People tried that already with Pancake edition. Just look how many people are playing that.

>>20855753
Pancake edition?

>>20855773
There was a set of rules that claimed to be a leaked playtest of 6th edition that found their way onto the internet. It got the name 'Pancake Edition' as the password for the file was 'Pancake'.

Nevertheless, it can be hard enough to get a single gaming group to agree on a couple of house rules. Trying to put together a complete homebrew ruleset that most people will be happy with and use over the actual official rules is going to be next to impossible. Most people would rather play with a set of rules they can take into a store or club and know they can use, rather than try to convince others to let them use a "no guys, it's totally balanced, really!" homebrew ruleset they made over the internet.

>>20855773
Exactly.

/tg/'s nid codex fix is pretty cool. Check it out on 1d4chan.

>>20855823
I don't know, I've met three people who've actually used the Angry Marines codex in games; and that's far from the only alternate ruleset for 40k to come out of /tg/; I have a little more hope for this than you do, but I don't pretend to think it'll be something easily accomplished.

I'll tack it up on my wall with the rest of my /tg/ projects to work on. But I'm mentioning it here because I'm a relative newcomer to the game and while I've been disappointed by GW I cannot fathom the let downs experienced by a fan of longer duration. I'd love to put something together that yeah, makes people happy. I don't believe that with all the talk of 3D printing and freeing ourselves from that aspect of GW's domination we can't take it all the way and make rules which reflects the tastes and desires of at least a certain slice of the fanbase.

I'd be up for it, writan parts of the Space Muhreen codex.

Also, only one codex per army. Because fairness.

>>20855918
Do you mean something like consolidating all the Marine chapters into one codex, and all Chaos factions into one codex, and give Guard more options for variants and stuff like that?

>FAN RULES
>40k

I chuckled. They never work

>>20855992
Pretty much. Daemons, Cultists, and Trater Muhreens get one codex, the SM (All of them, I'M LOOKING AT YOU SPACE WOLVES), the IG, The Eldar, the DEldar, etc get their own codexes.

File: 1348525663104.gif-(863 KB, 435x360, light don't give a fuck.gif)

Sounds interesting. Not sure how you'd actually get it balanced, I'm assuming that balancing so many armies in a game is harder than it looks to the outside observer. Balancing two armies is one thing, balancing everything 40K has to offer? I dunno.

>>20855711

Unless you can get around patent laws (read: Brazil)

You're not going to be re-writing anything.

All we need is a cheaper source of models, and no Mat Ward.

And I swear to fuck, a Sisters of Battle Update.

>>20855711

Because fans have more bias than ward and if I'm playing 6e 40k I can drive to another province and find a game

>>20855711
>why don't we just make an edition of 40K and Fantasy all our own

Because I'm not going to play with any shit tier /tg/ rules, and even if I wanted too I doubt I could convince anyone else.

>>20856056
If anyone could do it, /tg/ can. I want to believe. I truly do. But the fear that people might start falling off...we'd have to do it fast and hard, and make damn well sure it makes it through playtests.

>>20856067
I'm not sure we would need to if no one is making a profit off of it; simply a fan made version, even if it is in the spirit of telling the parent company to fuck off.

>>20856103
Then let's do it.

Let's get this shit running.

First topic. What needs balance first? Crunch wise. We can re-write fluff later.

Because;
>Eldar should have X, Y and double Z. Space Marines have nothing a cost a billion points.
>Yer fuk Space Marines
>FUKKIN XENOS SPESS STRONK
>HUUUUUURRR
>DUUUUUURRR

>>20856142
Good man, I was just typing out exactly this. Hopefully if we get some momentum, we'll pick up more people for the project Katamari-style.

>>20856142
For Spess Muhreenz:
Make Land Raiders worth the cost
Have actually usable bike units
Better HQ choices
For IG:
More tank types beyond Leman Russ
Make an infantry blob somewhat viable
More Command Choices
More CQC choices

Those are the two armies I'm best with.

Its easy to recognize bad rules. Its hard to write good rules. This is why this project will never succeed.

>>20856159

>First, an SoB update.

Please.

>>20856187
They are squatted. Next.

>>20856150
>implying

>>20856187
We are doing this. It's for the good of all mankind.

>>20856184
For IG I really liked how there were rules for customization in the last codex, which were reduced to certain unit choices in the new one.

The IG is the largest, most widespread and diverse fighting force in the entire galaxy; their rules need to reflect this.

For me, this means shitloads of light infantry. Fuck yeah Tanith First and Only.

>>20856201
Fuck that, we're bringing Squats back. And making them more than just Dwarves in SPAAAAACE

>>20856249

We need concrete examples and changes.

>>20856249
Yeah, we need more variety to make a bunch of different playstyles work. If you want to run light infantry with a few Hellhounds and Sentinals, go for it. If you wanna run a Catachan Helicopter company, go for it.

Actually, I'd like to see a lot of variety in every Codex. Make more than one of two lists viable. We can do it since we're folding all the not-necessary codexes together.

>>20856303

On a related note, I just got a nice Witchhunters codex off Ebay.

I guess we're focusing guard right now.

let's roll with that.

>tfw you love the hilarious 40k fluff but have no intention of ever playing the game

I kind of feel like a dick for some reason.

>>20856317
Alright then, Guard it is.

One of the biggest flaws I have with them is the lack of HQ's that are really viable besides a Command Squad. Maybe we could work on that, or maybe a few more vehicle units (Leman Russes are fine, but I want more than those and Hellhounds..)

>>20856184
What the FUCK do you want in Space Marine HQ choices?

>>20856338
Nobody at GW is starving and there are a lot of ways to give your money to them that aren't related to the tabletop game if you feel guilty (which I wouldn't).

>>20856352
Feeling guilty for those faggots? Yeah, no.
I mean knowing that I don't really have anything to give back to teegee despite browsing here all the time. Feels bad, man.
sage for off-topic

>>20856344

Predators?

>>20856345
Captains that aren't outclassed by librarians. Chapter masters that aren't captains+Orbital strike, hurrrrrrr.

>>20856386
Preds would work, maybe a Heavy Hellhound variant?

>>20856550
Probably.

Now we just need to figure out solid numbers.

>>20856479
For SM HQs I'd say...

Captain goes down by 10 points, re-give him his "give all SM with blah" his LD rule".

Chappies go down to 80 points. Reclusiarchs are 100

Libbie stay same cost, chief librarian option for a 3W model. Say...165 points? (includes epi upgrade)

Chapter Master +1WS and +1BS over normal captain. Increase LD buff range by blah". Maybe also give Warlord Trait Rerolls?

Tech marines go to 2W, Master of Forge goes to 3W

This is on top of my head, feel free to criticize

>>20856565
Alright, Pred can stay as-is, it's a pretty balanced tank. For the H Hellhound:
BS: 3 Armor Front: 13 Side: 12 Back: 10
Gear: Heavy Bolter, Heavy Flamer, Twin Linked Lascannons
Standard ?Upgrades
Cost: ????

>>20856601
keep elite techmarines at 1W. Have them be a "1 to 3 in a slot" deal. Maybe drop their price a bit

Give the MotF an upgraded version that hits 3 wounds. Maybe let him buff two ruins, or improve one twice as much

Also, have captains on bikes/jump packs/terminator armour unlock those units in troops, and take a corresponding command-squad

>>20856646
Actually Bike Captains already unlock bike troops

Jump Packs makes sense, However Termie troops imo should be limited to Chapter Master

>>20856338
Same feeling here. Tried to get into the game, but I love the IG and the cash just wasn't around. Shame really

>>20856703
Since the Marines are getting one Codex, why not just use the Dark Angels character for that?

>>20856703
>Termie troops imo should be limited to Chapter Master
why?

There is a captain of the 1st company. Chapter Masters are outside the normal hierarchy, and have command of the Honour Guard.

>>20856344
I think the IG would benefit from a light tank. Something between the Predator and a Russ. A cruiser tank to complement the Leman Russ used to line break. And a return to thudd guns and heavy mortars. Its not fair only the Kriegers getting them

>>20856774

Aren't terminator suits usually reserved for only first company, however?

I don't think a community made game can ever function properly for the same reason a true democracy would bankrupt itself.

That said it'd still be awesome if this works and I hope it does.

>>20856778
Arent Salamanders light tanks?

>>20856790

(read: every /tg/ created homebrew TTRPG ever.)

>>20856781
Yeah, and the 1st company has its own captain. The chapter master leads the entire chapter, he's a captain of captains. But he does tend to wear termie armour.
Here's an idea, the chapter master costs a hell of a lot, but he unlocks all options. If the Chapter Master has taken to the field the situation is pretty damn desperate

File: 1348529742381.png-(980 KB, 921x750, Screen shot 2012-09-24 at(...).png)

>>20856781
here's a handy diagram to show what I mean

/tg/ cannot into fan rules, accept it

>>20856778
This. Bring back the Leman Russ Conqueror.

>>20856781
Termies are all part of the First Company, along with Veterans, from what I remember. The 1st Company has a Captain, like all the other companies, and answers to the Chapter Master. I believe what he's saying is that you could have a 1st Company Captain as your HQ to get Termies as troops.

>>20856800
More recon tanks, more like half tracks really. But maybe with a bit of reworking it could make a tank destroyer model. Oh, and on the IG armour front, have the option to make a armoured company straight out of the codex

>>20856826
>But maybe with a bit of reworking it could make a tank destroyer model

but we already have the Destroyer Tank Hunter

But yea the Conquerer I guess is the LR "Light Tank"

>>20856826
You pretty much already can; command squad for HQ, and two minimal squads of vets as troops. Leaves you with a lot of points to spend on Sents, HellHounds, Lemans, Hydras, and Arty. And since IG tanks come with the option to takes squadrons, yeah.

>>20855711
I've been saying this is a great idea for years, and /tg/ just keeps passing it by.

I think the pancake edition did a damn good job at it, but building the game system from the ground up instead of re-using an existing broken system might be better.

>>20856836
I was thinking something cheaper. Like a modern style laser rapier or something. I don't know. Conquerors are good, just hard to justify them with the Lemans can shoot their ordnance on the move rule. Maybe less armour, or more vulnerable to crits in return for just plain being faster and being able to shoot and go flat out?

>>20856839
I was thinking more along the lines of an HQ choice that allows Hellhounds or our Line-Breakers as Troops...

>>20856843
Stat everything in Tomorrows War or Stargrunt


DONE

>since people clearly don't like the way Games Workshop is heading,

but i LOVE the way games workshop is heading.

>>20856889
How much are they paying you, exactly?

>>20856889
It makes a lovely whistling noise as it plows into the ground...

File: 1348530558499.gif-(1.82 MB, 302x240, 1346407255013.gif)

Not to be a party pooper, but I think we NEED to update anything that needs fixing in the main rules, and then fixing the codices based off of that.

Otherwise, we'll make revisions to codices, finally get around to the main book at some point, and end up needing even more edits to the just-edited codices to make them mesh with the rules.

That said, the Space marine revisions are valid and important, and we should keep them in mind for as soon as the main book is finished.

So, any Main BRB revisions, changes, or suggestions?

File: 1348530613023.jpg-(30 KB, 619x304, Jackie.jpg)

Hey Tg! I was messing around with this custom vehicle creator

>> http://www.ageofstrife.com/the-site/vdr-and-tdr-calculators-available-t646.html

I'm not a tabletop player and just made this vehicle for fun, thinking of what might have been good to put at it so excuse me if it's bad or retard. Opinions about this and what category/role it should be or if it's even viable? Note that this was made before 6th edition came out.

>>20856909
>someone disagrees with me
>they must be a paid lackey

>>20856911
>6th ed sales

yeah, nah they got more money than god.

>>20856949
They always make a ton of money when they release a new edition.

However, keeping that momentum once the "OOh Dark Vengeance" initial buzz dies off will be even harder now that they keep raising prices.

>>20856976

What's the current price on 15 IG?

>>20856938

I agree with this man.

>>20856938
This.
So much of this.

The question is where in the hell do we start?

>>20856976

if the quality of new releases stays where it is with the dark vengeance box and the new dinochaos, the prices are fine.

>>20856938

charge distance d6+4 instead of 2d6.

>>20857001

Basics, Basics, Basics. See what is in sixth edition and test it, then return with results. We should just have emails back and forth.

>>20856938
My thoughts:
---Scenarios need to be changed. The "My Heavy Support/Fast Attack is scoring!" is okay, but a wider array of scenarios would be nice.

---Victory points need to be improved, and preferably based on the value of the model and not a flat "1 per squad" rate.

---Warlord traits need to be selectable, and a wider variety would be very, very nice

---If we're rewriting the BRB, better layout for some rules would be great. It's fucking ridiculous that the Wall of Fire or whatever it is for Templates on Overwatch is only found in the CC rules and not the weapon rules (Or vice versa. Either way, it should be in both for convenience)

---TLOS; Keep or go? I honestly don't have experience with abstracted LOS, so I have no idea if this needs to be changed or not, but I know it's a point of contention.

we might as well start with updating a weapon even if it is something small. Here is an improvement i feel should be made.
Shotgun:
current stats: R 12" S 3 AP - Assault 2
new stats: R 12" S 1 AP 1 Assault 2
For IG Veteran Sargent instead of being free it could cost 5 points.

>>20857066
Basics first, specifics later.

Basic Rules > IG > SoB > Everything Else

>>20857066

S1 AP1? That's not like a shotgun. That's more like trying to drill a hole in terminator armor with a adamantium sewing needle.

>>20857082
i always thought S was something that was good at pounding through vehicle armor while AP was something that could rip infantry in half/blow into large pieces. A shotgun could fit that roll

>>20857066
>S1 AP1

Wow /tg/ is terrible at rules

>>20857113
i think a shotgun should have at least AP1, it's not meant for taking out vehicles. What would you make the stats

>>20857100
Noob here, feel free to correct me if I'm wrong with this.

Strength is a measure of how good something is at damaging other things, armor notwithstanding. The higher the strength, the more oomph it's got in its paloomph. A Bolter is S4, Plasma is S7/8 (don't remember).

AP is a measure of Armor Penetration. As a rule of thumb, an attack ignores armor saves that are equal to or higher than its AP. As you can imagine, AP1 is the most massive penetration possible. An Orbital Bombardment is AP1. A Lascannon is AP2.

S1 AP1 is a very weak attack that ignores almost any armor.

>>20857100

S is Brute force and general power
S1=a somewhat painful punch
S3=full strength of a soldier with a bayonet, or the strength of an assault rifle
S4=Extreme strength
S6=Monstrous strength
S8=massive explosion Strength
S9=Carnifex Strength
S10=railgun firing its projectile at half the speed of light

AP=Sharpness and the ability to ignore armor
AP-: Lethal, but armor was designed to stop it
AP6: Probably able to punch through a thick wall or two with no problem
AP5: Able to punch through armor
AP4: Able to punch through pretty much anything
AP3: Distortion Field/Anti-tank missile level AP, can punch through ceramite power armor
AP2: Anti-materiel weapon level AP
AP1: You just got vaporized

So anti-vehicle proficiency is kinda split between Strength and AP. That's how I see it at least, it's not the most realistic system, but whatever.

>>20857131
Unless it's using special ammo, like Expanders, Inferno, Manstoppers, or whatever, a shotgun fires a spray if pellets or a solid slug. They're basic, low-tech weapons, pretty simple in design and somewhat crude in application.

You're suggesting that a simple slugthrower should be able to penetrate Terminator Armour, or the hide of a Tyrannofex. Think about that for a moment.

Shotguns might not be great, but their rules fairly accurately represent what they're capable of. At most, bring them all up to st4 like the shotguns SM Scouts carry.

>>20857028
That's a good idea, maybe a Google doc with all this in it?
>>20857066
Wow. I'm losing faith in the project already.

Yea I agree that Shotguns as S4 AP- is decent enough

Hell maybe make it AP5 or AP4 at extremely close quarters

>>20857174

Make it so.

>>20857203
>Hell maybe make it AP5 or AP4 at extremely close quarters

In which case you're verging on Bolter territory. It doesn't need AP4; a global boost up to st4 would be quite sufficiant.

>>20857203
that sounds good

>>20857206
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1H9BSZAMNLNupOgwFLyWrCNrb1uBG3j_9XbopwhAES_4/edit

BEHOLD

>>20857226

I agree. S4 would mean incredible stopping power in close quarters, since it's a Shotgun. The AP needs to remain -, though, since whichever way you look at it, you're shooting small round pellets that aren't designed to pierce vehicle armor or anything.

I have seen such weird house rules

I have seen a space marine dex that literally gave you the option to MAKE A CAPTAIN OF ANY OF THE 10 COMPANIES OF A CHAPTER

>>20857259
S is for taking out vehicles, which is not the point of a shotgun

>>20857131

Which rules have you been reading? armor penetration rules work different depending on the game system. In 40k, AP of X means "ignore armor saves of X or worse". AP2 and AP1 weapons also have a higher chance of causing a vehicle to explode. So an AP3 weapon ignores power armor(a 3+ save). And AP2 weapon ignores terminator armor(a 2+ save) AND power armor, and has a higher chances of immobilizing/insta-killing a vehicle.

File: 1348532706419.png-(116 KB, 809x609, 1295412037763.png)

I GOT IT

Shotguns should be like boltguns, give it more ammo types

>MFW 10 pages of ammo types for guns

>>20857275
What are you trying to say? S4 is only capable of taking out the lightest of vehicles, and even then only if you shove ten of them right up the tailpipe.

S4 is balanced for a Shotgun.

>>20857275
Does /tg/ even PLAY 40K? I'm very new to the game, and this is still incredibly basic: S4 is about as strong as a Bolter, and low AP would make sense.
Was this different in something earlier than 6e?

>>20857275

S is not just for taking out vehicles.
4S vs 3S means a powerful infantry weapon vs a weaker infantry weapon. The Boltgun is S4, and it's not an anti-vehicle weapon either.

It's only weapons of really high Strength and sometimes AP added on that are "anti-vehicle weapons". S4 is like a 50 caliber weapon: it might damage a light vehicle, but that's not its only purpose, it also gibs infantry like none other. A shotgun gibs infantry in close combat, and so should be S4.

>>20857304
No, he's just a rather retarded neckbeard who thinks he's trolling

File: 1348532968796.jpg-(37 KB, 638x323, 1247594697199.jpg)

>/tg/
>trying to fix a game

>>20857330
Oh good. I can never tell if someone's just referencing an older edition or just a fucktard.

>>20857304
That anon's probably trolling to kill the project. It's working, too, because having agreed that the first thing to do is to work out the main rules, /tg/ is now discussing the exact stats for a shotgun with someone who apparently has no clue about the rules in the first place.

Anyway, main rules, people! I say give 40k alternate activation already. That turn structure is ooooold.

>>20857344
Agreed

Maybe its me but I like "unit per unit" activation

File: 1348533144724.jpg-(8 KB, 250x104, indegtx.jpg)

WE WILL SUE YOU WE WILL SUE YOU WE WILL SUE YOU WE WILL SUE YOU WE WILL SUE YOU WE WILL SUE YOU WE WILL SUE YOU WE WILL SUE YOU WE WILL SUE YOU WE WILL SUE YOU WE WILL SUE YOU WE WILL SUE YOU WE WILL SUE YOU WE WILL SUE YOU WE WILL SUE YOU WE WILL SUE YOU WE WILL SUE YOU WE WILL SUE YOU WE WILL SUE YOU WE WILL SUE YOU WE WILL SUE YOU WE WILL SUE YOU WE WILL SUE YOU WE WILL SUE YOU WE WILL SUE YOU WE WILL SUE YOU WE WILL SUE YOU WE WILL SUE YOU WE WILL SUE YOU WE WILL SUE YOU WE WILL SUE YOU WE WILL SUE YOU WE WILL SUE YOU WE WILL SUE YOU WE WILL SUE YOU WE WILL SUE YOU WE WILL SUE YOU WE WILL SUE YOU WE WILL SUE YOU WE WILL SUE YOU WE WILL SUE YOU WE WILL SUE YOU

>>20857344

I'd be down for an alternate activation ruleset for 40k. It might work for skirmish games or whatnot. Diving behind cover etc. would be cool.

>>20857344
How about this:

Every unit's Initiative stat determines where it goes in the turn order. If two units have the same Int, it's the roll of a D6 to decide which one goes first.

>>20857376

>suddenly, Genestealers are the master race of 40k

>>20857370
might be easier to work with 2nd edition base rules (and points) if you're going down that route.

>>20857344
How would alternating activations work? Would a unit activate, and take its move-shoot-assault, or would you maintain the move-shoot-assault turn structure and have each unit activate once per phase?

If a unit takes all its actions at one, it would be easy for assault units to deny an enemy unit their movement and shooting for the turn, skewing the balance heavily in favor of fast assaulty armies.

If each phase has all units getting an activation, the game will take FOREVER to play.

ATTENTION.

Also, where the fuck do I find pewter sisters of battle.

>>20857363
Did they sue "In the name of the Emperor"?

No?

Hmm funny

>>20857419
Ebay

>>20857419
ebay derp

>>20857410
To further complicate matters, would a Transport vehicle and their passengers be one activation, or two?

>>20857457
Which further exacerbates the problem of Assault units denying enemy units their activation, by rushing forward in Open Topped/Assault vehicle transports.

Also, when would the Fight sub-phase occur? Would a separate Fight sub-phase happen during the assault phase of each unit's activation? Or just once at the very end of the game turn? With either solution, close combat either becomes waaaay too fast-paced compared to shooting, or you just slowed CC to a crawl by cutting the number of Fight phases in half.

It seems to me that adding activations causes so many balance issues that you would essentially be writing a whole new game system, as opposed to fixing the existing one.

>>20857524
Could just copy 2nd ed Epic rules. At the start of the turn, the players give each unit a face-down counter with 'first fire', 'advance', 'charge' on. Then flip the counters over. First all the units with 'first fire' get to fire, without moving- alternate activation. Then comes advance- single move, single shot. Then comes charge- double move and assault.

Within 'first fire', 'advance', and 'charge' sections, alternate activation.

Your last point is true. But then... why not just play Pancake?

>>20857344
>alternate activation
What exactly does that mean?

>>20857524

Yeah, I deleted my post: I think they should probably activate separately right now.

>>20857596
Should say that each unit obviously only gets one counter, so the number of activations stays the same.

>>20857604
Instead of moving, shooting, assaulting the whole army in one go, you activate each unit in turn. Player A activates a squad, moves and fires them, Player B activates a squad, moves and fires, then back to Player A. More dynamic than the standard 40k rules because you get to respond to what your opponent's doing.

>>20857661
Or you can activate, shoot, then move. If you're not hamstrung by the turn structure you can have all kinds of crazy tactical fun.

Hey, has anyone ever walked into a GW with a suitcase and pull out, like, fifteen hundred points of papercraft crisis suits and be like, lets do this fuckers?

Guys, look at the google doc. We're discussing good shit.

Bump.

>>20857708
I think you'd give the resident blackshirts an aneurysm with that.

>>20858205
Another bump, also,
Who?

>>20858299
>blackshirts
GW management, if I remember correctly.

>>20858299
Blackshirts: GW Employees.

Also, I'd be happy to do those papercraft crisis suits vs my papercraft tyranids.

>>20858320

Ah. Now join the google docs, we're getting shit done.

>>20858351
Me? I'm a noob, I don't know shit about what's balanced against what.

>>20858360
GOOD

Honestly, just look at a model we're talking about, and visually guess how powerful he seems like he should be. It'll help get us out of any ruts about "This guy has stats like X because he always has" vs "This guy seems like he should probably have stats like Y because his figure/description seems to indicate those abilities"

>>20858335

Our work is for the emprah.

GW might as well represent chaos now.

File: 1348540455445.png-(101 KB, 610x263, 1347550734767.png)

Oh god... I fell asleep at my computer, I didn't think this would go anywhere today.

I wake up and there's a google docs discussion list...

I love you /tg/.
Tomorrow I'm taking this to my friends who've got the rulebooks going back a couple editions and talk with them about it. We're gonna do it, we're gonna get shit done.

Can we throw a pure Kroot Merc list in there too? Theres plenty of non-tau associated Kroot in the fluff out there, and Ive got a hard for playing pure kroot. Been working on my own, drawing from other homebrew codices out on the inter webs.

>>20858828
Yes, but we should also stat some other auxiliaries for the Tau, like the Demiurg and Humans and that psyker race they have.

>>20858874

I'm on it.

Demiurg will have a codex by some time next week.

>>20858874
I think a general "Mercenary Allies" list would be good
Toss in Demiurg, Gue'vesa, Hrud, Genestealer cults, etc into it. Make them allied with everyone, except maybe nids (Save Genestealer cults, of course)

Don't forget too that we can fix the wtf allies matrix! (Since I dunno about you, but I liked allies being a totally tournament-allowed choice)

>>20858915
Oh god the allies list needs to be fixed so much.

>>20858941
And so it shall be.

>>20859039

Bump. More interested parties would be nice.

Since this thread has a Tau image, can anyone tell me how to handle Broadside units when I play against Tau?

I am playing codex marines. I've got some predators, rifle dreads, and a drop pod of Sternguard. Am I supposed to just drop my Sternguard on them and pray?

>>20857708

There are papercraft Crisis suits? Could I have a PDF of this shit?

>>20859194
Toss something to tarpit them in melee ASAP. A pod with assault marines would probably work fine.

ON topic, does anyone else have general suggestions for the BRB or overall rules or structure for the game?

>>20859194
Plasma. All of the plasma.

Or lascannon sniping, or vindicator blasts. Or anything else that is ap2.

>>20859194

Basically, yes. If you get something into CC with broadsides then the broadsides are done for the rest of the game, so consider getting something cheap and expendable like scouts to infiltrate near the broadsides and get into CC early.

>>20857708
>>20859209

How many Crisis suits would I be able to fit into a 1500 point army? (Is that the amount of points people play with these days?)

I basically want to have the maximum number of crisis suits and only crisis suits. I love the fuckers and am thinking this would be a great way to play 40k.

>>20859240

Just remembered I'll need to take at least two units of Fire Warriors in Devil Fish. Can they be deepstriked?

>>20859229

>Drop pod

>How I wish sisters could use them.

I use the /tg/ nid dex from 1d4 chan. Struggle on guys, your work is never in vain!

Bump

So, anyone else have suggestions for changes to make for the WH40K BRB or codices?

Editing is going on here:
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1H9BSZAMNLNupOgwFLyWrCNrb1uBG3j_9XbopwhAES_4/edit
Join the fun!

Teegee: Getting Shit Done since Emprah knows when

>>20859407
In a nutshell so far, we have outlines for
--Points costs based on actual effectiveness instead of arbitrary values
--2d6 based vehicle damage chart
--Exploding dice!
--Changes to WS vs WS system to resemble S vs T table
--Chaos Demons cause wounds that can only be saved with Ld checks. Certain daemons have AP for an LD values
--Base Ld value downshifted to 6. The grimdark future is a scary, scary place

>>20859396

I use the 1d4chan tactic articles to learn pretty much all the armies. I use them as a base (though sometimes I disagree with a few of their options since they either overstate/understate or describe them as fun/viable when they're really not) and go from there when it comes to info searching.

>>20859501

I thought we decided on 7?

>>20859540
My bad. I thought people had reached general consensus on 6. I'll bring it up on the google doc

>>20859501
>Exploding dice

>Jacking Spartan Games' Swagger

File: 1348545389001.jpg-(49 KB, 324x297, 1344754812502.jpg)

I am going to playtest this so hard.

>>20859601
Is that... OGLAF?

Heheheh... good times.

>>20859601

They said we would fail. They said it wouldn't work. And yet we are discussing this. Shit is getting done.

>>20859650

Now now, we're still only in discussions. The biggest challenge is getting it all working, then after that the HUGE challenge is convincing people to play it.

Now you'll have to excuse me. My fire alarm just went off.

>>20859650
So long as it doesn't end with a pretentious prick-prince with a bunch of hunting dogs ripping it apart.

Seriously, though, I'd love to see this happen.

>>20859671

What are you referring to?

>>20859684

This most liekly >>20859601

File: 1348546123845.jpg-(77 KB, 700x465, 45636_gallery.jpg)

>>20859667
Playtesting over vassal. Fuck year.

>>20859650
>4 months later

Hey remember that project? What project?

File: 1348546278065.png-(123 KB, 281x700, 1347984196190.png)

>>20859705

>>20859684
This. http://www.oglaf.com/goldensongbird/1/

Warning, though, this webcomic is kinda NSFW. It isn't really an ero-comic, though, it's just got a lot of nudity and/or some sexing.

>>20859738

I already love it.

Anyways, another bump for glory.

>>20859932
Double bump for more glory!

And yes, it is a great webcomic. Not many webcomics manage to make me consistently laugh, but Oglaf succeeds with spades. Some people just can't get over the crude humor, though.

Oh, Emperor save me. This project needs to be kept alive, and I will not be caught diverting the topic to Oglaf!

>>20860015
We have a couple rough outlines for major points of change. Anyone, though, please state anything you ever disliked rules-wise with 40K, even the smallest thing, and we'll work towards fixing it. Rules for the BRB main book are especially appreciated right now.

In the age of Kickstarter, it would be smarter to create your own 'grimdark future' miniatures game and avoid GW's legal division.

>>20860081
After seeing GW and the CHS suit, I have no fear from the GW lawyers anymore.

File: 1348548370310.jpg-(211 KB, 550x2834, corpsehammer.jpg)

>>20860081
WELCOME TO CORPSE HAMMER

THERE IS NO HOPE

>>20860131
I don't know how funny I should find this, but I almost fell out of my chair.

>>20860131

Is that guy made out of sausages and chains?

File: 1348548595503.jpg-(303 KB, 550x4036, corpsehammer2.jpg)

>>20860131
MY FACE, IT IS MADE OF DEATH

>>20860183
>yfw they attack by doing lunges with their face (as in the exercise, not the attack) or by doing the drinking bird movement

Tired of getting smoked in 40K and being able to do nothing in return? No longer! (At least using the rules so far). Now you can snap-fire at people who shoot you!

>>20860635

To elaborate for people. The new version is a combination of Battletech and the existing 40k rules. With a heavy emphasis on snapfire which allows greater technical choice and strategy and fun, without sacrificing simplicity.

I find this thread compelling because I had the same idea the other day. Separated form the internet, I could not share my glorious actually no, it's unedited and terrible fluff.

I named it fanhammer 24BTM, being "twenty-four billion terametres", the distance away this fluff takes place from the Imperium.

Just prior to the Horus Heresy, the Imperium of Man sent a force of several hundred million into the abyss. This colossal stretch of darkness is the space between the imperium and a distant galaxy, called Tenor Insula ("faraway island"). The estimated journey time was one millenium - the actual duration of the journey ended up being five times that. Only the highest ranking officers of the Imperial Fleet are burdened with this knowledge - it is heresy of the highest order to divuldge such secrets to common peoples. The fleet has gone through many names and identities. The current name for man in Tenor Insula is the Blood of Sol.

The fleet has since broken into two major factions, with sub-factions owing allegiance:

Brothers of Sol: Space Marines from many chapters. Unique chapters, like Sparte and Athenia, arrose in the absence of the Imperiums regulation. These chapters are utterly devoted to the protection of the fleet, and the purity of mankind.
Sparte, arguably the most powerful of the brothers, is the equivalent of space-marines back in the Imperium. They wear brass, white, and red colours. Their favourite patterns are stripes, but armour varries from ship to ship. Sparte prefers terrestrial combat to naval, and employ a large number of tanks and heavy weapons, though preferring power swords, spears, hammers, or axes.
Athenia is the largest faction by population. Athenia relies less heavily on artilary than Sparte, and employs a large array of psychers, and a notably larger fleet than Sparte. Where Sparte prefers tanks, Athenia prefers ships and air support.

>>20860822
>actually, I think I renamed it "blood of sol", but like I said, no editing


Children of Sol: The Imperial Guard's manifestation within the fleet. They tend to be on the vanguard, and apply their numbers to issues, much like their kin back home. Specific fleets have their own names, like the two largest: Polemos and Sarka, along with the handful of micro-fleets that exist for smaller scale operations.
Polemos is well equipped for war, surprisingly. They have claimed many planets, and built forgeworlds from scratch in order to manufacture the sheer number and mass of weapons and armour that they require to do battle with the enemies of the Blood.
Sarka is more operative-based.

Even in Tenor Insula, the Blood of Sol could not escape the orks. Inquisition special ops have reported that orks may have stowed away, or followed them, but regardless of the truth the orks are in Tenor Insula.

The tyrannids are here too - it would seem the long arm of the hive mind has left no stone unturned. It would be many thousand years before the people of the Imperium would learn of the tyrannids. The tyrannids here tend to be black, brown, orange, and yellow.

>>20860834
Chaos, too, is ever present. At this time, no significant force in the fleet has fallen to it. There are sightings of chaos marines, though they are rare.

The tau do not exist in this sector. Instead, there is a similar race of red, orange, and purple skinned aliens called Yorxi ("your-she").
>this would be joke, fyi, it's supposed to parody existing space-fiction's views on women
This matriarchal race is largely women, with men bearing a resemblance to worker drones in a bee hive. The members are still individuals, like humans, but their socio-biological structure is similar to that of a colony of insects. It is known to the Sol Fleet that these drones that are accepted for reproducing are subjected to intense screening and physical training, much of it brutal, killing of weaklings and undesirables.

Bizarrely, Necrons are here. Their presence is mostly limited to a single solar system, and they lie dormant. Unlike many necrons back in the Imperium, these respond to the proximity of starships and defend their solar system with tooth and nail, then return to dormancy. The Necrons here are accompanied by a handful of grotesque monsters, seemingly an ally of some sort.

>>20860877
>I only got around to doing the two big space marine legions, because I have a gigantic boner for greek-styled space marines. Sue me.


Σπαρτιάτης - Spartan

The forces of Sparte are known as the Alpha legion. Spartans employ the largest and heaviest assault weapons they can get their hands on. Their most favourite weaponry is often mounted on tanks or other mobile platforms. Despite this, Sparte holds highest regard for those who fight in the melee. A Spartan marine is only allowed to add to his kill tally if his foe was within arms reach upon its death. Spartans also tend to eschew tools that they deem to make "war too easy". They will always be reluctant to the idea of non-Spartan aid, and will sometimes throw away clear advantages to test their own mettle.

Sparte is lead by two high lords, Leonidas and Nabis. Leonidas is an Admiral under the Supreme Patriarchus of Man, while Nabis is a Great Lord Comissar who rules Sparte. Leonidas has a reputation for bravery in war, while Nabis has a reputation for cruel and tyrannical control over the populate of Sparte.

Non-comander Spartan marines wear brass and gold coloured armour, with highlights of white and red. Commanders and other leaders wear silver or platinum as their base colour of armour, and also highlight with white and red, some of especially high rank may highlight with yellow or gold. Spartan helmets are often "pointier" than Athenian helms, and few Spartans ever enter combat without a power-spear or power-sword, if not both. It is a common belief that Spartan marines utilized powered javelins, but the truth of the matter is that the common Spartan power-spear actually doubles as a large javelin.
Spartan vehicles and machinery tend to be coloured brass with white and red highlights, like their marine pilots. These vehicles usually feature red less than white, but there are some which are painted to have red as the dominant colour.

>>20860896
The Spartan homeworld, Sparte, is a relatively high-graviy world. Its rusty orange soil is surprisingly furtile, despite its hostile environment. Most natural bodies of water are too acidic to swim in or drink, and a variety of nocturnal wolf-like carnivores make night life difficult if not downright dangerous. Prior to the Spartan colonization of the planet, Sparte was catalogued as a death world, though centuries of human presence has significantly reduced the level of danger.

Sparte is a mass exporter of heavy artillery and powered weapons. Sparte also manufactures a great deal of armour and heavy vehicles, though it may not quite be considered a forgeworld. For that purpose, Sparte has slowly been stripping their solar system of all viable resources, colonizing Phoebos and Daemons, two twin planets, for the purpose of constructing two massive forgeworlds.

Αθηναίος - Athenian

The forces of Athenia are known as the Beta legion. Athenians employ a bewildering array for long ranged weapons and psychers. They prefer defensive tactics utilizing mobility and support vehicles, involving air support whenever this is deemed possible. To the Athenian Marine, there is no greater honour than control over naval forces or ships, which are the prize of the Athenian war machine. In combat, these support ships have proven invaluable. Despite what Leonidas may say about it, Athenian air support has (cumatively) saved tens of thousands of Spartan lives, and many more Athenians.

>>20860904
Athenia has an "elected" High Lord and Admiral. Athenian marines are able to vote once every ten years, if they are within communications distance of Athenia, to determine their leader. Consecutively for ninety years, Pericles has been the victor and maintained a strong grip on the deomocracy. The Supreme Admiral of Man then approves, or disapproves, of the choice. The Supreme Patriarchus has never denied or nullified an Athenian ballot or democratic election, but it is within his power to do so.

Non-commander Athenian marines wear silver or nickel coloured armour, with highlights of white and blue. Commanders wear gold or brass coloured armour, highlighting with white and blue. Some commanding officers are of high enough rank they they are awarded the opportunity to highlight with yellow or gold as well. Athenian armour tends to slope more than that of Spartans. They also tend to favour curves over sharper edges, especially with helmets. Athenians are less reserved about what weapons they employ, and often make use of ranged weapons when Spartans would not.
Athenian vehicles and machinery tend to be coloured silver with white and blue highlights, like their marine pilots. These vehicles usually feature blue less than white, but there are some which are painted to have blue as the dominant colour.

>>20860914
Athenia is one of the few planets that did not require terraforming. It features many similarities to Old Galaxy Terra, and is considered a place of refuge from the horrors of war. Many scientists and scholars compete to have their institutions built there - comfortable and safe from the fringe worlds where war is all but constant.

Athenia does not produce weapons or armour. Rather, it produces a great deal of food. Athenia is also an oxygen world: The quantities of oxygen that the planet is capable of producing seems impossibly high, and the Athenians have taken to shipping it off-world in solid or liquid form. This is actually a much needed resource on some forgeworlds, and is a necessary ingredient in many combustion based engines or weaponry.

>And, that's the end.

This was all just written in spare time over the course of a few days while I couldn't internet. Most of it is bad. I do not expect praise for my Matt-Wardian wank-fluff.

Most recent shit.

Sorting through the "allies" clusterfuck.

BUMPING, IN THE NAME OF THE EMPRAH.

Come, help us filter the valued special rules of the emperor from the uneeded and unbalanced chaff of Chaos!

Help edit here:
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1H9BSZAMNLNupOgwFLyWrCNrb1uBG3j_9XbopwhAES_4/edit

What if shotguns were S3 AP- template weapons?

>>20861209
Mite b cool. Sure would make facing a squad of scout marines with shotguns a daunting prospect for a guard or nid blob

File: 1348558753950.gif-(339 KB, 604x453, a7a.gif)

>>20861390
Bump for great justice!

bumping for the glory that is... well, there must be SOME glory, right?

any update on how this is going down?

>>20863249
I can tell you they are putting effort into this. Seems promising.

bump for the morning crowd.

>>20864201
I had the same idea.
First step was changing turn structure.
Is this on the Wiki yet?

>>20864266
That's not supposed to link there.
It's no supposed to link anywhere.

Time for another bump.

>>20862498
There is always glory in the emprahs name.

Most discussion has moved to the google docs link.

Reposted here


https://docs.google.com/document/d/1H9BSZAMNLNupOgwFLyWrCNrb1uBG3j_9XbopwhAES_4/edit?pli=1

>>20864518
https://docs.google.com/document/d/141U7tQtxOqLFP0Qt1GM3zk-a5eS-5Vhus5xQ1hFY51g/edit

Solid Changes list here.

>>20864518
Unless anyone has any complaints, I'm going to start cutting and pasting the huge rambling initial discussion into the appropriate section of the rulebook discussion at the bottom. It'll make it a bit more logical, and allow us to see what ideas have been said for what subjects so far.

>>20864668
Go for it.

In the meantime, I'll be getting lunch.

>>20864683
'Nother bump

>>20864668
Finished the updates. For anyone interested in joining the editing here:
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1H9BSZAMNLNupOgwFLyWrCNrb1uBG3j_9XbopwhAES_4/edit?pli=1
It should now be a LOT more readable, and easier to get into. I;ll try and go through the longer discussions and pare them down to the core points though, for brevity's sake.

>>20865108
Woot, finally having something resembling a working system!

Feel free to drop in and comment wherever you see fit

I'm gonna bump this shit again.

more bumps for the emprah's justice

We're working on the IG's rules right now, anyone's free to pop in and offer suggestions

>>20866635

Bumping this.

In the name of the emprah.

So how about this thought: What if to-hit for shooting was vs the enemy Initiative? So like melee with your WS vs their WS, it's be your BS vs their Initiative (Still always hit on a 6, like for melee)?

>>20867910
welp there goes ork shooting

On the other hand eldar are now unhittable

Honestly with GUNS, no matter how fast you are you really cant dodge bullets (unless you have a specific invl save)

>>20868227
Well, you can't be unable to hit, just like you can't be unable to hit with melee attacks. Hell, Orks just go from a 5+ to a 6+ to hit, same as all your snap firing and all. For something like Guardsmen against I4 or I5 Eldar, that's a hell of an important change.

I can't even load the google doc, guys.

>>20868352
Should be here:
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1H9BSZAMNLNupOgwFLyWrCNrb1uBG3j_9XbopwhAES_4/edit?pli=1

There we go.

Stop sittin' around, work to be done!

I have access to physical copies of 6th, 5th, 4th, and 3rd editions; do people need stuff looked up?

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1TFDm3_L_78lmShwAaD0-fTRkuBEq_oK-KEdMLjqW1eg/edit

SoB discussion goes here.

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1fErnu50c-52eGGfOHs9Vf_p-Ws87f9srvyAbXxPYsRs/edit

Someone sort through this shit and Make concrete rules for the guard.

HEY

CAN SOMEONE STICKY THIS.

>>20869670
OH AND THIS IS ALSO A BUMP.

>>20869670
A sticky, a sticky, my internets for a sticky!

>>20870006

More bumps and shit.

Is there a Tau discussion page on gdocs?

>>20870400
Not yet, we're working through sisters of battle currently.

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1TFDm3_L_78lmShwAaD0-fTRkuBEq_oK-KEdMLjqW1eg/edit

>>20870488
At some point we'll need to get everyone going through and editing each section together, to avoid the spotty edits here and there that some people don't even notice.

>>20870872

I've had these docs open on my laptop for the last few day.

We've only got two or three dedicated dudes. WE need to get some serious networking together.

>>20870488

Bring back Kasrkin for SoB. Or was it DH that had that? I forget.

>>20871181
stormtrooper tier troops, not specifically Kasrkin

>>20871194
testbump

Okay guys, I really want to help, but I am not up to date on the rules having not cracked a rulebook in about 2 years; what do ya'll need done?

>>20871890
Advice on anything that you thinks should be better or changed. Even if this is just general impressions from seeing others play or just hearing about a rule, let us know in the appropriate seciton or page

mod pls stiky

>>20872552

We have cried out, and they have not listened. We will work in the dark, our work as unsung heroes never known until we are all gone.

>>20872740
LOOK UPON OUR WORKS YE MIGHTY AND DESPAIR

File: 1348633791469.gif-(1.72 MB, 297x196, 1339744191278.gif)

>>20872768
Well, we've got a fuckton done in just one calendar day. Can you imagine how fucking nice of a product we'll have if this keep sup for an entire week?

Pic unrelated

>>20872867
and beyond? I am going to playtest this shit so hard.

Boomp

>>20872867

The only thing is the momentum we need to keep up.

It's slowly grinding to a halt.

We have to prevent this.

We need scheduling, emails, chats, anything to facilitate work times and scheduling.

>>20873664
Anytime I have, I'll be on this.

If no thread exists for it, I'll make and bump one.

This shit is so worth persevering to make sure it doesn't die...

>>20873744

This is true.

Anyone make the 1d4chan page for it yet?

File: 1348639310082.gif-(Spoiler Image, 1.47 MB, 300x239)

>>20873775
I am unaware of a 1d4chan article. This is necessary for the continued survival of justice.

Also, bumping. Pic appropriate.

>>20873996
Someone needs to write this.

bumpaboo

Okay, so here's an update. We're getting slogged down in SoB updates, but we're making progress.

We've verified problems being:

Wargear and just unit cost points being done correctly.

Anything else, we'll fix later.

last bump from me tonight

File: 1348649114592.jpg-(94 KB, 343x361, doomhappening.jpg)

It's HAPPENING!

But not right this second, it's kinda late, but still I have a good feeling about this, /tg/, finally, we may be free of GW's shackles.

Also vote for this on suptg please.

And/or get a mod to sticky it...

Bampin

Stayin' alive, stayin' alive ah ah ah yeah

File: 1348657039755.jpg-(84 KB, 800x600, 40k.jpg)

If you guys are serious about this, I did have an idea about Army building and customization. You would start out with a 'jack-of-all-trades' army, but then could branch out into different themes to focus your army and give it a different feel.

Let's take Marines for example, you would start with the Basic marine force with all the choice available to you, but then you could go down one of the 4 different theme paths to unlock better stuff, the Angry path would unlock better CC units, Defense unlocks better guns, Gotta go fast unlocks better fast attack units and Inquitors unlocks all sorts of secert Ordos stuff.

One could go futher down the path to get even better stuff but lose the choices given to him by the other paths. For example a play might pick the Angry path to allow him to take Assault Marines as troop choices but he could then go futher down that in exchange for giving up the Defense path units in order to allow him to buy thunder hammers for his Assault Marines.

Each army would have different paths. The Guard might have Armour company, Abhumans, Faith and Hold the Line. Chaos might have a path for each of the chaos gods

How is it coming along?

>>20876010

We've already got major changes down.

We have them here:

https://docs.google.com/document/d/141U7tQtxOqLFP0Qt1GM3zk-a5eS-5Vhus5xQ1hFY51g/edit?userstoinvite=w
inslows010@gmail.com

>>20877487

Every other doc we have down:

Guard Changes
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1fErnu50c-52eGGfOHs9Vf_p-Ws87f9srvyAbXxPYsRs/edit

Sisters of Battle
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1TFDm3_L_78lmShwAaD0-fTRkuBEq_oK-KEdMLjqW1eg/edit

Main Discussion
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1H9BSZAMNLNupOgwFLyWrCNrb1uBG3j_9XbopwhAES_4/edit

>>20876010
that's pretty neat, throw it into the main doc and it can be discussed when we get to army organization.

bump

File: 1348675913680.png-(34 KB, 510x546, 1348064556272.png)

>>20877578
>>20877578
>>20877578
>>20877578
>>20877578

NEW THREAD

Jesus Christ OP, GW is a BUSINESS, they aren't here to make the Tau happy. They are here to make money, and if SMs do it, then that's what they'll do.

Doesn't mean we can't try to make it better to the best of our ability

>>20878740
>let's create a fanbase and then let them down at every possible turn!

There is nothing wrong with that whatsoever.