Shijou Manor, Tokyo - November 17, Sunday, 8:00
You must take victory in the Holy Grail War if you're to survive. You're certain of that fact, and it is the premise on which all of your other plans must rest. It isn't enough to dismantle the ritual, as the Emiyas want to, motivated by a fear of the evil which they say is sealed within the Grail. If it ceases to be, you'll have nothing left to sustain your existence, and you'll fade away without a trace. Such a fate is quite unacceptable for a man of your quality.

Even with that conflict of interest in mind, though, you find yourself drawn to the idea of working with the Emiya family, if only temporarily. They hold a potent tool in their Servant, outside of the seven summoned for the Holy Grail War, and whatever the true natures of Emiya Shirou and Sakura are they both have incredible supplies of mystic energy themselves. Perhaps it's only your lust for control, but the idea of allowing such a powerful group to intervene in the Holy Grail War without your oversight feels repugnant. Thus, you resolve to raise the topic of an alliance with the Emiya family again in your next conversation with Ayaka. If all goes well, the two of you can use the Emiyas' power to more easily destroy the five remaining enemy Servants and Ayaka can continue sacrificing them to you in the process; by the time the Emiyas have realized you don't intend to dismantly the Holy Grail, you should be too powerful for them to overcome.

With your long-term plan for the War thus decided, your mind turns to immediate prospects, and the implications of the powers revealed in your trance. All three of the miraculous powers of Heiligöffnungschwert sound incredible, but what intrigues you most right now is the manifestation of your aligned elements, Nothingness and Void. If you want to take advantage of that, though, you'll have to do some more reading in the Shijou library.

Finding your body a bit sluggish after the strange trance you went into to learn about Heiligöffnungschwert, you get up and stretch again before making your way back to the library room. If Ayaka's gotten up, you haven't heard her, but she probably hasn't. After 20 hours on her feet, you can't blame the poor girl for sleeping past eight in the morning. So it's in a silent house that you slip into the library and track down the magic texts you studied previously. Sinking into one of the room's deeply padded armchairs, you begin to read...

>[ ] Forms of Power, a catalog of various sigils and geometric formations instrumental in ritual magic.

>[ ] Transcendental Principles of Elementalism, which deals with applications of pure element control.

>[ ] Introduction to Structural Energy Systems, which deals with magic circuits, leylines, bounded energy fields, and related topics.

>[ ] Look for something else (Write in what sort of magic you're looking for)

And while we consider that choice, and Alberich catches up on his reading, enjoy the sights and sounds of another's planning...

>>3603953
>[ ] Transcendental Principles of Elementalism, which deals with applications of pure element control.

Einzbern Tower, Tokyo, Top Floor Penthouse - November 17, Sunday, 10:00

Nobody could claim that the penthouse was anything less than luxurious. Occupying the entirety of the Einzbern Tower's top floor, it was a sprawling abode filled with antique furniture dating back to the best days of the Austro-Hungarian Empire. In size and style, the Einzberns' workers had done everything they could to replicate the atmosphere of their mistress' palatial home. Nevertheless, Liliesviel was furious. She paced back and forth in front of the living room's large picture window, passing heedlessly by a beautiful view of the city for which the girl had no eyes; long pearly hair and the voluminous frills of her dress bouncing in synchronized time with her steps. Finally, she stopped and whirled away from the window, asking "Isn't this ridiculous, Stachel?"

The recipient of this comment was one of Liliesviel's two personal maids, distinguished above the other servants by their status as high-grade homunculi, Stachel. She had no second name. Standing impassively motionless a few feet from her mistress, the maid answered in a toneless voice, "It is ridiculous, Lady Liliesviel."

"Oh," Liliesviel pouted irritably, "Can't you at least try to act like a conversation partner? I haven't even told you what it is yet!"

"Whatever you assert is ridiculous certainly is so," the maid answered confidently. "An inferior one would never dissent. What is it that is ridiculous, Lady Liliesviel?"

The smaller girl sighed, casting a profoundly disappointed gaze on her more developed servant. An outside observer, looking at their faces and bodies, might have thought the pair were two bickering sisters, or an extremely indulgent mother and her daughter, but this impression was only an illusion created by the two girls' peculiar origins. Stachel would appear just about twenty years old regardless of her age, as would all the homunculus maids turned out by the House of Einzbern's sophisticated manufacturing process. That Stachel was only a few years old showed in her reactions, however. No amount of Einzbern mental training and accelerated growth could do away with a tendency towards mental simplicity that obstinately appeared in the most intensely focused combat models.

"I'm talking about my living arrangements," Liliesviel said with exasperation. "Onee-chan got a castle in that town where the fifth ritual took place! Why do I have to sit around in some tower room? Doesn't Grandfather have any faith in me?"

While Liliesviel was explaining her complaint to the first, another maid entered the room, bearing a sealed letter. Liliesviel promptly rounded on her, continuing, "what do you think, Stengel? Isn't it absurd, the difference between my treatment and Onee-chan's?"

"If I may be allowed to express my humble views," the second maid said, head bowed low.

"Yes, yes, go on," Liliesviel answered, waving a dismissive hand.

>>3603953
>[ ] Transcendental Principles of Elementalism, which deals with applications of pure element control.

>>3603953
>[ ] Introduction to Structural Energy Systems, which deals with magic circuits, leylines, bounded energy fields, and related topics.

With her head still bowed so as to keep here eyes from meeting her mistress', Stengel continued, "I am certain that the Lord has the highest confidence in you, Lady Liliesviel. He knows that you are the final, truly perfect successor, here at last to complete the Heaven's Feel, and that you therefore require less support than your predecessor."

Her emotions ever volatile, Liliesviel whimsically shifted from an angry pout to a teasing smirk and raised an admonishing finger before her maid's eyes. "Now now," she chided, "you shouldn't lie just to placate me." Then in a more serious tone, continued, "I wish I could believe you. If Grandfather didn't think I needed any support, why did he send that Alberich?"

At this point the first maid interjected again, speaking with the same emotionless voice as before. "Perhaps there was no space to construct a castle in this city."

"Maybe you're right, Stachel," Liliesviel said with a sigh. "It's not as if they could go out into the 'woods on the outskirts of town' and build one. Still, it is infuriating having to spend my days in this horrid modern tower."

"Ahem," the other maid, Stengel, reminded her mistress of her presence.

"Go ahead, Stengel," Liliesviel assented. "What is it?"

"On the subject of this... 'Alberich' character, I have a report to deliver." Stengel's voice dripped suspicion as she mentioned Alberich's name. Though her mistress had decided to put suspicion aside regarding the fellow and Stachel would go along with whatever Lady Liliesviel said, Stengel still had her doubts. Why would Lord Acht have sent another homunculus, and one with such bizarre capabilities at that, into the Holy Grail War without informing Lady Liliesviel? Could such a homunculus have been created, not only without Lady Liliesviel knowing, but even kept a secret from the servants? It was a mystery, to be sure.

The innocent smile Liliesviel showed at her words gave Stengel pause, though, as the girl said, "A report, lovely! Maybe we can find out what Grandfather had in mind for him, then. Let's hear it, don't just hand over the paper." Was it right to question the situation, and dash Liliesviel's hopes of a new ally in the Heaven's Feel? Was it proper to trust in this uncertain figure and become vulnerable to betrayal? Neither truly seemed appropriate.

Stengel quashed her wavering emotions and unsealed the letter, scanning over the report before summarizing it for her mistress. "Lady Liliesviel, you noble Servant here reports that he had no trouble overseeing the death of Rider, which you observed last night," she began, "and that he witnessed something quite strange in the battle."

"Oh? Go on," Liliesviel prompted, "what sort of part did Alberich play?"

"Quite a prominent one, it would appear," Stengel continued, "for he battled Rider as the Servant Saber. After a heated contest, described in detail here, he slew Rider and consumed a portion of his spirit's energy, transforming and empowering his Noble Phantasm in the process. A singularly strange and enigmatic event, it would seem to this humble servant."

Liliesviel, however, wasn't sharing her maid's emotions in the slightest. Instead an impish smirk adorned her face, and she said, "No, no, not at all, Stengel! Don't you see? This is the key to figuring out what kind of homunculus Grandfather has sent for my older brother! I've no more doubts now, if that's how it is!"

"And will you share with us your sagacious insight?" Though her words remain polite, sarcasm leaks into the maid's tone. Liliesviel's reaction is hardly what she might have hoped for, had she known in advance the contents of the letter.

"Of course!" Liliesviel was all smiles now, and she usually stays free with her favor as long as her mood is high. "See, if Alberich-nii-chan could absorb Rider's power that shows us how he became a Servant in the first place! Grandfather must have made a new kind of combat homunculus, a cross between our Stachel's type and a Lesser Holy Grail, with the ability to absorb a portion of a Servant's power upon its death. Then, Grandfather sent him as an agent to assist me in case the Servant we summoned wasn't good enough to complete the Heaven's Feel for me. So then Alberich came to Japan and managed to defeat one Servant, the one who died on Wednesday night, and take its place, but lost his memories when he absorbed its energy, like the early Lesser Holy Grails did. After that he ended up fighting as a Servant normally!"

Stengel remained unconvinced. "This seems like a strained and elaborate rationalization," she declared. "Lady Liliesviel, do you not think it more likely that this Alberich is simply a Servant with a strange ability? One summoned in the normal fashion, and quite unrelated to the Einzbern family?"

"Oh, you be quiet!" Liliesviel snapped. "If you had my magical talent, and you'd had a look at him properly, you would know Alberich-nii-chan was an artificial creation. No artificial human looks so much like us without being an Einzbern homunculus, you do know that. Now I'll hear no more argument from you. We're going to restore Onii-chan's memory and bring him back into the family properly! Now let me have a better look at that note."

"As you say, Lady Liliesviel." In harmonizing unison, the two maids affirmed their mistress' intent.

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>>3603966
Liliesviel is best girl. We gotta play both sides if you all insist on working with Shirou.

>>3603974
Would Shirou really kill a Enzbern loli? If anything he would try and save her.

>>3603977
They're completely at odds on the topic of the grail war so there would definitely be conflict. I didn't say anything about him killing her.

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>>3603953
>[ ] Transcendental Principles of Elementalism, which deals with applications of pure element control.
>>3603966
Liliesviel a best.
God damn it.
Oh no, I want to protect her smile.

Here's my last height comparison.
Arturia is so fucking short.

>>3604001
>Oh no, I want to protect her smile.
meh, 8/10 smile
now adelheid's smile is a smile worth protecting

>>3604009
You can't stop me.
I want to protect her.

>>3604001
And even with those platforms, Circe only just comes up to her height. Truly lovely.

>>3604027
I included her platforms and head feathers in the height calculation.
Circe is very short.

I still want to protect Lilisviel. Like, let's not just stand around doing nothing if she's going to die like Illya in UBW.

I wonder if we could draw something that can extend a life from the realm of imaginary numbers...

>>3603974
>>3604046
As I said before, it certainly isn't a route closed off to you entirely. Working with the Emiyas does make it harder, though.

>>3603953
>[ ] Transcendental Principles of Elementalism, which deals with applications of pure element control.

God, all of those are useful things to learn, but this seems like the most obvious to have Immediate short term benefits.

>>3604046
I know this Is presumptuous, but to all the Lillisviel supporters I'd say unless we get some major motivation, wait for a different route, assuming we get to go back and play as the other classes.

Right now the way I see this the objective here Is to solidify Alberich's life after the war and Increase his power as much as possible, Incarnate, or even grant our own wish. Saving our master may be a secondary concern to consider, as she's the one who Is giving us our power from servants deaths, and she's growing on me a bit.

>>3604053
Sure, but she's already making rationalizations about us.
The Emiyas are useful in the short term, if only to keep an eye on them
Personally I don't really want to betray either of them.
We can always say that after our humiliating defeat against the other Saber, we decided we would get the help of the strongest non-aggressive faction.
Einzbern non counting because we have no idea where they were or what bullshit servant they've summoned this time, if they even had summoned one.
Assumed amnesia makes lying easier.

>>3604060
Anon, the motivation for Lilisviel route is literally in your statement.
>solidify Alberich's life after the war
Only the Einzbern can allow us to achieve true incarnation where we don't need orphan juice like Gil.
Ayaka's safety is also a primary concern, as she has been an excellent partner so far.

How well would Judas have done if he won and came back from Akeldama?

I think he would've won the war pretty much single-handedly.

>>3604060
Also
>not wanting the Einzbern loli to say that we won't lose to anyone because we are the strongest in the world
My disappointment with you is immeasurable, anon.

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>>3604074
>My disappointment with you is immeasurable, anon.

You are entitled to your opinions.

>>3604071
I wonder, would he just have massive stats or would he get some of the servants abilites/phantasms at his disposal as well? It was noted a good deal of the energy was used In just making us a servant In the first place, then the rest went to Improving stats.

>>3604080
>You are entitled to your opinions.
My opinion is that you are a bad person.
Her smile must be protected.

>>3604080
Some of the energy was also used in making our cape an NP proper and creating a whole new one as well.

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>>3604084
>My opinion is that you are a bad person.

Hmm. Harsh opinion over a Mongolian picture-board game.

>Her smile must be protected.

No. Protecting her smile Is optional. Putting forth hypothetical scenario's, how much are we willing to sacrifice for her wellbeing?

Would we-
Let Ayaka die?
Let our chance at a wish go, especially If we can get value from said wish?
Let Alberich die?
Give up the chance to save/bring back Circe or Adelheid?

There's a difference between what we must do and what we'd like to do. Personally If we can keep this girl alive, certainly, that's fine. I don't see any reason to kill her so we could keep her alive If It's manageable. Am I willing to sacrifice others or ourselves for her sake? No. I'm not sacrificing those we like for her sake when she has currently established no reason to do so.

I personally think you very much like Lillesviel In part because she's like Ilya and are biased In this regard. Would you extend this same devotion to Vassiet? Of course not, we don't know the full extent of either character, but one comes across as endearing and the other did not.

Why don't we see how the story progresses before making decisions regarding the loli?

>>3604093
See the current smile protection tier list.

Smile protection tier list
Circe>Adelheid>Liliesviel=Ayaka>Shirou's Family(they can protect their own smiles)>>>everyone else>>>>>>Saber

Liliesviel is an existence that is more similar to us than a normal human could ever be, and not just appearance wise.
We'll have to see what her personality is like in closer detail.
If she's apparently "perfect" she might be able to complete a wish without dying.
The only other issue is that homonculi have very short lifespans but I feel either Circe or the contents of the realm of imaginary numbers could help with that.

If we do go for becoming a king...
What do we have as our title?
The obvious "King of Fairies?
Something less obvious?

>>3604104
She could be useful. If I get conformation that she could help us get a wish, especially If we could circumvent the 'Angry manjew Interprets everything as kill the world' thing her stock goes way up and I'd find myself suddenly charmed by her personality.

Ayaka gets protection for very obvious and very selfish reasons, but she seems like a decent enough If rather normal girl. It'd be somewhat disappointing for someone likeable to die, Master or no.

Truly though, Alberich Is at the front of his own smile protection list. We don't have anyone we care more about than ourselves. Whatever happens from serving our own Interests will be what It Is.

>>3604116
>Alberich Is at the front of his own smile protection list. We don't have anyone we care more about than ourselves.
Except maybe Circe and Adelheid.
Circe especially considering he prioritised saving her in the final battle when she got hit over the actual final battle.

>>3604119
To add onto this, Circe is the one that actually gave Rushorou's life meaning.
He cares more about her than he does about anyone else in the world.
He can't protect his own smile if he doesn't protect her smile.

>>3604128
>>3604119
I'll give you that. If anyone means more to Alberich than himself, It's her.

Which Is why my main goal outside of surviving to become a king, Is to bring Circe back using the holy grail.

>>3604115
>Arturia
King of Knights
>Iskandar
King of Conquerers
>Gilgamesh
King of Heroes
>Ozymandias
King of Kings
>Alberich
Break the mold?
Fresh Prince of the Gods,

>>3604142
Could go with King of Miracles, I guess.

>>3604134
We don't even know if she is gone.
I still want to protect our new little sister.
As a king, it is expected.
We can bond over not having a palace sized building to live in.

I don't mean to alarm anyone.
But Liliesviel has her base in the top floor of a tower.
So uh...
Welp.
I'm sure Alberich can realise the strategic worthlessness of a base such as that.
If we meet her at her tower, we should probably tell her why the tower is a bad idea.

Lily is really coming off like a princess in a tower, waiting for her knight in shining armor to free her.

>Everyone is going gaga over the Einzbern Loli
Ok I understand getting in good with the Einzbern is the clearest way to cement our survival after the War, but can you all please tell me what your intentions are with this girl?

Cause yeah, Lily is cute for now..., but we have Circe, the rightful queen of our new world already.
And she's a very jealous woman.
We also have Adelheid, and her presence already tries Circe's patience. How do we explain bringing in two extra smiles into the mutual protection pack?

>>3604187
>intentions for Lily
We'll be her Older Brother.
>intentions for Ayaka
She's our benefactor and has been a fantastic help. A dear friend.

It's not like either of them will start demanding kisses for mana.

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Seeing as the last thread archived just after I posted it, I'll just repost the latest Alberich edit.
Any suggestions or do you think it looks alright?

I just wonder if Shirou can trace our sword.
I hope not. I mean, the circumstances of the forging should hopefully be beyond him, and it's explicitly not made of human materials.

>>3604190
>implying she'd want anything to do with us when she finds out what we are and lied about it.
I know it worked with the other snobby magi we interacted with but I feel like Truv and Lily are on two totally different levels of prideful entitlement.
A regular noble woman is gonna take way more shit than a princess.
On top of that I'd like everyone to keep in mind that by the time we told Truv the truth she was dependent on us for survival. I highly doubt Lily will find herself in such a situation given her massive support network. I also doubt we'd even be able to lie to her much longer either way due to us trying to buddy up to the Emiya's. Provided she's not stupidly prideful rather than extremely prideful, she'd definitely at least send her servants to look into us more closely.

Not saying we shouldn't try, but I'd curb your expectations just a smidge.
Even if we get her in a temporary alliance, it will probably be just that, temporary.

The likelihood of a true friendship is slim.

>>3604242
The difference from when we weren't a servant is we now command all the power of a servant.
We've also been somewhat adopted by the Gods.
Us just going along with her little game instead of killing everyone in the car should be something she is grateful for even if she finds the truth out.
She might be considered a princess but we intend to become a King.
If she sides with us she could be a true princess, unshackled from careless magi and her short life expectancy.

>>3604235
I mean, not explicitly, but heavily implied.

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>>3603953
>[ ] Transcendental Principles of Elementalism, which deals with applications of pure element control.

>>3603960
>>3603963
>>3603966
*hhhhhhhhnnnnnnnnnnnnnggggggggggg*

>>3604053
Oh, sweets. Is a sleeker version of pic related what you had in mind for Alberich's helmet (with appropriate coloration)?

>>3604252
>Us just going along with her little game instead of killing everyone in the car should be something she is grateful for even if she finds the truth out.
I very much doubt she will be.

>She might be considered a princess but we intend to become a King.
I want you to imagine what Rush would have done if some self proclaimed king was throwing their weight around and giving him ultimatums.
I doubt it would go very well for either party.

>If she sides with us she could be a true princess, unshackled from careless magi and her short life expectancy.
I doubt she'd be so willing to throw away her family ties to be some figurehead in some lying fool's court.

But that's all I have that the moment. Doubts.
Just want people to keep them in mind for the future. For all I know DM is bluffing and Lily will be our bff in 3 threads time.

Just remember. It's ill advised to play with the hearts of young women.

>>3604270
You seem to be forgetting in our very first encounter with her she decided to mystic eyes a Servant.
Not being killed for that is a pretty nice thing.
>imagine what Rush would've done
Probably do what he did a lot in Akeldama, die.
>throw away her family ties
Ah yes "we grew you to do a single thing, now go die." A great family. Also fuck you for even implying Alberich is a lying fool.
>It's all advised to play with the hearts of young women
Not if Predatory Charisma C++ has anything to say about it.

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>>3604235
Your broken outlines bothered me, so I fixed them.

>>3604298
Thanks!
They were bothering me too but I'm not able to edit anything rn.

>>3604282
>Probably do what he did a lot in Akeldama, die.
To be more specific, die fighting.
And even if we can take her out with ease, which I doubt, that very much goes against the "Protect Smiles" prime directive doesn't it?

>Ah yes "we grew you to do a single thing, now go die." A great family.
I'm not saying they are a good family, but based on my general knowledge of a variety of things, such an upbringing also breeds undying loyalty.
I could be wrong in this case, but I'd keep it in mind.

>Also fuck you for even implying Alberich is a lying fool.
I was typing that from her perspective. It's probably how she'd see us, no matter how powerful and cooperative we are.
That said, old boy does lie.
A ton.

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>>3604265
Someone posted that helmet in the last thread, and I still feel it looks more like a monkey's face than a lion's.
That helmet and Ornstein's both get the positioning of the face right, but in terms of the beast's facial shape it should look more like the attacked image.

>>3603953
>>[ ] Transcendental Principles of Elementalism, which deals with applications of pure element control.
THE PATHWAY TO INSTA-DELETE BEAMS

>>3604335
So a more bestial design, but similar layout. Ok.

>>3604334
His lies are necessary.
You'd hide the truth too if upsetting somebody could lead to your unwilling suicide.
As for your other points...
Well I guess we'll see what happens.

Kind of related but any magi worth anything would be immensely interested in Rushorou
A normal human turned conceptual being turned servant?
Also his Noble Phantasm is utter bullshit.
Hmmm.
I wonder if we can link Kenotis to a portal from Heiligöffnungschwert to redirect an attack...

>>3603953
>[ ] Introduction to Structural Energy Systems, which deals with magic circuits, leylines, bounded energy fields, and related topics.
So Lily has Assassin. There wasn't much doubt about that, but it's nice to have some certainty.

>>3604071
>I think he would've won the war pretty much single-handedly.
That's a fairly safe conclusion to draw, but Kishi Ou has Magic Resistance A, which can basically negate the entire Caster class, and her master is a dedicated mage killer. They might actually give him some trouble, even with all that power.

>>3604235
>I just wonder if Shirou can trace our sword.
I'd guess that he can, but he can probably only reliably reproduce the "cut through anything" effect since, if it's like our cloak, it only really requires putting magical energy into the blade. Reproduction of the miracles would require favor from the gods that he may or may not have, being a Heaven's Feel-certified superhuman existence.
>the circumstances of the forging should hopefully be beyond him
Unlikely. Shirou's so good at tracing and projecting that he starts with the "creation concept" rather than the process of forging - which, in our sword's case, more or less IS the process of forging it since it's a layering of two sword concepts on top of each other. He might even already know how to create Durandal thanks to the vast amount of Archer's experience and arsenal that flooded his brain and body towards the end of HF, which would make forging our sword that much easier.
>it's explicitly not made of human materials
First, that's not quite true. Second, even if it is, I don't remember that ever being a limitation for Shirou since he can replicate holy swords and even Rho Aias (whatever the hell a magic flower is made of).

>>3604270
>Just remember. It's ill advised to play with the hearts of young women.
Well, that's kind of how we won the Akeldama Grail War, so...

>>3604334
>such an upbringing also breeds undying loyalty
It certainly didn't 15 years ago. In FSN, as soon as Illya realized Shirou was her chance at having a real family, she went to great lengths to keep him around, which directly contradicted her explicit orders to kill him. Granted, her lack of proper upbringing caused that affection to manifest in... curious ways.

Regardless, working alongside both the Einzbern and the Emiyas will be a very dangerous dance for a plethora of reasons. We're going to need to be really, really slick about it, regardless of what direction we take it in.

>>3604455
I'm still not certain if Shirou would be able to trace it, honestly.
I guess we'll find out at some point.

>>3604369
>So a more bestial design, but similar layout. Ok.
A more Classical Greek design is what I'm trying to get at; the first design I posted was Greek statuary, and this (I think) is a movie prop based on Alexander's famous lion helmet.
The Greek style of depicting lions differs from the modern in several important ways. First, there's the proportion of the head to the mane. In a modern statue or other depiction of a lion you'll typically have a smaller head, with the mane flaring out, encircling it, so that you clearly see the mane when looking at the beast from straight on. The Greeks didn't do this.
Instead, Greek depictions of lions have a larger head, with the mane flowing back from it. It's still slightly flared, but the profile is overall far more sleek and continuous.
Greek depictions of lions also typically use points for the whiskers, rather than the lines traced by other depictions.
What's most important, though, is the Grecian attention to muscle contour. As in classical sculpture of men, classical sculpture of lions pays close attention to shaping the rounded contours of the muscles below the skin, so that the beast seems almost to be straining at all times. See how its brows fold and its nose wrinkles, observe the softly curving cheeks and upper lip. This incorporation of round shapes and furious expression sets the Greek depiction of a lion apart from the more angular appearance they often take on in other cultures' depictions, and from the more serene countenance they bear in modern statuary.

>>3604060
>I know this Is presumptuous, but to all the Lillisviel supporters I'd say unless we get some major motivation, wait for a different route, assuming we get to go back and play as the other classes
Since it seems to be pertinent here, I'll let you folks know. After some further consideration, I've decided not to restart the Fate Quest. When Awakening Mirror ends, I'll move on to writing either the third arc or an entirely new quest.

>>3604455
You've made plenty of rational responses here, but where do you really stand on the Liliesviel debate? Were you charmed by her cuteness, or are you staying aloof?

>>3604455
>Well, that's kind of how we won the Akeldama Grail War, so...
Fair, but I'd still be careful.
Between Lily and the Master of Archer I don't see much room to turn our swag on with only Charisma D.

Another note.
Lily is not Illya.
I'm pretty sure the Einzberns would make certain not to make that mistake again.
But who knows at this point?

>>3604470
You could have been writing the update, but instead you taught us about sculptures.
What a great QM, you can't get this autistic devotion to quality information almost anywhere else.

>>3604455
>Introduction to Structural Energy Systems
Why this one?

>>3603953
>[ ] Transcendental Principles of Elementalism, which deals with applications of pure element control.
Seems the most useful one.

I am fine wtih not slaughtering Einzberns and talking some sense IC in Liliesviel if possible but being indebted to Einzberns or relying on them for existence after the War is the last thing we should aim for. There ought to be better and more reliable ways to maintain our presence.

>>3604495
>Einzbern
>Not repeating mistakes
>"Guys lets do the exact same thing for the sixth time! It's sure to work this time!"
I don't think they understand the concept of not repeating mistakes.

>>3604495
The Master of Archer is a hag, she was already out of the question.

>>3604506
>"Guys lets do the exact same thing for the sixth time! It's sure to work this time!"
>tfw you tried a Grail War to gain immortality, but it failed because it wasn't a true Grail War...

>>3604513
>immortality
Wait, am I thinking about Zouken or did they have that end goal as well?

>>3604494
>third arc
Crossing fingers for Moon Cell shenanigans.
Although it existance would make our verse even more of a mash up.

>>3604465
Also I'm not quite sure how Shirou would deal with tracing an Anti-World Noble Phantasm.

>>3604514
They just want to complete the Third Magic iirc.

>>3604455
>Reproduction of the miracles would require favor from the gods that he may or may not have
He almost definitely won't have it, because we came first and he's firmly against using the Grail to wish for the gods to return.
>since he can replicate holy swords
He made a cheap, hollow fake, didn't he?
The wiki cites Nasu in Fate/complete material III (p.134), where he states that Divine Constructs can't be replicated but "there might be some degraded NPs with similar performance in stock though".
>and even Rho Aias (whatever the hell a magic flower is made of)
Seven cowskins and a layer of bronze.

>>3604506
No, they do understand. They try to make different mistakes every time.
>First War: no Command Seals, so the Servants can do whatever they like
>Second War: idk but something nasty no doubt
>Third War: summoned AM
>Fourth War: hired Kiritsugu
>Fifth War: sent Kiritsugu's daughter to be both Berserker's Master and the lesser grail
Wonder what they did this time.

>>3604527
Well the first mistake they made was somehow allowing the grail to let Judas Iscariot be summoned with a totally bullshit Noble Phantasm.

>>3604528
Technically that was AM altering the Grail and letting evil people be summoned.although einzberns are still to blame for summoning him in the first place
Before that only Good and Neutral alignments were allowed, actual character notwithstanding.

>>3604536
He should be gone now though, right?
Dumping the grail into numberspace for our wish is a solution, but not a perfect one, if he isn't.
>>3604523
The biggest thing in our favour is that our sword (which is also a top tier holy sword) was seemingly created in Imaginary Number Space from material originating within it, Shirou can only use Earthly materials so he theoretically shouldn't be able to copy it and an attempt might just default to Durandal.
Additionally, to analyse our sword, wouldn't he have to also analyse a portal leading to an uncertain realm?
If that's the case our sword is Ea-tier "this makes my brain hurt."

Would the Emiyas really dislike us absorbing the other Servants? If the energy isn't going to the Grail, doesn't that mean it won't work if we absorb enough of our enemies?

>>3604558
Nah, it's specifically mentioned when we did it that most of it goes to the grail.
As for whether the Emiyas would appreciate us Megamanning our way through a Grail War to win, Shirou slapped Archer's arm directly onto his stump in order to get through the Grail War.
And it's not like we're properly absorbing them like the Shadow did.
We're just using our fucky nature to our advantage.

Now they might have a problem with killing Saber again but hey, Shirou's got experience.

>>3604494
I was in favor of trying to team up with Lily and the Emiyas even before this interlude because I think it's a smart plan considering what we're up against, and I'd prefer to avoid her death because that's just how I am. The fact that she's adorable is a bonus.

>>3604498
As useful as pure element control will be, it's just that - pure element control. There's no structure to it, which we'll probably need to learn something of to achieve desired results more effectively. Alternatively, Forms of Power could help us learn stuff like summoning circles, which we might be able to use to draw specific things out of the IN realm.
I'm not against learning pure element control, though. It might be a good first step that will help us get more out of the remaining two books.

>>3604523
>he's firmly against using the Grail to wish for the gods to return.
I certainly don't remember Alberich ever being firmly for that.
>He made a cheap, hollow fake, didn't he?
He made a functional Caliburn and perfectly projected Avalon in Fate, and in Heaven's Feel he creates a working copy of Saber Alter's Excalibur. Archer also threatens in UBW to create a "faithful" replica of Excalibur to duel Saber with, with the inevitable collateral damage of an Excalibur-off limiting Saber's options.
>Divine Constructs can't be replicated
We don't have a reason to believe our NP is a Divine Construct. Anti-World is no more than a classification indicating what our NP targets.
>Seven cowskins and a layer of bronze.
According to legend, yes, but personally I don't think the seven layers of glowing purple glass that Archer projects match that description very closely.

>>3604550
>wouldn't he have to also analyse a portal leading to an uncertain realm?
He's successfully traced Gem Sword Zelretch, so I don't think things that poking holes in our world will be too difficult for him to trace.

>>3604527
In the second war, while they had finally added command spells, they had forgotten to add rules.

>>3604558
Based on the description when Rider died, we're not siphoning off enough to cause concern. But even if we were, wouldn't it be ideal for the Emiyas if the Grail doesn't have enough energy to function?

>>3604558
Eating strong magical beings for fun certainly isn`t going to win goodboi points in their eyes.
Since they might assume that we will take them as a snack next. Medusa, Shirou and Sakura are very nutritious. Sakura might be even enough to stabilize our existence post-War.

>>3604569
Archer was probably bullshitting in UBW
Only time he can even create a half-way close to believeable fake of Excalibur is within the Moon Cell
His Excalibur in HF is a "close enough" fake that also kills him
He made Caliburn with Saber's assistance no?
As for Raw Ass, it's magic I don't gotta explain shit.
The Avalon Projection is because of some stupid bullshit that isn't possible with anything else
The Jewel Sword doesn't specifically have a portal for it's cutting edge. The Jewel Sword is also specifically something that Zelretch intended for humans to be able to create eventually, Our sword is linked to nothingness bullshit.

>>3604583
>The Avalon Projection is because of some stupid bullshit that isn't possible with anything else
It's because Avalon was literally inside his body for the greater half of his life, making it the most familiar object that he could project. So stupid bullshit.

>>3604583
>Archer was probably bullshitting in UBW
It's hard to say for certain, but if a mostly-dead, mind-addled Shirou can pull it off, Archer probably can too.
>His Excalibur in HF is a "close enough" fake that also kills him
Not really. It's a "close enough" fake, sure, but so are all his projections. It doesn't kill him, though - what kills him is Archer's arm, which puts a huge strain on his mind whenever he projects and his mind inevitably shatters as a result.
>He made Caliburn with Saber's assistance no?
He needed Saber's assistance to use Caliburn, but not to project it. He projected it straight out of his dreams.
>As for Raw Ass, it's magic I don't gotta explain shit.
That's kind of my point.
>The Avalon Projection is because of some stupid bullshit that isn't possible with anything else
True, but he still managed to project it, it takes you to another world, and it's not even a sword.
>The Jewel Sword doesn't specifically have a portal for it's cutting edge.
If anything, that should make it easier for Shirou to project, since the portal IS the sword.

>>3604607
You're totally wrong on the Excalibur thing.
Complete Materials 3 retcons it
>Q: What is the limit of replication in UBW? The highest level of NP (sword types) is probably Ea, but while it might be impossible for Shirou, could Archer make it? Also, under the meaning of weapons, to what extent can he make modern weapons? Must it be only blade types or can he make guns and mobile weapons?
>A: Divine constructs like Ea and Excalibur are non-replicable. There might be some degraded NPs with similar performance in stock though. Also, since sword is becoming his origin, the weapons that he has stored are fundamentally limited to close combat.

How should him having to analyse a portal leading to imaginary number space make projecting it easier?
Hell, if it's entire edge is a portal, then you could actually say it has no edge at all.
So could you even really call it a sword?
Avalon is absolute asspull tier so lets try not to use that as our example

>>3604620
Ah, Kinoko "I can't stop contradicting myself" Nasu.
>Archer is Shirou, with a superior version of his ability
>Shirou can project Excalibur using Archer's arm
>Archer can't project Excalibur
>By the way, he can only project close-combat weapons
>But if he fucks up his magic circuits badly enough, he can project guns!
orz

>>3604620
>Complete Materials 3 retcons it
Christ, Nasu, give us a break, will ya?

The Gem Sword doesn't have much of an edge, either. It's an oblong crystal on a stick with a hole to another world inside of it so you can turn it into the world's most dangerous laser pointer. A sword that cuts through anything by sending material its edge comes into contact with to a different dimension is conceptually very sword-like by comparison.
And Rho Aias isn't a sword at all.

>>3604629
Things that aren't swords are apparently more expensive and lower quality.
Fishing Rods and Bows definitely aren't swords.
Basically Shirou is wildly inconsistent in both his ideals and his powerset, but we love him for it.

>>3604298
Thanks for the cleanup, anon! This looks excellent.
By the way, I'm curious what Servant the face and arm are coming from. The main armor is Saberlot's, and the cloak is an edit of Seiba's, but I can't place the head sprite or the arm holding Heiligöffnungschwert.

>>3604624
Prisma "Nasu is asleep, have Shirou win a grail war in one night, trace Divine constructs and create sword tidal waves in Unlimited Blade Works." Illya is my favourite example of inconsistency

>>3604644
Did Miyu's brother even go through the same inciting incident for his sword origin? I'm not caught up on Prillya, but it seems like he probably has a different set of powers that merely look similar.
Of course, everything in that world is stupidly OP compared to FSN. There's a family of human magi that can manufacture new NPs using cards.

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>>3604640
orig spriteanon here, these are the parts I used.

>>3604656
He just uses an EMIYA card (which is meant to be degraded from a Servant) and activates bullshit mode
Then he loses the card and activates super bullshit mode.

>>3604659
Interesting.

>>3604659
Oh, interesting. So it was Saber Diarmuid and Li Shuwen...
Nice job picking the parts; they really came together well.

By the way, you referred to that as "take 1" in the last thread. Planning on doing another version?

>>3604668
I could maybe try for something with the lion helm but that'd have to be drawn from scratch I feel.

The color corrected and properly outlined version >>3604298 looks pretty dang spiffy, thanks for fixing it up m8s!

>>3604682
I'd be glad to see it if you did try drawing the helm from scratch, but either way you've contributed something great to the quest. Thank you!

>>3604661
>He uses an EMIYA card
That's one of my big problems with Prillya, right there. Not Servant cards, I can accept those as a plot device, but the EMIYA card in particular. EMIYA is a direct product of the timeline in which F/SN takes place. He begins as Shirou, experiences the Fuyuki fire, has Avalon stuck in his chest, becomes a sword, and eventually contracts with Alaya to obtain UBW and become a counter guardian.
Prillya occurs in a world where none of that happens. There is no Fuyuki fire. Illyasviel is an almost normal girl. Shirou is a random orphan who Kiritsugu and Irisviel decided to adopt for no real reason. Nobody stuck Avalon into Shirou's chest. There is no cause in this timeline for the existence of Archer. UBW and his abilities are a causeless existence with no origin.
Even then, you could say that events diverge in F/SN, but he still exists there, so he has some independence from the flow of history. But then, it gets even worse! The Servant cards are from an entirely different world, in which history diverted much earlier, and there's no conceivable path to the existence of Archer! Where does UBW come from? Where does the EMIYA card come from? It makes no sense.

>>3604711
>adopt
I think the term is "kidnap".
No Fire = Shirou wouldn't be an orphan.

Prillya is so dumb
At least Kid Gil shows up, and that was pretty cool.
The cards are just stupid though.
Especially the EMIYA card.
Don't forget the card was actually blank until EMIYA decided to just somehow hop into it.
And nobody is remotely surprised by the existence of Counter Guardian EMIYA at all.

>>3604726
Also how is it possible for Saber to be a class card?
She should either be mulliganing grail wars, in Avalon, or a Counter Guardian, no? She shouldn't be a Heroic Spirit, right?

>>3604735
Presumably Artoria would normally be capable of being a Heroic Spirit, but in the Prillya timeline she didn't make that deal at the end of her life or whatever?

>>3604742
You need to make so many exceptions for Prisma Illya.
It's like a wierd fever dream.
It makes even less sense than HA at times, and HA isn't meant to make sense
what's your favourite HA scene anyway, everyone?
I think mine is the shenanigans that occur with Rin's second true magic box.

>>3604142
>Alberich
King of Gods please.

>>3604774
My favorite scene from Hollow Ataraxia? I'd say it's a toss-up between the pool-date with Illya and visiting Illya at home.

Wait what would happen to Alberich if he fused his current sword with Ea?

>>3604814
>King of Gods
I don't think it works that way.
>>3604815
Both great scenes.
Good taste.
I mostly like the Rin scene because of the phone dialling through to other timelines.

>>3604822
I have no idea.
The real question is what happens to everyone else.

I still don't think Shirou should be able to trace our sword.
I hope not.
But his abilities are just too inconsistent to know one way or the other.
At least if he can he'd only be able to trace a sword that can cut through anything, not like the gods are just gonna hand out miracles to anyone.

Also I would imagine an Anti-World NP would have a large energy cost to trace, even for him.

Transcendental Principles of Elementalism is what you settle on. It was Heiligöffnungschwert's third miracle that provoked this return to the library, after all. If you hold in your possession an artifact that can manifest your Imaginary Elements, the only reasonable choice in magic study is to read the book on elemental control. Previously you were interested in general magic theory; supplementing your understanding of the way magi look at the world, since you had no direct path in mind when it came to your own magical pursuits. Now, however, the need arises for a more practical focus.

Unfortunately, the author confined himself to writing about the so-called Five Great Elements: those elements which manifest in this world, namely Earth, Water, Fire, Wind, and Sky. Although one of these is an alignment of yours, its nature makes it less than ideally useful for raw manipulation. Sky, the author explains, is an element that can only affect magical constructs and actualized mysteries, since it is the element of magic itself. You recall Circe telling you something similar during her own dissertation on the elements, back in the Akeldama, but she didn't get into much detail regarding manifesting them directly. Her view of magic, you recall, was as spells created by a combination of element and attribute, where the primary focus is to produce a certain effect on the world by actualizing the mystery related to it through a foundation of element and a form defined by attribute. As you consider the subject, you realize this likely has to do with the origins of magic from a goddess' perspective. If magic began as using the divine language to command the world to reshape itself, it would be natural to, when studying the composition of magic that makes up these commands, prioritize the effect and regard the mystic substance as subsidiary.

Elementalism seems to be a very different sort of magic. It's manifestly human in its outlook, to continue with the speculation regarding conceptual origins, as it studies magic beginning with substance. Both Circe and the elementalist magi recognize the world as being composed of five elements, but whereas her approach to magic focused on the manifestation of effects, the author of Transcendental Principles writes exclusively about the manifestation and control of elements in their pure material state. Since Sky has no function in a pure material state, it's naturally glossed over. Still, you persevere despite the cold treatment given to your alignment. It's the method that matters, after all, not the subject. With Heiligöffnungschwert's power, you should be able to maintain the existence of Nothingness, which Circe called "the element of impossible materialization," using the principles outlined here for the ordinary material elements.

The methods outlined in the text are, by and large, as much the object of Circe's scorn as its subject. The book follows a chronological approach to the development of elemental control, beginning with the most rigid of formal craft by outlining such things as magic circles that can be inscribed on parchment and then burned to summon a gout of fire. After that, the author progresses to the autohypnotic method, using incantations to promote the subconscious shaping of Od. Less than a third of the book pertains to the information most useful to you, the actual forms which these indirect methods should induce mystic energy to take.

Nonetheless, after several hours of reading you arrive at a basic understanding of how to shape your energy into the elemental forms according to the internal method of control that Circe taught you. By focusing on the inner system of your magic circuits and channeling the mystic energy that flows through them to the boundary line between yourself and the world, you can compel it to manifest as materialized Nothingness; at least, that's the theory. Now that you have a clear idea of what to do, you begin your first practical test, conjuring into the air before you...

>[ ] A projectile, modeled on the classic fireball design. (Duty)

>[ ] A barrier, like an oversized round shield. (Self-Preservation)

>[ ] A sword, its shape replicating Heiligöffnungschwert. (Pride)

>[ ] A flat strip, like Kenótis' shape when Circe first created it. (Compassion)

>[ ] Something else (Write in)

Note that just came to mind:
Someone in the last thread asked if the emotional stats in the menu were up to date. They are. I've been keeping them updated with fair frequency, I think, and at any rate they're presently current.

>>3605337
>[ ] A projectile, modeled on the classic fireball design. (Duty)
We need a projectile attack anyway.

>>3605337
....
>[ ] A flat strip, like Kenótis' shape when Circe first created it. (Compassion)

>>3605337
>[ ] A flat strip, like Kenótis' shape when Circe first created it. (Compassion)
You see, Circe? I'm learning

>>3605337
>>[ ] A flat strip, like Kenótis' shape when Circe first created it. (Compassion)
Actually, I take it back. Fuck the insta-delete beam, doing this in honor of Circe is too good to pass up.

So this is basically creating a deletion portal without needing to use our cape, right? Though from the sound of it it's not gonna be as big as our current cape.

>>3605350
Eh fuck it I'll switch to
>[ ] A flat strip, like Kenótis' shape when Circe first created it. (Compassion)
I'm not sure about what we could even use it for though.
We'll need to find out what effect it has on the material world.

>>3605392
No. You're putting your element into physical form. A portal is a complex construct; what you're shaping is solid Nothingness. Neither the projectile nor the ribbon would be "deletion."

>>3605337
>>[ ] A flat strip, like Kenótis' shape when Circe first created it. (Compassion)

>>3605395
Ah, so by creating a flat strip, we're putting something in mid-air to interrupt people's weapon swings or cause them to trip, right? And not an out and out barrier, since that's a separate option?

>>3605408
I assume we could also use it for the purposes of binding.

>>3605408
Honestly, aside from the nostalgiac factor I'm picking the strip because it seems like the thing that could go the least wrong on our first try.

>>3605408
Think of it like an appendage. What you're doing is summoning and controlling your element, after all. You can manipulate it in the same way as you could manipulate a fireball to fly forward, or the sword replica to strike an enemy from behind. If it helps make it clearer, I had first thought of a chain or a tentacle, before deciding that modeling it on Kenótis' first form was more stylistically appropriate.

>>3605434
Ah, so like a big ribbon we're controlling with telekinesis?

>>3605443
Something like that, yes.

>>3605434
Ah so I was correct on my binding assumption.
Could be useful.
Especially on enemy Masters.
Unlikely to work on a Servant but very few Non-Casters can actually use magecraft at all.
Like, you might get a few that use runes
+1 to us over Arturia
We can actually use our magical potential for magecraft other than stupid huge golden explosions and temporarily getting stronger/faster.
I assume that materialised Nothingness would be a fairly difficult substance to break.
With all the other's they have limited uses.
A strip of telekinetically (sort of) controlled difficult to break cloth however has a large variety of uses. Binding, neck snapping, blindfolding, suffocating, tripping.

>>3605337
A sharp projectile, like a thrown dagger or arrow

So, will Assassin be a Hassan, do you think?
Because if so I'm hoping for Serenity.
Conceptual Biology should make us immune to her poisons.
And if you don't die when she touches you, she gets... attached.

>>3605558
I feel like we've already met Assassin. It would make sense, given how Lily's family essentially confines her to the tower.

>>3605558
Assassin is "Niemand" in service of Liliesviel anon. A germanic figure most likely.

>>3605583
Niemand means "Nobody" too.

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>>3605337
A parrying dagger.

So that's 4 for a shadowy tendril and 2 for a blade.

>>3605618
I've always had really mixed feelings about the Abyss Watcher's design

>>3605635
I'm not surprised, that pointy hat is dinky and ugly as hell.

Why not a projectile? We're severely lacking in ranged options.

>>3605644
You can use a blade for a projectile or to parry, so it's the same either way.

>>3605644
Fuck the projectile, get the utility ability that allows for a wide variety of write ins while also honoring our first waifu.

>>3605644
Don't think it's of much use in "serious" combat, while a utility option which can be controlled while fighting is more useful.

>>3605644
A basic projectile won't do shit damagewise to a servant.
The Cloth Strip can probably be used to trip them or something though, where we can follow through with a deadly finish.
Cloth can also be wrapped around an enemy masters throat and squeezed I imagine. So a great way to subdue or kill an enemy master.
Hell, we could even wrap it round their face tight enough so they can't use a command spell.

>>3605660
It'd be a great way to start a fight off right, most wouldn't expect a Saber cast a projectile magic spell at them and might injure them before we close to melee range.

>>3605671
We could definitely kill a master with an unexpected projectile. Don't get me wrong, I think the cloth strip sounds cool too. But it's still only useful at close range and we're already the best close range class without it.

>>3605676
Anon, if a servant could be caught off guard by suddenly having a conjured projectile lobbed at them, they probably weren't a very good servant.
And it's not like we'll be conjuring an EMIYA style projectile to shoot.

You know, I'm surprised nobody made a joke about Heiligöffnungschwert's three miracles being analogous to Killer Queen's three bombs. Has the kiraposting died down?

>>3605690
I mean, the three abilities aren't as seperate and distinctive as the bombs. The three bombs would be more analogous to three related but distinct NPs imo.

>>3605688
I mean, the same could be said about a strip of cloth

>>3605702
I really like that the cloth can do more than just lob itself at the enemy. It lends itself well to creative tactics.

>>3605684
Anon, the Cloth is controlled telekinetically.
It's no less useful at long range than shooting a sword would be.
And it has far more utility.

Could the strip of cloth also be hardened or sharpened?

>>3605337
>[ ] A flat strip, like Kenótis' shape when Circe first created it. (Compassion)
Honors Circe, can be used in a lot of creative and unexpected ways, and sticks to our bootleg Shadow theme for abilities. How can we not?

>>3605714
Why do you need to stab people with your fabric?

>>3605714
I assume it won't break easily, but if you want something that's hardened or sharpened, you're probably better off getting the shield or the sword? Like, I love the strip of cloth, but I'm not gonna pretend it can also do what other options offer.

Remember that this is practicing elemental control, not summoning.
None of these options really locks out the others permanently or anything. We're just determining what form you're most familiar with based on what you first practice with.
It's like the difference between (in some other fantasy series) a pyromancer who starts off learning to throw fireballs and one who starts off with touch of fire.

>>3605718
We don't have to be constrained to making it clothlike in every way right? It's a magical construct that we're just making up. We can get a little creative and add even more utility to it.

>>3605724
What do you mean by it not being summoning? Would summoning lock us out of other things?

>>3605726
From what Sweets just said, looks like it yeah, eventually.

>>3605730
If you summon a sword, it's just a sword. If you make a sword out of Nothingness, you can make it float or reshape it into something else, or what have you. It's not a real sword, just a lump of elemental magic shaped like a sword.

>>3605736
Why not just start that way now? We're capable of forming it into a blade if we wanted to, so we should be able to add those attributes to a flexible clothlike construct.

>>3605726
By all means, do get creative. I put that set of prompts up primarily to demonstrate the versatility of elemental control.

>>3605337
Changing my vote to
>[ ] A flat strip, like Kenótis' shape when Circe first created it. (Compassion)
With sharpened edges, a sharpened point, and can be made flexible or solid
>>3605747
Doable?

>>3605747
Can we make a semi-autonomous construct?

>>3605755
*Dream Crusher EX Activated*

>>3605755
Sorry to immediately say no after telling you to get creative, but...
No.
Elemental magic is all about manifesting your element into the world in simple shapes that you control directly. A fireball, a great stream of water, a blade of wind, etc.
Complex constructs that exist or act beyond your direct and continuous maintenance would require a more complex form of magic.

>>3605778
Hmm.
I take it we cannot create something that would react upon something touching it?
Like, something like a beartrap.

>>3605778
How distracting (during mid-combat) would directly controlling something like an animal construct be? What about a bird construct capable of flight?

>>3605803
If you're watching it happen and make it move, yes, but I don't think that's what you mean.

>>3605747
Is there any downside to adding attributes to the cloth?

>>3605805
Do you want to show off to Lily by making cool animals or something?
I don't really see how puppeteering birds or animals will have many applications in combat.

>>3605805
Depends on the specifics. If you want something generally shaped like a bird, that "flies" by being propelled through the air by magic, no more distracting than controlling a floating sword or the shadowy ribbon. If you want a realistic-looking bird replica that flies under physical principles, the same way a real bird does, it would be highly distracting. It would also require more knowledge of bird anatomy than you have.

>>3605813
Only the downsides entailed by the attributes. If you want it to be hard, it will be less flexible, and so-on.

>>3605810
I meant more in the way of creating something that would utilise a spring or some kind of release mechanism that would trip when pressure was applied.

>>3605822
So could we twist the cloth into a drill?

>>3605822
I could do without the hardness if the edges could still be sharp.

>>3605848
In the first place, it would be complicated; you'd have to research the construction of it, manifest the mechanical parts individually, assemble them, and then concentrate on maintaining its existence until it had fulfilled its purpose.
You can see why magi turned to mystic codes instead, I'm sure.

>>3605856
I guess?

>>3605871
That's slightly irritating
Also
Cool, drills > swords anyway.

>>3605882
>drills > swords
Unless you're talking about hairstyles, you can take that heretical talk right out of this quest, anon!

>>3605887
Drills are a man's weapon pointing to the future, and I won't let you shit talk them while I'm around.

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>>3605887
No.

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>>3605900
>>3605902
I'm not going to tell you twice!

>>3605882
>>3605887
>>3605900
>>3605908
>>3605902
>Local men don't recognize the greatness of the spear, more on that at 11

>>3605920
>look at me! I've got a pointy stick!
Fuck off, Lancer.

>>3605920
Truth is, the reason why I dislike the idea of drills as a weapon is that they're bastardized spears.

A wise man once said "If there's a hole, it's a guy's job to thrust into it".

>>3605936
But spears don't drill
Spears spear
Drills drill.

>>3605939
Fantastically poor advice around Kiara.

>>3605925
How so?

>>3605924
>A repurposed slave's mining implement
>Versus a noble weapon which has been wielded by conquerers the world over

>>3605945
Usually if you see a "drill weapon" in fiction, it's a piercing attack, often placed on the end of a pole. In other words, it's a polearm. What is the origin of polearms? That's right, the spear.
Otherwise it's used like a shortsword, and that's just even more lame.

>>3605945
>a mighty instrument that can smash through solid rock
>sharp stick used to stab fleeing animals with

>>3605957
They're not even supposed to be a weapon, anon. Just give it up.

>>3605956
I see, makes sense

>>3605957
At least the drill is better than the crossbow and similar garbage

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Check out this drill like thing that is explicitly better than any sword.

>>3605986
>Drill-like thing
>Doesn't drill through anything
>Explicitly a cutting implement
>No point
Are you kidding?

>>3605999
It's more like a drill than it is a sword.
However I feel we've gotten way off topic.

>>3606004
We can all agree that drills are best hairstyle though, right?

>>3606016
It's pretty great, no doubt about that.

Nothingness: the element that makes up all materials in the Realm of Imaginary Numbers. Although the world you dwell in is made up of Five Great Elements, only two exist in the gods' newer realm. These are Nothingness, which fills the roles of Earth, Water, Wind, and Fire; and Void, which fills the role of Sky. With Heiligöffnungschwert's third miracle and basic knowledge of elemental magic, you're now finally ready to make proper use of the fact that you are aligned to this multifaceted Imaginary Element.

You draw the mystic energy out of your magic circuits, transforming it at the edge of your existence, and introducing it into the world as Nothingness, physically materialized. You imbue the element with the soft flexibility of silk, interwoven with the resilience of steel. Then, carefully maintaining the force of will necessary to impose your control on the manifestation, you give it shape, flowing into the world from the energy gathered around your hand as a long ribbon three inches wide by six feet long, of the same color as your cloak. At first you only hold it in place, the difficulty of maintaining its existence gradually slackening as your mind grows accustomed to the task of governing an elemental manifestation.

You look at the strange thing floating in the air, for all the world an ordinary strip of black silk, with a feeling of great pride. You've changed a great deal since appearing in the Akeldama; all for the better, of course, but it's never really been by your own power. Akeldama gave you power, first through the pseudo-grail and then through the completion of its ritual. Ayaka empowered you through her ritual, which allowed you to absorb Rider's sacrifice. Circe gave you power in the form of the mystic codes she created for you, which later became your skills and Noble Phantasms. Even your fighting abilities, partially learned through your own effort, were aided by the first mystic code she gave you, the gloves which enhanced your muscle memory. Now, though, for the first time, you've truly improved your power exclusively by your own efforts and study. You've learned, on your own, to wield the power of your element!

Status Updated

Experimenting with your control over the manifestation, you will it to take on the red edging that marks the black areas of Kenótis. It obligingly shifts, proving one of your hypotheses about the nature of your weaponry. You'd been wondering whether it was the other side of Kenótis' portal that was wholly dark, or if that were a property of the portal itself. The ability of this construct of Nothingness to hold color proves that the darkness of your portals comes from the fact that whatever light strikes them is being transported to the Realm of Imaginary Numbers, rather than being a fundamental property of the Imaginary Elements.

Next, you experiment with the size and physical properties of the ribbon. By pouring more energy into it, you're able to lengthen it as much as you like, and you make several circuits around the walls of the room before returning it to a more manageable size. You confirm your deftness with it by picking up and replacing several books; there are no problems using it as an extensible limb. You can harden it to greater rigidity, making a narrow shield out of the thing, or narrow the edges into a blade, with somewhat more effort than was required to change the color. Finally you try moving the ribbon's entire length away from yourself, and find that it becomes more difficult to sustain the ribbons existence as it gets farther from you. Intriguingly, keeping one end tucked away in your cloak and extending the other across the room uses less energy than holding the entirety of a smaller ribbon at the same distance. You make a mental note to save energy by always keeping the ribbon's 'base' on your person.

Satisfied with your control over a single mass of elemental magic, you try creating three ribbons at once. The first comes more easily than before, but trying to keep it in existence while creating a second is taxing, and the third proves too much for you; your concentration breaks, and all three dissipate. Still, you're confident you can continue to improve with practice. Checking your watch, it's about noon. You've spent four hours on magic practice, and it suddenly seems odd that Ayaka didn't contact you to see what you were up to. Then again, perhaps she looked in on you during your reading and you were too absorbed in the book to notice.

>[ ] Head to the kitchen for some lunch (Self-Preservation)

>[ ] Go down into Vaisset's workshop and start looking through his research notes. (Curiosity)

>[ ] Contact Ayaka to discuss your next moves in the War (Duty)

>[ ] Do something else (Write in)

>>3606137
>[ ] Contact Ayaka to discuss your next moves in the War

>>3606142
>[ ] Head to the kitchen for some lunch (Self-Preservation)

He needs a break, and why not have a nice lunch after a hard days work of training.

>>3606142
>>[ ] Head to the kitchen for some lunch (Self-Preservation)
Ask if Ayaka wants something to eat as well?

>>3606142
Well, let me rephrase.
>Check in on Ayaka before going to have Lunch

>>3606142
>[ ] Contact Ayaka to discuss your next moves in the War (Duty)

>>3606210
Supporting. Make sure Ayaka is okay, and if she's fine then grab a bite to eat.
>Inb4 Assassin kidnapped Ayaka so Lily can force us to come after her

>>3606262
W O R R Y
O
R
R
Y

3-way tie. Haven't had one of those in a while.

>>3606286
I have arrived with the tiebreaker!
>>3606210

>>3606286
I am >>3606210

Apologies for not linking

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>>3606288
Oh.

>>3606294
Your contribution is still important to the cause of keeping Ayaka from being blown into many bloody pieces! Every post counts!

>>3605583
>>3605590
Now, assuming Assassin is Otto, we can deduce a few facts from his behavior.

Firstly, we saw him, but he didn't register as a Servant: this implies that his Presence Concealment was lost because he had Espionage.
Second, he didn't seem very threatened by us, and he knows we're Saber. That means he had an ace up his sleeve (some kind of counter-attacking NP?) or he was bluffing and has Vitrification (which according to complete material III also allowed Sasaki to conceal his presence to some extent, so fucking whatever).

>>3606335
Well, it seems you've got it all figured out. Color me impressed. What's your verdict on his identity, then? What Germanic legend can be summoned as Assassin while also fitting the Einzbern criteria of breaking the system in their favor?

>>3606426
Is his first name actually Otto? I've got nothing.

>>3606448
Otto is what he told us his name was. It's probably about as much his real name as "nobody" is.

Here's all we know about Otto Niemand
Physical description
>One is an old man, perhaps in his early sixties, dressed in a navy three-piece suit and antiquated cravat. The primary impression features is of carved ivory, with extremely pale skin, white shoulder-length hair, a full beard, and ice-blue eyes. It is those eyes that belie his apparent age. They seem to glimmer with a font of hidden vital energy, as if the man might at any moment burst into laughter, or spring up and attack you. The same humor in his tone as he invited you in is plainly written on his face, and he seems to examine you like a man reading a finely crafted joke with too much restraint to laugh aloud.

>Niemand, too, lets out a chuckle on hearing your introduction. "Alberich, eh? I haven't heard that in many a long year. You're a bit tall for it though, aren't you? Heh heh heh." He sweeps his eyes between you and Liliesviel before continuing, "My, you two do make a pair though. With your looks and the oddity of your names, you two really ought to be siblings. How about it, missy? I'm sure you have a use for an older brother." His eyes twinkle as he throws out the jest, no doubt hoping to prod the girl into more anger.

Seems like he wanted us to work with Liliesviel? He sort of suggested it to her.

>The second voice is a low whisper from Niemand, which seems to travel directly to your ear without passing through the surroundings. "Best of luck with the deception, Saber. I look forward to your performance."

He's aware that we're lying to his master and doesn't care, in fact he's interested to see what happens. Calling it a performance is possibly significant but probably not, maybe he enjoyed the performing arts or had some link to them.

If he's Beowulf I'm gonna be so pissed

>>3606463
...Hold up.
How tall is Niemand?

>>3606469
I don't believe we ever saw him standing.

>>3606469
>>3606478
You only saw him sitting down, but he was looking you in the eye levelly while seated. He's probably not much taller or shorter than you are.

I swear to god if Niemand is actually Albrecht Höhler.

>>3606491
Niemand = dutch for noone.

>>3606491
Holy shit, that is a deep cut! Where did you even get that idea?

>>3606491
Anon, I've made my own way-too-obscure servant guesses before as well but what in the goddamn man

>>3606509
>>3606511
Well I do have a nice History degree but I was more thinking the name than anything.

Huh now that I am thinking about it, someone who is deep into History and Mythology would call out servants left and right in a Grail War.

>>3606522
>See obvious Knightly servant who just took a bite out of some other servant
>Instead of going for Vlad or somesuch, call out that he must be Roger of Tosny
>"Yo what the fuck anon"
That'd be a funny as like a fanfic or something I guess

>>3606522
>I was more thinking the name than anything.
I'd be more concerned about the very real possibility that our name is his name too.

>>3606542
He isn't a manlet, so I'd discount it. That would be funny though, if in at least two of our first servant encounters Alberich claimed to be the servant he's facing.

Is Otto's ability to whisper directly into our ear from a distance significant?

>>3606548
Its definitely meta-gaming but next time we see her I want us to tell Artoria that we are Arthur just to see her mad.

>>3606560
Probably very much so,

>>3606565
>Sarcastically say Alberich is King Arthur if questioned on on his true name
Would support

>>3606565
>ARTORIA: So you've survived, false Saber! Are you ready to reveal your true nature at last?
>ALBERICH: Sure, sure. Truth is, I'm King Arthur. Rider in this Grail War. You might have heard of me. This is my famous black sword, Excalibur. They said I was the true king of Britain after I proved I was the only one who could pull it out of that lake.
>ARTORIA: ...I despise you.

Otto Skorzeny?
I'm getting too obscure too.

>>3606578
inb4 I'm right and he's a literal werewolf

>>3606578
There's someone I'd actually love to see as a servant from the modern period.

>>3606574
Fucking beautiful XD
I support this course of action

>>3606548
My google-fu tells me that, in Der Ring des Nibelungen, Alberich has a magic helmet - the Tarnhelm - which lets him change his form and turn invisible. Theoretically, changing his height a little bit wouldn't be that hard compared to the animal shapes he takes on.
The beginning of Das Rheingold would also explain both Espionage and Vitrification. The girls in charge of guarding the Rheingold don't consider Alberich to be a threat (Espionage), but he renounces love (Vitrification, which is basically mental serenity the skill), swipes the gold and bails out with the prize.

>>3606578
A cool guess, but the one we're looking for is a legendary figure. One who knows the name Alberich. And whose summoning breaks some sort of Grail War rule.

>>3606600
Ooo, interesting. There's no way the first listed option in the official name vote is an actual servant in the war, right sweets? Right?

>>3606600
Meh, I'm pretty sure Lily would've reacted to us telling her our name is Alberich if that was also her servant's name. I doubt that she would allow him to conceal his name from her.

>>3606609
Or maybe that is why she does not think we are a servant.

"Why would Big brother Alberich be a servant is my servant is Alberich? So obviously my family made him to help me, he just so happens to take the name." - Lili's thoughts probably

>>3606631
She doesn't think we're a servant because she's sure that we're a homunculus like her

>>3606634
Exactly. She probably thinks Alberich as our name is nothing more than a way for her to find this new weird homunculus.

>>3606643
I personally don't think her Servant is Alberich at all, it's a pretty major reach

>>3606645
Everything's a major reach, given that we've seem him once and know he's assassin. We had much more to work with when dealing with Longinus and Judas, and I don't think anyone figured those out until sweets revealed them.

>>3606645
While it would be kinda funny, I don't think so either. Just playing around with the idea.

Any more updates tonight sweets? Or should I go to bed?

>>3606692
I'm working on another update now, that I plan on having out before I go to bed.

If we had more to work with, it'd be easier to make it out. I have theories, but none perfectly fit what we've seen and what we know. My best guess at the moment is Siegfried, but I just can't say for certain.

One of the things giving me the most trouble is that Lily receives a written report from her Servant. Why? Don't they have the Master and Servant mental connection? It just doesn't make sense. Is it a Noble Phantasm? A strange limitation imposed on Assassin? Lily's eccentricity at work? Maybe just Assassin's preference? There has to be a reason.

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>>3606692
The eternal debate

Although you do find it odd for Ayaka not to have asked about what you were doing, you decide it's unlikely to be a pressing concern. Certainly if something dangerous had happened she would have alerted you by the mental link you share. What is pressing at the moment is the matter of food. It occurs to you as you finish your elemental magic training that you haven't eaten breakfast. Nor, in fact, did you eat lunch or dinner yesterday. Even for a Servant, this is surely pushing yourself too far.

So you make your way downstairs, heading for the kitchen and lunch. As you walk, you reach out over your mental link to Ayaka, asking, 'How has your morning been, Miss Ayaka? I've been training since dawn, and seem to have lost track of the time.'

'I could tell.' Ayaka sounds amused as she answers. 'You didn't show up for breakfast, so I had a look around and saw you in the library, hunched over one of our books. I figured you'd rather not be disturbed, but I bet you regret missing breakfast now, right?'

'Not only breakfast,' you answer, 'but yes, anyway. I'm on my way to the kitchen now, to try my hand at making myself some lunch.'

'You don't need to do that, you know. I was about to eat on my own. Come down and join me.'

'Gladly.'

When you arrive, you find Ayaka by a cutting board, assembling meat, vegetables, and bread. Lunch, it turns out, is western style. Roast beef sandwiches, with lettuce, tomatoes, horseradish, and red onions. As she sets the assembled food on plates for you two, Ayaka asks, "have you had these before, Saber-san? I think they're pretty good, but they don't sell sandwiches like this at the school cafeteria so I've gotten used to making them myself."

"No," you answer truthfully. They're not something you've had before, as your experience eating has been almost exclusively Japanese dishes, but you soon find that they make for a fine meal. Seeing you wolf down your sandwich, Ayaka is quick to offer you another, and you find yourself eating several without pause. It's lucky for you that Ayaka doesn't mind catering to your ravenous appetite.

"Well," you say once you're finally finished eating, "those really are lovely. Thank you for the excellent meal, Miss Ayaka."

"Oh, it was really nothing," Ayaka answers with a wan smile. "After the way you fought last night, I'd expected you to be starving. I wasn't expecting you to take an interest in our library, though. Are you a magus, Saber-san?"

"Not as such. I do possess magic circuits, and can physically channel mystic energy, but up until I began reading from your family's texts I had only the most general knowledge regarding how to implement that capability." You give this self-deprecating answer with effecting bashfulness, before continuing, "I have been making progress, however, and can hopefully show you a useful new technique when we meet our next foe."

"Our next enemy, huh?" Ayaka sounds disheartened at the prospect. "I guess that would be those Emiya people you were talking about, right? If they want to prevent the Holy Grail War from finishing, it's my responsibility as Second Owner to put a stop to them."

"I wouldn't be so certain of that," you say cautiously. "As I told you before, I made a favorable impression on the Emiya family the last time we met. They believe the Einzbern family to be the primary masterminds directing the Holy Grail War. If we simply represent ourselves to them as having had a change of heart, and wanting to help them dismantle the Holy Grail, we can make use of their strength to defeat the other Masters."

"And we'd be sacrificing the enemy Servants using my ritual, so you'd be powering up as we go, is that the idea?" Ayaka sounds more suspicious of your plan than you'd hoped. In fact, her tone suggests she thinks it's extremely flawed. "After that," she continues, "you're thinking we'd betray them once we were strong enough, right?"

"That was my thought process, yes," you answer, "but you sound concerned. Why?"

"Because you aren't considering Father Antaglio, that's why!" Ayaka jabs a finger at you to emphasize her point. "If we brought in outside magi, he'd be sure to put out a reward and tell all the other Masters to fight us all at once! We'd be a threat to the balance of the War, and that's what he's there to preserve! Part of the reason the Holy Church sends a priest to oversee the War is to prevent the Masters from bringing in outside help and turning this set of duels into a real war with armies involved, you know."

"But the Emiya family is becoming involved in the Holy Grail War regardless of what we do," you protest. "That man Emiya Shirou won't stand by and wait. However misguided his conviction may be, he's utterly certain in it. I could tell that from one meeting with the fellow. Surely we could simply conceal our cooperation with them from this priest of yours."

"I guess so, maybe..." Ayaka assents hesitantly. She still sounds suspicious of the plan, but she's at least beginning to come around.

Suddenly a new thought occurs to you, and you freeze. You were thinking of your time speaking with Emiya Shirou, and remembered what you'd said to him about your identity. That man knows you used to be human, and Ayaka still believes you're a Heroic Spirit! If the two of you go to meet the Emiya family with matters as they are, your identity may well come into question. Then, as you're considering that subject, the matter of dreams comes to mind. Often, in the Akeldama, you dreamed of scenes that seemed to be from Circe's life. If Ayaka is experiencing the same link, could she have witnessed some scene from your life as a student last night? Her demeanor doesn't seem changed, but the uncertainty clings to you. You have to make a decision now, whether or not to maintain your persona as a Heroic Spirit!

>[ ] Tell Ayaka you were once Yumigawa Rushorou. (Self-Preservation)

>[ ] Keep quiet on the subject. (Pride)

>[ ] Find another solution. (Write in)

>>3606814
>[ ] Tell Ayaka you were once Yumigawa Rushorou. (Self-Preservation)
Just feeling it desu

>>3606812
>[ ] Tell Ayaka you were once Yumigawa Rushorou. (Self-Preservation)
It would cause too many problems down the line NOT to tell her.
If we wanted to be sure the Emiyas wouldn't tell her, we would have to ask them to keep it a secret, which might prompt them to ask why, and then we'd have to think of a good reason not to.
Also, keeping secrets from Ayaka only guarantees that they'll come out at the most inconvenient time.

>>3606814
>>>[ ] Tell Ayaka you were once Yumigawa Rushorou. (Self-Preservation)
>>Also explain how it's even possible for you to have turned into a Heroic Spirit, ie the grail war you got sucked into by Judas' NP
>Finally. Time for the reveal.
Fuck, linked the wrong post, second try.

>>3606814
>[ ] Tell Ayaka you were once Yumigawa Rushorou. (Self-Preservation)

>>3606821
too lazy to delete my post so i'm linking to >>3606814

>>3606814
>[ ] Find another solution. (Write in)
Let's tell father antaglio about the likelihood that Shirou and company will be involving themselves in the war. We can't have them successfully destroying the grail or risk working with them.

>>3606836
Again if we tell him we want to regain what was lost due to Judas's bullshit and put it in a way that means the lives that were lost, he would bend over backwards for us.

Or if he finds out we just want to be reincarnated and bring back Circe. We can turn it around and say something like "Would you not do anything to bring back the one most important to you?"

>>3606814
>[ ] Tell Ayaka you were once Yumigawa Rushorou. (Self-Preservation)

Apologize, and let her down gently. Say going Into It that we'd understand If It seems too ridiculous to believe, but we have a full Akeldama story to tell to back up our claim.

>>3606849
Sidenote: Thank god for rank D Charisma

>>3606844
But how does this remove the risk of the priest putting a bounty on you for cheating?

>>3606836
Let's not approach Antaglio. He doesn't need to know about us, but Ayaka does.
>>3606881
I think he's talking about Shirou.
Alberich does reflect Shirou's character a bit, in that they both care deeply for the people close to them and would do a lot to protect them.

>>3606881
Can't put a bounty on us if we kill him.

>>3606814
>[ ] Tell Ayaka you were once Yumigawa Rushorou. (Self-Preservation)
I guess we're doing this.
The last Hero.

I wonder if we can properly befriend Shirou.
I mean, Shinji was his friend for gods sake.
Alberich also seems to be a magecraft prodigy, thank you, bullshit elements!
I wonder if our element combination of Sky, Void and Nothingness is rarer than being an Average One...

>>3607023
A: That may not be so easy, since the overseer is an Executor to prevent these sorts of shenanigans. Risei used to be one, right? Can't remember right now
B: That would prompt the Church to send another Executor to replace Antaglio and find out who did it. The new overseer would be even stronger than the last, so if you persist then they'll either kill Ayaka or send in Ciel or some such bullshit.

>>3607039
>send Ciel
>Ciel is immortal
>just throw her into Imaginary Number Space, bye Ciel, make some friends while you're there.
And no, killing an executor is very simple for a Servant, see Lancer obliterating Kotomine in UBW.

There's one thing you're all forgetting about Otto.
He's an Einzbern Servant.
Meaning bullshit is afoot.
It's not impossible they've summoned an actual Divine Spirit as a servant, it would certainly explain his amusement towards us as a "finely crafted joke."

Some guesses as to Otto's identity:
>Utgard-Loki could craft illusions good enough to fool even gods (one of them being Loki), so he could easily manipulate our senses. He might've used an illusion to speak to us without having to shout.
>Loki, another accomplished trickster who favored shapeshifting and sophistry, might probably still use illusions since he was conflated with Utgard-Loki.
>Alberich had his helmet, Tarnhelm, which let him shapeshift, become invisible and teleport. It would be pretty funny to him that another hero just happened to have the same name and look exactly like an Einzbern.
I'll think of more as it comes.

>>3607083
>Loki
That would be a very Einzbern thing to do, actually.

>>3606844
Doesn't this version of Shirou only really care about those close to him?

>our go to technique with magecraft is red and black ribbons that are attached to us
Hahahahahaha
Saber rematch is looking like it's gonna be fun for some PTSD triggering.
I wonder what Rin will make of us?
She's got much more of a magus aligned way of thinking (but actually is a good person) than the rest of the Emiya faction. So she should understand just how ridiculous we are.

>>3606814
>[ ] Tell Ayaka you were once Yumigawa Rushorou. (Self-Preservation)
Hmm it's almost like telling Shirou about our past made no sense at all...

>>3607123
Yeah but he's still Shirou.
When he has to weigh the life of somebody he cares about or complete strangers, he'd save the one he cares about.
Doesn't mean he can really tolerate innocent deaths though.
He just has his priorities sorted out.

>>3607126
At the time it made a lot of sense.
>"This man is a servant!"
>"You're right lol what are you gonna do about it?"
>Rider activates eyes and crushes us easily

So I am not totally sold on this, and just wanted to discuss it. Now this might be crazy, but what if the Ezinberns wanted a servant who could plan and strategize their way through the war, so if we are looking at an assassin with espionage and who calls themself Otto, is there any reason it cant be Bismarck besides the fact that it is too obvious and Sweets might be trying to trick us.

Bismarck would certainly be aware fully of Alberich's legend considering the piece that fleshed it out was created when he was alive.

>>3607133
A good tactician wouldn't be happy having their base in the top floor of a tower like Kayneth.

>>3607133
>active from 1860 to 1890
Born too late, didn't do impossible enough things.

Hmm.
I wonder if we could summon something like a Valkyrie through our sword...

>>3607143
Maybe we should start small, go for a Monstrous Beast like a Kelpie or something.
Then we progress to a Phantasmal Species.
Finally we should be good enough to control a Divine animal.