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>>1784694

>>1784222
After more wandering, meandering, and dice rolling you the bus finally makes its way to some kind of heavy underground gates and bigger highways with more traffic. Several actually, before exiting into a vast underground cavern.

A sprawling industrial complex is seen before you, as Old World industrial spires and factories rise up from floor to roof. Railway bridges criss cross the ceiling around giant pillars of stone, concrete, and metal. The surrounding landscape is strewn with green glowing nuclear waste, and curious crystals growing among them, glowing green.

People, mutants, vehicles, and slaves move in and out of the underground city, along with entire train cars moving above.

It would seem you have arrived.

"Oi, normie. Welcome to Complex 80"

---

The Bus makes a stop at the gate and drops you off in front of the gate. A huge structure of concrete and steel, piled on generously with scrap and garbage tied and welded together to add bulk to it. You are greeted by several guards, one mutant and several humans plus a few ghouls. Big jury rigged weapons turrets hang above pointing down at you from the ceiling and the top of the wall, directly aimed at the tunnel entrance. You also spot a blind shaman on a chair, the old hag smoking a pipe and breathing out in circles of smoke.

The guards and soldiers appear to be from one of two groups. One appears like the fiends did in the Mojave, skulls and motor parts hung from their bodies and tatoos. The other almost looks like Tony Gam for some reason. Black leather jackets with a big 80s sign on the back, denim pants, thick beards, and sunglasses smoking cigars and with big pistols or SMG's on their side. You spot several motorcycles parked near on the otherside of the gate.

"Oi. Vincent Vincent told us you were coming.

Don't you cause no trouble or brother trouble is gonna come for you. Got it?"

---

Is there anything you wish to do before you enter?

>>1784764
Make them swear on their dark god to not harm our mind body or soul like the forecaster said, unless that was for when we meet a witch lady.

>>1784776
QM, please answer this.

Wait QM, do we have any boons remaining?

>>1784788
Just one more thread for another boon

>>1784764
Supporting. Do the thing he said not to harm our body or mind

>>1784775
This

>>1784775
>>1784790
>>1784819
Writing

"Before I enter I'd like to make a pact with the Great Elder One for my saftey."

The guards seem confused, but the old hag puts down her pipe and stares at you, before standing up.

"Haven't heard that in a long time. Yes, a long time. Sometimes the tribals try, but they don't have a choice."

The guards still look confused, but don't question it.

"I demand my safe passage in and out of this place, unmolested in body, soul or mind by the Great Elder One. In promise, I will not molest anyone here either by body, soul, or mind."

"Ah, a fair deal. A fair deal. What's your forfeit?"

"What?"

"Your forfeit dearie. We need a mortgage in case you do break your word."

"Will money work"

"We're no longer accepting cash dearier, so you'll have to offer us, either of Body, Soul or Mind. What's your forfeit? Flesh or bone, sanity or soul, thought or information."

>What say

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>>1784877
"And don't worry. So long as you do keep your word, we won't touch whatever you pledge. Ah ha ha ha."

>>1784883
"How about a nice shipment of Jet that I bought in? That affects the mind and body of who takes it."

>>1784888
>That affects the mind and body of who takes it."
Mind, body, and soul depending on who takes it.

Guess it's a good thing we brought these Jet samples?

>>1784888
Isn't that supposed to be a gift?

>>1784877
Will a hand do?
And what's your forfeit going to be?

>>1784888
"I told you, we have no need for material possessions. Even then our god provides us recipes for enlightenment more powerful than what you have in those syringes.

We know you. Do not ask a rich man to forfeit his money for honesty, for he will have much more where it came from.

Gold and goods the Great Elder One does not want or need. But a little bit of flesh is quite valuable. You could pledge us some of your flesh."

>>1784901
>And what's your forfeit going to be?
"A god cannot break his word, but were such a thing possible, he would offer you flesh and blood as a reward.

To some, it is a dearly departed one, or perhaps a loved one that is missing from you? I sense someone has been taken from you, yes."

>>1784902
Have my left hand

We're right handed? Right OP?

>>1784908
Your ambidextrous.

>>1784910
An appendix? That's flesh, and 1 of a kind.

>>1784902
We could actually regrow flesh unlike our mind and soul from what I know, so let's forfeit that.

The contractees also won't manipulate each other to have them break their contracts first?

>>1784908
We could offer our non-dominant hand without mentioning that part.
>>1784910
Neat. Let's give our left hand for simplicity.

>>1784912
What about our liver? I'd bet that's in high demand amongst the MLA.

>>1784913
"Very well. A hand. Do not think yourself so fortunate because you can grow it back. Others have tried!

I must also warn you, do not take that which belongs from our god. For he will repay you MUCH greater than what you stole. As a binding agreement will not take by theft nor barter nor force that which is marked for our god.

Under these terms we pledge your saftey."

>Accept
>No
>Other?

>>1784922
What if i'm given something marked by your god? Is this a I can't have it sort if deal, or a don't steal thing?

>>1784922
>Do not think yourself so fortunate because you can grow it back. Others have tried!
What happens if they try to regrow it back?

>that which is marked for our god.
What do the markings look like?

>>1784922
>>Other?
What sort of contracts have others made in the past for something like this?

>>1784926
>>1784928
"Niner has pledged to us that he will not trade off that which we have marked, and his men respect it. Should he or they break their bargain, it will be them that pay."

>>1784928
"They will be marked on their forehead or over their heart and chest."

>>1784933
Accept to the terms, and keep our hands to ourselves, I don't want to get meme on for taking things.

>>1784933
Okay. Sounds fair.

>>1784933
Oh. So people.
Is it possible to remove those markings, or are they permanently stuck with those?

Are we going to get a marking like that?

>>1784937
>We literally lose our hand because we couldn't keep our hands to ourselves.
It'd be a great meme if that happened.

>>1784937
>>1784940
2 for yes, just need one more.

The witch pulls out a blade and slices her hand, and offers it to you, clearly asking the same.

"Fear not, I have no diseases of the blood."

>>1784948
>"Fear not, I have no diseases of the blood."
Is that literally or figuratively speaking?

I'm fine with these current terms, can we request to change them later?

>>1784948
Can we cut our hand ourselves?

Also ask for a receipt need that proof on paper.

>>1784951
Ask for a receipt anon. We need that paperwork, I don't want to get meme out of a hand, because of no signing of paperwork

>>1784952
>Also ask for a receipt need that proof on paper.
And make it in red ink!

>>1784948
Can we talk to any of our companions from here? Like our Brain?

>>1784952
Coincidentally she as a piece of parchment as well.

>>1784956
How considerate of these dark god cultists.

We don't even have a dedicated town hall yet .

>>1784956
>>1784955
Neat. Let's write the contract and get our accessible companions to look over it.

>>1784960
>inb4 the MLA are more organized than us.

>>1784964
We can just read it ourselves.we don't have to drag other people into this.

>>1784967
>>1784964
Use that int 10 to read through it and use per 10 to look at small print

You slice your hand and shake hers, the blood of you both dropping onto the parchment which, a moment before was blank, writes out in simple terms in blood.

-You will not harm or be harmed of body soul or mind here
-You will not steal or barter or forcibly take for that that which is marked by the god, lest he take more from thee than you offered
-this contract grants you safe passage for the duration it is due, until the end of your journey here, and once you have left the MLA

they are eve nice enough to give you the receipt. They have no need of paper contracts, but mortals prefer it

>>1784975
>-You will not steal or barter or forcibly take for that that which is marked by the god, lest he take more from thee than you offered
Does this also extend to our stuff?

>>1784967
>We can just read it ourselves.
>read
Are you sure about that?

>>1784977
We can buy MLA stuff, but not dark god stuff. Kniwing them, they'll probably be rubbing that in our face by making us see our people who were taken as dark god slaves. We can't ask for them back or free them.

>>1784975
>marked by the god
They have a big X in the forehead and chest?

>>1784977
Alright anon now we need to not barter with anyone. Since they can have a X on their chest.

>>1784977
"Yes, but to our priest. If niners men thieve from you, then bring it up with niner or them.

I cannot sense you now, but when I did, I forsaw you tend to have no problems with pickpocketers. Are you not the greatest of them yourself? ha ha ha.

>>1784983
>>1784984
>Alright anon now we need to not barter with anyone. Since they can have a X on their chest.
>This was all according to their plan.

>>1784988
Shit, they're onto us! Abort! Abort!

>>1784989
>Tfw When Niner has a X on his chest. And giving him the Jet counts as barter

>>1784988
Are gifts given to marked ones, barter?

>>1784988
>I cannot sense you now, but when I did,
What makes now different from before? Shouldn't it even be easier now that we're right next to her?

>>1784999
She could feel the palm of our left hand. That's how they have a feel of you, and tell the future.

>Tfw Anons are extra worry about paperwork, after the NCR dick us over for not having patents

The city gates are open to you, and you smell the mix of human inhabitation, rust and nuclear waste, supermutant and ghouls, and diesel and gasoline fumes. The air is filled with the roar of vehicles and machines, and the cracking of whips and wails.

>Head directly to wherever Niner is
>Detour Let's go to (Slave Pit. Cultist Church. Garage. Bar and restaurant. Arms Shop. Barracks.)

>>1784997
>We decide to help some of the slaves around here, because we're a good guy like that.
>We give some gifts to a slave girl as charity.
>tfw the slave girl starts to cackle as she tears off her bloody rags on her forehead to reveal a red X.

>>1785001
>>Tfw Anons are extra worry about paperwork, after the NCR dick us over for not having patents
>In the distance, Oddball has the inexplicable urge to have a smug smirk.
>His inexplicable smug mood improves until he evilly laughs and sips his Salient Purple wine.

>>1785011
Go to niners.

>>1784997
>Are gifts given to marked ones, barter?
"You can give gifts. Just don't try to cheat like handing keys or a means to escape. We will know."

>>1785016
Are buying slaves at a fair price, and taking them with us, against the pact?

>>1785011
>Detour Let's go to Slave Pit.

>>1785011
>>Head directly to wherever Niner is
>>1785022
Maybe we can work out a deal without having to go buy them first.

>>1785022
"Like we said, buy what you will, but not that which is marked by our god.

You notice most of the slaves don't have a mark on their head and chest, so not all of them are marked.

>>1785022
Only cultist slaves i imagine. We can deal all we want with the MLA.

>>1785024
Will the marks be plainly visible, or are they allowed to cover them up?

>>1785026
"They are always visible. This is so others will know."

>>1785027
Alright
I'm the third vote to go see Niner.
I do want to set something up with the slave tho. We can talk with Niner about it.

>tfw niner asks if we should fuck his wife
>tfw told to by him
>tfw she is marked everywhere

>writing

>>1785029 - Late post of mine before I noticed the link to the new thread.


Also I think we need to accept that we can't beat any other faction in any real terms. We need to just focus on trading, expansion and researching, exploring and training everything we can for another decade. Then we can think about making our move.

>>1785049
>Also I think we need to accept that we can't beat any other faction in any real terms.
I refuse, i believe once we build the new Reactor we will snowball.

Quick question QM, what do we need for passive metal generation?

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>>1785054
Synthesis is a long ways off, but you can achieve passive metal scavenging from the divide.

>>1785054
>I refuse, i believe once we build the new Reactor we will snowball.
We really, really won't mate. I mean, I'm against wasting time on nuclear tech for now and I'd rather just focus on massive expansion and trying to get better tech from everywhere.

>Quick question QM, what do we need for passive metal generation?
Metal ores / salvage, a mining / salvaging facility, transport and a refinery / smelter.

>>1784975
>>1785027
Neat. Does the contract not work as well if we break it unintentionally?

>>1785054
>Quick question QM, what do we need for passive metal generation?
>>1785057
I don't think we will unless we do a Courier and adventure.

>>1785058
It works perfectly well if we break it unintentionally. As in we lose a hand.

>>1785064
Except I plan on doing a Courier and adventuring everywhere. Seeing as we are so insanely powerful and the rewards are so large.

>>1785054
>I refuse, i believe once we build the new Reactor we will snowball.
>>1785064
Meant to link that.

>>1785073
Personally I wonder why we haven't been doing it more often since that's how we get most of our work done.

>>1785073
Theres no real reason not to adventure and gather tech while homefront works on nuclear reactors. Best of both worlds.

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>>1785056
The Legion were Brutal. And cruel.

But they had order and discipline. They broke slaves to make them stronger, fit them in the heirarchy of their society.

These guys here are another story. As you pass by you see regular acts of cruelty and savagery for the sake of savagery.

Little vendors roast human cadavers on barbecues, hanging the meat alongside brahmin and gecko flesh as though it were no different. Advertisements for "Live barbecues" point towards the large bar and restaurant.

The air is rife with filth and smell. The Legion hung bodies as a warning and punishment to those who defied them. To the raiders and former tribals here, they make it a part of their decoration. Bones, skulls, ribcages, all hung as ornaments on person and buildings, bone laterns and skull lamps. No part of the human is wasted, and you see people regularly dressed in cloaks of human skin. You ask if they were from slaves who tried to escape.

"Sometimes. Escape is a good reason, but eh, sometimes its nice souvenir"

"Souvenir of what?"

"The torture pits of course! No better way to relax and have some good long fun. Get to try new things every time. Keep the skins as a nice reminder since the slaves usually don't make it.

We got some good holotapes too if that's your thing. Want some?"

You've never seen so many psychopaths in one place. This is more raiders than you've ever seen in your whole life actually.

>>1785058
You pretty much will only break if it you kidnap someone. Just don't steal someone.

>>1785078
Mostly the limit on how much we can do per turn I imagine.

>>1785080
I disagree over the utility of nuclear reactors without cold, mass or hot fusion technology ignoring more breeder reactors since they are self-sustaining reactions which are essentially perfect for our very long term focused civilisation. However solar power consumes few resources in it's simplest forms and can be mass produced and used everywhere without worry while also working well for long term focused shit. Still we can do both as is feasible since reactors will need lots of fissile so they'll be an occasional thing while solar can be a more immediate solution.


Also OP, how easily could we replicate solar panels / the shit for our solar plants using non-fissile replicators?

>>1785092
Sounds like a horrible place to raise a family

>>1785080
Based on what we discussed in the last thread, we should really go mass solar at this point. Less hassle and more power straight away. Since nuclear, right now, is way too much trouble for way too little gain. Spam solar and we get more energy faster.

>>1785095
Breeders only self sustain as long as someone is shovelling fertile materials in. So self sustaining in the same manner as coal generators.

>>1785057
Look, he just said that we can generate a (tiny) amount of Fissile each turn with a small breeder reactor >>1784822
Which takes about half a year(Half of that if we get that 2nd Construction action)
QM also said that we need less energy to replace the Fissile requirement in replicators compared to using energy to make Fissile >>1783952
With this we can logically assume a Small Breeder reactor can generate more than a tiny amount of metal (Most likely low)
With those Low metals per turn income we can begin building more breeder reactors or Solar towers which will give us more metals per turn and at some point we reach critical mass and begin pumping out robots constantly.

Do you see why i believe it's important to get the reactor?

>>1785092
>>>1785056
>The Legion were Brutal. And cruel.
I think you might've mislinked there.

>>1785106
>>1785095
The best route would be if we were able to secure a non-aggression treaty with the MLA while we then negotiated with the Legion in either diplomacy, gunboat diplomacy, or straight up grabbed Hoover Dam and other abandoned power generation facilities and started pumping shit out like no tomorrow.

Also I guess we're moving over that discussion to here now? It seems like it's starting to overlap.

>>1785092
Eh, seems par for the course with raiders and such. To be honest the "cannibalism" ain't all that bad and the torture pits just makes sense given sadists exist and shit.

The only thing that pisses me off is that their city isn't even fucking clean. I mean I understand they probably are all too high to give a damn but have some pride in your hellhole dammit.

>>1785100
Except we've not had to do that for the Big Mt one and even if that were accurate I'd point out we can get nuclear waste from the NCR fairly cheaply and sell them back a portion of the fissile material we refine from it.

>>1785106
Except the problem is how much fissile material we need to create the reactors and shit in the first place. The actual raw material cost of producing them and getting their reaction started.

>>1785116
The divide is full of fissile materials. We won't be wanting for a good while.

>>1785116
For myself whos been in and out of the last couple of threads (work)

Assuming we dont build the nuclear reactor, what would your ideal plan be for the next 5 turns?

>>1785116
>Except the problem is how much fissile material we need to create the reactors and shit in the first place.
When did that become a problem? Did QM post something about the reactor i missed?

>>1785112
>straight up grabbed Hoover Dam and other abandoned power generation facilities and started pumping shit out like no tomorrow.
Well there are a fair few vaults in the NV area with functioning nuclear reactors / geothermal generators. So if we secure the region we can easily generate a large amount of power by linking them together and repairing them.

>>1785124
True but we shouldn't assume it is a endless source, even at our scale. We must begin planning for our next operation to secure yet more resources. Personally I would advise continuing through the Divide to NV and then securing that region if possible while linking to the various vaults / bunkers and such in the region by tunnelling.

>>1785130
He stated awhile back something about how much we'd need to generate the fissile alone for a breeder reactor but I can't remember the details too precisely.


The main point is that we would need a fair bit of the shit to get even a single one up.

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>>1785092
The place is also incredibly diverse, there are humans, supermutants, ghouls, and lots of other humanoid mutant species you've never seen before. Leather jacketed 80s gangers, skull and bone wearing fiends, and people of different tribes.

You even see some Deathclaws walking among the crowd, and talking. Intelligent deathclaws, and you wonder about Best Friend and his clan how they are.

--

Niner's palace looms up ahead, a veritable factory made fortress, with scavenged guns and turrets and cannons of every make and design hanging from its balconies and windows. You walk past more guards and gates of soldiers.

Does anyone have the flag we made for our country?

>>1785143
>He stated awhile back something about how much we'd need to generate the fissile alone for a breeder reactor but I can't remember the details too precisely.
I'd like to see the exact post please if you could.

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>>1785148

>>1785143
>Well there are a fair few vaults in the NV area with functioning nuclear reactors / geothermal generators. So if we secure the region we can easily generate a large amount of power by linking them together and repairing them.
Right.
Known power generators in the Mojave to my memory: Hoover Dam, Helios One, Vaults, cities like Ghoul City, and other abandoned places. We could probably take the Gun Runners' generators too if we wanted, since they make energy weapons and stuff.

>>1785126
>Assuming we dont build the nuclear reactor, what would your ideal plan be for the next 5 turns?
I'm not him, but I could offer one for becoming active on the inter-factional stage, since I think we've gone too far on the American isolationist end to be doing as much as we could.

>>1785143
>He stated awhile back something about how much we'd need to generate the fissile alone for a breeder reactor but I can't remember the details too precisely.
>>1785149
>>1784822
The QM answered this as a bonus of my quantity comparison question so we'd have a basis to work with for construction plans.

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>>1785146


At last you come upon his great treasure room where stores the loot of his exploits. And boy is there a lot. Fancy weapons of every single make line the walls, including a few sets of Power Armor from the NCR, and even from the Brotherhood of Steel. There's even a new type of Power Armor you haven't seen before, clearly of Brotherhood make.

Stockpiles of Nuka Cola and foods, stuffed corpses of beasts and monsters, outfits of officers killed. Gallons upon Gallons of booze, beer, and wine.

Artworks, statues, swords, armor and artifacts clearly from museums in both the NCR and the Old World. Colorful silk and linen carpets, curtains, and clothing.

Tribal artifacts, god statues, and religious totems strewn around haphazardly.

Shiny knickknacks and bits and pieces of technology. NCR and Old World furniture and goodies.

And money. Bottlecaps, NCR dollars, Brotherhood of Steel Scrips, Old World Money, Legion Denarrii, and gold and jewelry galore.

A big NCR tank sits in the center of the room, along with a Broterhood of Steel motorbike, stolen modified and uparmed, his prize possession.

And thats only a small list of what this room is full of. You imagine its what you probably would have done had you decided to go on a raider spree across the wasteland.

And an evil looking statue watching over them all. An ugly thing that looks like an octopus or a hideously deformed wasteland monster, with a body of emerald and red jewels for eyes that almost seem to be glowing.

>>1785169
Posted too soon and derped. I'll repost without the extra paste.

>>1785171
">>1785157
>>1785029
>If we expand to Utah we could make use of the rivers there. Generating power from them as well as getting farming water would be a good idea.
Another anon mentioned this, so we could also make more water generators from the Utah or Mojave rivers. Possibly some stuff from Goodsprings, Newberry Springs, our underwater aquifers, and other secondary sources depending on what their water source is from.
Maybe we could make water generators integrated with nuclear generators to really combine the two aspects, like for Cold Fusion and as neato cheap coolant for the other reactors."

>>1785169
You do realize any power we generate in Utah would only be in Utah, right? We can't transfer it to Big Mt, si we would also need to build all the infrastructure to use the power.

>>1785174
You mean like power cables and stuff?
We could hook up replicators to them directly, or the power cables would be far easier than an entire new generator in our area.
Anyways, it wasn't just Utah, I mentioned some other stuff too.

>>1785157
That post doesn't detail anything about the Breeder reactor's fissile requirements.

>>1785177
Cables from Utah? We don't even have a stretch of land connecting us to Utah to build power lines on. Also at that point were using more resources than we would building some other power source in the mountain.

>>1785126

>>1785126
>Assuming we dont build the nuclear reactor, what would your ideal plan be for the next 5 turns?
1) Establish a basic presence in Utah: a fusion battery / generator, a alien battery and teleport pad. To be used to support the creation of actual (subterranean) colonies in the Utah region to support additional population, industry, power and so on without using our Scout ship for transport. This would then be followed by the establishing of a small scale presence. Roughly 50 people and basic but small scale industry. This would then be followed by deploying a flight of scout drones to map out the region, locate sources of salvage and then reprocess these Utah side to support further expansion. Creation of a prospecting robot would be advised at this point to locate mineral deposits for extraction using local assets for processing.

During this period efforts would have been made to move our Brahmin herds to Utah, freeing up additional food and water supplies in New Washington for people / new arrivals / additional farming and such along with creating an opportunity to transport massive amounts of Jet (refined from the, now unrestricted in their growth, herd) to the Utah city of the MLA for trade for slaves, metal and fissile material to then allow additional expansion of the Utah side population and colonies.

Longer term plans would then see us start mass military robot production and deploy them against the local legion settlements to gain access to additional lands without risking much as well as getting much needed brains.

2) Perform tech trading with the BOS and deploying a few robots to the destroyed BOS chapter in Texas in an attempt to establish a presence in the region while bringing back additional technological samples and PA from the region for study, use and salvage. This effort would be reinforced by attempting to establish contact with the FO 3 BOS, to gain access to the technical documentation they have salvaged from the Commonwealth as well as reinforce the in-character reasons to risk going there. Especially since they will send another expedition soon or already be there.

3) Constant efforts to salvage the Divide, refining the resources into construction robots and electrical generation. Along with small scale trading with the MLA potentially.

4) Attempts to create new drugs that enhance the user's combat abilities for sale to the MLA since they'd stabalise the NCR front, get us cash / resources and let us advance our knowledge of human-biochemstry and shit.

5) An additional colony / presence project. Depending on if we can get the FO 3 / 4 BOS to agree: sending the Courier and a few robots to the Commonwealth, appropriating industry (there are steel mills and factories we could use) to establish a presence. May not be feasible or advisable but would grant an additional site for expansion with large amounts of resources and minimal interference.

>>1785173
That'd be me. Thanks for reminding me.

>>1785188
That plan's flawed we should first build the reactor for metal gain then do all that stuff you wrote.

>>1785188
I could see that working. Im still hesitant to trade with the MLA, but otherwise it seems pretty straight forward

>>1785183
>Cables from Utah? We don't even have a stretch of land connecting us to Utah to build power lines on.
I don't have the map of our area so I wouldn't know. Doesn't mean we can't expand to that area.

>>1785183
>Also at that point were using more resources than we would building some other power source in the mountain.
Those were ideas, but the water generators in general are the 2nd most powerful option next to the nuclear ones, and presumably faster too.
>>1784683
All of our power options can be improved on, as Fallout Science efficiency was canonically shittier than meta Earth's science efficiency because they started out with more shit than us. Which is apparently why the Hoover Dam is still pretty powerful compared to our current nuclear reactors.

>>1785179
>>1783748
>>1782849
If you look at the thread, from what I can tell it just uses fissile materials to make more fissile materials. So any really, probably (tiny) for a decent amount then more is better.

>>1785194
That'd take a while, but it's still pretty good now that we have the Divide.

>>1785199
So long as we attach some strings and don't give anything important it shouldn't be too much of a problem.

>>1785211
>If you look at the thread, from what I can tell it just uses fissile materials to make more fissile materials. So any really, probably (tiny) for a decent amount then more is better.
Yea, just a tiny amount, not a problem at all like >>1785116 was saying.

>>1785211
>That'd take a while, but it's still pretty good now that we have the Divide.
I agree, which is why i first plan to finish the railway and get that second construction action.

>>1785230
Actually, we might be able to hook into any remaining power plants that are left over in the military bases for a power boost. The terminals still work, so they have power.

>>1785238
Huh?

>>1785230
What are we making a railway to? Are both our railways going to have the hexcrete foundations someone suggested?

>>1785238
>>1785255
He's talking about the abandoned military bases, like the ones with the fusion research plans and all the pre-War shit the NCR is salvaging. Depends on how close they are, though.

>>1785194
That is a waste of effort seeing as we wouldn't need as much power in New Washington once 50 people plus a complement of robots have left to Utah and most of our efforts would be redirected to Utah and such.

Also as I have stated so many times, no. A reactor takes a year assuming we only used one action but even if we invested all available labour into it it would still take too long for me.

>>1785199
The MLA are the only source of more population that isn't Legion loyalists, potential NCR spies or BOS human-supremacists. Plus we need the resources especially since setting up mining will take time and salvage is a fairly limited source.

>>1785211
>>1785225
That is the reactor's ability to produce more itself and I must point out that it can't make more fissile materials from nothing. Rather it can reprocess nuclear waste.

I was referring to a question that was proposed during one of the first threads when we got the Non-fissile replicator upgrade about how much power we'd need to produce the fissile to make a breeder reactor.

>>1785259
>What are we making a railway to? Are both our railways going to have the hexcrete foundations someone suggested?
The Divide and they do currently.

>He's talking about the abandoned military bases, like the ones with the fusion research plans and all the pre-War shit the NCR is salvaging. Depends on how close they are, though.
He is talking about the ones in the Divide.

>>1785267
Yes. The divide has a bunch if nuclear silos and other military infrastructure that still has power. Might as well use it.

>>1785263
The objective isn't for energy itself, it's for the energy that we can convert into metal that we can use.

>>1785272
Energy is energy. Take it from the divide or make it ourselves, we can use it all tgr same.

>>1785278
I agree.

>>1785267
>>1785271
Oh. The ones we were going to salvage for massive loot. Those, yeah.

Are we going to dismantle the nuclear stuff for power to then eventually make more military stuff instead of launching it at everyone?

>>1785263
>Rather it can reprocess nuclear waste.
>>1783748
>>1784683
Right. Which we can easily find in large amounts.

>>1783883
>>1785263
>Also as I have stated so many times, no. A reactor takes a year assuming we only used one action but even if we invested all available labour into it it would still take too long for me.
So about 10-15 turns to get all the reactor stuff for decent power generation if we just did it with the stuff we had. 5 if we just wanted to actively make tiny fissile materials each turn. He had the right idea but possibly the wrong order.
I'd say we expand our Solar Tower to tide over our needs for now, then divert the efforts we would have made for independently make the reactor and snatch up all the existing power infrastructure to then make our own power infrastructure.

>>1785278
>>1785281
I think he meant it so we could have our own power supply locally with fairly efficient results.

>>1785288
>So about 10-15 turns to get all the reactor stuff for decent power generation if we just did it with the stuff we had. 5 if we just wanted to actively make tiny fissile materials each turn.
You forget, the energy from the reactor can also be used to make metals, which is my reason for wanting to build it.

>>1785288
Well if we find any military reactors we can disassemble them and rebuild them if we want them closer to home. But we could also just build some maintenence drones, lay some cabling and get the power that way.

>>1785308
Yeah, which is the same thing in terms of time.

>>1785314
Either works.

>>1785317
>Yeah, which is the same thing in terms of time.
Well, actually it wasn't mentioned come to think of it.

>>1785056
>>1783883
>>1784822
Hey QM, for the same amount of power it'd take to make a (small) or (large) Breeder reactor for (tiny) or greater Fissile materials, how much could the power from those same Breeder reactors be used to convert really base shit like rocks, dirt, gravel, and sand into metal?
If it's too small, how big of a power generator would we need for (tiny) metal generation?

>>1785288
Eh we'll play it by ear but the main point is that I want to focus on expansion, exploration and trade / development over building tall here in New Washington.


Especially since the NCR continues to expand, yet they won't contest our claims to land. So grabbing it before they reach it is a important goal.

>>1785327
>Eh we'll play it by ear but the main point is that I want to focus on expansion, exploration and trade / development over building tall here in New Washington.
Yeah. Which is what I meant. We still need a Solar Tower at least to fulfill our local needs while we snatch up the foreign power generators.

>>1785327
>Especially since the NCR continues to expand, yet they won't contest our claims to land. So grabbing it before they reach it is a important goal.
Are we going to pull an Italy?

>>1785263
>The MLA are the only source of more population that isn't Legion loyalists, potential NCR spies or BOS human-supremacists. Plus we need the resources especially since setting up mining will take time and salvage is a fairly limited source.
So instead we take druggie/cannibal/cultist people? Nice try.

>>1785211
>All of our power options can be improved on, as Fallout Science efficiency was canonically shittier than meta Earth's science efficiency because they started out with more shit than us. Which is apparently why the Hoover Dam is still pretty powerful compared to our current nuclear reactors.
This is the worst excuse ever. This is something QM said and something that makes no goddam sense. If you invest in power production, you want to have better performance for your material. Especially seeing the price of gas in pre-war times (literally thousands of dollars per gallon) and the fact that the need for resources was the reason it all went to hell in a handbasket. That they are not as efficient as ours at 2017, fine, maybe I can believe that. That they are shit-tier compared to hydro in 2077? No way, hose. With the added need for weapons-grade material and scarcity of nuclear fuel they would have optimized the system to hell and back. And I dont think abundance of materials was a thing, seeing as microfusion was there, just not quite large-scale yet (think Mass Fusion and the excited CEO of the company, as bad as F4 lore is).

>>1785331
From the forecaster's vision, it seems the NCR is not interested in finishing of the legion, probably keep the enemy around for propoganda purposes. Which gives us time to handle internal affairs and build up so we can take territory.

>>1785340
While the Bull, can't defeat the NCR, it's slowly being killed off. But it's going to take time for it to collapse. Like 10 years or so

>>1785347
NCR is prolonging it intenruonally. Bleeding the bull, but bot killing it. While they waste time on that we can build up so we can take our pounds of flesh.

>>1785336
>So instead we take druggie/cannibal/cultist people? Nice try.
If you actually read the post I was responding to and the post he was in turn responding to, you'd understand that entire exchange referred to trading Jet for slaves and metal.

>Are we going to pull an Italy?
Too small fry, we are talking the British empire in Africa levels of sprawling and shit.

>>1785336
>This is the worst excuse ever. This is something QM said and something that makes no goddam sense.
Going with what the QM said mate, that's just what the rules he set are for this universe.
>Especially seeing the price of gas in pre-war times (literally thousands of dollars per gallon) and the fact that the need for resources was the reason it all went to hell in a handbasket.
To be fair it ended up like that because the pre-War nations were being decadently wasteful dicks to each other.

>That they are not as efficient as ours at 2017, fine, maybe I can believe that. That they are shit-tier compared to hydro in 2077? No way, hose.
When did they decide to switch over to nuclear power is an important thing though, because they didn't really go for alternative power sources until it was too late. By then it might've fucked up any chances they had with doing things properly.

>No way, hose. With the added need for weapons-grade material and scarcity of nuclear fuel they would have optimized the system to hell and back.
Apparently from from this universe they just shoveled more nuclear fuel and other shit to make shit happen and hoped it'd work.
>And I dont think abundance of materials was a thing, seeing as microfusion was there, just not quite large-scale yet (think Mass Fusion and the excited CEO of the company, as bad as F4 lore is).
It was there, but not enough to sustain the world's needs and keep them from being paranoid dicks to each other. Remember that they had it but kept it secret or selective between each other and other bullshit because reasons.

To be honest the real thing that fucked everyone over was the unmarked nuclear missile that went off to my memory and caused pandemonium.

>>1785358
Eh. I'm of the opinion we should build tall, not wide. We just got some new resources, i say use them to improve the city we already have, rather than try to establish more elsewhere.

>>1785369
Building tall is good when you've not got a nice easy expansion right next door.

Plus, we can't really afford to build taller in our current lands for much longer so we must expand. Especially if we want to make use of conventional industry in some parts of our society.

>>1785389
Can't afford how? We have building material in hexacrete and metal, we have the labour. All we need to do is comit the time.

>>1785358
And I am saying that the slaves we get from the MLA are in no way better in quality. Seeing as they enslaved the Marked Men i bet there are many cannibal tribes, indebted junkies and disfavored cultists in the slave pens. And I dont know how you intend to filter them out. Not to mention that likely every slave is somehow mentally and physically scarred for life.

>>1785369
I agree. Although I see the point with Utah. Seems like the endgame is fast approaching, as every major power now has ungodly amounts of bonuses going for them (NCR literal Blitzkrieg they had to slow down because it was too effective, MLA living underground and having literal fortresses with mazes of tunnels you can only navigate with voodo magick, BoS going drone fleet on the MLA so they have to stay underground or get blown up instantly, and so on). So I would like to support a landgrab in Utah but I want to secure the Divide first. See if we cant safely loot all the nukes, reactors and whatever else we can. Not leaving those in the hands of the MLA. And also getting the power problem solved in the home front so we can print robots without worry.

I do agree we have to liberally spam the Courier at quests though. While we get royally shafted at infrastructure, the hero quests make up for it. Strange that, with all the might and mind of BigMT, a lunatic package delivery man is the best hope if you want to build a computer.

>>1785408
>Strange that, with all the might and mind of BigMT, a lunatic package delivery man is the best hope if you want to build a computer.
You have to understand, the Courier has the backing of meta voices from another universe that wasn't torn apart in nuclear fallout and mostly have common sense compared to everyone else pre-Quest.
Also apparently adventuring makes you godlike in all areas, maybe from the FEV and stuff.

>>1785394
We will struggle to support more population both in terms of water for their own consumption and more importantly in terms of farming.

>>1785408
I'd point out to you we have purchased a multitude of slaves from the MLA and they have done excellently well. You are creating issues where none exist.

>>1785362
>To be honest the real thing that fucked everyone over was the unmarked nuclear missile that went off to my memory and caused pandemonium.
Looking at the actual timeline, it wasn't unmarked, it's just that nobody confirmed who dun' did it first and everyone was a dickish paranoiac enough to launch nukes at first sight.

>>1785429
I don't think we connected to the river yet, nor finished the underground farms. There is still possible growth here. Then we can build up Newberry and Trona.

We bought 3 slaves from the MLA, and they have been unnoteworthy.

>>1785429
>>1785443
And the one slave we got from the Legion seems fine as well. The point is that MLA is not in any way special. I would argue going Legion would get us better brains to harvest, if we want citizens who are loyal yet useful, lets find the followers remnants who are supposedly somewhere out there.

>>1785443
>I don't think we connected to the river yet, nor finished the underground farms. There is still possible growth here. Then we can build up Newberry and Trona.
Yes there is but for all the effort it takes to do that we could expand far more in other places like Utah.

>We bought 3 slaves from the MLA, and they have been unnoteworthy.
Exactly. Not noteworthy. Not a fucking waste of time and money and drug addicted cultists like you'd implied that they would all be but rather just as productive as any of our other citizens with no more or less problems or needs that have been presented to us.

>>1785450
What about the BoS Mojave possible Remnants? We never bothered to check up on them.

>>1785455
We don't know where they are. They disappeared from their bunker.

back, just ate, writing

>>1785336
>So instead we take druggie/cannibal/cultist people? Nice try.
>>1785454
>Exactly. Not noteworthy. Not a fucking waste of time and money and drug addicted cultists like you'd implied that they would all be but rather just as productive as any of our other citizens with no more or less problems or needs that have been presented to us.
Wrong guy, m8.

>>1785458
Couldn't we well, ask the Midwest Brotherhood for what a fleeing Brotherhood chapter would do?

>>1785461
We sort of asked the mid west, but they didn't have any clue.

>>1785450
>The point is that MLA is not in any way special.
They are a nearby source of population and resources that won't strengthen the NCR and that isn't the Legion. To be frank that is special and trade with them works well with expanding into Utah.

>I would argue going Legion would get us better brains to harvest
What do you mean by "going Legion"? And I would point out that is a part of my plan.

>if we want citizens who are loyal yet useful, lets find the followers remnants who are supposedly somewhere out there.
Probably dead, in hiding or enslaved by the NCR. Waste of effort.

>>1785461
>Wrong guy, m8.
My mistake. Point still stands.

>>1785469
If they are in hiding we could offer them safety and they would come. So they aren't locked away from us forever.

>>1785469
>They are a nearby source of population and resources that won't strengthen the NCR and that isn't the Legion. To be frank that is special and trade with them works well with expanding into Utah.
True. Wouldn't it be more cost-effective and efficient to go the broadcasting immigration route though? Didn't we get like, 50 immigrants that one time we broadcasted of which I think 10-23 died from walking all the way here and through the Divide storms? Compared to the I think 6 slaves we bought from the MLA and Legion which seemed expensive.
We could make another broadcast, modify the abduction system to not kill them, then include some party-size transportation units like Trucker Tim's Truck and tell them to get the fuck inside it if they see it. We'll handle the immigration stuff once they find us.

>My mistake. Point still stands.
>>1785443
>>1785450
Yeah. It was still the same thing the actual guy said.

>>1785477
Build some drones to watch for refugees at the border, drive the party bus out to pick them up if they are spotted.

>>1785475
>>1785477
Both valid points. Also I dont think QM would have mentioned them if it was a dead end. And the abduction way of getting citizens was outlined earlier. Get the same systems that abduct people grab them from the desert and bring them to a secure location where we determine if they are a spy/hazard or not. If clear, they join an outpost, for starters. If no good, we pick the brain and make a new TACT bot.

>>1785488
>>1785489
Yeah, those were stuff some other anons mentioned earlier that I forgot to accredit.

Some anons and the QM also discussed having passive administration done by people while will manage it for us and give us some bonuses when we aren't doing it ourselves. We should start organizing that with our companions and special people and stuff. Maybe get Trucker Tim's input on how to manage transportation and logistics.

>>1785459
QM, would this >>1785489 be doable without a dedicated action turn spent? Have the program altered slightly so it doesnt immediately debrain, just transport. Have SPI/Bond supervise and improve along the way.

>>1785475
That'd take resources and time we don't have to get a few dozen people at most. Especially given we would need to send people into the NCR to find them which we would struggle to do since the NCR haven't found them either.

>>1785477
>True. Wouldn't it be more cost-effective and efficient to go the broadcasting immigration route though?
True but we can do both seeing as Jet is effectively a byproduct of an industry which we would struggle to use otherwise.

>Didn't we get like, 50 immigrants that one time we broadcasted
Correct

>of which I think 10-23 died from walking all the way here and through the Divide storms?
They died of the heat, the wildlife and other such general hazards. Not Divide storms.

I did suggest creating a road to a NCR town and having a monthly bus / truck go and pick up anyone who wants to join us.

>Compared to the I think 6 slaves we bought from the MLA and Legion which seemed expensive.
We got that few slaves because those were the only well educated slaves that MLA slaver had on offer (we've specifically asked for more and he has started looking for us, we should check in) and the Legion didn't allow us to more than two and the rest weren't that useful.

File: slide_312040_2780551_free.jpg (80 KB, 789x791)

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At the end of the treasure room is an archway from which spills forth a colorful cloud of thick, colorful smoke and music.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZCkHanF4v1w

The cloud seems to have a movement of its own, dancing and billowing upward, as though it were alive. There are leaves floating atop them, real green and colorful leaves lifted up by the breeze, and the whole room is illuminated with a writhing glow like a cave of water with a lamp thrown at the bottom. Even from this distance you sense an intoxicating smell, almost sickly sweet, like burnt spices. Your skin tingles in a good, exciting way that wants you to rush headlong into it, while remain exactly where you are, as your heart dances to the beat.

The familiar twinge of the electric guitar music, made soft and mellow and the voice of singing and drums echos from the cavern of lights and colors.

---

Do you want to put on your gas mask before you enter?

>>1785511
>Do you want to put on your gas mask before you enter?
If we don't, do we get to bang women?

>>1785511
Put on our best armor against gas/rad, since I think it can go through the skin

>>1785513
This. We should've brought our hazard armour.

>>1785511
yes

>>1785511
>>1785513
Armor up.

>>1785512
>>1785513
More seriously, yeah. First thing we do is get as much protection as possible just in case.

>>1784694
>>1777743
>>>>>>A. Scavenge (for what)
>>>>>>B. Try to improve (which) base
>>>>>>C. Try to improve weapons (where).
>>>>>>D. Research technology.
>>>>>>E. Explore in a direction/something.
>>>>>>F. Scavenge for raw materials (where/what)
>>>>>>G. Your choice/Write in
>>>>>>Turn: 113
Hey QM, you may want to revise the turn prompt suggestions into the number and types of actions we have available. I think that'd save on more space and be more helpful for future turn orders. Especially since we've outpaced the original 2-3 actions per turn.

>>1785505
The followers can smuggle themselves to us. Once at the border they are ours.

And we get a few dozen more trained scientists, which is always good.

File: 8486.jpg (176 KB, 800x482)

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>>1785512
You don't know if you invented it, but you're pretty sure you've perfected the 'Power Armored Smash'

>>1785513
>>1785520
>>1785521
You suit up, for a non caustic gas, a good old fashioned radsuit will work.

You find yourself in some kind of big pleasure den. The floor is covered in pillow, plushes, and mattresses. Slave women of every skin color and raider officers both human and non-human lie in recline, or furiously engaged in coitus, as a band plays to the side idly. Some familiar faces meet your eyes, 'Vincent-Vincent,' 'Motherfucker' the Super Mutant, Cook-Cook the Fiend, and others too. All seem to pay you no attention and are focused on whatever it is they are doing, if they are doing anything.

The center of the room is a great incense pit before a golden statue of that ugly thing again, where bubbles a mix of glowing chemicals with little crystals that shine like stars and rainbows. You swear you see the ruby eyes of the statue glowing again.

The floor is littered with used rubbers, syringes, bottles and trash which is being picked up and scooped by slaves wearing masks.

At the very end of this room, on a throne of skulls, guns, and gold. There is also what looks like two doghouses to the side, but big and with thick steaks in front of them. Must be some huge dogs

Sitting on the is a man. Women in the nude lie sleeping or mewling at his feet, and you recognize two of them as Cyan the Raider, Mellissa the Great Khan.

The man, like the rest of the human raiders in the room, is beefed up to hell and back, like the supersoldiers you and the NCR deploy. Only he's built far above them. He's almost size of Marcus now, only without the ugly deformation. A thick beard and mustache covers his face, in the style of the 80s, and wears a Yao-Gui pelt on his back. NCR and Brotherhood of Steel Medals line his chest, and a skull with an NCR Ranger Cap is his codpiece.

You're trying to recognize who the man is, and apparently, he is trying to recognize who you are..

>Man on the Throne
"Oi. You some kind of new slave? What the fuck are you staring at?"

>You
[Are you Niner?]

>Man on Throne
"That's WARLORD Niner to you. Fuck you're some dumb as slave. You better be a pretty bitch underneath that or I'll give you to the cult.

>You
[You don't recognize me?]

>Man on Throne
"Hang on a twitch. That voice, so familiar.

Who the hell are you?"

>You
[It's me. Courier Six.]

>>1785580
>"Hang on a twitch. That voice, so familiar.
>[It's me. Courier Six.]
Curious, what does our voice sound like? Does everyone hear a bracket of sorts with our speech, or is that for style?

>>1785568
This. It's not as useful anymore.

>>1785571
The problem is that they aren't going to abandon their cover to come to us for the most part and that'd require we got the information to them somehow. Seriously it's not like they are in radio range.

File: ncx4ihh.jpg (185 KB, 1024x768)

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>>1785611
Your voice is muffled by the gas mask, also of course you speak in Brackets. Even the Forecaster knows it.

>>1785580
>You don't know if you invented it, but you're pretty sure you've perfected the 'Power Armored Smash'

>>1785616
>[Desire to learn more intensifies.]

>>1785580
>Niner
"Six?

. . .wait.

Fucking Six? Is that you?

Well that's a fret. Shit man, I haven't seen you since we left the goddamn Mojave two lifetimes ago.

Cyan, Mellisa, look Six is here!"

He nudges them with his foot, but they do nothing.

"Oh don't mind them, they're just wrecked. Little too much fun for the girls sometimes. Ain't got the stamina that 'Bitch' has over there. Now she's a real animal.

I'm dragging. Six, my fucking man, what are you doing here? Aw this is great, I gotta host a feast or something we need to catch up."

>What say?

>>1785638
Buisness first. Here's some jet. Its a gift.

Now take your people out of the Divide.

>>1785646
Supporting this. The Divide is our territory.

>>1785638
"Nice to see you man but I'm here on business."


>>1785646
>>1785647
Don't be idiots. That'll fuck this shit up and doesn't even benefit us.

>>1785646
I also support this

>>1785652
Support. We come bearing gifts because Niner's a cool guy and all.
Also ask what that gas is.

>>1785646
"Oi, what. . .OH.

You mean our operations there? Man, you have any idea how long and how many slaves it took to dig a tunnel right underneath the divide?

When I heard you was there and fighting the Marked Men I asked my witch to do you a favor and give it to you. Though we could share the divide. You get the top and all the resources and goods, I use the bottom to mass my dudes for a big mechanized attack just like the NCR.

We're allied against the NCR right? I mean, last I remember you hated their guts."

>>1785664
>You mean our operations there?
"Yes."
>Man, you have any idea how long and how many slaves it took to dig a tunnel right underneath the divide?
"We have an idea. It's pretty annoying when we tried. How'd you manage?"

>When I heard you was there and fighting the Marked Men I asked my witch to do you a favor and give it to you.
"Thanks for trying to do us a solid. What'd she say?"

>Though we could share the divide. You get the top and all the resources and goods, I use the bottom to mass my dudes for a big mechanized attack just like the NCR.
>You get the top and all the resources and goods, I use the bottom to mass my dudes for a big mechanized attack just like the NCR.
"So you're saying that we get the top, you get the bottom?"
"More seriously, we'd like to consider that, but first we have to make sure doing so won't interfere with our operations in case the NCR comes knocking."

>We're allied against the NCR right? I mean, last I remember you hated their guts."
"We'd be allied against a lot of people, like the NCR, but we'd rather not have to deal with them on our asses. So we're more like contracted mercenaries anytime we're not fighting alone."
"Sorry about any earlier fights our forces might've gotten into. We were contracted without knowing who you were or what we were fighting at the time, or told much of anything really. Turns out that sort of bullshit sucks."

>>1785664
Thr marked men were losing, and you decided they were worth more as sacrifices than dieing at my hands. It wasn't a favour from you to me.

I dislike the NCR, but i also don't want to bring them down upon my people, so if your attacking the NCR, do it somewhere that usn't my land.

>>1785664
"Look so long as your guys don't touch any of the salvage or pre-war bases in the region I guess you can keep your tunnels and shit.

I'd point out, by-the-by, that my people have designs for advanced tunnelling robots that could probably do the job of your slaves quicker, safer and cheaper. We could see about renting a few of these for out to you for materials and slaves but these are things to consider later.


For now I am here to offer an immediate trade of high quality Jet and potentially other drugs or other shit depending on what you can offer and how easily we can set up production.


As to being allied against the NCR, currently my people and the NCR ain't at war but that has more to do with them being so god damn terrifyingly well armed and shit than any sorts of warm feelings towards them. So we are standing on the side lines and it is terrifying to watch them fuck the Legion up the ass.


Still if you want you could come visit sometime, we can have some good fun with some of our prototype weapons and I can have you meet my children and shit. Plus a pre-war ghoul singer and a few AI's."

>>1785703
I like everything here except for saying that we've fought against him.

"They're big and scary so we're at peace with them for now, but we hate them too."

>>1785703
>"Sorry about any earlier fights our forces might've gotten into. We were contracted without knowing who you were or what we were fighting at the time, or told much of anything really. Turns out that sort of bullshit sucks."
>>1785718
Yeah. I was thinking of leaving that out until he mentions it. So let's exclude that for now and use that as our response.

>>1785703
So supporting everything up to the question about being allied to the NCR.
Supporting >>1785717 too.

>>1785703
Ill support the first three.

>>1785717
Supporting this

>>1785703
Supporting this, but not the part about allied against the NCR bit

>>1785703
>>1785728
>>1785729
>>1785733
>>1785762
Reworking the last statement.
>>1785703
>We're allied against the NCR right? I mean, last I remember you hated their guts."
"Right now we're leaving everyone be so they leave us be until the situation changes. We don't like many of the factions around, but it's easier for us this way."
"So we'd be contractors anytime we decide to involve ourselves elsewhere. You might be able to contract us, depending on the circumstances. We offer some sweet services."

"What's your stance on the Legion and other factions?"
"If you've seen our stuff or people before, what do you think of them?"

>>1785717
If we're going to betray the MLA eventually, why would we let them establish a base within spitting distance. Of our capital? Thats just strategically dumb.

>>1785703
>"We have an idea. It's pretty annoying when we tried. How'd you manage?"
The Cult Helped. See, you had always told me about these tunneler things right? Little nasty monsters but good at digging. Well, the Cult send over some of their Beastmasters there and what do you know it there were also Ghouls too! They had been fighting someone off and needed a hand, so they we made a deal. They helped us we help them. They guided the beast wizes and helped em capture a queen. So now we got a whole flock of tunnelers to help with the digging. Just gotta feed em. Brahmin and gecko works, human is better. Then it was just getting enough slaves and a rig up a couple of digging machines from some smashed Brotherhood and NCR bits and voila! A nice big tunnel. Course a couple hundred slaves died but eh, we recycled them."

>"So you're saying that we get the top, you get the bottom?"
"Hah. There's the six I remember. You still into pretty babes right? I got plenty right here. I'm sure you remember Mellisa and Cyan, but you ain't seen nothing till you met 'Bitch'. She's my pet on loan from the cult."

>"More seriously, we'd like to consider that, but first we have to make sure doing so won't interfere with our operations in case the NCR comes knocking."
"Hah. NCR don't even know we're there I bet. Even if they do, what are they gonna do eh? They've avoided the Divide like a plague. We're gonna build a big enough army, wait for a clear enough day, and march right out of there to fuck them in the ass!"

>"We'd be allied against a lot of people, like the NCR, but we'd rather not have to deal with them on our asses. So we're more like contracted mercenaries anytime we're not fighting alone."
"Whatever you say mate. We're trying to be all quiet about this thing too. Can't have the NCR figure out we're doing this. Got the witches to help."

>"Sorry about any earlier fights our forces might've gotten into."
"Hah You know that wasn't even me. Boy, Warlord Bishop is going to be mad as hell when they figured out my bud Six was the creator of those robots that fucked him up at Flooded City.

Don't worry about it mate. It's all water under the bridge now, ha!

Robots eh? Well, I suppose that makes sense, you did leave with House's whole bloody army. Now that was some serious looting skill.

Could really use you on the Eastern Front against the brotherhood. Wait till they get a load of machines to fight their own!"

>>1785768
I can dig it.

>>1785789
They avoid the divide because its worthless. If the MLA operates from the divide it becomes strategically worthwhile to kick them out. Do you anons see how this gets us in hot water with the NCR? We're letting rats infest our home so they can infest our neighbour.
This is terrible deal.

>>1785768
>>1785790
>>1785789
RIP.
fack. On the bright side, now we know the MLA isn't as unified as we might've thought.

>>1785772
Ignoring the fact that we can't displace them even if we wanted to, it's better to have a vague knowledge of the end of their tunnel network in the region being there since that is where they surface from so we can fuck them all the harder by destroying it later.

Also I'd point out that our capital is still a fair distance away, more than a days travel I believe. Given a few layers of defences or our army (now or when we expand it) fighting them? They'd be fucked to get close.


Also this weakens the NCR which works fine by me since the MLA ain't going to try and hold land without reason so we can sweep in afterwards and secure the ransacked settlements and such for ourselves. If the NCR question it we explain that we secured them from the MLA or something.

>>1785717
>"Look so long as your guys don't touch any of the salvage or pre-war bases in the region I guess you can keep your tunnels and shit."
"Deal. You take it. I don't wanna touch that shit. Could explode at any moment or release some nasty robots. Got enough of that with the damn Brotherhood."

>I'd point out, by-the-by, that my people have designs for advanced tunnelling robots that could probably do the job of your slaves quicker, safer and cheaper.
>We could see about renting a few of these for out to you for materials and slaves but these are things to consider later.
>For now I am here to offer an immediate trade of high quality Jet and potentially other drugs or other shit depending on what you can offer and how easily we can set up production.
"Shit man, it must be my lucky day. Course we have some slaves to trade for machines and good shit.

But I tell you Jet is old school. The Cult can brew up some real fucking good ass shit. Would love to see you put that big tree growing brain of yours with them together."

>As to being allied against the NCR, currently my people and the NCR ain't at war but that has more to do with them being so god damn terrifyingly well armed and shit than any sorts of warm feelings towards them. So we are standing on the side lines and it is terrifying to watch them fuck the Legion up the ass.
"Ain't it? See, that's what we do all our shit underground. Can't bomb us down here! And we can make it real painful for em in our tunnels what with the cult helping us.

We try to do our part. Hit em from the side, pull away before they can bomb us. Gotta do it like clockwork cause the moment they know where you are the bombers start flying."

>Still if you want you could come visit sometime, we can have some good fun with some of our prototype weapons and I can have you meet my children and shit.
>Plus a pre-war ghoul singer and a few AI's
"Aw that's great! When I'm not busy I gotta go there. You don't mind if I bring along a few of the old gang and some of the new right? I'll even bring the food and booze.

Got some little Six's running around eh? Heh, maybe I bring some of my kids too. Cyan and Mellissa gave me sons each, and I got one growing in Bitch's belly too."

>>1785772
>>1785789
>>1785810
From what it looks like, the MLA is going to try pulling a NCR and pull a massive counteroffensive.
So until that point happens, the NCR won't be able to detect them, or if they would they'd probably have done something while we were busy fighting at the Divide.

I think we should allow them to build up forces around here, so long as they don't directly launch forces from where we're at.
>>1785816
>>1785818
>>1785789
We should have them inform us and have discussions about the MLA network underneath the Divide and when they try launching offensives from it and stuffc.

>>1785818
>"Aw that's great! When I'm not busy I gotta go there. You don't mind if I bring along a few of the old gang and some of the new right? I'll even bring the food and booze.
>Got some little Six's running around eh? Heh, maybe I bring some of my kids too. Cyan and Mellissa gave me sons each, and I got one growing in Bitch's belly too."
I feel like this might become tragic.

>>1785816
Yeah, but tunnels to the NCR go west, pass the capital. When we finally try to put down the MLA, they would be in a perfect place to attack us.

Were bitching out and you guys are arguing "it hurts the NCR" despite the fact it will hurt us even more.

>>1785810
>They avoid the divide because its worthless.
More so because it is a irradiated hellhole that they'd struggle to explore, let alone fight or have a siege in.

>If the MLA operates from the divide it becomes strategically worthwhile to kick them out.
It can be worthwhile all they like but they still need a way of doing it which they lack.

>Do you anons see how this gets us in hot water with the NCR?
Not really. Seeing as they have no reason to think we'd work with the MLA.

>We're letting rats infest our home so they can infest our neighbour.
That is a terrible metaphor.

>>1785810
I'm aware. Its a shit Situation.

gonna brb in a few hours, will try to continue dialoge on my phone, keep talknig as long as you need to

>>1785826
>>We're letting rats infest our home so they can infest our neighbour.
>That is a terrible metaphor.
REMOVE RATS FROM OUR SHITTY NEIGHBORS!

>>1785826
Yeah,. because letting the MLA build up in our territory can't possibly go wrong.

>>1785823
Agreed.

Potential solution: region we are in experiences minor seismic activity on a "regular" basis which could most likely be detected. Seismic sensors could be used to detect presence of tunnels or caverns within certain regions, thanks to the effect is has on the waves as they travel through the earth. Would allow for certainty of the size of their networks but would take time to gather data and computing power similar to a radar array to process it.

>>1785824
>Yeah, but tunnels to the NCR go west, pass the capital.
Except there are no tunnels to the west, only towards their land as far as we know and that would be towards Utah most likely: to the north-east roughly.

>When we finally try to put down the MLA, they would be in a perfect place to attack us.
So we position our assets to eliminate the tunnels before that can occur by collapsing them or flooding them with poisonous gas or water or something. Not exactly hard

>Were bitching out and you guys are arguing "it hurts the NCR" despite the fact it will hurt us even more.
Only if we are unprepared when we declare war and I'd point out it only hurts us because you plan on betraying the MLA rather than maintaining neutrality long term and allowing them to die to the BOS or to internal struggles while we expand.

>>1785849
They're all under one banner of the dark god. They are not going to fall to internal struggles.

The brotherhood doesn't seem to be winning, especially since we're helping them attack the NCR. And they will build up tunnels to go west. Why would they not build more tunnels.

>>1785830
I'm confused as to what you mean by this post.

>>1785835
Never said that but I would point out that more or less everything could go wrong or backfire. This is just you redirecting discussion rather than providing a counter to my arguments. Even then I must point out that the chances of this resulting in major damage long term is incredibly unlikely. Seeing as we have many different ideas as to how to deal with subterranean enemies and could smuggle a nuke into their tunnels or underground to collapse them if those fail.

Plus your plan of getting them to leave essentially revolves around asking them to and I fail to see that working which leaves only military force which results in our death.

>>1785876
>They're all under one banner of the dark god. They are not going to fall to internal struggles.
Kind of. We should ask them that. It's not like a dark god doesn't allow strife between his dark disciples.

>>1785849
>Potential solution: region we are in experiences minor seismic activity on a "regular" basis which could most likely be detected. Seismic sensors could be used to detect presence of tunnels or caverns within certain regions, thanks to the effect is has on the waves as they travel through the earth. Would allow for certainty of the size of their networks but would take time to gather data and computing power similar to a radar array to process it.
I remember some anons briefly discussing this, this'd be a clever way to resolve the tunnels issue. We should get on that.

>>1785890
>I'm confused as to what you mean by this post.
I was joking to continue the metaphor. Maybe I should've spoilered it instead.

>>1785876
>They're all under one banner of the dark god. They are not going to fall to internal struggles.
Yet Niner doesn't get angry at us killing the followers / warriors of another Warlord.

>The brotherhood doesn't seem to be winning
They are constantly gaining is my understanding which is why the MLA is pushing into the NCR: the salvage, slaves and space allows them to hold the line against the BOS while also putting valuable ground between them and robotic death.

>especially since we're helping them attack the NCR.
Less so helping, more so not interfering.

>And they will build up tunnels to go west. Why would they not build more tunnels.
That is a different point entirely and could be resolved by requiring they keep their tunnels out from under our actual lands. Maybe explaining we need that space for our own shit.

>>1785890
Ask them to leave, and if they don't fight them. Remove them before they become too big to handle.

Will all the new tech they have you think they can't mitigate the Divide's weather? We did.

Again, they have all sorts of fancy tech. THey surely have a solution to MLA tunnel networks.

MLA is in our territory. We're either complacent, or incompetent, both means they would put their fist down.

>>1785901
Doesn't mean they would turn on each other. Especially as the Dark God gets their loyalty more and more.

The Brotherhood is causing problems, but not wrecking face any more than the NCR. They're just focusing on other things.

We're quartering them in our territory. That's helping.

They would get as close as they can. They would position themselves advantageously.

>>1785896
>I was joking to continue the metaphor. Maybe I should've spoilered it instead.
Nah I'm just tired as shit.

>>1785902
>Ask them to leave, and if they don't fight them.
They won't and we'd lose.

>Remove them before they become too big to handle.
Don't know if anyone has told you this yet but too fucking late to stop this shit. The MLA is set up, has troops in the region and ain't moving.

>Again, they have all sorts of fancy tech. THey surely have a solution to MLA tunnel networks.
If they did then the MLA wouldn't still be relying on them to survive now would they?

>MLA is in our territory. We're either complacent, or incompetent, both means they would put their fist down.
As I have said so many times: it ain't our land, they can't do shit regarding the Divide (and don't know what we can do there either so for all they know we can't either, ergo we can't stop the MLA) and even if they could, they'd be busy dealing with the MLA's raids and shit.

>>1785908
>Doesn't mean they would turn on each other. Especially as the Dark God gets their loyalty more and more.
Raiders are raiders. They'll do as raiders do. Also you are making assumptions just as much as I am.

>The Brotherhood is causing problems, but not wrecking face any more than the NCR. They're just focusing on other things.
Which means that if the BOS actually focused, they would win the war far quicker but they have greater concerns. So they will in due time.

>We're quartering them in our territory. That's helping.
No, it's not our land and we couldn't beat them back even if we wanted to.

>They would get as close as they can.
Then claim a border further away numb-nuts.

>They would position themselves advantageously.
Then expect them to do that and work under that assumption.

>>1785925
You keep saying the Divide isn't our land, but as far as the NCR is concerned from the border treaty we signed it is. We are responsible for anything and everything inside of it. Including the MLA.

If they use the Divide as a spring board to attack the NCR it will draw them to us. Not the Divide, Us. They may not have the tech to attack the divide safely, but they sure as shit do to attack us in Big MT.

>>1785925
We would lose harder if we let them build up more.

We were just fighting against the marked men, we can take whatever they currently have in the region and push them out.

Better than frontal assaults. Just because it can be mitigated doesn't mean it isn't the best option.

We claimed the DIvide, and they respect that because they have no reason not to. If the MLA operates there, then the NCR will come for it. You think dealing with the raids means not going at the rading base camp? You want the NCR to find the Nukes?

I'm assuming the dark god would keep everyone in line pretty much. Not large scale civil wars, just personal conflicts

BOS has no other enemies. they are completely focused on the MLA

We claimed it, and we can beat them back.

Why let them build at all? numb-nuts

Ok first off:
- We recommend him someplace else to attack from somewhere that doesn't lead them back to us.
- We tell him about the NCR spy drones and as such stress the importance of staying underground. (we can have seismic detectors for future protection from underground attacks.)
- We ask him who Bitch is.
- Ask about how unified the MLA is.

>>1785908
Please understand that they are underground so we have plausible deniability. We can just claim that we were unaware. In fact I would say that the NCR would be further convinced of our innocence by the fact that we dealt them a huge blow at the city that we fought at.

>>1785944
Ignorance is no excuse for incompetence. If we can't keep our territory free of enemies of the NCR, they would do it for us.

>>1785960
I feel that they would see us as a liability more than a potential ally and work on Annexing us.

>>1785972
Exactly. Why are we giving them an excuse?

>>1785944
>- We recommend him someplace else to attack from somewhere that doesn't lead them back to us
"Divide seems like as good a place as ever. Right south if all the heaviest fighting. Legion won't attack us. Well smash the NCRs spearhead in between them and the Legion.

What do you suggest six?"

>>1785944
>- We tell him about the NCR spy drones and as such stress the importance of staying underground.
"Invisible spy drones.

Well that fucking explains it. Damn I knew they were spotting us somehow.

Hmmm, wonder if I could try and get some better radar vans. Maybe more AA trucks. Four barreled ones like the NCR uses. Yeah."

>>1786010
Head north and burn down the miracle forest that gives the NCR tge majority of their fuel for everything they do.

>>1786010
Do it under the main legion front While the NCR is fighting the Legion, You can pop up behind them and cut their supplies off, and have them overrun by the legion, while you fight inwards.

>>1785960
You have not answered any of my points. What we're trying to do here is to take advantage of the two wars to weaken both of them. The forces under this attack is our friend: Niner. We have plasible deniability against the NCR as well because of reasons stated.

>>1785972
>>1785981
I don't think so guys. The NCR views us as unbeatable as of yet because of what Oddball told them. It's why they had (or still have) spybots on us.

>>1786010
>>1786021
>>1786024
>>1786032
"Also we'd like to claim some land afterwards, we have some things in mind that might benefit both of us."

>>1786046
>I don't think so guys. The NCR views us as unbeatable as of yet because of what Oddball told them. It's why they had (or still have) spybots on us.
So Oddball technically did us a solid by being paranoid about us. Thanks, Oddball?

>>1786046
>I don't think so guys. The NCR views us as unbeatable as of yet because of what Oddball told them. It's why they had (or still have) spybots on us

This is just my opinion /assumption but i think its less thinking us unbeatable, and more of not opening a third front conflict

But if MLA attacks from our territory they may not feel like they have a choice.

>>1785944
>- Ask about how unified the MLA is.
"Bout as unified as a bunch of Raiders, Ideologists, Supermutants, and Death claws can get.

Yeah sometimes we get into scraps but what bandit doesnt. But we all know what happens if we let that get in the way of kicking ass of our real enemies.

Its death camps to the east and death camps to the west. Least the Legion have gotten off our backs.

We might scrap ver resources, the best slaves, or because I don't like their face, but when it comes to the Cause we get together.

Not the least cause we all gotta pay respect to the Cult, without them we'd all be dead."

>>1786046
Which points? Playing ignorant?
That won't work because the NCR won't care.

They got a good look at our capabilities. We lack industry. The NCR doesn't see us as unbeatable, but as a neutral power that share enemies. They watch us because that's just standard foreign policy.

It's not that they can't beat us, but that it isn't worth it. Letting the MLA operate in our lands makes annexation more worth it.

>>1786067
So basically, as long as they fight other people, they won't fracture.
Basically a unified front. Why are we helping these assholes?

>>1786067
>Not the least cause we all gotta pay respect to the Cult, without them we'd all be dead."
"Did you guys sell your soul to them, like the Marked Men did?"
"How tough is the war for you?"

>Its death camps to the east and death camps to the west. Least the Legion have gotten off our backs.
"We might be able to offer you refugee in that case, but we'd have to get some more resources to accommodate everyone before we do."
"How bad are your people, say if they tried working with normal people and stuff?"

>>1786084
They remind me of Orks.

>>1786091
And working with the orks never works out for anyone but the orks.

>>1786103
Not unless we can turn them from Orks into Orgyns.

>>1786066
We can say something like:
"We must pull all of our forces back and to defend ourselves from the raider menace." if the NCR comes knocking.

>>1786091
No refugees. Don't do this.
Instead ask:
"Death camps? Are the NCR genociding mutants or something?"

>>1786112
How will that stop the NCR from marching on the Divide and setting up shop there?

And the NCR probably genocides mutant raider rapist murderers. Which is a fair action.

>>1786112
Also, I image the lack of being raided. At all. Would warrant suspicion. If the MLA is getting past our forces to attack the NCR, why are they not attacking us?

>>1785938
>You keep saying the Divide isn't our land, but as far as the NCR is concerned from the border treaty we signed it is.
Except as far as they know we don't do anything in there. Ergo, it is our land in name only and thus they can't blame us.

>We are responsible for anything and everything inside of it. Including the MLA.
Again, not really seeing as we couldn't stop the MLA even if we wanted to.

>>1785939
>We would lose harder if we let them build up more.
They aren't going to be building up more here seeing as they're already well established but we will be you fool.

>We were just fighting against the marked men, we can take whatever they currently have in the region and push them out.
You mean we can take an army of battle hardened, well equipped, dark god enhanced supermutant, ghoul and humans who have experience against robot armies, tanks and everything else under the sun? Who have fucking witches? We'd be fucked and lose the resources of the Divide and get pushed back mile by mile until death or having to join the NCR.

>Better than frontal assaults. Just because it can be mitigated doesn't mean it isn't the best option.
I don't see your point.

>We claimed the Divide, and they respect that because they have no reason not to.
And they'd be fools to suddenly disregard a sovereign nations borders. Seeing as the instant they do that we have no reason to regard theirs as well as it ruining relations and turning us against them.

>If the MLA operates there, then the NCR will come for it.
Assuming they have the resources to spare, the MLA doesn't push them further out, they figure out a way to fight in the Divide effectively and shit.

>You think dealing with the raids means not going at the raiding base camp?
When the raiding camp is underground in a fortified pre-war city in a region which is constantly irradiated and filled with dust storms that strip skin off of people? Aye. Seeing as they'd be fucked to fight in there and Divide storms would make creating a defensive line outside of the Divide difficult.

>You want the NCR to find the Nukes?
Now you are just making inflammatory statements in an attempt to make my position look shit. I'd point out that my immediate plan for those weapons is either to disassemble them and reuse the material or place them in storage for use against the MLA's tunnels as previously described.

>I'm assuming the dark god would keep everyone in line pretty much. Not large scale civil wars, just personal conflicts
Which can escalate to civil wars.

>BOS has no other enemies. they are completely focused on the MLA
I never said enemies, I said concerns. Could be as simple as getting a border with the D.C chapter taking priority over a perceived inevitable victory. Perhaps they're trying to fight something we don't know about or perhaps they're making better progress than we know.

>We claimed it, and we can beat them back.
We did and we can't.

>>1786134
>Except as far as they know we don't do anything in there. Ergo, it is our land in name only and thus they can't blame us.
Its our land. They can blame us, and they will.

>Again, not really seeing as we couldn't stop the MLA even if we wanted to.
As long as they are in our land, we are responsible for them.

I feel our military is strong enough to put up a fight, and i can see us winning. It wont be easy, but its doable.

I think at this point its doubtful well come to a compromise or an agreement for this topic.

>>1785944
>- We recommend him someplace else to attack from somewhere that doesn't lead them back to us.
Personally I'd just let them attack from the Divide and if the NCR asks we got pushed back if they ask.

>- We tell him about the NCR spy drones and as such stress the importance of staying underground. (we can have seismic detectors for future protection from underground attacks.)
Agreed.

>- Ask about how unified the MLA is.
Agreed.

>>1785960
Ignorance is a excuse for not doing shit you dumb fuck. The MLA were far away, why would we ever expect them to pop up in the Divide?

>>1785972
And we could resist them seeing as they'd be distracted dealing with the MLA and we can easily create some fairly effective defences.

>>1785981
If they needed an excuse I am certain they could have found one by now.

>>1786055
>Thanks, Oddball?
Potentially. Still want to kill him though.

>>1786084
Because they are a useful tool for weakening our enemies and are lead in part by old friends of ours.

>>1786116
The NCR as I have stated repeatedly lacks the ability to fight in the Divide.

>>1786123
Static defences can be made cheaply and far more effectively than any sorts of mobile force. So raids can be stopped easily but any sorts of counter actions would be harder.


>>1786134
>Why let them build at all?
Ignoring it weakening the NCR? Because we lack the forces, the industry, the tactics and everything else to fight them and win anything more than a small fight.

>>1786134
Then they are free to move in.we can't handle the claim so its void.

You keep saying that but you have no proof. And the MLA presence will only get worse.

They are partially established, but as niner said, theyre building up more.

And your plan is to roll over and take it like a bitch? Aren't you the anon with all the plans that never go wrong?

The NCR can partially deal with tunnels as they fins them, but tunnelling is still the MLA's best option.

According to you, its not ours so they won't be violating borders. And quartering an enemy force would be a reason to annex anyways.

If the MLA is attacking the heart land"
, they would put resources into stopping it. Just cause you're rolling over doesn't mean they would.

Its the smarter choice than just dealing with surprise attacks. Its what we would do.

Removing the nukes means we don't have the missles anymore. Having warheads lieing around is not helpful.

Well niner says your wrong >>1786067
No civil war anywhere in the horizon

The brotherhood military is wholy focussed on the MLA threat. They can't focus anymore than they already are. The midwest doesn't really care about the east anyways.

We're not fighting the entire MLA, just the ones in the Divide. After that we collapse the tunnels so they can't mount an offensive against us.

>>1786116
Because of the defined borders that we have established when we first met the NCR. Also, we don't know if the NCR DOES genocide mutants, and if they do than you ALSO don't know whether those mutants are raiders or not knowing that there ARE mutants living in the NCR.

>>1786123
Because of the giant ass robot army in the way? We can go with the Switzerland card. "They were too strong and powerful for us to join you while at the same time they didn't want to lay seige to us because we were too dug in" sort of deal. This is of course if they manage to beat back the MLA to warrant such questioning. They will have way too much to deal with in the mean time.

>>1786169
>Its our land. They can blame us, and they will.
Baseless assumptions.

>As long as they are in our land, we are responsible for them.
No, not really seeing as we can claim to be fighting them as hard as we can and the NCR will struggle to disprove it. Plus they wouldn't be able to really do much in the Divide themselves as I have argued in past so they would have to accept this as truth and as the maximum effort we and they can do against the MLA.

>I feel our military is strong enough to put up a fight, and i can see us winning. It wont be easy, but its doable.
No it fucking isn't. These guys can actually go on the offensive, have greater numbers, actual vehicles, better weapons and black magic. We'd be fucked.

>I think at this point its doubtful well come to a compromise or an agreement for this topic.
No, but I am going to stay up just to make sure you don't fuck us up the ass like with Elijah.

>>1786195
>No, but I am going to stay up just to make sure you don't fuck us up the ass like with Elijah.
Are you sure you don't want to sleep so we try soloing Elijah immediately after we leave him? Then end up hospitalized for several weeks?

>>1786189
If enemies are operating from the divide, its free game for the NCR to move in.

And you think the NCR would buy "were to strong"? Don't be ridiculous. If were strong enough to defend ourselves were strong enough to push them back, especially one small cell.

There is a circle of conflict going on:
Brotherhood<->MLA<->NCR<->Legion

>>1786207
Do you think that Switzerland had any capabilities of fighting and defeating the German Army during WW2 if they attacked? Not they didn't But why didn't Germany attack? Oh wait that's right it's because of Switzerland's defenses and strong professional army. Assumptions on your part. With good rolls and more fleshing out of the plan we can succeed.

>>1786215
IN THIS CASE IT'S NOT EVEN A PLAN. IT'S HAVING THE MLA ATTACK THE NCR. YOU ARE ASSUMING THAT THE NCR WOULD GIVE A SHIT AFTER HAVING TO DEAL WITH THIS.

>>1786195
"The fascists won't blame us for not keeping our house in order and letting the MLA operate under our feet"
Haven't you argued repeatedly that the NCR would screw us over at the first opportunity? Why wouuld you think this wont draw their ire?

What happens when they tell us about the MLA and tell us to deal with it? Do we refuse? They are watching us constantly. They can tell if were doing militaty actions.

Yes we can, especially now, before they don't pull in reinforcements. If we can take 3000 marked men, we can take the small MLA force in the divide.

So you want to fuck us over with the NCR to fellate the MLA?

>>1786215
Do you want to cede the entire divide? Cause that's what that means. The NCR wont give it up.

>>1786189
>>1786215
Switzerland had mountains, mountain passes, and scorched earth plans ready for any of their territories.
We have mountains, divide storms, desert plains, and possibly space or tunnels. Also maybe the Cloud depending on what Elijah is doing right now.

We have a similarly strong professional army, and unlike Switzerland, can actually back up our claim that our regulars are like any other nations' special operatives.

>>1786230
For now, let's keep the MLA here, then check on the NCR, then see how it compares if we want to tell the MLA to not draw their attention here.

Also we should check out where any Marked Men who didn't sell their souls went.

>>1786188
>Then they are free to move in.we can't handle the claim so its void.
Except they can't move in either as I have repeatedly stated.

>You keep saying that but you have no proof. And the MLA presence will only get worse.
Aye but they have been preparing for this major offensive for months now seemingly and all those bases that they have in the Divide are stocked with troops armed to the teeth. We couldn't beat them fast enough to prevent them reinforcing and pushing us out.

>They are partially established, but as niner said, theyre building up more.
Aye for a offensive into the NCR. Not to sit around in the Divide.

>And your plan is to roll over and take it like a bitch?
No mine is to accept the deal he offered that entirely gets everything I want from the Divide before moving onto more important shit in my opinion rather than getting into another protracted conflict in the Divide for no reason and pissing off another empire.

>Aren't you the anon with all the plans that never go wrong?
I've never claimed such a thing.

>The NCR can partially deal with tunnels as they fins them, but tunnelling is still the MLA's best option.
Aye I suppose. Your point being?

>According to you, its not ours so they won't be violating borders.
It's ours but that doesn't mean we actively hold it. We claim it but that doesn't mean we are responsible for that which occurs inside.

>And quartering an enemy force would be a reason to annex anyways.
IT'S NOT FUCKING QUARTERING IF YOU CAN'T PUSH THEM OUT. Plus the NCR couldn't fight in the Divide.

>If the MLA is attacking the heart land, they would put resources into stopping it.
Aye but that might prove insufficent or unable to reasonably push back their advance especially given how much they have thrown into fighting the Legion.

>Just cause you're rolling over doesn't mean they would.
Fuck you and the high horse with a dildo for a seat you sit on.

>Its the smarter choice than just dealing with surprise attacks. Its what we would do.
Aye because we can actually move through the Divide without our skin flying off, becoming ghouls, suffering eternally painful un-death or dying. UNLIKE THE NCR.

>Removing the nukes means we don't have the missiles anymore.
Like I give a fuck seeing as that ain't how I plan on using them.

>Having warheads lying around is not helpful.
It is to me.

>No civil war anywhere in the horizon
Never said there was and in fact his point confirms what I was saying: there is potential for civil war but it is suppressed by greater outward threats.

>The brotherhood military is wholy focussed on the MLA threat. They can't focus anymore than they already are. The midwest doesn't really care about the east anyways.
You can't prove that without speaking to the BOS and I would disagree entirely seeing as their leader is at least partly dedicating efforts to expanding elsewhere I would imagine out of interest in bringing more people into his control.

>>1786195


>Baseless assumptions.
Its not baseless. Ive listed my arguments post by post. Just because we disagree doesnt make it baseless, thats ignorant.

The NCR has every possibility of blaming us for any attack that comes from our territory, just as we would do the same if we were suddenly attacked by rogue elments from within the NCR borders.

>No, not really seeing as we can claim to be fighting them as hard as we can and the NCR will struggle to disprove it. Plus they wouldn't be able to really do much in the Divide themselves as I have argued in past so they would have to accept this as truth and as the maximum effort we and they can do against the MLA.

My argument isnt the NCR fighting in the Divide. I Doubt they have the tech, unless oddball is hiding even more shit in his pockets.

My argument is them holding us accountable /potentially attacking us in Big Mt.

>No it fucking isn't. These guys can actually go on the offensive, have greater numbers, actual vehicles, better weapons and black magic. We'd be fucked

I disagree. Sure they can go on the offensive, but there tunneling system as far as we know is in the divide. They can only attack us in the divide, wich turns it into the same city fight weve been winning at against the marked men. They have more numbers and interesting tech, but they cant bring it all to bear when cramped in the punishing confines of a city.

>No, but I am going to stay up just to make sure you don't fuck us up the ass like with Elijah

...... Was i responsible for Elijah? Im actually having a hard time remembering.

>>1785944
>- We ask him who Bitch is.
"HEY BITCH. Wake up!"

He whistles as if to a dog, and starts jangling a chain that leads to one or the two dog cages.

"Bitch is my pet fuck beast, a real animal, wild and crazy on the sack."

You hear a human growl coming from inside, and a sniffing noise. Someone is crawling out on all fours.

An arm painted with tattoos steps out first, followed by a bald, scarred head. Then shoulders leading to breasts and chest seductively wrapped with more tattoos to entice the eyes, all stemming from an unreadable sigil over the heart. Then a belly, swollen with child, and finally the rest of the legs and body.

There, crawling out on all fours and sniffing like a dog is someone you once called Officer Laura Blakely. She volunteered to give her brain at great risk to the TACT bot. You gave her a medal. She has a husband and kids.

And right now she's baying like a dog and crawling up Niners legs, trying to undo his cod piece with her mouth while sniffing his crotch.

"Cult bought her from Bishops men and bound her to the gods. I don't know if she's always like this, got a big scar on her head and said she was zapped by lightning. Fuck me if I could figure out how to do that to some other slaves."

"She's actually not mine. I'm babysitting her for the Cult as a gift. When they found her all she cared about was eating, sleeping, fighting and fucking. Cult trained her real good in the last bit. What man doesn't like a good tussle with a hot babe before doing it like deathclaws in heat!"

She tries to pounce on him, but he pulls her down forcibly by the chain. Then she tries to sniff your pants.

"Unsatiable isn't she. She'd tear the place apart if she doesn't get some good fucking now and then. Thankfully Buster over there keeps her occupied."

He points to the 2nd doghouse.

"You know, I don't even know if what's growing in her is mine or mutant dog. Guess ill find out."

>>1786241
Being in divide means their past the mountains. Its a straight shot to the capital from there. Its nothing like switzerland.

And what do we do if it turns out the MLA would shift the balance of power too much? At that point we can't remove them. Best not to let it get that far.

>>1786258
WHY THE FUCK ARE WE COOPERATING WITH THESE ASSHOLES?

>>1786264
>And what do we do if it turns out the MLA would shift the balance of power too much? At that point we can't remove them. Best not to let it get that far.
We could check up and back in like a turn or two. It won't take that long.

>>1786258
Ah... Okay. Now I have some problems.

>>1786258
"Is she permanently part of Cult property, or is there a way to remove said branding or marking?"

>>1786275
Hm... I feel like this is the sort of people the Cloud was made for.

>>1786258

Niner, Im not sure if you are aware of this or not, but that is one of the members of my Millitary Officers that went missing in action. Who would I have to talk to or kill to get her back?

>>1786230
>Haven't you argued repeatedly that the NCR would screw us over at the first opportunity?
Where it benefits them, I would imagine so yes but this isn't an example.

>Why wouuld you think this wont draw their ire?
Because I am not retarded? Because I think I can imagine a reality where they can respect our tiny state not being able to fuck up the massive MLA offensive that just rushed through?

>What happens when they tell us about the MLA and tell us to deal with it? Do we refuse?
No, we claim that all of our military experts are in agreement that taking offensive action will result in unsustainable losses.

>They are watching us constantly. They can tell if were doing military actions.
And let them fucking watch. They won't see shit seeing as we plan on destroying those spy drones soon.

>Yes we can, especially now, before they don't pull in reinforcements. If we can take 3000 marked men, we can take the small MLA force in the divide.
You are assuming that the MLA force is small, that they are as capable as the Marked Men, that they aren't already being reinforced and that us taking as many marked men as we did wasn't because of luck, positioning and surprise.

>So you want to fuck us over with the NCR to fellate the MLA?
Now you are just being creepy.

>>1786251
>We're not fighting the entire MLA, just the ones in the Divide. After that we collapse the tunnels so they can't mount an offensive against us.
You are assuming that we can defeat their entire force, collapse every tunnel and avoid defeat before they can get a single reinforcement in.

I consider this more insane than declaring a war against the NCR right this instant.

>>1786293
Don't say that. That's bargaining for god property. We can't do that or god strikes is down.

>>1786091
"Yeah. Best decision I ever made. I feel great, stronger than ever, and I run my own clan now. We ain't no gang no more were fucking raiders and we're the bloody best at what we do"

"War is bloody and fucking hard but we make do. It helps that the NCR, Legion, and Brotherhood make so many enemies and are such tight assess that they're practically pushing recruits and outcasts onto us."
"Refugees? Hah. Mate we ARE the go to for refugees. We're fighting for real freedom here. Freedom from the NCRs laws, from the Legions assimilating, and from Brotherhood extinction.

My boys will behave if I tell em too. Just hope you don't mind a few picked up habits."

>>1786112
"Nah. The Brotherhood genocides mutants, ghouls, and deathclaws who don't swear to them. You swear to them they just work you to death anyway.

NCR doesn't care about that much. With them it's the Tribals they round up and gas in camps. Thats why all the Tribals come to us."

>>1786299
I just want to know the name of the person, so that when we aren't bound by the oath we can come back and perform 100Barter AND/OR High Impact Violence.

>>1786307
Fuck the MLA. Get your people out of the divide.

>>1784922
>>1784933
>>1786293
>>1786299
Yeah. We have to be discrete about this. Although I think it only counts if the transaction happens.

>>1786307
Oh fuck...

>>1786307
>"Yeah. Best decision I ever made. I feel great, stronger than ever, and I run my own clan now. We ain't no gang no more were fucking raiders and we're the bloody best at what we do"
"Oh. Is selling your soul permanent? Is there a way to get or buy your soul back?"

>>1786316
Let's not say it to him in those words though. But yeah, this is much worse than I imagined.

>>1786314
Don't want to risk it. Might conflict with the spirit of the deal, and when making deals, we're bound by spirirt, they're bound by letter.

>>1786255
>Its not baseless. Ive listed my arguments post by post. Just because we disagree doesnt make it baseless, thats ignorant.
It is seeing as I have provided counterarguments which to me refute your points entirely. Rendering it a statement without reasoning and thus without basis.

>The NCR has every possibility of blaming us for any attack that comes from our territory, just as we would do the same if we were suddenly attacked by rogue elments from within the NCR borders.
Except this is different because it isn't "rogue elements" it's another nation that is invading that one.

>My argument isnt the NCR fighting in the Divide. I Doubt they have the tech, unless oddball is hiding even more shit in his pockets.
Agreed.

>My argument is them holding us accountable /potentially attacking us in Big Mt.
Which would be retarded seeing as it makes another enemy and draws resources from fighting the MLA.

>I disagree. Sure they can go on the offensive, but there tunneling system as far as we know is in the divide. They can only attack us in the divide, wich turns it into the same city fight weve been winning at against the marked men. They have more numbers and interesting tech, but they cant bring it all to bear when cramped in the punishing confines of a city.
Mate they will win. It's a fact. We just don't have the resources to sustain a war of this scale currently especially against an enemy which scours battlefields for salvage reducing our ability to reclaim war material from our dead and their losses.

>...... Was i responsible for Elijah? Im actually having a hard time remembering.
Quite possibly. All I know is that some of you are to blame and it pisses me off.