The year is 3040, and you are Daniel Holdt, Battlemech Engineer.Currently, you are in a lunch meeting with Lord Shun, emissary of the Capellan government, here to discuss purchase and/or license of the HZP Phobos from Skvorek Armorworks. Over peking duck, you are speaking on the possibility of two versions of the HZP, which utilize the modular armor and torso in such a way as to appear as two different models: one which would be a general-service 'Mech, used in whatever duty the CapCon would need it for, and the other as a bodyguard for the Raven; that EWAR 'Mech you just had the good fortune to get a look at before the meeting. This version would maintain the visage you originally chose for it, which would be useful in the hands of a group such as the Death Commandos.You had given Lord Shun a possible date of completion (1 week, to which he agreed), and were wrapping up that part of the conversation it seemed. You know his engineers are still due to arrive and discuss with you the Phobos in detail, as well as Janine speaking with Shun about finances. Add to that the curiosity you feel about Hatamoto being there with you, and you still seem to have a full day ahead of you.It seems the engineers still aren't here yet, so if you have any questions for Lord Shun, or anything to bring to his attention, now is a good time.
>mfw I misspelled SkvorecArchive link:http://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive.html?tags=mechengineer+questSarna.net for a helpful reference and to learn more about the Battletech world.Camospecs.com for paint jobs, miniature work, and more forums.
HOLY SHIT I ACTUALLY MADE IT IN TIME FOR ONE OF THESE. YES!
>>24304714not really no
>>24304714I say we ask Lord Shun what types of Mechs would the Capellans would be looking for at this time.
>>24304714Fuck, gotta sleep early today.Good luck, Anontech.
>>24304948Didn't he already tell us?
>>24304784(glad you could make it)>>24304975(thanks, sorry we missed you)>>24304948"Hm. that is a fair question.As you know, my government is not one of the richest or the most powerful or influential of factions. Our military budget is quite limited, and we have to make due with what we can. Hence why jokes abound about entire companies of UrbanMechs abound, for example. Machines like the Vindicator have become staples for us, but we are always looking to diversify. That is why I am here. We have a quite intelligent and able cadre of designers and engineers ourselves, as you have seen with the Raven, but it is the belief of men like me that we have to turn our eyes outward for new ideas and new possibilities. Remaining insular and separate from the rest of the Inner Sphere, regardless of how some of them might have sinned against us in the past, will eventually curse us, I believe.You should know that there are some who oppose my being here. No project is without its intrigues, Mr. Holdt. Once your battle is done here, mine will begin in the halls of government.What you have here is something I think we need; a new 'Mech, to be sure, but also a new link to the outside. Sometimes I think my countrymen forget anything that does not wear green still merits consideration.That said, I would not be remiss if we were to find a new, heavier workhorse to act as a lynchpin to our forces; the Vindicator is only so heavy, and it may be outclassed soon."
Some discussion from the last thread about redesigning the faceplate for the Phobos and some of its armor plates to make it look like a different 'mech:1.) Modify the faceplate so that the "teeth" look more like a huge visor. 2.) Put a shutter or reflector over the eyes (like headlight covers), resulting in a long strip over the HZP's forehead that looks like a searchlight. Or just put a shutter over the two eyes that would make it look like two traditional searchlights, although the placement might be a bit conspicuous without some other modifications.3.) Armor plates are cosmetically altered to look smoother or look more like banded armor, rather than scale mail.Pic related.
>>24305201Sounds like our next project. Pity, I like the Concordat better as a customer personally
>>24305201"Well, I'm currently busy with Phobos, but after I've cleared time I could work on making a good workhorse, around 60 tons give or take."
>>24305329Yeah, I like the Concordat too, they gave the feddies one heck of a wedgie.
>>24305201Everyone jokes about the Urbanmech, but it's still a solid design for city fighting. Even moreso when used in conjunction with infantry and other vehicles. If you stick a heavier engine in there and slap on a few energy weapons, it can compete with some heavier 'mechs in that respect, especially with its stocky profile and rounded design. Speaking of which, would there be any sort of opportunities for contracting smaller companies such as Skovrec for creating field refit kits for existing 'mech designs in the Capellan Confederation? Or would the 'mech companies there generally prefer to keep those things in-house?
>>24305329>>24305395"I would be elated to see a new effort from you along that vein, Mr. Holdt. But of course, we should probably ground ourselves in the now for the time being; it seems my engineers are here."He motions to the door, where three men stand. One of them is dressed in what appears to be official garb, mostly consisting of black silks and green and gold trim. The other two are in their lab whites."Mr. Holdt, this is Dr. Zhang. He is a member of one of our elite engineer corps, whose job it is to evaluate any external contributions to our nation's infrastructure, particularly military hardware. Dr. Zhang, please."Zhang bows slightly in a curt fashion, and approaches the table. He sits, while his two lab coats stand at his flanks. he does not seem to be hungry, but turns to you directly."Mr. Holdt, thank you for allowing us to pour over your blueprints on our own accord. We appreciate your trust. We have some questions, however..."He produces a small device which you recognize: it's a holographic projector used to evaluate structural designs in three dimensions. You have used them before, but they are too expensive for Skvorec to have at the time, and too costly to maintain since they are quite delicate.He inputs a code and the device flickers on, displaying the 3D CAD wireframe of the Phobos."Firstly, I'd like to know how much testing you've done regarding the placement of your fusion block. It is non-standard, so I am concerned about the precautions you have taken to be sure it will not suffer failure under stress, say from fast movement for example."
>>24305683Tell them about our structure tests, then pass the torch to Hatamoto regarding the engine itself.
>>24305683(I would like to add my hate for my name not being on that, as well as to add that Hatamoto does NOT seem pleased to see this man at all. He is physically tensing up.)>>24305610(before Zhang shows up, Shun manages a reply to this too)"Sadly that is something less likely, since the needs of the battlefield are a constantly shifting dilemma, and allowing external sources that might be compromised to know our exact outfitting details for certain machines might be a detriment. So it is my government's stance not to allow modificational work to occur outside Capellan space, sad to say."
>>24305744Seconding this. Mostly because I'm assuming that Daniel makes the frame, while Hatamoto would worry more about the intricacies about Fusion Engines and its placement. Also I don't know enough Battletech tech-speak to create a fluffy statement that would say the same thing.
>>24305683Tell him about how the stress numbers in tests have come out, how we've tested it and the numbers come out in favor of the design, any redundancies we've put in place but how we do not have any real world data for it as of yet.And >>24305744assuming Hatamoto looks like he can field the question right now, he looked over all the Engine stuff with/for us and should know this little portion better than we do.
>>24305785Hmm. Hatamoto seems to be someone who doesn't hold grudges for petty reasons, but he might have a history with this particular Capellan engineer. I have a feeling that Dr. Zhang is going to do his best to give us a hard time.
>>24305744>>24305804>>24305837You inform him about your numbers, using his own display to bring them up (hooray for learning in a Davion school that had money to get the good gear!), and feed the numbers from your CAD to him. He looks them over and nods. "I agree that these seem solid. Real world testing will prove the virtual, however. This engine placement is highly irregular and it will require much more vigilant testing than usual to be sure it will not fail at a crucial moment."You refer to Hatamoto as the better person for actual engine details, and he seems to relax all at once as you do."Dr. Zhang, while the placement might seem strange to you, it has opened many possibilities within the design itself. And if you'd address the shielding, it has been juxtaposed by ninety degrees to offset the jarring effect the structural stresses would cause. Also, note the shock-absorbing mounts. Necessary due to the placement, but an additional precaution that will ensure the block functions at full efficiency for the life of the machine."Zhang nods. "Did you build a shock-test rig to get hard numbers, or are you relying on your computer data at this time?"Hatamoto scowls a bit. "We are limited in resources, but the two of us have been over this with a fine-tooth comb. If you had found weakness in the design, you would have brought it to the table with you."Zhang smiles slightly. "Well, I suppose we shall see with real-world testing then. The numbers are green, and everything is in order in that regard." He turns back to you."Now, explain to me how it is that you came upon the idea for this modular torso layout."
>>24306115The inspiration for it came chiefly from a Battlemech design that I found fascinating during my university days: the MCY-99 "Mercury." While it seemed like most of the professors over there glossed over it in favor of more recent designs such as the Wolfhound, I was intrigued by the modular weapon replacement system that the Mercury possessed. Though it was originally intended to speed up repairs on the 'mech in question, I thought that the concept deserved to be expanded upon. Ofttimes, many battlemechs are "hard-wired" with a primary configuration in mind; other variants can come afterwards, but they require extensive redesign of the battlemech's structure or power routing. But with modular weapon railings, it becomes possible to swap out weapons as the situation calls for it, instead of being restricted to how many spare 'mechs your quartermaster deems sufficient.
>>24306336Of course, it still takes quite some time to swap weapons, but on a strategic level, it may be quite useful, since it allows changes to be made significantly faster than normal.
>>24306336>>24306392Yeah. A technician would still need to run calibration tests and other things to ensure that the HZP wouldn't fall over, but it lessens the need for field modification kits, and also speeds up repairs.
>>24306336>>24306392>>24306428Zhang nods."And how much testing did you do regarding the gyro and the necessity to re-calibrate it with each load change? I know that you are planning to use our software for your prototype, and I can tell you I was part of writing it. It is capable of handling your system, but the gyro itself has its own firmware; have you run any simulations regarding re-calibration? Any stress load sims with different weapon loadouts?"
>>24306552Err, have we? I know we were fucking around with alternate loadouts at one point, so presumably we ran at least some tests.If so, bring up some of the theoretical loadouts with their test data
>>24306552I'm going to assume that Daniel was running those when we were designing the other loadouts for the HZP.>Response:We have already run several simulations involving different armor loads and weapon loadouts on the gyro. They have all tested green in the programs. If you wish, we can show you the data on the various example variants we have planned.>If Daniel didn't:Although if necessary, we can rerun those tests using a sample scenario where the weights would change in a hangar setting.
>>24306552"We have done testing on that, we have multiple sample variants of Phobos all of which have tested green and ought to be easy to swap between, if you'd like we can test the ease of putting in odder weapon configurations such as putting in a PPC or a large Autocannon on the computer without much trouble."
>>24306598>>24306686>>24306754"I see. I noted you had plans for several variants; presumably giving prospective clients options for production loadouts, since as I'm sure you know any military is capable of re-outfitting a design they already have, given proper facilities. And while your idea might save time on the front, very rarely do changes of that magnitude occur in a combat situation, barring the destruction of a component, and the necessitation of its replacement. Your design might also ease the burden of maintenance, but there are certain logistical issues with that notion, specifically the issues of manpower. I know you are not a military man, Mr. Holdt, but I will explain it to you:Militaries are run on manpower. They have since the dawn of time. And inefficiency is actually a part of that. You need tasks for your troops. You need machines that take time to alter, repair, and maintain. Why? Because a bored soldier is a mischevious soldier, even with good discipline. That is one reason you do not see many modular designs. It is expensive to produce; moreso than a traditional design. And it complicates manpower logistics by not needing as many techs and crew to maintain, causing issues with task assignment. I don't expect you to know all this, Mr. Holdt, but I wonder if you can justify your choice in light of it."
>>24306933Aren't sergeants and lieutenants perfectly capable of finding more than enough make-work for any soldier?
>>24307082That's what they pay them for. Maybe they can run drills on how fast they can swap out components.
>>24306933I feel like reminding him that we simply designed the best mech we could with what we had. Whatever happens on the field, it's their army, their soldiers, their techs that will need to maintain discipline. Not the mech. If their troops cannot maintain discipline because a new mech makes life a little easier on them then there is larger issues at hand than simply the mech, no? But I feel this would be bad to say for many reasons. >ynepag REFORMYes, I think they should be looking at reforms should they truly have discipline issues.
>>24307082Officers, making simple shit hard since, well, forever.
>>24306933I do not expect soldiers to be acting as a maintenance crew on these Battlemechs unless they were qualified to do so. While I have heard that there are more Mechwarriors in the Inner Sphere than there are functional Battlemechs, I do not doubt that a military of one of the Great Houses in the Inner Sphere would find a use for any idle soldiers. Given what I have seen here today from your exemplary protectors, Dr. Zhang, I have a hard time imagining that they would be mischievous on their spare time. As for your task assignment concern, less technicians assigned to maintaining the HZP would mean that they are free to work on other battlemechs that are not quite as easy to maintain. Or they could be re-assigned to other fronts where they are more needed. I have heard that competent technicians are very much a valued commodity in the militaries within the Inner Sphere, even in these relatively modern times. By designing an efficient battlemech, this frees up resources to use as you see fit. It is more expensive than conventional battlemech designs, but it is an investment. You get monetary returns on lowered maintenance costs, and returns on labor by freeing up personnel to use elsewhere. Though I am not a military man, I think that these would be a good things for any of the Great Houses' extensive inventory of battlemechs to have.
>>24306933"So you're saying that you'd rather soldiers have busywork than to have a better machine that can be repaired and altered in a more timely manner.Having to find some task for a soldier to do seems well worth this being cheaper and faster to repair, alter, and maintain. Not to mention that you can re-outfit this design with less dependence on facilities, you do not require as much complex machinery to repair or re-outfit this."
>>24307082>>24307123>>24307127>>24307192*Dr. Zhang smiles in what seems a genuine way."I do not know what you thought of that question, Mr. Holdt, but I like your answer to it. I am glad you are capable of defending your ideas and not backing down to criticism. It is a necessary trait in this field.That said, I have been through your design with a fine-toothed comb. I can find no glaring faults, though manufacture will require re-training and specialized instruction on our part due to the uniqueness of some of the components, but that has been forwarded to the pertinent people as a concern already. The modular design is something that could offer advantages, as you say, and whereas I am a scientist, and my god is rationale and logic, politicians are not the same as I, and that was the reason for my question. Your design is likely to run afoul of many speedbumps on the way to being accepted, and the biggest of which is the way you have made it appear. Some people might appreciate it; the Lyrans perhaps, or the barbarians in the Periphery, but many people in charge will see it as childish, and unnecessary. It was under my advice that Lord Shun asked you about re-designing the appearance of the Phobos. I find it lacking for military service, and more suited to the arenas of Solaris. But the machine beneath is solid, and something I would find acceptable to work with for our military.Do you have any other information for me, or any questions before I render my decision on your machine?"
>>24307453Are there any channels that I can use to convey design information to the right people in your government? The task that Lord Shun has assigned me regarding the redesign of the Phobos is largely aesthetic in nature, and may require some revision before it is physically constructed.
>>24307453"Are there any smaller less glaring faults that you wish to address? Do you find the level of redundancy acceptable?As for the face, I admit that it's unique but I still love it. It won't be difficult in the least to attach a faceplate on it that is more benign and professional. Though I feel that the grin gives it some personality, the Atlas pulled off the look quite well. I think anyone who served it would come to be comforted by its visage, knowing that the scariest thing on the battlefield is yours might help morale.For addressing any concerns that come up will I be asked to participate in that personally, and if so in what way, or will that be the task of yourself, other scientists and engineers and Lord Shun?"
>>24307625>>24307667"I believe Ms. Steiner has all the contact information necessary. I would not ask you to transmit specifications over HPG Pulse, but notes regarding progress are acceptable. I will expect revisions to be done in one week, and after that, we will arrange for finalization of the agreement, providing Lord Shun finds the motion to acquire the Phobos for the Capellan military passed."Lord Shun nods. "I will be prompt with informing you, I assure you."Zhang clears his throat. "Insofar as other concerns, I have none. Though I will tell you that it will be my position that we license from you, and produce the Phobos ourselves. The logistics of transport are not feasible for us, as you are located in the Free World's League, and trade between us might change at any time, not to mention cost for the paltry number of units you could produce annually would outweigh the benefit of leaving the design in the hands of the designer. Is that acceptable?"
While we're waiting for Zhang's response, here's an amalgamation of some suggestions from the last thread about redesigning the Phobos' faceplate. The idea was to make it a bucket-helm 'mech, like the Trebuchet/Vindicator/Thunder.
>>24307792Not my department.
>>24307792>ZhangI believe that question is up to Ms. Steiner to decide.
>>24307792"I believe our business plan assumed that would be the case, as you said, one never knows when an embargo might be enforced, and we certainly do not have the capacity to build enough to satisfy a successor state's needs.
>>24307792"I could not expect our armorworks to provide for the needs of the entire Capellan Confederation, and I believe that is our business plan. However you will have to confer with Ms. Janine Steiner for any details on that."
Personally, I want to sell our designs to as many people as possible. IIRC improving the military might of the Rasalhague Republic and Taruen Concordat would probably actually strengthen the Cappellen military position
>>24307082There's limits to that, especially once the soldier's skills become something that would clearly be quite in demand anywhere else.Like being able to repair fusion reactors in the private sector.For those guys, you can't just order more latrines unless you're in a war zone and there's literally no one else that can pull it off in the entire roster.Worse still than a bored soldier with a lot of technical skills is a disgruntled soldier with a lot of technical skills and almost as much time.
>>24307834>>24307839>>24307843>>24307864Janine nods. "I believe it's time for me to take over talks then, if we are getting into logistics and costs."Shun nods as well, and Zhang stands. "If that is so, then I will excuse myself. I have work to attend to." He leaves with little ceremony, and no farewell. Shun sighs when he is gone."I apologize for that, and for him. His kind are becoming more common in the higher ranks of government these days, and I fear what that might mean for relations in the future. All business, little decorum. And unnecessary questions."Janine shrugs. "People are who they are. Dr. Zhang is good at his job, if his own word on it is to be taken truly, and his personality isn't what the Capellan government hired, I would bet."Shun laughs. "I agree. Now come, let us walk while we negotiate. I would like to see your founder's grave. And I would like both of you to come. Of course, if you would like to get to work as soon as possible on the changes we suggested, then feel free, Daniel. I will not keep you."
>>24308030Let's go and pay our respects. If it weren't for Goddard, we wouldn't even be here.
>>24308030Let's go with him, pay our respects, that sort of them, let Janine and Shun talk shop.
>>24307792Licensing the design seems the appropriate option though there will be footnotes I expect.(we need the money to expand the works and pump out serious numbers of HZP mechs for other customers)>>24308005Don't really care about them as much as strengthening our Company and making Skvorek actually tough. Tough enough to withstand a Comstar intervention.Our Company shall not stop until it becomes the Wayland Yutani of the FWL. Embedded everywhere and in everything.
>>24308122I actually have a major soft spot for the concordat, and I find the idea of upgrading the Republics forces enough to give the clan a major belly ache highly amusing.
>>24308189Don't try to Meta.Beyond the very healthy and sane paranoia about Comstar we should function on enlightened self interest. If it is not profitable and good for us and the company we wont do it.
>>24308228I'm not being meta. Trying to sell weapons to powers with no common border but with common enemies is common sense. Plus, maybe those barbarian perepherals will appreciate our aesthetic design.
>>24308339Clans don't exist yet, that's meta, HOWEVER, the periphery would appreciate the aesthetic, so that isn't meta and is a valid business proposition given to us by none other than Shun himself.
>>24307453Shit, maybe we SHOULD sell HZP to the Lyrans.I'm sure there is more than one pilot that would LOVE to run one of these guys with a big-ass hatchet.
>>24308058>>24308106>>24308122You and Janine follow Shun out onto the tarmac."Daniel, Janine, I am glad we are at this point in talks. As I'm sure you are too. I get to return home with something new to strengthen my state, and you get to find the finances you probably need to keep your company going. And that's the best part, isn't it? It's -your- company. Your vision. You don't have to answer to anyone else."You arrive at MechBay 5, and Shun gives you a quizzical look."This is his resting place? It seems odd to me, but..."He looks around, and smiles."I suppose this place was his dream, and so making him a physical part of it is only proper. Take care though, that you don't make a bad decision for the company... his ghost may haunt anything you try to build here."Janine chuckles a bit at that.Shun walks forward to the plaque you had installed on the bay, and produces a small pot of some sort from his sleeve. He then produces three sticks, and fixes them into the pot, lighting them with a match he gets from his pocket.He folds his arms and holds them before his chest, and closes his eyes. You hear him softly mumbling to himself.Is there anything you'd like to say to Goddard while you are here? Janine has closed her eyes and seems to just be having a moment of silence.
>>24308431maybe a quick thanks.
>>24308431"Thank you for letting me be a part of this family."
>>24308431Thank him for everything hes given us
>>24308431"Every last shred of terror these babies cause, every life they save or take, old man, they do it to remember you by. If only I were more spiritual about it, it'd make your absence bearable."
>>24308431"You should fucking be here man, it's just not right without you. But we'll make it work, you brought us together, it's the least we could do for you. Your name and Skvorec Armorworks are going to be known by every single Mech pilot in the universe, I promise you, whether it be in fear for facing our Mechs or love for getting to pilot one. Worlds will burn because of something you caused to happen, nobody is ever going to forget you. Every iota of terror the Phobos brings is dedicated to you. Just wish you could call me Champ one last time."
>>24308572>>24308522Fuck mang, these two, right where it hurts.
>>24308505>>24308518>>24308519>>24308522>>24308572The three of you spend your moment with Goddard, and afterwards you begin to stroll the grounds. You begin by heading towards MechBay 3 where they are assembling the first Phobos prototype. It would seem they have already started fixing structural pieces to a framework.Lord Shun looks on and smiles."This is only the third time I have ever gotten to be up close to the production of a Battlemech. Sometimes I wish I had been born in a different caste; this is what I feel my calling would have been."He turns to Janine."Barring any last-minute pittance from Zhang, I am ready to hear your offer regarding the licensing of the Phobos. I had my men work on the total market value, and do some calculations based on that, so know I come to the negotiating table armed, miss." he says with a smile.Janine nods. "Well since you are not looking to buy, but license, did you want to outright opt the design or did you want to co-opt it and pay royalties..."As they begin to talk, do you want to listen in/try to be a part of the conversation, or is your mind elsewhere?
>>24308774Let's listen in, but stay quiet, since this is not our job.
>>24308522>>24308572(gonna be a bit of a treat due to these at the end of the thread; nice to see thoughts like that for poor o'l Goddard)
>>24308672oh lawd that pic
>>24308774huh, well, on one hand, we want to know how well this baby sells, but on the other hand... fuck if I know>>24308811captcha: second pondorr
>>24308774Listen in. While we're not financial personnel, it would be good to have at least a vague idea of what Janine deals in. Plus, we might be able to help out in case she needs any technical details from us.
>>24308774Listen in, if anything technical comes up we come in or if he mentions anything that makes the Phobos seem not worth as much as it ought to be by disregarding how worth it the added Terminator stuff or Modularity we might want to pipe up.
>>24308774I'm leery of an exclusive contract.
>>24308811>>24308831>>24308838>>24308839Janine and Shun get down to business. The main source of negotiation doesn't seem to be money, but HOW the Capellans will handle the license. There seems to be two ways:Opt: The Capellans buy the Phobos. This gets them exclusive rights to production. It is similar to what teams like VEST do, or Team Banzai when they pretend to be a design firm. Smaller companies that aren't willing to try production and risk the costs tend to do this. You get a large chunk of money, but only once. After that, the Cappes can make as many Phobii as they want, and you don't get a dime. They also own the design, and you can't produce it unless you build a clause into the contract that says you can, which in turn makes it become...Co-Opt: They either pay a smaller lump-sum of dosh to produce as many Phobii as they want, or they cut you a check each quarter based on production numbers as a royalty payment based on an agreed-upon sum per unit made. The benefit of this is the Phobos is still yours, and you can sell it to others, and make it yourself. The downside is, less cash unless they make the Phobos for a long time and in large numbers.You aren't able to follow the conversation 100%, so in your head you start wondering which option you'd prefer.(i'll give you guys time to put together a group consensus on what you'd want Daniel to vote for if he is asked, which, knowing Janine, she will ask)
>>24309160I much rather a co-opt plan, but thats my opinion
>>24309160Co-Opt based on how many they produce per quarter.
>>24309160The Phobos is our flagship product, I know we had plans for a revamped design at 40T once the MkI's kinks are ironed out so we could opt the MkII to CapCon or whatever buyer wants it badly, the the original should remain ours and the company's.
>>24309160Co-Opt, preferably royalties, and a smallish sum down payment thing to cover the first X units produced, I think the Phobos is going to be popular as hell over a long production period, and we can sell it to others as well.
>>24309160Co-Opt would be my vote. The Phobes is our first mech and I would like to use it to get as many future buyers looking at us as possible. Later we can do Opt type agreements with them that have specific request.
this has my vote
>>24309219>>24309235>>24309260>>24309292>>24309309>>24309339(Co-Opt it is.)It seems Janine is swinging that way with the negotiations, and when asked, you say you'd rather Co-Opt as well, considering you might have other potential customers and want to keep your hands on your first child, as it were.Shun nods in agreement, and smiles. "The proud papa, I can relate."Next is the nitty-gritty of the contract. Shun tells you that in the event Co-Opting was chosen as the contract type, he says the Capellans are willing to offer a down payment increase to add a licensing limiter to the contract. Basically it is them purchasing the rights to shut out other buyers from purchasing, but only agreed upon parties before the contract is ratified. They can't add parties after the fact unless the contract is re-negotiated.He says his superiors have only two factions to add to the list: Comstar and the Federated Suns.You and Janine converse for a moment. Do you agree to add the stipulation? Janine tells you the Davions had expressed passing interest in the design, but no arrangements had been made to send an emissary yet.What do you think?
>>24309530Hmm... I have a feeling that Comstar could get their hands on it if they wanted it anyway, and as long as we don't bring it up to the fedsuns again, they'll probably forget about it or something.I'm okay with that.
>>24309530Given that the FedSuns and Lyrans are merged into the FedCom right now, does that preclude us from flogging it to House Steiner?
>>24309530>Comstar>pic related"While I did have some notions of looking at periphery states and the Free Worlds League, I suppose a close neighbor makes the worst of keeping your yard."
>>24309530ComStar isn't in bed with Rasalhauge so far, so we can still sell to the space draculas.Periphery isn't locked out, so that's fine.No FedCom dosh probably won't hurt too bed since we cans till sell to the FWL.
>>24309587>I have a feeling that Comstar could get their hands on it if they wanted it anyway,I read this and suddenly my paranoia made me think that Bruce is a ROM plant and they already have HZP's plans
>>24309609(oops, my bad, I typed Suns instead of Commonwealth. My mind was elsewhere, gf just got home, was saying hi. yes, FedCom)
>>24309644Oh, the CS and FC are out as potential buyers, that's totally fine
>>24309688Well, that's okay. We still have Wrasslehog, the FWL, Dracs(lol) and the Periphery to sell to. And it's not like the FedCom doesn't have an abundance of good light designs already.I'm fine with this.
>>24309530"Well if Comstar wants our design I don't think that any piece of paper anybody has can stop them."As for the Federated Commonwealth, that's Steiner and Davion, that's a huge amount of possible customers and I'm pretty sure we could sell this baby to them. Unless the down payment is truly absurd I'd politely say no on that one.
>>24309530I'm guessing there is no time limit no the licensing limiter to the contract?
>>24309778(nope, can't be changed unless the contract is re-negotiated. however, you could move for a stipulation that removes a name from the list after X time, that's legal. It'd probably cost money off the bonus though)
>>24309778...If there isn't we can freely sell to steiner and davion once Kitty shatters teh FedCom. Glorious.
>>24309733Agreed this, thus has my vote.
>>24309812Though we can score a few points by offering to voluntarily change the contract to Fedsuns once that happens. Assuming we want to have a close relationship with the CC anyway.
(Looks like most everyone seems okay with adding the FedCom and Comstar as blacklist for selling in the Co-Opt contract then?)
>>24309934I am okay with this.
>>24309934it has my vote anyway, and besides if the Phobos turns out as amazing as we think it will, FedCom might work hard to make sure they can get our next toy
>>24309934No, I am against putting FedCom on the blacklist, but ComStar is fine.
>>24309934Does non-licensing also include the sale of actual units produced in-house?
>>24309960>>24309978>>24309993You and Janine agree to the terms, and Shun nods."Good, I had hoped that wouldn't be a bump in the road, especially given your ancestry, Ms. Steiner."Janine smirks. "If I were concerned about my cousins and uncles I'd still be in Lyran space."Shun chuckles. "I am sure Goddard rests well knowing such a firecracker is in charge of his dream. Well then, I suppose it is time to get down to numbers then? With the calculations my men have made, and estimating the value of the developments you've added to the Phobos, I come to a complete value for each unit, pre-consumer, of 2.6 million Cbills each. This is pre-consumer, understand, so the number may seem low. This is what the government 'pays' itself to make one, essentially.Since we will have a state-owned firm making the majority of the Phobii we will be using, this is the amount for most of the Co-Opt my government wants to use. This is for the 'neutralized' version you will be designing for us in a week's time. The other version we spoke of, the one that is more like what you originally envisioned, that will be made by a different firm that is outside the government for certain reasons I cannot divulge. That will be calculated as a private production, and the full post-consumer price will be used to calculate the royalty for that quota. The number they gave me for that was approximately 3.3 million Cbills."He looks to you. "What do you say so far?"
>>24310074(if you take the money then you can't sell to or license to anyone on the blacklist)
>>24310170That sounds pretty much the same as our own rough calculations, give or take a few hundred thousand. Certainly within expectations.
>>24310170"Well, as much as I would like to disagree with the numbers they are hardly out of line with any estimations I had. The important part is how much we'd be getting per unit."
>>24310249Gah, messed up my word usage.I was thinking "Well, as much as I would like the numbers to be higher they are hardly out of line with the rough estimations I had." I don't know why I typed that. And does our Engineering Knowledge notice anything hinky about the 2.6 million Cbills? It sounds reasonable for doing things at cost, but if it's hinky we should make note of that.
>>24310170"Well, I can't exactly haggle with our prime benefactor, now can I?"We aren't selling to anyone else below 3.4mil if we can help it
>>24310315(you guys can make a roll if you want)
>>24310170Aren't those figures lower than our own estimates?I think we should point that out, that the estimates are assuming best possible price.
>>24310339Sure, may as well.
>>243103473.2 is at-cost, 3.4 is high-margin haggle, 2.6 is most likely materials and parts only, the labor cost is defrayed by in-house production which we really shouldn't be asking for a royalty onShun is cutting us a deal, though we'll see how low-ball the 2.6 is in a moment>>24310351FUCK
Rolled 5>>24310351>>24310390>>24310394Rolling Engineering, lower is better, to determine the validity of Shun's estimates.
>>24310351Why the fuck would you roll? You KNOW /tg/ dice hate MEQ>>24310454HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
>>24310454holy shit, Anontech just save Daniel's ass
>>24310503I guess that Daniel really paid attention in that optional Engineering Economics course that was taught. Especially the boring parts about how much you should charge for intellectual properties and other battlemech design miscellanea.
>>24310454>>24310470>>24310472>>24310503>>243105132.6 million Cbills is actually pretty close to what you would suspect it would cost when labor is a non-factor. You could probably get that up to 2.8, but it depends on how much you want to haggle with Shun.His estimates about the post-consumer cost are pretty spot-on. You had wanted to try for 3.5 before, so it's up to you if you want to mention it.
>>24310513(also this reaction image confuses me. I can't tell if it's disappointment that the 5 could have been some other roll or not)
>>24310591I think we can let that slide for the sake of our professional relationship.
>>24305201>Interested in a Heavy workhorseSomeone dig up that 3/5/3 Budget Falconer that guy posted wayback. 's perfect.
>>24310591Let it slide. Say that we'd peg it at a bit closer to 2.7 or 2.8 but that we won't quibble as we are planning to do a fair bit of business with him in the future.
>>24310591>>24310623Yeah I agree. Shun isn't trying to under cut us badly at all and if this mech turns out to be a hit. We may get better deals or deals in the same vain later on.
>>24310591The 3.5 million was more a very rough estimate based on other 'mechs in its class, plus some extra stuff thrown in for modularity and such. I think we can let the price slide due to the fact that we may also be licensing the weapon mountings for the Phobos. Priority is not getting ripped-off and getting the Phobos into production so we can start getting steady cashflows from licensing agreements and weapon mounting licensing. So I think we can afford these estimates that Lord Shun has.
>>24310743>>24310725>>24310702To that degree, what is Lord Shun planning on paying us for this investment? Assuming we can do so without sounding rude.
>>24310743>>24310725>>24310702>>24310623You nod to Janine, and she nods back."I'm glad we are in agreement. Though I must say this has been less of a negotiation and more a series of neck exercises with as often as we have nodded to one another so far. It feels like getting into business with an old friend, in some ways."Several minutes of minutiae later, and you arrive at the moment of truth: what the royalty payments per unit will be like, and how much the down payment will be.Shun pulls out a data pad, and passes it to you.It reads:"Pre-consumer production royalty payment: 8% of the agreed upon pre-consumer value per unit.Post-consumer production royalty payment: 6.5% of the agreed upon post-consumer value per unit.Pre-consumer/unit: 2.6 mil, or 208,000 Cbills per unit royalty.Post-consumer/unit: 3.3 mil, or 214,500 Cbills per unit royalty.To be paid quarterly.Agree?"Next to the Agree? there are two boxes, one with each of your names. They are biometric thumbprint scanners for initial contract signing. Pretty common practice.
>>24310911(oops, add a down payment of 7 million Cbills, five for the base payment and one for each agreed blacklist)
>>24310911Look at Janine, "Neck exercises, huh?"vote: Agree
>>24310911Look at Janine, raise an eyebrow, if she nods then we nod right back and sign that shit.
Thoughts: since we can crank out one or two Phobii at a time on our own, why not get a pilot in the Solaris Arena to showboat our baby in the gladiatorial circuits?
>>24310911Yeah, sounds okay. I still think putting FedComm on the blacklist was a bad choice, by taking out such a huge potential market.
>>24310985to continue, the modularity and durability would let us maintain our publicity model at a lower cost than the competition and respond to challenges in the arena much faster than other mech teamsso long as the guy we find isn't a waste of a pilot, it should be good PRI'd even say run it by Shun as well, since the arena matches could give heed to when the CapCon starts fielding them
>>24310985That's a thing a lot of manufacturers do, actually. It's not a bad investment, especially if we can get the Solaris team to lease it (For less than market value of course, as an incentive)
>>24311032and we need a proper test pilot who'll push the Phobos Prototype to its limits anyways
>>24311032It would have to be one of the "friendlier" looking ones; the CapCon wants to keep the chryssalid version for their Death Commandos.
>>24311008I agree, but what can you do? We still have plenty of other clients and just because they don't get the Phobos doesn't mean they won't want Phobos's big brother. Though technically the FedCom doesn't exist yet, in practice it does and we get the idea.
>>24311032I don't see any need to mention it to Shun since it's OUR baby; it just doesn't directly concern him. As to pilots, Ivan supposedly has friends involved in the solaris circuit, so I imagine he'd be our guy to talk to there.
>>24311066Again, pass that by Lord Shun, we could even give the testbed model a unique faceplate with CapCon Guard llamelar or just give the lucky bastard a Red Comet getup
>>24311092It's not our baby any longer as soon as we sign the papers. We should look more closely at the clauses concerning the production of the original Phobos design and who it can be sold to.
>>24311066Iunno, he wanted a custom exterior for the CC Guard model, there was nothing about restricting the original appearance to Death Commandos, just that the grimhild on our baby was too brutal for police duty
>>24310942>>24310951>>24310971>>24311008You look to Janine, and she looks to you.Two more reps on that neck exercise you've been doing, a smile, and two thumprints and it's done."Wonderful!" Shen exclaims. "We are in business. Of course the official contract will be here to sign once the finalized Phobos 'general use' model is finished and the whole thing is approved. We will be in touch, of course."Shun puts the datapad away, and smiles broadly."And now the part that you probably didn't know about."(TUNE IN NEXT WEEK WHEN YOU FIND OUT WHAT THE HECK SHUN IS TALKING ABOUT!Sorry guys, but I have to end a bit early tonight, but we got to a good point that I can call it at thankfully. With any luck 5pm PST Wednesday will be back to our regular day and time, since it seems my schedule has normalized a bit.Archiving this then Q&A as usual.)
>>24311142Eh, it's still our mech and more importantly our company we'd be looking to promote at Solaris. Shun is an affable guy and all, but he's a rep for a customer, not a partner. As to which version we use, I'd go with the rapeface model, Solaris is kinda the place for showmanship anyway.
>>24311224"...goddammit, Shun, I'd better not be crying after this."
What were you talking about in>>24308814 ?
>>24311224>NEXT WEEK IT WAS ALL A DREAM!
>>24311245A rep for a customer, with which we just signed a licensing agreement that has restrictions built into it.It would be better to make sure under what conditions we can sell/lease the full production original variant.
>>24311245Even better, if it gets the stellar results we expect, imagine the enemies faces when they realize the CapCon have full-production models of whatever deathdealer the arena prototype becomes>Wait, they're using THAT THING?! How Long has this been under wraps?
>>24311277>yfw he brings Goddard back from the not-dead-all-along>revealing why so many Death Commandos were present>they were the boarding party
>>24311282Bonus XP!I like when people take the time to contribute or write when I feel is a pretty cool post, so I like to reward that.Daniel has therefore earned a bonus XP that I will apply to him based on what he's done this thread.Huzzah!
>>24311376So, we get a bonus to Carouse/Diplomacy/Barter/Speechwell, we won't just be another Zhang
>>24311316We can't sell it or license it to commonwealth or comstar, that was pretty simple. I'm sure Anontech would have mentioned it if there were other notable restrictions, as this isn't 'intricacies of contract law' quest. Not being allowed to showcase our company's first major production model at Solaris would have been a pretty big sticking point after all.
>>24311224Oh god we didn't read the contract WHY DID WE NOT READ THE CONTRACT!
>>24311661Are you kidding? Nobody ever reads the contract.That said, Janine derserves everything that happens to us if she didn't read the contract. That's her job.
>>24311694You absolutely need to read contracts if you do important business.>>24311694And this is primarily Janine's job, yes. However, with important contracts like this usually several people read it over.
>>24311743But still... if Janine showed no reservations and what we talked about was literally the be-all-end-all of our initial contract, we shouldn't be getting totally shafted here. At worst Shun has some other surprise and enjoys watching us squirm because he was raised for politics.>>24311277I agree with this sentiment
>>24310941waitaminute, so each blacklist was worth slightly less than 5 mechs worth of royalties?Seems a little weak in exchange for cutting out some potentially huge markets.
>>24311926FedComm would have bought 5 for testing purposes alone as soon as they heard that CapCon bought it up, and wanted to deny it to them and Comstar.
>>24311926but that's money we can put to:1) funding the remainder of the testbed model and paying our people what they've been promised2) repairs3) R&D tools, both for the Hazard Pay line and the Lostech4) kickstart for the next project and a single production-model Phobos to sell off to anyone but blacklisters - we can trickle-build Phobii one-by-one until we have enough of a margin and reputation to begin increasing production one two or even three Phobii at once while pursuing other avenues of businessSelling Phobii won't be hard since, like it's been said before, people are building up their forces and will be snatching up anything they can find and we'll be steadily producing a robust and dependable light mech in numbers that won't outshine the CapCon interests
>>24311926Well, it does seem like a pittance, BUT:YOU can't sell or license to the FedCom or Comstar.Make of that what you will.
>>24312111We can however work through intermediaries without much trouble, we just need to find some middle men. If they show up in Davion armies well we didn't sell it to them, who knows how it got there?
>>24312173You seriously want to try to piss off the Mask?
>>24312111We could hire out a contractor to produce CS and FedCom Phobii, but that would take even more capital than we have at the moment. We could also use that contractor to build our personal materials and ramp up production for the cost of labor, a portion of materials and the privilege of being able to sell an extra Phobii unrestricted on the market.But, I'd say we save that till after they make their debut in CapCon forces to massive effect and our personal gladiator builds up their utility.
>>24312206*any extra Phobii
>>24312197We didn't sell them to them, they just fell out of the back of the local space equivalent of a truck.We just gave royalty production rights to someone else and they just happened to sell them to some people interested in buying a cool new mech, Wasn't us.
>>24312293Or they made their way by method of second-hand merchandise. Really, after we sell off a Phobos, it leaves our sphere of control.But our chances for repeat business and improved deals with the CapCon would be hurt severely if we did this right away.
>>24312323>>24312293So basically, we need to sell production rights with a royalty high enough to put non-CapCon and non-Skvorek Phobii into the 3.4million-plus C-Bill range. Literally, you buy it from us, the Capellans, who aren't selling, or you buy it at mark-up.
>>24312361I'm sure the CapCon can appreciate that we are pursuing our interests as a budding enterprise and cut-throat business while respecting both the word and spirit of our agreements with them.
>>24312111>YOU can't sell or license to the FedCom or Comstar.Does that include the company as a whole or just that one model of the phobos?
>>24312474So far we've only signed agreement on the Phobos 35T, anything else we make is subject to new contract
>>24312651We might want to check any other Great House to see if they're willing to look for 'mech designs. I hear that the FWL is particularly hurting for light 'mechs in 3040 due to the Andurien Crisis.Also, bump for archive.