One of my players decided to roll a Chaotic Evil Blackguard for my current campaign.Said player's been in my group for about two years now (bear in mind my current campaign is nearly at it's first anniversary), mostly keeping his head down and sticking to fairly standard character archetypes - a Paladin, a Wizard, and so on. He's never been a troublemaker, but even so I was reluctant to OK the idea of a Chaotic Evil character in a party full of LG, CG and LN characters, humble Fighter disguise or no. He managed to talk me into it, but the entire time I was just certain he'd start up the Chaotic Evulz and cause party strife by the end of the first session, assuming he didn't immediately blow his cover and get Smite Evil'd into the ground.He didn't. In fact, in character, no one in the party has realized his true alignment yet, and as I mentioned it's been nearly a full year of at least bi-monthly sessions so far.In fact, he's probably done more 'good' so far than the rest of the party combined.....
>>24599545sounds like it's motherfucking storytimer
>>24599545you have my motherfuckin' attention, bro
>>24599545It started off all the way at the beginning of the campaign, when the (secret) Blackguard teamed up with the party Paladin to prevent our Cleric and Ranger from killing young kobolds after the party had to clear out a den of them in search of a local treasure. After talking the rest of the party down the two helped the kobolds escape into the wilderness, pointing them away from the nearby towns and their guards - the Paladin of course certain that the kobolds would learn from this act of mercy and avoid attacking people in the future. The Blackguard in character 'agreed' with the Paladin, while explaining to me OOCly that he reasoned most of the young would likely die before they found shelter, and the few strong survivors would be out for revenge and would eventually terrorize the surrounding area once they built up their numbers.Later, I tried to involve the party in a fairly standard 'evil cult that wants to destroy the world' plotline, which most of the party missed when they failed to capture any of the cultists alive and accidentally destroyed the main bit of evidence that was to lead them to the next plot point - I thought for a moment that the group might totally miss the entire quest I'd planned, but then the Blackguard managed to figure out the situation after taking a few of the dead cultists to a wizard dabbling in necromancy, giving them over as test subjects in exchange for a little Speak With Dead interrogation. In fact, he skipped over a part of the plotline I'd planned - preventing a local nobleman's daughter from being kidnapped by the cult - entirely, instead learning the location of the cult's hidden temple directly rather than having to pursue the cultists as part of a rescue mission.Rather than take this info to the party, however, he urged the party Paladin to take everyone else bandit hunting while he 'wrapped up some family business in town'.
>>24599614>encouraging lawful stupid paladin>handling main quest line on his ownYES YES, MORE OP
>>24599545>>24599614You have my attention.
>>24599638Agreed. I am monitoring this thread.
>>24599614My good sir, you had my curiosity. Now. >>24599650
>>24599614Sounds more like LE to me but I couldn't care less.MOAR!
>>24599576Still monitoring, just thought I'd explain that I posted the original picture because while I didn't have a picture of a box of popcorn I did have a picture of a opossum in a box, seemed like an appropriate substitute.
>>24599614While most of the party went off doing their own thing, the Blackguard proceeded to 'infiltrate' the cult by posing as a champion of the cult's (fake) evil god and presiding over their human sacrifice - and derailed their kidnapping plans by declaring that their god didn't want a virgin sacrifice (besides, their intended target had already been deflowered by the Half-Elf ranger, little surprise there), but rather the blood of his most fervent followers. The cult leader (who'd started things up just to shill money but got caught up in the mood himself before he realized it) protested, but was quickly torn apart by his former followers before they all rushed to poison themselves in the name of their god. The Blackguard then delivered their bodies to his new secret necromancer cohort, earning his loyalty, and preventing the baron's daughter from ever being kidnapped in the first place.When I questioned the Blackguard why he, a Chaotic Evil character, had done all this without even involving the party in it (which would've been reasoned as merely him maintaining his cover), he pointed that now he and he alone - with the possible exception of his now-ally necromancer if he chose to interrogate the dead cultists as well - knew the location of the cult's former lair, which he could use as a base of operations for later schemes if he so chose, and besides, wasn't it fitting of a Chaotic alignment to *interfere* in other Evil factions' plans if they didn't match up with his own goals?It hasn't ended there.
>>24599681I'm pretty sure that's a kinkajou.>>24599688Jesus, this fucker...
>>24599717>kinkroodytoodyfroowell fuck you.
>>24599688So far he's helped the party overthrow a Lawful Evil king (to put his Lawful Good but untrained daughter and her secretly Lawful Evil - and friendly to the Blackguard - mentor and advisor in power), kill a dragon terrorizing the countryside (in order to get a share of it's scales and bones and also grab up an evil artifact from it's lair while everyone else was distracted), talked down the Paladin from losing his faith and Falling after the party had to deal with corruption in the Paladin's church (which the Blackguard pointed out would make the Paladin *never* suspect him of evil deeds or buy into anyone elses' suspicion of him), and has solo-killed a Lich (who was trying to unleash a plague of the undead on the kingdom the party 'liberated' earlier in the campaign - bear in mind this wasn't the Blackguard's necromancer ally either), another marauding dragon (which had recently laid an egg, which the Blackguard stole and and kept for himself - it's since hatched into a steadily growing black dragon), another more competent cult (because *their* world-ending plot would've actually worked, and this would obviously have put an early end to his own schemes) and an orc warlord who was plotting an invasion of a peaceful coastal duchy (he killed the warlord in single combat, claimed command of the orcish host, and ordered them back into the mountains to prepare for the day when he returned with a fully-grown dragon to lead them), all while keeping the party at large distracted with other matters. Out of character of course everyone all know what's going on, but in character none of the party even *suspect* that he's anything other than the most Lawful Good hero of a Fighter to have ever lived.I'm not sure if he's doing Chaotic Evil wrong, or if everyone else is.
>>24599844He is doing CE right. In a machivelian way. The only way to do CE right. Bring down power systems and prepare your own. And when the time comes. BAM total world destruction and all the loot. And perhaps Lichdom
>>24599844It most certaintly does seem to be more Lawful Evil or Neutral Evil, but Chaotic Evil doesn't mean Chaotic Stupid. It depends on what his ultimate goal is once he's gotten everything. What are all these plans leading up to?Also I'm surprised that the Paladin's never noticed him with Detect Evil by accident.
>>24599844I would suggest that he is simply playing neuteral evil but that's just my opinion.
>>24599844More like NE, but doing it motherfukin' well.Hope you gave his actions buttfucking consequences for the party.Also what's his Long Term Secret World Destroying Scheme?
>>24599844So, he has>A secret evil temple base>A secret evil artifact>A secret necromancer sidekick>A secret evil chancellor controlling the young queen>A secret dragonand>an orcish hordeThis guy is doing a FANTASTIC job. This is what a Champion of Tzeench looks like.
Someone screencap these posts please.
>>24599721I was expecting /ss/Turns out I was right
>>24599924And now there's coffee all over my keyboard
>>24599930What the fuck? I was replying to >>24599924
>>24599924You. I like you.
>>24599545Alignments are fucking stupid. Why do you people still play with the retarded D&D alignment grid?
>>24599999>Wasting delicious quints for stupid trolling purposes>>>/b/
>>24599880Houserule in my group: Detect Evil doesn't exist. A That Guy Paladin a year and a half ago (not the same Paladin as in this campaign) kept abusing it, so we threw it out the window and the That Guy ragequit. We've had a perfectly nice and cohesive group ever since, which is why I was suspicious of the until-then quiet guy suddenly popping up with the idea of playing CE.>>24599881>>24599902I half want to peg him as NE too, but the player insists that CE fits his theme better since he keeps dicking over every other evil faction that isn't aligned with him and occasionally performs Good deeds to protect his cover, and I like to keep hands-off my players' alignments unless they do something ludicrous like burning down orphanages for the lulz as CN (which, thank God, hasn't happened with any of my players since long before the Blackguard joined my group).As for his goals, he's been keeping those close to his chest. I'm suspecting either world conquest or godhood myself.
>>24599999Well, I hate the alignment grid and find it arbitrary and pointless, but for a lot of people I know it does make things a lot easier. It's sort of a hand-holding for character motivations and morals in an easy to digest format. Which is fair enough, in some campaigns that's all you need. It also comes into play with certain spells and gods and such.
>>24600038> caring about post numberWhy are you doing this? To what end?
>>24600044Here's hoping he becomes a God.
>>24600062Just a habit I guess, what's wrong with that?(Polite sage)
>>24600062Because shut up and marvel at the quints.
>>24599999I gotta squint to see those quints.
>>24600117 No. >>24600108 Because it's stupid, distracting, and derails the thread in non-interesting ways. It reeks of the worst areas of /b/ and /v/, where it matters less the content of your post and more its placement and the speed at which it's crafted - everything /tg/ works to avoid.
>>24600044Also,>>24599904The dragon isn't actually secret. The party knows he killed the second hostile dragon single-handedly (though they *don't* know it was only hostile because it was seeking food for it's soon-to-be-young) and kept it's hatchling as a companion, but while the Cleric (a holier-than-thou high elf that's more Lawful Stupid than Lawful Good, unlike the Paladin who for all his faults is more naive than a rules lawyer - bear in mind this is just how they're RPed, the players of both aren't really like their characters) pointed out that it should be killed because it was a Black Dragon the Paladin and Blackguard teamed up to shout her down.
>>24600044He becomes Tzeench
>>24600157You sound tremendously assmangled. It's the simple things, bro. If you can't derive joy from scoring repeating numerals then you're way too far up your own autistic ass and The Great /tg/ Myth to be any fun.
>>24600177Someone's mad they didn't get quints.
>>24600181Manipulating the paladin to contradict himself and make him question his own morals is exactly what CE should be, messing with everyone else's views.
>>24600181And then what happend?
>>24600044The cleric doesn't have the Good domain, does he? Holy Smite might be a problem later.
>>24600266And then the party had to go solve some church corruption and the dragon matter was put aside. It's still far too young to be used in a fight, so the Cleric has dropped the point so far.>>24600310Yeah, LG High Elf Cleric. We've also got the LG Human Paladin, a CG Half-Elf Ranger, a LN Human Wizard and, of course, our CE Human Blackguard. Briefly had a CG Halfling Rogue for the first few sessions, but the Rogue's player couldn't make our sessions anymore due to other matters and their character was retired.
>>24600716No, I said good DOMAIN, not alignment.Unlike Holy Word (Clr 7/Good 7), Holy Smite is domain-only (Good 4).It still damages neutrals, but the blinding is kind of a dead giveaway.>teamed up with Paladin to shout her downGoodie. If ever there were an alignment minefield (beyond Paladin Falls) it's "Always X".
So the question is...>is it by nature evil>is it nurtured evil by the blackguard>is it nurtured other-alignment by the blackguard>is it nurtured other-alignment by the party>is it nurtured evil by the party>is it by nature other-alignment
>>24600867>No, I said good DOMAIN, not alignment.Oh, right. My bad.>mfw this is why the Wizard has to spend more time helping me with DMing than actually playing his character
The core rules are full of many strange things.>Unconscious creatures are automatically considered willing,
>>24601012I am so ashamed of laughing at that.
>>24601012Oooh. New vistas are opening!
>>24599924Actually it's not /ss/.The first s in ss stands for straight.It's just s.
>>24601670>didn't get the joke
Bump for more storytiem. Should we archive this?
>>24606891It's already archived.
>>24599844he is, he should be NE
I won't let this 404.
>>24600867The important thing to always remember is that the 'Always X' alignment category makes it clear, EVEN IN JUST THE CORE BOOKS, that 'always' is actually 'almost always'. There are exceptions. So one can always (ha ha) argue that this one particular critter could be the exception, in character.I guess 'Almost Always X' was too much of a mouthful for them to use.
>>24600716WHAT HAPPENS NEXT OP? I'm quite literally on the edge of my seat.
>>24612013I don't follow - you mean the church corruption incident after the dragon capture, or what's happened after the orc horde incident (ie, nothing)?
>>24611880The problem is, Savage Species [I believe] clarifies that "always" is about "999,999 per million"- and some other source points out that if an Outsider changes alignment, they actually become an outsider of the appropriately-aligned plane instead. (This contradicts SS, which instead has them retain their previous alignment subtype and be vulnerable to both their present and "subtyped" alignment unless they change it throuhg a ritual)Whereas "usually" is supposed to be just 50-70% or so...like Dark Elves. Drizzt Daermon NashezBaernon? Go fig.