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>>35897536
Current Date and Time: Midday on September 30th, 1953PC

The flow of events has gotten away from you of late. A deal that was meant to just delay an obnoxious foe appears to have galvanised them instead, and you’re busy preparing to seize the initiative. The problem is that doing so puts you in a really bad position.

“I think you might be overestimating your ability to convince the mages that they’re in a hopeless situation,” Gnome says when you tell her of your short term plan. “It was boasted that the construction of the platform would protect the city from the Gods themselves. I can readily believe the mages to be egotistical enough to believe that.”

“Egotistical doesn’t mean brainless. I’d imagine at least one mage would look at the mass of witch-hunters bearing down on them and realise the danger,” Maloric replies as he looks at the names of the grand magisters of the towers.

“There’s also the knight. He went from Chair to just a regular member of the council. There’s probably a reason they all flock to Ahm,” you say.

“And there’s probably a reason that the knights in Shropham didn’t go to Ahm. Patriotism means they might be happy to die for their city,” Gnome says.

You sigh. It wasn’t that your idea was impossible. It was just that there was every chance that, even if you could get in contact with a tower or knightly order, they simply wouldn’t be interested. Or even if they were, they didn’t think you’d be able to protect them from the Guard or to take the city even with their help.

Still, you were going to have to try. That meant contacting Neir and Karise to see whether their spies were available for this. Sendings were being blocked and any other method would take too long, you fear. You needed the men and women you had in the city to make contact. You use the sending device to contact Harrowmont and Neir’s voice crackles over it, with no sign of Karise.

[DC12/18 Counter Propaganda]

Rolled 2 (1d20)

>>35897550

Rolled 4 (1d20)

>>35897550
not a 1 pls

Rolled 5 (1d20)

>>35897550

don't believe in your failing leaders, believe in me, who believes in a better future, a future Together

There's your failed roll Aspir.

>>35897583
>>35897636
>>35897651
This is what you get for asking us when the last time we failed a roll was, I guess.

>>35897583
>>35897636
>>35897651
Great start. I sense multiple crits from this thread.

>>35897536
So, FMK is a thing
How practical is an enchanted item you can carry that grants flight?
Because, it can be reused if it is light enough to survive long drops

>Fly to higher platform. unclasp it, drop it down. another soldier picks it up. flies up. repeat

>>35897583
>>35897636
>>35897651
When was the last time we succeeded a diplomacy roll?
I am thinking when sarah convinced that baron in vale to join us. back when we just had harrowmont and mier and olmm

>>35897799
This want a diplomacy roll.

And we did one recently.

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Just a quick note that I'll be taking a 2 to 3 hour break in about 2 hours. That will probably be when you'll finalise the battle plan for the city itself.

>>35897687
An effective flying enchantment has to be layered into a full suit of armour.

>Target not met

Neir’s voice is a little tense as she explains the situation, “It seems that Shropham was running inspections on everybody coming up to the upper platform and they somehow detected one of the foxes. It wasn’t difficult for them to get away but the city is more alert and their cover is blown. My spies managed to finish their propaganda work down below before the crackdown happened, but the fact they were spreading these rumours meant they had to hole up too.”

“So, we have a whole lot of spies, including members of Karise’s clan, that are immobile or in a lot of danger,” you say, scowling at this impediment. “Where’s Karise?”

“Organising her foxes. I’m not sure if she’s planning a rescue attempt – I doubt she would without confirming what your plans are,” she says. “What are those?”

You explain your intentions and what you’d hoped your spies would help with. It’s clear even as you say them aloud that you might find yourself a little at odds with Karise over this.

>continued

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>>35898000
“With my spies’ cover blown and the lifts being watched, the only reliable way to make contact with the knightly orders or towers is using the foxes that are already on the platform,” Neir says slowly, thinking as she says every word. “That would put the foxes in great danger if a trap was laid for them, and that is likely. I have received reports of the Order of the Horned Giant not being entirely satisfied with the war but that may not be genuine.”

“So risk the foxes or let the plan lie,” you say, sighing. “I should speak to Karise about this.”

“I doubt she’ll offer much more than the odds of success. She doesn’t like to criticise you or go against you much,” Neir warns. “I know that she’ll be upset over her foxes being in more danger than usual, given their covers are blown and they’re not military. I also know she will seethe silently if she has a problem with you.”

You run a hand through your hair, thinking over the options. There were open rumours about the knights being dissatisfied but the towers were saying nothing. Gnome had warned you about their egos. You needed to carefully weigh up the risks before making a decision.

>1. Try to make contact with the knights in search of allies.
>2. Try to make contact with the mages in search of allies.
>3. Leave the foxes to lie low.
>4. Custom

>>35898022
>3. Leave the foxes to lie low.

Let things calm down a bit. Even if we charge at the city right now, any seige will take days if not weeks.

>>35898022
>3. Leave the foxes to lie low.

>>35898122
it will be sooner. we are rushing in to beat the mage guard there. as well as to be there before the army that is facing the mage guard can retreat and rejoin the city's defenders.

>>35898160
I mean the siege itself. No matter what plan we come up with, we still have to get through the outer wall first, which will take time.

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Clearly people don't like making decisions about maybe putting foxes in danger?

>>35898269
There is no outer wall. It's just a huge sprawl. The only walls are around the central keep and the towers on the platform.

>>35898022
3

>>35898022
>3. Leave the foxes to lie low.

>>35898302
Huh, seems a bit open but ok.

Well, i have an idea or two for how to breach that monstrosity. Will have to wait till we scratch out the plan.

>>35898022
>3. Leave the foxes to lie low.

>>35898345

If you saw how tightly packed and nonsensical the roads were you'd think otherwise. Street fighting is hell

>>35898377
Street fighting is hell for the invader. Locals have a much easier time of it.

>>35898022
Dammit, I hate when I'm late.

>2. Contact with defecting mages would be worth the risk.

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>>35898345
Placing walls around a city of that size tends to be pretty ineffective simply because of the amount of soldiers you'd need to defend it. That was one of the problems Rome had with trying to wall up so much of its city.

Also, the roads are a bit of a crazy sprawl in contrast to that diagram. There's no highways to important areas - you'd need a map to get anywhere slowly.

>3.

“I think it’s for the best if we leave them be for now,” you say after a long period of deliberation. “Gnome’s words about the mages of Shropham believing their own invincibility are nagging at me.”

“If they’re anything like the older nobles in the RSK then that might be right. Father had a lot to say about certain nobles not understanding that they couldn’t defend their lands without the kingdom’s military might,” Neir says, though you’re not sure if she’s just trying to be comforting.

You end the communication and look over your military. You’ve got more soldiers than they do, but you’ll need them. You’re also not sure how many you’ll need to dedicate to transporting supplies. It sounds like the civilians won’t trouble you but progressing through that much sprawl runs the risk of putting your troops out of position and getting ambushed.

This is probably your last chance to do anything regarding your army and its composition. Or to call in allies.

>Are there any last matters to attend to before marching on Shropham?

>>35898302
Random question, but what has the Fortun Garrison been doing this whole time?

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>>35898631
Glaring at the Guard troops on the other side of the border, probably.

>>35898610
I'm trying to think of any allies to call in, are any of the Vampires in the camps actually worth calling up?

Attacking the city right this damn second was a bad idea.

>>35898610
Question. can they actually bombard us from the top? because it seems like they can't. they would have to "shoot" through their own fortification.

the decision is than, do we try to rush uptop and capture the head. or do we thoroughly secure the bottom city first. and then just cut off food to the top until they surrender or come to us (or we sneak in to do something dastardly)

>>35898731
nah, they are all neophates. also this will work in the favor of their PR.

captcha: zsecont occupy

>>35898610
Er, maybe a detachment of those monks that really hate the things Shropham are doing?

>>35898659
Wait, have the mage guard not taken any of Shropham's provinces?

>>35898794
That's not what was said actually.

>>35898763

Those mages don't give a fuck about the city below, they'll waste it if it means stopping us.

>>35898824

No. They expressly said they wanted to level the city and that was about it

>>35898834
>Those mages don't give a fuck about the city below, they'll waste it if it means stopping us.
You misread.
I said they can't shoot it because they will hit their own fortifications
Not that they WON'T shoot us because they would hit their own POPULACE

They are standing on super fortified floor, how do you shoot through super fortified floor?

>>35898885
That is what was said that shropham citizens fear.
But they told us they only intend to raze the tower and slaughter all the mages in them. Not raze the entire city

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>>35898801
You could try to contact the monks at Basilii.

>>35898763
They could easily have stored months of food up there.

>>35898731
Not really in such a short period of time.

>>35898824
They haven't actually conquered them so much as rampaged through them.

>>35898763
If their mages stood on the edge of the platform they could fire down so long as you're not underneath them, though it would cause a lot of collateral damage. Your mages and AAs could fire back but they'd be at a disadvantage. The towers are too small to see over the edge of such a large platform, though.

Note that there is also no wall on the edge of the platform. Anybody who could scale the platform could easily scale such a wall, too.

>>35897583
>>35897636
>>35897651

Of course. We spent all the good rolls last thread.

>>35898927
If the platform falls wouldn't that crush about a third of the city?

Also, we should seriously consider tasking Gnome with making sure the Mages don't drop the damn platform when it becomes obvious we're going to win this one.

I think the key to taking the city is to try and bait the combat mages out somehow, and try to wound them, capture them, tire them out, or kill them one by one in traps. There are only 4, but they are very powerful.
I assume their orders will be to kill as many of our men as possible, but they might also be commanding defensive barriers. Any ideas?

>>35898961
>You could try to contact the monks at Basilii.
Eh, worth a shot if it doesn't slow us down.

>>35898989
>If the platform falls wouldn't that crush about a third of the city?
Why would the platform fall from them razing the TOWERS?
the towers are top of the platform, they can be razed without dropping it.

>>35898993
It seems like Devon won't be answering the call to defend the city. Thats what, 20k soldiers out of the way?

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>>35898961
>You could try to contact the monks at Basilii.
aren't monks good at shutting down mages?

>If their mages stood on the edge of the platform they could fire down so long as you're not underneath them
So there are angles where they basically can't bombard us, that was my point, yes?
see attached image

>>35898993
(additionally)
We also have two weeks if I remember until the guard reaches the city, maybe less. I think we can throw a few days if it means getting rid of those 4 mages.

>>35899119
Picture is wildly inaccurate. They can fire straight down. Only safe haven is directly under the platform. And that comes with its own issues

>>35899197
>They can fire straight down
QM EXPLICITLY said they CANNOT fire directly down
>Only safe haven is directly under the platform. And that comes with its own issues
That is EXPLICITLY what I am asking QM to confirm. and EXACTLY what is shown in the image

>>35899228

Calm down, anon.

>>35899245
I am perfectly calm. capitalization of a single word is called EMPHASIS, it is not showing anger in any way shape or form.

>>35899228
Straight down from the edge. You need to chill

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>>35899228
Ah, so it's the picture that's the problem. Have a different one that might be a tad clearer.

I'm donig a write-up of the monk conversation. Good catch by the guy who tried to contact them.

>>35899259
oh, this picture is much clearer.
alright than. so my picture was incorrect.

Is there a "safe zone" underneath the platform in which they cannot LOS our troops?

>>35899253

I dunno, I see CAPITALIZATION like that and I see all those crazy cranks dominating the comment sections of newspapers and news websites.

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>Contacting the monks at Basilii

You remember what Merce said about the monks opposing the development of the magic-sapping weapons that Shropham developed. Maybe they could lend a hand? You just need to get in contact with them.

It’s a great deal of wrangling, as it turns out. Vad contacts the monastery, who fob him off. Or, as he suspects, are too scared to contact the main monastery without going through lots of bureaucracy. So Vad starts trying to go through the foxes. You spend an hour or so organising your men while Tsucchi then tries to get Ren to talk. Eventually…

“What the devil do you want to talk with Basilii for?” Ren says, sounding incredulous.

“Is it such a big deal?” you ask.

“What makes you think they’d want to waste any time on you? They’re rather busy and important.”

“I’ve been told that they made political moves to destroy a particular branch of enchanted weapons that Shropham developed. That Shropham is still developing. They might be interested,” you say, before explaining what the weapons do.

There’s a long pause as Ren digests what you’ve told him. “I’m not sure I like those weapons at all. Something powerful must be helping them develop them and that same something powerful might try to stop you. If Basilii opposed it then they likely know more. I’ll see if I can’t get in touch.”

>continued

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>>35899393
You’re surprised at how quickly Ren gave up his resistance. Clearly something about what these weapons can do troubles people – you’d thought it was more like anti-magic; something that is natural but disliked. This sounds more like some sort of malevolent invention. What has Shropham been doing? Should you be letting Sylvian know? Gnome had warned you about letting the Guard know about the weapons, given the historical abuses that the Wardens had done in the Golden Age but this seemed worse than expected.

After a little while you’re told how to contact Basilii via sending and do so. It’s been almost two hours now, you think. This had better be worth it.

“So, I’m told by a friend that you have something to tell me, Talon York,” comes a sharp female voice over the line.

“No introductions?” you ask, trying to see if you can place the voice.

“I’m the head of the order. That’s all you need to know. I’m sure I don’t need to tell you which order, given your explorations at our Farun monastery,” she says, and you can almost hear some amusement in her harsh tone.

“I see,” you say. You’re not sure how to proceed here.

>1. Tell her about the weapons that Shropham is developing and ask for her aid.
>2. Tell her about the weapons and ask her what they are and who created them.
>3. Tell her about the weapons but nothing else.
>4. Custom

>>35899393
oh snap
now the monks would want to raze the towers of shropham, and we again have problem with alyce.

>>35899432
>>1. Tell her about the weapons that Shropham is developing and ask for her aid.

>>35899432
>1

>>35899432
>1. Tell her about the weapons that Shropham is developing and ask for her aid.

>>35899432
>1. Tell her about the weapons that Shropham is developing and ask for her aid.

>>35899432
>>2. Tell her about the weapons and ask her what they are and who created them.
Get info first, then we can ask for aid later

>>35899432
>2. Tell her about the weapons and ask her what they are and who created them.

>>35899432
Wait, sharp voice... spiritualist... no introductions Oh fuck me, its Asira. She was in a monastery when we met her.

>>35899688

What do we need to know about her, if anything

>>35899708
Well, she might have had her memory modified by the God Knights to think we dumped her and stood her up.

>>35899432
>3. Tell her about the weapons but nothing else.
I want to hear how she responds to that first before making any offers/requests.
heck, the request can be made as an offer... an opportunity to go through the towers and remove such dangerous research and artifacts. as well as point out who has been working on them. (and that means non destructively, we don't want them burned down)

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>1.

“Do you remember the weapons that Shropham developed and you wanted destroyed? The ones that sapped the magic from mages and magical beings?” you ask her.

“I am aware of them. Mercenie of the Tower of Stars made a recent inquiry about them, which led me to believe that somebody else has developed them,” she says, her voice gaining a trace of anger. “Now that you are contacting me, I have a feeling that our warnings were ignored and development was never stopped.”

“That is how it appears,” you say and explain what happened to Gnome in Orkney.

“Yes, those are the same disastrous weapons as before, if weaker. No doubt they are mass producing them. Dealing with them in this situation is a difficult proposition, however. War makes our limited resources even less effective,” she says.

“Then give me the resources and I’ll handle the war. We want the same thing here,” you say, asking for help in a stronger fashion than planned. Something about this woman makes you think she appreciates the strong approach.

“Hmph. Very well. I’ll dispatch my brother. He should arrive within a few days along with some allies of his own,” she says, before leaving a parting remark. “Be sure to keep careful Watch, Talon York. The world may change at a moment’s notice.”

Then she ends the sending, leaving you very much in the dark. You’re left with the feeling that you just spoke with somebody that few people ever see, let alone converse with. You hope that her brother is worth more than information.

>Anybody else you want to contact or ask for help from?

>>35899803
>Her brother
the monk hero we didn't choose?

I got nussing, hopefully other anons have some ideas

>>35899803
>send out spies to ask for help from Blackwater

>>35899862

But the spies are Blackwater

>>35899803
ren
about possibility of fighting foxes if the commander there attack us.
no wait, we were told to speak to pride clan directly about this.

ugh... tsucchi first, for advice.

What's the likelihood we could get Devon to defect immediately? We might have to throw some deals around but having their force would tip the scales far onto our side.

>>35899803
Uh, the tower of Kassak? Summons are pretty powerful in a long run siege because the battle lasts long enough for them to be refreshed.

>>35899940
Frankly, I wouldn't trust their forces.

>>35899803
If we don't ask Tsucchi, it will cause problems trust wise.

>>35899964
Why? They want out. We offer them a route and frontline them.

>>35900051
Because the way out might be a midbattle betrayal. If they could punch us out in such a fashion their position MIGHT be tenable.

Why don't we just ignore the idea of working our way up at the onset and teleport several hundred heavy hitters up to the top with Taira and work our way down. Then we move our forces up through the cleared tower.
We really just want to avoid doing what they expect us to do, which is
1: Take the lower city and hide under the upper cities shadow
2: Take a tower and use the lift to bring our men up
3: Take the upper city spreading our from a single point.

>>35900153
I thinking using Tiara would be our best bet

>>35900222

Sailor Moon?

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>Marching on Shropham

You leave the next morning for Shropham, your armies planning to gather just south of the city for the final stretch. The march is relatively swift, and you estimate that you’ll have more than a week to assault the city before the Guard close. Assuming that Alyce’s estimate is right.

It is while you are waiting for your troops to rendezvous that the monk arrives along with his ‘allies’. Allies that nearly cause you to fire on them when they come into sight.

“So you’re Talon York. My name is Marek,” a young man says, introducing himself. Not that you know he’s young. He has a calm demeanour about him and you suspect it would take a lot to trouble him. “My sister wants me to help you, though I’ve not been told the specifics. My gut says these weapons are Fae, but I also know that Raphael would have put a stop to it if they were. He doesn’t have much of an appreciation for the Fae meddling with mages.”

You can hardly pay attention to his words, as important as they are, as you find your attention demanded by the enormous armoured bulwarks standing behind him. A flame emblem decorates the front of their elegant armour, and the horns on their helmets seem to twist like the tips of a flame. They stand half your height again and their weapons are almost as big as you.

>continued

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>>35900248
“I am Sir Baelrus, formly a Great Knight Candidate of the Lord of Ember,” their leader says to you, his face shadowed by his helmet. That must be an enchantment. “We will serve you in Marek’s name for the duration of this assault.”

“I thought you all went insane?” Mal says from beside you and you curse his lack of tact.

“Many of my brethren fell to the inexplicable madness, but some did not. My comrades and I stand as part of that small cadre of knights who remain in service to their lord’s cause, if not their lord himself,” Baelrus says, gesturing to the nine god-knights beside him.

With that, your troops are in line and finalised for your assault on Shropham. There is surely something more to the city, but you’ll have to delve into it to find out.

>I have to head off for a 2 to 3 hour break. I’ll tweet as well as post in this thread once I’m back. I’m hoping to start the siege this thread, and hopefully finish it with two threads next weekend.

If somebody would post the details of the city from last thread, it would be appreciated. I need to go.

>>35900153
it has been suggested last thread.
I pointed out we can do it 3 ways.

>Fly over the side
Fliers would be tremendously vulnerable
>Teleport with taira to capture a lift
Teleporting will tire out taira and we need her fresh
also, gotta hold out when outnumbered
>Fight our way on the central lifts that can't be disabled
Taking the central lifts (that cannot be disabled) up would be exhausting and risky for our hero units

I guess we could combine 1 and 2.
Have taira teleport heroes and 100 HMK. they secure the side of the platform to prevent bombardment and allow the FMK to fly up carrying some MMK with them
then the force secures a lift and lets the rest of our force up.

than again. after that I came up with this
http://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/35877395/#p35887132
ok, so the lifts can be disabled from the top, yes?
Well, a lift goes through a hollow shaft. yes? if they disable it, the lift is basically at the top of the shaft. We walk into the shaft from the bottom. fly up the hollow shaft. Barrier break a hole at the bottom of the lift, then go through it, take over the immediate area. repair it if needed (gnome), and start bringing troops up using it.
if we do it right. they might not realize what we are doing before its too late.

>>35900276
>There is surely something more to the city
City confirmed for transforming into a giant mech.

Damn you Blackwater...

>>35900276
>>35900337
Arrival of god knights = Lol give us the lift bitch.

Essentially unstoppable.

Aspir
was there an option for us to play a fluffy tails hero?

>>35900446
the elves have been stopping them for a long time.
The shadow copies of god knights we fought were supposedly stronger than the real deal too.
They are basically hero units.

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Anyway, Option 1 is the clear victor. I'm going to start the Shropham assault with the next thread (which is later today at 5:30pm). Given the nature of the assault and the fact I'm doing two threads this weekend, I'm going to stop with the content here and let you guys strategise. I'll post the details of the city and answer any questions about it over the next hour or two.

Shropham is basically two cities in one. It has a lower city (pic related) which is mostly like a normal city – a huge sprawl with a central keep that is about nine square miles in size and makes a rough circle in size. It contains approximately 400,000 people.

Above the lower city is an enormous stone platform, one square mile in size and a perfect circle of 0.56sq mi in radius. It sits 60m above the ground and is supported by eleven enormous support columns. The ten outer columns run the circumference of the platform and are equidistant from adjacent columns. Each outer column is 100m in diameter and houses more than 1000 people around a central reinforced support. The central column is 200m in diameter and is surrounded by a fortress wall and guarded by the central keep but houses no people.

The outer columns each contain one cargo lift that goes to the very top and is controlled from a warehouse from the platform. These lifts can be disabled by the platform in the case of attack, forcing an attack to ascend the twenty-plus storeys of the winding column. The central column contains a central lift into the palace above that works the same way but it also contains three chains of lifts. These chains of lifts each ascend five storeys before requiring their occupants to move to a separate lift to ascend another five – they must do this three times to reach the platform. These chained lifts cannot be disabled or activated remotely and are there to prevent an attacker from easily cutting off access between the platform and the lower city.

>continued

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>>35900654
The platform above (pic related) houses 40,000 people in wealthy apartments, noble estates and mage towers. The central palace is an enormous structure that is surrounded by a fortress wall and is heavily fortified itself. Atop it lay one of the seven great mage towers of the city and the three chained lifts of the column exit into the grounds around the palace. The six other great mage towers of the city have their own fortresses spread around the city. The city’s magitech foundry is contained within the palace.

The outer rim of the platform has no walls but there is a barrier to prevent projectiles from entering. This area is home to the other five mage towers of the city, as well as the large noble estates (prime view, after all). The central mage towers are home to the markets of the city and wealthy apartments and smaller residences separate them.

The platform was constructed in the Great War with the God-Knights and partially designed by Gnome.

>>35900337
>Fly over the side
>Fliers would be tremendously vulnerable
>Teleport with taira to capture a lift
>Teleporting will tire out taira and we need her fresh
>also, gotta hold out when outnumbered
>Fight our way on the central lifts that can't be disabled
>Taking the central lifts (that cannot be disabled) up would be exhausting and risky for our hero units

Flying over the edge is a bad idea. I have no hope for anyone who tries to fly over.

Fighting to a central lift is the most logical idea, will likely come down to brute force, will get us ambushed by the mages in a poor position, ect.
If we can fight off their magisters we can do it, but we will still have heavy losses.

It feels to me like teleporting up is the best bet. Tarira being tired would be a problem, but with the God Knights there as well I don't see us getting beat on arrival. In fact we would actually want their magisters to attack us then so we can take them out with our concentrated force.
The only question I have then is how to prevent ambushes when we cart our main army up. Even if we have one of the pillars under our control the magisters could still easily ambush a group on their way up, and we want to avoid splitting up our hero units too much.

We need to take more advantage of our troops up top and not simply let them sit around and guard the top of the pillar. Maybe have them spread our and try and take the center.

Another note, there might be a way for the mages to block teleportation. I don't remember.

A lot of the issues with all of these plans can be removed if we take our at least a few of their heros. Maybe pretend we are sneaking/rushing through a lift with just us and a strike force Gnome and a few others are there as well to get them to come to us.

Hmm. i wonder if the city underneath had a good sewer system, we could use undines power to gyser lift people up the lifts faster than anyone could stop us.

Literally flying on bullshit to conquor the place.

>>35900337
>ok, so the lifts can be disabled from the top, yes?
>Well, a lift goes through a hollow shaft. yes? if they disable it, the lift is basically at the top of the shaft. We walk into the shaft from the bottom. fly up the hollow shaft. Barrier break a hole at the bottom of the lift, then go through it, take over the immediate area. repair it if needed (gnome), and start bringing troops up using it.
this is my favorite plan. Its a lot like teleporting in.

>>35900685
>Flying over the edge is a bad idea. I have no hope for anyone who tries to fly over.
I think so too... UNLESS we first clear out any forces that would bombard the fliers. Via AA, teleport and slay, or some other method.

>>35900685
>the magisters could still easily ambush a group on their way up
Let them. How many people can go up at a time again? Yeah.
Our hero units are more valuable elsewhere. If our lift is attacked they can react quickly.

A big question is. do we decimate the forces down low before moving on to the top
or do we focus on getting our forces up top. leaving most of the enemy forces intact

the latter puts us at greater risk, but is very beneficial in that they might surrender and join us once we have taken out the leadership

>>35900886
Assuming they don't just cut/blowup the central lift with us in it. and let gravity do their work for them.
or bombard us heavily while we are using it.

>>35900903

Former, unless charging up will give us more immediate benefits.

This battle is difficult enough that we need to focus on gaining immediate edges rather than potential long term benefits

>>35900276
How good do we think Barius is? And can we make our standered unit of measurement the FTE (Fluffy tail equivalent)
I'm in favor of a conventional approach

>>35901048
>conventional approach
There is no conventional approach when you have one city atop another with hidden magic users.

>>35900922
That's why we start from the top down and keep heros on their toes to engage those magisters. I don't think there will be much bombardment unless they have kill slots through the floor to shoot through.
Long range bombardment from the rest of the lower city would be too difficult for them, and a shielding would cover it.

I don't know about just cutting the wires though, didn't Asp say the main paths couldn't be stopped? I feel like they are going to be using some hardcore scorched earth tactics against us and I don't know what to do about it other then take our time.

>>35901034
>Former, unless charging up will give us more immediate benefits.
it will take out the mages who are trixy bastards who might do annoying trixie things like summoning shit on us or whatever.
and it will give us a fortified position to defend against a potential incursion by the mage guard

also. the mage guard might just walk up to a lift and start going up themselves if we don't beat them to it.

>>35901244
a broken lift can be repaired
talon being in a metal box suspended in the air where he can't dodge is an ideal situation to nuke him

>>35900654
>The outer columns each contain one cargo lift that goes to the very top and is controlled from a warehouse from the platform. These lifts can be disabled by the platform in the case of attack, forcing an attack to ascend the twenty-plus storeys of the winding column.
huh. i guess there ARE stairs that we could take
it would tire the troops to climb them, of course.

>>35900654
>Shropham is basically two cities in one. It has a lower city (pic related) which is mostly like a normal city – a huge sprawl with a central keep

>Keep must be conquered to gain central lift access
>Central lift brings you to palace-fortress / prime mage tower
central lift is actually more work than one might think

>>35900446
see
>>35900683
>The platform was constructed in the Great War with the God-Knights and partially designed by Gnome.

was specifically designed against the god-knights.

>>35901650
Forget the lift, we use the stairs. And we clear the column from the top down.

>>35901778
It doesn't necessarily mean anything. I don't think there is any counter-god-knight magic. At least not that the mages know. I guess we could ask.

>>35901871
>I don't think there is any counter-god-knight magic
the counter is to hit them with enough force to kill them.

>>35901914
We better equip them with some kind of force dampening clothes to protect them.
Maybe metal clothes or something.

>>35901951
what if we make the metal clothing extra thick? to block even more damage?

>>35901986
Right right and we keep it curved like how cloth forms onto the body so that when they're hit the force slides off instead of making metal boxes.
This is brilliant, but what do we call it?

Ok so to sum up the ideas I have seen people throw

choice A:
>Clear out below then go for top
>Go straight for top first

choice b (how to get to top):
>Take the central elevator. (if I understand correctly, this will require us to take the central keep in the undercity and then the fortress above it. This is where the central ruling mage tower is, as well as their magitech foundry)
>Tairaport up and secure a periphery cargo elevator
>Fly up through the shaft of a periphery cargo elevator, and then bust a hole at its bottom to reach the top. then take over and use it to cart up troops
>Just climb the stairs on one of the periphery columns, thus securing a cargo elevator

Did I get them all, or am I missing any?

>>35899803
>Yes, those are the same disastrous weapons as before, if weaker. No doubt they are mass producing them
I can't believe I didn't notice this earlier. We just got told that spear was a mass produced inferior copy.
Do you realize what this means? they could have more of them! An assault spearheaded by our hero units can get assraped by a small army wielding those.

>>35902086
metal-box-clothes obviously. every scientist knows the importance of accurate and descriptive nomenclature

>>35902113
At least one person wants to ambush the magisters in a trap but has no ideas on how to do it.

Choice A makes no sense to me.

>>35902234
>At least one person wants to ambush the magisters in a trap but has no ideas on how to do it.
He said we would do it by taking the central elevator with a juicy target like talon and gnome and not a huge retinue.
they will see talon coming with few defenders and will jump at the chance to end him

what i don't understand is, how does talon and gnome walking into an ambush cause our enemies to be "ambushed"?

I guess we could have taira ready to teleport a crack team on top of them. god knights and other elites
but i find it more likely they will just toss an anti-magic grenade at talon or something instead.

>>35902185
Adamanteus Vestimenta Kúbos

I made it more official looking.

>>35902234
>Choice A makes no sense to me.
You are not choosing between A and B.
you are choosing one option from A, and one option from B

Choice A, the first choice we need to make. is whether we rush to the top platform to take out their mages and leadership. leaving us vulnerable to being pincered by their army below
or if we first completely defeat all their army stationed in the lower city before going upwards

>>35902294
>toss an anti-magic grenade at talon or something instead.

I know you're being facetious but seeing as Talon's power source isn't sorcerous its not like it would do anything anyway. That and Anti-Magic is highly illegal in the League(given this is Shropham we're talking but still) and such an item would be rare to come across. We haven't seen active anti-magic weapons since the beginning of the quest. Barring the spear which is something slightly different.

>>35902294
Have our retinue hit some important target visibly. Have Talon be visible somewhere else with only gnome. CMs go for the kill, GK s counter attack

>>35902294
Well we could always go with the old 'TALON STRONK' strategy and take on everything in our path.
Or we could have several heros on standby or else hidden in with our small group.

>>35902435
>I know you're being facetious
I wasn't, I was dead serious.
If I saw talon coming up my fortress lift on his own (well, almost) I would throw my biggest bomb at him. especially one that nullifies magic

>seeing as Talon's power source isn't sorcerous
they don't know that

>its not like it would do anything anyway
it is an extremely powerful explosive that nullifies magic.
last one we encountered injured us a bit and it was at somewhat of a distance.
that being said. it is extremely volatile and we got the astral flow ability. so as long as we can see it coming, we can trigger it from afar with no harm to us.
Still. they could follow it up with a barrage of fireballs and lightening bolts and the like.

>>35902470
>>35902478
Those are viable suggestions. But the anon that asked to "draw them out" didn't actually make them.

>>35902113
>Clear out below then go for top
>Tairaport up and secure a periphery cargo elevator
This seems like the least risky plan in a generally risky invasion that still takes advantage of our unique resources. I wouldn't mind only taking half the lower city first or something, but not taking the lower city at all is a huge risk and is asking for a disaster.

Also, I don't see any point in attacking the central keep on the lower city unless we plan on using the central elevator.

>>35901951
Or we could go with the armor forged by the Lord of Steel. Its probably pretty gud.

>>35903118
this is fairly sensible
>I don't see any point in attacking the central keep on the lower city unless we plan on using the central elevator.
justifications are:
they could sortie from the keep once we split our forces between top and bottom. As well as transfer troops with impunity via the central elevator.
Also, I bet the keep is where their knightly order is housed.
Oh, and their leaders might escape the city if we don't properly secure the escape routes first

I'd support taking the lower city first, the suburbs and outskirts won't take much more then a little occupation to quell. IIRC there are 4 mage towers in the lower city as well. Easy prizes of discontented mages.

The columns are an issue and I think we'll need to neutralize them. Obviously we can't bring them down, but that doesn't stop us from blocking their use. Gnome can turn a lower floor or two into nothing but earth, Undine could flood and freeze them solid, etc. That way the only way down is the lift and central column which we'll keep occupied. The city up top surely is ready for a protracted siege so let's let them stew up there and wait. Wait until the Mage Guard's army is on the horizon. We can lay claim to the city before hand with the lower city occupied so a direct attack would be an act of war, something neither side wants. Then we can force negotiations with the upper city that will surely be flipping its collective shit as nobles and cornered men are want to do. We'll get some to come peacefully and it'll allow us to storm the upper area and take the rest. Any counter offensives during the siege would have to be centered around the lift which we'll have pretty much on lock down or a daring attempt to dispel the magic/debris from a column. Either way it limits and funnels them. This way we can use the threat of the Guard without them ever touching our city as their hands will be tied by a technicality. We hand over those who are wanted, achieve victory.

>>35903379
the problem is that when the mage guard arrives, if we haven't yet conquered the city, they will ask to help us.
refusing will have reprecussions we don't want, and too early.

>>35903297
>Oh, and their leaders might escape the city if we don't properly secure the escape routes first
With the amount of pride and stupid overconfidence that has been spilling out of their collective asses, I don't think they will retreat. They'll probably keep in their ivory towers throwing patriotic slogans till they have a sword at their throat.
If they do retreat they don't have anywhere to run to except the magi league. We are turning over or killing all the leaders anyway, better that they die or get away before the fight ends.

The sortie could happen though.

>>35903454
That and the loss of that 25k army.

>>35903454
>We can lay claim to the city before hand with the lower city occupied so a direct attack would be an act of war

Our claim. Our city. Getting to the upper city(which would be its own sovereign city then) requires going through the lower city which is ours. It's pretty easy to keep an army on your border if they don't want to declare war.

>>35903514
>With the amount of pride and stupid overconfidence that has been spilling out of their collective asses, I don't think they will retreat
Even when we have already started conquering towers? when our army is up there with them at the top platform and the main towers fell... won't some of the people on the lower towers who know they are complicity in crimes try to bolt for it?

>>35903379
I don't want to take the lower city and sit on it to try and get some minor advantages. We don't know if they have a way to hit us hard from the top city.

And sealing off the columns won't work, they have a pure earth elemental that specialized in formations. She would simply unseal the column floor.

More then that this is a city of mages. They certainly have ways to get around closed off rooms/floors.

>>35903560
You are not getting it
They don't want war because they think us a friend
they are going to say "Hellow friend talon, how about we lend you some troops and do this glorious thing together! of course you get to keep the city afterwards."
Saying no will clue them in to our unfriendly intentions and views. which might cause them to actually want war with us.

On the other hand, if they come by and we already finished, we just say "oh, took you long enough. well. we are already done here."

>>35903653
all good points.
if we want to block off a column we do so by surrounding it with troops

>>35903653
>>35903687

I see no reason not to do both. Even if it only becomes a minor annoyance it'll still force them to counter offense in limited means and areas.

>>35903579
Alright, but my paranoia i

Nope, I'll vote to take the lower city, but only so that we can move on to the upper city without needing to watch out backs. Not what >>35903379 suggested, waiting around won't get us anything unless we want to do some weird thing against the magisters.

>>35903807
I agree on all counts
another advantage of taking the lower city, is that they don't know which of the 11 points we are scaling (10 periphery towers and 1 central one)
if we go straight for one of them, they will see us coming and reinforce it with all their troops.

Also, when we do go up a tower (assuming we take one of the 10 peripheries)
>Fly up the empty shaft, then make a small entry hole in the bottom of elevator. talon goes through first
>Once elites are up there, they start securing the lift top control and LMK troops rush up the stairs (super fast running and endurance enchantments)
>Taira ports some troops to coincide with our incursion uptop
>Gnome/undine hole in elevator floor, send elevator down to start brinking up more troops

>>35903807

Hey at least I'm suggesting alternatives. They hold a serious advantage defensively. Actually properly sieging is a different route as opposed to an all out offensive that will definitely kill more of our guys.

watch
>We roll ALL THE ONES!
>fail to take city
>Mage guard takes city
>Lose so much face
damn

>>35903788
I think their point was that we couldn't just funnel them into a singe acess point. We would do both you're right but that is assuming that
1. We do actually take a major hold of the lower city
2. We decide to go up through the central tower.

Or we could take the whole city, seal off the collums and guard them, and then act as though we will enter the center tower but instead silently and swiftly enter one if the surrounding collums.

>>35899925
Wait one fucking minute I thought we were black water?

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>>35904021
>Talon rolls a 1 in combat
>Gets blown up
>Loses even more face

>>35904259

Not the beard! You sick bastard.

>>35904245
Oh please, Blackwater's obviously that God Knight hiding his face with magic.

I wonder if we will ever see Blackwater ever again, or if Aspir plans on just letting the joke continue.

>>35904530
I swear if that's really him my sides will transcend all known existence and meaning

>>35904259
>Loses face
I see what you did there anon

>>35904614
Yes.

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Finally back - sorry it took so long. Having some lunch and catching up on the thread.

>>35903946
Didn't mean anything by it, if we didn't have hundreds of mages literally hanging over our heads and a count down I'd be all for squeezing them.

>>35904245

Aspiring Blackwater Quest when

>>35904681
Welcome back. Hope everything went well.

>>35904776
I'd rather play Disappointing Felix Quest.

>>35904530

After we have united the world under our banner, we shall retire to our chambers where our harem is waiting for us.
The following morning, we wake up, comment on how good things are, turn and all the girls are Blackwater. we then turn to the mirror and discover that everything is fine, as we too, are blackwater. In fact, everyone is Blackwater, and the all the Blackwaters lived happily ever after...
the end.

>>35904530
Thats a thing though. Some guy just came up to us and said 'Hey, I'm the guy and these are some other guys' and we are letting them join us.

>>35904819
Personally I'm hoping the tragic flaw in his powers is that his abilities are a horrible match up for us. He gained power at the cost of ensuring he will never be able to match the man who he compares himself to the most.

>>35904819

Aspiring Shadow Empress Quest
Where you play as one of Talons Harem, and using bedroom politics get him to do things the way you want...

>>35904894
Aspiring Squire Quest
Where you are best squire doing best squire things.

>>35904819
>>35904873
Maybe he thralls people by fighting people who have intent to harm him or those he cares for. Thralling them makes them unable to want to do Felix harm and thus he never can feel the thrill of battle again.

>>35904819

I would legitimately play a Felix (side) quest. Especially conflicted nature vampire Felix.

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Okay, so the overarching choice is between going in from the top; conquering the lower city first; and holding off from committing to either while you try to ambush or kill their Combat Magisters. Once that is decided, then we can filter down to the crazy schemes.

Does that sound about right for the first vote, after skimming all this discussion?

>>35904944
Eh, my plan to mousetrap the CM's was with the ground invasion plan.

>>35904944
only one guy suggested luring their CMs into a trap, and he didn't even mention how to do it. 2 guys later on came up with a potential method when it was pointed out.
Also. It seems like the majoriy was in favor of securing the under city first, then attacking the over city (which is sensible because that way they don't know which of the 11 entry points we are coming through.

>>35904944
I'd support trying to trap the CMs, but only after we take the lower city.

We could try quick raids to the upper city, and then leak that one of the raids will have Talon with a small strike force and no major players with him. We instead have Talon and several other heros laying low on the lookout for CMs.

>>35904944
cleaned up >>35904964

Lower city
>A) Capture the keep and secure (surround with troops at ground level) all 10 pillars before going after top city
>B) Secure some of the above, maintaining somewhat of a perimeter before going to top city
>C) Just blitz a single periphery column or the main elevator and go up it immediately without first securing the lower city

CM Trap
>Try to lure them into a trap while fighting in lower city
>Try to lure them into trap after securing lower city
>Try to lure them into trap when going after upper city
>Don't try to lure them into trap

Upper city (once one of the above is done)
>1) Take the central elevator. (if I understand correctly, this will require us to take the central keep in the undercity and then the fortress above it. This is where the central ruling mage tower is, as well as their magitech foundry)
>2) Tairaport up to secure a periphery cargo elevator to bring up troops
>3) Talon (carried), heroes and FMKs fly up through the shaft of a periphery cargo elevator, and then bust a hole at its bottom to reach the top. then gnome / undine fixes the hole and use the elevator to bring up rest of troops
>4) Just climb the stairs on one of the periphery columns, thus securing a cargo elevator
>5) Combine 3 with 2 to get as many troops up simultanously. As well as having the LMKs use their speed enhancements to rapidly climb the stairs on that same tower (while the HMKs and MMKs are ferried via elevator)

Something I've thinking about. Who says they would put all their heavy hitters on the top level. Wouldn't they want to defend the city in general?

>>35904944
Random question, but is Talon's battlefield basics still at 1? I don't think we ever leveled it up, which is kinda weird.

>>35905111
I don't see how we could possible lure them into a trap after having completely won the lower city battle. It would require them to be idiots.
also, I bet it would cause massive collateral damage to fight them in the lower city.

>>35905212
They can freely move between upper and lower levels. And have a fortress at the center of the lower level. And 7 fortresses at the upper level (one at the center, 6 around it)

>>35905212

Not really. The lower city is more a byproduct of the upper. And if the impressions of the upper crust we've received thus far are correct, they are thoroughly convinced that the upper city is far more important to defend. Outside of the Fortress and entrances to the columns.

>>35905223
I remember we leveled it up to 2

>>35905189
it occurs to me, if we fully secure the lower city, once we secure a beachfront at the upper city, we can then expand it to nearby elevators. if we can capture and hold 3 nearby elevators, we can bring up troops at 3x the speed to the upper city.

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>>35900505
>was there an option for us to play a fluffy tails hero?
Nope. The monk here is obviously the Monk PC, however.

>>35902152
I'm surprised nobody twigged to that sooner. It's like how only one person noticed the Sylvian thing (and only after I wrapped up the conversation).

>>35905223
It is a weird skill that is rarely used. It's basically there to lend a modifier when doing something battlefield related that isn't covered by other combat skills. Not really sure whether it's serving its purpose.

INITIAL APPROACH VOTE
>1. Conquer the lower city first, before moving onto the upper city.
>2. Ignore the lower city and try to attack the upper city directly (this includes the option of smashing through the lower city to seize a single lift to ascend).
>3. Hold off on committing the a full assault until you've been able to neutralise their combat magisters (not choosing this does not preclude trying this strategy with another option).
>4. Custom

I'll hold another vote on the specifics of whichever overarching option wins.

>>35905316
>1. Conquer the lower city first, before moving onto the upper city.

>>35905243
Yeah, my original plan probably has the best chance of success. Most of Talon's retinue is off causing trouble, he's visible with enough elites to appear vulnerable, but not enough to seem like an trap. The Cm move in for the kill, and get Jumped by Marek and pals, who they don't even know are in the city.

>>35905316
>I'm surprised nobody twigged to that sooner. It's like how only one person noticed the Sylvian thing (and only after I wrapped up the conversation).
I am both of those actually.
And I missed the conversation with the sylvian thing. I recognized it as soon as it came up, but by then it was already old news

>>35905316
>1. Conquer the lower city first, before moving onto the upper city.

>>35905316
>1. Conquer the lower city first, before moving onto the upper city.

I don't know why we're talking about this so much anyway, we're all going to roll 1's regardless.

>>35905316
>I'm surprised nobody twigged to that sooner.

I just sort of assumed it went without saying.

>>35902152
>>35899803
>>35905316
>>>Yes, those are the same disastrous weapons as before, if weaker. No doubt they are mass producing them
>>I can't believe I didn't notice this earlier. We just got told that spear was a mass produced inferior copy.
>>Do you realize what this means? they could have more of them! An assault spearheaded by our hero units can get assraped by a small army wielding those.
>I'm surprised nobody twigged to that sooner

Guys, we should keep in mind that if we do go for a CM trap with talon as bait, they likely will send multiple such awfulness spears at us.
also, if any of our elites is exposed
In fact, we should warn all our elites ahead of time to watch out for those spears.

>>35905418
Actually it's going to be a mixture of almost made it and just barely made it

>>35905316
>2. Ignore the lower city and try to attack the upper city directly (this includes the option of smashing through the lower city to seize a single lift to ascend).

>>35905316
>>1. Conquer the lower city first, before moving onto the upper city.
I don't like the idea of the enemy being above us at all times but...

>>35905494
>Someone pokes Talon with spear
>We still use astral powers and continue wrecking shit
>Everyone learns we use astral powers

>>35905561
>Loses face
>What a life

>>35905316
>I'm surprised nobody twigged to that sooner
since I am being a font of introspection here

>Mass produced inferior copy
>copy
does that not imply that they might have the original somewhere? And that it is much more dangerous than the inferior copy that took out gnome?

Also, we are assuming that their CM's are their greatest asset here. But we got warned that some powerful entity must have been helping them make those spears. And it has suggested that this is fae magic.
could they have a fae ally inside the city?

... holy shit. what if the magisters aren't even in control anymore and the city has been usurped by a fae who is calling the shots. pretending the towers are still in control? or is this full on paranoia?

>>35905561
Eh, it has a limited shelf life anyway. I mean, the instant a Warden or Pride fox learns about it it will plastered all around the world.

>>35905561
>We have been warned again and again to not let someone else's astral power touch us
>We are told those spears are probably fae made
>Fae use astral powers
These are probably astral spears, and probably can hurt talon.

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Okay, so a lot of the discussion focused on how to take the upper city with the lower city being something of a 'let's just capture it' deal. So I'm going to propose a few options that I don't think contradict any ideas so far.

LOWER CITY PLAN VOTE
>1. Capture a sizeable portion of the city, including 3 to 5 columns, before moving to the upper city.
>2. Seize the central keep first before attempting to seize some amount of the remaining lower city.
>3. Seize all of the outer columns before ascending or seizing the central keep.
>4. Custom

COMBAT MAGISTER VOTE
>1. Try to lure the CMs into a trap
>2. Don't try to lure them
>3. Custom

>>35905651
>>35905561
Haven't we regularly gotten hurt by sorcerous power?

>>35905815
>>1. Capture a sizeable portion of the city, including 3 to 5 columns, before moving to the upper city.
>>1. Try to lure the CMs into a trap

>>35905815
>Custom
I think it very much depends on exactly what their army is doing. We should be fluid and react to whatever mistakes they make. So far we have capitalized on enemy mistakes quite often and to great effect
water!

That being said
>3. Seize all of the outer columns before ascending or seizing the central keep.
This allows us to fight the keep without worrying about the enemy flanking us. furthermore. there is a chance that they would sortie out of the keep if we can trick them into thinking we are going to use the pillars to go up. In an attempt to flank us

>>35905815
>3. Seize all of the outer columns before ascending or seizing the central keep.
>2. Don't try to lure them

>>35905887 almost forgot

>>35905815
COMBAT MAGISTER VOTE
>2. Don't try to lure them

>>35905815
>3. Seize all of the outer columns before ascending or seizing the central keep.

>1. Try to lure the CMs into a trap

>>35905815
>1. Capture a sizeable portion of the city, including 3 to 5 columns, before moving to the upper city.
>1. Try to lure the CMs into a trap

>>35905815
>1. Capture a sizeable portion of the city, including 3 to 5 columns, before moving to the upper city.

>1. Try to lure the CMs into a trap

>>35905815
>3. Seize all of the outer columns before ascending or seizing the central keep.

Don't know about the CMs

>>35905887
To expand on this, I can see them doing the following
>Fortify in keep and upper city
>Sortie out of the city to fight us right outside it, to prevent civilian casualties and infrastructure damage
>Urban warefare, many small ambushes. guerrilla style
Until we know which of these they plan, its hard to decide

>>35905815
3
1

>>35905815
LOWER CITY PLAN VOTE
>3. Seize all of the outer columns before ascending or seizing the central keep.
COMBAT MAGISTER VOTE
abstain

>>35905988

To be honest I don't think they give a toss about the lower city. If they need to blow parts up to get to us, I think they'll do it, especially if they had planned on scorching the earth if the Guard showed up.

>>35906055
But we can't be certain.
The shropham army we just eliminated last thread marched right out of the city to face us on the nearby plains to prevent civilian casualties.
Also, even if the elites at their ivory towers in the upper city don't give a toss, the knights and soldiers guarding the keep down below might.
it might be that they want to blame us for damage to the lower city. to incense their public and get more recruits to replace whatever losses their army takes here.

In fact, I bet the keep is the home of the knightly order. and we might be able to communicate with them. If we can turn this around about how we care more about the civilians living in the undercity than the elites in the upper one. We might be able to turn them to our side

>>35906151
Well we always give a chance to surrender don't we?

>>35906356
Well, not always no, but definitely most of the time, maybe?!

>>35906389
Good enough.
Doubt anyone will want to fight at the sight of our Adamanteus Vestimenta Kúbos.

>>35906356
The question was whether it is plausible for them to sortie to fight us outside the town to prevent civilian casualties.
An anon said he thinks that they don't care about the civilians.

surrender changes don't really relate to that.

>>35906453
>surrender changes
surrender acceptance on our part

>>35906453
I intented to add to the idea that if they felt strongly about preventing casualties, and additionally had strong feelings against the mages up top, they would be willing to take our offer.

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>3 & 1

“The plan is straightforward on paper,” you explain to your assembled officers a day later. “We march through the outer city limits, where hopefully the civilian population will stay safely inside and not engage us. From there, we’ll march on the nearest columns below the platform and seize them all in sequence before either ascending to the platform city above or seizing the central keep.”

Your command tent is a little more impromptu than you’d like, mostly because it had to be expanded to accommodate the larger number of officers and the sheer bulk of the God-Knights. Your limited understanding of the God-Knight hierarchy told you that Baelrus was a high-ranking officer, in line with either a captain or general in the traditional armies. Probably a captain, given the small size of their armies but comparable to a general in terms of military strength. You wanted his advice if he would offer it.

And offer it he did, “Are you not worried about spreading your forces too thinly, lord? Attempting to cover all of the columns seems akin to trying to cover the entire centre of the city.”

“Their forces will be spread more thinly, Sir Baelrus,” you tell him, noting the way your officers fell completely silent when the bear of a knight began talking. “They have to defend, so if they attempt to counterattack one column then we can safely give ground and take advantage of their manoeuvre. It prevents them from easily guessing where we’ll attack from and limits their options in the lower city.”

Baelrus nods slowly. The lack of visible facial expression makes it hard to tell if he is doing so in comprehension or scepticism. He says, “Perhaps. Seizing the central keep seems the most viable option for ascending to the top. I believe their defences are weaker than they think. If an assault force can withstand the magical assault that will be upon them when they emerge at the top, then the centre of the city is already yours.”

>continued

>>35906055
Honestly my biggest fear is they'll blast the top and smash our army on the bottom if they get the chance.

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That was subtle. He’s making his thoughts clear without putting you in the tough spot of having to accept or refuse them. Nothing to gain or lose but his respect. And your men, if your decision is wrong.

There is some more wrangling over the specifics and which officers will lead where. One of your generals had best stay behind to manage your supply lines and prevent any raiders or counter attacks. Phillias seemed the best option, given the position also involves the reconstruction project and preparing for possible attacks by the Guard or Shropham forces. That left Arail to lead the initial assault alongside you, to get your troops underneath the platform, and then all of them to help you seize the city.

The final problem is trying to lure the combat magisters. Nobody is keen on that plan, even though everybody acknowledges that they need to be dealt with.

“We only really have two forces that can tango with them,” Mal points out after the officers break up. “The same group of us that fought them last time, and the god-knights themselves.”

“You don’t think they could defeat the god-knights? We handled ourselves against a pair of extra strong ones last year,” you say, frowning at the idea of a mere ten knights fighting against several combat magisters.

“These aren’t regular god-knights. They’re Bael’s retinue, which is why they wear his insignia alongside the Lord of Ember’s,” he points out. “They’re probably like the ones you saw back in Blacktaffe alongside Great Knight Garynth. Then there’s whatever Bael is capable of that makes him a candidate for a Great Knight. He’s no pushover.”

You split off from Mal and consider who to speak to for the night. You’ll be busy organising the march and raising the spirit of your troops after this, so it’s your last chance before the siege of Shropham begins. You speak to…

>1. Sir Baelrus of Ember’s (former) knights.
>2. Marek, the monk.
>3. Fuurin, yur fox general.
>4. Custom

>>35906545
>1. Sir Baelrus of Ember’s (former) knights.

>>35906545
>Sir Baelrus of Ember’s (former) knights.
I'm also thinking of the fox general, but Baelrus seems like he would have the most to say.

Also, did he hint that he would have prefered a rush to the central tower and forget about the other towers? I don't understand, would he just ignore the rest of the city and leave us open to all sorts of nastiness? I don't think any of us even wanted to rush the central tower.

>>35906545
>1. Sir Baelrus of Ember’s (former) knights.

>>35906545
>1. Sir Baelrus of Ember’s (former) knights.

Hello sir may I speak with you about home and country?

>>35904681
Welcome back...BLACKWATER

>>35906545
>>1. Sir Baelrus of Ember’s (former) knights.

>>35906545
if we lure the CMs into a trap, I would like to have all our heroes AND all the god knights hit them all at once.
This maximizes the chance of none of them escaping (since they do have teleport ability and home-field advantage)

>These god knights are even stronger than the extra strong ones we fought
Interesting.

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>>35906642
>Also, did he hint that he would have prefered a rush to the central tower and forget about the other towers?
Pretty much. Given how stupidly heavily armoured he and his brethren are, on top of the fact there are usually only a small number of them, they probably have very different strategic approaches.

>>35906545
>1. Sir Baelrus of Ember’s (former) knights.
what happened to lord ember
what is the deal with those spears, why do they freak people out so much
how bad are things at ember's lands
did many people escape his wrath
do they have any leads on ways to cure and reverse his madness?

>>35906771
Don't ask any of those questions. We either know the answers to them or he certainly either doesn't know or wouldn't tell us.

>>35906692
He is a great knight candidate. So he would need to be comparable at least to the top 9 strongest god knights. Otherwise they wouldn't think to replace one if it died.

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>>35906803
So what exactly do you want to ask Bael about? Is there anything in specific that people want to ask that isn't about Ember or the current situation?

>>35906692
Lets assume it all works out perfectly and we have all our heros in one location fighting all their CMs in a trap they didn't see coming.
That means all our other men are on their own. While they are well trained and we have spell casters, they'll get bogged down in fights with other infantry or with mages with no heros to break the lines.
Our men getting bogged down deep in an unfriendly city with a city watching us from above is bad. Not to mention the losses we would take.

>>35906699
Well, they also have knightly orders, battlemages, (presumably) spellblades and normal levees, though the knights probably don't even bother with those

>>35906803
1. we don't know the answer to ANY of those.
2. I can see him not telling us some. but why would some of them are fairly harmless. like asking how many people managed to escape. that one is actually relevant to talon because his family is from there.

>>35905316
>Monk pc

Can't wait to see aspir write combat scenes involving monkTalon

>>35906847
Mainly the capabilities of him or his knights. I just don't want to hear "Ember's lands are a wasteland" AGAIN.

>>35906847
Ask him about Ways to git gud
Subtly tell him about how great our country is for guys like him

>>35906860
He literally said he doesn't know what happened to Ember already. We already know that ember's lands are total wasteland, we've been told that so often I'm surprised Ember hasn't already starved himself to death.

>>35906852
You are making several false assumptions
Our men can avoid direct engagement with superior forces.
The CM fight will be VERY short with such overwhelming force
And our heroes don't need to all be in one location for that plan.

>Just talon or talon and gnome with some troops.
>All other known heroes leading another major portion of army, with taira having a short range port ready to get right on top of talon
>CMs attack talon
>Taira ports all heroes on top of CMs.
>Army with them temporarily disengages
>CMs decimated by overwhelming force
>Heroes return to leading army

>>35906847
Ask him what his favorite team is
Which side he pitches for
Arm wrestle

>>35906847
Honestly my top questions would be.

"Why are you allied to a monk?"

and

"What exactly is your knights skills?"

>>35906847
"So what do you bench?"

>>35906962
>We already know that ember's lands are total wasteland
Actually, false. We were told its a "no man's land". not a "wasteland".
the difference is in whether he eliminated all animals and plantlife as well.
Furthermore, this doesn't answer the question of how many people escaped

>>35906988
Hahahah

And then it turns out the CMs aren't retarded and bring about 2000 MMK with them.

>>35906988
I'm just not so optimistic

>>35907037
1. They don't have access to teleportation magic of that caliber
2. Talon is explicitly leading troops, just not heroes. so he has his own MMKs
3.
>2000 MMK + 4 CM
>10 god knights stronger than the 2 we faced in hien, Talon, Taira, Gnome, Sala, Undine, Mal, Lynn, and arbitrary number of MMKs
CMs are gonna get recked in seconds.

>>35907092
I'm more confused as to why you think you can lure the CMs in with that much force.

>>35907092
Remember that summoner CM that was killed? He could summon thousands of medium level summons. That was enough to stall our 10k army.

>>35907061
Pointing out false assumptions about what we are planning to do is not optimism.

If you were being a proper pessimist you would be saying things like
>They attack us with a huge force armed with those cursed spears
>They actually got reinforcements, more CMs
>They detect the trap and don't fall for it
or some such instead of
>The CM trap plan requires all our heroes to be sitting in hiding, twiddling their thumbs while our army gets slaughtered

>>35907118
>I'm more confused as to why you think you can lure the CMs in with that much force.
I never said we would.

>>35906988
the lure is talon and maybe 1 familiar leading some MMKs.
While the rest of heroes are visibly with another force. but with taira having prepared a short range teleport to land on top of talon at a moment's notice

>>35907239
I thought the plan was Talon + familiar visible while friends are doing other things. Sandbag them with surprised God-Knights.

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>1.

You find Bael and his knights in their own secluded part of the camp. Unsurprisingly, they’re keeping to themselves, aided by the fact that nobody wants to go near the nine feet tall giants of death. More surprisingly, they’re keeping their distance from each other. Perhaps it’s part of their nightly ritual, along with cleaning their armour as they are now.

Without his armour, Bael is no less intimidating a figure than he is fully armoured. Mostly he looks like you, but much bigger and with a face chiselled from stone. Also, there is a distinct lack of facial hair – you think he’d look much better with more than just his cropped black cut. He looks up from his breastplate as you approach and then rises to his feet.

“I take it that you have to speak with me, lord?” he asks you, his voice still the disturbingly deep baritone from earlier. That, at least, wasn’t an enchantment.

“I have, feel free to continue with your armour. Is this something you do out of habit or requirement?” you ask him, sitting on a nearby crate.

He sits and retrieves his greased cloth. “Both. It is good to have some consistency in life, for it maintains sanity where there is none. Not that I feel cleaning my armour protected me where my brethren fell. It is also a requirement, for I am not merely cleaning it but imbuing power into the armour to keep its enchantments strong. I have had this set since my uplifting and it is stronger than ever thanks to my daily ritual.”

>continued

>>35907279
Alternately, Taira switches down to a generic 4 tailed fox form and hangs with the small unit of foxes with us.

Rereading the first thread for the hell if it, and our description reads

>1. Knight

>You tear through your foes with terrible strength and skill. The magic you use is based around making yourself as fast and strong as possible, with some minor anti-magic thrown in for emergencies. You are an inspirational leader, too, and men desire to fight under you more so than others.

That antimagic bit get retconned?

Also:
>Your army:
50 Darlesian Flying Mage Knights (Vet.)
50 Darlesian Mage Knights (Vet.)
100 Darlesian Longbowmen (Vet.)
500 Darlesian Men-At-Arms (Vet.)
10 Darlesian Battlemages (Reg.)

Oh how far we've come. Dem feels

>>35907143
He is dead, bub.
The other 4 would get completely annihilated by the forces mentioned specifically in that discussion
if you want to argue that we can't lure them into such a trap. do so.
if you are arguing that those 10 uber god knights (each stronger than those uber god knights we faced in heien), as well as full talon retinue, and some regular troops? that is madness. they will crumple in under a minute.

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>>35907320
Pausing for a moment, he looks up at you with a wry expression. “If your next question is about my Lord and my homeland, I can save you the effort.”

“Actually, I was going to ask more about why you are here in particular,” you say. “I figure you get sick of telling people that it is an uninhabitable nightmare.”

“I do. It is a terrible fall from grace but there is little to tell beyond the obvious,” he says, his eyes crinkling slightly in a very faint smile even as his lips remain still. “As for why I am here, there is little reason. I travelled west after the Fall, able to do little other than ruminate on the words of my comrades. I encountered Marek and, knowing of his order’s mission, agreed to help him until I find my way. Just as one needs consistency in life, so too does one need a chance to demonstrate their talents and feel needed. It is a harsh shift for a knight of decades or centuries to go from a life of duty to one of wandering, and my men needed some respite.”

The god-knight can certainly talk a lot, you realise. You wonder whether anybody has just sat and talked with him like this recently. He might not be able to express himself like this to his underlings without shaking them. Or perhaps he knows what you, you think. Garynth sure as hell did.

What do you ask him next?

>1. What are you capable of?
>2. Do you know Garynth well?
>3. Do you know who I am?
>4. Do you know what these special weapons Shropham has developed are?
>5. Custom

>>35907322
the problem is that, in such a case, she can't prepare a short range teleport to bring the other elites right on top of the CMs when they show up.
the trap relies on her teleportation ability

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>>35907324
I polished up my use of the word 'anti-magic'. Back then it mostly meant 'countering a mage'. Now I'm using it exclusively for the stuff that explodes on contact with magic (ala antimatter), disruption magic for the stuff that Mal does and other terms or descriptions for everything else. Except the Anti-Magic Blade itself, which is something completely different. Because.

And yeah, there's some really dumb stuff at the beginning in terms of size compared to now. Like Glynn being surprised by a few hundred mage-knights. Haha.

>>35907341
>3. Do you know who I am?
>4. Do you know what these special weapons Shropham has developed are?

>>35907341
>All of the above, but that's a pain in the ass so 4 and 1.

>>35907341
>4
>1
>3

>>35907327
I was just giving an example. They could possibly have more CMs since the league isn't quite solid. Parts of the league might have secretly sent them help to retrieve the knowledge on the spears. Its not like we would have our entire hero group + the GKs all together especially in such a wide city combat as well. You have to factor in magical traps and other obstacles.

>>35907502
>They could possibly have more CMs since the league isn't quite solid.
this is a completely different argument.
I explicitly said, if you want to argue such a thing. do so
but the argument made was that those specific 4 CMs will stand a chance vs the full talon retinue and the full godknight retinue combined.

>>35907502
There are no CM's unaccounted for.

>>35907525
You specifically said that that I could argue on the basis on 'we can't lure them into a trap' not there are possibly more troops/CMs. All I am saying is that it is that 4CM vs all of heroes won't happen as we need to control the entire battle. Even if Taria teleports the heroes she needs information/location and time for the action. Most of our heroes can already 1v1 a CM at least.
>>35907569
Yes and those 5CMs that we fought were supposed to be accounted for and not present in our previous fight.

>>35907652
>Yes and those 5CMs that we fought were supposed to be accounted for and not present in our previous fight.
Right, but the only allies of Shroopham don't have any combat magisters to send to their aid. Also, do you really think Alyce didn't double check very carefully?

>>35907341
>1. What are you capable of?
>2. Do you know Garynth well?

That's the big ones. If he knew what the weapons where I"m pretty sure he would tell the monk and I would hope he knows who Talon is.

>>35907652
If they had more CM's they'd have used them before now.

>>35907738
>>35907710
We have only been in one fight and they have been mostly on the defensive. Alyce has been trying to tie down the League but there has been support for helping them. There could possibly be reinforcements.

Also didn't the daywalkers retreat in this direction or was it somewhere else in the league?

>>35907796
It was in this direction. Then they all died

>>35907805
Even Blackwater?

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>4.

“These, well, anti-magic weapons. Do you know much of them?” you ask Bael.

“I am not sure I would describe them as anti-magic but that is a murky area to describe. Their effects appear overtly deleterious – being able to sap the magic from beings that rely upon it could be easily abused. I would wonder what might happen to the world should one of your pure elementals be slain with one, given their connection with the world?” Bael says as he stares off into the distance. “Not that I am one to advocate such testing. It is more that I oppose the usage of weapons that cannot be easily undone. That spear could take but not give, and it could take too much.”

“So, you don’t know what it is but you do agree with everybody else that it’s bad,” you say, trying to decipher his speech.

“More or less,” he says with a smile.

>continued

>>35907858
no, he is the only surviving one

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>>35907858
>Doesn't realize Blackwater is Undine yet

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>>35907882
>1.

“What exactly are you capable of? And your knights, too?” you ask him.

“Fighting,” he says, before putting his breastplate aside and beginning to polish his greaves. “More specifically, winning. You want to know how I would live up to my subtle boasts?”

You’ve never heard boasting described as subtle, but you think it’s an apt description for now. “There’s only ten of you. Modifying an entire strategy and potentially putting everybody else at risk on just ten soldiers requires a large leap of faith.”

Nodding, Bael says, “Each Great Knight, and the candidates to replace them, have their own specialities. Yarrois, one of my former Lord’s Great Knights, had regeneration so powerful that he was all but unkillable. Most knights of Ember reflect his power, as he has been the model for most in the past century. As a candidate, I differ somewhat. My power is in defence and follows Holbelm, a Great Knight from two centuries past, and is about barriers. I am sure you can extend that to my proposed plan.”

The fact he only specified ‘barriers’ makes you wonder whether he’s also adept at destroying them. You also wonder about Garynth’s power, given you’re being led to believe the power of the knights under Bael is similar to his. You could even ask about Garynth in such a way to test what Bael know about you, perhaps.

>1. Just ask about Garynth.
>2. Ask about Garynth in such a way to test if Bael knows about your astral power.
>3. Ask Bael openly what he knows about you.
>4. Custom

Basically, 2 and 3 were the mutually exclusive options. Also, I'll be doing the beginning of the siege after this. I'm more exhausted than I expected after hauling wood around for a few hours, so I'll be ending the thread shortly after. Except a double thread of the siege next weekend. Come prepared with anti-CM plans.

>>35907882
this is the first hint as to WHY its actually bad
>Magic theory suggests that killing a pure elemental with such a thing might be harmful to the entire world
until now, the only reason to not use them I saw would be political (other people dislike them)
now i am in favor of destroying them all

>>35907900
>3. Ask about Garynth in such a way to test if Bael knows about your astral power.
Didn't you say that basically any user of asteral power roughly equal to or greater than Vlad in skill could pretty much easily spot our nature?

>>35907979
Ah, i meant
>3. Ask Bael openly what he knows about you.

>>35907900
>3. Ask Bael openly what he knows about you.

I am really curious to pick hgis brain about the uplifting process
even if he won't tell us details that would lead to us replicating it, I am curious to know if he can replicate it. or if it was dependent on ember

>>35907897
Who is blackwater agian?

>>35907900
>3. Ask Bael openly what he knows about you.

>>35907900
>>3. Ask Bael openly what he knows about you.

>>35907900
Oh, also ask if there is any particular reason why all the God-knights we've met are male. Seems kinda odd.

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>>35908137
Given the size of their armour, you wouldn't necessarily be able to tell if they were female. There's a couple of women in his group.

>>35908137
It's probably to balance almost every other powerful being being a grill.
Alyce, Sylvian, both archangels, the elementals, Taira, Lynn, Merce...
I'm willing to bet the first time we interact with a demon or fey in a non-confrontaional manner it will be both female and horrifically op.

>>35908099
the vampire-lich with the waifu phylactery why wouldn't die no matter how many times we sliced and diced him.
we gave him a bloody nose and a dislocated arm and he gave us a few injuries, then he left. we fought him at the top of the highest place in the city of taour
when we met him, he was sucking dry that daywalker gal who had the power to mass enthrall via singing

>>35907900
>1. Just ask about Garynth.

>>35908215
I wanted that daywalker girl, she'd have been fun to have around.

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>>35908192
What's hilarious is that this setting once had the problem of being too men-heavy in the same way, long before I started this quest. Now it's probably swung a little too far the other way.

>3.

“Tell me, Sir Baelrus, what do you think I am capable of?” you ask him, knowing that he should have been able to detect your abilities.

He looks up at you, giving you a strange look as he searches for something. It’s pretty clear to you then that he knows what you’re capable of and is looking for something else before admitting as such. Perhaps it’s the same thing that Garynth saw?

“You’re a little further in the process than Garynth expected you to be. You weren’t supposed to awaken for another decade or two,” he says finally, leaning back and giving you an approving nod.

“Supposed to?” you say, the words tapping a vein of anger.

“Expected to, really. Garynth tends to believe in his own foresight to such an extent he thinks he knows the future,” Bael says placidly. “To answer your initial question, I know both of your astral powers and of Garynth’s belief that you are… destined, in his words, for greater things. I came east after the Fall to see for myself.”

“And what do you see?”

“Right now? A man like any other, just with more power,” he says, and it cuts your ego more than you’d like to admit. “That is not a bad thing. The Lords were once men. Kushan was once a man. It is not the power, but what you do with it that makes it what you are. Don’t believe anything different.”

>continued

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>>35908265
No Anon. Do not listen to the dick. The dick lies. The dick schemes in league with Blackwater to bring about ruination upon all that the hands build, the heart aspires to, and the brain plans for. The Penis...is evil.

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>>35908423
You frown at that. It almost seemed directly contradictory to what Raphael had told you about your power directing you. Was it merely a different angle on the same thing or a different philosophy?

Unfortunately, Bael isn’t too interested in speaking on the topic further. Given you’ve just met him, you don’t feel it wise to press and make some small talk before retiring for the night.

A few days later your army arrives at Shropham. The city is hard to miss, with that great platform sitting atop an already massive city. The towers, so tall yet so small compared to the platform’s height, sparkle in the bright sunlight. A bizarre magic trick means the platform itself appears to cast no shadow on the city below it, with magical lights imitating the light of the sun as though the platform and its columns weren’t there. The city sprawls before you and it seems almost tranquil, as though unprepared for war.

Not that you’re so stupid to believe it. Twenty thousand enemy troops lay in wait within the city limits. Countless mages prepare their rituals to counter your advance and protect their egos and power. Knights sharpen their blades and polish their armour for use in protecting their pride and demonstrating their patriotism.

And some malevolent being lurk within the upper city, possibly manipulating the mages. Possible being manipulated by them. It is giving the mages a power that all the wise minds you know feel is a great evil in this world. In order to get to it, you’ll have to take the city first. Which suits you just fine.

>That’s the thread

Sorry for how short it ended up being. Next thread is November 7th at 6pm EST (DST ends). I’ll again be running two threads that weekend, hopefully without interruption this time. I’ll be around for another hour for questions.

>>35908265

I like the Shinobu Talon has better.

It's my fucking head canon and no one can tell me otherwise

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>>35908449
>Next thread is November 7th at 6pm EST (DST ends).
That should be 5pm, sorry. I went the wrong way with DST ending.

>>35908451
Black haired vampire is better than blonde.

You know I've always found it funny that as much as Talon talks to Sylvian we have never once really asked her about her philosophy.

>>35908451
>>35908556
Furthermore, lithe teen vampire is better than short loli.

>>35908556
>>35908617

Absolutely disgusting

>>35908617
Either that or a young middle aged vampire. Perhaps just a hint of grey. Experience yet vitality and looks.
Helps explain how the vampire is so cultured as well.

>>35908449
>You frown at that. It almost seemed directly contradictory to what Raphael had told you about your power directing you. Was it merely a different angle on the same thing or a different philosophy?
Aha!
I remember predicting some time ago that whether your power directs you or not depends on whether you BELIEVE it directs you or not. Because astral power is based on belief
furthermore, I predicted that if we end up actually going that route, we might set ourselves at opposition to raphael (as per the need of astral beings to prove themselves right and aversion to things that prove them wrong)

than again. don't humans become set in their ways anyways as the mature? old people are very resistant to changing

>>35908556

Don't rain on my parade, Blackwater.

>>35908661
Anon please, black contrasts so well with pale undead skin and a lare teen body has all the sleekness of loli, but far more grace.

Also, >>35908688 is objectively correct.

>>35908578
IIRC we have
some people are pretty guarded about their philosophy (alyce, syl)

>>35908556
You know speaking of vampires. What is the black haired waifus enthrallment method anyway?

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>>35908797
She can enthrall people who enter her home, basically. It takes a long time for her to recognise a place as her home, however.

>>35908911
would the enthralment polarity reversion into familiar bond thing happen if she tried to enthrall a god knight?

>>35908937
Not that I am saying I want her to
I am just wondering if its a thing with daywalkers trying to enthral astral users in general. or talon specific thing

>>35908911
Ah, now that is a useful power.
Get her to recognise the Harrowmont keep as her home, and we add a new layer of defence to the source.

>>35908976
I would rather we don't enthrall people. nasty PR there

>>35909002

Enthralling people would probably be used exclusively against invaders and other hostiles, in which case you take the PR hit every time. Source comes first.

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>>35908937
You don't have a clue and neither does she.

>>35909002
Not really. Enthralling some asshole that is busy trying to burn all your farms down in order to get military info wouldn't be so bad. It's more enthrallment of your own civilians that becomes an issue.

>>35908688
>Helps explain how the vampire is so cultured as well.

Probably that most have been alive for a 100+ years. You need to find hobbies unless you like become death destroyer of knights.

>>35908779
I don't think we directly asked things like what is the big magic research she hates and the likes. Other then creating sub species.

>>35910073
No, as in the apparent age helps the vampire seem cultured to people who don't know they're vampires.

>>35908099
You are Blackwater, fellow Blackwater.

>>35908435
So what you're saying is Blackwater really saved us from our penis who he is in league with? This is getting heavy...