just melt it down for recycling.
>>
>>3658128
BHOP said earlier two skills that are basically the same would just auto-merge for a stat boost.
>>3657756
but stat boosts to the skill, not the stats it gives it seems. which im perfectly extremely fine with.
>>
>>3658133
Right, which is why if we decide someone else needs speed, it would make sense to give it to someone other than Dorian. It would just merge because of the redundancies, on him. Though I guess we should let them merge, five to ten (depending on if we get only up to the point she left us, or the upgrades she got in preparation for attacking Almath) free levels in Spring-Heeled Jack would make Dorian pretty amazingly fast.
>>
>>3658140
eh, my argument is still he would utilize it the best. Julia would just use it to get close once basically then in most cases would never use it again. Rath might not be the fastest but shes not slow and has plenty of mobility and speed in her own right, plus shes the best to use Sui for her speed issues arent as bad as they seem, though even without it its not bad either. plus same thing as Julia, she really wouldn't use it it that much.

honestly though giving him both the Fibromancer and the greaves while he already has hit scythes feels like a much bigger redundancy to me.
>>
>>3658165
Honestly, I just want to get it to level two so he can use the "skate up walls" bit. Give Dorian all the mobility, don't let silly things like vertical surfaces get in his way. Anything above that I'm fine with recycling at the Sparagmos Engine.
>>
>>3658169
i mean...dude can literally basically teleport. i get its not the exact same thing, but even BHOP used teleportation as a reference for it. he really doesn't need the greaves to go vertical at all, just the movement zones, which hes got plenty of already. its also a free action to shift forms so its not an issue of that either.
>>
>>3658173
I was actually thinking something more along the lines of him being in a confined space without enough room for him to really accelerate. Like if we were fighting in a single room. Then he could continue his movement action up the walls and around the ceiling. I admit it's not the most likely of scenarios, but ever since I realized that Dorian is basically a Scourge from Exalted I've been worried about the classic anti-Scourge tactics being used against him.
>>
>>3658185
well...i mean, going int a mist form seems like a better situation to getting around in a confined space that staying solid. makes the lack of room not matter as much. plus, his mist form doesn't require acceleration for movement, and any extra wouldn't happen with either in a confined space, if even needed considering there less space to traverse.
>>
>>3658195
I guess. I still think that would restrict his options, but he wouldn't be helpless.
>>
>>3658203
theres just nothing Greaves adds though that he cant do without it is the thing. especially if we add the Fibromancer to him.
>>
>>3657912
hey BHOP, how would Dorians liquid form interact with the Fibromancers core turning ones body into wires(even if thats only later down the Fibromancers level tree)? feels like the two wouldn't mix very well, as the Fibromancers advantages kinda get nullified to some level if you turn them liquid, and well, obviously vise versa with the liquid form.
>>
>>3658259
How does his body being made of liquid interact with his existing Fibromancy power giving him stronger leg muscles? He'd probably get some sort of liquid filament capable of dissolving along with him or congealing into a high-tensile strength form.
>>
>>3658290
to be fair i asked about that one too and BHOP never answered me. its also alot easier to assume he just forms internal liquid springs or fires off a liquid jet pulse to use Jack, but the Fibro Core is a much different story. not only does negating its solidity change it significantly, but its another ability thats supposed to entirely change ones physical form, which Dorian already has. the interactions between his Core and the Fibros is alot more complicated and has alot more ways in which one or the other would have to concede ground and change to work properly.
>>
Thinking about it, the Crucible seems to have an understanding of the skills it can grant that is as much conceptual as literal mechanisms. It can mutate Consumed skills to better suit the consumer's abilities, and when hybridizing the resulting skill has as much to do with the intended uses of the components as what they themselves do. I wouldn't be surprised if Dorian's body "knows" that Spring-Heeled Jack is supposed to be a speed enhancement, and so when he turns into mist it just gives him an analogous method of enhancing his speed in that form instead of worrying about how to apply muscle power to a body with no muscles. I could see the Fibromancy Core doing the same thing, instead of having Dorian extend actual muscle fibers just use his blood to slash in the same way that the fibers would be doing if he was solid.
>>
>>3658330
yeah but abilities and even the crucible still has its limits, and still sticks to some rules. being liquid isnt just a straight up advantage, its comes multiple drawbacks, and thus any changes that would force on any abilities need to be known, or any changes an ability would force on it. changing the strands to liquid would significantly change how they work, and what advantages and disadvantages they have.
>>
>>3658323
Yeah, that's true, but I can see them working together alright so long as the interactions focus on the end-user experience instead of the underlying mechanics, like I said>>3658330. It depends on knowing exactly what the Fibromancy Core does, I think, there could be some easy ways to make them work together that we're just not seeing with our limited understanding of it.
>>
>>3658349
on a semi-random note, while im still pretty middle ground on the hybrid, i just realized i didnt catch something earlier.

you were calling Frozen Fury a Conduit ability, but its a Fibromancer Ability. so Frozen and Depressive wouldn't get the natural mesh bonus from being the same class.
>>
>>3658365
I could have sworn it was Conduit. Hmm. Well, I think they could still mesh together well, though with that in mind I'd understand if you're less enthusiastic about that hybridization, then. We do have enough points to hybridize Frozen Fury with Sculptress of Flesh if you really want, it would require leaving Badger/Ripper alone until next time but that's not a huge issue. Up to you, really, I still think Frozen/Depressive has some good logic behind it.
>>
>>3658376
nah, we can still give it a try. worse case we back off from it. probably will make something that gives Julia a strength or Crit Chance boost based on how debuffed the enemy is id imagine, so probably still worth it. might lose the Ice resistance it gives her though, well, obviously i mean no longer increase it, but still.
>>
>>3658259
(His Flesh Artisan quirk of having a liquid body-state would override any physical changes, since it's his Core. He'd still keep the liquid body, but it would rapidly congeal and solidify into the wires for the Fibromancy to work.

>>3658323
>>3658290
(Ah, forgive me; I'm sorry I missed that question earlier. Imagine that when he's running he typically occupies a tensile body that dissolves back into mist when something comes along that would hinder his physical form, much like how speedsters can phase through objects. He will of course gain greater speed, he can just rapidly shift forms to deal with the threats that come his way. I hope this helps.)
>>
>>3658398
hrm...still feels like that wouldn't work properly. the solid wires wouldn't have anything to properly cling to then, making them easy to remove.

as for his speed form, so he doesn't always take on the mist form? feels like something to have been told when we were worried about back when he was doing his storm run, or moreso, could've sworn you said it worked differently back then?
>>
>>3658408
(Hm, perhaps I'm misunderstanding the question. I'm afraid the weekend has been a little busier than I'd hoped for, so would you mind clarifying if it's not too much trouble?)
>>
>>3658408
well, earlier, when we were planning Dorians mad dash after Isabelle, someone brought up and you confirmed mother could summon storms, and it was then also confirmed Dorians Canvass Form now making him move via mist would make the storm a massive danger to him, as he moved via quickly jumping ahead in mist form over and over again, so we opted to have him not use his Canvass Form to avoid him getting blown away and killed in the storm.

but now it sounds like that works differently? because he only shifts into mist if he needs to, but then it still would've been better to keep him in canvass for the speed boost and him just know not to shift into mist? but we didn't go for that a you had said thats not how it works back then.

unless its now me misunderstanding something.
>>
>>3658408
>hrm...still feels like that wouldn't work properly. the solid wires wouldn't have anything to properly cling to then, making them easy to remove.
If he's using them to grapple, sure. But the focus seems to be more on them as monofillament wire. They only have to be on the target long enough for them to slice through, so having to dissolve into liquid to dodge around things shouldn't be an issue. He'll have time to get the cut in. Same as with his scythe-arms, I think.

>as for his speed form, so he doesn't always take on the mist form? feels like something to have been told when we were worried about back when he was doing his storm run, or moreso, could've sworn you said it worked differently back then?
I'm pretty sure we were assuming that he would only use the mist to get around obstacles, not that he was in it perpetually. The storm was a problem because he'd still have to turn to mist to avoid any further obstacles Mother through at him, so he'd take damage from being scattered in those brief moments. Or go around the obstacles properly, slowing him down, which is what he ultimately chose to do.
>>
>>3658438
>If he's using them to grapple, sure
well, i was more thinking someone like Rath or with heavy Armor getting annoyed and just quickly pulling them out of him before he can react and change them back to liquid.

>which is what he ultimately chose to do.
im very positive that was not it at all, and we still opted out of using Canvass Form.
>>
>>3658444
>well, i was more thinking someone like Rath or with heavy Armor getting annoyed and just quickly pulling them out of him before he can react and change them back to liquid.
Yeah, but like I said, he shouldn't have the wires on any opponent for more than a fraction of a second. They might get caught on something really durable, but that's a problem any Fibromancer would have. Them ripping out is actually a benefit in that case, because it means that instead of an enemy being able to inhibit his speed by catching his wires he can just detach them at the cost of some rapidly-regenerating Bio. Other Fibromancers wouldn't have that advantage, their fibers would be rooted to their solid skeleton and be impossible for them to dislodge safely.

>im very positive that was not it at all, and we still opted out of using Canvass Form.
No, he was in Canvas form. We voted for it first thing, and never gave him an order to shift out. Go to the last thread and CTRL+F for "Canvas", he was in it.
>>
>>3658466
that was a mistake then on our part, as that was specifically just to get him out of the door, not for his journey after Isabelle. i could've sworn we had it so he was to shift again after he got out of the tunnel, but i guess that part got lost in the edits.
>>
>>3658493
Why was that a mistake? Canvas form increases his speed and durability, two things he very much needed on his run. So he couldn't do the mist dodge safely once the storm started, that's something he wouldn't have had access to in Critic or Creator form either.
>>
>>3658503
because at the time BHOP had said the extra speed was via the mist teleport back then. so him using Canvass would've been a death sentence.
>>
>>3658515
No, it always gave extra speed, that's a part inherited from Unnatural Hue. The mist teleport is for evading obstacles in the path of the speed dash. So he can just not use it and get the speed boost but not be able to move around things in his path as easily, which is what wound up happening.
>>
>>3658523
and im saying the question was put forth to BHOP and he said something different in the past.
>>
>>3658526
If he did, it was a misunderstanding that he cleared up before Dorian's run. I'm looking at Vein 23 where we were planning it and the general assumption is that Dorian would swap in and out of mist form as needed.
>>
>>3658545
i dont think it was, but useless argument over something in the past. BHOP can answer the question himself when he gets the time.
>>
>>3658555
Yeah, let's just drop it. It clearly all worked out fine in the end anyway, so it's meaningless to argue about it now. If we did just get lucky, then let's thank our luck for it, and if we were planning properly then let's congratulate ourselves on a good plan.
>>
>>3658558
i think its safe to say no matter if it was a miscommunication or misunderstanding, Dorians simply not an idiot, and knew what to do.

speaking of, we should get him a bottle of something to commemorate his run. lets go on a side quest to a distillery or something. granted, we might not be able to bring him along TO the distillery, otherwise we might never get him back out.
>>
>>3658566
the Idea would be a good one i think and we definetly can not take him ith us, not only because he we would never get him back out of it but it would ruin the surprise.

If we get there however we should probably grab more than one bottle. I think our reserves in the Lair are gonna need a bit of refilling

Or we make him the BIO BOTTLE. Not exactly alcohol but something nice non the less
>>
>>3658590
why not both? go get him some more alcohol, then give him a Bio Bottle Variant thats say, 1-3% alcohol, that way he can still get a buzz off of it without getting drunk?
>>
>>3658590
Maybe there's a bottle of ten thousand year-old Hexane alcohol somewhere here in Almath. This was supposed to be a bourgeois city of luxury, I wouldn't be surprised if there were Relic drinks to be had.
>>
>>3658600
>1-3% alcohol, that way he can still get a buzz off of it without getting drunk?

Do you think his Regen is gonna care about 3% alcohol?
For him to get drunk he will probably need to chug vodka by the bottle or distribute his Regeneration like he did during the party

Maybe i can work out a relic for his needs if he just wants to get drunk without having to waste precious perfectly good alcohol from the old World......

Something to think about
>>
>>3658617
well, the alcohol might just be vinegar at that point, but if not, im sure he would be ecstatic. though, this city is technically mostly emotion, so Mothers old house might be the better shot for that.

>>3658618
true, though like i said, for the Bio Bottle he just needs a buzz, not to be on his ass. im not knowledgeable about alcohol, so im not sure how high a % you would want to go for a guy who still cares about the actual flavor of the alcohol too either.
>>
>>3658642
>well, the alcohol might just be vinegar at that point, but if not, im sure he would be ecstatic. though, this city is technically mostly emotion, so Mothers old house might be the better shot for that.
That's why it's Relic booze, not actually alcohol but just a comparable Crucible-made macromolecule that can still knock you on your ass.
>>
back from work...
brunch shifts is an easier beast but still takes a lot out of me.
>>3658034

>>3658065
I'll try to work my magic on making a more "humanistic" speech of comforting Isabelle.

Also, can you make sure that we keep tally of the points available in the consumption?
>>
>>3658666
fair enough. maybe if its a relic too, it can self-refill...which actually sounds like a bad idea around Dorian, but still.
>>
>>3658670
ive got that on my own list. didn't see the need to post it, but if you want it for some reason i can post it. obviously, once we see the Augments and Cores it'll need adjustments, but the general gist will be the same. you could argue at least for the Augments of course, that a level into 'Queen Crimson' could go either way, if the augment is good or not, afterall. only with the hybrids might it make a difference, and i think that will only affect Julia really.
>>
>>3658670
It's forty-four levels available to us total. Five have to be spent on recovering Gina and allied Dream Daughters. That gives us seven for each party member currently alive and capable of eating, with four left over to distribute as needed. Maybe use those four for the Hexane Cores, so that they don't come into the conversation for the rest of level allocation.
>>
>>3658689
eh, i still am of the opinion give everyone but Shu one Extra. its still points and skills to apply, and if anything, Rath and Julia could use it so the others Cores dont start making THEM get behind a bit. Shu always gets level up so one less doesn't impact her nearly as much.
>>
>>3658689
>Seven of us:
Shu's Family
>Shu
>Rath
>Julia
>Dorian
>Amara (Amara prime is present)
>November (can't eat, Forge body...does she still need to eat?)
>Gina (still a dream daughter at the moment)

Midnight Crew:
>Jack
>Quinn
>Ace
>Keane

>9 living daughters who can partake in the feast
>44 level up points total (Isabelle and Phalanx)
>5 level ups spent recovering Dream daughters and Gina
>including intense debate on whether or not to consume Isabelle's new core.
Where did you get Seven?
>>
>>3658642
Well to comfortably have a buzz(for a normal drinker) you would want a wine with somewhere in the realm of 10%. So that it is still sweet. Though that is something probably impossible to get a hold off now. Most Wine will have gone off by now or will have been drunk

I live next to a winery and the most potent wine you can have is around14%. After that the wine will just stop fermenting since all the bacteria that are imprtan to the process die. the wine will need proper storage or it will go off.

I am not sure if dorian likes the more fruity flavour of hard distilled liqour or prefers real wine/beer.

Hard distilled liqour might the only real kind of still good alcohol we can get him

If we want to have Alcohol that still tastes like something it would probably be in the ballpark of around 30% is my guess. I dont drink so i have no idea how that stuff tastes. So maybe liqueur is our best bet


>>3658670
>Also, can you make sure that we keep tally of the points available in the consumption?

Sure thing i will have my Spreadsheet ready for when the ordained time arrives. The plan this anon and me thought about should encompass the entire thing
>>3658065
>>3657997
We still have to hammer out the details on Dorian and who gets what core but other than that pretty much agreement i would say

>>3658717
I am pretty sure that the number OP gave us was with the part of the Midnight crew already taken into consideration
I do not think we get to make decissions for them
>>
>>3658717
i think BHOP was saying that number excluding the Midnight Crews portion, especially as they already got their share of the statues.

BHOP already said November cannot level up via consumption does not need a share.

Gina only needs the 5 from the Cores, that will give her at base a boost putting health at least above our frontline fighters, and makes the situation less complicated with her revival happening at the end.
>>
>>3658717
>Where did you get Seven?
As I said, seven for each party member currently alive and capable of eating. There are five party members here who can eat, so seven each with four overflowing, after the five subtracted for recovering Dream Daughters. The Midnight Crew I'm assuming are included in their own separate meal, since they're not formally part of the party. In the case that the amount we have is the total for everyone here, then the number goes to three each with eight overflowing for the whole group plus one each with four overflowing for Shu's specific group. Nine of those points came from the Phalanges, of which the Midnight Crew already ate their portion
>>
>>3658735
alright.

as for Cores and stuff, like i said, its a basic points distribution, with later details to be changed once we see the list. we still know, say, Dorian and Amara should get two cores, just which we dont know.

we can still agree, say, to give 3 points to Ignition, its just one of those might be an augment.
>>
anyways, ill be gone for the next two+ Hours to make up for my parents being out of town for fathers day, so ill see you folks in a bit.

ill post my list, just if nothing else so people can see the numbers allocation part of it better, as that seems to have caused minor confusion perhaps?

Level Up Distribution, 44 Points;

SHU, 7 Points;
>Hybridize Leash/Neuromancy (3 Levels)
>Drill (2 Levels)
>Tread (2 Levels)


RATH, 8 Points;
>Ignition (3 Levels)
>Alabaster (3 Levels)
>Grasp (1 Level)
>Forgemistress (1 Level)
JULIA, 8 Points;
>Hybridize Ripper/Badger (4 Levels)
>Hybridize Depressive/Frozen (4 Levels)
AMARA, 8 Points;
>Joyous (3 Levels)
>Lexicon (1 Level)
>Queen (1 Level)
>Cannon (1 Level)
>CONSUME CORES (2 Levels)

DORIAN, 8 Points;
>Jack (2 Levels)
>Charge (2 Levels)
>Red Death (2 Levels)
>CONSUME CORES (2 Levels)

GINA, “5 Points”;
>Ginas Core
>Kosi’s Core
>Megs Core
>Bellas Core
>Eloise’s Core
>Gain 1 Neuromancy level from Rath
>Gain 1 Neuromancy Level from Julia
>Gain 2 Neuromancy Levels from Dorian


and just for when i get back, and for the sake of said discussion, im not heavily married to putting two points into Drill and Tread for Shu, but i do want at least one into them. i suppose one less into Joyous for one more into Lexicon or Queen might be ok, but those are the only two places id move it, and 3 into it is still my preference unless convinced otherwise.

take care folks, have a good afternoon, ill catch you later this evening, if you're still around!
>>
>>3658770
Take care Anon
>>
>FULGURBUG FARADAY FIELD (Dorian x Shu: 1 stack of Accumulated Charge per Swarmling, 1 swarmling slot from Shu per swarmling): A frenzied swarm, a hive working in mutualism with a living storm. Shu can create a swarm of electric-blue Fulgurbugs that respond to Dorian's will. upon spawning, they automatically fly towards the Artist and attach to him as orbiting escort fliers where Dorian expends a stack of Accumulated charge into the swarmling for storage. Each attached Fulgurbug gives a accumulating 5% chance for Dorian to gain 1 free stack of Accumulated charge at the end of each round, with an additional 10% chance if Dorian has made a move action. Additionally if Dorian's Accumulated charge misfires, he may sacrifice half of the orbiting Fulgurbugs to mitigate the backlash damage.

A dual tech that I thought up for Dorian and Shu. Guess the reference.

>>3658770
Take care anon.

I feel like wee should leave one point out to decide if we should consume Isabelle's New Core ability. Considering the nature of Isabelle's ability set that we've seen in the past, I get the feeling that Dorian will be the one that ends up consuming it.

I'm still working on deciding what sort of parting words we should give to Isabelle while giving her the comfiest death.
>>
>>3658785
Monster Hunter? The Zinogrebugs that give him his electric charge?
>>
>>3658770
>anyways, ill be gone for the next two+ Hours to make up for my parents being out of town for fathers day, so ill see you folks in a bit.
Later, anon. I hope your parents enjoy their trip. My dad's on his Father's Day trip right now too, actually. Guess this is a good time to schedule them.

>and just for when i get back, and for the sake of said discussion, im not heavily married to putting two points into Drill and Tread for Shu, but i do want at least one into them. i suppose one less into Joyous for one more into Lexicon or Queen might be ok, but those are the only two places id move it, and 3 into it is still my preference unless convinced otherwise.
I'd move the extra point from Joyous into Lexicon, yeah. After this fight I want to upgrade Amara's Skintalking some, see if we can get her that six-hit 7600% damage area attack. We won't have it for a while, but we've got to start somewhere.

>>3658785
BHOP said that the Core doesn't do anything "unless a particular host is chosen". So it probably wouldn't do anything for Dorian, B'Ni has no special connection to him other than finding him annoying to fight. The logical choices, if we were to give it to anyone (and I'm still not comfortable with that idea), are Shu and Gina. They're the ones who would get something.
>>
>>3658793
bingo.
Also, for Dorian to say "FULGURBUGS SON" when some unfortunate daughter tries to attack him with the field active. All the Fulgurbugs will zap dat daughter gud.
>>
>>3658797
>I'd move the extra point from Joyous into Lexicon, yeah. After this fight I want to upgrade Amara's Skintalking some, see if we can get her that six-hit 7600% damage area attack. We won't have it for a while, but we've got to start somewhere.

We do not have the Words to cast Multi-Powerword Kill And i kind of doubt we will get them before endgame.
Slowly raising her Levels should be okay

>>3658799
I love the Zinogre...... I have a relic in the works based on his Stygian Subspecies
>>
>>3658806
>We do not have the Words to cast Multi-Powerword Kill And i kind of doubt we will get them before endgame.
Right, like I said, we're not getting it any time soon. But I think we're going to need a high level of the skill to make it work at all, I'm sure that there were boosts from the skill and not just pure word effects.
>>
>>3658806
MHworld or MHGenU?
>>
>>3658821
Right now i play World when i can sadly my Computer is down right now my harddrive died on me and i am getting it fixed in the next couple of days

I started with MH3U and played 4U sadly never played GenU at the time i did not have the budget to get myself a new handheld console after my own fell down and broke in half
>>
>>3658785
Could've sworn BHOP still said Isabelle surviving was tied to her core, so no, im not putting a point aside for it.

See
>>3657728
So no, im not setting a point aside for that.

>>3658797
We'll see, but besides getting mire ACTs i think that was in part tied to what words she used, not entirely the power if the Ability
>>
>>3658785
Not a bad family tech, basically they act like a layer of wool to absorb more electric shock. They better be super fluffy, even compared to Fuzzbuzz.
>>
>>3657575
>>3655820
I'm just reading and re-reading these speeches, and I can't place my finger on why it just feels "wrong". One of them has the impression of a disguised angry rant telling Isabelle it was "all her fault, that everything was 100% her choice and agency" on the verge of insulting Isabelle as she dies with the hint of "spitting on the grave" afterwards. The other speech tries to feel comforting but the emotional weight isn't there. Both of them just go on a ranting speech on a dying daughter who'll likely die in 1 act and die before the speeches are even half-way there, when just showing your feelings via empathy channel would instantly get the message across.

So here's my attempt at giving Isabelle some good parting words.
>Sit down next to Isabelle and gently move what's left of her onto your lap (using the gentlest methods, Neuromancy Terraforming, Almath's City empathetic assistance), with Isabelle's head resting on your thigh as a lap pillow. Look at Isabelle in the eyes and stroke her hair.
>Open up the empathy channel to Isabelle, let your feelings flow to her.
>The bitterness of her rejection of your repeated attempts to reconcile with her
>The guilt that you held tightly in your heart ever since she left the family,
>The anger you had when she attacked your family, when she killed Gina, and brought them to death's door.
>The happiness that Isabelle finally opened her eyes to the truth
>The regret that keeps lingering in your mind with repeated wishful thoughts of "what-ifs"
>The sheer exhaustion that weighs on your shoulders with your mind and heart at war with each other, one part of yourself demanding cruelty and vengeance to leave her dream state lost forever, the other wanting to extend one last offer of kindness and mercy and preserve Isabelle's dream state.
>The sadness you wear on your face seeing your oldest friend dying in your lap.
>"Even if you did win the Crucible, that fantasy would never have become reality, Isabelle."
>"You would have chosen to become another 'Mother' of the next Crucible from despair. Just like the like the one currently sitting on the Cord, alone and without control."
>"I wish it hadn't come to this, Isabelle."
>"Rest now, you must be tired of everything. Just relax and breathe. Your family's here to see you."
>In Isabelle's final moment, show her the love that had always been reserved for her should she had stayed or had come back through the empathy channel. Bathe her in the warm and fuzzy feeling of familial love. Shu's Tears may or may not have been shed
>>
>>3659737
The ammount of things i disagree with here are numerous. But ill start with the simple one: Isabelle didn't want to become the next Mother. It was a very big thing how she specifically was planning on not doing that.

We also are not her family. At all. In any form. I wouldn't back this if it was life or death to do so.
>>
>>3659737
I get what you're going for with the empathic channel, and that part's good. But the actual spoken dialogue doesn't work for me. B'Ni had that realization already. She doesn't need to be told that winning the Crucible wouldn't give her what she wants.

>>3639780
>"Just so you know, I have zero intention of completing the Crucible. Right here, right now? You're proof enough that its a useless reward."

Besides, with how in despair she's in right now about how her efforts were wasted, telling her "your plan would never have worked, that's a terrible idea" is just going to make her feel worse. If you want to comfort B'Ni, that's not the way to go.

Also, I kind of like the angrier write-in because I think it's something that Shu needs to say for her own sake. That "damn it, I was trying to do right by you, you're the one who rejected it, I can't be responsible for your happiness" bit is a thought that Shu needs to articulate, rather than just express via empathic field. It's not just B'Ni we're trying to give closure to, after all. But we can do it gentler. How about this?

>"It wasn't a lie, when I offered you happiness. I really wanted that. If what I could offer wasn't good enough for you...well, then I accept that. I'm sorry, B'Ni. You deserved better than Sam, yeah. But I'm not her, and I can't bear the responsibility for her sins."
>"Just...be at peace. Please. I don't want this to end with us angry and bitter at each other, still fixated on how Sam hurt you and how you hurt me. It's exhausting. Aren't you tired of it?"
>"I am. So I'm going to try to let you go, B'Ni. And I hope you can let me go, too."
>"Goodbye, Isabelle."
>>
>>3660116
See, i could compromise for this. Good work Anon.
>>
>>3660116
>>3660136
This...This I can accept.
>>
>>3660116
>>3660217
so, probably a redundant question of course, but i think even with the pre-work put in here, it would still be best to work together to try and make sure we do the Levels vote one character at a time, with the pre-disposition made for the even spread, minus 1 for Shu and 5 Cores for Gina, as trying to also decide how many points go to everyone while also doing the individual characters i just think will ruin the process and point of trying to do it one character at a time.

its gonna be cutthroat enough without at least trying to keep a focus as much as we can on one thing at a time, and even then im still positive this will be the most uncivil set of votes to date.
>>
>>3660337
You're right about it being cutthroat. Even now there are some anons who are still conflicted about the issue. And I'll probably end up fighting you tooth and nail.

I think I have an apt thread description for the next vein when I archive it for the initial highlight.
Anyways. it's getting late. lets sleep.
>>
>>3660375
and if its over the issue it probably is, letting you win would be the biggest mistake anyone makes.
>>
Blerg. Can't sleep. Tired as hell, but can't get to bed. Great, I'm going to be just....super lucid in the morning. Yep, completely awake, no sarcasm there.

>>3660337
Yeah, of course. It's the best way to handle it for efficiency's sake, if nothing else.

Speaking of cutthroat arguments over B'Ni's fate, I should probably edit my write-in a bit, I think. Change that last "let go of you" part. I personally don't want to retain B'Ni's mind-state, but I know some people do, and our last words to B'Ni should be something that can reasonably lead to putting her in our Dreamscape without it coming across as weird and vaguely hypocritical. Not sure what to say, though. Anyone got any ideas for what to replace that with, that can work as both a final farewell and leave the possibility for future interaction? Everything I can come up with just sounds wishy-washy, which I suppose is appropriate given that I'm trying to write a contradiction.
>>
>>3660390
We can edit that when Bhop cuts open the next vein.

As for some suggestions a final farewell and a possibility for future interaction:
How about a this:
>"Just...be at peace and sleep. Please. I don't want this to end with us angry and bitter at each other, still fixated on how Sam hurt you and how you hurt me. It's exhausting. Aren't you tired of it?"
>"I am."
>"Goodnight Isabelle"
Saying goodnight is a good way to say farewell akin to the memetic "Goodnight sweet prince" while retaining the possibility that we might have a future interaction with Isabelle as a dreamdaughter..
>>
>>3660390
cant sleep either, but then again ive got some stuff to put in a crock pot i gotta time for it to be ready in 6-8 hours when ill be hungry.

honestly? dont. obviously im biased and not sure exactly the way you bend, but if you dont want Isabelle to stay around, dont write like you do or even care about the option. for one thing, you wont be able to find a balance, its too...thin a line, to where something you write will undoubtedly feel like it leans towards one option or the other, so best to go for the one you actually want.

all i could think to add or change myself, was i like adding body movement and such to my write-ins, so i was gonna do my vote as;

>Sigh, and let your shoulders drop.
>meet her eyes, and shake your head.
>"It wasn't a lie, when I offered you happiness. I really wanted that. If what I could offer wasn't good enough for you...well, then I accept that. I'm sorry, B'Ni. You deserved better than Sam, yeah. But I'm not her, and I can't bear the responsibility for her sins."
>Walk up to her, and sit down next to her, never turning away from her eyes.
>"Just...be at peace. Please. I don't want this to end with us angry and bitter at each other, still fixated on how Sam hurt you and how you hurt me. It's exhausting. Aren't you tired of it?"
>"I am. So I'm going to try to let you go, B'Ni. And I hope you can let me go, too."
>"Goodbye, Isabelle."
>Let her die, on her own time, as peacefully as she will allow herself to.

nothing major and i dont think it changes the meaning at all. just felt like showing what Shu was doing felt a bit more natural.

again though obviously im not hiding how i lean at all. i dont want Isabelle around as a dream daughter, i think her being inside Shus head would be the worst idea ever, and i think no one else should have to have her in their head, no ones done anything horrible enough to have that fate put on them. honestly ill be overly dramatic for a second, but id honestly probably compromise on a plethora of the rest of the level vote distribution to avoid having Isabelle stick around.
>>
>>3660397
Yeah, that could work. Use the death as rest metaphor, from which you may or may not work. I feel it needs a bit of polish, but you're right, let's address that in the next Vein. I should get back to trying to sleep.

>>3660399
I don't want B'Ni around still, either. I think that sounds like a pretty bad idea, and at best I'd agree to store her away somewhere, somehow. Like some neurotic crystal memory storage unit that we can keep her mind in stasis in until the epilogue, when she is sent to a therapist. Definitely not putting her in the head of any of our party, though, that's crazy, so in the absence of storage crystals I'd be fine with letting her fade.

But I'm just seeing a possible scenario where my write-in wins for what we say to B'Ni, and then the "keep her around" option wins and she's in Shu's head, and then we have to explain to her why we said we'd let go of her but still held on to her. That feels unnecessarily cruel, like we're jerking her around. I'm just trying to cover my bases to make sure that Shu doesn't come across as an asshole.
>>
>>3660412
well, id think people would understand that and vote accordingly with what we say to Isabelle. to be fair, while its iffy on whether keeping her or not is winning, i do think not putting her in Shus head at least has the majority support, so even if she still sticks around somewhere else...somehow....i think from the perspective of Shu at least what you wrote would still make sense.

plus again, you dont HAVE to compromise on everything, aside from the fact there is literally no middle ground here, both the vote of what to say to her and whether to keep her or not ARE inevitably tied together, i dont think anyone would deny there will always be some connection between the two, so trying to vote neutral or against what you want for the second part just isnt gonna mesh well, regardless of the side you are on.
>>
>>3659309
The whole "Accept" thing makes me think that it won't cost a point at all. It will be a "yes/no" thing before the actual point distribution.

And I'm going for it. I trust BHOP and think it would lead to some good scenes and a new friend, for real this time.
>>
>>3660429
sounds like it still costs a point, but not the point of it yeah.

and honestly, i dont. on top of everything else, the character was never the most interesting and became boring and should've had its ending awhile ago. im tired of her being around, shes not interesting and her story is done, should be done, and i want us to actually move the hell on from her. keeping her around would be the biggest mistake the play base here has made.
>>
>>3660435
I disagree. If you think she's boring, then she's a chance to change that, and if you worry about seeing her too often, the trips to the dreamscape are infrequent and we don't even get to see everyone in those cases. It's not a mistake, it's an opportunity to set things right instead of leaving it at some final bitter moments and Shu regretting what could've been.
>>
>>3660443
i dont think Shu has any reason to have any regrets over the outcome of letting Isabelle disappear. and keeping Isabelle wont wont change any of that, because the reasons for her even needing redemption already got tedious and annoying and boring, having to now work to resolve them will only make it worse. letting her go permanently IS setting things right, both IC and OOC, as far as im concerned.
>>
>>3660446
As far as *you're* concerned being the operative phrase here. Maybe Shu would want that because Isabelle was her first friend and would want a second chance at that again. To actually try in honor of that time as partners and the help she showed her.
>>
>>3660450
no, as far as Shu is concerned to. even Shu, both in ours and in BHOPS writing on her, knows theres limits to being nice, and to what you can risk, and to how much people can change, or be forgiven for. Isabelle has been unhinged and unstable since before the crucible even started, has done mountains unacceptable things for unacceptable people and unacceptable reasons. we cant know that without knowing she is gonna die, that she wont just revert back to her old self. people do that all the time, think they are gonna die, or get injured to the point they think they, only for them to live and not change at all. Clarity of death is not guaranteed to stick around, and Isabelle has shown over the course of her entire character development to only ever use clarity to double down and becomes worse, from before the crucible til the end.

and this isnt even yet touching on the actual, personal reasons to not cling onto her like that. hell, keeping her around is just being as unhealthily obsessed with her as she was with Shu. we are not the cause or responsible for how Isabelle was, and we are the LAST person that needs to be trying to work out her issues, nor are we probably capable of doing it given everything thats happened between the two of us, nor do we have any obligation to try and 'fix' her. we have other things, people, and issues to worry about, ones that we actually can do something about, and have a reason to care about.

(1/2)
>>
>>3660464
>>3660450
letting Isabelle go would make perfect sense for Shu, allow her to move on from something honestly Shu herself had no longterm part in, but was roped into by Isabelle and Sams quarrel. its not Shus fault any of this happened, not her obligation to keep holding onto it, or fix it, nor is it a healthy situation for her or Isabelle to cling onto a relationship this messed up with this fucked a history. all it can do is cause problems and lead to bitterness. Shu does not need more of Isabelle, and the last thing Isabelle needs to get better herself would be more of Shu. you dont fix issues like Isabelle has by literally locking her in a cage with the source and core of her issues. same boat, Shu does not need Isabelle and the feelings, trauma, or issues she comes with sticking round in her head, in a very literal sense.

nor is letting Isabelle rest, REALLY, TRULY rest, at all an evil thing to do. she lived a fucked, terrible life, and trapping her in a head, one that is literally the source of her entire lifes woes mind you, where she has nothing to do but literally stew in and relive a life she absolutely abhors honestly sounds like goddamned torture to me. and we know from being told, its not a choice either, the memories flow on their own, and thats the last thing she needs or probably WANTS. even on Isabelles part, she gets literally nothing but pain and misery from sticking around, having to continue a life that wont and now cannot lead anywhere, stuck reliving and rethinking on a past she cant even improve upon properly anymore.

It is absolutely absurd to think this is the right choice, IC, OOC, for Shu, for Isabelle, for anyone. Shu and everyone she has loved, hell maybe literally the world itself, has suffered more at the hands of this woman and her mental insanity than at the hands of anyone else, besides maybe West for the world. keeping her around is just not a good idea, nor something Shu has any reason to put on her shoulders already weighed down with a mountain of other things. its tiring, its uneeded, its without a doubt justifiable to not do, and lets just goddamned move on from this over stretched, overused plotline.

(2/2)
>>
>>3660450
im tired of all of this honestly. ive been here since the beginning, ive had to deal with Isabelle since the beginning. ive had to watch as mine and everyone's efforts, every bloody decision with her, lead to nowhere but pain, and annoyance, and her being a fucking annoying selfish bastard since nearly the beginning. shes never gotten more interesting, never gotten better as a character, only ever doubled down and made any attempt to be nice to her or get through to her worse. again, and again, and again, and fucking again. im so, so tired of Anons giving her chance after chance after fucking chance, all for it to end worse than the last time, be no more interesting, and end up exactly as expected, with more misery and more tired rehashed character traits. i just want to be done and gone with her and this plotline, to leave it behind us and finally move on to better and more interesting things, and she cannot and will not provide that.
>>
>>3660469
>>3660450
While i think comparing Isabelle to west and how much suffering she brought might be a bit hyperbolic...... The rest of the Argument finds merit in how it is portrayed.

After waking up this morning.... i made a decission.
While i would like Isabelle to have some control over her own fate and how it will go on from here. I think no matter what, Isabelle wants to rest to not have to life with the decissions she made anymore. You could see that as running away from her problems. What it actually means is that Isabelle has seen what she has done and she judged herself not worthy of living.

Isabelles Arc is over she had her Build Up(Prolog), she had her Climax(Fight that lost us Gina), had another Climax(fighting us in Almath) and then now has an Epilogue(dying right in front of Shu). And only now in her Epilogue has she showed anything resemebling acceptance that she screwed up royaly.

To make a quote: "Only in Death does duty end". And Isabelle has done her duty as our guide and introduction to the Quest. Now let her rest and die her final death. We do not need a guide anymore that protects us from the dangers of the Crucible, we do not need a mommy that saves us without us even knowing. Now we are independent and do not need a guide anymore. While keeping her around may sound merciful at the surface...... (Well if there is such a thing as hell Isabelle is gonna be there but we will not know). I think it is only there so Shu could say to herself: "See how great and merciful i am. I let my biggest enemy stick around in my head and try to help her become a better person" That would be nothing more than a lie to make Shu feel better about her concious decision to condem someone to possibly eternal torture, and prop Shus Ego up because she had control and Isabelle did not. And while i think Shu may be obsessed with Isabelle at least a bit. Letting go is the best course of action for all involved. Letting Isabelle stick around in Shus Head is gonna be torture for both of them.

After we stand up from her Deathbed we will be a new being, Strengtened by her death. Let us not make the same mistake Isabelle did and be unable to let go.

And after all we would not want Isabelle to interrupt Shus private time with Gina and Rath ;)s. Dont think i have forgotten about the Fic folder on Ginas Phone OP, i want to read them all no matter how bad they are ;)
>>
>>3660480
I'll put off my original response and say this instead. One last chance, and it's not even one to live and rejoin the party this time.

I'll also give some advice: Be less attached. I know it sounds weird to say that you're the most attached to her, but you're the one that's contributing the most to keeping this argument alive. And you keep trying to convince everyone that you're completely and utterly right while pulling out reasons and write-ins filled with spite which puts people off. Maybe some of us would be less concerned with B'ni becoming a dream daughter if you were less adamant with her not becoming one to the point of denying she was ever a friendly part of the party that readers liked. If you'd actually gave consideration to the other side of the issue and thought about how things could turn out if we did accept her now that we've defeated her and won't have to fight her ever again, instead of lambasting it as not the "right choice" as if BHOP will present a wrong choice during that vote and will later punish us for choosing it. Maybe people wouldn't get as defensive and worried that your character bashing would get rewarded in some way. Her arc is over, but you seem to still seem to want to inflict any kind of punishment in any small way, then justifying it by disguising it as mercy.

Just look at>>3660493
Better reasoning for not letting her keep existing while still ultimately leaving it up to her.

I'm worried you have or had similar issues with Francine, honestly. The cyborg one.

You’re the one that needs to move on the most, regardless of what happens.
>>
>>3660512
I am literally trying to get us as a group to let go and move on from her, while other Anons refuse to. take your own advice before you try and give limp wristed nonsense to others.

basically everything you said there was wrong, minus of course if im putting people off. ever think im so defensive because i feel no one will listen to my side of things? stop speaking nonsense and attacking me personally just because you dont like my opinion or cant counter it.

seriously your reasoning here is fucking stupid, im sorry but it is. im trying to literally not have to deal with a character and be able to move on from her, literally never have to deal with her again, yet im the one attached? meanwhile other anons have literally admitted to wanting to keep her around over reasons relating to her time in the quest over anything else. i stand by everything i said, as it is, and much of it was said in aid of Isabelle, and i stick by those opinions. the fact you refuse to seem them as anything with merit just means you're not one to see as their words holding any merit in return.
>>
>>3660493
>that spoiler
er, i mean...i guess thats a reason. also Gina promised to read those to us, so in due time i suppose.
>>
>>3660493
I don't think it's about ego, or at least not the sort of ego you're talking about. From what I've seen, nobody wants to preserve B'Ni as a way to prove Shu's virtue, make her look like some grand messianic archetype. I think it's just that this is a really shitty scenario, where we have to kill our first party member because she went full yandere, and we'd all prefer a happier ending. And since a big part of Shu's character is the ability to pull out a win by refusing to give up despite impossible odds, they figure it should be possible to fix this scenario with enough determination and resolve. The ego involved is the sort that refuses to accept that we can't fix this. And I'm not blaming them, like I said, it's totally in-theme for Shu to want to fix B'Ni. But...I don't know, I just can't believe Shu or anyone else in the party is equipped to give Isabelle the help she needs. We're too emotionally connected to it, I think we'd just cause her further pain (and cause ourselves pain in the process) if we kept trying to push the issue. I think we just need to accept that this scenario is in some ways a defeat no matter what we do, and move on from it.

Also, yeah, it's going to be weird enough for the Dream Daughters who aren't Isabelle to have that going on right outside their window, can you imagine? Kosi would be into it, though, she likes to live vicariously through Gina. Please don't give a running commentary, Kosi, let us have the moment to ourselves.
>>
(The 26th Vein is open, Gentlemen.)

>>3660660



Delete Post: [File Only] Style:
[Disable Mobile View / Use Desktop Site]

[Enable Mobile View / Use Mobile Site]

All trademarks and copyrights on this page are owned by their respective parties. Images uploaded are the responsibility of the Poster. Comments are owned by the Poster.