"Vaisset is..." you stop to correct yourself. Calling him by his last name in this circumstance feels somehow wrong. "Your brother is gone. I'm sorry, Miss Ayaka." Without knowing the two siblings better, there's nothing more you can say to lessen the emotional impact.

Before your eyes, Ayaka's expression collapses as her fear turns to despair. She drops her gaze, hanging her head in sorrow. "S-so that's really it," she says in a weak voice. "I th-thought it might be, but..." The girl trails off, and large teardrops well up in her eyes, before spilling out and running down her cheeks in silent weeping. You step closer, putting a hand on the girl's quaking shoulder. She flinches away at the touch of steel, and you realize you're still armored. You let your armaments fade into energy, and reach out again to offer comfort. She seems to unconsciously lean into your hand, seeking the warmth of human contact even while her mind is dominated by loss.

The two of you remain still for a while, until Ayaka's tears begin to slacken off. When her composure has finally returned somewhat, she pulls away and gives you a resentful, hurt glare. "You were supposed to protect us," she whispers. "Why did you let this happen?"

"I am truly sorry, Miss Ayaka," you reiterate. "I couldn't save him. When we encountered an enemy Master and Servant tonight, your brother ordered that we each face our own foe, and trust in one another's victory. He battled against the enemy Master, and I dueled with the Servant. We were separated in the fighting, and when I was able to return to his side... things had come to an end."

Something in your words spurs Ayaka to a renewed bout of crying, breaking off eye contact to weep once more. "You said," she moans between sobs. "Nii-san, you said you wouldn't be like Dad..."

Dissatisfied with simply watching the girl cry, you begin, "Miss Ayaka, is there anything..."

She cuts you off, snapping her reply with fury in her eyes. "No! Saber-san, just leave me alone!" Then her tone softens as she continues, "We'll talk in the morning or something, I don't know. Just leave me be now, okay?"

"As you wish," you say with a bow, and exit. Outside Ayaka's room, you can still faintly hear the sound of her sobbing. For a while you only stand in place, trying to think of what to do in the wake of this crushing night. Eventually it comes to you that Vaisset's security measures will likely have been destroyed by his death, and you decide to take up your post of the previous night, overlooking the front yard from the second-floor hallway. Sure enough, the bounded fields you had been able to detect outside have vanished, and the light in the surveillance crystals has faded. You're the manor's only defense now.

Easing into a chair by the window, you consider everything that's happened this evening. That other Saber, the girl-knight, was a fearsome opponent; possibly more dangerous than any of the Servants summoned in Judas' Akeldama Grail War, and certainly capable of killing you. A shiver runs down the nape of your neck as you recall the moment when she was stopped by Harris' telepathic order. If she had struck, you wouldn't have been able to escape. That blade would surely have pierced your throat.

Then there's Harris himself. Vaisset described him as an apparently terrifying figure: an enforcer for the Mages' Association, and a "magus killer," who uses unspeakably brutal methods. That brutality was certainly put on display in his execution of your ex-Master, but you find yourself wondering just what his methods could have been. He seemingly had no weapons on his person, given the tight fit of his clothing, and although it's true that you were focused on your battle with the enemy Saber you can't help thinking you should have noticed if Harris had used some spectacular display of magical might against Vaisset. Could he have augmented his body with mystic energy, the way Circe had once suggested trying with you? Your mind runs in circles with no answer. Perhaps Harris was using the same energy bursts as the enemy Saber to empower himself. Perhaps he had some potent biological magecraft that destroyed Vaisset from within. Then again, perhaps he simply carried some kind of concealed explosive.

Finally you give up on the conundrum of Harris' mode of attack and shift your thoughts back to your own foe. Clad in royal blue and shining steel, striking with overwhelming force and a hidden weapon, she seemed like an invincible opponent. You were unable to even strike at her, constantly fighting for your survival; an honest battle of the sword will be useless in defeating her, most likely. You resolve to use any underhanded method necessary to secure your victory upon your next encounter, and fortunately one comes to mind. There was something about your cloak that put her off, made her call it a shadow. She seemed frightened of it and filled with animosity towards it simultaneously. As you picture her expression in your memory, you see her eyes, focusing on it with such intensity that one might have surmised it was wearing you, rather than the reverse. Perhaps, then, using that mental vulnerability to your cloak could be the key to victory. Losing control of one's emotions in battle can be fatal, after all. It isn't as if Kenótis' primary ability is mental disturbance, either. You could potentially wield it like a net, entangling the enemy Saber before activating its power and dismembering her. You chuckle to yourself, imagining that cold, arrogant woman screaming as the mutable portal severs her limbs, her body coming to pieces and collapsing into a pool of gore with no chance of retaliation.

But it's not wise to let your fantasies run away with you. With an effort of will, you dispel the pleasing vision and return your focus to the yard, watching vigilantly for any enemies. Saber may think you dead, but it's possible Rider's master could have learned of your home's location somehow, and of course there are four other unknown Servants to consider. The night passes slowly as you watch the road, with no movement violating the sanctity of the Shijou land. After an hour, or perhaps several, of keeping yourself focused on the stillness ahead of you, you find that you can no longer keep your mind from wandering.

The subject of the Shijou land is another thing again to consider. Vaisset had been the Mages' Association representative in charge of administrating the local magi, the Second Owner of this area. With his death the duty will pass to Ayaka, but is the trembling girl sobbing in her bed capable of carrying out such a duty at the same time as she battles in a Holy Grail War? The prospect frankly worries you. What if a general power struggle should ensue on top of the existing battle for the Holy Grail? Though you've heard a fair amount now about Magus society from first Edelfelt and later Vaisset, you're still uncertain whether the local magi would likely be inclined to such a revolt.

Then there is the matter of Ayaka's mental constitution with regards to the Holy Grail War. From her earlier words, it would seem that the girl's father also died in an incident of magical violence. With both father and brother perishing in such circumstances, will she be able to face the dangers of the coming battle? If not, perhaps it would be better to cut ties with her and seek a new Master through the War's overseer, the priest she'd mentioned: Antaglio. On the other hand, there is the chance that the death of her brother might motivate the girl to seek revenge. In that case, she would make a fine Master for the aggressive prosecution of the War.

As you turn the various aspects of your situation over in your mind, the first rays of sunlight at last begin touching the garden below. The disastrous night has ended with no further disturbances, and the sun rises on Saturday, November 16. Despite the weekend, it isn't long before you hear the raucous sound of an alarm clock from Ayaka's room. Even without school, it seems, the girl prefers to rise early. You decide to wait for her at the kitchen table, where the two of you shared breakfast yesterday. If she's in the mood to talk, she can come to you at her convenience. Otherwise, you don't intend to intrude.

Your concern that she might remain secluded in her bedroom is soon proven groundless, however, as you hear her first showering and then descending to the house's ground floor. When she enters the kitchen, in a casual skirt and cardigan only slightly different from her uniform, she gives you a complicated expression. "Tired and determined" might be a good way to describe it, you consider, or perhaps simply "resigned." Either way, it's a curious mixture of determined energy and depressive burnout. "Good morning, Saber-san," she says tonelessly. "Would you like some eggs?"

"Certainly, thank you," you reply, "but if it would be pushing yourself, there's no need."

Ayaka shakes her head. "No, I'll be making them for myself anyway. It's no trouble."

As the girl gets out a pan and starts getting ready to fry several eggs, you sit uncertainly, letting things fade into an awkward silence. You hadn't expected her to begin the discussion with food, and find yourself strangely unable to think of how to shift the topic to the War without being insensitive. She's obviously in an unstable emotional state, after all, so the matter warrants some consideration.

Fortunately, Ayaka saves you the trouble. With her back to you, looking down at the frying eggs, she starts to speak. "I did a lot of thinking last night, you know," she says in the same toneless, soft voice, very unlike the emotional dynamism you've observed from her since your summoning. "At first I just cried, of course. You saw that. But a little while after that, I guess it faded out. The sadness, I mean. It was the same way with my parents. I was as hurt as you'd expect a child to be when it happened, but pretty soon their deaths stopped moving me. I remember Nii-san would keep breaking down when they came up in conversation for months after it happened, and even after that for years he'd suddenly go into a grief again thinking of them. It wasn't like that for me. All the grief drained out in the first round of crying, and it seems like it's the same with losing him. I guess that means I have a pretty terrible personality, huh?"

"Of course not, Miss Ayaka," you say reassuringly. "Your feelings about loss do not define you. I have lost two people very dear to me in my life, and didn't shed a tear afterwards. For some people grief is a subtle thing, but that subtlety does not make you an unfeeling person."

"Thank you, Saber-san," Ayaka replies. "You're very kind. But anyway, I was saying that I spent a lot of time thinking last night, about the future. I don't think I have any choice but to participate in the Holy Grail War at this point, do I? Even if I went to Father Antaglio and gave up, the other Masters would probably still want to kill me as the heir to one of the founding families." At this point, she pauses to serve the eggs. She puts two fried eggs each on two plates, with a salad on the side, then crosses the kitchen to sit down at the table across from you. "Here, enjoy."

"Ah, thank you," you say, taking the plate and beginning to eat. "I'm afraid I can't make any guesses about the personalities of the other Masters."

"Well, I don't think It's a very safe idea," she says. "After all the changing of the Shijou Master already, they'd probably suspect me of planning some kind of trick. So it seems like I have to fight, but I don't know anything about how you'd go about this War. Mom never told me about it before she died, even though I was her successor. Nii-san was only able to confirm it from her notes after the Einzberns contacted him, you know? Then you and Nii-san went out to fight straightforwardly and he died. I don't know what to do, Saber-san." She gives you a pleading look, obviously hoping you'll have some miracle plan to win the War.

>[ ] Suggest she keep going to school normally to gather information on Rider's Master and stay at home during the night. You can work out new magical defenses with her over the weekend. (Compassion)

>[ ] Suggest that Ayaka completely focus on defense, staying here 24/7 and gathering information through magic (if possible) or otherwise by having you scout alone. (Duty)

>[ ] Suggest that the two of you go looking for the enemy at night. It was the execution of the battle, not the overall strategy, that killed Vaisset. (Pride)

>[ ] Tell Ayaka about the Emiya family and suggest meeting with them to discuss future strategies. (Self-Preservation)

>[ ] Say something else (Write in)

>>3566397
>[ ] Tell Ayaka about the Emiya family and put forth the necessity of training, both master and servant, to be able to better prosecute the war. Stay home and reorganize the defenses of the manner as best as possible, but otherwise focus on becoming more able to defeat the foes set before you.

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>>3566409
+1
>>3566389
And the thing I promised.

>>3566397
Gonna support >>3566409, it's what we planned to do in the first place.

>>3566439
It's beautiful. *chew*

>>3566439
>Favorite food: Circe's homemade porridge
Hilarious! I love it.

>>3566439
Wonderful anon

>>3566439
You may not like it, but this is what peak performance looks like.

Hey, just wanted you to know that someone archived a thread of mine as your Fate quest. Do you know how you can reverse that so I can properly archive my thread under the Commentarii grouping?

>>3566389
Um, Sweets, you archived the wrong thread for Thread II...

>>3566540
My mistake apparently, sorry. Honestly I have no idea how to do anything with suptg other than archive threads (...and as you can tell, that not always successfully.) I'll do whatever I can to help resolve the situation, but...

>>3566389
Kek, I missed the end of last thread but we already got Vassiet killed.

Poor girl, we weren't In the right route to save him, It can't be helped.

>>3566409
+1
And Rin arrives today as well.

>>3566592
Maybe we could introduce the two.

But I'll reiterate that asking Rin personally for Magecraft training is risky, since she'll probably ask questions we don't want to answer. It's better to talk to Ayaka and go through Jean's notes (we can also show Rin his notes on Synthetic Elemental Conversion).

>>3566409

Yes, it's time. Sword training with Shirou, Magecraft with Rin and Sakura, and general parameters with RoF. Where my True Magic boys at?

>>3566595

Oh relax, even if she does ask questions it'll be only like you said. A probability. Doesn't mean that it'd be likely, so we need to milk all we can learn from them for all it's worth.

>>3566604
Also the Emiya household will be far more secure than Ayaka's mansion due to the removal of it's defences.
Man Alberich really despises Saber already.
Poor Saber.
Can't say she didn't bring this on herself though.
>You chuckle to yourself, imagining that cold, arrogant woman screaming as the mutable portal severs her limbs, her body coming to pieces and collapsing into a pool of gore
Wonder how Rin will take all this, if she's not already aware.

>>3566604
i'm just super scared anon

>>3566622
Honestly, even full disclosure about ourselves isn't that bad.
We killed a few people because it was necessary to survive.
We tried to put a stop to the war at the meeting of the servants but it all went to hell.
We were the only reason anyone survived at all due to seeing through Judas' act, with the help of Circe of course.

>>3566622

It's fine to fear anon, but don't let it cloud your judgement of our secret weapon of this war. The Emiya family are going to be our best teachers and we still have room for ourselves to grow, Jean may have been kind of a cunt but I will be damned if I won't avenge him for being ballsy enough to try and take Kerry2 head on while we fought against the King of Knights.

It's only going to get harder from here anon, so what do we do? We grind and grind with Ayaka until we're able to not just be a match toward some of the strongest Servants, but overpower them.

Besides can you imagine how much the other Masters and Servants of this war will shit themselves when this Fake Saber can not only perform Magecraft but goddamn True Magic? We'll build our legend into something great

>>3566625

And this too. Be honest with the Emiyas since they're the ones who'll help us even more so now. No more time to be wasted, we should take at least a week or two to train and strategize accordingly. For what the others know we're dead along with Jean, so best we take advantage of it best we can

>>3566628
We're still missing one thing, bitching fight music

>>3566628
>Saber has defeated the last servant in the war, finally her wish will be granted
>hold on something feels wrong
>Alberich smashes through a window with superior Parameters and more skills
>"Time to die, King of Knights." (I imagine the Emiya household would likely reveal her identity.)
>halfway through the fight declare we're going to let her "die her own way" after orchestrating Harris' death and withdraw.

>>3566638
Wait, why would the Emiyas sabotage Arturia?

>>3566640
Why would Shirou kill Arturia?
I'm also not saying it would have to be the Emiyas.
We are familiar with the concept of military grade explosives, after all.
Killing Arturia is honestly the nicest thing you can do for her.
Her wish is stupid and makes her a Counter Guardian if it actually works.

Shirou didn't really part with her under the best circumstances in HF.

>>3566397
Name our damn sword before anything else.

>>3566552
You gotta email Lord Licorice and he'll fix it for you. Happens all the time. He runs suptg.

4chan@ thisisnotatrueending.com

>>3566669
We were gonna name it Lückeschwert weren't we?
Saber is firmly on Alberich's shitlist now and I can't wait to bully her.

>>3566409
Before we commit to this plan, we should probably make a key decision about the war - do we want the wish from the Grail?

If not, then let's go for it since it's our best chance at winning. But if we do, we should think carefully about whether or not to go through with this. Remember that Team Emiya's goal is not to help us won but to dismantle the Grail War entirely. Teaming up with them could very well shut us out from getting a wish at the end due to destruction of the Grail or something similar, and it's highly unlikely that we'll be able to backstab the entire Emiya family (and perhaps even Ayaka) successfully if we try to snag the wish at the last possible second.

>>3566439
True art. Louvre exhibit when?

>>3566714
I mean, if we're going for a wish then it'll probably be incarnation anyway, which is pretty much the most reasonable wish possible.
and if our absentee servants are actually around somewhere we can win against pretty much anyone.

>>3566714
My thoughts exactly. We don't even know what happens to us without the grail's power. If we want to live then working with them would have to involve some kind of betrayal, which I don't think people would be willing to do because "muh canon characters"

>>3566728
>still using the "muh canon characters" garbage point when pretty much every player wants to murder the face of Fate.
Stop being dumb.

>>3566731
There's still the fact that our goals in this war are completely at odds with the F/SN crew, I'm not sure how working together with them would end well.

>>3566714
>do we want the wish from the Grail?
Fuck yeah. How else are we going to get Circe and Adelheid back?
>Remember that Team Emiya's goal is not to help us won but to dismantle the Grail War entirely. Teaming up with them could very well shut us out from getting a wish at the end due to destruction of the Grail or something similar, and it's highly unlikely that we'll be able to backstab the entire Emiya family (and perhaps even Ayaka) successfully if we try to snag the wish at the last possible second.
While these are valid concerns, I think it's possible to somehow maneuver everyone into being unable to stop us from claiming the wish.
To that end, we need to plan to tie them up in conflicts with the other Masters -- that means we need to meet the other Servants and Lilisviel, and make some friends we can throw against them.
I'll get to work on a list of potential allies and enemies now.
>Louvre exhibit when?
Not if they value the integrity of the Mona Lisa.

>>3566744
Our goals
>kill enemy servants
>kill masters if they are too dangerous
>get grail
>incarnate
We're 100 percent a victim of circumstance, we had our life snatched away (not that we were enjoying it but still) and were forced to fight to the death for survival.
We were irreversibly altered by magic.
There was no way to forfeit the war as it would mean death.
And upon managing to escape with survivors our reward is a fleeting existence that requires a Master's magical energy or else we would cease to exist.
And to top it off he might never see the two girls he loved(?) ever again.

Alberich is a tragic hero already.

>>3566755
Right, but they still want to destroy the grail. It's not that they oppose us as a person, our goals are just incompatible

(OOC knowledge spoilered.)

>Definite allies
Shirou: an unknown; we currently only know he has a large amount of Magical Energy, and is thus likely to be a Servant-level combatant. The most dangerous one to backstab, because of the sheer range of weapons he can bring to bear and the possibility of copying our own sword.
Rider of Fuyuki: a dangerous one, purely by virtue of being a Servant with an unknown NP. She's faster than us and as strong as us, but more fragile as well. Cybele will make the battle much more difficult if we're not careful, and it could transform a victory into a loss.
Sakura: a total unknown. However, she did seem to be afraid of us, and we could use that.
The children: useful hostages if it comes to that, but that will put us on their shitlist forever.

>Possible Allies
Lancer, Berserker, Assassin: total unknowns.

>Possible enemies
Rider: he doesn't like us, but maybe he'll have cooled down by now.

>Definite enemies
True Saber: she's an extremely dangerous enemy to face and a counter to us, having greater endurance and Agility as well as equal strength, Magical Energy Burst A to further strengthen herself, and Instinct A to get around Kenotis. It's best if we face her with an ally at our side and hope they don't push her to Excaliblast us somehow.

>>3566714
The plan isnt explicitly to go train with the Emiya clan, it’s to tell Ayaka about them.

>>3566760
We won't know until we try it but Kenotis might defend against an Excaliblast.
Then we can cut her and her dumb sword in half.

>>3566775
Do we really want to try our luck?

>>3566799
Yes actually.
Just for the concept of recreating what happens to Gil on the Fate route.
And if we die oh well.

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>>3566803
>if we die oh well
Don't be like that, Taiga will be so disappointed in us.

>>3566809
It's far from the dumbest thing Rushorou will ever die to.
That would be attempting to 1v1 Berserker .

>>3566814
No, that would still be sitting around while a wall collapses on us.

>>3566816
No, that would be running away from his servant and challenging an assassin to straight combat

Wait, the stupidest thing we did was when we rushed onto the QAR in the middle of multiple fighting Servants.

>>3566826
Oh yeah that was a real shitshow.
Why did we do that again?
Honestly Alberich and Shirou have both made some dreadful choices leading to their deaths before.
Can't wait to get Shirou killed at the same time as us and have us both show up in the dojo.

>>3566607
>Man Alberich really despises Saber already.
Well, this is the same character who kicked Keiseki's head off for a laugh and turned O'Mordha's head into hamburger in the heat of the moment. Gotta maintain murderous rage continuity.

>>3566855
Alberich is one of the nicest evil people around.
Just don't fuck with him and you'll be fine.
Also don't get in the way of his plans.

>>3566855
We should probably learn to reign that in...

>>3566628
>Besides can you imagine how much the other Masters and Servants of this war will shit themselves when this Fake Saber can not only perform Magecraft but goddamn True Magic?
Where are you getting this impression that you'll be able to learn Sorcery from the Emiya family?

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>>3566863
They will face retribution for defying their superior.
Saber must be bulli'd.

>>3566870
I think he's talking about Rin.
Stop using Dream Crusher.
Though it is practically impossible regardless.

>>3566876
I wasn't talking about Saber because she isn't liable to use that against us.

>>3566902
The murder-rage only really activates once we've won or are about to.

>>3566907
>playing a friendly game of tennis
>hit the last game-set ball so hard it becomes a deadly missile, decapitating our opponent after bouncing off the court
>still counts

>>3566870
Why would they even teach us anything, let alone sorcery?

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>>3566923
Did you say servant tennis?

>>3566935
They might be up for some training.

>>3566950
Why would we reveal that we can learn new things, and that we're therefore abnormal, and why would we want them to know what we can do by watching us during training?

>Sword-related amateur magus protagonist asks for help learning magic for the Grail War
>Rin: Again? Are you serious?

>>3566952
I suppose that you have a more optimal method of training? the vote is still open, you know.

>>3566952
Because they are by far the best possible trainers/training partners we could hope to use?
Besides, they know we are non-standard.
We've literally already told them we were transformed into a Servant.
And I quote
>"Caster had one more favor left to do his Master. He channeled Akeldama's power into me instead of himself, transforming me into a Servant and binding me to his Master"

>>3566952
If only there were some character who already knew you were an abnormal figure, had a lot of resources, and expected you to be on their side...

>>3567018
Yes if only.
It's a shame there are no characters like that.

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>>3566973
>Besides, they know we are non-standard.
>We've literally already told them we were transformed into a Servant.
Oh, right, we did that.
WHY THE FUCK DID WE DO THAT AAAAAAAAAA

>>3567037
Because muh canon characters

>>3567037
To gain trust.
What's your aversion to being friends with Emiya and pals?

>>3567043
Anon please.
Stop being dumb.
We told them so that they would understand that we were genuine when we said we were only after survival.

>>3567047
I honestly don't think we would've been so open with characters that the players weren't already familiar with OOC, but it's already been done and will continue to happen so I guess I might as well stop complaining. Sorry about that.

>>3567056
Maybe not, but already being familiar with Saber isn't really dissuading the players from wanting to murder her.
And it's not like we won't backstab the Emiyas if we have to.
Though I'd prefer if we didn't have to kill any of them at least.

>>3567023
Well now you're just being willfully obtuse.

>>3567063
I'm sure Vaisset would've proven to be a good master if our first battle wasn't against a non-jobbing Arturia.

>>3567068
I'm not talking about Vaisset, anon. I'm giving you a hint of an option I didn't think of in time to add it as a prewritten choice.

>>3567068
I think he’s talking The Einzbern maybe? This heat is keeping the old noggin from joggin, but that kinda makes sense.

>>3567084
Possibly the old guy?
We should look into that one.
And maybe befriend the Einzbern girl.

>>3566397
Meet up with the Einzbern.

Why don't we mention the Einzberns and the Emiyas and see what she thinks?

I feel that it would be too risky to seek the Einzbern out. She would know for sure that we are a Servant once hers points it out and that Ayaka is our Master, hence "in her way". I would definitely say yes if we had time to get her score high enough that she wouldn't try to kill us or Ayaka but that isn't the case.

The way I see it the Einzbern would initially be risky but congruent with our end goal, whereas the Emiyas would initially be helpful but a threat to our end goal.

The question is how do we seek the Einzbern out?

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>>3567517
>how do we seek the Einzbern out.
Anon I think we all know the answer...

>>3567583
The real magic was the park bench all along...

>>3567611
The Sixth Magic of Happenstance.

I miss the Akeldama crew.
I miss Matsuda
I miss Ogawara
I miss Kikuko
I miss Truvi (bitch needs to work on her temper though)
But most of all I miss Circe and Adelheid.

If Matsuda, I wonder what he's doing fight now?

>>3567890
>he's doing fight now?
Most likely.

>>3567892
I bet his fights don't even end with people being reduced to fresh new coats of paint.
What a casual.

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>>3567887
"Aww, that's totally sweet, thanks! I, like, thought you guys all hated me."

>>3567900
I was actually one of the few people that liked Kikuko.
I can't really hold her laughing when we died against her considering our own actions towards killing our enemies.

>>3567910
I have a fondness for valley girls and malicious people. Understandably, not all of you folks were as into Kikuko as I was.
Still, glad at least one person liked her.

>>3567910
Also it was possible to bad end on Circe's pottage test and Adelheid killed us twice.
Honestly Rushorou's real Charisma might be in seducing girls with mental issues.

>>3567887
Imagine how crazy Circe is going right now. She's got a pretty bad way of dealing with separation from her loved ones.

>>3567932
I mean, she's no more malicious than Yumigawa "Brainwashing is the first choice for dealing with prisoners" Rushorou.
The guy who kicks peoples heads off because he feels like it.
Tbh Rushorou killing Keiseki is probably my favourite moment in the quest followed by Telling Cid to fuck himself.
>>3567955
If she's still around then she's probably going mental.

>>3567517
If we do seek out the Einzbern, we need to discuss how to disguise the fact that we're a Servant from her for as long as it would take for us to reap the benefits of a partnership. Or, do we simply reveal ourselves as Saber once it becomes necessary and hope that we're entrenched enough as allies that she won't kill us?

>>3567932
>I have a fondness for malicious people.
That explains a lot. The way you construct characters makes far more sense now.

>>3567955
>Rushorou wasn't viable to support Circe as a Servant, so she got stuck to Truvi instead when being thrust back into the world
>Circe now acts as Truvi's alarm clock, waking her master every morning with "take me back to my hubby you bitch reeeeeeeee"

>>3568079
I wonder what Adelheid is up to if she's around.
>"Unexplained explosions have completely destroyed the Reichstag! No terror organization has claimed to be behind these attacks."
I highly doubt Truvi would be able to tell Circe "No." to that request without bad things happening to her when she sleeps.
And good luck trying to keep a Caster away from you with modern magecraft.

>>3568079
>The way you construct characters makes far more sense now.
How do I construct characters?

>>3568079
How sure are we that the Einzbern has a servant?

>>3568137
Is water wet?

>>3568149
She didn't seem to have one when we met, unless it was Assassin

>>3568115
To me, at least, it seems like you define characters primarily by some major flaw that they have, and other positive characteristics spring from there but are generally secondary to said massive flaw. To give a few examples of what I've observed and how I've interpreted it:
Circe is dangerously obsessive over the target of her affection and doesn't really care about others besides said target. The silver lining of that is that she's ferociously protective of the one she's fixated on and anyone said target deems important.
Adelheid is literally Hitler. But Hitler was undeniably charismatic and incredibly daring, the latter trait helping us finally kill the cockroach.
Truvi can't separate herself from her status as the heir to a prominent mage family, resulting in an overblown ego that is easily injured when she doesn't live up to the expectations that result. To prove herself, she's willing to share her knowledge with a magical neophyte in desperate need of information.
Kikuko doesn't really care about other people, but she was able to harden her heart and her mind to the point where she didn't go completely insane despite being a sheltered girl tossed into Akeldama.
Ogawara has crippling social anxiety, but his resulting proficiency with even 2004-era internet allowed him to piece together that Archer was in fact Clint Eastwood.
Matsuda wants to live like a badass to the detriment of his health, safety, and any future occupation he might have. But since it's the badass way, he's one loyal son of a bitch.
Alberich thinks he has the right to rule over everyone. To demonstrate that, he willingly takes on a leader's responsibilities, striving towards his goals and protecting those under him to the best of his ability (when his massive head doesn't get in the way).

>>3568137
A Grail War is happening. The Einzbern wouldn't bother helping build another grail unless they intended to use it themselves. To use it, they need to win the war. Sending a proxy master went fantastically in the 4th war, so they almost certainly won't be doing that again. That means they have their own master in this war.

>>3568167
It's possible that it was an Assassin who was only partially concealing his presence to appear weaker than he was.

>>3568181
>partially concealing his presence
aka Espionage

>>3568250
It's also possible that Assassin was just hiding and Otto was just a stooge (or he had the skill Powerless Shell). But that would be too clever for the Einzberns...

>>3566397
>>3566669
This. Why is nobody voting for this?
>almost die to a servant because we were completely unable to attack
>nobody cares enough to take five minutes to name it afterward
wtf guys?

>>3568287
Because we can do that immediately after getting in sync w our new master

>>3568289
I don't think downtime is guaranteed for the next vote either. No time like the present.

We've had a lot of discussion since the beginning of this thread, so just to confirm:
Are people still on board with >>3566409 ?
If not:
Should we have Ayaka stay home or attend school?
Do we want to tell Ayaka about the Emiyas, the Einzberns, both, or neither?
If we tell her about either, do we want to suggest approaching the ones we tell her about for help?

>>3568418
I suppose we should add our Einzbern “connection” to my write-in as well. I don’t want to tell her we’re going straight to either the Emiya clan or the Einzberns for help.

>>3568418
Honestly the mansion isn't safe at all.
We'd probably be better off asking the Emiyas for shelter, it's too dangerous to have our master unprotected but it's also too dangerous to have them accompany us when Harris might appear.
Of course this means we should tell her about them.
And going to school with a servant that is unable to materialise is just begging for problems.

>>3568418
I think she should stay home. Standing outside the school is a huge waste of time for us and we're hardly even protecting her like that.

I think we should tell her about both, and we ought to tell her our full backstory. I don't see why we should keep any of it from her. She seems much more engaged with us and the war than her brother so I'd like to see more genuine cooperation.

I definitely agree with the need to train more but I'm not sure if that can be done effectively on our own, or if there are even any teachers around with skills that would be useful for us to learn.

I think we need to explore her capabilities and the resources from Vaisset's lab before we going running with our tail between our legs to either the Einzberns or the Emiyas. She's part of the most powerful family in the area and we aren't as helpless here as some people think.

>>3568447
That last point is most pertinent for me. I really want to exploit the Mansion’s resources before we duck out.

>>3568430
While I agree that asking the Emiyas for shelter is certainly the safest route, it also might lock us into helping them and therefore out of the wish. We don't know if we're ready to give the wish up yet, so I'd suggest we don't do that quite yet.
There's also the possibility that the remaining Servants could be called to ally against us and the Emiyas to protect the war if the Overseer catches wind of that operation. We should at least wait until a servant or two dies before pursuing an open partnership with the Emiyas.

>>3568447
>>3568463
I agree that we should see what the mansion has to offer. Vaisset was working on some groundbreaking shit and almost got it to work. There has to be something we can use. Anything that can help us learn Mana Burst would be particularly helpful. In my mind, the ideal case would be modifying his synthetic transmutation to convert Void to other elements and then using our sword/cloak as a budget Gem Sword, but considering our magical knowledge that's a pipe dream and a half.
That said, it may be worth pursuing the Einzbern connection regardless simply so we can coordinate our movements with another Master. If we were to, say, meet her in our suited state and then appear where we've agreed upon in full armor + helmet, we may be able to play it off like we're a servant and master combination arranged to covertly work together with the Einzbern master or something of the like.

>>3568463
Again, we need to take all of Jean's books and shit out of there. Those are the most valuable things in the mansion.

>>3568472
Can we even afford to give up the wish? What happens to us when the war's over? It's all too unknown to risk missing out on a wish that guarantees our continued existence. We need to do more investigation into our current state of being, or find someone friendly who could. This would require coming clean about Akeldama however.

About a cover story for the Einzberns, could we be explained as a demi-Servant or pseudo-Servant?

>>3568483
Do the Einzberns know about it? Lilisviel mistook us for a homunculus, but their Servant probably set the record straight already. We have no reason to give them a cover story rather than just claiming to be a Servant.

If you insist, just say Caster sounded us and transferred the rights to his Master before dying. It's true, but it reveals nothing that we want to keep close to our chest.

>>3568483
Ironically, the Emiyas would probably be our best bet for determining our nature and what to do about it. They're the ones with the most exposure to absurd Servant nonsense since this is the HF timeline, and we already pretty much came clean with Shirou about Akeldama. That motherfucker can even sway someone with no concept of morality hellbent on torturing him for the rest of his days. And he needed nothing but a brief conversation and a little bit of food to share. He has terrifyingly good people skills.

Alberich doesn't know anything about other kinds of Servants than the normal ones, so we can't use them as a cover story.

Lore question: What is the difference between the reverse side of the world and the imaginary number realm? Based on the wiki it seems like Sweets almost combined the two.

>>3568518
Do you think they'd be willing to help us if we revealed fully that we're just an "innocent" student that got swept up into this, and that if we don't win the war we'll cease to exist since we're not a real servant stored within the Grail? before incarnating and assuming our rightful role as ruler of this world

>>3568529
The Reverse Side of the World refers to that portion of the Imaginary Numbers Realm which has been made observable to magi by its inhabitants. To put it another way, if the Realm of Imaginary Numbers is the home of the Gods, the The Reverse Side of the World is their front window.
The Reverse Side of the World was discovered first, and the two areas were originally thought to be separate, but it is in fact only part of a greater whole.

Alright, at this point I'm really not sure if there's a consensus, so here's another set of prompts to hopefully get a majority vote for something.

>[ ] Tell Ayaka about the Emiya family and put forth the necessity of training, both master and servant, to be able to better prosecute the war. Stay home and reorganize the defenses of the manor as best as possible, but otherwise focus on becoming more able to defeat the foes set before you.

>[ ] Tell Ayaka about the Emiya family and suggest going to them for shelter, as the manor's defenses are compromised.

>[ ] Tell Ayaka about your entire story: your experiences in the Akeldama, the Emiyas, the Einzberns, all of it. Suggest staying at the manor, not going to school or the Emiyas.

>[ ] Tell Ayaka about the fact that the Einzbern representative took you for an ally sent by her grandfather, and so allying with her may be possible. Suggest going to the Einzberns for support.

>[ ] Focus the conversation on something else. (Write in)

>>3568634
>[ ] Tell Ayaka about the Emiya family and put forth the necessity of training, both master and servant, to be able to better prosecute the war. Stay home and reorganize the defenses of the manor as best as possible, but otherwise focus on becoming more able to defeat the foes set before you.

>>3568634
>[ ] Tell Ayaka about your entire story: your experiences in the Akeldama, the Emiyas, the Einzberns, all of it. Suggest staying at the manor, not going to school or the Emiyas.
This, EXCEPT we suggest going to the Emiyas. Or not, if anons don't want it.

>>3568634
>[ ] Tell Ayaka about the Emiya family and put forth the necessity of training, both master and servant, to be able to better prosecute the war. Stay home and reorganize the defenses of the manor as best as possible, but otherwise focus on becoming more able to defeat the foes set before you.
But don't mention the Emiya family. For now, focus on getting the manor's defenses back online and look through Vaisset's research to see if there's anything we can use.
Let's hold off on choosing alliances for the moment since I don't think we've reached a consensus on that, but keep the possibility open. We're not going to make it through this war flying solo.
Ayaka will probably be confused by the notion that a Servant can get stronger or better, but we can just blame it on the empowering effect of Akeldama. It's not exactly a lie.

>>3568634
>>3568731
Still don't feel that seeking the Einzbern this early is a good idea.

>>3568745
It's a terrible idea. We know very little about them, they probably divined a lot of information about us and we don't even know which class Lilisviel's Servant is in. We shouldn't approach them until we're stronger, we know what to use them against and we have leverage on them.

>>3568634
>[ ] Tell Ayaka about the Emiya family and suggest going to them for shelter, as the manor's defenses are compromised.

>>3568634

>[ ] Tell Ayaka about the Emiya family and put forth the necessity of training, both master and servant, to be able to better prosecute the war. Stay home and reorganize the defenses of the manor as best as possible, but otherwise focus on becoming more able to defeat the foes set before you.

>>3568745
I meant to support >>3568731, btw.

>>3568779
I think you misunderstand how an alliance with the Einzbern would work. Liliesviel has two expectations about Alberich: a) that we will be acting in some way to her benefit and b) that we will be subordinate to her in any direct alliance. If we were to choose to work with the Einzbern, it would involve Alberich playing to and taking advantage of those expectations. Whatever her servant is, it's not Artoria so we can probably take it, meaning we wouldn't need strength. We wouldn't be "using" them as much as they would be "using" us, but either way enemy servants die so we would still benefit. Lili's expectations about us would be our leverage, given that they're a reliable key to an alliance.

I'm also not really sure why those are your criteria for an alliance. The only one of those things we had when working with Truvi and Lancer was Lancer's class. We weren't decidedly stronger than her and her servant, we had no idea what we were up against, and she had most of the leverage being the expert on how Grail Wars work.

>>3569098
Also allying with the Einzbern is a quick way to get on Shirou's shitlist.

I have a question about the fate universe. Are the servants just that strong when they were heroes in the past, or is the grail empowering to their levels of strength? Does this also apply to their NPs as well, or does the grail give them one base on their legend?

>>3569158
Also, I think I may have saw something about this when I played stay/night but don't servants get a power boost based on how well known their legend is?

>>3569158
Servants are actually weaker than they were in the past. Heroic Spirits are so absurdly powerful that the Grail can only manage to summon them if they've been dumbed down enough to be crammed into one of the class containers. Presumably, this applies to NPs to some degree as well.
It's also worth noting that the Grail doesn't "give" NPs, it just decides which ones a Heroic Spirit gets summoned with of those they has access to.

>>3569161
They do get a power boost based on how famous their legend is where they're summoned, but it's not huge enough to make or break a Servant.

>>3569158
Yes and no. A Heroic Spirit is summoned into the form of a Servant, as one of the 7 classes. This Servant form is also known as a container, because it restricts the powers of the Servant.
A good example of this is Cu Chulainn. In his legends he was known as an expert charioteer, and once wielded the sword of the war god, as well as being a potent spearman. Summoned into the container of Lancer, however, he is only able to use his spear and fight in that capacity.
It's generally thought that Servants are weaker than their Heroic Spirit originals, although this is not the case for some, who have been surpassed by their own legends. Vlad III would be a good example of this; as a living hero he was a surpassing commander, but as a Servant he can take on the vampiric powers of Dracula due to the legend attached to him.
As a side note, yes, Servants are empowered by their legends being well-known, and particularly by being summoned in a place where they are famous. This is one reason why the False Assassin was able to go toe-to-toe with Saber in F/SN.

>>3569182
>It's generally thought that Servants are weaker than their Heroic Spirit originals, although this is not the case for some, who have been surpassed by their own legends.
It's my understanding that in cases like this, the Grail itself isn't responsible for the empowerment. The Heroic Spirit may become more powerful than the individual was in life (if that person ever existed) since Heroic Spirits are based on belief rather than fact. Sasaki Kojirou never existed, but Heroic Spirit Sasaki Kojirou was placed on the Throne of Heroes regardless in the form of an unknown swordsman given Sasaki Kojirou's name. Angra Mainyu was placed on the Throne because people believed that his evil was their salvation.
I don't know of any case where a true Heroic Spirit would be weaker than a Servant summoned by the Grail.

>>3569205
Sorry, I was unclear. You're right, it's the Heroic Spirit that's surpassed the living hero in such cases. Since anon asked about "when they were heroes in the past," I was comparing to their power in life.
Except in the case of Avenger and his abnormal birth, the Holy Grail doesn't empower Servants beyond facilitating their existence.
This is one of the things that makes Alberich unique, since in your case you actually are empowered to be a Servant and have no Heroic Spirit. I think I made this comparison in a previous thread, but whereas other heroes must be constricted to fit into the class container, you've grown to fit.

>>3569216
Yeah I'm really curious about our existence. Shouldn't we have filled Judas' class container of Caster since the saber class container was already occupied and his was available and tied to Vaisset?

>>3569232
Although this is an interesting subject, it's something you'll have to learn about in character if you want more information.

By the way, we currently have 2 for training after telling Ayaka about the Emiya family, 2 for just focusing on training and determining what Ayaka can do as a master, and 1 vote for each of a few other choices.

>>3568906
I think my ID changed but
I'll switch to

>[ ] Tell Ayaka about the Emiya family and put forth the necessity of training, both master and servant, to be able to better prosecute the war. Stay home and reorganize the defenses of the manor as best as possible, but otherwise focus on becoming more able to defeat the foes set before you.

List of magical fuckery that has changed Alberich

Pseudo grail dips his body in the imaginary numbers realm and reforms him, adding 126 highly ordered magical circuits and turning him from a physical being to a conceptual being (which we still don't fully understand)

Circe uses his flesh to create his cloak that is linked to his new origin and element

He fucks with his command seals enough to create a link to his servants separate from the grail that can supposedly support them both. The markings have disappeared but the state of our servants is unknown.

Akeldama energy fills in the gaps required to fit the class container of saber, also develops a link to the IRL grail as a servant, creating a fundamental change to his being. Unknown if this is only for the duration of the grail war or permanent.

>>3568634
>[ ] Tell Ayaka about your entire story: your experiences in the Akeldama, the Emiyas, the Einzberns, all of it. Suggest staying at the manor, not going to school or the Emiyas.
I honestly don't even know why we kept our origin a secret in the first place

>>3569262

Keeping up with tracking votes it's

4 for going to tell about and train with the Emiyas, 2 for telling Ayaka about all our experiences and staying at the manor.

Tell Ayaka about the Emiyas and train
>>3568650
>>3569039
>>3569264

Train without yelling Ayaka about the Emiyas
>>3568731
>>3569074

Tell Ayaka the whole story
>>3569324
>>3568657

Well seeing as we'll be training with the Emiyas+Rin. What should we be namely focusing on for our training? Who would be able to train us and Ayaka best for what? And finally, can we still work on our magecraft? I think we should making best with learning under Rin and Sakura. The latter I might add also shares our Origin in dealing with Imaginary Numbers, that and their help in making best of Jeans transmutation of the five elements will be a major boon. We still don't know Ayaka's real potential as a Magus so we best learn it quick and make the best of it. We've met True Saber and Rider so far IC, but we have yet to meet any of the other Servants. So we best grind and grind until we're at beyond 500% maximum performance.

>>3569595
I don't think the vote is to train with the Emiyas. We're just telling her about them and then training with her.

>>3569600

Considering we're making mention of the Emiyas, the option to head out and train with them very well be an option I'm thinking. That and they'd be our best option in figuring out exactly what the deal with our conceptual existence is and what it means, because I'm sure as shit not going to trust Ms. Einzbern with poking and prodding at our essence.

But best we make a bullet point list for our goals of training I think. So from what I can gather it's this:

>Gage Ayaka's skill as a Magus and sharpen her skills accordingly
>Figure a way to make use and complete Jean's notes on transmutation
>Learn more about our own existence as a Number Man and figure out what advantages and disadvantages it entails
>Grind parameters until at least one would be EX or an A++
>Form some new Skills/NP?
>Work on sharpening our ability with Kenotis and Lückeschwert to try and unlock something new for them and figure out tricks to use them for our next Servant encounter

>>3569623
>>Grind parameters until at least one would be EX or an A++
A-anon do you understand how high EX and A++ Parameters actually are?

Don't forget that we have to help Ayaka continue her duties as the Second Owner of the area.

>>3569635
That is absurd. I’d like to just get Agility or Endurance up...

>>3569645
>he thinks that shit matters during a grail war.
"No."

>>3569623
I'm not sure it's worth working with them if we can train through other means. The Vaisset Manor likely has plenty of tomes on magical theory and other resources we can use. Vaisset was very interested in the theory and research of magic.

>>3569635

Yes. And? Are you wanting to settle for less? Because I say if we're going to grind we're going to do it until we have it high damnit. WE GOT A WAR TO WIN, AND TO WIN WE NEED POWER. Besides who knows how quick/slow we're able to get these up? We won't know until we get going on it

>>3569648
Honestly I just want to be able to match Arturia physically.

why didn't we get to keep the training gloves Circe made us too

>>3569649
But it will matter more when the war is over, and give Alberich a good place to start his plans for global domination via those connections.

>>3569659
Anon, how do you think you learned Mind's Eye (True)?

>>3569659
They’re not really integral to Rushorou on a conceptual level, and we didn’t really use them a ton aside from a bit of sparring with Matsuda. It’s understandable as to why the grail overlooked them.

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>>3569654
Emiyas actually have two people we can combat train with
Alberich is a magic brainlet and Ayaka won't be as good at magecraft as Rin.
>>3569656
Anon you don't seem to understand how stompy a servant with A++ or EX in a parameter should be.

>>3569672
The C++ doubling thing is so dumb. I refuse to believe that's what Nasu was planning originally.

>>3569668
Wait what's the correlation between the gloves and that skill

>>3569654

We know that Shirou through gauging him is a Servant-level combatant and there's the actual Rider of Fuyuki there along with them.

Plus Rin and Sakura would be good teachers for both Ayaka and ourselves, to say that it's not worth working with them even if we can train through other means is absurd.

If we have something to make use of, then shit we better use it. Who says we can't go for utilizing the Emiyas along the Jean's notes? If anything I think it'd be better to have a few extra people to help us study the tomes and other resources.

>>3569672

I know how a Servant with A++ or EX in those is, I'm saying that we should set it as a goal to strive for. Doesn't mean that it COULD happen but we need to try and go for it regardless since considering we have Artoria and Archer Hercules in this war we need to get as stompy as possible

>>3569677
It's ridiculous yeah.
At least we don't have EX parameters being put where they don't belong on servants.
Oh wait yes we do.

>>3569685
If you think we can either survive after the war without making a wish or that we can survive betraying them at the end then sure, it's totally worth it

>>3569698
>Implying using and abusing the Emiya clan in order to become able to win the war, and then cunningly betraying them, wouldn’t be a perfect crowning achievement for Alberich.

>>3569704
I agree that it would be, but I really don't want to end up genuinely teaming up with them. Which is a risk.

>>3569707
>I really don't want to end up genuinely teaming up with them
Just avoid the high jump and it’ll be *fine*

>>3569698
Anon why do you think we'd have trouble backstabbing anyway?
Our sword is literally a "fuck you instant kill" and ad such is perfect for backstabs.
Though if the grail isn't gonna shit out manjew there's no point in blowing it up anyway.

>>3569712
>Our sword is literally a "fuck you instant kill"
I take exception to this. The sword is the perfect Anti-Armor NP, but if we fucked up someone with Battle Continuation or somesuch skill they could still get Alberich.

>>3569707
They are a means to an end for sure.
Alberich does sort of like Shirou because Shirou is a candidate for "World's nicest person".
I don't want to have to kill any of them though.
They also lose pretty badly against us in a fight if Adelheid and Circe are alive.

>>3569712
>one decent to good strength servant vs multiple servant tier enemies
Don't like those odds amigo

>>3569725
Just cleave straight through their heart or brain. Those are a servants weak points iirc.
Also Battle Continuation won't do you much good if you've been bifurcated.

>>3569729
>insta kill Rider and escape with them not fast enough to pursue
That was hard.

>>3569738
Confidence is great and all but I think you're going a little too far with it there

>>3569734
>Just kill the servant anon!
It’s never that easy.

>>3569763
Try telling that to Perseus.

>>3569689
Did I put ridiculous EX parameters on any Servants? Thought the only place I used it was for Adelheid's aberrant version of Madness.

>>3569679
The Gloves of Learning enabled you to rapidly memorize and comprehend fighting techniques after performing them. To put that another way, they enabled you to understand combat. The core of Mind's Eye (True) is a deep understanding and clear view of combat. As your mystic code was sublimated into your NPs, the gloves were sublimated into your current form of that skill.

>>3569769
Makes sense...
update when

>>3569768
He was a bitchmade jobber. No way sweets graces us with such an easily-slain opponent.

>>3569769
I believe anon was referring to the state of servants in the macro sense. Also, very neat with the application of the gloves! That’s more satisfying than just a raw powerboost to our Mind’s Eye.

>>3569780
Some time after I get home, anon. It's a weekday, and I can't write updates when I'm out.

>>3569769
I was talking about FGO actually.
Mostly Edison.
What the fuck were they thinking?

>>3569800

Anything you can do Edison can do better. I'm sorely disappointed that his head isn't an electrically burned elephant though

>>3569800
Oh yeah, FGO is rife with pointless EX-rank stuff. Skills are most egregious. Three quarters of the cast have unique skills that are then EX-rank anyway, when EX-rank means it can't be measured by the same metric as other rankings of the same skill.

>>3569734
>Just cleave straight through their heart
Tell that to Cu.

>>3569872
Battle Continuation is kind of a rare skill and it won't help much if you're bisected horizontally.
Especially won't help if you're bisected vertically.
And Kenotis can just delete their entire torso.

>>3569892
You make it sound like getting just the right hit on a Servant would be easy. Which of our enemies would simply allow themselves to be cleanly cut or wait for Kenotis to billow into them without at least trying to dodge?

>>3569920
>Inb4 Medea fucks up again

>>3569920
One that we are allied with who isn't expecting us to cut them in half?
I'm mostly just saying our NPs are excellent for betrayals.

IRL responsibilities have forced me to push back another update, sorry. I did find some time to work on it tonight, but not enough...

Oh boy I can't wait to kill Arturia.
only way I can possibly see Alberich not trying to kill her on sight is if there's a greater threat present, and to Saber, Alberich looks like the greater threat. Alternatively it miiiight be possible to talk to her if we get more 5th war info.

>>3571285
It'll be a long while before we're able to do that.
both IRL and in the quest

>>3572780
Yeah Arturia is broken when she's not forced to job by the plot.
anyway.
I wonder if there is another Edelfelt sibling in this war, they are sometimes twins aren't they?
If there is that's a possible alliance.

>>3572791
Did Truvietianne tell you much about her family life, or did you only get as far as discussing magic?

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>>3572980
>tfw ywn 100% Fate/City Akeldama and Fate/Awakening Mirror

>>3572980
We kept pissing her off every time we spoke to her.
Luckily magi like to reveal their names to everyone at any opportunity.

>>3572987
Hmm... should I start the quest over after Awakening Mirror ends so people can try for the other routes?

>>3573168
It would certainly be interesting.

>>3573168
Is awakening mirror the end of the story of Alberich? Will it end when this grail war is finished?

>>3573181
Honestly, that depends on what kind of ending you get.

>>3573191
Well that's both relieving and concerning.

>>3573168

Well if there's not a third True Route to be made after Awakening Mirror then sure. Other wise I say we should hold off until we go through our own Heaven's Feel of a sort.

>>3573168
Why not. The sizeable number of anons who wanted Seigi no Mitaka would certainly be satisfied. There’s no precedent for it on /qst/ but I’d be on board. Only if you want to of course.

>>3573257
>Yumigawa as Seigi no Mikata
Imagining this just makes me laugh.

>>3573262
Awakening with Assassin (Shadow) Rushorou would also be fun, actually.

>>3573270
>Go ALL the way back to the start
>Matsuda
>Blood for the Blood God Morality
>Archer
>Go into Fate/Awakening Mirror as raging Bahsaka

>>3573168
Absolutely. If you're willing I'd be happy to try the war as Assassin, maybe Archer.

I'm Interested to see how you'll spin the story In a different direction each time.

Also I'd like to note that wow, we really should have trained earlier. At least we seem to be of one mind that we need to get In gear now.

>>3573191
Just out of curiosity, how many routes does Vaisset get to live through I mean, just an estimation or a percentage of course . From the setup, It does't look like he lives through very many timelines.

>>3573495
He probably would have lived if we both bailed.

>>3573478
Archer or Assassin would definitely be most interesting.
Assassin for literally being The Shadow and Archer for Independent Action.

How long do Grail Wars usually last on average?

>>3573495
At the choice of whether to flee or not, there were three outcomes. If you had both run, you would have both died. As you fought, you could survive with suitable tactics, but Vaisset was guaranteed death. If you had held your ground and sent him fleeing, you would have had a hard fight, but there was the possibility for both of you to survive.
Previous to that, you had the option to investigate the mysterious fires in town or to pursue Rider. Vaisset had worse chances of survival in the former case, and better chances in the latter.
Overall, I would say that Vaisset survives longer in about half of the overarching routes I had considered, but only makes it to the end of the Grail War in about a quarter.

>>3573534
About two weeks, give or take.

>>3573593
Damn, so we made some of the worse choices for Vaisset's survival.

>>3573593
>but only makes it to the end of the Grail War in about a quarter.
Jesus Christ those odds are worse than Shinji's.

>>3573697

To be more fair on Shinji, he had two more plot important family members that kept him alive for those parts. And remember

He's only 8 years old

>>3573168
If you ask me, the possibilities are highly alluring. I hereby present the Hyaku Pahsento Certified Badass™ Run of City Akeldama:
>BADASS Seigi no Mikata Matsuda/Archer Certified Badass™ Tag Team
>BADASS Matsuda making a man out of Ogawara
>BADASS role for Truvi beyond Lancer's battery
>BADASS redemption run for Truvi to be more than an emotional wreck
>BADASS Truvi route get
>BADASS actual appearance of Assassin's master
>BADASS Saber not jobbing
>BADASS Circe/Orpheus being terrorized by the ultimate cockroach servant
>BADASS Kikuko surviving yet again
>BADASS Matsuda stealing Kikuko's heart by Seigi no Mikata'ing her and not dying like the rest
>BADASS catfights between Truvi and Kikuko
>BADASS Archer eating popcorn in the corner and mocking Matsuda for not controlling his women like a BADASS
>BADASS Ambrose breaking his contract with Berserker and joining the BADASS team
>BADASS Berserker surviving via Judas-facilitated contract to Jack DeLancey
>BADASS Sadism Yumigawa swapped with Keiseki, now Rider's master
>BADASS Rushorou + Rider + Berserker Ultimate Evil Tag Team
>BADASS Operation Get Ambrose a Servant
>BADASS Ambrose's Servant keeping Rider occupied
>BADASS showdown between an American icon and literal Hitler
>BADASS Matsuda and Ambrose taking on Silver Grailed Yumigawa
>...
>It's over
>Victory is almost ours
>Judas comes to collect
>Archer is ready to draw
>Longinus strikes, lance about to kill Archer
>...
>BADASS Iron Heart activation
>BADASS Archer putting a hole in Longinus' forehead
>BADASS Matsuda killing Judas in a fit of righteous anger
>BADASS Berserker of Righteous Fury ready to RIP AND TEAR the Tokyo Grail War
While it's just a possibility, it'd be the exact opposite of our current playthrough in every way imaginable. I think it'd be fun.

>>3573923
That post is a weapons-grade assault on my sides. Fantastic, ID!
My personal favorite part of that route would probably be when Teach gets Yumigawa drunk and they sing a morbid sea shanty on the deck.

"Well," you say, considering carefully how best to put your advice to the girl. "The first thing I would advise is focus. For your brother, the Holy Grail War was not a priority; he preferred to spend his time immersed in research, and I had to prompt him to pursue the War. You must focus yourself entirely on the task ahead if we are to seize victory. I'm afraid your daily life will have to be set aside in favor of the Holy Grail War. Is that something you can accept, Miss Ayaka?"

"I'll have to, won't I?" The girl gives you a half-smile. "If staying home from school and spending all my time on the War is the only way to survive, I'm not going to argue with you about it."

"I'm glad you understand," you say with a firm nod. "Now, the second thing we must consider is information. Frankly, I still know very little about what your brother was capable of with regards to magecraft. If we are to be victorious, I must know the extent of your capabilities. I know well that my own power was insufficient, and intend to train heavily before we next go into battle."

"You'll probably be disappointed," Ayaka says. "My ability as a magus is hopelessly average; I don't think I can do much to help you."

You shake your head, gallantly declaring, "whether you are average or superb doesn't matter in the least. You are my Master now, and I will fight by your side regardless of your abilities. What is important is that I know, and can plan around them."

"Alright then," Ayaka replies, though it's clear from her tone that she's still hesitant. "My mother's family cultivated old black magic. Curses and things like that, I mean, ritual magic focused on living things."

"Go on," you say.

Ayaka nods, and continues, "I don't know how to perform a lot of it, actually. Although the whole crest was transplanted to me after Mom died, our arts are complicated and confusing even with its help. I can't just power a mystery stored in the crest and have it work, I'd have to know how to use it properly. Mom would've taught me, but..." Ayaka trails off, looking down. After only a moment's silence, though, she picks back up her narration. "Anyway, I've been learning from the Shijou library since, but it's slow with nobody to help me along."

It would probably be wisest to let the girl tell her story at her own pace, but against your better judgment you let your curiosity get the better of you, asking, "How is it that your lack of understanding inhibits you? I had believed that a magus' hereditary crest completely facilitated the manifestation of an inherited mystery."

"Huh..." Ayaka considers the question for a few moments, staring off into space and pursing her dainty lips in irritation as she tries to call to mind a clear explanation. Finally the answer dawns on her, and she speaks up again. "Here's a good example. Mom once told me about a curse invented by our family that settles in and takes root in the cursed person's magic circuits, running off of their Od until it finally kills them. She said nobody could remove it once it was used, and it was one of our best techniques, but that I wouldn't be ready to learn it until I was 36 years old. So that curse, as a part of the Shijou inheritance, is part of my magic crest, right?" She looks to you for confirmation before continuing.

"Yes," you say, "I should think it would be."

"It is," Ayaka replies with a nod. "I can manifest the curse by activating the crest and doing a short chant, very easily, without ever having learned how it was originally done. The problem is, I can't send it to someone. Apparently the target was assigned using a special ritual described somewhere in our family papers, but I can't find it. So even though the magic crest does the hardest part of the magic, I still can't use the curse. There are a bunch of other Shijou techniques like that, too."

"I am beginning to understand your circumstances, Miss Ayaka," you say. "Even magic is no substitute for a proper teacher, I suppose. But surely not all of your hereditary powers are so complex. You must be able to use some of them on your own."

"I'm not quite that useless, no," she answers with a self-deprecating smile. "Mom also performed a ritual sacrifice of a pigeon every morning, and took its energy in to supplement her own. That's something I can do with only the crest, but I've never actually worked up the courage to kill one. Last year Nii-san finally got rid of the pigeons once he gave up on me being able to kill them. Ehehe..." She chuckles, embarassed at the memory.

You give her a level stare. An ability the girl can't bring herself to use isn't any more use than one she doesn't know how to. Anyway, what kind of family were the Shijou, you wonder. Are all their mysteries based wholly around bloodshed and the consumption of life force? You have to admit the aesthetics appeal to you, but putting abilities with that kind of focus in the hands of a soft girl like Ayaka... well, her discomfort's not working in your favor. Kikuko would have been a much better heir for them, you reflect.

Interpreting your silence as disappointment, Ayaka hastens to move on. "I can also put up bounded fields, of course, that's one of the basics. I guess I'll need to raise one around the house now that Nii-san's gone. And there's the black wings, of course."

That makes you sit up and take notice. Black wings? Does she have some kind of flight magic, of the kind Circe used? "And what would that be," you ask leaning forward in anticipation.

"Here, I'll show you," she says, and gets to her feet with right arm outstretched. The magic crest on Ayaka's arm comes to life, its complex patterns glowing through her sleeve, and she recites a sentence of something you can't quite understand. From the sound, you guess it's a form of archaic Japanese, but despite your perfect marks in classics you're quite unable to comprehend the words. At the end of this short incantation, the air around Ayaka's head and shoulders suddenly fills with ten black feathers, arrayed about her in motionless levitation.

Noticing your baffled expression (and enjoying it a bit, you suspect,) the girl explains. "They're the feathers of birds we sacrificed over the centuries, brought back and empowered by magical energy. 'Black wings' is kind of a misnomer, I guess, but the name stuck a long time ago."

"Of course they're very pretty," you say, "but what do you do with them?"

"Take a look," Ayaka says, and without further warning one of the feathers shoots from out beside her head with the speed of a bullet, burying its point in the table. Then it slowly rises back to its former place; the feather is undamaged, while there's a tiny, perfectly round hole dug into the table, like the scar left in cork after a pin has been withdrawn. "The black wings are how the Shijou magi fight in person, when we have to. I can attack with them, like I just showed you, or make a shield out of them. Even if using the black wings is all I can really do, I hope it'll be useful anyway..."

"Of course your abilities will be useful," you answer reassuringly. "From appearances, these black wings are a very versatile tool, which should prove invaluable in protecting you from enemy attack. More precious still is the humility you hold regarding your powers. Since you hold such a low opinion of your own ability to fight, I know that you will allow me to protect you, and not attempt to face the foe in a duel. Let me fight for you, Miss Ayaka, and stay close by my side whenever we face an enemy Master. Devote yourself to improving your magical abilities when at home, and rely on me when we are in battle, and then we cannot fail."

Giving her this kind of pep talk isn't really in your nature, but you reason that the girl needs plenty of encouragement this morning if she's going to serve as a decent Master for you. That being the case, you put plenty of energy into your tone and flash her a chivalrous smile as you describe your certainty of victory. Sure enough, your repeated encouragement over breakfast has its desired effect. Ayaka is in much higher spirits now as she blushingly mutters, "Th-thank you, Saber-san. I'll put myself in your care."

Then, all of a sudden, she seems to rally self-control by shifting her thoughts to a different subject, and moves the conversation at the same time. "Information goes both ways, though, you know," the girl declares. "If we're going to be fighting together, don't you think I should know about your abilities too? You haven't said anything about how you fight, or what your heroic powers are, or anything like that! I don't even know what kind of hero you are. All you said before was that your 'memories are indeterminate'."

"I suppose I haven't told you much," you muse. "You won't find it a long explanation, though. My abilities are without complexity and I have no arcane lineage to describe. I'll be frank, Miss Ayaka. I was summoned with no memories of life as a hero, or of my true name as a heroic spirit." For a dramatic flourish, you manifest your armor and cloak, and draw your sword as you continue, holding it and standing in the manner of a knight at attention. "I am Saber, an armored knight who wields this blade."

As you're speaking, that strange flash of instinct you felt when swearing your oath to Vaisset and again when introducing yourself to Liliesviel von Einzbern suddenly takes hold, and you continue almost without control over your tongue. "This sword's name I do know, however. Its smith called it Lückeschwert, and I too use that name for it; but if there is some famed tale of how a hero clad in white steel and black silk took it for his own, it is unknown to me. As for my powers, I can fight with sword or fist. I can plan a battle too, and perhaps ride out to fight on horseback, though I haven't attempted it since being summoned here."

Status Updated

At this point Ayaka actually breaks into laughter, quite unexpectedly interrupting your speech with a kind of mirth shocking so soon after her brother's death. "We make a great pair, don't we," she manages to say once she's gotten control of herself again. "I'm a magus who can't use the powers she inherited, and you're a legendary hero who can't remember his story! Nii-san said that the Holy Grail would summon someone with a compatible personality for you if you didn't have a catalyst, but I guess it ignored his catalyst and did it anyway!"

"Well, I'm glad you find the situation mirthful, Miss Ayaka," you say with dry sarcasm, "but there is one more detail I ought to relate to you."

"Oh, really? What's that?"

"The Emiya family," you declare. "While I was scouting the city for your brother, I happened to run across an extraordinary pair of magi: Emiya Shirou and his wife, Emiya Sakura. Survivors of the previous Holy Grail War, that set at a place called Fuyuki City, who are dedicated to preventing this one from being completed. They have both magical energy and experience in great supply, and even sustain the existence of a Servant, Rider, fifteen years after the end of the existence of the Holy Grail which facilitated her summoning."

"What?" Ayaka leaps to her feet, her eyes wide in shock at your account of the Emiyas, but before she can make a further response you raise a hand to stop her, and finish your own explanation.

"I believe they could come to be our greatest enemies in the end," you continue, "but could also be useful allies in the short term. Emiya and his wife are two very compassionate people, and it is my view that they'd like nothing more than to put an end to the Holy Grail War peacefully. That, we can make good use of." You decide against mentioning either the conflicting account of your history which you provided them or the fact that it was from your lips they learned of the Tokyo Holy Grail War in the first place. Even now, you can hardly figure out just why you were so frank and honest in speaking with them. It's as if there was some potent spell hovering about Emiya which made you feel as if you were his true friend.

"That means these people were living in secret from my brother, and plotting against the Second Owner all along," Ayaka exclaims in indignant shock. "We never knew about any magus family called Emiya here! And then they have a Servant?" She slumps down heavily in her chair, suddenly spent by the outburst. "Oh my god," she moans, "just when I think I've come to terms with everything, it gets crazier." Ayaka sits back up, focusing on you. "I need some time to think about these Emiya people, alright, Saber-san? Since I also need to set up a new bounded field around the house, I'll be doing that now. You said you wanted to do some kind of training, right?"

"That's right," you answer placidly. One trick you've learned in your time as a student council president is that, when dealing with emotional teenagers, you should always project total calm yourself. It often has a stabilizing effect. "Please inform me when you are ready to discuss our next plans for the War."

"Alright, Saber-san," Ayaka says softly. "Thanks again for being so understanding." With that, she gets up and heads out toward the front door. Although you have no experience with bounded fields yourself, you guess work has to be done on the perimeter to construct them, and she's heading into the garden for that purpose.

>[ ] Go looking for the Shijou library to broaden your magical knowledge and improve on the fundamental energy control Circe taught you. (Duty)

>[ ] Head out into the back yard and do some physical training to hopefully improve your raw power and speed. (Pride)

>[ ] Go down to Vaisset's workshop and see what you can make of his notes. That synthetic transmutation research he mentioned sounded quite interesting... (Curiosity)

>[ ] Do something else (Write in)

>>3574138
>[ ] Go looking for the Shijou library to broaden your magical knowledge and improve on the fundamental energy control Circe taught you. (Duty)

It may take me forever to post an update, but at least I can say I don't skimp on length.

>>3574138
>[ ] Go looking for the Shijou library to broaden your magical knowledge and improve on the fundamental energy control Circe taught you. (Duty)

>>3574138
>[ ] Go down to Vaisset's workshop and see what you can make of his notes. That synthetic transmutation research he mentioned sounded quite interesting... (Curiosity)

>>3574138
>[ ] Go looking for the Shijou library to broaden your magical knowledge and improve on the fundamental energy control Circe taught you. (Duty)

>>3574138
>[ ] Go looking for the Shijou library to broaden your magical knowledge and improve on the fundamental energy control Circe taught you. (Duty)
Fundamentals first.

>>3574138
>[ ] Go looking for the Shijou library to broaden your magical knowledge and improve on the fundamental energy control Circe taught you. (Duty)

>>3574138
>[ ] Go looking for the Shijou library to broaden your magical knowledge and improve on the fundamental energy control Circe taught you. (Duty)

Fuck yes, finally, the basics.

>>3574386
Finally we can start trying to figure out how to do cool shit with our cloak like attack reflection.

>>3574138
>[ ] Go looking for the Shijou library to broaden your magical knowledge and improve on the fundamental energy control Circe taught you. (Duty)

>>3574138


>[ ] Go down to Vaisset's workshop and take along his notes,afterwards look for the Shijou library to broaden your magical knowledge and improve on the fundamental energy control Circe taught you. (Duty/Curiosity)

No reason why we can't take the notes to the library and study them along with the basics

>>3573951
I'm glad you like it!
I forgot to add BADASS Lancer dying in multiple hits

>>3574138
>[ ] Go looking for the Shijou library to broaden your magical knowledge and improve on the fundamental energy control Circe taught you. (Duty)
Vaisset's research seems promising, but also pretty high-level, so we probably won't get far with it unless we have someone with us to help us understand them.

>>3573923
>>3574969
>Matsuda route
>playing the hero route AFTER the villain route
>needing to get info dumped again by Truvi, if she's even an ally.
>having to kill Yumigawa with alternate timeline bro
>dead ending about 15 times against grailed Yumigawa regardless
At least it's not the Ogawara or Keiseki route.
Though honestly repeating Rushorou's story in Akeldama seems pointless, the only thing that could be changed would be falling for the trap.
Unless Rushorou went full on Seigi no Mikata and tried saving everyone, that would be entertaining.
Personally though I think if we're gonna do a second run, Awakening is a good return point, just because most of the info-dumps have been done with.

>>3575400
Y’know, sweets could just randomize the non-essential personnel. Different servants, different masters aside from the route-related ones (Truvi & maybe Kikuko).

>>3575407
But then that's not a different route.
It's an entirely different war.

>>3575413
Yes, but keeping the narrative-important personnel is the only pertinent part from my POV. So what if Akeldama Saber turns into Charlemagne or something? Obviously, we still would want the war to be a fresh and at least marginally challenging experience.

>>3575421
Because what you're suggesting completely obliterates the point of routes.

>>3575431
Feh, perhaps you’re right. There’s probably a better way of ensuring difficulty and reducing the usefulness of meta knowledge.

>>3575438
Meta knowledge isn't all that great considering True Saber is still going to beat the shit out of us and we've got no real plan on defeating her despite everyone in this thread knowing everything about her.
And it can't be used in character anyway.
Fucking Metaknowledge ruined us in Akeldama because everyone assumed Archer had a Fragarach Six-Shooter due to his status.

>>3575438
We could get an easy-bake hardmode just by not having Caster, playing a Seigi no Mikata, and limiting the use of meta knowledge when making IC decisions. No Caster means vastly more limited recon, and acting IC as a Seigi no Mikata would deny us many of the unscrupulous but effective decisions we could make as Rushorou, like baiting out and decapitating Keiseki.

So what is your plan of action after training, folks? How do you intend to pursue the war, now that you have an idea of what Ayaka can (and can't) do?

>>3576181
We’re going to need to seek out an alliance. How many servants to we have confirmed as against us? Rider, Saber, those cutscene servants..... limited options. Frankly, we’ll probably have to settle for the Emiyas.

>>3576200
Or another master.

We should probably call Cromartie Tech and ask them about Matsuda to make sure Judas didn't lie to us about them surviving. If he didn't then time is on our side with Circe, Adelheid and Truvi.
Until then we can use the help of Emiya family and betray them later when our help arrives.

>>3576200
>>3576779
Both of these, we should also probably mention the death toll of Akeldama but not the specifics to Ayaka.
Suggesting she meet the Emiya's is probably our best bet.

>>3576181
It's becoming increasingly clear that we can't win this Grail War without help. The question is who to ask for it.

>>3576549
I don't recommend that. Ayaka may not be terribly effective in combat, but the autonomy we have under her and the resources she has access to won't be easy to find in another Master.

>>3576779
This is a bad idea for multiple reasons, but primarily because it's founded on the incorrect assumption that Matsuda's presence means Truvi, Circe and Adelheid will be able and willing to help us.
Truvi's not exactly our biggest fan. There's no way she's rushing to Tokyo to help us. If she gets involved in the Tokyo Grail War, it will be to steal a Servant and win in order to restore her image of herself as a top-quality mage. Any assistance we might receive from her would probably take the form of her murdering Ayaka, demanding that we contract with her, and running the war her way.
Circe and Adelheid, though they would come running to our aid if possible, are probably gone for good. Judas only said that our connection would be able to sustain them in the real world. He gave no indication that they would be transferred to the real world rather than back to the Throne of Heroes, nor that the connection we shared would survive that transfer of it occurred.
If Circe and Adelheid got brought back and were severed from us, it's uncertain if they found new Masters in time given how Adelheid guzzles mana and Circe may well have ended up on a remote Mediterranean island.
I think it's highly unlikely that some system was in place that transferred them to the real world and attached them to the survivors of Akeldama. But betting on that small chance would mean we need to not just "check on" Matsuda but get into direct contact with all three Japanese survivors to see if any of them are attached to either of our Servants (Truvi could have one at most, so one of the others must have one if this is the case). We would be putting almost all of those we managed to save in danger with a very low chance of reward beyond knowing for certain only that our Servants aren't attached to the other survivors if they still live.

>>3577805
>It's becoming increasingly clear that we can't win this Grail War without help.
God, it hurts. It hurts to admit but you're so fucking right and I hate it.

>>3577805
>Circe and Adelheid, though they would come running to our aid if possible, are probably gone for good.
Peddle your blackpills somewhere else.
We can win alone but that requires we just butcher anyone we even suspect of being a master, even attacking them during the day.
Which is a genuinely awful idea, honestly.
We should probably just team up with Medusa. Saber is 100 percent dead against Rider and pretty much any other Servant.

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>>3577886
>trying this hard to pretend that you're reluctant to work with the canon characters

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>>3577921
>working with canon characters to kill canon characters

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>>3577923
>also both of Rushorou's waifus are likely to be gone for good

>>3577926
Isn't there a version with an agitated skeleton?

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>When you get to kill more people for ultimate power

>the year is 2079
>the entire playerbase has long since all become tripfags
>our grandchildren use their ancestral tripcode and government assigned IP address to post
>their only knowledge of type moon comes from F/GO, which is still going strong
and by then we'll almost be halfway through our upcoming training montage at this update pace

>>3577921
It's more of a pride thing.
I don't wanna have to work with people to kill canon characters, or any characters.
But it's seeming more and more like we're gonna HAVE to and that sucks.

>>3577926
Also yeah that continues to be the worst thing ever.

>>3577940
https://youtu.be/TnlPtaPxXfc

>>3577977
Based QM.

>>3577977
It's always comforting that at the very least QM takes the time from his busy schedule to shitpost with us.
It's unironically wonderful.

>>3577992
Glad you get a kick out of it. I am trying to keep the updates coming as fast as I can, for what it's worth.

>>3577923
>>3577921
You don't have to work with canon characters. It's one option, but there are others.

After finishing your breakfast, left to go cold during your conversation with Ayaka, you decide to have a look through the library she mentioned. If she's been able to use the texts there to learn how to be a magus in the absence of her parents, you can hopefully make use of it to improve your own abilities. That said, when you first went through the house after being summoned, there was nowhere in it that really fit the name of "library." After some consideration, you decide she was referring to a second-floor room adjacent to the office, which you'd initially dubbed a storeroom, and go upstairs to investigate its contents.

Taking a look around, you see that it's it's quite a small area, perhaps the size of a bedroom, and windowless. All four walls are covered by bookshelves, with the only gap being for the door. In the center of the room four armchairs are arranged in semicircular fashion below an overhead light fixture. It's a far cry from the literary cathedral present in the Eighth Imperial University, but then perhaps this is the norm for private household libraries. Your family didn't have one, so you have no real frame of reference.

Enough musing on the room's design. You walk the circle of shelves, scanning the books there. Many are unrelated to magic; there's a complete set of Homer, the Divine Comedy, the Aeneid, the Tale of
Genji, and other classics, as well as a wide variety of books on the mythology of different peoples across the globe. This last set must have been purchased at some point after the Shijou were brought
into the plan to conduct the Holy Grail War, you conclude. Besides the mundane texts, however, there is a selection of books on magic, divided into two very distinct types. One type is ostentatious,
expensively bound in thick leather, with gold leaf titling spelling out names like Transcendental Principles of Elementalism or Introduction to Structural Energy Systems. These, you imagine, are something along the lines of textbooks used at that College of Magi which Edelfelt mentioned. The second type is more subdued, bound in the traditional Japanese style, and have tiny inked titles, all in the form of Records of Shijou no Tamanaga, Vol. 3, Journal of Shijou Reika, Book 7, and so-on. With such an opaque method of recording her family's inheritance of knowledge, you're not surprised Ayaka has had little success in teaching herself.

Still, ignoring the annals of the Shijou family and focusing on the general texts does yield some promising results. After taking several books down from the shelves and easing back into one of the chairs, you decide to read...

>[ ] A Treatise on Conceptual-Material Ties, which seems to be a book about the way magic defines the world.

>[ ] Forms of Power, a catalog of various sigils and geometric formations instrumental in ritual magic.

>[ ] Transcendental Principles of Elementalism, which deals with applications of pure element control.

>[ ] Introduction to Structural Energy Systems, which deals with magic circuits, leylines, bounded energy fields, and related topics.

>[ ] Look for something else (Write in what you seek, though I can't guarantee it's there)

Note: I'm actually online tonight, available to do multiple smaller updates like this one if votes come in relatively quickly.

>>3578286
>>[ ] A Treatise on Conceptual-Material Ties, which seems to be a book about the way magic defines the world.

>>3578291

>[ ] A Treatise on Conceptual-Material Ties, which seems to be a book about the way magic defines the world.

>>3578291
>[ ] Transcendental Principles of Elementalism, which deals with applications of pure element control.
I want to get to Vaisset’s research ASAP

>>3578320
>>3578291
Meh, scratch that. Über basics first.

>[ ] A Treatise on Conceptual-Material Ties, which seems to be a book about the way magic defines the world

>>3578291
>[ ] Transcendental Principles of Elementalism, which deals with applications of pure element control.
This will be relevant to us no matter given our connection to Void, and it will also help us understand Vaisset's research.

>>3578291
>[ ] A Treatise on Conceptual-Material Ties, which seems to be a book about the way magic defines the world.

>>3578330
Now that I think about it, even though we've gotten the basics about how magic works, we don't really know much about it's relation to the world overall. Changing >>3578332 to >>3578330

>>3578291
>[ ] A Treatise on Conceptual-Material Ties, which seems to be a book about the way magic defines the world

Point: I want to write an isekai quest in my original fantasy setting
Point: I also want to finish Alberich's story and write about what happens after the Tokyo Holy Grail War
Q:How can I reconcile these desires?
A: Maybe after the Grail War, Zelretch hits Alberich with a kaleido-truck to make him another world's problem.

Idle thoughts...

>>3578291
>[ ] Transcendental Principles of Elementalism, which deals with applications of pure element control.

Control thy power, then shape It as we see fit.

>>3578381
Maybe, but only after we see the other three Rushorou servant routes. I want to go full guerilla with the Shadow, hoping for Independent action and just eating people to survive, spying on servants and masters and pouncing on folks and disappearing Into the night.

I've noticed that no matter what type of servant we become, we should always have a few things to work with no matter what.

Kenotis. No matter what class, I can see Kenotis being a constant, or a nigh constant If It has slightly changed properties for another class. It fits any of our classes well and was with us before, so It likely always will be with us as a stylish recognizable constant, and a constant reminder of and connection to Circe.

Minds eye. The glove was also with us before, and Minds Eye would be an Important foundational tool to compliment any class.

Inhuman physiology. The Akeldama turns us Into conceptual mush. I'm still not 100% certain what this means for us, but those kind of energies are going to put In us regardless of servant class.

I know I really shouldn't be concerned with these far off things before this war has even truly begun, but I'm already hype for the next routes. I wonder how our goals will change If at all from playthrough to playthrough.

On a whim, you select a book titled A Treatise on Conceptual-Material Ties. Although you came here hoping to improve your combat abilities, this text catches your fancy by provoking your curiosity. Circe told you you had become a "conceptual being" back in the Akeldama, but you never really understood what that meant. Hopefully this book can enlighten you as to what conceptual really means in terms of magic. Although the book itself is full of confusing jargon, roundabout metaphor, accounts of tests and their results, and elaborate diagrams which are meaningless to you (they evidently refer to some other body of magical knowledge which you lack), you do manage to work out the essentials over the course of a few hours. What you learn is as follows:

Anything in the world can be divided into material and conceptual components. Something existing purely in nature is an exclusively material existence, with no concept relating to it. Once it is observed by a sentient being, however, it gains a conceptual nature pertaining to the definition applied to it. Moreover, different objects have a different proportion of material to conceptual existence. A naturally occuring stone, for example, is far less conceptual than a chair, which is created in accordance with a pre-existing concept. At the far material end of this spectrum would be an object that has never been observed or imagined, and thus has no conceptual existence; while at the far conceptual end of this spectrum are gods, spirits, and other beings which derive their existence from magic. Magic itself is entirely conceptual, and it is through the study of magic that the effect that concepts have on the world was discovered. Magic, after all, is the conceptual recreation of naturally occurring mysteries, and affects the world on a conceptual basis. It might be thought, then, that magic can only alter people's perceptions of the world around them. That this is not the case proves that concepts affect their material base, just as materials affect the concepts derived from them. One popular example of the alteration of material by concept is the use of Reinforcement magic, whereby an object is altered in accordance with its conceptual purpose, rather than its material nature. Another is the use of Transference magic to shift a conceptual property of one object to another.