Hey, you yeah you dumbass http://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/20990709/ You're fucking welcome.

Let's go straight to the Scrollophant in the room-

For a borderlands game to be true to source material, there will have to be lots and lots of randomly generated loot.

For there to be lots of different loot, the loot will have to have lots of statistics.

How can we compromise between fast paced shooty action and number crunching to shame FATAL?

My thoughts- A dice pool system that, depending on the gun's base stats and special powers, rolled numbers can mean vastly different things- combat rounds focus on interpreting one bigass roll rather than "Roll to shoot, roll vs recoil, roll for fire ignition chance, roll for fire ignition damage, roll for reload..."

>>21011532
You, STOP FUCKING TALKING, AND LOOK AT THE THREAD I LINKED

I'd rather do it with Stalker than Borderlands because it needs a lot less handwavium and the pillars of the story are identical (post-apoc scenario, grail quest).

>>21011542
There is precious little of anything in that thread besides discussion of a time system, a monster table, and a lot of videogame discussion


unfuck yourself, sir

'Borderlands pen & paper' is how I'd describe a couple of Dark Heresy campaigns I've been in.

Would play/10.

File: 1349516656625.jpg-(793 KB, 1063x1417, Concept_sketch_for_Raider.jpg)

I'd rather run Degenesis, Fallout or Tribe 8.
Borderlands seems to shallow a setting for anything other than hack&slay..

>>21011519
i just went through the entire thread, theres really nothing worth looking at.

File: 1349517852282.jpg-(64 KB, 456x412, 1344751758166.jpg)

I just finished the first game night of a boarderlands pen and paper.

Our party:
Steely Dan "the mechanic" - a inbred hick who pilots a houwitser with chicken legs

Vincent "the hunter" - a stoic survivalist who has a way with the animals of pandora

Logan "the bruiser" - a man possessing a robotic arm which is home a tyrannical and sadistic A.I.

Jessy "the genius" A 12 year old girl who commands 4 modified clap trap robots.

Cletus - a claptrap who style him self sheriff cowboy hat and painted star included. his hands have been replaced with six shooters

Fetus - A claptrap who wields an smg arm doesnt have a personality yet

Jeb - a shotgun wielding claptrap. she yells random insults and sounds like scooter

Horatio - a claptrap with a rocket pod welded to his head.

we are hunting down the leader of a skag themed group of bandits.

>>21011821
can you post the character sheets? what did you use for stats? bonuses? skills?
im adapting a d20 system right now, working on weapon gen first, will report back with what i got

>>21011885
sorry everything got left at the dm's house. basically he homebrewed everything and we rolled with his system.

>>21011912
damn, this sounds like it could be a damn fun system though

>>21011885
more or less it went

name AC based on size and class 100 health ponts

5 skills they are good at such as repair, treat injury,ride, pilot, ect

one feat such as an extra point of AC or better accuracy with a specific weapon time or something along those lines.

and every gun gets 4 reloads and you have to count ammo if you run out your up shit creek.

oh shit and one action skill like faze lock or the hawk or in my case an anti fear for my clap traps so they didnt run away


my clap trap army worships me like a god and carry my around on a throne atop and ammo crate which i can hide in while i give them orders

>>21011937
that helps a bunch just getting the basics down, did you each start with a weapon? or did you find it like in the games?

>>21011985
well we were hired by a company to get on a train and fallow orders. Our first order was to retrieve a shipment of guns from the cargo car. as soon as we got up to do so bandits derailed the train. so we grabbed the guns and headed in to battle and now we are basically slaughtering our way to the bandit boss baqck in their camp.

our dm was calling us on the phone from the other room to give us instructions and to give the train conductors last screaming words. we had it hooked up to speakers and it all sounded like the game with guns and explosions in the background. And we did the whole opening song which pandora chose for us which was another one bites the dust. we took turns giving out name and nickname like the opener for the games does.

>>21012062
sounds fuckin awesome dude, i like the idea of someone calling to give you instructions to act like angel in the first game, might have to impliment that, and a theme song is just pure epic, actually you can have a theme for each campaign. i like the nickname idea, it makes it more personal. i assume your characters did not know eachother before hand, or did they? were they a group that got hired, or hired individually, and formed a group?

If this is viral, please do it with a SHITLOAD of background and fluff, and try not to make it like the vidya, because we don't wanna a game to sqay "fuck this would be better as a vidya" (aka DnD)

And recruit the guys who wrote HöL and Tank Girl

>>21012166
they were hired by a company and didnt know eachother but agreed to work together for their unknown employer

File: 1349543638993.png-(1.51 MB, 2043x507, 1349460659351.png)

aside from conveinantly listing off the BL2 and BL1 factions (I only played 1) the archived thread prvides us with some marginally useful stuff like this list of gun parts.

Now first thing we need to do?

Gun Tables, we can worry about companies and stuff like that later but we need to build a table for making guns first.

>>21014065

>we can worry about companies and stuff like that later but we need to build a table for making guns first

Well, you could start with picking a manufacturer first, but honestly, BL2's model of Manufacturer bonuses can be added at any stage.

Looking at the handy chart once again provided, we can see all the parts which make a gun, at least in BL1.

Guns should probably be generated Body first, which actually decrees what kind of gun it is, possibly so much as the type like "Revolver" or "Machine Pistol" or "Double-Barreled Shotgun" (Which is why personally I argue for manufacturer first, because manufacturers usually have a specific style of gun for each of the types). From there, Barrel, Clip, Stock and Grip can probably be rolled in any order (but an order should be picked), and Scope and Accessory should be generated last, since those are both optional parts. Designing the tables isn't hard, filling them in is.

>>21014065
>clip
mmmmmmmmAGAZINE

>>21015484

It's a fair colloquialism. Half the guns in BL1 have revolving mechanisms anyway. Might as well call the part "Clip" than clarify it as a magazine or a cylinder once the piece is defined.

>>21015441
As I recall, in BL2 the computer generates guns in the order of Type -> Manufacturer -> Parts, but I don't see that it matters either way. some manufacturers don't make some gun types, but you can deal with that using either method - if you choose type first, then strike the incompatible manufacturer's off the list, and if you choose manufacturer first, strike the incompatible types off the list.

You definitely want to wait to do parts, even the body, until after type and manufacturer have been chosen, though.

>>21015484
oh God. I know someone just like you. Fuck off. It's just slang at this point.

>>21015544

I think that discussion was decided based on how chests open, eg you only ever find one launcher at a time, or two long-arms, or four pistols (or relevant ratio thereof). But even-so, if one were to generate by class of weapon first, you have six to pick from (a la BL2); Pistols, SMGs, Assault Rifles, Shotguns, Sniper Rifles and Rocket Launchers.

Personally, I'm fond of the DH hack approach because it solves a lot of the system building by simply having some good architecture to adapt. But six is not a handy number for d10 based random picking. I suppose you could make it percentile and figure out some slightly more balanced odds that way, but it's probably easier to just make a "Loot Type" table, and add Grenade Mod, Class Mod, Shield and Relic to the table for ten options. From there you go to a manufacturer table for manufacturers for that type of item. Example: Only Bandit, Dahl, Hyperion, Maliwan and Tediore make SMGs.

>>21015697
>But six is not a handy number for d10 based random picking

Then use a d6 for that roll

>>21015738

But... but..

The symmetry!

>>21011512
IMAGINE ROLLING TO MAKE WEAPONS!
IMAGINE THE CHARTS!
IMAGINE THE CHAAAAARTS!

>>21015781
We are. I mean, we're discussing how to make them right now...

File: 1349554583116.jpg-(35 KB, 310x232, 7ae.jpg)

>>21015781

Are you saying we don't like charts?

>>21015788
I just going through the FATAL book for inspiration. Not for subject matter, but for unbridled obsession with charts.

>>21015803

Might be enough Dakka, I mean charts.

Charts of Dakka. Dakkacharts?

Have any of you thought about using weapon creation charts from an old, free RPG called S.A.V.A.G.E?

And, while we're at it, does any of you guys know whether or not it can still be found on the internet? I only have the printed-out version...

File: 1349556168588.png-(12 KB, 409x612, BL2 loot table.png)

Let's start making the loot tables, since that will be the most complicated bit.

I figure this is a good layout for opening loot chests.

File: 1349556451790.jpg-(58 KB, 743x586, Rakkglider.jpg)

>>21011689
You cant be a midget riding a rakk in Fallout. Also, Borderlands is far from a post-Apocalyptic setting, so comparing the two is kinda hilarious.

>>21016110
Well, it could *be* a post-apocalpytic setting, since humanity spans three galaxies in-universe.
But from a practical standpoint - it's a planet of psychopaths, mutants, rednecks and aliens, check one or more. Post-apocalypse was made for this shit.

>>21016062

So you wanna just go down the line and say which manufacturers can make what item?

Sadly, there is no article on the BL wiki about Relics, but I presume they are all "Eridian" manufactured. This also means that I don't think there's a reliable source for Relics, so what options they all have may have to wait until later.

>>21016161
>since humanity spans three galaxies in-universe.
Six, actually.
>But from a practical standpoint - it's a planet of psychopaths, mutants, rednecks and aliens, check one or more. Post-apocalypse was made for this shit.
The difference is all these murderous freaks are funded by multi-billion dollar corporations with state of the art guns and grenades and all sorts of other hilarity. Its kind of like a post-apocalyptic setting wrapped inside a post-scarcity setting, taking the best bits of both for maximum shooty fun.

oh look it's this thread again

>>21016207

>Its kind of like a post-apocalyptic setting wrapped inside a post-scarcity setting, taking the best bits of both for maximum shooty fun.

It's like if orks had capitalism and megacorps.

So a lot of the loot that drops in Borderlands is really just vendor trash, and rolling up complete stats for every bandit pistol is a huge waste of time.

Before we even figure out what kind of item is dropping there should be some kind of roll to determine whether or not it's going to be remotely worthwhile, and if it isn't just substitute the weapon drop for cash. I always want a way to sell items right off the ground anyway. We have teleporters, how hard could it be?

So a big part of this is going to be item level, or whatever the equivalent behind the scenes number in BL is that ensures a level 5 skag doesn't drop a gun you'd be envious of at level 30. Specifically, do gun types have some simple scaling algorithm, or will there be different tables for different item levels?

>>21016269
>It's like if orks had capitalism and megacorps.

But then they okkupy WAAAGHstreet?

>>21016297
There could be a %chance of any loot found being just vendor trash.

>>21016319
Yes.
Okkupy would be bandits and resistance movements and WAAAGHstreet would be Pandora.

One of the fundamental problems with tabletopping borderlands is that the random gun aspects are so insanely minute and fractional that rolling for them wouldn't quite work.

Instead, I'd suggest something a little bit more direct for the various stats that make up a gun, with the ranges on these stats being determined by the level of the gun as well as what type of gun.

For instance, Reload speed, instead of being some sort of 2.4 or 6.7 or whatever, have it be a certain amount of 'actions'

I'm thinking of this like an action point system where all players have a limited amount of points for each turn to spend.

So, for reload speed, you'd have it be a flat amount of action points. Quick reloading guns like pistol or Tediore style grenade exploders would only take 1 or 2 action points and be related accordingly with something like "Reload Speed: 2" while heavier or bigger guns like Rocket Launchers and Sniper Rifles might be "Reload Speed: 5"

A majority of the stats could stay within the same range without being a huge inconvenience, as all you really need to increase would be damage and elemental damage, which would make randomly rolling weapons a lot easier.

>>21016297
It's scaled by level of the baddy. Nothing in either game dropped a piece of gear with a higher level than itself.

File: 1349557730465.jpg-(15 KB, 800x137, waaghstreet.jpg)

>>21016340

pic related

>>21016322
But high level vendor trash might still be a good item for a lower level character. Is that something we try to accommodate for?

>>21016347
We talked about this in the last thread. Some people were thinking about just using the DH turn with either two half actions or one full one. It doesn't have quite as much granularity as ticks, but it's a lot simpler and burst fire rules would still give you a lot of options for fire rate even if reload and swap speeds suffer.

>>21016356
Yes. Which means you either need different tables for different level ranges or you need to know how items scale.

>>21016394
Well, I'm always in favor of creating something new instead of going through the painful process of trying to make another system's mechanics make sense in the context of a wildly different setting.

>>21016297
>>21016322

Well, the percentile chance of weapon value is probably appropriate for rewards for killing enemies. something like a 60 or 70 of it just translating to more money (to buy more guns) and only if the percentage you roll is high do you actually generate the gun appropriate to level. Level-appropriate loot chests should probably always be rolled, even if they don't do better in every area, most guns of the same level have some pros or cons over another.

How we handle this in a tabletop game, I'm not sure. It assumes we're using a level based system to scale. Personally, I like the DH-hack method, so I'd just add some blanket bonuses that scale with the character's Rank.

>>21016394
>>21016347

Going from that 40k RPG style, those weapons already have Reload times, usually in the form of 1 or 2 full actions (IE, full rounds of combat) with high rates being 3 or 4. I'd go with something like a Tediore or a quick-reloading SMG/Repeater being something like 1Full or even a Half in very good cases, and larger weapons 2 or 3 Full depending on type and manufacture. This balances with magazine size, as well. Even if your reload time is 1 Full action, if you only hold two shots (And you fire both each attack) you can only attack every other round with that gun.

>>21016445
>mechanics for shooting guns
>won't make sense in the context of a wildly different setting.

Besides, the system under consideration is basically what you're proposing except simplified down a narrower band of costs (Around the 0-4 range, probably). I'm usually in favor of not re-inventing the wheel, especially when your engineering team is 4chan.

>>21016445

I'm of the school of thought of getting things done.

I'm all for homebrewing if you really can't find anything to match what your looking for or need unique mechanics that badly, but I think the 40k RPGs have enough existent elements leaning toward a BL RPG (Like RoF, Reload, Weapon qualities and upgrades and damage types) that I'd prefer to just pull out all the elements that do or can work that have actually been professionally written and tested and adjust from there rather than reinvent the wheel whole cloth and hope we all come to an agreement. (Or worse, it's one guy's creative baby, and it takes forever to get everything done.)

>>21016544
To be fair, the way some BL guns work is pretty redonkulous to the point the word redonkulous is not a ridiculous word to describe them. TK Wave or Hot Button Bane, anyone?

File: 1349558720798.png-(44 KB, 1885x279, Capture.png)

I don't even know how to use excel, so don't expect miracles out of googledocs.

>>21016577

Unique accessory rules.

>>21016579
>Atlas
>no S&S
Both gone or both in.

>>21016579
Cash, ammo, and healing items need to be added. The really big important part though is determining the drop rates of different components.

>>21016673

But S&S has the same shtick as Bandit. And way less charm.

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>>21016673
I already added it, but thanks.
>>21016681
That's a fair point, but in my defense the prolific little containers are how those are provided in game.

Guesstimating at ammo quantities, assuming 1-2 minor drops for a mook, 1 major and 2 minor for a threat, and 2 major for a badass (plus a gun). Scale up for more players, scale down to increase deadliness.

>>21016695
Bandit actually replaced S&S's functions entirely. Atlas doesn't exist anymore, assuming some sort of massive bankruptcy that caused a company that was EVERYWHERE disappear immediately within two years. Also:
>implying either S&S or Bandit have the charm of a VLADOF firearm
Do you even repel your oppressors?
>>21016579
There are grenade launcher type assault rifles. Literally, they shoot little bouncing ball grenades. You can recognize them in BL2 because they have that massive cannonlike barrel, and go for about four times the usual price of an assault rifle that part of the game.

>>21015544

We might want to have a couple different default component profiles for each type of weapon. We'll need a die roll with a pretty big range to determine what drops anyway (since pistols are far more frequent than rocket launchers or relics), so instead of having the 30-45 range on d% be an SMG or whatever, we could break that up into three or four different standard SMG component loadouts and only roll up the components that are going to be exciting.

So the very first roll could be, for example, whether or not you're getting cash, ammo, health, or a gun with between zero and ten above average components. After you figure that out you roll on the big table of gun types for the basic profile, then roll up the appropriate number of fancy components.

>>21016838
Bandit weapons have shit for accuracy but seem to turn up with blades more often. I'm just trying to cover all bases. Also, a company going out of business *might* actually justify their products disappearing - the templates are discontinued by whoever bought the rights, so your next New-U spawns without that gun, since the machine can't churn out a new one.

That'd qualify as 'functions differently'.
>still waiting on my gun that shoots flaming rocket midget bees

>>21016838

Oh, Vladof has it's appeal. But a Rarez Horrorshow is no Bulets Go Fasterified Acurate smgg

>>21015947

I can't seem to find it, so scans of such content would be great.

>>21016579
>Iron Sight
>?!?
>I don't know, ask /k/.

I'm not even from /k/, and I can tell you that it should go No sight>Iron Sight>Laser pointer sight>Reflex sight>Sniper scope>Video scope(like a scope, but not a tube).

Also, just put Bandit/S&S, because one replaced the other.

>Large Item
>Something other than a Rocket Launcher
>Borderlands

Just have it be higher-ranked versions of smaller items. Like, instead of a green-rare, it's a blue-rare, or instead of a blue-rare, it's an orange-rare.

Also, Scopes would have different occurrence rate item to item. Sniper rifles, with the exclusion of unique items, always have a traditional scope sight, at least, where as pistols probably have a more even distribution between them all.

>>21017248
I would say it goes sniper>pistol>rifle=rockets>SMGs>shotguns

Just guesswork and asspulling, though.
Brick is best Vault hunter
>Slab strong

>>21017248
Maybe sniper rifles would just have a rule where after you roll on the scope table you advance the result up until you're at a scope that's better than reflex? It would be nice if we didn't need different component tables for each type of weapon.

>>21017193
One more thing.

The best way I've seen for handling variable loot uses multiple tables.

Start with one that tells you how many items are inside the chest, move on to one that gives you what level they are, compared to your level, then one that tells you the base kind of item from the level of it.

Then there's a different table for each kind of item that determines the manufacturer, barrel, magazine, etc.

One MORE thing. Borderlands 2 has a derivative of Eridian weapons, E-Tech. They fire multiple bullets at a time, converting them into energy. I'm pretty sure it's a barrel type.

File: 1349562200098.png-(47 KB, 1855x293, Capture.png)

>>21017193
Meh, someone somewhere probably wants a high-capacity gun that isn't cobbled together out of a dildo and a remote-control car. Leave it off if you want. I haven't even assigned percentages or anything, because I don't really see anyone actually building a system for this, just adapting whatever they think fits best.

Along the same lines, if it wasn't already obvious, I'm assuming that folks know which tables to use to suit manufacturer (ie Jakobs Sniper Rifle is always single shot, Maliwan gets an element but never), with any noncompatible result meaning you begin again (Pangolin Rocket Launcher? Not on my watch!), because ROLLAN GAEMZ.

Also, I left off health pickups because they're just "Oh you're dying? Here's one or three, pull yourself together," which translates to GM fiat pretty much perfectly.

>>21017364
The problem with that is that it's LOADSACHARTS.
I'm occasionally alt-tabbing to monitor the thread/adjust the chart, but frankly I'm not invested enough to make the necessary number of charts and probabilities. Then the 'what system to use' issue raises its head like dread Cthulhu and I just fuck off to somewhere landlocked.

>>21017407

Eh, that's fine. Judging by this and thread and the last one, there's enough interest here to probably make a srs bznz BL hack or homebrew with full charts and other complex elements.

Building a simply framework for people to work from (or stop at if they don't have any reason to go further) is progress, at least.

>>21017407
So, let's get the system hammered out and go from there.

Hell, some people already mentioned some systems that they think might work. If you people are still in this thread, or if anyone else has any ideas for it, can we get a list of pros and cons of using that system for this?

Just, like, what works, what doesn't, what needs to be changed, mandatory alternate rules, that sort of thing.

I was just watching this thread and feel like a dick for not contributing. Have some music to help set the atmosphere http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P1QUZzeZoPQ

>>21017456

Well, the 40k RPGs (Dark Heresy, Rogue Trader, Deathwatch et al.) are a pretty standard percentile system, and being based on 40k, they have robust weapon rules already, which include a lot of the stuff mentioned above like Rate of Fire and Reload speed rules. It also has a class system (But not really a level system in the truest sense of the word) with talents for classes, a fair number of which could probably be given to a borderlands game without having to make them all up. It also has a decent history of random tables itself, and it's critical damage charts (Which involve results like your bone marrow boiling so that your femur explodes like a grenade) are completely in tone with Borderlands.

I'm not sure of any intrinsic "won't works" things, other than that you'll just have to ignore all the setting stuff, but looking at it there are probably some approaches to a hack which would have less than optimal results.

>>21017613

On the other hand, homebrews have the advantage that you can build and tailor all your mechanics perfectly to your design goals. Conversely, however, they require WAY more work to even get to a testable version and moreso to make a complete playable result which will address most issues and areas of play.

>>21017456
I suggested the SR4 firearm combat rules in the last thread, but mostly as something that could be easily attached to Dark Heresy for a little bit more weapon variability (since the combat turns are very similar.)

The upside is that you'd get rules for guns with five different rates of fire from single shot to something called hyper velocity, a bunch of ammo types, and an entire chapter on gun modifications in the Arsenal splat to use as a starting point.

The downside is that some of the rules in SR4 are kind of wonky, even if you try to keep it to the guns. The burst fire rules, for example, don't really make a lot of sense compared to the GURPS or DH method and we'd probably scrap initiative passes in favor of faster guns or extra free actions to shoot with.

I pretty much completely agree with using DH or some other FFG 40k game as the core system (mostly because it seems relatively straightforward to translate the skill trees into that advancement system), but SR4 has a lot of little mechanics we can probably poach.

>>21017659
I think the heart and soul of this project is going to be on the "what are you shooting them with" end of things, so we'll some wiggle room in deciding how you roll to shoot. Some mechanics will still be better than others, but DH seems like a pretty good place to start.

>>21017613
Enough people have suggested or commented on that in previous threads that it seems like the way to go; I'm not familiar enough with anything 40k to comment.
I can leave you with the links I was glancing over while I sketched out the table, though:
http://borderlands.wikia.com/wiki/Manufacturer
The wiki has an immense quantity of information; the BL2 sections are still patchwork in places but will probably improve over time.
http://blmodding.wikidot.com/manufacturers
The modding wiki has all the parts, details etc. for Borderlands 1. Has its uses for broad strokes, but particularly valuable for people who want to get intricate, since this is the meat of BL guns' how and why.

>>21017827

Short version, BL1 is:

Atlas - Above-average balanced attributes.
Dahl - High recoil reduction.
Eridians - Energy-based alien weapons, with no reload, only a recharge time (giving them infinite ammo).
Hyperion - Highest accuracy, good recoil reduction, marginally increased damage.
Jakobs - Highest damage, lowest rate of fire, heavy recoil, non-elemental.
Maliwan - Elemental weapons only, highest tech.
S&S Munitions - Highest magazine capacity, high tech.
Tediore - Fastest reload speed, mediocre overall stats, ammo regeneration.
Torgue - High damage, decreased accuracy and heavy recoil.
Vladof - Highest rate of fire.

BL2 is:

Bandit: Big magazines
Dahl: Burst fire when aiming down sights
Hyperion: Negative recoil, gets more accurate as you fire
Jakobs: Semi-auto old west style, most damage per bullet, never elemental
Maliwan: Always elemental
Tediore: Quick reload time, throw like a grenade when you reload them.
Torgue: Every gun shoots gyrojets instead of bullets, causing explosions
Vladof: Rate of fire rate of fire rate of fire rate of fire.

So after looking at some of these charts, how about a big master d% gun generation table that looks something like...

1/manufacturer Rocket Launchers (5 total)
2/m Sniper Rifles per (10 total)
3/m Assault Rifles, Shotguns, and SMGs (15 each, 45 total)
5/m Pistols (40 total) (Is this too many? We could drop it down to 32 and give each weapon an extra entry for a preferred manufacturer. Or make rarer Atlas/Gearbox items)

So with a single roll you'll find out what kind of gun you get, who makes it, and what its default components are in case you're not rolling for each of them.

>>21018409
That sounds pretty good.
Now all we need is a drawfag to make a pretty-looking chart.

All Im saying is that midget better be a modifier you can attach to your class. Even if all it does is make absolutely everything worse though logically it should increase your speed and ability to dodge, I want it as a class option.

>>21017035
>>21015947

Any news on the S.A.V.A.G.E rpg? Google fu gives me nothing.

File: 1349574640348.png-(49 KB, 311x853, Base Gun Table.png)

>>21018615
That is... a lot of pistols.

Also, it's a lot of Maliwan guns. Right now all the manufacturers are equally likely, and I'm not sure if that's actually the case.

>>21020156

Technically, I think they are. In BL2, with the exception of Pistols (made by all manufacturers) each class of weapon is only made by 5 of them. Looks like this:

Assault Rifles (Dahl, Bandit, Jakobs, Torgue, Vladof)
Launchers (Bandit, Maliwan, Tediore, Torgue, Vladof)
Shotguns (Bandit, Hyperion, Jakobs, Tediore, Torgue)
SMGs (Dahl, Bandit, Hyperion, Maliwan, Tediore)
Sniper Rifles (Dahl, Hyperion, Jakobs, Maliwan, Vladof)

>>21020209
Dont forget all the different types of shotguns. A Bandit rum kleener shotgun is way different from a Bandit longy rangy shooty shotgun

>>21020243

Well, that would be what the difference is between Bandit Shotgun A and Bandit Shotgun B on the table is, I presume.

>>21020286
I was mainly just in awe at how much fun BL2 is and not really making any observations towards the system, sorry. I am glad you included that, though.

>>21020209
That's the breakdown I used to make the table. It doesn't necessarily mean that manufacturers are uniformly distributed across each type of weapon, though. Jakobs snipers could be more common than Maliwans, for example.

>>21020243
The way I'm picturing it, after you roll on the d% table you'd make some number additional rolls for extra special components. And even if you're only swapping one or two components, there are three or more basic versions of most weapons for each manufacturer so even two mostly vanilla Hyperion SMGs should be different.

>>21020301

Honestly, that's probably pretty good. It allows GMs to find generic guns for vendors to sell, or for enemies to use/drop. They can just pick a base weapon and if they want either randomly generate a bonus element, or they can just say this is a Dahl SMG. Aaaaaand it does shock damage.

(Totally saved that wicked sweet chart for later use, BTW)

Archived thread for posterity.

This game must have midgets. Lots of them. Everywhere.

>>21020815
Seems to be a bit dry for archival. What did you deem archive-worthy?

>>21026760

Well, somebody archived the last one, and this one has at least as much actual on a borderlands game.

Also, tables.

>>21017882
>new Torgue: BOLTERS
I have to play this game!

>>21026923

Torgue fires bolt rounds, but their aesthetics are kind of orky. Giant barrels, racing stripes and danger signs, with names like Hole Puncher or Bangstick.

Only thing orkier could be Bandit guns, which have giant magazines and are held together by duct tape and dreams. And have names like Zooka! and Smig