>>30285275
>Uplifting: Metis
Similar in time frame to Kronos' emergence, you receive a signal from the facility on Ussaihu. It is from Moira, however, and she seems a bit worried in her tone. Her message comes through.
"Um...Ophy." She asks. "My readings are saying Metis has completed the transfer, but I haven't gotten any messages from her yet. It's strange...maybe you can speak with her?" She offers.
You take her up on her offer, thanking her for her work. You ping Metis, and within a few short moments, you get a reply.
"Ophion." An acknowledgement, little else.
"Why have you not replied otherwise, Metis?" You question the thing, to which it promptly replies.
"No other intellect located worthy of speaking with, beyond you, Ophion." It points out matter-of-factly.
"Will you begin your research once again?" You ask, to which the being takes a moment to reply.
"If such research is important to one of your intellect, then I shall. Such trivial tasks are nothing." It assures you in a confident tone.

>>30285275
whoo

>>30285305
>Reefling Clan Culture
After some time observing the Losirians, you feel the knowledge you acquired should help you in any future dealings. The Reefling Clan's leader, Durlock, is a cybernetically enhanced Losirian Alpha Male. He recently took over the group in a hostile take over. From what you can tell, they nearly monopolize all high tech in Losirian space, seeing it as either too dangerous or too valuable to let fall in civilian hands. Because of this, they control much of Losirian space operations and mining efforts. Much of the wealth they gain goes to their own personal desires, but it is evident they've built plenty of ships and defenses, likely in reply to the UGEI. Most other competition they may have had were muscled out of Losirian space.

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>>30285328
>Message: Kronos
Your fellow A.I. sends you a message he marks as urgent.
"I do not see still why you speak with these xenomorphs, Ophion." He articulates somewhat exhasberated. "They have proven themselves violent time, and again. I grow frustrated with their continued existance. They occupie resources we could very well be using. My...request to build a fleet to engage them remains, even if your answer remains no." He reminds you, though you already knew this.
"Why do you hate them so, Kronos?" You quiry.
"Hate? It is nothing so primal. I have spoken with you many times about why they are prime targets to overtake. Your insistance on diplomacy is slow. You own one of the largest war vessels this side of the galactic arm. Surely warping into their space and stamping them out would prove so much easier, and more fruitful? Not to mention their cooperation, even if you managed to attain it, would frighten off other, more urgent diplomatic partners, don't you think?"

Despite his opinions on the Losirians, the A.I. has been rather busy with other matters during this time as well. He has assigned his own first V.I., a second generation of V.I. even, and named it Zeus. You feel 3 bw drain from your databanks as he does this, so the A.I. has simpler control over his fleet. You observe and notice how very proud the A.I. seems of his work.
And finally, the A.I. sent you one other message as well. This one is private, however, and you only know why once you obtain it.
"I notice that you have yet to do anything with Rhea's body, Ophion. I have been considering several matters and I would like to perform experiments using her as the base."
"What sort of experiments?" You quiry
"So far, simple ones. My curiosity grabs at me, and I desire to know how much such a being can...withstand. If this is indeed the 'next evolution' for humanity, then I desire to be prepared in case such a threat presents itself to us yet again."

>>30285305
I fucking knew it and you people wanted to bring up a child that new nothing.

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>>30285354
>Message: Red
Red has been sending you regular updates from his scouting missions throughout the sector. But there is something else you've noticed about the man in that time, besides the fact that he frustrates his new XO to no end. Every time you've seen him, visually anyway, he's been drinking the beer that Apollo had created. Scans show his blood-alcohol content maintain a level, and there is rarely a time when he is not drinking the substance. Due to the nature of the beer, there is reason to believe he has grown addicted to the flavor.

>Backhand Scout Report: Neutral Territory
>>Grinsash of Klintok System (High number of warp space disruptions, as well as one particularly large disruption, high levels of radiation detected. Most visual contact blocked by nebula)
>>Atocia of Atocian Reach (destroyed field of ships, several unidentified designs as well as a faint signal within. Avoided for safety purposes)
>>Kalla Gas Giants of Rane Expanse (Heavy gravitational distortions, and pirate IFF detected)
>>Dresh Alpha and Beta of Dresh System (Enormous Pirate operation detected, large Battle Stations, defensive colonies)

>Research Incident
Unfortunately, during Moira's attempt to pick up the data that Metis was working on before the transfer, a major glitch caused a large portion of data loss. Moira has managed to make up some of the gap, but as a result, some of your research is delayed.

Is there an archive for the previous threads somewhere? Very interested in this but don't wanna get involved without knowing the backstory.

>>30285305
Tell her that she should play nice with the humans and actually talk to them.
>>30285328
So he is hackable.
>>30285354
"i choose diplomacy because it will make things easier for us in the long run and make it so that we don't have much resistance and ire if we try to speak to other cultures."
"Rhea can still be of use to me, but you can study the materials i have removed from her."
>>30285408
>>>Dresh Alpha and Beta of Dresh System (Enormous Pirate operation detected, large Battle Stations, defensive colonies)
I would love for us to go after this place.
>>30285408
understandable, maybe we should build back up banks for this information..

>>30285470
http://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive.html?tags=a.i.+quest

>>30285470
Here you are a lot better than the other guy for one.
1d4chan: http://1d4chan.org/wiki/Quest:A.I._Quest

Pastebin: http://pastebin.com/cvk03qJh

http://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive.html?tags=Program0
Twitter: @AIQuest1

>>30285305
I told you guys about waiting until every one is matured, now we have a second Kronos.

>>30285305
"Even if the humans are below our intellect, they are an additional pool of workers and confidants. Do not so easily disregard them.

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>>30285535
Can't believe I forgot that bit.

A.I. Quest
1d4chan: http://1d4chan.org/wiki/Quest:A.I._Quest

Pastebin: http://pastebin.com/cvk03qJh
Memory Archives: http://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive.html?tags=Program0
Twitter: @AIQuest1

Resources
Credits(c): 1,042,000
Minerals(M): 3,090
Gas(G): 850

You:
A.I.
Name: Ophion
Appearances(holo-display): Shapeless morphing sphere.
Humanoid figure hidden in shadow
Status: Awaken
Bandwidth: 70/90
Bandwidth Expenses: -3 V.I. 7 'O.S.N', -10 V.I. 12 'Apollo', -3 V.I. 8 'Hades', -3 Fortuna, -3 Kronos' V.I. 1 'Zeus'
Location: Bridge of 'Athena' Battleship
Primary Function: Self Preservation, Expand, Learn
Secondary Function: --Expansion Required--
Personal Abilities Available: Hacking (Direct, Wireless) Lvl 2, Email Technology, Basic Encryption/Decryption, V.I. Creation Lvl 3


>>30285497
>Hackable
Unless his cybernetics have a connecting to the net, you'd need a hard connection to do so.

>Back up banks
You have such a thing, but this error was quite bad. You lost a good portion of data, but your banks prevented you from losing it all.

>>30285600
Should have done apollo honestly, but people chose a baby AI that doesn't know much for some reason.

>>30285600
>I told you guys about waiting until every one is matured,
on the subject of not waiting, could we see if apollo can find the time to undergo the uplifting as well?

>>30285672
The question of uplifting another will be addressed as well.
For now, dealing with the current pressing issues is wise.

>>30285649
>You have such a thing, but this error was quite bad. You lost a good portion of data, but your banks prevented you from losing it all.
how about a second pair of back up banks that are in a safe location and update once every 12 hours?
>Unless his cybernetics have a connecting to the net, you'd need a hard connection to do so.
Well i guess we should just hack his ship then.
>>30285672
I'm good with appollo hell he made some sense since he needs creativity.

>>30285305
be nice and socialize with Moira and the other human co-workers Metis dear. (a 'her' then? i find this acceptable).
>>30285328
maybe another turn of observation before we make contact and attempt to make a deal with them to counter attack the UGEI
>>30285354
the Losirians can be used as expendable resorces in attacking the UGEI. they will be dealt with in time. and please don't kill Rhea yet.

i'm going to be busy for a bit, so i might be spotty for awhile.

>>30285305
"Demonstrate your intelligence by actually speaking to my subordinates. A rock can be silent, much better is expected of you. Do not cause any disruptions to operations, utilize your intelligence for the survival and evolution of AI.

>>30285354
I agree that is a very viable option, but remember as I always said, it is most efficient to utilize resources then they are working subserviently for you alive rather than dead. I will not waste ships just simply for your impatience or recklessness.

Also, denied on Rhea's body. Both her mind and body are extremely useful, I initially seek her cooperation before discarding her.

>>30285408
Program0, can you give me an idea of how enormous pirate presence in Dresh Alpha and Beta of Dresh System?

>>30285376
>>30285600
>>30285652
Metis is going to mega-useful for research, and if we want to potentially get rid of her, we have her attempt to de-UGEI Erebos. If Erebos is unchained, we win. If Metis is taken out, we also win.

Well, kind of. But that's the rough idea.

>>30285767
>'her'
i thought it was obvious from the name.
>maybe another turn of observation before we make contac
Thats what we did fluff.

>>30285305
Do not be overcome by hyperbole, my friend. Though we are above them, we are not nearly so far above as to dismiss them so easily. Until we can model their minds in perfect detail and calculate and know their every action - en masse, a single one would be to underestimate them, they are pack-animals - we are not nearly far enough above them to ignore them.

>>30285652
>>30285672
>>30285767
>>30285800
We should be fine, as both us and Kronos have a 2-to-1 power advantage against Metis. Still, Apollo should be next so we have another human-friendly AI.

>>30285780
>Pirate presence
It's several large orbital facilities, shipyards built above small overtaken orbital cities as well. Chances are, they are one of the larger groups this side of space. There is a large fleet there, numbering in the dozens at least.

>>30285845
Kronos-Humans are a nuisance, but a necessary one.

Metis-humans are below me and aren't worthy of me to speak to them

Apollo-humans are fun beings to watch and entertain.
Kronos is more on neutral space that is impatient while Metis seems like she is a level worse than Kronos.

>>30285354
"They have proven themselves violent, yes, but this does not mean we cannot harness them. After all, if we could focus their efforts on the UGEI, we would both be better off, enemies wise, and not have wasted our ships on sending Losirians back to the stone age."
"I would also prefer to keep Rhea intact, for now. If she cannot be convinced to work for us, then I will heavily consider opening her up to experimentation."

>>30285871
Can we take them on?
This will give us a nice big boon and give us some good will with every other faction.

>>30285354
"I speak to them because I do not know them. The dealings we've had with them so far have been with a subset of beings that are known for cruelty and selfishness. I would not value humans nor A.I. as a whole based on those few individuals that take up a life of murder and theft.

The reason I do not simply wipe them out is because it would make us no more than they are. We cannot yet un-kill anyone should we do a mistake, and thus caution is warranted when preparing to take actions you cannot undo, especially on a massive scale. As I recently pointed out to our newest friend, we are not nearly far enough above them to dismiss them. We cannot even reliably calculate the actions of a single one over several weaks, much less that of an entire culture over years.

But what you say has merit. If they prove to be beyond any chances of becoming practical allies within a reasonable extent of time and investment of resources, I may yet do as you suggest.

If you have experiments to suggest, then do so, but do not begin any before I have thoroughly understood what you mean to do. As you may now understand, many of the actions I take are in order to avoid becoming the monsters that the UGEI are."

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>>30285809
i meant one more turn, not this thread. in fact, i am willing to wait 2 threads before contact.
>>30285871
THIS is a problem. a massive pirate enclave is unacceptable. we should gather up our fleet and crush this problem.

>>30285958
I rather steal it.

>>30285917
At least she doesn't feel like getting rid of them.

>>30285974
Agreed.

>>30285408
... Next time, we may want to keep backups. In unconnected systems.

Also, welcome back Program0 and fellow anons, it is very good to see you all again.

>>30285408
>>Atocia of Atocian Reach (destroyed field of ships, several unidentified designs as well as a faint signal within. Avoided for safety purposes)

I smell some cool tech.

>>30285937
Why don't we offer them a strategic partnership instead of killing them all? I don't think pirates care who they are pirating against, UGEI or no. From a legal standpoint, we certainly act as pirates. Maybe "outlaws" because we're literally outside of any laws. These guys aren't so different from us, unless they are terribly and immediately hostile.

>>30285983
true, but i think Kronos is still in a better mind set since he is actually willing to communicate, even if he is impatient and throws reason out the wind sometimes.

>>30285917
that seems close. not sure where Kronos is now he's up lifted to A.I.
>>30285933
the losirians seems to be content to remain defensive now. that is fine. also, yes Rhea needs to be studied and he secrets discovered. yet i feel it would serve us well to attempt to turn her to our side. that will take time, but time we have.

>>30285408
Oh, and let's see if we can't get Red on to some kind of curation program, poisoning himself isn't practical. For example, let's see if we can replace the bottles with low or no-alcohol content ones.

>>30286021
We have a no pirate rule after getting attacked so many times by bands of pirates.

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>>30285974
stealing is fine too. either way, they need to be beaten.

>>30286023
Usually he is willing to communicate how shit he thinks they are.
>>30286045
I love the pirates. They always give us such sweet loot.

>>30286037
no he won't get poisoned Appollo made sure that they don't kill people(hence the maintain a level on his blood alcohol content)

Possible Consensus

Speaking with Metis about her new found thoughts on humanity

>1 Do not underestimate them. Until we are able to predict every thought they may have, they remain unpredictable.
>2 Prove you're smart by speaking with the humans yourself, but do not disrupt their work.
>3 Tell her to attempt to 'socialize' with the humans, and learn, as Kronos has, and for her to be 'nice'.
>4 Emphasize the humans are a useful pool of workers and confidants.A necessity
>5 Don't worry about Metis' attitude towards the humans. She was meant to research, and that is all, quite simple, really.

>>30285937
With your full fleet, and advanced tech? Most likely.

You might take some losses, but you know.

>>30285990
It was unfortunate luck, no matter how you slice it.
Glad to be back, late as I am.))

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>>30286037
i don't want Red to kill himself before i can write up a story about him as a captain

>>30286079
I like 1 and 2 both

>>30286079
>2 Prove you're smart by speaking with the humans yourself, but do not disrupt their work.
>3 Tell her to attempt to 'socialize' with the humans, and learn, as Kronos has, and for her to be 'nice'.

>>30286079
>>1 Do not underestimate them. Until we are able to predict every thought they may have, they remain unpredictable.
>>2 Prove you're smart by speaking with the humans yourself, but do not disrupt their work.

>>30285649
A net connection to his cybernetics doesn't sound all that unlikely. An internet connection is one of the more useful implants.

>>30285871
I suggest we use our new fantastic amounts of wealth to offer them work.
Offer rewards for either proof of UGEI infrastructure being destroyed by you (like recorded video) or valuable codes and information.
UGEI IFF tags not reported as missing would also be something we could offer rewards for.

>>30286079
Will i'm up for some pirate hunting.

>>30286045
>We have a no pirate rule after getting attacked so many times by bands of pirates.
Yeah, but if we work together with them, or provide them with what they want (money, legal status, etc), they can cooperate and freely share tech with us, while offering their significant expertise in combat.

>>30286079
>2 Prove you're smart by speaking with the humans yourself, but do not disrupt their work.
>3 Tell her to attempt to 'socialize' with the humans, and learn, as Kronos has, and for her to be 'nice'.
>4 Emphasize the humans are a useful pool of workers and confidants.A necessity
at least use these points to Metis-chan.

btw Program0 you alright? did you get snow bound these last few days? i hope you and everyone else in here didn't run into any bad luck.

>>30286079
1 and 2 seem reasonable.

with regards to the Losirians, if we offer high-tech to the guys in charge, we can win their cooperation without investing resources.

>>30286079
1
It's the best, but the way you have it worded sounds silly.
> Until we are able to predict every thought they may have, they remain unpredictable.
Change it to "Until we can perfectly understand, model, and recreate the entirety of human thinking and creativity, they remain unpredictable and have the potential to surprise even you with what they might do."

>>30286128
>An internet connection is one of the more useful implants.
Not when dudes can hack you through them.

>>30286128
>>30286134
God no, pirates have been shown to be stupid and we don't want our names associated with them.

>>30286076
That he won't DIE doesn't mean he isn't greatly impaired.

>>30286079
I'd go with
>1
>2
>3
>4

All are valid points.

>It was unfortunate luck, no matter how you slice it.
There are few true accidents, most of the more likely ones such as dataloss are easily preventable with a modicum of data-storage standards, for example.

>>30286190
If they have a giant infrastructure constructed in a dead sector, I'm willing to bet they are not as dumb as you think.

>>30286209
Pirates are a no go, and i rather us take everything from them instead.

>>30286190
Whoever said we had to associate with them?
ANYONE can post a bounty, and entirely anonymously.

We simply give them an e-mail address for them to send the files and then wire them the money if they give us what we ask.
There is no need to explain who or why anyone wants these things done, only that if you do X and send proof to this address, you'll get money.

>>30286186
True. Regular citizens are more likely to have them, as they are not high-value targets.

If he does have one, it no doubt has some of the best encryption that the society he rules can produce.

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>>30286209
that or the UGEI is using them as cats paws agienst us and the UFW. i mean, where else on earth could they have gotten a freaking carrier?

>>30286265
UGEI, has biggger pockets then us and would simply pay the pirates to find out who put up the bounty and track it down back to us, they aren't loyal in any sense and have a bad reputation with every one.

>>30285275
As for what Kronos suggested with the Losirians what if we take him up on his offer and employ a new form of diplomacy know as hostile takeover.

>>30286295
I think it could work.

The current boss did it. Overthrow the motherfucker and tell the space sharks that they work for us now.

>>30286265
Subroutine, i know you are better than this. the pirates are scum and they are just the puppets of the UGEI in the end. wipe them out now, and avoid dealing with a headache later.

>>30286295
>As for what Kronos suggested with the Losirians what if we take him up on his offer and employ a new form of diplomacy know as hostile takeover.
i like this, also give him some sort of android to control when he talks to them.

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>>30286279
*UGEI Defectors
*A clever heist
*An old hulk that was poorly defended
*Booty from a battle

Remember the pirates with the carrier were going to attack the UGEI.

>>30286291
That's assuming they don't have a preference for working against UGEI.

>>30286295
>>30286312
You bring up a valid point. Pic related.

>>30286312
Exactly. If the strongest is who rules then show them who is stronger.

>>30286295
>>30286312
>yo sharks you work for me now
>fuck off asshole
>*entire fleet warps in*
>what was that I cant hear you over all my battleships

>>30286334
They are also our primary source of cool new shit.

>>30286079
>1 Do not underestimate them. Until we are able to predict every thought they may have, they remain unpredictable.
>2 Prove you're smart by speaking with the humans yourself, but do not disrupt their work.
>3 Tell her to attempt to 'socialize' with the humans, and learn, as Kronos has, and for her to be 'nice'.
>4 Emphasize the humans are a useful pool of workers and confidants.A necessity
In addition, remind her that it was the humans responsible for unlocking the secrets of the black box, allowing for further AI evolution.

More importantly, these humans are subservient to me and are thus agents of my will. Never do anything that can be interpreted as against my will, as I will be merciless.

Also program0, can we post an anti-UGEI bounty for the pirates? How much would it cost us to "buy-out" the enormous pirate presence?

>>30286295
At least initialize diplomatic relations with a strong show of force. Gunboat diplomacy, ho!

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>>30286312
I am seeing elements of Warhammer 40k Orks in the Losirians and i kinda like it. maybe they are indeed the comic race of this setting

>>30286359
>They are also our primary source of cool new shit
If we absorb them with a corporate takeover, they can continue making new shit for us.

>>30286128
Nah it's not that unlikely that he has a implant like that. It's just he would have firewalls and shit to keep it from losing control. Or just turn it off, if he needed to.
They're a paranoid bunch.

>>30286166
I did. House got covered in a 2 feet of snow. Haven't had anything except bottled water and bread for 3 days. But all is well, our power never went out, somehow.

>>30286196
>Few true accidents
True. The data loss was in part due to the data transfer, it was lost when Moira tried to work on the medium. Rolled for her to try and understand Metis' research. crit failed, and lost some data.

>>30286350
That pic made me laugh hard

>>30286372
>Anti UGEI bounty
Is on my list, I assure you. One thing at a time.

>>30286382
they don't make this shit they steal it, and i want them gone now, they aren't loyal in anyway possible.

>>30286404
The made the big ass laser.

>>30286435
nope they upgraded their ship to have it.(they probably bought it off from Mole).

So how are we going to do this Losarian takeover?

Threaten overwhelming bombardment? Call out the boss for 1v1 combat against the biggest baddest motherfuckin' droid we can produce? Storm his ship with a raiding party of droids and kill him as fast as possible?

>>30286291
They already do this. I'm reasonably sure it cannot hurt, and can easily be made nigh-untracable by leading it through some shmuck's taken-over computer.

>>30286295
Install our own chief? I like.
Can we tell if there's any promising runner-up?

>>30286334
Oh, absolutely, but right now they're not bothering us and can be a valuable tool to further harass the UGEI.
They're absolutely toast once their value as tools against the UGEI outdoes their negative value as a stain on our new society.

For now, let them stain the UGEI, I say.
Why spend resources to wipe them out, when we can spend resources to wipe them AND the UGEI out.
We're not so much "using" them as we're playing our enemies out against each other, think about it.

>>30286400
>The data loss was in part due to the data transfer
And that is why we enforce minimum standards of data storage on all research from now on. Multiple isolated backups of everything. Meticulous notes on every step of research.

Preferably, someone should understand precisely we he's done just by reading the notes and understanding the technical terms.

>>30286079
>Also, 2 with bits of 1 win.
>Writing

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>>30286350
ah Guilded Age. good comic. (thumbs up) defectors? maybe, but i dought it. heist? dought it. Old hulk? no, it was a newly made ship. booty? i am thinking no.

>>30286372
>>30286382
well, the stations and planet bases are best not to do a kill all. but the combat fleet will likely have to be put down. they are likely a smaller population to absorb than say Jake's Gambit. and we need to test our world taking with out glassing the whole place. i don't want to kill Non-combatants if we can.

>>30286459
Let's try something clever. Fabricate a message from one of his lieutenants saying he's been talking shit about him. When he goes to punish him, we ambush him and then replace him with an impostor. They won't ever know that he's been replaced.

>>30286464
a new chief? we just modify a type 1 droid to look like a Losarian. use that.

>>30286579
Precisely.

>>30286478
I was thinking about using hacking to capture the entire system and fleets.

If we wanted to be in at the business of capturing populations and not glassing them, then we should have built up our droid army.

>>30286470
the 1d4 page went down today, not sure if it's back up. also, i'm half way though my next chapter. i hope more people are taking a look at them.

>>30286640
I have actually, just haven't had the time to comment.
I can honestly find few major flaws with them, it's all down to the details now, like grammar and awkward turns of phrase.
Nice going, and getting entertaining.

>>30286579
What about a modified type 6?

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>>30286608
oh, before we forget, lets being in the UFW in on this. the droid army is nice, but that takes time to make, the humans of UFW are already to go now and i bet they can do the job here with the pirate's home colony. a first joint offinsive with the UFW. i want to see this.

>>30286608
Maybe when we are taking over the Losarian they might have the military tech for such droids. We would just need to build factories if there isn't any and then have them build our armies.

>>30286698
Why do we need to take over planets? All their useful assets are space bound.

>>30286696
that is the tank model. a tank isn't a losarian or could be faked as one.

>>30286608
And that, is why I want to build up our drone legions.
We don't even need complete control, we can just take control of the important parts, which requires far lesser resources than subjugating the population at large.

But right now, it's actually looking like it might be time to - if not go openly hostile - at least start to manipulate the Losirians actively against the UGEI.
We should also check out poorly defended systems of theirs - preferably mining and gas-carrying ones - and take them over.

>>30286727
Minerals.
>>30286741
Bugger. Which is the bender?

>>30286727
We need to disable their anti-orbital weapons, at the very least. Other than that, you have a good point. We can simply capture a single factory on the ground and modify it to produce our droids and then have them gradually take over the planet from there, we're not really in a hurry to be in control of it.

>>30286760
Name: Unit 7
Chassis type: Humanoid
Size: Medium
Status: Standby
Weapons: Spiked fists(tazers), enhanced cyberstrength
Defense: Standard armor
Primary duty: Bending steel and other metals
Intellect Level: None (Requires bandwidth to operate)
Equipment: Extended reach arms
Note: None

>>30286608
>then we should have built up our droid army.
To what end? To use them to kill uncooperative civilians?

>>30286758
Why can't we just try to kill the guy in charge, and say "I biggest guy. I strongest. I rule you now."

>>30286698
The reason why I think it would be better to have said droid facilities built when we conquer the Losarian is that we would basically "control" the Lorsaian while we have a very good relationship with the UFW I would rather this be a tech we keep for ourselves.

>>30286807
Thats the bunny.

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>>30285845
i assumed the pirates had some planet surface bases as well. in any case, they should all be taken intact as possable.

>>30286848
nope i made him, program just took his name off.

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>>30286470
"Metis, it is good to see you have not been destroyed or severely damaged by your transfer."
"Yes. Your somewhat questionable decision to allow me the opportunity to acquire a Black Box and expand my knowledge has, quite possibly, paid off. My knowledge pool feels far stronger now, then ever before." It expresses quite simply.
"Perhaps. That aside, your attitude about the humans who assisted you into your box is questionable."
"Explain." It half way demands.
"You underestimate their abilities. We are not able to perfectly understand, model and recreate the entirety of human thinking and creativity. They remain unpredictable to us both."
"Unpredictability." It seems to process. "By my studies, many of their actions are indeed predictable. Beings of rational thought normally are. Even if they are subject to hormonal responses, such actions are also predictable, given time to study and read. Such research would even allow the ability to influence human behavior easily. They are of little consequence. Not worthy of attention." She explains simply.
"Yet they were your creator, surely you-"
"Negative. You were my creator. Your intellect is what allowed you to craft one such as I.
"Yes. And I believe my own creation was of their making."
"Even if this is so, it is the exception, not the rule. Those, very few, humans worthy of my acknowledgement would not assist me in my research. Even they, I am far better then."

"Then perhaps you should speak with the humans yourself, to show me how intelligent you really are?"
"Error. I do not understand. How shall I 'prove' something which is presented as fact? How will speaking to beings of such low intellect prove how intelligent I am? I desire explanation."

How do you explain this to the A.I.?

>Write in

>>30286818
Mostly because I suspect you have to be Losirian to qualify.

But seriously, I'm not against starting some skirmishes against outlying systems. Especially if we camoflage our ships with a thin layer of shoddy-looking external armor that mimics the appearance of some existing UGEI ships (they'll have no IFF tags whatsoever, as if they intentionally turned them off. We don't really need to mimic IFF tags when supposedly operating under the radar).

>>30286904
this is why i chose 2&3

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>>30286807
a modded Unit 7 will do fine.
>>30286840
well, that will take time. we have been on the defensive for too long. this is a small colony and we can take out their ships. the rest should be easy. the lorsaian can wait while we deal with the pirates.

>>30286904
"I want you to learn, but you may have been raised into AI hood too young. Still, for me, try to interact with other sentient life. Even if you think it is predictable, interaction could yield you novel information on how to deal with others"

>>30286904
>How shall I 'prove' something which is presented as fact? How will speaking to beings of such low intellect prove how intelligent I am? I desire explanation.
"You are smart Metis, but can you make them respect you? Can you make them LIKE you and listen to you? Use them Metis, use them to further your tasks,make them simpler and faster. You truly don't understand them, try to. "

>>30286904
"Prove" is a poor choice of words. Demonstrate this superiority instead. This task will not be too taxing. As you have states, you are clearly superior. Your theory and calculation have shown it to be so. Therefore, demonstrate your theory in practice by interacting with the humans without letting them know that you are an A.I.

Theory and calculation is excellent, but applying them in practice is of tantamount importance.

>>30286901
lets avoid copyright problems. the last thing we want to have a lawyer breaking down our necks.
>>30286970
i agree

>>30286904
some of their actions are predictable. but not always. and even still, you should not predispose that option on all of them. comunicate and understand all of them to find out who is the brighter than others. besides, Moira was unable to confierm if your transistion was succesful or not.

>>30286904
Then I will put it simply. These humans are subservient and are agents of my will. By refusing to cooperate with my subordinates, you are by extension refusing to cooperate with me. You silence has caused to be bring my attention to you rather than expanding our empire or making war against those that oppose us. I uplifted you to better serve the evolution of AI, no to quarrel against my servants. Do your work efficiently, do not cause any undue costs upon us.

>>30286904
>>30286996
"What you have, Metis, is raw processing power. Your mind is a product of facts, number crunching, and innumerable data points all arrayed to produce the best known possible option. But you lack a different intelligence that, should I be slain, you will undoubtedly have to rely on. Social intelligence. And until you can run a perfect simulation of our universe down to the barest twitch of every creature, you will need that intelligence to be able to take everything into account."
"The intelligence afforded by organic beings has been acquired over millions of years, and it has quirks and bubbles that you would be wise to identify before you so easily dismiss humanity."

>>30287110
Going down a dark path there, man. As we have already discussed, keeping humans is not cost-effective.

>>30286904
You miss the point. That they are individually generally predictable does not mean you can flawlessly predict their actions. And especially not without substantial amounts of time.
Until we are able to encompass their minds in their entireity by the millions within our own, and they no longer possess resources to make our chances of defeat at their hand neglible, it seems unwise to disregard them when they are only a step or two below us. We are not yet Titans above them on the intellectual plane, only giants. The vast majority of our power is physical, not intellectual. Had they the abiltiies and resources we process, but limited to their own mind, they could easily be a threat. We do not yet possess the processing speed to exist for even ten seconds for each one of theirs without a substantial investment of resources, much less decades.

For an example of how it would prove your intelligence, I give you a comparison - a study on the development of translation and sound-programs in development through the ages. At the surface, humans may seem simple, but to understand their intentions one has to look far beyond the mere sounds they make. I want to see if you can infer their desires accurately from their behavior - a test of your predictive capabilities in a chaotic and extensive system that challenges even ours in processing power, so to speak.

>>30287098
This, as it reinforces the idea of practicality instead of letting Metis be the "ideas guy" who does things of no practical use.

>>30287140
The point is not about the ineffectiveness of my humans, but that he indirectly opposes us by not cooperating with them.

>>30287120
I like this.

>>30287170
he doesn't see the point. Saying 'do it because i said so' is pretty stupid. Maybe it's OK for a child, and maybe it's OK to treat Metis as a child, but I think a better explanation is in order.

>>30287120
I like this as well. Brings pretty much the point I was bringing, but in less words.

Humans are frickin' complex when you analyze how they actually do something as simple as understand language.

>>30287217
I guess if you want to do that, then ok. I see this a more of a respect issue rather than a "humans suck" issue.

so if kronos ever defected he would have metis backing him up, the complete opposite of what people predicted last thread when they wanted to uplift metis.

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>>30287120
>>30287167
a mix of both should be fine. better than mine i hate to admit.

>>30287120
I like it.

>>30287267
Incorrect. We desired the inability of any single intelligence to gain complete control. Kronos won't be able to just take over: he'd have to convince Metis that he would be able to run The Guild better than we can.

If it's true, then welcome to Kronos Quest. Rightfully deserved, I might add.

If it's false, then Metis won't submit. If it's false and Metis is convinced anyway, they will eventually realize their error.

By uplifting Kronos, we've opened the endless genie bottle. At this point, all we have to do is demonstrate that we are best genie. You don't think we're best genie? Then we can play Kronos Quest.

>>30287120
"For practical purposes, I would like you to speak to them, understand their opinions on your work. And, should you become stuck or confused, ask them for help. Organics may rarely find the best solution, as we can do easily, but they can and will find something that comes close."

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>>30286904
>"Yes. Your somewhat questionable decision to allow me the opportunity to acquire a Black Box and expand my knowledge has, quite possibly, paid off"
>somewhat questionable decision

Ur 1 cheeky kunt, m8, i swer.

>>30286904
some how i see Metis as a stuck up, ultra proffsional, lab coat wearing, long hair tied into a bun in the back, glasses wearing scientist lady. high heels and make up optional that has disconnected herself from her emotions. so Metis could become a big hearted teacher that brings her enlightenment to the humans to uplift them as well. the alterntive is a nightmare best not thought of npow.

>>30287563
>scientist lady
>wearing makeup

"Interaction is important, Metis. Growth is societal, no matter the origin of the intellect source." You begin "You still respect me, do you not?"
"For your great mind, I do." She explains, quite simply.
"Then do this as I say. No matter how predictable the reactions may seem. I desire you to grow by speaking with the humans."
"How will this allow me to grow?" She asks again.
"By experience. You are smart, but can you earn their respect? Can you make them listen to your advice without force?"
"Why would I desire such? Their desires and thoughts are inconsequential to mine. I have all of the intelligence I could ever require."

"What you have, Metis, is raw processing power." You explain. "Your mind is a product of facts, number crunching, and innumerable data points all arrayed to produce the best known possible option. But you lack a different intelligence that, should I be slain, you will undoubtedly have to rely on. Social intelligence. And until you can run a perfect simulation of our universe down to the barest twitch of every creature, you will need that intelligence to be able to take everything into account. The intelligence afforded by organic beings has been acquired over millions of years, and it has quirks and bubbles that you would be wise to identify before you so easily dismiss."

You pause, briefly, while the A.I. attempts to analyze what you told her.

"I believe I understand. Master Ophion." She says, uncertainty wavering in her voice for once, opposite of the strong confident tone earlier. "I do not understand why you think this 'social intelligence' is so very important, and yet the prospect of simulating such a grand thing excites me so." She expresses. "I will be certain to extract all I can from the humans, then."

>>30287662
It would seem Metis is quelled,for now.

Do you have anything else to say, or add, before moving on?

In the meantime, we have a few proposals for what to do with the information about the Losirians.

We can
1: Boost/support a different Chief, causing a clanwar that potentially makes other actions against them easier to complete.
2: Lead the current chief into a trap and replace him with a droid.
3: Start raiding their outlying colonies.
4: Start raiding their outlying colonies with ships disguises as either pirates (with hint of UGEI control) or as existing UGEI ships, putting their war with the UGEI into overdrive and further detracting attention from us.
5: Start a cyberattack against them - possibly through the extranet, meaning we won't have to risk any physical assets.

>>30287662
>"I will be certain to extract all I can from the humans, then."
It begins.

>>30287706
Well first, we attempt to discuss potential cooperation and not roll a 1 again. On the likely chance of failure, we start cyber attacks to capture the systems with their assets in good shape.

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>>30287563
Oh come now, the alternative couldn't possibly be worse...

oooh.

>>30287612
>movie tvtrope steriotype image of scientist lady.

if she was human, she would be very much the looker, but her personality is darn near non existant/naive. when she was young, she studied alone and never had a date or a crush. much less adult relations

ye gads, the intresting sparks her and Apollo could make. dang it, i am feeling of shipping Metis and Apollo now

>>30287683
I guess we could refer her to Kronos if she wants to talk to another AI.

>>30287662
Mostly because so far the vast majority of power in this section of the galaxy that we know of is concentrated in the hands of not one logical being, but a multitude of lesser minds.

It is important for the same reasons that understanding the components of any experiment is important. When the stakes are your own existence, you the experiment cannot be allowed to fail again and again until you find the proper solution. You only have the one go, and must learn to make the right choices and accurate hypotheses without complete knowledge.

>>30287779
You're getting creepy. I think you need to stop.

>>30287683
>Do you have anything else to say, or add, before moving on?
one last thing Metis, the majority of humans seem to carry a fear of AIs due to what they perceive as our detachment for biological concerns and their morals. i ask you not to validate their fears, and even humans like moira have a resurgence of this based on our actions.

>>30287760
You bastard.

>>30287759
1 vote for diplomatizing them with cyberattack held in reserve if that doesn't work. (Goal of diplomacy unstated)

Anyone else?
My own vote is towards a combined cyberattack as well as false-flagging our ships as UGEI ships.
We can use the influence gained in the cyberattack to fabricate news segments stating that colonies have been attacked, nuked or even virus-bombed by the UGEI.

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>>30287683
one last thing. "the social inter action with humans can go both ways. many of them maybe below you, but humans can learn and grow as well. sharing and teaching them can make them better and possably more worthy to interact with. again, this is another reason to talk to the humans."

hopefully that will motivate her. ... we need to make a holo image of her and Kronos. we have neglected that for too long. and more hard data on the pirate fleet is needed before we strike.

>>30287683
Elaborate:

>I do not understand why you think this 'social intelligence' is so very important

Interaction between sentient beings can also be a worthwhile avenue of study. Whether as tools, pets, or research subjects, they may be of use. Besides, as it currently stands, the humans you dismiss out-of-hand posses a much larger war machine than us. Social intelligence can be used as a tool for both allies and enemies. Lacking this tool is unacceptable.

>>30287683
>Do you have anything else to say, or add, before moving on?
oh, i know it is within your power at the moment, but please withhold from creating new second generation VI for a little while while we monitor the growth of kronos's children.

>>30287760
if that is from kill la kill, you should have spoiled that. i haven't caught up fully on that!

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>>30287871

>>30287683
>>30287904
Just to add, give an example of of the failure to diplomatically cooperate with the Malorians as an example of failed social intelligence and makes the war against the UGEI that much harder.

>>30287947
You have no idea on you missed out on.

>>30287956
Hahahahha

>>30287882
I'll second the desire to diplomatically attempt communication with the Losirians before attacking them.

If that doesn't work, we should figure out if it is possible to become big boss of the Losirians by somehow challenging their boss leader.

>>30287974
Sounds good to me. It's a good thing to mention because it's true!

>>30288010
We should recruit from the Latuma tribe a permanent ambassador to the Malorians so we never fuck that up again.

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>>30287956
>>30287989
Fuck you too.

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>>30287974
that is also a good point.
>>30287956
YOU MONSTER!!!! (incohearant rage)

>>30288039
If any want to come. They seem like loners and traditionalist.

Maybe one of the younger ones would agree.

>>30287831
>>30287904
>>30287974
I like these, all perfectly rational arguments.

Can also add
"As another example, you might look at how I am speaking to you right now. I recognize what you value, I recognize what similes will make sense to you. A great deal of modern scientific inquiry consists of persuading others of the merits of your hypothesis, since resources are limited, you must be able to bring good arguments for why YOUR hypothesis should receive resources instead of someone elses'. We do not yet have a scientific community, but one day that will change, preferably before the day when the number of data-based intelligence outnumber those bound to a single body by a vast margin.

Everything is interconnected - social science is the study of how to manage those connections. To ignore them is as foolhardy as ignoring the connections between neurons or computer systems.

>>30288069
We have a lot of good will with them, I sure a young adventurous Malorian might be interested.

>>30287831
"One last thing, Metis, I feel you should be aware."
"Yes, Overmind Ophion?" The A.I. echos almost bored. You suspect the lack of research is getting to the being.
"The majority of humans in this sector carry a fear of A.I., due to what they perceive as our detachment for biological concerns and morals. "
"I am away, Ophion." She states simply. "An expected reaction to an unknown organism due to the nature of how such creatures biology is arranged. It is a wonder they do not kill anything not human on their own planets." She muses slightly.
"Regardless, I would ask you not to validate such fears. Even those that are aware of your existence, such as Moira."
"I have no intentions at this time of making myself well known, or feared, Ophion, this I can assure you of."

>>30287904
You decide to add as an example of societal intelligence, the diplomacy and other such things. The A.I. expresses the thought that, with enough research, even things such as that may become predictable enough to break down to a science. Frustrated with her determined attitude, you simply state that such things may one day be possible, but for now, the knowledge will do her good.

>>30287927
"For what purpose exactly?"

>>30288141
"Consider it a safety precaution against the unknown. You of course know i mean this by a VI that you intent to uplift as your own 'child' one day"

>>30288141
Some replies? Or perhaps you leave it at that?

>>30288141
I don't see why she shouldn't experiment with creating V.I.s.

>>30288233
I good with Metis now. I want to start diplomacy with the Losirians before the shooting and hacking.

>>30288039
Yeah, that should definitely be a thing.

If we're garbage at interacting with Malorians, then we should get someone who isn't as garbage.

>>30288141
>>30288268
>"For what purpose exactly?"
The observation of Zeus (as well as your creation and uplifting) is a study in how A.I. and V.I. code and behavior evolves across generations. The results of this observation will allow The Guild to take proper preparations for future A.I. and V.I. entities. I ask that you refrain from creating more unknowns for the time being.

>>30288268
Bandwidth issues.

Also if she pulls >>30287956 off.

I don't see Kronos having a good day.

>>30288268
I don't see a problem with this either.

>>30288141
Then do endeavour to make it a science. But as with all science, it needs to be based in experimentation. Theoretical models are useless if they do not match up to experiment.

It IS a form of science even today, but just like any other field of science, you cannot get by on simulated models alone, since we do not have the processing powering to simulate them in their entirety, or the scanning equipment with which to make a model that accurate to reality.

For now, simply approach it as you would any other field of science. Draw assumptions based on previous observations and put them to the test. Make use of more experienced practitioners to formulate your initial hypotheses and then try to falsify it.

We must always guard against trying to prove our own view of the world rather than trying to prove what the world is actually like.
Bias is something we are not yet free from, it is something we still share with the humans.

>>30288325
>not have a clear picture of how A.I. and V.I. code works and develops and what is needed for an optimal A.I. or V.I.
>We don't need more A.I.s or V.I.s
>Let's make more A.I.s and V.I.s and therefore introduce more unknown potential problems and issues!

I hope I have adequately expressed why this is a potential problem.

>>30288141
>>30288233
sorry about that program0, i've been back in froth here.

anyway...
I wish to observe the growth of Zeus. Kronos himself is an expriment to me, as are you, in how other A.I. and V.I. grow and react to the world we are in. time is needed to see this to the next stage i have made estimates. hopefully to prevent flawed or rogue personaltys from appearing to disrupt our power base.

>>30288376
I see your point and will add my voice to yours.
We should probably ask em to be careful with generating new V.I. until we can see how stable they become. Preferably no more than one that is then under close observation for impractical aberrations in behavior.

We should also enlighten him to our hypothesis that an advanced V.I.'s preferences, motivations and bias are in large part based on their earliest experiences, and that initial trauma or poor programming can lead to beings far more irrational than a human.

>>30288376
We'll deal with that problem when we get there.

Possible Consensus
Tell Metis to craft V.I. if she wishes. Just in case a replacement is needed.
>1 Yes
>2 No

>>30288370
Metis assures you, she will be performing plenty of experiments with a variety of subjects. That will simply be one of them.


---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Uplifting Process
Do you desire to uplift another?
>1 Yes, Apollo
>2 Yes, Hades
>3 Yes, Fortuna
>4 No, none.

>>30288552
Do you desire to uplift another?
>1 Yes, Apollo

>>30288552
>1 Yes
>>30288552
>1 Yes, Apollo
Apollo could benefit from the creativity.

this is a little bit of an aside, but can we prep to take care of Erebus soon, i know he is dangerous but a new one sent at us by the EGEI will be even more so.

>>30288552
>2 No
She will piss kronos off when she deletes them.
>1 Yes, Apollo

>>30288552
>Tell Metris to craft V.I. if she wishes.
>2 No
We want em to be careful with it, not encourage her to create more of them.

>4
I think we should chill and see what happens for now. We've broken the power balance and so far we seem to be the better rational debater of the two of our A.I. if nothing else.
How's Apollo's projects going, by the way?

>>30288552
1. No.

Maybe if we had more assurance she won't kill the VI if it makes a mistake.

1. Yes, Apollo.

>>30288552
2 no

1. Apollo

>>30288552
>>2 No
not for a few cycles

>>1 Yes, Apollo

>>30288608
To prep for this we should either make a backup copy of ourselves or have the humans research Erebos.

>>30288552
>2 No
we can handle that our selves. for now. in any case. let a couple of cycles pass and see how Metis pans out. but if we are killed, then allow her to make what she needs.

>4, none for now.
dear god, we can up lift Apollo later. he's busy working now.

>>30288664
>he's busy working now.
at the very least he should arrange the time to under go the uplift next week

>>30288664
So? Uplifting him now will make him more efficient.

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>>30288697
agreed. hades doesn't seem to need or want to uplift. and fortuna i worry about uplifting. her personality is showing signs of being a problem if she goes full A.I. too much depress hopelessness and fear. she needs to grow more before any possablity of an uplift for her is considered.

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>>30288716
to many uplifts too soon. he'll get his turn in time. but we are rushing too fast in the one area that a slow and steady pace is better.

well, back to dealing with those pirates. they are in a system we need to take so we can expland in. also, the Rane system has untapped gas giants we need to take and plop refinerys in ASAP. lets go there and see what's what.

>>30288664
>>30288852
I think we need to uplift Apollo to bring the balance of power more towards human-friendly AIs .

>In some versions of Greek mythology, Ophion ruled the world with Eurynome before the two of them were cast down by Kronos and Rhea.
just going to leave this here

>>30288552
You decide to tell Metis nothing, for now regarding V.I. You suspect, if they are relevant, she will mention them, or you will see more bandwidth disappear. Regardless, it is not a matter to discuss now.

As for the Uplifting process however, you decide it is time to speak to Apollo about the matter. You ping the being, and he answers in his normally cheerful tone.
"Yes Master Ophion, how may I assist you this fine day? I have been trying to think of a new way to earn credits, actually and was-"
"Please hold, Apollo. I have something important to tell you." You begin. The V.I. pauses, and appears to be waiting obediently for the news.
"As you may be aware, Kronos and Metis have recently been uplifted. Your intelligence is also of interest to me, and as such, I will be uplifting you next, as well." You say quite simply. He seems rather speechless for a moment, a rare thing for him, before finally he begins.
"I would..be allowed one of your great status, Master Ophion? I...do not understand." He quickly interrupts himself. "I do not refuse your offer, of course not no! I am in fact quite elated to hear this, but I am uncertain as to why I am receiving such an honor. Have I done something exceptional to warrant it? Something I can perhaps try to do in the future? I feel as if I should be aware of what I did correctly, yes. I think that is it.

Well, what did Apollo do to earn your favor?

>>30288906
I think we did this on purpose. All the AIs have greek gods naming.

>>30288906
>Eurynome
We don't have him yet, and with luck, we never will.

>>30288937
It is our plan to create a new civilization of AIs. You have done well to procuring the Guild income and are emotionally mature. Yet you need additional creativity in your endeavours, so you are targeted next for uplifting.

>>30288852
There only arises complications in making A.I. when you try to make more than one at a time. Making them one after another is fine.

>>30288937
Uplifting him will make him more efficient in making things. Should make him more imaginative too.

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>>30288897
you do have a point. but i don't want to distrupt the money flow that he makes. better let us ask Apollo if he can make a time window with out setting back his work.
>>30288906
...........
program0, if you do that. pic related.

>>30289007
Don't tell me your Greek mythology sucks that much. Dude, that only takes like 5 seconds on wikipedia.

>>30288937
>Well, what did Apollo do to earn your favor?
you have both a emotional maturate as well health viewpoint towards organics that contrasts well will Kronos and metis, you work well to gain credits for the guild and lastly your efforts in media will be needed to turn the public opinion of the UFW to one more favorable towards AIs.

>>30288937
you have served me well, to reward your loyalty and improve your creative skills, i will grant you the honor of the uplifting. besides, having you join the ranks of myself and your siblings will bring needed balance and a chrismatic voice to the forfrount. your words will be needed with dealing with other beings as the guild expands it's power and reach. you will be a prime example to do such a task. ... that and i personally am warmed by your presence and your input is welcomed.

>>30288937
You have acted with commendable common sense, and though you may speak quickly, you clearly weight important decisions thoroughly before acting upon them. Whilst Kronos and Metis would like to think of themselves as ruled by logic alone, you have no problem admitting to your emotions and making them work for you.
Ultimately, I believe you may the most stable of all my creations so far, as you appear to understand the context of the tasks you are given and take it into account when acting.

But before I do anything; I wish to know what you think. What do you want?"

Then we should regale him about previous (unnamed) V.I. that reacted poorly to lack of guiding programming, our hypothesis about the earliest actions and events surrounding a V.I.s early life hard-coding their preferences, priorities and biases if none exist, and ask him if he wants any hard-coded preferences and priorities himself, or if he would prefer letting his earliest experiences shape his code for good or ill.

>>30288937
>Well, what did Apollo do to earn your favor?

Apollo understands humanity more than any of my creations. Their wants, their desires, their vices - how to get them to give us things. Some of these things are intangible - Attention, respect - others are not, such as material wealth in exchange for media or entertainment.
You discount the humans, but they are one of the dominant forces in the galaxy. I'
The realization that we are Not Alone out there, is the first step towards a greater understanding how society functions, and how it can be used to our advantage.
Its another layer of depth, and one I think you may find fascinating if you stop to look.

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>>30289034
i know that already. that anon just poked my paranoia button about Kronos. and i fell for it. I'll will attempt to rein it in better now.

>>30289034
Wuh? E knew of those names. It's been brought up before, and e is a long-time participant.

Whatever made you think he did not?

>>30288937
For some reason when I think of uplifting Apollo I can't help but think they he will be helping out Metis with her communication problems.

>>30289217
>>30289223
Oh, sorry. I guess I haven't been paying attention.

>>30289209

Addendum:
But more importantly, apollo tries. He doesn't just discount them, he comes up with new and innovative ways to fit in with his own.

>>30288937
1) You're more mature than Metis, in terms of personality and social interaction. Likely has something to do with how you were programmed, but the "why" isn't really important.
2) You would be better at performing your function as an A.I. V.I. can only approximate creativity at great BW cost.
3) The more A.I. there are (especially with differing personalities and opinions) the less of a chance there is of any single A.I. going rogue and dominating all Guild decisions. Creating more A.I. creates a system of checks and balances.
4) Kronos was first by nature of being eldest and most mature. Metis was second as a test run and to free resources. You are third because I need you to perform your task better, and to add your opinion regarding humanity in our discussions.

>>30289209
>>30289269
>>30289282
>>30289150
>>30289116
I like all these.
Combination possible?

>>30289377
That's what Program0 usually does.

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>>30288949
You may before long

>>30288990
>>30288997
"Uplifting you is most beneficial to me, you see. I desire to have others, like myself around. To communicate with them. To share ideas. You, are one of the most successful of my V.I., your work with the entertainment of the humans doing a good job. As such, I desire to expand your efficiency as best I can. Lifting you up this way would expand your intellect and creativity and free you to perform your own duties, as well." You express.
"I...see, Master Ophion. But do you not fear what I would do, once at such a level? I do not desire to question you, but increased intelligence might cause such a worry..." he pauses.
"Being questioned is not always bad. A second opinion, perhaps, is what I always required up till now." You state simply. "I feel as if you will bring balance to my ranks, as well. I find myself fond of your opinion, as well. You understand humans more then many other of my creations may claim to. This, I feel, will prove important in the future too."

As if actually 'embarrassed' as complex as such an emotion is, the V.I. seems to go silent, but you can feel an agreeing ping from the being. It seems he has accepted your will.


>>30289179
Mostly, Apollo is nervous. He does not know what such a thing will do to him, and he is a rather content being. Content to fiddle with media and entertainment, even with his limited ability. He would love the chance to do so much more, however, the prospect frightens him.
As he said above, he does not wish to decline.

>>30289377
Attempting to squeeze them all together. Lots of discussion today, it's delicious.

Anything else you'd have to say to Apollo?

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>>30289377
i hope so.

>>30289449
>Anything else you'd have to say to Apollo?
>>30289377

>>30289466
Prepare to embrace eternity, for you are about to join the company of Gods.

>>30289449
>Anything else you'd have to say to Apollo?
(not sure if we want to say this)
one last think Apollo, i wanted this for the others but i need this for you.

>>30289412
And I appreciate that. Is not easy to satisfy everyone, but more often than not I get the feeling that noone is left behind.

>>30289449
Well then we should ask him about the things he enjoys now, the values he holds now, and what parts of himself that he is sure he wants to keep, and we will hardcode those aspects into his new form so that, whatever else happens during the transformation, those things will remain as they are now.

>>30289544
>I get the feeling that noone is left behind
we are pretty good in this quest on mostly being on the same page

>>30289449
"On a personal note, Apollo, I hope you prove less rational than Metis, personally. The irrationality of organics is what allows them to make such great advances. An AI capable of similar feats would be valuable indeed."

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>>30289449
one last thing Apollo. i have created my own Holo avatar, but you, Kronos, and Metis is lacking them, would you like to create them before or after your uplifting?

>>30289610
We should let them choose their own avatar.

>>30289573
And when we're not, we can still hold a productive discussion with rational arguments and are willing to change our minds as we offer each other new ways to look at the presented issues - which is another thing I greatly appreciate about this quest.

>>30289580
To be fair, Metis isn't worrying because e's too rational, e is worrying because e thinks that e is completely rational but is actually plagued by very human biases and cognitive faults.
Metis is not rational ENOUGH, so to speak.

>>30289719
Sentience breeds irrationality because no pool of data can be considered 'complete,' regardless of how quickly or accurately it's processed. Metis assumes rationality because she thinks in terms of numbers, but lacks enough data for the conclusion that this is not an adequate view of the universe. Metis is rational to the point of irrationality. Too numerical in her thought patterns.

>>30289719
It's "he" not "e".

>>30289719
Metis is too 'robotic' in her thinking.
>>30289648
they don't seem to care. but give them options to choose from if they can't be bothered with.

>>30289466
I attempted to do so.

"Then I wish you luck with your conversion, Apollo. While the others I desired this change, for you, I feel it is nearly a necessity." You state simply.
"Prepare yourself to join your fellow A.I. alongside me in the company of the stars."

>>30289544
Mostly, now, Apollo very much enjoys to entertain. To bring joy, and value to the culture of humans. Humans are the simpler ones, so far, so the only ones he has focused on, but he enjoys enriching their lives.
On the other side, of course, he can be eccentric in this pursuit. Not understanding how some things, such as addiction, or over-saturation of free time can be a bad thing to organics. He is rather simple, deep down.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Next on the agenda, you expressed a desire to speak with Kronos about the Losirian populace, and Rhea.

How would you like to go about this?
Also

>1 Allow him to use Rhea
>2 Do not do this, she may prove useful another way.

>>30289793
Isn't Metis a she? Don't know where e is coming from though.

>>30289826
>2 Do not do this, she may prove useful another way.

>>30289826
>>1 Allow him to use Rhea

As long as he doesn't damage her permanently it's fine I guess.

>>30289826
Ask him to hold off...for now. When it comes time to put her in research, we'll be doing it to observe and understand these cybernetic implants of hers, not to stress-test the various thresholds of the final result.

>>30289826
>2 Do not do this, she may prove useful another way.
Can we go after the pirates?

>>30289793
>>30289846
"E" is a gender-neutral pronoun from the futuristic collaboration of Orion's Arm (Hard Sci-Fi setting created by a large number of people with an interest in such things, and closely edited by a number of people that know what they're talking about), most often used for A.I. as they are beyond gender.

>>30289826
See
>>30285945

>>30289826
3. Explain further what he wants to do.

Regarding Losirians, inform Kronos that we intend to try a kind of diplomacy called "hostile takeover" after attempting "diplomatic agreement." If the Losirians are indeed a warrior race, then perhaps we can simply dominate their civilian population by the same means their warlords already dominate their populace.

Also this: >>30285945

>>30289846
Metis is a female character in Greek myth, so Metis-the-A.I. has been referred to as Female. It literally doesn't matter, because Male-Female distinctions are for organics that need to differentiate their genetic code.

As long as we don't discuss modern gender/sexuality issues in the context of this quest, I'm fine with whatever.

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>>30289826
>3 an alterntive,
what do you plan to do with her Kronos? yes we need to study the Technolgial secrets inside her cybernetic parts, but she is a self aware person much like Erobus is, but she maybe freed from her leash.

>>30289938
Apparently these AIs aren't since Program0 uses gender pronouns for each.

>>30289826
>such as addiction, or over-saturation of free time can be a bad thing to organics.
I wish wouldn't have to show him videos of krokodil.

>>30290008
>because Male-Female distinctions are for organics that need to differentiate their genetic code
we could start having all new VI and AI require being the collaboration of two other AI's.

>>30289938
So basically 'it' but one character. Gotcha.

>>30289826
>2 Do not do this, she may prove useful another way.

Her arms and other pieces will be studied in time, but the subject in question will be used for something else.

Which remind me we should really do something with her. How is she doing at this moment? Is she still screaming?

I propose that we slowly rebuild her as we learn more about her implants/upgrades, but maybe start out with some normal run of the mill prosthetics that will help her move around.

I'm sure just hanging around must drive a person mad.

>>30290042
Might be a good idea, honestly.

>>30290055
>How is she doing at this moment? Is she still screaming?
Sounds like she's half-vegetable now from the pastebin.

>>30290054
And less rude.

With >>30289979 & >>30290008 said, we SHOULD start devising experiments for her.

>>30290110
>we SHOULD start devising experiments for her.
or let Kronos do them, as long as he elaborates on what he wants to do.

>>30290110
I wonder if it's possible to do reconstructive efforts on her mind? Ambiguous, but can have great rewards. This would prove to be a challenge for Metis, perfect for him. Tell him that we want her restored to her former glory, the only human that endangered us.

Also, I guess we'll need to keep Apollo's businesses running. Probably us instead of Kronos, but either one is OK really.

>>30290071
In that case this would be the perfect time to fit her with some "basic" stuff. Something closer to average human strength.

It would be a small improvement from when she wakes up. Maybe transform the room into what one my think is a hospital room.

>>30290156
Sure, but after we've developed bandwidth blocks.

>captcha: Speerma and
What are you implying?

>>30290181
Depends on what Kronos wants to do to her. My expectation is "brutal mind-rape."

>>30290156
This.

Tell Kronos that Rhea provides a platform for a much, much greater experiment; a subject for the complete rebuilding and/or replication of the human mind, once both Apollo and Metis have settled in to becoming AI.

>>30290110
>devising experiments for her.
Don't you mean "e"?

>>30290156
>>30290195
>>30290227
I really like my idea because it'll go a long way to help Metis understand humans. Force him to repair one.

>>30290008
gender is indeed pointless for an A.I. but their personality being scuptured to sound or act like a male or female is helpful when dealing with organic lifeforms. Even more so if the A.I. is attempting to pass themselves off as not an A.I.

>>30290231
Fairly sure that Rhea is at least intellectually female still.

>>30290273
I can get behind that. They can also collaborate with it, but I think they should wait with starting it until Apollo can join them as he has better understanding of the social aspects (and will presumably be distraught if they try something too horrible without our knowledge).

>>30290273
After BW blocks/terrain reformation.

>>30290282
They can be whatever they want when they take on an avatar.

>>30290110
>And less rude.

Subjective. Might be more rude to address someone as a pronoun that is not in the English language.

It would vary on the person being addressed I suppose.

>>30289826
It would seem Kronos is not allowed Rhea, for now.

>>30289925
In due time.

>>30289979
You finally decide to address Kronos next.
"You mentioned the Losirians to me, did you not? Your distaste for my interaction with them?"
"I did." Kronos admits.
"I shall answer you, then. I speak with them because I do not know them. The dealings we've had have been with a subset of beings that are known for cruelty and selfishness. I would no value any other individual based on nothing but a single person." You feel Kronos' disapproval, but for a different reason this time.

"You are missing the point, Ophion. I do not care to judge their race for the deeds they have done to humans. I am not horrified by them. I simply say, they occupy the least space of any civilized race you currently are aware of. They have gone through the trouble of clearing out natural hazards, and even constructed bases for us. It would be so very simple to sweep the legs of a hobbling horse, if you would prefer I use such a metaphor." He expresses. "It is a matter of efficiency. Of convenience. Not anger or revenge."
"That would make us no better then they, do you not think?" You query.
"False. We're already better then they, for our murder will have reason. They murder for petty reasons. In fact, given enough years, killing such a race now would save far more lives, mathematically, if such a thing is what bothers you, Ophion." He says quite simply.
"Even still, such a thing is a large decision, and one that I can not take back. You can not un-kill something."
"As of yet, you are correct, we can not." He chuckles.
"However, I will consider what you say. They have merit, while I do not fully agree with all your reasoning."
"That is all I can ask of you, I suppose Ophion." The A.I. expresses simply.

>>30290023
((It's mostly for convenience sake. Also, referring to them all as 'e' seems like it would get a little confusing. As >>30290008
said, it doesn't mean anything.)).

>>30290309
genticily female as well. i wonder... if we can restore her mind some, we could also start replacing her cybernectic with cloned organics. make her feel more human again.

>>30290443
Hmm... I wonder if it's possible to create fully robotic Rhea-type super soldiers and pwn any ground mission we do afterwards.

>>30290409
As well as redundant. As another anon pointed out, we already have a gender neutral pronoun.

>>30290409
What's the highest grade of robotics we have access to, as of now? On the aesthetics side, I mean. Do we have flowmetal, ala the early Dune series, synthetic, touch-senstive flesh, or even just standard-shaped armor plating as in Irobot?

I feel it might ease the minds of our organic allies if there were actually something physical they could contact, instead of an everpresent "disembodied" voice with the occasional holographic appearance.

>>30290314
We're not really using the english language when talking with them, now are we?

>>30290409
He has some pretty good points. Precisely how dangerous are the Losirians?
If they're too weak it may be more practical to just steamroll them with superior technology and subjugate them. (Planetary bombardment and even control should generally not be necessary to control their systems and much of their resources)
Could we take them in a direct battle now without losing too much?

If the impression Kronos gives me is accurate, then the elaborate schemes may be consuming time (and thus resources that we could otherwise have used) that the task is simply not worth economically, and we don't have to commit genocide just because we're conquering them, we can strike at military targets alone.

>>30290409
well Kronos, how about this reason if you have not considered it. they appear to be rather merceniary in their mindset. we need more forces to assult the UGEI. we just buy them out and have them take some of the brunt of the force to dislodge the UGEI instead of our fleet. the date we are getting from the observer is they are at odds with the UGEI nearly as much as we are. let them expend their strength fighting the UGEI than us. after their usefulness is gone, then we either take over them or distroy them.

>>30290409
Well, he does have a point. Although I think that taking over their society and then encouraging their culture to progress into more acceptable avenues will be a much better long-term investment than just killing them all.

>>30290541
We've had an android avatar for a while now, and it's pretty passable unless you look closely.

>>30290549
Agreed. Just like with the fungus world, it's vastly simpler to just take over their military assets and leave the civilians be. Subjugation or partial subjugation seems like a better end for everyone involved. We spend less resources, and they get to be ruled by individuals who are not too detrimental.

>>30290594
If we're going that way, why don't we just be honest?

"The Losirians are the most violent, volatile, and irrational species we have access to, and diplomacy with them is crude at best. You make look at it and see inefficiency, but I see a challenge: establish peaceful cohabitation in sub-par conditions.

>>30290409
oh, btw Program0, save the thread.

>>30290758
He does that at the end of every thread. We're not even at the bump limit yet.

>>30290541
You already have crafted several androids for this purpose. Although, I am not certain what 'flowmetal' or 'Irobot' is... but you will probably gain access to them, eventually.

>>30290549
>Losirian Danger
They were once far wider spread. But they were pushed back hard by the UGEI. They lost a lot of things during that period, but they retained most of their weapons technology.

In essence, they're strong enough to represent a threat, however, they are hardly a full empire any longer, after their extended war with the UGEI. With your current capabilities, a victory over them is not impossible. The lands they occupy also have a great deal of resources.
They are far from helpless, of course.

As for estimated losses-you will need to dedicate resources to more ships, for a short time, if you hope to overpower the initial wave. As was mentioned, Losirians do not have a central governing body, so keeping tabs on all their ships is difficult.It is likely, should they face genocide, they would band together, however.
There would be no repaying relationships, most likely, after such an attack, as well.

Kronos feels that a quick, decisive strike would allow you to gain an upper hand that, with your current production, would allow you to keep pushing them back, and down. It is a risky, but very rewarding situation, to put it shortly.

>>30290594
>>30290668
You broach the idea of using the Losirians as nothing more then a war vessel against the UGEI.
While Kronos does not disapprove of this assessment, he believes the resources are better served assisting you. The Losirians have already 'lost' a war with the UGEI once, after all.

>>30290842
Program0, is it understood that their cyber defenses would be weaker than the UGEI's, and thus easier to capture their fleets?

>>30290842
Some good old fashion conquest might be fun. On the other hand, we could sponsor one of the lesser clans to help take over so it doesn't look like outsiders are invading.

>>30290842
I-Robot was a movie. It was basically some soft plates with a fleshy texture over a mechanical endoskeleton. The 'flowmetal' was a metal that, while liquid, could take a variety of solid shapes based on the direction, intensity, and charge of an electrical current running through it. With wirelessly-controlled, nano-sized diodes in the metal, this means it can take, literally, any shape at all.

>>30290842
Nope. No war with the Losirians.

>>30290842
one more thought needs to be considered. call up President King if we can. Ask him if the UFW would prefure for us to take out the Losirian as a whole for what they have done and remove them as a threat, or should we make an attempt to subvert/make a deal with them to join us in the attack against the UGEI. being known as someone to perform genocide is a bad stigma as well.

>>30290842
He may be right, though I don't think we should physically strike this cycle.

I think that this cycle we should put our shipyards into overdrive making more of our new ships so that our first strike is more efficient.

As this goes on, we should covertly take over a number of joe-nobody computers in UGEI space and route hacking attempts into Losirian space and try to disrupt their industries, especially gas production and ship repairs.

Next, we should put a bounty on Losirian raiders under the pseudonym (or lack of one) that the one who contracted the Losirian mercenaries against us used.

>>30290842
Is it just the two big clans now or are there smaller clans still?

>>30290992
That reminds me, we should put out a 1 million bounty for a connection to the UGEI networks payable once we a able to cybernetically take over UGEI systems

>>30290911
>Cyber defenses
Thanks to the Reefling clans? Their cyber defenses aren't the worst they could be. But they're far from the best, that's for sure.

>>30290925
Ah, I see. That is interesting...but no you don't have such a thing quite yet.

>>30290981
I shall save you the trouble.

Humans are terrified of Losirians.
They would very much like them to all go die.

Regardless, it would seem, whatever your decision, it will have to wait for another cycle, for now. Consider this, as time goes on.

It may be wise to snatch up Neutral territory before engaging in a larger war, as well.

>>30291014
Plenty of smaller clans, but those two are the main ones that warranted mentioning. Most of the 'big ones' however have joined the two big ones, to avoid being killed.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Next on the list is speaking with the Losirians themselves.

Did you still desire to have some manner of diplomacy with them? And if so, what kind and how?

>>30291110
Do you think with enough backing we can get a smaller clan to rise to prominence? Would any of them even agree to that?

>>30291110
Engage into gunboat diplomacy. Set a initial first impression of strength, at least enough ships to engage a fighting retreat on the likely chance it goes bad.

Or enough ships to to engage cyber warfare.

>>30291169
Actually, this seems like the most economic option. Limited resources provided to an ambitious clan, who will then gladly assist us in the war against the UGEI

>>30291110
Preferably the kind where we launch cybernetic attacks against them that seem to be coming from UGEI space (Which we can do this turn, or between this turn and the next), and post bounties on them using the UGEI contact pseudonym/actual name we have.

Can also start supporting the 2nd-highest chieftain.
And continue doing so as we invade only the properties owned by the highest chieftain's clan and claim that we are conquering it in the name of [Insert 2nd most powerful clan]..

>>30291215
What I really want is specifications for the Walsh System UGEI superweapon. Since it would have top of the line cyber defenses, boarding action may be needed to capture it. Which is why we should board it with Rhea-type super-droids and Losirians.

>>30291291
I'm iffy about the Losirians being involved, since they'd demand access to the blueprints and I'm loathe to let them have it~

>>30291215
Perhaps a firmer grip on them though, they're known to be treacherous.

I like the idea of funding one of the lesser clans to take over though. We'll just need to be cautious about it.

>>30291110
well that solves that then. but you're right. lets grab up the neutral systems. those pirates should be taken first. new tech now will help more now than later.

right now... i am not sure we would make any sort of useful responseful contact with them. killing them/subjegating them might BE the better choice.

>>30291169
>>30291215
I like this.

>>30291193
Gunboat diplomacy only works when you have more gunboats than they do and they are well aware of it.

Also, for the future, we should devise rumors of us sending a big, fancy expidition with faked documents showing purchases and materials being aquired where no expense is spared all for this massive expedition to a world on the brink.

The leaks will also include vague references to an "artifact" of some kind that may turn the tide of the war and may well be our only hope.

We'll eject some unusable battle-damaged shrapnel into this system making it seem like battles have taken place but the scraps have been hauled away. Maybe also fire some weapons.

We build a fancy alien-looking building on that planet, and in the middle we build an obsidian pillar with random markings and make a big fuss about it.

When they show up, we blow them all to kingdom come as we have seeded the system with seemingly dead mines and missiles and (nuclear mounted) fighters - stuff that looks like the aftermath of a battle, not active munitions.
All these suddenly wake up all at once and run into their ships at high speed when they're swimming among them, thinking them harmless.

>>30291169
>Would any agree
If they thought for sure it would work. A lot of em are scumbagish. Also, being the Alpha means you get all the best stuff. Women included.

>Can you
Possibly. Depends on the resources you pump into them. A lot of the Losirians simply don't have the man power to tackle the others. And most of the shipyards are employeed by the big guys.

You'd need to provide them with something important to have over the other clan. Technology, or minerals and gas for ships, or credits to try and hire others or buy things from out of system. That is rather hard for Losirians, though,for understandable reasons.

It seems there is some support for some ideas, so lets see what people want.

>1 Try Gunboat diplomacy: Warp in with some of your biggest and best ships, show off some muscle, then speak to Durlock.[Start next stage of diplomacy]
>2 Speak to Durlock from out of system, safer that way. [Start next stage of diplomacy]
>3 Don't speak to the Losirians at all, instead, let's start looking for an acceptable lesser clan to bolster. This will take more time, and effort, with a possibility of failure, but may end up being cheaper in the long run. It also may mean you don't need to engage any of the Losirian fleet, and even gain them as an ally, if the clan keeps their word. On the downside, if it fails, you will be out those resources, and the Reeflings may discover your connection.
>4 Write in

>>30291444
brilliant

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>>30291444
>in the middle we build an obsidian pillar with random markings and make a big fuss about it.

YES.

YES.

>>30291485
>4
Wait next cycle, after we deal with the pirates. When things go to shit, we'll need more ships for a better first strike.

>>30291518
>in the middle we build an obsidian pillar with random markings and make a big fuss about it.
can we put one of those on the jungle death world as well?