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The first thread: http://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/29252276/

The Project Workspace: http://1d4chan.org/wiki/User_talk:KhorneFlake_Manufacturer/GuildWarsTT

Getting shit done like the olden days. This thread: What bonusses should each race and subfaction get? I did the Charr myself, wondering what yall got.
Give the Asura golems depending on their backgrounds.
Give the Sylvari elemental powers depending on their time of day/year
Norn should have the four great spirit shamans and a few smaller ones, each with their morph abilities and ability to bestow blessings for a short amount of time.
Put in Dwarves. Fleshy and petrified ones.
Put in Tengu
Oh and make contaurs, ogres, skritt also fieldable.
This caught my interest. I'll be reading through the archived thread, but real quick to give me an idea of what it's gonna be, GW1 or GW2 era?
Just a few questions you may or not be able to answer just yet.

What is this? An RPG or war game type thing?

How are turns going to flow? Would simultaneous turn resolution be possible?
Are the games going to be based off of character squads (1 person controls a team of 4-8 characters) that start say, at a Guild Hall? It seems from reading the description of the Charr that you'd play as factions with and be able to deploy your units kind of like WH40K?

And it doesn't look like skills from GW going to be copypasta'd and scaled to fit the Hit Point values of the game, correct?
God dammit now I'm sad about the Mursaat again. I want my mass murdering demigod sorcerers back dammit!
Interested in how OP intends for game to be played as well?

Is this basically Warhammer with a GW flavour or Final Fantasy Tactics with a GW flavour?
Both, seperate at first, interchangeable later.

Tabletop Wargame, skrimish, if you really stretch it a max of 25 models or so, have to work on point cost when the time comes

Will be included as a minor faction

GuildWars with a tabletop flavour.
Contribute on the wiki page if you got ideas.
I was talking about gw2, but I guess this is a consolation.
Though they'd be highly impractical to implement unless you consider everyone to be fully infused, which from lore perspective would be a bit weird.
Sorry, I don't know what tabletop flavour means in this context. I've played GW and I'm on /tg/ for MtG so I don't know the terminology. Just wondering if it would play like a Fire Emblem/Final Fantasy Tactics where you deploy units at the start of a match and then each character has a turn or something different than that.
And I recently played the Mursaat Arah path and was incredibly disappointed by it. The only snippet of new lore is "mursaat fled and hid while the rest of the races faced the dragons last time and got wiped out in putting them to sleep."
The rest is "Lol, we iz inquest, we got here before you and destroyed pretty much everything that could have given you more information.
Not that the whole thing makes sense at all anyway. How the hell would the Orrians have known about the Mursaat?
tabletop flavour = you control a small group of characters/units on the field and duke it out in small skirmishes.
they do bring a heavy effect to the table. have to see in what form though
Copy-pasting something that just caught my eye in the archived thread:

Ascalon: Higher damage, better fortifications
Kryta (Lionguard): Generic All rounders
Kryta (Mantle): Great casters
Orrians: Better equipment, Great casters (if during the Guild Wars, else they dead)

Imperial Cantha: Numerous, Better equipped, low mobility
Luxons: Higher mobility, great siege
Kurzicks: Highly resistant, great melee

Istani: Less numerous, Great support
Kourna: Great formations, lots of troops
Vabbians: Better equipped, Bad support

Could extend this with their backers, like Mantle getting the mursaat and lionguard getting the shining blade, Kourna getting margonites.

I'm primarily interested in the GW1 aspect here, and I agree with pretty much everything in the copypasta here except that White mantle has a bunch of magic knight/paladin stuff with strong caster support, and I'd say orrian main magic faction.
Yeah I have to talk to Kleeve about that. I have to format it to what I did with the Charr, because you still have all the professions to tooy around with.

And I am going to have to include all of them
Screw it, namefagging, I'll probably (finally) make an account over at 1d4chan too.
Not too sure how the actual system would work yet, but I'd say do it a bit like the psychic powers in 40k. every faction has every profession, but can only choose from a limited amount of skills and gets some flat bonuses from their faction.
Also, I do apologise in advance, I might be mentioning Mursaat a bit too much, but I am one hell of a Mursaat fanboy.
Glad to have you on the team, drop a few ideas and lets get shit done.
/tg/ style
it's okay. Mursaat were cool.
Might give em an AoE marker, stand within that, get
...Get degen 2 wounds per round while within the target area (3")
Going ahead and archiving thread. Might need this.
As far as GW1 goes, I feel like time was a very important aspect of the game what with skill recharge times, casting times, attacks per second, and probably most importantly, pips of energy (and health).

I'd personally like to see that reflected in the game, just by using turns. I think if a single character's turn represented 6 seconds, it would feel Guild Warsy as far as what a character is able to do which would be:
>Use skills
Moving X distance could use up 1 second
And using skills, and making attacks, would use up X seconds based on the casting time of the skill or the attack speed of the weapon.

Then, after you cast a spell or skill, the Recharge Time would be divided by 6 for the number of turns before you can use it again.
So something like Reversal of Fortune, 2 second recharge, could be used up to 3 times per turn (maybe) - it could have 3 charges that could be used up in any turn that recharge on your next turn.
Whereas something like Shield of Regeneration which takes 8 seconds to recharge would be usable once per turn (maybe once every other turn).

Attacking could be based off of weapon speed. If you use a 6 second turn, swords and axes attack faster than hammers would be shown as how many attacks they can make.

If using the 6 second model, I think it could break down like this:
Daggers, Swords, Axes each get 1 "1 Second attack" as the first attack of the turn and 2 "1.5 second attacks" if they choose to use them.
Hammers could get either 2 "1.5 second attacks" or a 1 second and a 2 second attack.
Bows would be like hammers except usually they have more activation time modifiers for bow attacks so that could be taken into account for attack skills.

perhaps for simplicity we should reduce the number of human factions to Tyria, Cathan, and Elona while using special units to represent the sub-factions within, and also it should be set before GW1 so that we can explore the a world different from what we saw in both
GW is the setting with HUMANITY FUCK YEAH, WE HAVE GODS AND DIVINE POWER, FUCK YOU versus Furry Cats with the power of TECHNOLOGY right?
That would make the whole system a lot more P&P-esque, but that might be a nice thing if it doesn't get too complicated. You would be controlling like 8 characters at a time, right.
I'd dumb it down with something like two or three actions per turn, and some skills using several actions (meteor shower = all three) and with cooldowns also put into actions, with some spammable spells like RoF with none.
A direct translation from game to tabletop would be too complex. The way you describe things I'd think a single turn would take way too long.
Then like in D&D combat, I think Attacks of Opportunity would be applicable here. A character could take 1 AoO when it isn't their turn on anybody moving in or out of range or another character in range that is activating a skill. Attacks of Opportunity could also be taken for actions/skills that take less than 1 second to activate.

If attacks of opportunity wouldn't be possible I think characters, especially Mesmers with their counterspells, could "Prepare" ahead of time, spending 1-2x the normal seconds of their turn to concentrate on and pay attention (flavor wise) to a target and stand ready to cast a Power Leak or whatever. Monks could do that too if they need to cast a Reversal of Fortune or something. I think if everybody got an attack (or action) of opportunity that takes 1 second or less, it would be ideal.

Fast Casting could also reduce the Prepare time, depending on if attributes will matter in this game.
We could do a move action, standard action kind of thing. >>29318821
We'll look into it. Thanks

You should check out the project page and see what I did with the charr, I think it is similar to your suggestion
also made archive http://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/29318187/

upvote it
I think the X actions per turn would be a nice way of doing it.

I'd like 2-3 skill actions and then movement before or after the actions. Skills could cost X action points and some could restrict movement. So Meteor Shower taking 5 seconds to cast in game, that could take up all the action points and movement points for that characters turn (or they wouldn't be able to cast it if they'd already moved). Same for Resurrect.

Also forgot about energy regen. I don't see energy as one of your listed traits so must be going for more of the GW2 approach.

But anyways if it was added, energy pips fit perfectly with a 6 second turn.
1 pip is 1 energy every 3 seconds.
Warriors/Paragons have 2 pips, they'd gain 4 energy every 6 seconds/per turn.
Rangers (3 pips) gain 6 energy per turn
Other casters would gain 8 energy per turn.
So I'd say we could do with a bit of general consensus on this issue: GW1 era: human only and then the human factions, or do we split the humans into main origins ("tyrian", "elonan" and "canthan") with some specialisations, and add in other races like charr and centaurs?

I'd personally lean towards the first and situate it in or before the Guild Wars themselves. GW1 era was dominated by humans, and aside from charr I don't really see many other playable races. Norn haven't interfered with humans and the rest before EotN, and the same with asura. I admit that lore-wise, there's not really any room to make any random two factions battle anyway (since the mursaat have been vanquished by the time the margonites show up again with the kournans etc.), but it seems to fit a bit better in the universe at that time. It's the great age of humans, almost coming to an end.
The system should be able to cover in depth human detailing and other minor races.
The seeting in time depends on the players choice of campaign/mission.
We should give the player the freedom to make a beautifull Orrian army and still pit it against the Charr, because it would still make sense.
I think it was brought up in the previous thread that in game, characters/enemies traits aren't defined by race, but their species has a preferred skill set.

I think that the "bonuses" each faction would get, at least in game, aren't inherent traits but rather skill choices. Elonians would be Paragons and Dervishes and Canthans would be Assassins and Ritualists or the other classes but using that expansions added skills.

A Canthan Warrior uses Triple Chop, an Elonian Warrior uses Decapitate, and a Tyrian uses Eviscerate. And anyone can Cleave I guess.

I'd be all for everybody being standardized and just having 8 different skills or something idk.
So, humans+minor races of the time. Charr, centaur, grawl? Mursaat/margonite would be subfactions of respectively White Mantle and Kourna would be my first thought, but that might make things too restrictive. Not sure about this. Both are varied enough to make their own factions I guess.
Afflicted, Torment Demons, Titans and Shiro'ken separately?
Basically we're going to have to cut in what we consider Major/Minor/Single-Trick races.
Example: Charr/Grawl/Quaggan (quaggan only have 1 trick up their sleeve, being cute). And give them customisability accordingly
Thread Archived, ahve to go to work. If any new additions come up to the thread, archive them accordingly: http://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/29318187/
I think some people would be offended by saying charr are one-trick ponies, but I understand your argument. There could be a "primitives" race including ettins, Grawl and giants, with other main non-human factions being centaurs (tyrian and elonan subfactions I'd say), tengu and charr. Perhaps the main primitive races could also be divided according to continent, with elona having harpies and hylek.
Oh, and undead, how the hell did I forget undead. Orr/lich undead and Elonan undead separately of course, with Orr being undead mindless hordes while elonan undead seem to retain most of their free will and personality, but are still bound to obey palawa joko.
Follow this format
Major/Minor/Single Trick

quaggan aren't even cute wtf
Got really excited seeing the title having been thinking of making a Tyria-set RPG and then saw that this is to be a skirmish wargame. Still pretty cool, if I had to make a comment I think a pre-EotN setting time-wise would be best for a wargame as it has the most diversity of rival factions and unless I'm mistaken we don't know what Cantha and Elona are in during the dragons story arc.
Here I was hoping for an RPG system.
Though it might not be too hard to port over what you guys do. Worked alright for Iron Kingdoms and Warmaderps.

>tfw you will never have that many skills in a tabletop

I remember trying to homebrew skills in 4E then giving up really hard.
I might try to do it in HERO, but I've never actually DMed it, was just in a campaign and making powers seemed pretty neat and customizable in it.
Oh derp, completely misread that.
And shut up, quaggans are the best thing about the entirety of gw2.
>Being this wrong
C'mon it's 2013+1
Yeah, seeing from the talk here I'd say general consensus is have all non-eotn factions in the gw1 era. Possibly starting with one continent at a time, that'll already be enough to balance as it is I'd say.
I'm gonna go do some other stuff and maybe tonight I'll try and make a bit of a foundation of the Tyrian races of what they specialise in.
I used to have DnD3.5 rules for Charr and Norn races. Worked pretty well.
Cool, I'll get to that as well and then we'll compare notes.
Really going to work now. Nazgir, update suptg if new info comes to the thread, or put it on the 1d4chan
Yeah, working out races wasn't a huge deal, but There wasn't really a great analogue for most of the casting so I felt the need to figure out at least enough stuff for each class.
Then gave up and just left it up to the players to fluff their class choices as they wanted. And then the campaign exploded because some players stopped showing up for no reason (then coming back a couple months later all "oh what happened to that?")
- Move Action
- Standard Action

Stick to this or else you gonna end up wasting time on unfun movement rules.
That sounds cool. Going with a continent at a time approach, I guess Tyrian factions to consider are:
Ascalon, Kryta (could include White Mantle if we say this is before the Flameseekers came and revealed what they were doing (I guess this also means before the searing)), the Charr, the Deldrimor Dwarfs, the Stone Summit. Are there any major factions not present in the game but involved in conflict before its start?
>Krytan (Lionguard + shining blade)
>White Mantle (I figure they're high profile enough to make their own faction, though if need be could be just a set of units in "Krytan" too)
>Stone Summit

Minor factions would be
>Primitives (Ettin, Grawl, Hill Giants and their hunting beasts)

Not sure how the minor factions would come into play. They could be full on races, or something like an allied detachement taken with another primary race. The problem there is the mess that is an alliance roster like 40k, unless you make it a complete FFA ally with who you want, which could increase fun and creativeness but would be absolute bollocks in the fluff. Of course having Orr and orrian undead at the same time already disregards that, but I think because we know fairly little about human Orr that I'd say throw them out and take the undead instead.
The Mursaat would be allies of the White Mantle and the would be Titans allies of the Orrian Undead as they're both controlled by the Lich, no? Depending on the time of the setting, there may also be no Titans on Tyria.

I know come GW2, Centaur, Tengu and Ettin are a bit more major but I haven't played much GW2 myself. Are they simply given more screen-time/portrayed more seriously in GW2 than in GW1, or were they all actually pretty small-stuff in GW1? Weren't Ettins supposedly very advanced at one point?
Well, tengu are barely present actually, and have a starter zone-sized area carved out but inaccessible, back from when they pretended they wanted to make expansions.
Ettins are still just the same random dumb but sentient creatures, but centaurs are like the human's main antagonists. half of kryta is covered in them, and the northernmost zone of kryta is almost entirely populated by them.

And yeah, I had been thinking about the Mursaat and Titans in much the same way, but they've actually got a lot of different units too, pretty much on equal standing with the factions (I think titans even have more due to the frost titans being another branch)
So are you guys going for a more Armageddon or Kill-Squad feel, armies or small teams?
I'm wondering this too. The main people doing this should try to summarize what their gameplay plans first.

Make that a priority over bonuses races get, please. Fluffy stuff can be done after all the mechanics and central ideas are laid out.
I'd be going for the smaller teams style I think. Keep it tactical and small, more gw1 PvP style than big battlefields.
Could also have small campaigns similar to missions.
The way classes are handled in GW lend itself to small teams, each character being The Monk, or the Mesmer, or whatever.

Although I'd say it would be a good idea to restrict a player to one faction and sub-faction, just to differentiate itself from GW2 where everyone is friend with everyone

Nope, not at all. Humanity is actually at a low point.
Yeah, I agree. What larger "sides" and "subfactions" are is still up for debate though. Currently focussing on Tyria (continent, not world, duh) when it comes to races, but on every continent there's 3 human factions. Add them all and we get a 40k situation where half the factions are just subfactions of the same side.
I know /tg/ has a big race fetish but can we focus on how it's played add race/factions later? Or at least explain it better so those of us who don't know will know?

It's like you're building a house and trying to figure out what color you want the walls painted before you have a framework.
Humanity is at a low point at GW2 era, we're currently mostly working on gw1 era, which is pretty much right after the high point as the decline is starting, but still pretty much in control.

Well, KhorneFlake Has some basic stats on his wiki page, I'll paste them here too so we could get into that a bit deeper.
Pasted straight from the wiki page:

I've been thinking what the best type of unit profile would be best.
First of all I recon the best would be a mix of the War of the Ring and Warhammer profiling
Fight Value(Weapon Skill/Initiative)
Movement speaks for itself
Strength versus Defence, straight up. Note that I do not intend to use armour saves, but rather improve Defence where it is expected to increase to represent better armour.
Fight Value is a tricky one. The guy with the higher value will strike first. Also Fight Value will have something to do with dodging/blocking, might do a Ld test like save roll for this.
Attacks. Number of attacks per model, stacks in formation. Pretty clear.
Hitpoints are a big thing. Because it is so small scale, but we also have Monks to heal this value will usually be high, they work like wounds in warhammer, using it as resiliance like war of the ring would result in a disusage of monks.
Leadership, courage value etc. When something is terrifying to go up against, roll leadership. Works like BOTH warhammer AND war of the ring, might have to roll up a new way to uniform these tests.
Unique value: special attacks, spells etc. Might come up with a DnD 3.5 like calculation for the power of the special ability.
Will: Spell resistance, might become obsolete and merge with Leadership.
>pretty much in control.

It all depends if we set it before or after the searing. Before it everything was OK, after it things beging to look bad, not too bad but Orr is dead and ascalon is already dying.
Well I'd think because we know so little about the Orrians themselves We'd go for post-cataclysm, but keep things hazy for the rest. There's undead and titans and mursaat and everything. Leaves room for all the scenarios possible.

Timeline gets messy when we'd move on to cantha though, with both titans and mursaat wiped out and undead pretty much too if I'm not mistaken. And that's exactly why I proposed to start with just Tyria.
Humans are the elves of the setting. Culturally and magically advanced but on the downswing. They've got quite a bit of advanced technology but you don't really see it on most days. The Charr are brutal industrialist warmachines who burned Ascalon (a human kingdom) to cinders in the first game in conquest to retake their old homelands. However the magic used in the Searing was flame legion bullshit so the charr rose up, banished the flame legion and murdered their gods. Meanwhile, the last king of Ascalon cursed all of the humans in the kingdom to die at once and fight forever against the Charr as ghosts.

Fast forward to gw2 and they have colonized Ascalon as their rightful homeland but are still fighting the fucking ghosts everywhere.

Then there's the Asura, a race of genius dwarf/gnomes who really enjoy the odd spot of genocide. They tend to fuck themselves up more than anything though.

Sylvari as salads. Remove salad.

Norns are big bookahs who are shamanistic and hit things really hard and live in the mountains with the holier than thou polar bear peoples.
Small update from work (please no promotions).
I updated a thing with point costs.
On time and races, like I said, this is up to the player. If he wants to make a Canthan Imperial Army that he wants to use against Orrian mages, go ahead, but you're going to spend a lot on gear against those casters.
It is all possible, but you could say for certain campaigns, certain restrictions will be in place.
As in prophecy era charr are mostly Flame Legion, don't expect heavily armoured blood legionaires going up against norn bear shamans that boost their allies with +1S for this round. etc.

Time depends on the choice of the players/scenario. The system is uniform.
It's like imperial Guards from 40k. Theres tons and tons of subfactions within the guard, and sometimes it doesnt make sense, but hell, an armageddon steel legion fighting against pre heresy death guard? hell yeah, if it's painted awesomely, this could happen yes.

We should not forget the golden rule: YOUR DUDES.
But yeah, for campaigns stick to the time setting. You're not bringing Bolt Action miniatures to a Pike and Shotte match.
I've run Guild Wars games in Savage Worlds. Just give everyone an arcane background free and things work out wonderfully.
Actually, the chosen (humans) killed their gods, at which point a lot of the charr realised that the flame legion were pretty much bullshitting them around.
Humans were bastards anyway. When they settled in ascalon they assassinated the charr leader, which caused his sons to squabble amongst themselves. Taking advantage of the charr power struggle, the humans effortlessly swept in and took over Ascalon.
And Adelbern pretty much maginuked the whole of Ascalon with the foefire as the Charr were beating him.
Guild Wars would be best as a card game since it was originally inspired by CCGs to begin with - your class is your "deck" and the bar you take with you is your "hand" - the skills themselves are basically cards.
Inspired by CCG? That's the first I heard of that. It was made by a bunch of guys that had previously worked on WoW (and diablo 2 iirc), I thought it was just them making their own game.
he's correct.
and you are correct.
it's a combination
Huh, never heard about the CCG angle. That IS interesting.
Could I run IWAY warriors in this?

I better be able to
perhaps, your suggestion will be taken in
Yeah, they even used to have seaIed deck GvG tournaments.
You don't like Quaggans, therefore you must like Scarlet

Why are you a terrible person anon?

Am I /v/ yet?


Originally, all the skills where rings you carried on your fingers. Hence you had 10 skills you could take with you. The signet skills are heritage to that legacy.
I knew about the ring concept from what I read about beta, but I only started playing after the release of factions, so my beta knowledge is fuzzy at best.

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