From which chapters were Por'O M'arc's bodyguards drawn? Other than the three latecomers were they all Ultramarines?

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What if one of Por'O M'arc's entourage went native?

What kind of campaign did the Emperor and Eldred launch on Nurgle's Garden when they rescued Issha?
Was it a sneaking mission, or a full on assault?

>>60606481
It was a smash-and-grab; Eldrad found a webway entrance right into Nurgle's garden, then he, Emps, and all their best warriors basically ran to the objective (Isha), threw her over Oscar's golden shoulder, then ran for the exit like the legions of Hell were on their tail, because they were.

>>60604925
I'm thinking that we should the more weebs bit of the standard OP to Necrons, the Tau have gotten a lot of love and other major factions are significantly less developed at this point. I know this is an inconsequential clerical matter, but still.

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So does the Cthonian ring get gravity just by spin, or does it also use active gravity manipulation? I ask because I'm pretty sure one of the real world limitations on ringworlds is needing to spin at relativistic speeds to generate earth-like gravity, so generating your own gravity and spinning it slower could be a workaround. On the other hand, the GaBHD has been set up as proud enough to distain that sort of workaround, and they might have just gone all out and made Cthonian neutronium strong enough to handle those stresses.

Am I even remembering correctly that the neutronium that makes up the Cthonian ring and the neutronium used in space elevators and smaller structures was significantly different in makeup, with Cthonian neutronium the much stronger of the two? There had also been some debate as to the grade of neutronium the Savlar foundry produces. It was agreed that the foundry produces much smaller batches of neutronium than its GaBHD output, but I'm pretty certain it was as strong as space elevator grade.

Also, since I was hoping Fulgrimfag would post new stuff soon I reread the contest on Mars section of his story, and he seems to have space elevator grade neutronium that was left on earth as a supremely dense, but gravity and inertia defying, wonder-material such that a chunk of it when turned into Forgebreaker has the mass to knock mountains around with its blows, while also being possible to lift, swing, and control as a melee weapon.

Also with that contest, how is such innovation, if not direct invention, permitted by the Mechanicus right in their home? Added is the fact that half the participants were Terran technological orders with no connection to the creed of the Omnissiah. I figure it can be partially justified by the OMB having just taken their ruling position on Mars and still deciding what they considered orthodox after swallowing up numerous other orders, with the added political pressure to make nice with the Imperium's assets

>>60607297
Regarding the Mechanicus, I think it has a lot to do with the fact that they just hadn't been a singular entity long enough to come up with the rules and homogeny that would later come to define them. They'd just finished doing a rush-job of trying to unite everything on Mars because they realized the Imperium would actually be able to get to them, then they got absorbed into the Imperium and thus had all of Earth's Mechanicus sects added to the mix.
Put another way, they didn't have all their knowledge collected into a whole by which to judge what was techno-heresy and what wasn't; one enclave had the secret to servo-limbs, another might know how to build jetbikes, so forth and so on, but there wasn't a cohesive guide to what was already known, and thus they weren't really in a position to prevent innovation when they couldn't be sure if that innovation wasn't just knowledge that their particular sect had preserved and passed down.
It was only once they'd had time to sit down and file out the paperwork about who knew what and catalogue it that they were able to start REEEing about attempts to advance technology.

That, or at this point they hadn't yet figured out that the Void Dragon was able to plant inventive ideas in people outside his prison. The general progress of the Great Crusade makes more sense if the Mechanicus were still operating under the assumption that they had the genie locked in the bottle.

>>60604925
i havent read girl genius in like 5 years...i should reread.

>>60607297
It's worth noting that neither are probably actually neutronium. It's just a slang name that stuck with the plebs.

>>60607581
How long did it take them to realize that The Dragon wasn't totally declawed and how?

>>60610247
I can imagine it was something pretty early on and undisputable. A computer asking them questions or some such.

>>60607297
A consistent 1G environment could be maintained by having differing thicknesses of "neutronium" in the structure of the hoop. The hoop does not need to spin. In fact it might be better that it does not as spinning at that speed would make landing on it difficult.

The inner segmented ring with the cut outs does spin. It was supposed to make day/night sequences. But the event that ruined everything for everyone knocked the inner hoop out of alignment and now it just has a day/night sequence over the two opposite ends of the ring where it's shadow still covers.

The inner ring was never meant to be inhabited although coating the inner edge of it with solar panels is probably a good way to generate all of the electricity. The GaBHD never bothered because anything generated would be almost insignificant compared to what they already had.

Did the Deathwatch got formed in this timeline?

>>60612974
Yeah but we don't know exactly how, seeing as the WotB was the driving force behind their canon founding.

>>60612974
Yes. There are still vast numbers of zeno-breeds out there that are on The List. The ones to malevolent and too inherently dangerous to tolerate. So for the sake of everyone else they have to go. Orks, 'Nids, Rak'Gol, maggot people and others. Someone has to specialize in slaying them.

>>60611127
Or an instruction manual written in Necrontyr

>>60613062
We don't know exactly how they were formed in this timeline of the WotB, or that we haven't decided if they also formed in the WotB outright? Either way that could make for some interesting writing.

>>60605938
What if is interesting, but I don't know if Por'O M'arcs's mission would be soon enough for one of his entourage to just up and drop their whole caste system idea straight into living with the humans.

Of course if you wanted to describe as a sort of one night fling for 'the betterment of diplomatic relations' then that would be another story.

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>>60615100
>Either way that could make for some interesting writing

Eagerly waiting for it.

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>>60607581
I think the way we have it so far, the AdMech stumbled upon it during the unification, were smart enough to realize than when Cthulhu asks you to let it out of its cage you say no, and it only started planting ideas once it realized asking wasn't going to work.

>>60614199
I would ask how would they know the connection, but I just realized the Dragon would just flat-out tell them. It's not one to lie, and it identifies itself as the "last of the C'tan" (laughingOutsider.holo).

>>60609282
No, man...no. I can't even keep track of the plot anymore. The story is going nowhere, and the art style hasn't improved.

>>60616925
Presumably it would have been founded by the Inquisition. I can imagine it being founded in the wake of the WoTB from the veterans who could reliably predict the behaviour of orks and Croneworlders (and other mercenaries and the like) by understanding how they thought. Also veterans of the Great Crusade who showed similar aptitude.

We know that A&O had something to do with the early Inquisition, this would probably be in the life time of the origional A&O. As with the rest of their work much of the records were scrubbed.

>>60615148
One-night stand would probably work, and would also be a good way to introduce the Tau to just how fixated humans can be by the reproductive act. The Tau aren't a race of perma-virgins of course, but reproduction is a more... "systematic" thing, as part of a union between two compatible individuals in order to produce offspring to benefit the Greater Good.

The personal account of said guard is added to the list of things the Tau Council find implausible and likely exaggerated.

>>60606551
Did we ever establish an actual roster for the Raid? We know Oscar, Eldrad, Magnus, Macha, a signifigant number of Primarchs and all the Phoenix Lords were in attendance. What Primarchs would have come? I feel like Russ, Angron and Khan would 100% be here for it at least. Anyone else?

>>60621192
Those three were probably the main ones risked among the primarchs. In this setting all the Primarchs started out as humans rather than being born demigods, so the majority of them aren't necessarily anything special in one-to-one combat, even with Astartes modifications. Maybe Guilliman too, because the boys in blue need to be involved somehow.

>>60621659
Guilliman was unaugmented and too old to be a frontline fighter for much of unification, so if he was involved it was probably on the logistics end. Sangy was mentioned in some stuff about the raid, and I figure it was the mostly the younger primarchs that went.

>>60622322
I feel like Lorgar would leap at a chance ti kill some daemons and rescue a fair maiden from the clutches of a grotesque monster. Probably some of the expertise gained from the Raid made into his various daemonology works. And did Russ and Lion still have their rivalry in this timeline? If so, Lion would have to come or Leman would NEVER let him hear the end of it. Maybe Morty too, toxic enviornments are the DG's forte afterall.

>>60621192
Dorn and Perturabo were said not to go. If anything they were fortifying the shit out of the other end of the Webway gate to make sure nothing came back out. Imperium needed brutal and fast. Magnus didn't go because he was holding the portal open with Malcador IIRC.

I think Lion was confirmed by Sangy's bio, need to double-check.

>>60622593
Lorgar definitely would not have gone. He was a genemodded middle-aged human, which might have worked well for most situations but not a jaunt into the Realm of Chaos. Same with Corax.

>>60622593
Speed was the main concern on who got invited. Vulkan didn't get come along for the ride for that reason.

>>60621192
Would Angron? He was a good combatant over the short term but had many health complaints

>>60625931
Probably not. Sangy and Lion were invited because they were freakishly good combatants even by Mk3S standards and very fast. Khan came along because he was an expert at high speed raids. On the whole though taking too many of the Imperium's leaders on the same venture would not be advisable. Oscar was not unaware of the possibility/probability of total failure and would have insisted that enough of the hierarchy be safe at any given time to ensure continuity of the national stability.

>>60626646
I really do feel like Leman would be coming no matter what Oscar told him. Even if he was told not too, he'd probably steal a suit of Custodes and sneak in anyways.

>>60622593
Mortarion was likely consulted but not brought along. There toxic environs and then there's the Garden of fucking Nurgle. Armor seals only work when poisons obey the laws of physics.

>>60627666
He probably did. Bjorn did and the two of them were pretty inseparable. The Merry and Pippin of the Great Crusade.

>>60625931
I feel like he would have. He was no good at administrating by his own admission, better to let him die with an axe in his hand. If anything Oscar would have to physically stop him from trying to come.

>>60628026
The way around this would be to give him another assignment whist The Raid is going on. Point him at a world that practices chattel slavery a long way away from where the gateway is being opened up and he will be busy for months at least.

>>60622593
Curze would have been considered and rejected. Realm of Chaos is made up of dreams and shit and it would probably react to the presence of the intruders depending on what they were thinking and feeling. With that in mind nobody wanted to see how it would react to Curze's fucked up mind.

>>60617669
>Main character currently faffing about in England to tie up a bunch of minor loose ends
>Gil currently possessed by his father who is under the other's mind control
>Klaus Wulfenbach... I think he rendered himself comatose, so the other couldn't control him?
>the other was found to be Agatha's mom, and through a robo-proxy built by Tarvek is trying to build her power-base
>Agatha's mom is also possessing Agatha, but she's sealed in a locket
>Storm King factions more or less under Martellus' control, he's trying to build his power-base
>Mechanicsburg was sealed in a time-stop, pissed off some other-dimensional beings, must have seal broken in... two years, I think?
>No idea wtf Tarvek's doing, going to Agatha for some reason I think idfk
>Everyone else is unimportant

How long did The Raid take from entering the Realm of Chaos to sprinting back the fuck out?

>>60630367
From outside probably not very long. It was a substantial strain on the best psykers of both human and eldar. Does six to eight hours sound right?

Time doesn't work right on the other side. It would be within mad dash timescale. Mad dash for super humans. A few days tops.

>>60621126
Do humans even have anything Tau would find attractive?

>>60632252
Depends on what you mean by that; if nothing else, humans are more similar to the Tau than, say, the Kroot or the pancake-polar bears. Plus the fact that Tau have a taste for novelty, and so might go for it just for the experience.
Then there's the matter of individual tastes; of course there's going to be a majority of Tau who don't understand why it would be desireable, just like humanity has plenty of normies who would turn up their noses at the idea of blue-skinned space babes. The Tau are individuals, with individual tastes, after all.

Of course, it could also be that this is a case where the Council's skepticism is well-founded; the Imperium's version of Commander Shepard is hardly an indicator of the prowess of the species as whole, and neither would some green recruit whose hormones convinced him that hitting on the blue lady was a good idea, despite his total lack of experience.

>>60628242
I remember in the ye olde "Kharn , what a great guy" stories that the other World Eaters would distract Angron with a ball of string. In this universe Angron got this reputation because Oscar distracted him with what was in retrospect a very obvious diversion. Angron absolutely would have demanded to go on The Raid and he absolutely would have died and he absolutely would admit that.

>>60613254
Out of all the Great Crusade era figures who should be the first leader of them?

>>60631676
As far as I remember from the Indigo Crow's failed gambit in the Great Game, part of the Tzeentchian side of the plot was to bait Khorne into visiting Nurgle and sucker punching him when he answered the proverbial door. This relied on the idea that Nurgle holding Isha was akin to Tzeentch with his wand, and the Crow and Tzeentch convinced Khorne that if he didn't strike first Nurgle would be set to drag the galaxy onto a course for stagnation and decay, and might usurp THE BLOOD KING OF THE GALAXY as mightiest god. Since this hit all the right buttons Khorne was glad to go kick Nurgle in the head while Tzeentch's pawns robbed him. Slaanesh was in on it too somehow, not really as a neutral party, but certainly as another party interested in having Isha again up for grabs. It was mostly Tzeentchian and Slaaneshi daemons that harried the raid after they found Isha and were attempting to flee with her, with most of the Nurglite daemons tied up in a massive fight with Khorne, who didn't actually care who got away with Isha as long as Nurgle lost her.

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>>60631676
Additionally, the further down you go the concept of things like time increasingly loses its meaning. Lunchtime doubly so. Isha was said to be so far down that it was on the timescale that continents shift. It was part of the reason she thought the Conservators were all that was left of the eldar people; between Slaanesh eating them all and how much time she percieved had passed she thought uncorrupted eldar had gone extinct hundreds of millions of years ago. But that could be because she was captured by Nurgle, who wanted maximum time to spend with his unwilling plague-dumpster waifu. Things could have been different during the Raid, especially if the Four were fighting for control behind the scenes.

>>60627666
>>60627716
I remember a partial list of some of the persons of the Raid were made in a really old thread (like, Thread III or something). The Imperium was said to have sent "its most brutal nutters", which included Russ. Bjorn has also been explicitly said to have gone on the Raid. Russ would have brought him along anyway if he went because Bjorn was one of the people he trusted to watch his back.

That said, there were probably a whole lot of otherwise promising people who got mulched by the Raid. If anything resulted in either of the two missing primarchs going missing in this timeline, it would be that. However, if that were the case Oscar would have put statues of them up all over the Imperium and trumpeted their deeds from the four corners of the galaxy. He wouldn't invoke an edict of damnatio memorae. It would also take away from the in-universe punch of Sangy being the first primarch to die.

>>60626646
This. They brought the people they knew had the best chance of getting in and out, but Oscar is smart enough not to risk everything on a gamble.

>>60639222
Do you know who the artist is?

>>60633893

Maybe they pointed him at Nuceria.

>>60641227
And hat might explain why he hated the place so persistently.

>>60641217
Looks like something from deviantart.

>>60636838
Missing primarchs in this timeline were more likely to be an error in the paperwork. Oscar fully intended to have the full 20 but then pussied out of making Uxor Mu one because he didn't want to encourage women to go into the military and Omegon counted as another and he is even less well known than Alpharius who is barely known about after he went on his record burning binge.

>>60639222
Isn't this official AoS artwork?

>>60643940 here

>>60639222
>>60641217
>>60642674
Yep, as I suspected, it's AoS art.
http://ageofsigmar.wikia.com/wiki/Realm_of_Azyr

>>60617472
Dragon knows it will get released eventually and with every new horror that day of desperation gets a little closer. In the meantime it does what it can to help it's people.

>>60641227
I thought Angron wrecking Nuceria was aa much of a problem for the Great Crusade as it was a benefit. Angron went tearing off for the planet in a PTSD-induced fury when he heard about it and it reminded him of his homeland, and while it was a horrible place and few really cared to see the high-ridera gone, it made things harder for Guilliman who was trying to make Ultramar more organized, since they got nervous about one of the Imperium's primarchs suddenly burning one of the worlds of Ultramar to the ground.

Angron definitely does need a distraction or else he would have tried to go along or die trying.

>>60645797
That could be a good source of three way disagreement between Guilliman, Angron and Oscar

Oscar - It's a world of a Survivor Civ. It's shit but we can't interfere without calling into question the sanctity of the alliances of the other Survivor Civs. We can't risk the potential fallout but I will try and subtly nudge them into a less shit system over the next 3 - 5 centuries.

Guilliman - With my grandson's reforms we will be able to get Ultramar to do something about it as under the new rules the other worlds that have always considered it distasteful will be able to step in legally. In the next fifty years everything will be better

Angron - LIKE I GIVE A SHIT ABOUT YOUR FUCKING POLITICS YOU PREENING FUCKING BEUROCRATS! NUCERIA LOOKS LIKE JUST LIKE THE FUCKING NORD-AFRIK AND AS SUCH THE HIGH-RIDERA FUCKING BURNS TONIGHT! IF THEY DIDN'T WANT TO DIE THEY SHOULD HAVE BEEN LESS SHIT!

>>60643484
As in that old crusade regiment Chiliad? I had honestly forgotten about that a while ago. But were we not sticking with the canon explanation of losing 2 of the primarchs? I admit chocking Omegon up to one of them sounds like a good fit.

>>60646573
The main issue is that the Emperor here doesn't like to cover things up unless absolutely necessary (i.e., genestealers on Old Earth to prevent a panic), and even when he does the Imperium usually keeps a copy of the information around with the Inquisition or Grey Knights or Harlequins making it harder to get lost if it's that level of importance. Planets and conspiracies and apocalyptech slip through the cracks all the time, but events related to Imperial government less so.

Alpha Legion and to a lesser extent Malcador would be the ones with the greatest impetus to cover something up. Oscar would too, he might try to be nice but he is very much a velvet glove in a steel fist, but he knows the importance of saving a copy somewhere, even if it's just in his brain.

>>60635461
Nobody knows anymore. The records "mysteriously deleted themselves" .

How much does the average pleb know about ancient Imperial history?

>>60649280
About as much as the modern average pleb knows about world history. In other words, mostly half-remembered bits about the stuff that pertains to their particular planet or sector, with some vague recollections about the bigger Imperium-wide events that are usually pretty inaccurate.
This has less to do with the knowledge not being available as it does with the inherent tendency of the masses to simply ignore stuff that's "not my problem." The information is mostly available to those who want to seek it out, but the average citizen is going to be more focused on work, personal life, and local happenings than history.

>>60649546
I kept thinking of this when we discussed Taranis having 'Piccolo Syndrome' way back when given how perfectly the quote fits (especially given how Oscar was actually found) but could never find a gif for it.

Taranis: I won't be in the history books anyway, only you. Oscar did this and Oscar did that and Oscar did some other damn thing. Malcador smote the ground and out sprang Oscar the Steward, shining with dazzling light and riding a golden horse. Malcador then electrified him with his miraculous witch-lightning and the three of them — Malcador, Oscar, and the horse — conducted the entire Great Crusade all by themselves.
Oscar (clearly kidding Arik):...I like it.

>>60649280
You'd probably also get some areas that are more distorted than others. Oscar can't go around slapping sense into people who misremember history because otherwise he'd be at it all day. In some sectors misremembered history can lead to some really bad shit. And Oscar wasn't around to see everything. On top of that Oscar isn't unbiased. Like all humans, he has a tendency to glamorize or villify certain things.

>>60650338
How much of the history of the Age of Strife is known by Oscar? Presumably Malcador would have told him what he knew but Malcador was a child of it's last days.

>>60651598
Just what Malcador told him and what he was able to see from whatever Dark Age databanks and records he could find. Oscar wasn't conscious for any of the Dark Age of Technology. Woke up completely tabula rasa besides knowing how to breathe, eat, and a few other things after Malcador found him.

Bump

>>60643940
>>60643963

Oh crap. That's embarrassing! I don't pay much attention to AoS, saw the planet with artificial rings and thought it was an appropriately fancy sic-fi illustration... time to go refile and rename it.

>>60605938
I don't think that there were enough of them to leave one behind. There was M,arc, three advisors and his apprentice. Apprentice would be the youngest so possibly more likely to try the local flavour

>>60646573
The Chiliad may or may not be still around. Alpha Legion shepherded them away, the Alpha Legion have a great interest in The Ring, nobody knows where the Alpha Legion recruit from and you could hide an entire civilisation on The ring quite easily.

>>60646346

Maybe Oscar and Guilliman finally gave him the greenlight for Nuceria as a distraction?

I'm on with trying to re-do the Rak'Gol. Hopefully by this evening.

Let's talk more about what to expect about Human-Eldar Relationships.

What's the sex life like?

Do marriages occur and are allowed?

How is it preceived? I'm talking about one night stands, short-term relationships and long term relationships and etc.

>>60662166
It would vary hugely from world to world. On Cadia it would not be questioned. On Krieg it would get you shot.

Most won't condemn it because of the Royal Couple.

>>60660487
It would have had o have been a big reason like that, they wouldn't have casually allowed the borders of a Survivor Civ to be violated.

What details do we have so far on the corrupted Man of Gold the grey knights fought?

>>60665741
Per original anon "In the official fluff there was mention of a Dark Age cybernetic person shaped thing on a vessel lost to the warp. Got intercepted by Grey Knights. It's death screen cut off the Astronomican to a shit load of ships. It was mentioned in the GK codex but I can't remember what it was called." I kind of wonder if anon was thinking of the Cacodominus. From what else has been said it was bumming around in space when the Imperium found it circa M34 and was capable of interfacing with the ship. The Imperium tried hailing it got shot at. They threw all sorts of shit at it (though not World Engine levels) until a team of Grey Knights boarded the ship and killed it. The backlash of the thing's death scream killed a whole bunch of psykers and blocked out the Astronomican for quite a region of space. We've debated on where the Man of Gold came from, but my best guess is it's a Man of Gold who went crazy, got stuck in the Warp, and then spat out nine millennia later because Warp. A lot of the Men of Gold went crazy and tried to attack the Warp, which went about as well as could be expected. Slaanesh claims to have eaten one, nobody except the Slaaneshi believe them.

Worth noting the Imperium don't know for 100% sure if it was a Man of Gold, but it looked and acted more like one than anything they ever saw beyond the dead one on Cthonia. The lack of confirmation is more you couldn't analyze the dust left over.

>>60662247
>>60662247
I've kind of thought that the general perception is kind of like pic related. On the one hand it doesn't produce any offspring. On the other hand there are no shortage of war orphans out there (the fact that the Schola is overloaded even in spite of people's best efforts to adopt or find next of kin is a good sign of that), and for humans loss of reproductive potential isn't much of an issue, even in Nobledark sheer numbers is still one of the Imperium's greatest advantages. Eldar and humans have both shown attraction to individuals outside their species (for humans, thing modern humans and Neanderthals/Denisovans, for eldar, think of how all the shit Commorragh and the Old Empire did reflects a corruption of natural eldar tendencies), which would be expected to be higher the greater the similarity between the two (a human/Eldar pairing is much more likely than either with, say, a kinebrach). But again, it would vary on world.

You'd get a lot more pushback from the eldar side of the equation. Humans might not care, but for eldar every adult not making babies is one not contributing to saving their species. However, a human/eldar relationship is only like five years from an eldar point of view so it's not like they're tied up forever. It could be like Victorian era nobility or some cultures today where it doesn't matter who you fall in love with as long as you have a "proper" spouse (that you almost never interact with). In-vitro is a thing. And at the same time if it ensures an eldar orphan grows up well-adjusted it helps the eldar.

The bigger issue would be if the mon-keigh parent impresses mon-keigh values upon the eldar child. This should be averted by the clannish nature of eldar (so many extended relatives), but is more of a symbolic issue. So again it varies. Alaitoc would REEEE about it, Ulthwe and Saim-Hann don't give a shit, and everyone else falls in between.

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>>60667131
I derped.

>>60667131
The eldar aren't facing extinction due to low birth rates as such. It's attrition and spiralling grief cycles that are the real problem. The loss of a wife or husband is as tragic to an eldar as it is to a human but the eldar don't have middle gears. They don't get upset, they fall into a pit of despair so deep no light can reach the bottom of it and have to be put on suicide watch. They don't get angry, they get murderous. The Path is there to mitigate this but it's not always enough. An eldar might loose one maybe two partners in a normal life time. Unless they like humans. Then they could go through dozens.

There are still trillions of eldar. Thanks to Isha and her followers the birth rate does have positive figures.

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So did this happen in this AU? Was the little girl Ceggers in a dress? Who or what was the dog?

>>60669264
It wouldn't be necessarily so much the truth as what groups like the council of elders on Alaitoc say. They see an eldar and humans holding hands and go "muh birth rate", "muh sake of the species" when it's them whose getting creeped out by how friendy the eldar are getting with the mon-keigh.

There are points in favor of either argument (again, grief spiral, and the Imperial eldar are at a massive low in population compared to the Old Empire), but they're not making the argument out of pure logic.

Alaitoc in particular likes to claim it's hewing closest to the old traditions of Old Empire before it went to shit, but it's changed as much as everyone else. Most conservative doesn't necessarily mean hewing closest to the old ways.

>>60669848
I think there was a suggestion that one was Ceggers and the other was the Changeling, the Changeling being a daemon made by Ceggers who Tzeentch stole the identity of to keep under his thumb (the rest of the Eldar pantheon not being crazy enough to voluntarily break themselves into pieces to make daemons). But it was one of those things that was left ambiguous. All that is known for sure is Tzeentch isn't happy someone got through his labyrinth.

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>>60629683
Agatha: possessed by her mom (the Other) but the locket keeps her from controlling Agatha, currently in England to find a way to free Mechanicsburg and herself
Gil: wasped, possessed by his father to act as his proxy and keep both him and Agatha/the Other in check while frozen
Tarvek: trying to free Agatha from the Other, keeping tabs his family and stopping them from taking over (without him)
Klaus: trapped himself in a time bubble along with Mechanicsburg so the Other couldn't control him, both under attack by other-dimensional beings in the time-stop
the Other: Agatha's mom, currently a consciousness in a robot built by Tarvek building her power-base

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>>60672434
There's also the problem that humans don't go to the Infinity Circuit.

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>>60672434
Or the Changeling sought out Big Bird and bound himself to it to evade Slaanesh.

>>60675147
A problem that will be resolved when Isha takes back her garden. All her children both natural and adopted will be welcome there to spend as long as they wish or be reborn.

>>60669848
Either the girl or the dog were probably Ceggers and although there is much speculation as to which, motivation and the nature of the Changeling nobody seems to have stopped to consider one important question;

What did they see at the heart of the Labyrinth? Because the well of eternity is there and in it all past and future and possible knowlage and although probably not even Ceggers would be able to see and comprehend the entirety of everything he went into that Labyrinth with a reason. Did he see what he was looking for? Something else? They would have seen something.

>>60653642
Malcador and Clan Terrawatt, other than the Chiliad held vaults, were probably the best source of recorded Strife and pre-Strife historical information. The Lichtenstein Vault should have been due to having continuity all the way back to just after the fall of the GaBHD but they had no intention of ever opening the door so their knowledge of outside was extremely limited to the point where they didn't believe the Imperium was real until about 30 years before the WoTB.

Oscar and friends would have known the names of the other little and relatively short lived and fallen nations that had come before them in the time between everything going to shit and everything being rebuilt and may even have known at least a retrospective over view of their history. But much would have been lost, nations rising and falling and leaving only oddities in the records and ruins of no interest to anyone but historians and the obsessive.

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>>60666988
If the Cacodominus was a Man of Gold it was one that had been given the Dr Weir Event Horizon treatment. If that made it stronger, weaker or just more malevolent is hard to say as the Imperium has a sample size of 1 to compare it to, and even then it's a self-taught and poorly optimized one.

>>60665741
Presumably it killed a bunch of people and that's what drew attention to it and it took most of a Grey Knight Brotherhood dying to put it down.

>>60679888
Slaanesh did claim to own one at the time of The Raid, though nobody else believed her. That might have been it.

>>60677742
They probably wouldn't have seen all of it. Figuring out what's in the Well is Tzeentch's long term goal, and he's wary enough of the place to throw Kairos in there as his canary in the coal mine.

>>60679888
That's basically what I was thinking. Dr. Weir only goldier and with telepathic control over a Dark Age ship and all its functioning weapons. Maybe not the OP stuff because of Warp exposure (plus the MoG seemed to have been crazy rather than an active Chaos follower), but one potential Man of

Did we decide what to do with the "Man of Gold impersonators"? I think the main issue with it was how many people know Oscar is a Man of Gold. Obviously the primarchs and higher Imperial officials know, but who else was the question? A lot of people see the Men of Gold the same way they see superheroes in Injustice: once they were the greatest of us but then for some reason they just started killing people. Plus Oscar wanted his ideas to be accepted because they were good ideas not because he had the biggest psychic dick in the room. The psychic powers are only to be pulled out if people won't be resonable.

On the other hand Malcador figured out what Oscar was with little to no help. Yes he is from Terrawatt but who's to say any Survivor civ could do the same. And Isha would probably trumpet it to force Oscar's hand with the whole divinity issue. We've also said he doesn't go out of his way to deny it or cover it up, he just doesn't use it as his symbol of divine right. Sebastian Thor definitely knew.

It could be something gradual. Like during the Crusade era it was not well known but by now it's more common.

>>60683045
I think we should have it so that Oscar's seen as the Last Man of Gold™. I'm not sure WHAT Malcador told Oscar, or what Oscar's let known about his status, but the Imperial propaganda machine might spin things so that "what? All those Other so-called Men of Gold? Oh, they were all killed when the Iron Minds rose up. Yep, totally what happened. What's that? More Men of Gold? Ones who stirred up shit? Oh, that can't be- after all, Emperor Oscar's so swell and all. No, those are bastards TRYING to present themselves as Men of Gold, because they think raw power's all it takes. Don't be fooled by them good citizen!"

And so on. Now, I don't think Oscar'd go with this at first, but Isha's enough of a politician to persuade him otherwise (I like to think that for all her mother aspects, she is by far the more practical half of their marriage) as well as to set up the whole thing.

>>60683045
Isha would know because she may have met the old Golden Folk back in the old days.

Historians know what he is and what a MoG is, also the people who have to work with him. Most other people just know he's a tank-born psyker and assume he's super compatible with rejuvenents or he's a Mk3S or he's getting longevity with his psykerness. Vulkan and Magnus lived a fucking long time so it's not an unreasonable assumption.

>>60659781
Lets assume that the ring has a width of the circumference of the Earth because the Iron Minds had to choose a number from somewhere and hey seemed to have a mild flair for the dramatic. That's 40,075km.

Diameter of the earths orbit is 299,200,000km which The Ring would have to be assuming a star like Sol.

40,075 X 299,200,000 = 11,990,440,000,000km2

Earth has a surface area of 510,100,000km2

That's ~23,506.06 times the surface area of Earth assuming I've done my maths right which I possibly haven't.

If the Alpha Legion have set up a base on The Ring and haven't told anyone then it won't be hard to hide it and keep it hidden.

On a similar note it makes Malcador finding Oscar by "chance" very unlikely.

>>60683288
“Oscar my dear, I love you, I truly do, but you simply must put a little more pizzazz into your actions when you act. You shouldn’t restrict yourself so, not just for you, but for the people around you. For those who stand behind you it provides them with a reminder that you can protect them. For those who oppose you, it provides an abject demonstration of why they should not stand in your way.

Being intimidating is not a sin. It was Kurnous who pointed this out to me. The most intimidating looking animals in the galaxy are not the ones that want to fight. It’s the ones who want to fight the least. The children of Khaine know this as well. In battle they display their skills to a degree that some might call pretentious not out of vanity, but to show their foes how outmatched they are and to convince them to back down without a fight.”

I kind of forgot the exact wording of, but that was the gist of it. The point being to show how Oscar and Isha have very different views on what constitutes being a proper “god” (and I use that term loosely, seeing as Oscar would dispute that).

Isha was created as part of a pantheon to design and shepherd the early eldar people. Her idea of being a “responsible” god is one of noblesse oblige. It’s a god’s job to protect their people. Being dramatic in your actions makes your enemies fear you, your charges feel safe, and those among them that might be tempted stay on the right path. It’s also a bit dramatic because, you know, eldar.

Oscar takes a different view. To him, throwing around power sets up a dangerous precedent, because it gives the implication that the user is an absolute arbitrator of right and wrong. Which is dangerous because he knows very well how even the most powerful beings, himself included, are flawed. His idea of a “responsible” god would be a god who is first among equals. Someone like Thor, Gilgamesh, Jesus, or Hercules than Zeus, Odin, or Ra.

>>60683288
>>60686290
Shit, forgot the beginning. I was going to say, this reminds me of a quote I was thinking about for Isha which was >>60686290.

>>60683384
In-universe Oscar would probably be seen as the Last Man of Gold like how Superman is seen as the Last Man of Krypton. Except Supergirl. And Zod. And Kandor. They don’t count. It helps that in this case the only contenders for the title are a corpse and a “we’re not sure it was a Man of Gold but it was Dark Age, human-shaped, and OP as fuck”.

I think it's been mentioned that Oscar's MoG-ness would have had to be made known to the eldar because it's the only way for their marriage to have any sort of legitimacy in their eyes, especially early on. The eldar would be enraged at the idea of Isha marrying some pleb human, but the Men of Gold were powerful enough that the Old Empire would have had to give them respect (in the same way you give an elephant in the wild respect), even if they didn't like them. The Men of Gold were also the closest things humanity had to eldar-style gods or royalty, which also made it more tolerable.

Bamp

>>60686390
So how do the latest generation Eldar view the Emperor, the ones who have only grown up under imperial propaganda?

>>60692260
They'd much rather believe their own romanticism of their past but Oscar and his people are/were pretty cool

>>60672434
I think that Alaitoc would pride itself on being far from the Old Empire

>>60695876
>>60692260
I think it's been mentioned that they see him as a heroic mortal in the same type as Gilgamesh or in their case Eldernesh. Not a god but someone so great that he can look them in the eye.

>>60686290
One other big difference between Isha and Oscar is that Oscar plans to become obsolete and fade away. Isha does not.

>>60696302
>>60672434
>>60669264

So when LIVII and Taldeer got together how did everyone react? In general what is everyone's opinion on a Vindicare Assassin and a Farseer somehow getting and staying together?

>>60699063
It wasn't against any rules, assassins aren't in the chain of command so she wasn't fraternizing with and underling. But it was extremely unprofessional. For the most part the only people who knew were the officers of her regiment and almost certainly her grandfather but if they knew they kept quiet about it because the Colonel-Farseer has no time for fools and has a mean right hook. LIVII and Taldeer's affair is not common knowledge. Even when the pregnancy became impossible to hide the regiment just assume that she had a one night stand with a foreign eldar at some point, these things happen and it wouldn't be the first time among the officers of Cadia.

They would not suspect that the child is LIVII's. If anything her getting pregnant would remove a lot of suspicion because a hybrid child is a thing of myth and prophesy.

Also as far as the cadians can tell LIVII is fucking weird. Total deadpan at all times, sees everything in terms of firing positions and cover and his first instinct on meeting new people is to calculate threat level and probable effort required to terminate them. They can't deny that he is polite and professional but he genuinely does have a plan to kill everyone he meets. The cadians would be genuinely surprised he was capable of affection or indeed any strong emotion.

All in all the other high brass would be shocked by her unprofessional behaviour, her officers wouldn't be but would pretend to be suppressed and the common soldiery would be surprised for different reasons. She wouldn't care about the opinion of others so long as they do their job and LIVII would adjust his threat level estimations.

>>60699063
>ear lovers anonymous
I remember those threads.

>>60696302
They do, but when they talk about upholding the old traditions they are talking about the way the empire was before it devolved into drugs, sex, and rock and roll. Kind of like how late Romans wished for a return to the glory days of Augustus Caesar and gloss over the parts in-between that involved the less competent Emperors. Which is still a bit of a romantization as their intepretation of the glory days of the Old Empire is prim and proper crystal spires and togas with cultural posturing, when one could make the argument that Saim-Hann shows just as much similarity. The Old Empire in the days before it went to shit was crystal spires and togas, but it was a lot more emotional.

Biel-Tan's the same way, looking to the "empire that was" rather than the "empire it became". And to some degree you could make the argument that the eldar went millions of years being at least decent before the corruption set in.

>>60700160
It makes you wonder how thy view the Harlequins and how hard the Harlequins troll them with history lessons about shit they would rather their people wouldn't remember.

>>60700668
It can safely be assumed that the Clowns don't pass an opportunity to troll anyone.

>>60699221
What were they?

>>60703249
filled with fanfiction of eldar women and human men

Did that business withe the stolen suns get saved?

I swear I'm trying to fix my Rak'Gol mistake.

>>60703249
>>60703566
I'm pretty sure that there have been a few of those put up in the writing section on 1d4chan, and not just LCB at that.

>>60704624
Yep. Dark Eldar, Necrons and related subjects (C'tan, C'tan vampires), Orks, and tyranids moved to their own page with minor groups, hopefully to be split up further later.

>>60706358
Don't stress too much about it, there's no such thing as deadlines here. The first iteration was decent if it were a different species, just do what you feel you need to do to make it more accurate to the canon Rak'gol.

>>60708975
Didn't get the chance to check out the new organization; it definitely helped with the organization.

How long ago should the Imperium have met the Rak'Gol?

Are the illustrations and descriptions of the advanced tank and shield of luna ship anywhere on the wiki?

Should the Rak'Gol have psykers? Should they be divided into castes?

>>60712388
Assuming that the Lexicanum page is accurate the canon Rak'gol don't have that much information on them to be accurate to.

>>60703566
>>60699205

Can I write about Inquisitor Cadmus or Trask in this setting with Eirella or Kayleth respectively?

>>60716207
Sure, why not.
>Cadmus and Eirella
I know that author, Muttonchops, is not longer ded and is rewriting his story. Supposedly Macha will get dude for herself in rework.

>>60716238

Still it would be interesting to write about. An Ordos Xenos Inquisitors and a Bel-tan Farseer.

Also does anyone know how to bypass the repatcha altogether? It's kind of annoying.

>>60716289
Well you could make your own OC is you want, I would read it for sure.

>>60716289
Or you could mix it up a little and have the Inquisitor be the eldar and he's trying to get with one of his human acolytes or something. Technically illegal but it's only something they get you for if they can't get you for something else.

>>60666988
I wouldn't be stepping on anyone's toes if I tried to do a Leggy and Draco story would I?

>>60684791
U R Rong

It's 40,075 X the orbit which is 940,000,000 = 37,670,500,000,000km squared.

That's 73,849.25 Earths.

It's a really long oblong that joins at the ends.

And then there's the outer edge. If a nice flat gravity is maintained by alternating thickness of neutronium then the outer edge also has a 1 G environment. So that's that number again and possibly a little bit more depending on how thick the ring is.

And then there's the inner ring that's out of alignment that was supposed to make night and day cycles that we don't know the size of.

Shit's big.

>>60714454
We suggested they were a relatively young species, one that only developed spaceflight after the Fall of the Eldar and the ensuing Age of Strife.

>>60719046
Did they still have the potential Yu'Vath connection? Hell, have the Yu'Vath been explored in this AU at all?

>>60720408
Yes.

Bump

Since we haven’t had any new ideas of late, here are a couple of ideas for events that are the kind of blurbs you see in codexes that don’t really get elaborated on.

970.M41, Reactivation of Ouakronos - The Imperial world of Neo-Alexandria is invaded by Necrons of the Sarnekh Dynasty led by Thaszar the Invincible at the orders of the Silent King. Unbeknownst to its inhabitants, Neo-Alexandria is really the Necron World Engine Ouakronos, millions of years of asteroids and debris being drawn into its gravity well leaving it deceptively caked in kilometers of soil. Covered in rich regolith, the planet was terraformed by humans during the Dark Age of Technology, with none the wiser as to its true nature. While the Imperial military above engage the Necron forces, oblivious to their true goal, Thaszar descends below the planet’s surface and reactivates the World Engine. Great fissures open up across the planet, cyclopean engines jutting forth from the layers of earth, before Thaszar points Neo-Alexandria at Mandragora and engages its inertialess drive. Not being protected by external shielding or artificial gravity, the planet’s soil, atmosphere, and inhabitants are stripped away by the acceleration by the time Ouakronos arrives at its destination.

Liked this one because it shows just how little the Necrons care about other life, wiping out the entire population as a side effect of reactivating the inertialess drive. Originally the idea was the Necrons paid no attention at all to the people on the surface and just infiltrated the planet and reactivated the World Engine without anyone noticing until the fissures starting to open up, but I thought that the Necrons probably wouldn’t care enough about the response to bother with stealth. Also worry it’s too similar to Thaszar’s introduction in the fluff (in which case a different Necron could be used).

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I've tried to add more.

https://pastebin.com/fLzgxPwL

Am I doing it right?

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>>60724868
Here is the other one.

???.M38, the Raid of Bor’kan - In an early encounter between the Tau Empire and the Dark Eldar, a raid by Archon Klax on the Sept world of Bor’kan takes thousands of Tau and Poctroon slaves. Sending a communication receivable by Tau technology, Klax offers to release the slaves in exchange for a significant amount of ransom. Still naïve to the ways of the Dark Eldar, the Tau Empire pays the sum, only for Klax to send another communication openly laughing at the Ethereal council’s actions and broadcasting the torture of dozens of prisoners. In response, Tau and Poctroon engineers spend several months building a 0.8 km unmanned projectile out of modified unused Poctroon designs for an interstellar sleeper ship and launch it at the apparent location of the transmission at one-third of the speed of light. Several years later the ship strikes the moon of a seemingly uninhabited gas giant several lightyears beyond Tau space with enough force to leave a crater in the planet’s surface kilometers deep still visible when the Tau colonize the system centuries later. Although the attack fails to kill Klax, it damages his operation enough that Klax is not heard from for several decades.

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>>60725038
Huge improvement. Really taken the "it could be this, but nobody really knows for sure" tack and done it well.

The bits that are totally new give the Rak'gol some much needed character, showing that they have depth to their behavior even if the Imperial can't figure out what the hell the meaning behind it is.

>>60725232
What more should I do?

>>60719036
The outer edge is actually more heavily developed then the inner one, being covered with absolutely massive domes, towers, and port complexes

Say, has anyone mentioned what's happened on Armageddon yet? IIRC the whole shebang started because some Eldar decided to throw Ghazgkull into Armageddon to spare a few of their race. What's the situation in Nobledark, now that the Eldar and humans are cool with each other? Did the Eldar throw Ghazzy into Commorragh or something?

>>60731800
Ghazzy still went to Armageddon because it was the old homeworld and attack planet of The Beast. He sought it out intentionally as it is sort of holy ground for the orks.

>>60731800
>>60731817
Ah, right then. I admit, it's something of a relief- I like the Nobledark setting on the whole, but a setting without Commissar Yarrick is certainly missing a lot of cool factor (for lack of a better phrase). Did the Imperium have some kind of warning, at least? Or is Von Strab as dismissive of Eldar as he is of practically everything and everyone else?

>>60732084
Von Strab was executed by Yarrick for criminal incompetence at the end of the war.

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>>60732084
Von Strab was dismissive and refused to call in Imperial aid to deal with the hulk and it's orks assuming that his own forces would be more than sufficient to deal with a few orks. It might have been but he never read the reports of the feral orks in the wilderness (because reading is for plebs) and how much the ranks of the invaders would be bolstered by them. Also he used the officer ranks of the PDF like a social club for rich fops so the leadership of the PDF was severely lacking in competence. Shit snowballed from there.

Yarrick trained as a commissar among the tribes of the Ashlands who are all insane ork hunters by profession and went a bit native.

>>60728252
I imagine that it would have been settled but not that extensively. If the ring itself isn't spinning then the edge could be where the ships docked. The only reason to make a docking area on the dark side would be for convenience of it being a shorter distance through the middle than to the edge. Habitation would therefore only be practical to be in a thin band running right down the middle.

Such settlements would not be luxurious. They would be dockyards at the end of a tunnel with low level accommodation. It would be the equivalent of working on an oil rig.

>>60683022
Then it must have either done something very wrong or been very boring to get shat back out in to real space and left to die by Grey Knight.

Or it was tricked out b a jealous rival in the court.

>>60604925

>>60735400
It could have been that due to being a devout Slaaneshii for so long he craved something new. Slaanesh is a jealous deity and didn't take his lack of faithfulness well.

>>60735400
>>60736746
I think we might be conflating the two. Slaanesh saying they ate a Man of Gold would be in the same way as them eating Lileath, Vaul, and Asuryan: super-dead. If we had a fully Chaos-embraced Man of Gold running around bad things would be happening.

>>60731800
The idea of Ghazzy being steered into someone else is kind of funny when you think of it. Although I'm not sure how well Commorragh would have worked since Ghazzy, Vect, and Malys know one another. Not as friends, but Ghazzy knows he can't be too open or they'll kill him and they see him as one of the main warbosses they have to control to get the orks to do what they want.

>>60736871
Depends on the condition they ended up in. If I'd gone for thousands of years in a gay orgy with all of the worst bug chasers in the universe whilst living off of diet of crack and horse tranquilizers I would not be operating at peak performance.

Also Men of Gold were supposed to interfere with consciousness greater than themselves. The one Slaanesh fucked rather than ate may have initially made contact by substituting Slaanesh for a Iron Mind.

>>60737769
Honestly, I think it works better if whether Slaanesh actually got her hand-dicks on a Man of Gold remains unconfirmed claims that may or may not be true. Giving a solid answer to something ambiguous can detract from a story's appeal.
Plus, a Man-of-Gold with Chaos blessings and Warp-steroids isn't the type of thing that a company of Grey Knights could handle. You'd need multiple Phoenix Lords with Astartes support as a bare minimum, and that's giving the "good guys" a generous helping of plot armor.

>>60725079
I like this. Bonus points if Klax survived by luck and he knows it

>>60734161
>Such settlements would not be luxurious. They would be dockyards at the end of a tunnel with low level accommodation. It would be the equivalent of working on an oil rig.
Maybe not luxurious, but certainly not cramped or grimy either. The scale of a single port structure on the ring would dwarf most hives, and if its even somewhat functional it would be automated to a level of efficiency unmatched by most imperial ports. Living in even a tiny reactivated structure on the Cthonian ring would be like living in the City from Blame with somewhat more ornamental architecture. A single dome on the outer surface might be large enough to hold a nation, a single docking spire could service a whole armada of ships, and a population of a few billion could fit into either with room to spare. The accommodations might be like an oil rig in terms of comfort, but in scale it would be like more like all the industrial zones of modern day earth in one big block, just being the area brought back on line in a single structure.

>>60737889
Thinking back to those older mentions, I think there were claims from all four chaos gods about having one or more Men of Gold in their service, either in the past or currently. Similarly, they all could brag of having killed Men of Gold and Iron Minds in the Iron War with a level of plausibility.

The Rangdan Abomination was an Iron Mind, and it was stated to explore the warp and hold congress with daemons by way of its machine spirit/soul/warp impression. The historical races section describes the souls/warp forms of Iron Minds as deamon-esque beings made of conceptual clockwork, and we've already been floating the idea that the Iron Minds and Men of Gold were the GaBHD's equivalent of warp gods, with individual power levels surpassing the greatest daemons but below individuals from the Eldar pantheon. We didn't affiliate the Rangdan Abomination with any of the four in specific, and going by power (and their very alien though processes) Iron Minds might be strong enough to remain free agents even when corrupted by Chaos. Golden Men are much closer to mortals in mentality and the structure of their souls, so the gods might have an easier time binding them to their will.

I just found a TV Tropes page for this setting. Is it one of us that's made the page, or a lurking TV Tropes native?

>>60743298
Lurking Tv Tropes native. It popped up and then hasn't been updated since, notice all the tropes that are left blank without explanation.

>>60744864
Interesting to know. I think they occasionally sift 1d4chan and update from there.

On an unrelated and somewhat meta note, I remember a pattern of discussions on topics ranging from characters to places and events in which we discuss whether something is too similar to an existing piece of lore to be included in a given form. The respective sides of the debate have been the argument against telling repetitive generic stories, preservation of uniqueness, and focus on variety, and the other being acknowledgement of the repetition of events in history, circumstantial similarities between individuals, and the idea that in ten thousand years across and across a galaxy it would make sense for some similar events and people to be prominent. Has there been any consensus as to which argument should guide writing and editing for the project?

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bump

>>60740989
I think The Rangdan Abomination was the last of it's kind. Certainly no others have been seen since

>>60745607

O I get it, it's a man of gold!

>>60750269
Named Oscar, at that.

>>60750329

...!

Ok that's amazing.

So how is Ephemeral Stern doing?

>>60751451
Nothing was set in concrete. Not yet anyway. With the Emperor not being a god it means that she has to be getting her power from somewhere else. I think one of the few things that was agreed on was that after 10,000 years the chance recombination of genes that created Magnus the Red has occurred again but due to a different upbringing has manifested in physical buffs rather than more overt wizard magic.

She started out as a latent psyker but the trauma of being stitched into The Flesh Cage caused them to go active and everyone involved with making The Cage had a very bad day.

She wandered into the Webway where she would have died of starvation eventually but for a chance encounter with Inquisitor Silas Hand (an eldar in this AU) and the merry band of Hunters he was traveling with at the time.

Hand and Stern form a kickass team after the investigation and go on many Inquisitorially sanctioned adventures together and hunt down many monsters.

>>60663968
It could also have been that the Ultramar government wanted to do something about the place but never could due to prior arrangements. Then Angron comes along, reks the place and Ultramar has it's problem solved for them. They make the token complaints but it's all just procedure, in truth they were happy the place got what it deserved.

>>60725038
>https://pastebin.com/fLzgxPwL
An improvement was made

>>60752028
>With the Emperor not being a god
Does this really mean anything though? I mean, there are bound to be cults worshipping Oscar directly- considering how belief works in 40K, who's to say that he isn't at least somewhat empowered?

>>60754586
That may be but Stern, as a member of the Adepta Securitas, absolutely does not worship him as a god. So if there is or is not a big reserve of undirected power she isn't tapping into it.

Magnus wasn't tapping into anything enhancing, he was just extremely powerful in his own right. Much like the APEX twins.

>>60740644
I can see it being built on an inhuman scale. It would be intentional. The Iron Minds did at least in part build The Ring as a dick measuring vanity project. They would have kept it usable for humans because they would have wanted them to see it but they would have made it inhumanly grand because they would want them to know that It might be called the Great and Bountiful Human Dominion but it sure as shit wasn't anything human calling the shots by that point.

>>60755946
The Iron Minds and Men of Iron were human in an All Tomorrows sense, as much as the weirder Men of Stone were

>>60756934
>weirder Men of Stone
Elaborate?
Men of gold were the superhumans that could interact with Men of Iron overminds and relay information at FTL speeds
Men of Iron=straight-up robots and AI, completely inorganic

>>60757025
Men of Stone were completely organic and the legitimate heirs of humanity and ancestors of the human population of the Imperium. They went in for gene-splicing and that is the reason for Ogryn and Void Born and other developing so fast.

And those are just the long-term stable ones that survived the passage of long years

>>60757025
During the GaBHD the children of Sol spread across the galaxy, but it definitely wasn't a long enough time to reach the level of variance they did with unassisted evolution. We've been running with the idea that abhumanism is the result of a massive genetic engineering overhaul of organic humans early in their expansion into the galaxy, called Men of Stone for their combination of durability and mutability. One of the oldest strains are the Navigators, a triumph of the Iron Minds, viable humans with a sample of reconstructed Old One genes producing the third eye. Other projects saw mankind adapted to numerous extremophile environments, and optimized in response to the many hazards of the galaxy. Its the reason Cadians have lenses in their irises that filter Chaotic radiation and Catachans have abs like flack armor, humans of the Imperial era have the biological blessings of a previous golden age.

Theres also the fact that human societies with heavy augmentation like the Mechanicus and the Olamic Quietude trace their ways most directly back to the GaBHD. This as well as the cultural habits we've alluded to make it seem likely the line between humans and human level AI in the human dominion would be frequently crossed, if not blurred to nonexistence. While large networks of purely mechanical Men of Iron were present and tied to the Iron Minds, independent AI like Tiberius has also been mentioned. To add to that, late Men or Iron like Castigator, as well as Men of Gold are so advanced as to blur machine and flesh. It follows that there was a significant transhuman/posthuman population in the GaBHD, all under the absolute rule of the Iron Minds, as well as novel strains of abhuman that would beggar imagination.

>>60757751
There were also the fuckups. Ogryn went retarded and beastmen were both mentally and physically unstable. Presumably in a functioning GaBHD they could have been tweaked and repaired over time. The lower tech base of the AoS meant that the errors became cumulative.

This could have been avoided with research into stabilizing it all but it was far cheaper and easier to just fix things immediately as they went wrong. The Iron Minds weren't infallible and they didn't think the good days would end. Chaos wasn't something they appreciated the danger of.

>>60745451
I can understand the wish to hold a unique nature to the project as a whole in regards to separating it from its origins and other fan projects, yet I think we can safely say that thousands of years of history across the whole width of the galaxy will end up with a few situations repeating ad nauseam.

Although I don't want to reignite the debate and let it spiral out of control, I would just see that there would be little chance of us ensuring total variety through every writer that contributes.

>>60751030
>>60750329
So, if any drawfag wants to get onto some art with a massive Emperor statue being portrayed in that stance on a hive world, I think that would be pretty great.

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>>60758816

bump

>>60752028
If she was like Magnus then she would be a slight mutant. Magnus was half navigator and the navigators are all very small part Old One. From that we can assume she wasn't augmented so she wouldn't have been part of the Orders Militant. Which of the non-Militant orders should she have been from?

>>60733249
Oh sweet fuck that's a good filename

>>60756934
>>60757025
>>60757601
>>60757751
>>60758162
The reasons for the differences between the various groups, both abhuman and baseline human, are said to differ between natural selection, genetic engineering, or both depending on who you are talking about.

Cadians and squats are just boring old natural selection, the differences between them and your average human about as exotic as the genes that let some groups of people digest milk, or some people to have light or dark skin, etc. Cadian purple eyes evolved because those with non-purple eyes on Cadia tended to go crazy more often. They’re not even different enough to be abhumans, they’re just weird baseline populations in the same way that Prosperans look sunburnt, Interex have huge ears, Nostromans are pale with big eyes, etc. Squat differences have nothing to do with their height, it’s a few genes related to preventing heart disease under high gravity, but it was enough for the AdMech to fudge some paperwork in an attempt

Ratlings are also said to be natural selection, but their changes were a bit more pronounced due to being stuck on a planet that just entered an ice age.

Felinids are a clear case of a Dark Age society going “oh shit” and genetically engineering themselves to be able to survive off of the land before their tech base completely broke down. At least one Ogryn planet, Catachan, has a similar story (even in the Dark Age Catachan was never meant to be inhabited).

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>>60764335
Navigators are genetically engineered products of the GaBHD. We all know where the Fenrisian wolves come from, even if the average person doesn’t. The octo-humans are due to the Old Eldar Empire being dicks and giving them the REMOVE QU treatment. Voidborn are currently unknown, they aren’t that different but their differences are heritable and enough that it can mess with geneseed (which is designed to work on baseline humans using the genetic variety on Earth as the standard).

Beastmen have been implied to possibly be very shoddy attempts at creating a servitor race or something similar, which is why there are so many populations of beastmen across the various worlds. They may not even be humans in the strictest sense, possibly being uplifted animals spliced with a ton of human DNA to make them smarter or able to use tools or chimeras created wholesale from a mixture of human and animal DNA. It’s even possible that different beastmen populations have different origins. Whatever they started out as, they clearly weren’t designed with any sort of quality, suggesting whoever designed them didn’t care that much of about quality (or assumed they could fix things that cropped up) or were really, really rushed, because their DNA looks like crap. The AdBio assumed they were abhuman and fixed the problem by splicing in even more human DNA, which has made them a little more stable (did we ever decide if Tzaangors were in?)

>>60764496

And then you have the various versions of cyborgs. Men of Stone who decided to forgo their flesh and upload their minds into A.I. Men of Iron who preferred the stability of the material world over cyberspace and became “human” by putting themselves in a single meat-and-bone avatar with an electronic brain. And everything in between (think your typical tech-priest or Adam Jensen). Many of which either had some Internet-esque connection to the Iron Minds, went crazy, had to be killed, and were lumped in with “Men of Iron” by history, or the technology to make them didn't survive in great abundance and they just whittled away through time. Tiberius was basically an old man with no wifi connection who had to use a screen or plug in like the rest of us.

The strange thing is that despite being increasingly alien in mindset, the Iron Minds were more similar to humanity in outlook than a lot of other species out there (at least if you strip away the godlike computing power and post-survival outlook). Similar enough at least that the Men of Iron and Men of Gold were seen as "Men" in their time (the Iron Minds possibly less so, in the same sense the canon Emperor is seen as ''''human''''), and Drach'nyen's "cannot be defeated by human violence" power might apply to them (which is a good thing he's currently stuck as a pointy stick).

In general, populations with high cybernetic augmentation tend to be those with a high tech base from the DaoT.

>>60764638
>>(think your typical tech-priest or Adam Jensen)
Would this include Nano-technologically augmented individuals like J.C Denton and his brother Paul?

>>60765353
We know that the Bloodtide was a nanotech terror weapon the insane Men of Iron created out of a corrupted medical device. There is also mention in canon and here of omniphages, which are basically a DaoT "fuck everything" button in the form of gray goo.

If the GaBHD was capable of brute force applications of nanotechnology, and we know they are capable of Jensen-level augmetics based on the AdMech, then it's possible that they were at least experimenting with more advanced ways of using them, at least before it all went to shit. Nanomachines don't seem to be mentioned too much as a thing in the present timeline, but it's possible some "viruses" are basically cyborg viruses. I could have sworn someone once said the Life Eater was nanite based.

Still not advanced as what the Star Empire has, though. Necrodermis is basically nanomachines in a macroscopic form, hence the whole "living metal" and Necrons being able to tell it what to do.

>>60764496
Presumably Tzaangors are just beastmen who went to Chaos and either weren't fixed by the AdBoi or have since mutated again

>>60769565
There was a description of Tzaangors as a bunch of Igor/Gothic gargoyle-like familiars for the Tzeentchian colleges of the Webways in one of the old threads.

The idea of Chaos-corrupted Beastmen in service to the Crone Eldar is kind of interesting, as it really highlights the general Crone mindset of everyone else as useful, talking animals and little else.

>>60769985
If there are a significant number of them, enough to form a cultural influence that lasts, it could also result in a reason why beastmen don't trust psykers. Tzaangors tend to be drawn to bigbird so they often get magic.

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>>60771409
The similarities just keep mounting up.

>>60764335
Squat's aren't in any meaningful way genetically any different to baseline humans. The dorfness is just what happens if you spend your formative years in high gravity.

They are classed as Abhuman because the AdMech were the ones doing the filing and the Hubworlders and the Olympus Mons Brotherhood don't get along well. Hubworlders don't submit to outside authority. The classification was the equivalent of the OMB calling them niggers.

>>60761081
For no reason other than to show that she was originally a woman of peace who was driven to war Orders Dialogous, Order of the Lexicon. Her life was supposed to be spent making translation books to assist in understanding between the many and varied parts of the Imperium

>>60764496
That pic is basically cloning in 40K.

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What kind of numbers would be involved in a typical space-battle? Not just dealing with pirates or whatnot, but something like a splinter group from a Waagh, or the hundreds of smaller conflicts around planets during the periods between Crusades, where there isn't so much a main fleet as raiding parties.

I believe that line-ships, like Cruisers and Light Cruisers, would be fairly limited in such confrontations, with the majority of such engagements being essentially "Cruiser (x) and her escorts." Escort-class ships are the more common sight, with relatively important planets like worlds with space-docks or significant enough contributions having around three Escort-class ships as a local guard force.

Part of the reason for the oft-repeated adage of most space battles being between "single ships" is more referring to Line ships than actual vessels involved. Destroyers and Frigates are considered too small and easily-replaced to count to the general public. To put it another way, Escorts are the Sloops of the void-seas; small, nimble, and great for rapid response and token defenses, but not considered legitimate warships in their own right, especially considering how the majority begin or end their careers as civilian vessels.

>>60767734
The Bloodtide was also self aware but it had no agency beyond asking for death.

>>60777490
Sounds about right, most of the ships called to defend a given Administrated system would be local utility ships with some degree of militarization

>>60764335
This discussion reminds me that a Men of Stone writeup needs doing

bamp

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>>60775888
On an AdBio heavy planet would there be the possibility of Blade Runner style Replicants?

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Has anyone ever posted a picture/described what the throne room looks like in this AU?

>>60783023
Not that I know of

>>60781426
I'd think that even for the Adbio that'd be skirting the edges of AI. Like classic servitors, I'd suspect that the AdBio's servants be obviously nonhuman, though in this more cosmopolitan Imperium, it'd be very easy to mistake one of their servant creatures as simply another abhuman/alien.

That'd make for a good plot for a TTRPG or story, actually- a sapient bio-servitor (or servitors) escapes and tries to hide in a vibrant Imperial metropolis, while a team of AdBio agents try to recapture or neutralize them before anyone finds out what they've done.

It also raises the question of what might happen if these servitors can breed true- would they then be allowed entry into the Imperium proper? And what would the OMB think?

>>60785674
I remember something on the notes page along the lines of the AdBio being free to use sentient volunteers as long as they don't abuse.

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>>60783023
There was some description of what the Imperial Palace is like. It’s this huge structure built about somewhere between Moscow and Perm. Houses a whole bunch of stuff ranging from the important things like the offices of the High Lords, a big chunk of the Administratum’s bureaucracy, one of the major Webway gates on Earth, to relative minutiae including an orphanage and a museum dedicated to human history. Ironically, despite nominally being the Emperor and Empress’ house the two barely ever stay there. Indeed, that was one of the reasons we weren’t sure Isha’s garden (as in the physical one she has as a hobby) is there, as the two spend more time on the Bucephalus or bouncing from place to place via the Webway. The Imperial Palace is also at least partially Perturabo and Dorn designed, so it’s just as much of a deathtrap as anything else Perturabo built, with hidden passages everywhere.

The Golden Throne itself is actually some piece of DaoT archaeotech junk the Emperor, at that time the Warlord, dragged out of the Despot of Ursh’s treasure vaults to set up as some big important symbol of the “rightful ruler of the Imperium” so people would stop asking him to take charge for the five-hundredth time. One of the suggestions made for the Kaldor Draigo idea was that the Golden Throne might actually be the endpoint for something like Dark Glass, the DaoT attempt to hack into the eldar webway, in which case making the Golden Throne the centerpiece of the Imperial Palace may turn out to be a bad thing.

>>60781426
>>60785674

It depends on what one means by replicants. If you mean specially bred humans, the AdMech vat grow humans all the time, the AdBio do weirder things (people trees and using your own body as a surrogate for selected breeding), and, you know, Krieg.

I agree though that it makes a good TTRPG hook or story, especially given how the AdBio have gone too far before, like with the project that produced Legi being hijacked.

>>60777518

I think we decided those were two different Bloodtides to account for the extreme difference in personality between the canon appearances. Different corruptions of the same model, or one was less broken than the other. One was able to talk (but kept asking for death) and was suborned by Voldorius, the other was mindless and was able to be hijacked by a Bloodthirster.

>>60769985
>>60771409
>>60772330

I would suggest that maybe they not hate psykers for that very reason, as well as the fact that if Chaos is going to snatch up a world of Beastmen, they’re going to grab the whole bunch rather than be picky. Even if only a few of them meet their standards, the rest can always be canon fodder or Nightmare food. Or at least, no more paranoid of psykers than everyone else, and while they probably do hate the Crones, it’s probably more for the same reasons that everyone hates the Crones.

Also I don’t think there was ever any discussion on whether the Tzaangors went in or not.

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>>60777795
I had this that I was working on, it was supposed to be the kind of dry "what are humans" entry a curious sheltered young tau or eldar might find in an encyclopedia somewhere. Obviously this is a work in progress and not well polished.

Humans (Homo sapiens spp.) are a species of bipedal mammal native to the planet of Old Earth in the Segmentum Solar. Humans naturally range between 90 and 250 centimeters at adulthood, though their size and appearance is heavily dependent on the population they come from. Like many life-bearing worlds, the ecology of Old Earth shows signs of having been tampered with by the Old Ones, however the specific group to which humans belong did not begin to diversify until roughly around the end of the War in Heaven sixty-five million years ago, after a catastrophe wiped out the planet’s formerly dominant organisms, something that is thought to be related to the general Necron purge of Old One vivarium worlds.

Prior to the Age of Strife, humans were organized into the “Great and Bountiful Human Dominion”. The Great and Bountiful Human Dominion, in turn, were organized into the “Interstellar League” a group of allied like-minded xenos species that banded together in the face of external threats, mostly Orks and increasingly up to the Age of Strife raiding parties by the Old Eldar Empire. It is unknown how many other species were part of the Intersolar League, though it is known that the Tarellian Empire were members and there are suspicions that Kinebrach were as well.

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>>60787149
Life in the Great and Bountiful Human Empire was dominated by the use of the Men of Iron, an artificially created race of sapient artificial constructs, which were linked to the Iron Minds, extremely powerful silica animus. The Iron Minds were originally created by humans, but their thought processes were so alien to humans that communication was nearly impossible. In order to facilitate communication with both the Iron Mind and the rest of the Empire as a whole, humans and the Iron Minds collaborated to created the Men of Gold (Homo sapiens aureus), a genetically engineered subspecies with substantial psychic, biological, and pseudo-cybernetic modification that could act as a link between the god-like Iron Minds and the average human and aid in broader faster-than-light communication to the wider galaxy.

Human (or “human beings” as they are sometimes referred to), are the second, possibly the third most abundant sentient life form in the galaxy, after intelligent orkoids and possibly after tyranids or necrons, depending on how one estimates the populations of these species and whether one considers them “sentient life”.

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>>60787205
Prior to the Age of Strife, there were few subspecies of humans aside from artificially created variants like H. s. aureus (Men of Gold), H. s. navigo (Navigators), and H. s. variegatus (beastmen), as the human world were linked into a single empire and there were few opportunities for speciation. During the Age of Strife, most human worlds were effectively cut off from one another, which led to genetic isolation and the evolution of many distinct species, including H. s. minutus (ratlings), H. s. hirstutus (felinids), the “Ogryn subspecies complex” (H. s. giganteus, H. s. cranopus, and related forms).

Hubworlders, although often (mis)classified as H. s. rotundus, are not actually a distinct subspecies from baseline humanity. Genetic analysis of Hubworlders have found them to deviate from inhabitants of Old Earth (who are considered to be the genetic standard for humanity) to a degree comparable to the inhabitants of Cadia or many other worlds across the galaxy: in other words, not enough to be regarded as anything more than a local variant of baseline humanity. (Insert section talking about how their stature is due to gravity, and the AdMech classifying them as abhumans out of revenge for not rolling over for Mars).

Keep in mind this was with older lore, before we really started talking about the DaoT, so its a little out of date.

Beyond that it was going to talk about how humans resemble and differ from other species, pointing out what differs varies from species to species. Also mentioning how despite their similarities humans and eldar evolved their appearance convergently and are very different in several details, much like the case on Old Earth of dogs and thylacines, a carnivorous marsupial which was a popular pet during the Dark Age and exported to several planets (by extension implying humans cloned thylacines during the DaoT and spread them everywhere, and by extension history has become so muddled by M41 no one knew they went extinct).

>>60787313
>>60787313
It's good. It could go under culture and society section as A Tau Guide To Man or something

>>60787110
If they do go in Tzaangor could be a beastman swear word that means degenerate

ded

>>60781426
Possibly. It would have to be a world that had a reason for it. Maybe they were afflicted by a sterility plague or some other reason that vat-grown progeny became a tradition.

>>60791601
Or they could be the result of some sort of bottleneck and the whole thing is now cultural.

is there a little mentioned vanilla canon world we can tack this on to? Birmingham was jokingly mentioned as a sunless planet of low tech inbreds in Rogue Trader in the 80s

>>60787149
>Voyager
>ye olde classical dick pic
>eldar maidens point and giggle

>>60794199
And blushing while glancing at each other.

>>60777490
It should be pointed out that even the smallest warp capable ship often last for thousands of years

>>60787149
Is the Voyager in a museum somewhere?

>>60796742
Someone crunched the numbers and it turns out by M41 Voyager won't have even reached Proxima Centauri. It's probably too far in the gap between stars to try and track it down, though someone always could have with OP-plz nerf Dark Age tech. Or the Orks could have found it by accident.

The museum in the Imperial Palace does have the Titan Rover from Mars (I wonder how that got there given how picky the cogboys are about tech) and parts from the first functioning Warp Engine humanity ever built (presumably the first that didn't go Event Horizon).

>>60789078
I haven't seen any votes no, but no votes yes. I will try to dig up the old writeup.

>>60788588
Still needs a bit of work (am the one who wrote it). Good way to get some of the general fluff up. Will try revising it when able.

Just had an idea on when and how the schism between Orioc and the Martian Mechanicum could have started. In Watchers of the Throne/The Carrion Throne there is mention of an AdMech district on Terra called Skhallax City, which in canon was created when the AdMech had to supervise rebuilding after the Horus Heresy. Skhallax City could be the capital of Orioc.

Orioc initially submitted itself to Mars because Mars was the holy land and the scattered brotherhoods of the AdMech were re-uniting under one house once again. There was a honeymoon period where everything was peachy which lasted the entire Crusade. Then the Beast comes and both Earth and Mars are torn to pieces, and then you have the Martian Civil War where the exiles come back and cause a schism offering false wisdom and Kelbor-Hal’s plate-twirling act blows up. Things get so crazy that the Dragon almost gets loose and, if we are going by the Beast Arises series, the AdMech get desperate enough to temporarily lift the ban on inventing things (Ordinatus tanks) to make the problem go away.

Earth and Mars are the administrative and industrial hearts of the Imperium, respectively. But with all that damage it is going to take a lot of money to rebuild it, especially Mars given its importance in industry. Orioc kind of gets shafted because most of the money going to Earth goes to non-AdMech factions, since it is assumed Mars will provide for them, and most of the money going to Mars stays on Mars. Orioc asks if they can get some funds to rebuild. Olympus Mons brotherhood say no, Holy Mars is more important. Orioc starts reconsidering if putting themselves below Mars was a good idea. Not enough to become space Protestants, but enough to start complaining.

>>60795609
Well, yes, in the same vein that lobsters are biologically immortal. The hardware is capable of continuing to function for that long with proper maintenance, and similarly impressive lengths with “duct-tape and glue” maintenance, but the main reason for small warships to last that long boils down to “never seen action.” Small skirmishes against pirates in their own Escort-class ships are one thing, since both parties will typically keep their distance in the interest of survival, but actual military encounters tend to have notable attrition rates.
Biggest reason for this is because the Imperium is usually defending, and while smaller void ships are fast and pack a respectable punch, they do not hold up well in battles of attrition. Line-ships are perfectly capable of having multiple battles under their belt, but Escorts simply have too little staying power; the margin between “no damage” and “we need to warp out” is so relatively small that if you reach that point, it’s already too late. Not to mention how many of the Imperium’s enemies love to go after the weakest link first.

>>60799629
Given those assumptions, it wouldn't surprise me if the Imperium has relatively fewer escorts compared to overall fleet strength than most other factions.

>>60798551
Seems good, it would only have escalated from there

>>60801546
Actually, it might be the opposite. Humanity’s greatest advantage is their numbers and manufacturing base that can pump out disposable gear in great enough numbers to make equipping soldiers all across the galaxy. In addition, the Imperium is the faction with the most use for civilian and merchant void vessels- everybody except the blatantly-evil factions engages in trade, but the Imperium has the most ground to cover and the most associates to trade with- all survivor/Xenos civs trade with the Imperium, but they don’t necessarily trade with each other.
As such, the shipbuilding Forgeworlds are likely pumping out a disproportionate number of Escort-class ships. On the one hand, this means the Imperium is more likely to wind up in situations where a group of Escorts are up against a Line ship and her escorts. On the other, even with all those numbers, there are significant areas in the Imperium where the distance to any response fleets whatsoever is “too far away to matter.”
The Imperium does it’s best to account for these shortcomings; many sectors are patrolled by “Wolf Packs” whose entire purpose is working together to punch above their weight-class, and general doctrine for outmatched ships or fleets is “fall back to the nearest rally-point or Line-ship, whichever is closer.” The Line-ships aren’t sitting idle either, and a single line ship with a half-dozen escorts can potentially match three enemy line-ships- Escorts might be fragile, but they’ve got teeth, and ignoring the small fries to go after “da big’un” has cost many an Ork fleet dearly.

damp

>>60798551
There may also have been a move in the reforms to get The Gorgon promoted to a position of importance in the hierarchy of the priesthood. Dissatisfaction when suggestion was rejected because he was to close to the Imperium

>>60806870
That could be the source of conflict. The Antarctic Brotherhood wanted greater recognition for providing a lot more for the Imperium than it's relatively small numbers and resources would suggest quite besides producing the Gorgon Primarch and the enormously useful contributions he had personally made with the contacting and unifying of the other distant enclaves and forgeworlds.

Olympus Mons Brotherhood does not share power and has always taken the stance that all brotherhoods are equal (beneath them). Given the prominence of The Gorgon in Imperial culture in general and the reverence he holds in Mechanicus culture in particular this is interpreted as the opening shot in an attempted usurpation of Mars and the Machanicus. In the lifetime of The Gorgon things are kept a lid on by

>>60798155
Dark Age humanity could have found it by going in the direction that they know it took because they would still have access to the old historical NASA records. Plot where it probably is, give an AI a ship or two and tell it to search the most probable location aided by being FTL capable.

Voyager if recovered would have been put in a museum for children to marvel at the ambition of their primitive forefathers. New AI would have visited it like we look at dinosaur bones.

At some point it would have been transferred to Cthonia as Old Earth is eclipsed and left behind. Assuming it survived the star going wrong and the fighting it is almost certainly still in it's old exhibition. It would have been too shit to loot.

>>60786437
Golden Throne isn't that in this AU. Imperium has access to the Webway, just not unlimited access and the reasons for that are sensible and known.

The defunct webway gate that Vanilla Emps used to jack into the webway was instead used in this AU by supercharging it and using it to drill into the deepest layers of the warp and bridge the gap into the Realm of Chaos.

This was not done on Old Earth or anywhere else that was even slightly valuable. Presumably the gate was destroyed or at least disassembled not long afterwards due to how dangerous the bloody thing was.

>>60798551
If thread is still here this evening I'm going to try and write a blurb on the Orioc Kingdoms.

>>60725038
Should this be put up on the page? If so where should it be put?

>>60808750
Dark Age humanity was written to have done something like that with their generation ships, since they got warp-travel working before the first sleeper ships could reach their destinations.

Also, with the scale of building on Cthonia, reserving an outer-side dome for a museum of historical ships would be entirely within the means of the GaBHD, and the Voyager could fit into such a museum's back catalogue like a single Roman spoon between the many eras of torch-ships and fusion driven contraptions that would all be looted long before it.

>>60811701
There is still always the possibility of finding a lost ship. total bullshit all the old ships are accounted for, not that it stops idiots with totally genuine treasure maps

>>60809676
I'm assuming that the pieces were stored in separate lead lined boxes at distant parts of Ganymede. Too risky to leave in one piece but it may one day be needed so best not to destroy it.

>>60604925
How the hell did this mediocre shit last 63 threads...

>>60811431
There's a shiny new Xenos page intended just for Xenos Independens groups like these.

>>60809676
In canon, humanity tried to hack into the Webway using stuff like the Dark Glass device from the Horus Heresy novels. Assuming the same stuff is present here, I assume the motivation of the Iron Minds was along the lines of "fuck those fucking knife-eared pricks and their Empire, take away their biggest advantage".

But yes, the Steward's long-term intention was to get humans using the Webway like in canon, until he talked with the people who actually used the Webway on a regular basis (the eldar). They presumably looked at him with an expression of equal parts confusion, bewilderment, and laughter before showing him how bad the Webway was.

The Webway is a glorious piece of crap, but it’s a piece of crap nonetheless. Travel through it is highly disorienting and sometimes dangerous even during the heyday of the Old Eldar Empire. It’s very fragile, very prone to breakage, and worst of all nobody knows how to fix it (laughs in Tuchulcha). The Eldar know how to fix minor breaks, but repairing major damage is the like the difference between knowing how to change a tire and knowing how to change an engine. Of which the birth of Slaanesh did it no favors, because now there’s holes in the Webway submerged in the Eye that allow things like daemons and psychneuin to get in. Luckily the Webway kind of self-compensates for damage (and is alive…sort of, and has a bad sense of humor), but eventually it is likely to reach a point where it just can’t function anymore. “Don’t fuck with the Webway” is one of the few things Craftworld and Dark Eldar agree on.

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>>60811092
Events have not gone as planned. I'm sorry.

>>60775140
If she was like Magnus she would have to be half-Navigator as well. Magnus' weirdness was almost certainly due to having the Old One gene.

>>60820843
I think this was part of the reason why people didn’t like the idea of Stern being a second Magnus. Magnus was a one off, weird even by the standards of the teeming masses of humanity. Plus Warpy stuff generally doesn’t duplicate well. Some explanation is required, since being thrown into a cage made from the screaming, twitching bodies of your comrades does not turn normal people into daemon punching machines, but a complete repeat of one of the primarchs is a bit much. Especially since you can make a similar argument by saying it was latent Navigator gene + unusual circumstances + self perception causing the same thing. The Navigator gene is weird. It’s rarely consistent.

Everyone seemed to liked the Inquisitor Hand idea though.

>>60775140
I like that. It really highlights the twist of fate nature of what happened to her. Yes, one of her parents was a Navigator, but that normally means jack and shit because the Navigator gene is recessive. There are probably loads of half-Navigator individuals out there for which nothing interesting ever happens (indeed, probably less than their full Navigator cousins since they are considered unimportant when it comes to Navigator House politics unless you are really crafty or really desperate). Stern was not one of them.

>>60822677
So we leave the origins of her ability ambiguous

>>60822677
So we're keeping Hand as an eldar Hunter Disciple who joined the Inquisition to hunt bigger game.

>>60826716
Yes.

He was born on Siam-Hann some time in late M37 or thereabouts making him an extremely old and experienced eldar by the time he encountered Stern. His name in the court speech of the Old Empire literally meant The Hands Of The Gods but non-eldar found it hard to say and he got sick of people mangling the pronunciation. Silas came from having to fill out some forms when dealing with human border guards just after eating a tin of Silas' Tinned Vegetable Paste.

He started on the path of the Enforcer remarkably early though never actually became pathlost due to getting bored with it every few centuries. He would then take a break and go on a different path from anywhere between 50 to 200 years before returning to being an Enforcer. He continued this pattern until some time towards the end of M38.

In late M38 he was tracking an at the time quite notorious and sadistic bandit and outlaw through the mountains of some backwater agri-world when he encountered a party of Hunter Disciples who were also tracking the bandit with different intentions besides arrest and trial. At first he was appalled by their attitudes and lack of regard for legal procedures but as he spent time with them and learned of their beliefs and traditions he started to see the world with different eyes. By the time they caught up with the bandit he was slain rather than arrested; Silas Hand had become one of the Hunters and he left in their company.

He remained with the other hunters until the early half of M40 when on hunt for the Daemon Prince Kernax Voldorius, thrice cursed and faithless, along side Kor'sarro Khan of the White Scars he first met an agent of the Inquisition.

Is there any art of the 'civilized' Beastmen? And if you were playing them in the RPGs (let's say DH 2e), what stats would you give them?

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>>60828219
I think that the civilized ones just look and to a certain extent act like Qunari. Stat wise it would just be a slightly more durable human with slightly shit social skills.

>>60827610
Presumably he initially just saw the Inquisition as a means of hunting bigger game. If Voldorius was the sort of shit they hunted he wanted in.

It would only be after accompanying them for a while that he would come to realize that the Inquisition is the perfect fusion of his old love of the Enforcer path and his new life as a Hunter. Stays in the Inquisition and really throws himself into the work. Eventually becomes an Inquisitor in his own right.

>>60822677
If they have the gene but it's receive then they might still be able to be bred back into the Navigator lines after a few generations to allow a trickle of new genes.

>>60828716
Probable lower max San due to trying to keep instincts at bay, but might get earlier chances to reroll given most of their society's strong discipline. So when they do break, they break hard.

>>60826106
I think recessive Navigator gene doing something was the most popular option, though the Imperium doesn't know exactly what. They can speculate out their butt all they'd like, but they have no way of confirming most of the theories.

>>60830284
It would only be something that they suspect from not easily provable occurrences.

She and her siblings are all born at three years apart, five of them all having birthdays within the same two weeks. A particular trader ship visits the system every three years and enters orbit approximately nine months before those two weeks.

She and her siblings are all pale and lanky.

Her mother's grand-mother was a commercial astropath.

It's speculated that the psyker gene has been passed down the generations but the ability was always latent. She's just the first in generation that it's switched to active. Somehow it's been amplified by the recessive Navigator/Old One gene.

Or at least that's what they assume. Navigators have often had unofficial families. Navigators have had unofficial families with psykers both active and latent before now. Why has she gone full on crazy powerful? Who the fuck knows. It's the warp.

Of course there's no legal way to prove who her father actually is. The Navigator of that boat is married, he won't officially admit to an extramarital affair as his family would look bad.

In any case it might all be totally baseless speculation. Her abilities could have been an unintended side effect of the cage interacting with some unknown billions to one variable.

>>60813502
Despite the megacity sized port-city settlement on the edge of the ring, itself with a population of several billion that have been around since the Great Hunt at least, much of Cthonia even in the immediate vicinity of the settled portion is almost totally unexplored, just because the ring is so damn huge the area between the bases of the few reactivated docking spires is more than enough new frontier to push into for the time they've been there. Cthonia's area is vast, its internal facilities run deep, and while its structure is stable and somewhat predictable, unlike a planet every next room could hold strange and ancient oddities and perils of design no natural world could compare with. Locals say that between the handful of port spires they have running they could service all the ships in the galaxy all at once, given the manpower and traffic control. It may be so, but Cthonia itself could swallow crusades Black and Golden, and Whaaghs, Xenocides, and Tyranid splinter fleets, just like the adventurers and treasure hunters that vanish into it on a daily basis.

In the event on another truly major war, the naval yard Cthonia plan might be put to the test. Its close to Old Earth, has the infrastructure to do it and make it worth the investment to make useful, and in a defensive posture massive forces can muster there, or entire sectors could recede into it as a base to wage a system-spanning guerrilla war.