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  • File : 1264350916.jpg-(103 KB, 484x628, Momiji Blade Butterfly.jpg)
    103 KB 4e Character Builds, Bonus Thread: The Primal Duelist (Level 11) Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)11:35 No.7754100  
    The following build is something that I had hastily sketched up as part of my experiments on hybrid characters. One would not expect a hybrid rogue|warden to be possessing of much synergy, but careful selection of powers can produce quite a potent defender/striker. The combination of Nature's Wrath (Hybrid) and Riposte Strike generate a consistent stream of counterattacks, and non-standard action attack powers such as Low Slash, Guardian's Pounce, Darting Strike, Form of Winter's Herald, Surefooted Retort, and Form of the Vengeful Storm ensure that your standard actions can be dedicated to Riposte Strike each round. The tactics of this build involve marking a single enemy and performing all in your power to establish a flank with one of your allies, and so the "stickiness" of this build was not given any special emphasis. The only true issue with this build is the noticeable amount of feat tax required to have it function, particularly with the necessity of Hybrid Talent and Versatile Duelist.

    No commentary shall be provided for this build, as I believe it to be straightforward enough to grasp on one's own.

    Level: 11
    Race: Half-Orc, Player's Handbook 2, pages 14-15
    Class: Hybrid Rogue|Warden, Dragon Magazine #383, Player's Handbook 3 Debut: Hybrid Characters
    Paragon Path: Shadow Assassin, Player's Handbook, page 128

    Ability Scores:
    Level 1: Strength 16+2, Constitution 11, Dexterity 16+2, Intelligence 10, Wisdom 13, Charisma 8
    Level 4: Strength 17+2, Constitution 11, Dexterity 17+2, Intelligence 10, Wisdom 13, Charisma 8
    Level 8: Strength 18+2, Constitution 11, Dexterity 18+2, Intelligence 10, Wisdom 13, Charisma 8
    Level 11: Strength 19+2, Constitution 12, Dexterity 19+2, Intelligence 11, Wisdom 14, Charisma 9
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)11:35 No.7754107
         File1264350951.png-(392 KB, 1013x750, Momiji Blade Ponytail.png)
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    Feats:
    Level 1: Hybrid Talent (Warden's Armored Might [Lifespirit]), Dragon Magazine #383, Player's Handbook 3 Debut: Hybrid Characters
    Level 2: Versatile Duelist, Dragon Magazine #381, page 70
    Level 4: Weapon Proficiency (Bastard Sword), Player's Handbook, page 201
    Level 6: Weapon Expertise (Heavy Blades), Player's Handbook 2, page 190
    Level 8: Weapon Focus (Heavy Blades), Player's Handbook, page 201
    Level 10: Backstabber, Player's Handbook, page 194
    Level 11: Reserve Maneuver, Player's Handbook 2, page 191

    At-Will Attack Powers:
    Level 1: Riposte Strike, Player's Handbook, page 118
    Level 1: Thorn Strike, Player's Handbook 2, page 154

    Encounter Attack Powers:
    Level 1: Dazing Strike, Player's Handbook, page 118
    Level 3: Low Slash, Martial Power, page 76
    Level 7: Guardian's Pounce, Primal Power, page 97
    Level 11: Darting Strike, Dragon Magazine #381, page 80

    Daily Attack Powers:
    Level 1: Form of Winter's Herald, Player's Handbook 2, page 156
    Level 5: Surefooted Retort, Martial Power, page 76
    Level 9: Form of the Vengeful Storm, Dragon Magazine #383, Class Acts: Wardens of the Breach

    Utility Powers:
    Level 2: Sneak in the Attack, Martial Power, page 75
    Level 6: Treacherous Ice, Primal Power, page 96
    Level 10: Combat Tumbleset, Martial Power, page 79
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)11:37 No.7754114
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    Equipment:
    Main Hand: Jagged Bastard Sword +3 (Level 12, Free), Adventurer's Vault, page 71
    Off-Hand: Heavy Shield (Level 0, Free)
    Armor: Summoned Hide +2 (Level 6, 1,800 gp), Adventurer's Vault, page 53
    Neck: Amulet of Protection +3 (Level 11, Free), Player's Handbook, page 249
    Arms: Iron Armbands of Power +2 (Level 6, 1,800 gp), Adventurer's Vault, page 117
    Hands: Parry Gauntlets (Level 5, 1,000 gp), Adventurer's Vault, page 136
    Wondrous: Salve of Power (Level 10, Free), Adventurer's Vault, page 176
    Loose Change: 400 gp

    Miscellany:
    Initiative: +10 (5 half level + 5 Dexterity modifier)
    Size: Medium
    Speed: 6 squares (8 when charging)
    Vision: Low-light
    Passive Insight: (10 base + 5 half level + 2 Wisdom modifier)
    Passive Perception: (10 base + 5 half level + 2 Wisdom modifier + 5 training)
    Trained Skills: Acrobatics, Athletics, Perception, Stealth, Thievery
    Languages: Common, Giant
    Special (Half-Orc Resilience): The first time you are bloodied during an encounetr, you gain 5 temporary hit points.

    Hit Points:
    Hit Points: 86 (74 rogue|warden + 12 Constitution score)
    Bloodied: 43
    Healing Surge Value: 21
    Healing Surges per Day: 8 (7 rogue|warden + 1 Constitution modifier)

    Defenses:
    AC: 27 (10 base + 5 half level + 2 enhancement + 5 Dexterity modifier + 3 hide + 2 heavy shield)
    Fortitude: 23 (10 base + 5 half level + 3 enhancement + 5 Strength modifier)
    Reflex: 26 (10 base + 5 half level + 3 enhancement + 5 Dexterity modifier + 1 class + 2 heavy shield)
    Will: 21 (10 base + 5 half level + 3 enhancement + 2 Wisdom modifier + 1 class)
    Second Wind (Parry Bracers): When you take the total defense or second wind actions, you gain a +2 item bonus to all defenses until the beginning of your next turn.
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)11:38 No.7754123
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    Attacks:
    Attack Bonus: +17 (5 half level + 3 enhancement + 5 Strength/Dexterity modifier + 1 Weapon Expertise + 3 proficiency)
    Damage Bonus (Melee): +12 (3 enhancement + 5 Strength/Dexterity modifier + 2 Weapon Focus + 2 Iron Armbands of Power)
    Damage Bonus (Close): +10 (3 enhancement + 5 Strength/Dexterity modifier + 2 Weapon Focus)
    Damage per [W]: 1d10 (Jagged Bastard Sword +3)
    Extra Critical Damage: Ongoing 10 damage (save ends), critical hit on a natural 19 or 20 (Jagged Bastard Sword +3)
    Special (Sneak Attack [Hybrid]): This class feature functions as the rogue class feature (Player's Handbook, page 117), except that you can deal the extra damage only when you hit with a rogue power or a rogue paragon path power.
    Special (Backstabber): The extra damage dice from your Sneak Attack class feature increase from d6s to d8s.

    Marking:
    Marking (Nature's Wrath [Hybrid]): Once during each of your turns, you can mark one adjacent enemy as a free action. This mark lasts until the end of your next turn.
    Immediate Interrupt (Warden's Fury): When an enemy marked by you makes an attack that does not include you as a target, you can use Warden's Fury against it as an immediate interrupt.
    Immediate Reaction (Warden's Grasp): When an enemy marked by you that is within 5 squares of you makes an attack that does not include you as a target, you can use Warden's Grasp against it as an immediate reaction.
    Second Wind (Lifespirit): When you use your second wind, an ally within 5 squares of you can spend a healing surge and make a saving throw.
    Second Wind (Parry Bracers): When you take the total defense or second wind actions, you gain a +2 item bonus to all defenses until the beginning of your next turn.
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)11:38 No.7754134
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    Item Powers:
    Summoned Hide +2 (At-Will): Minor Action. You banish this armor to a secure extradimensional location. At any point in the future, unless you are wearing armor, you can use another minor action to recall the armor. The armor appears on you as though you had donned it normally.
    Salve of Power (Daily): Minor Action. When the Salve of Power is applied to a creature, the target can expend one healing surge to regain the use of one daily power of 5th level or lower (instead of regaining hit points). If the target has no healing surges remaining, it cannot benefit from the salve.

    That is all.
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)11:40 No.7754156
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    >Paragon Path: Shadow Assassin, Player's Handbook, page 128

    One thing I should add, however, is that this paragon path allows you to deal your Dexterity modifier in damage against any enemy that misses you with a melee attack. The applications of this with marking are wonderful.
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)11:42 No.7754171
    Spend less time memorising D&D rules and more on learning how to compose a decent sentence.
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)11:43 No.7754193
    >>7754107
    I see one discretionary feat (Backstabber), two if you count Reserve Manuever. That's pretty lame. Though, I'm not sure I'd consider Versatile Duelist completley necessary, as a rapier would be only slightly less powerful and require only a Superior Weapon Prof.

    Though, once those [W]s start stacking up, the difference between the two would start to show a bit more. I'm not terribly familiar with the warden, however. Do any of their powers require a certain type of weapon (i.e. heavy blades)?
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)11:43 No.7754195
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    >>7754171
    English is his secondary language, bro.
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)11:46 No.7754212
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    >>7754195
    >>7754171
    And still he succeeds in it better than most amerifriends.

    But moving on. Enjoying the show this far. And cute Momiji is cute.
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)11:49 No.7754236
    I love how hybrid classes allow for such interesting characters.
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)11:56 No.7754296
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    >>7754193

    Backstabber improves the damage of a paragon-tier Sneak Attack by 3 on average on a regular hit and 6 on a critical hit (recall that the Jagged Weapon increases your critical range to 19-20). Reserve Maneuver is necessary due to the fact that the Shadow Assassin level 11 encounter power does not fall under the domain of the Versatile Duelist paragon feat, and so it must be swapped out. Darting Strike, at least, is a solid power, as it allows for 2-square shift an attack with combat advantage as an opportunity action.

    I could have opted for a dagger and the Daggermaster paragon path, which would have eased the feat taxes of this build, but I had settled on the reliability of the bastard sword and the counterdamage of the Shadow Assassin paragon path.
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)12:05 No.7754382
    >>7754296
    No, I wasn't saying Backstabber is lame, I was saying that so many "Must have" feats, and so few feats you can choose to play around with, is lame.

    Reserve Maneuver is all about the "this paragon path is awesome, except for this ridiculously lame Level 11 power" so I hesitate to call it a "feat tax" most of the time.
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)12:06 No.7754391
    sage
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)12:08 No.7754412
    >>7754391
    How very insightful.
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)12:09 No.7754430
    That's the... third touhou thread today? Can't you keep it in one thread?
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)12:12 No.7754466
    >>7754430
    How about you keep your whining off the board?
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)12:13 No.7754488
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    >>7754382

    The issue of feat tax for hybrid characters is exacerbated by the necessity of feats such as Hybrid Talent.
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)12:15 No.7754504
    >>7754488
    Touhoufag, how do you define feat tax?
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)12:20 No.7754565
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    >>7754504

    A "tax feat" is, in my opinion, defined as "a feat that must be selected for a given class build in order to render viable a certain option that should be usable by that build by default, or to patch the gaps in the math of the system that were only recognized by Wizards after the release of the Player's Handbook."

    A Strength/Wisdom paladin, for example, absolutely *must* select Mighty Challenge in order to gain an effective Divine Challenge. Likewise, the above character would lack much efficacy as a defender without Hybrid Talent (Warden's Armored Might).
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)12:22 No.7754579
    >>7754430
    He could if the threads weren't saged and spammed full of shit brosep.
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)12:29 No.7754674
    >>7754565
    Feat Taxes aren't new, as far as I'm concerned, they're just more prevalent now.

    Hell, in my 3.5 games any vanilla barbarian gets Power Attack free; it's not as if he ISN'T going to take it anyway, might as well give him the chance to have a little variety in his feats.
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)14:16 No.7756005
    >>7754236
    I know, right? You can have all kinds of unique flavor with them.

    Hybrid rogue|warden? Dances with Wolves, anyone?
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)15:03 No.7756570
    I thought you couldn't sneak attack with a bastard sword?
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)15:14 No.7756712
    hey guise I just found this awesome comic!

    http://ansuz.sooke.bc.ca/bonobo-conspiracy/
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)15:17 No.7756744
    >>7756611

    Oh hey, Touhourist; hadn't seen you in a while. How's your shitposting going these days?
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)15:18 No.7756758
    >>7756744
    One would think that his usual image macroes ending up on the autoban list would've been enough of a hint, but I guess it was too subtle for him.
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)15:19 No.7756761
    >>7754674
    >it's not as if he ISN'T going to take it anyway, might as well give him the chance to have a little variety in his feats.

    This. Basically, if something is so valuable that EVERY member of a class is going to pick it, it's pretty bad design not to give it to them for free anyway.
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)15:21 No.7756780
    >>7754565
    You don't understand 4e nearly as well as you'd like to think you do.
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)15:22 No.7756797
    >>7754195
    I speak french fluently. What's his excuse?
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)15:23 No.7756807
    >>7756780
    and you don't understand how to troll nearly as well as you think you do
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)15:24 No.7756818
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    >>7756797
    you REALLY think we're going to believe you?
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)15:26 No.7756834
    >>7756818
    I live in Canada, if I want a job I pretty much HAVE to speak french fluently.
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)15:29 No.7756863
    >>7756834

    Okay, so prove that you speak fluent French. Go ahead.
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)15:32 No.7756899
    >>7756834
    That explains your situation, then. TF, on the other hand, lives in Mudhole, Pacific, where quality tutoring in english just isn't available. Kind of hard to learn a language when you're the only one in the country who has any interest in it.
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)15:36 No.7756948
    It's funny, these stat threads keep being made with touhou avatars.

    They always turn into some form of shit.

    This has been going on for years now.

    Why do they keep getting made?
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)15:38 No.7756966
    >>7756948

    Because one of the handful of people who do anything other than shitpost on /tg/ likes to use Touhou images along with his posts.

    As long as he continues to contribute (unlike the legion of shitposting retards), who cares what avatar he uses or even whether or not he uses one?
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)15:42 No.7757015
    >>7756966
    Because like Flare or furry images Touhou seems to be another instant trollstorm button on /tg/.

    The touhou has nothing to do with his post so he could have left it out, leaving the shitstorm out too.

    Therefor he may not be shitposting directly but he's making threads he knows WILL turn into shitstorms which is more or less the same thing.
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)15:46 No.7757067
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    ITT troll getting his ass handed to him.
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)15:47 No.7757081
    >>7757015

    They're only a troll shistorm because of immature retards. I'd rather keep people that can provide meaningful contributions to the board. What do you think the people who sage these threads are doing when they're not doing that? They're saging other /tg/ related threads because it's not 40k. Or making Avatar threads.
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)15:48 No.7757095
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    >>7756863
    >Canadian
    >speaks French fluently
    ... ah. No, you do not speak French. You speak quebecois, and calling that French is the same as squeezing out a lump of feces and granting it human rights at the premise of where it came from.
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)15:49 No.7757100
    >>7757015

    People who contribute are entitled to their harmless eccentricities (like tripcodes and avatars).
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)15:52 No.7757152
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    >>7757067
    >getting his ass handed to him
    I have to disagree. You did exactly as expected - you shat up the toushit thread even more than I could ever hope without your diligent help.
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)15:53 No.7757167
    >>7757081
    And theres only immature retards because he keeps using touhou. It would be easy to stop this shit from happening but years later he still does it.

    >>7757100
    Not if it's just going to cause a shitstorm every time.
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)15:55 No.7757205
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    >>7757152
    >diligent help
    >Implying I've been in this thread for more than 30 seconds.
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)15:56 No.7757227
    >>7757205
    >implying that "you" always means second person singular
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)15:57 No.7757243
    >>7757229
    And so are you. Shitposter.
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)15:58 No.7757258
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    >>7757227
    >Implying it wasn't a direct response to the post.
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)15:58 No.7757264
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    ITT: trolls trolling trolls. And one Touhoufag.
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)16:00 No.7757294
    >>7757167

    Yeah that's a good idea, lets stop posting useful content and let the board be porndumps only.
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)16:02 No.7757312
    >>7757294
    You know he could still make these threads but... without spamming touhou and drawing all the trolls to them. Just a thought.
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)16:02 No.7757313
    >>7757294
    Can you respond to the post you quoted, please? You're uttering bullshit.
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)16:02 No.7757321
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    >>7757167
    So entire categories of people should stop posting because of a single dedicated troll?
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)16:03 No.7757334
    >>7757312
    You flatly know his posting style and min maxing tenancies would attract them either way.
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)16:05 No.7757354
    >>7757321
    It's never been just one person.

    And again no one is saying never post ever, just don't use touhou and draw in all the trolls.

    I'm tired of all the shit threads and you make them happen just as much as the sagefags.
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)16:07 No.7757389
    >>7757334
    No not really.

    Even the ones that hate him for acting like a faggot would have a harder time finding the threads without the touhou.

    Really. Just try it for a couple months. See the difference.
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)16:07 No.7757393
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    >>7757354
    Okay, two or three trolls making categories of perfectly ordinary and not-forbidden-by-rules images unusable. Still doesn't sound right.
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)16:08 No.7757405
    >>7757312
    But I fucking love touhou.
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)16:11 No.7757441
    >>7757393
    Honestly, i'd say it's more than that. There's no way these threads could turn to shit with such consistency for so long with only a few people.
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)16:12 No.7757470
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    I loev the touhou art, mind you. Trolls can troll all they want, they generally run out of interest very quickly. By rule, only trolls and short-sighted people attracted by trolls - and me, a random retard - reply to these threads. The rest just read 'em, save what they like, and bother not to bump them. And it works pretty well, in the end.
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)16:14 No.7757500
    >>7757470
    >Trolls can troll all they want, they generally run out of interest very quickly.

    >By rule, only trolls and short-sighted people attracted by trolls- reply to these threads.

    Yeah that.
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)16:18 No.7757552
    >>7757470
    And then there are people like me, who fap to this
    >>7757152

    So with that said, moar please.
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)16:22 No.7757612
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    With builds like this and yesterday's Strength/Intelligence-based genasi Lifespirit warden, do you consider provoking OA a valid method of clearing out minions?
    Perhaps with some defensive buffing from a party member?
    Being able to run through minions, kill them, then stick to a BBG/artillery/healer would be excellent.
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)16:23 No.7757628
    >>7757612
    No ones talking about that anymore.

    Let a bad thread die.
    >> noko SRW addict 01/24/10(Sun)16:24 No.7757642
    because whatever avatar you use is completely goddamned irrelevant to the discussion you post on 4chan.

    also - you would have do some kind of idiot to not see that pics he is using for this character build are PORTRAITS of what an example of this exact character would look like. she's a bastard sword weidling duelist. saying pic not related in this case is a clear example of not even paying attention to what he is saying and getting pissed at "animu faggotry"

    /ignore this retard>>7757015
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)16:25 No.7757657
    >>7757642
    E-mail field, not subject field
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)16:27 No.7757689
    >>7757612
    sauce?
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)16:27 No.7757694
    >>7757642
    >because whatever avatar you use is completely goddamned irrelevant to the discussion you post on 4chan.

    Bullshit and you know it.

    If someone went around spamming furry images, they could be the best poster in the world but their threads would all turn to shit.

    The touhou threads have been going on for years, and they all turn into shitstorms. At this point when someone sees these threads they know exactly what they are and whats going to happen in them.
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)16:30 No.7757750
    >>7757095
    Butthurt metropolitan. How are you enjoying your muslims and divided society?
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)16:31 No.7757754
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    >>7757612

    This is highly dependent on how your DM plays the monsters present in any given combat encounter. No creature is forced to make an opportunity attack in most cases, after all.
    >> noko SRW addict 01/24/10(Sun)16:34 No.7757799
    >>7757694

    yes. in the extreme example of something as rageinducing a furry porn as an avatar, sure. but this is random cutesy weeaboo art. it's not like he's using something like actual cp as avatars, or furfaggotry, or even lol chemrat-chan. It's a question of extreme hate just because of weeaboo shit.
    we're on a weeaboo board.
    It's not rule breaking.
    and a good number of times, the art/avatar used is RELEVANT TO THE THREAD. e.g. this thread. he's posting a bastard sword wielding duelist. he is posting pictures of a bastard sword wielding duelist.

    How is this in any way shape or form not PIC RELATED?
    are you somehow going to try to say that the source of an image matters more on 4chan that what the image actually IS? if so, that's pretty god damned stupid. even for 4chan
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)16:35 No.7757824
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    >>7757750
    Rather the Frenchman in France than the muslim, rather the Canadian in Canada than the quebecois.
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)16:37 No.7757849
    >>7757824
    >>7757750
    >>7757095
    Huguenauts > all. I'll just be over here enjoying my stylish frankoid name while being completely integrated into the core of american ethnicity and society. Faggots.
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)16:38 No.7757857
    >>7757799
    It doesn't really matter why people hate touhou (even people on /a/ hate it) but they do. And theres enough of them that they're always going to be around.

    Throwing something a large part of a board doesn't like onto that board constantly, and not expecting a shitstorm everytime, is stupid.
    >> SRW addict 01/24/10(Sun)16:44 No.7757932
    >>7757857
    fair enough. and a valid point. however - even with "lol shitstorm" he still gets his goal done. people see build, read, and sometimes comment on it. some people hate the idea of min/maxing/whatever, some people love it. mostly i just find it amusing. I was a reader of the Charop boards for quite a while, it's silly/awesome some of the things people come up with.

    with at least some intelligent discussion happening, or people finding interesting ideas for characters/whatever, it's still productive as a thread. and some people like it. that's all it takes to be able to ignore shitstorm and focus on the good parts. like, as in, I actually really like this charcter concept, and might run something along these lines in an upcoming game. It's not unholy "lol orcusslayer", but it's powerful and a fair bit flavorful, if only because of it's unusual nature. that intrigues me.
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)16:44 No.7757933
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    >>7757857
    Of course, this gives the people who do needlessly hate it a free pass, effectivelly making their irrational hatred a law above the law. In other words, someone not doing something wrong has to do something they don't like because someone disapproves.

    Fuck you. The Touhou will proceed. CRY MORE.
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)16:49 No.7758005
    >>7757933
    >Of course, this gives the people who do needlessly hate it a free pass, effectivelly making their irrational hatred a law above the law. In other words, someone not doing something wrong has to do something they don't like because someone disapproves.

    Thats kind of what 4chan has always done though. You can't expect that to change.

    >Fuck you. The Touhou will proceed. CRY MORE.

    From your needless use of capslock and insults i daresay it is you who is crying more.
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)16:49 No.7758006
         File1264369770.jpg-(484 KB, 3000x2000, 1263716669811.jpg)
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    >>7757754
    It seems win/win. Either you're granted free movement about the field, or you pop a bunch of minions.

    Also, if the DM is playing the NPCs in character, you ought to get at least one or two before the others catch on, unless your reputation precedes you: "Those that attack the Primal Duelist die! Do not cross blades with him, if you value your life."

    >>7757689
    I got it off /tg/, but I think I saw it on reddit previously. Not that reddit has a search function, so....
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)16:50 No.7758025
    Touhoufag might get his goal done, but there will always be more trolls than lovers. There's also the fact that most "lovers" are trolls too, and will jump at any chance to shit up the thread at the drop of a hat.
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)16:55 No.7758114
    >>7758005
    > implying that saying CRY MORE without capitalization is needless
    > YOU ARE SO SMALL, IS FUNNY TO ME.
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)16:57 No.7758154
    >>7758025
    So long as there are more people who hate touhoufag than love him, his presence here is justified and I would be sad to see him go.

    My attitude towards touhoufag was bland indifference til I saw how much rage he generated. and I like cute animu girls, so it all combines well
    >> SRW addict 01/24/10(Sun)16:58 No.7758164
    >>7758025
    you are right again, but just because something devolves into shit doesn't mean it is worthless. goos things are buried in the shit, and, not to sound like the fuck you touhou retarded from a little bit earlier, not wanting to post something that you apparently dedicated to as a hobby, just because you don't want people to troll it up into a shitstorm?
    This is 4chan. people will troll ANYTHING into a pure shitstorm. who cares? Just ignore the faggotry, and talk about things. laughing at the people stupid enough to troll on either side is also about half of the entertainment/enjoyment of touhou threads anyways. I've been reading them either live in /suptg for well over a year now, and on the average they're still worth my time to read them.
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)16:59 No.7758184
    >>7757857
    I'd like to remind you that during all these years, Touhoufag hasn't gotten banned or anything. The dedicated trolls harassing him have gotten several of their image macroes and copypastas on the autoban list. I don't think I'm going to honor the complaints of people who got banned for those very complaints.

    If you want a Touhou-free board, there are plenty of alternatives to choose from.
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)17:01 No.7758222
    >>7758184
    He doesn't post on tgchan, for example, last I checked.
    >> SRW addict 01/24/10(Sun)17:01 No.7758225
    also - I just realized I am still namefagging from zeonquest. lol
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)17:05 No.7758302
    >>7758164
    >This is 4chan. people will troll ANYTHING into a pure shitstorm. who cares?

    True, but it rarely gets this bad unless a board really hates something.

    >>7758184
    And that helps at all? /v/ tried to autoban "butthurt" and all the anti console shit and it didn't work. What the mods want and what the posters want are rarely the same thing.

    >If you want a Touhou-free board, there are plenty of alternatives to choose from.

    And if he really wants to post touhou he could do that on /jp/, instead of doing it here. But he doesn't.
    >> SRW addict 01/24/10(Sun)17:09 No.7758375
    >>7758302
    yes, he certainly could post in on /jp/ however - do you really think that the community of people at /jp/ are going to care about his /tg/ character building? let aone understand it. it takes some of the severe grognards here to understand this shit. because this is what we are interested in. because this is the /tg/ board.
    usually the only times pics matter more than thread are either image threads, something interesting is used as a pic unrelated, or when trolls get butthurt.
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)17:11 No.7758402
    >>7758375
    Uh... you know you can post on more than one board at once right?
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)17:19 No.7758535
    >>7758402
    Sure, but Touhoufag's posts are, by volume, 95% /tg/ and 5% /jp/ related to /tg/ content. Posting in /jp/ makes fuck-all sense for him.
    >> SRW addict 01/24/10(Sun)17:23 No.7758620
    also - having the same thread in 2 boards is probably considered spam by some people. and yeah, what the guy above said about /tg/ content. the content of his posts puts it into solid /tg/ territory pretty much only. no one else on other boards is going to know or care about char op builds and character discussions.
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)17:25 No.7758650
    >>7758535
    >>7758620
    Way to miss the point.

    You want to post or talk about touhou, go to /jp/. Want to talk about builds? /tg/. Want to try and do both? Enjoy your shitstorm.
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)17:25 No.7758653
    >>7758302
    >And if he really wants to post touhou he could do that on /jp/, instead of doing it here. But he doesn't.

    Because he doesn't post Touhou. He posts 4E character optimisation advice with pictures of his character builds. Those pictures happen to be of Touhou characters.

    Why is this basic difference something that eludes you?
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)17:27 No.7758694
    >Why is this basic difference something that eludes you?
    http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/InsaneTrollLogic
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)17:30 No.7758744
    >>7758653
    He posts touhou, which people don't like, which brings in trolls.

    It's like my furry example, you can make the best posts ever but if you open with furry it will only start a shitstorm.

    >>7758694
    Oh come on.

    That has nothing to do with TV.
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)17:31 No.7758769
    >>7758694
    >Part of this object is blue! That must mean THIS WHOLE OBJECT is blue!!1!
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)17:32 No.7758786
    >>7758744
    Then get rid of the people who shitstorm needlessly; the guys not posting D&D related material.

    "Hey guys, that guy over there is wearing a red hat!"
    "We hate red hats, they make us mad!"
    "Hey buddy, no red hats here! The mob has spoken!"

    Protip, bro; the mob is an idiot.
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)17:33 No.7758793
    >>7758744
    last I checked posting touhou was basically saying 'CAREFUL, OPTIMIZED BUILDS AHEAD'
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)17:34 No.7758803
    >>7758786
    >Then get rid of the people who shitstorm needlessly; the guys not posting D&D related material.

    This is 4chan we're talking about.

    That is never going to happen.

    Even if it could, one person slightly changing their posting style is much easier than trying to convince a bunch of trolls to leave something alone.
    >> SRW addict 01/24/10(Sun)17:34 No.7758809
    and he very rarely imagedumps/makes a thread just as dump. I can only remember a few times when he first ame around. it's not like he jumps to /tg/, and makes a thread with this as the only text

    "HAI GUYS, LETS GET A TOUHOU THREAD GOING!!! BONUS POINTS FOR FEET!?!?!!!!!1111ONE!!!!111"

    he's posting pictures he likes that either a. complement his posts by BEING A CHARACTER PORTRAIT, or b. using random touhou pics as an avatar.
    Doesn't really post anything douchebaggery, the only real reason anyone says they hate him is because, what seems to me at least, "omg, he's using weeaboo pictures constantly!!!! avatar fag, must kill!" seriously, that much venom for what amounts to pretty pictures? that are usually at least started by being pic related in the best possible way?

    how many drawfags would draw character portraits if they got this level of hate. oh wait. a lot of them did. for basically being quality artists and having some pride in their talent. I still lol whenever I see a lot of the art by lolcron pop up in my image folder/screensaver. a lot of people, and i use that term loosely, on /tg/ hate things for the stupidest of reasons. look no further than things like edition wars, the crap that happened to the unified setting, and a lot of the drawfags that used be on /tg/.
    just because people raaaage over something doesn't make it bad. holy shit.
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)17:35 No.7758819
    >>7758769
    More like; "This object is almost entirely blue! I like blue things! It has a little bit of red on it, but the red is placed in such a way on the thing that it emphasizes the overall blueness of this thing!"
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)17:37 No.7758849
    >>7758803
    The right of one person supersedes the desires of many. Western Classical Liberalism 101, brah.
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)17:39 No.7758886
    >>7758809
    Again regardless of why people hate touhou they do, enough to keep ruining these threads.

    By starting every thread with touhou he is ensuring that the thread will be a shitstorm, which is only slightly better than shitposting.
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)17:39 No.7758887
    >>7758803
    /tg/ likes to think that it's better than the rest of 4chan, but it really isn't.
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)17:39 No.7758889
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    ITT: Posts by TF: 9
    95 posts total at time of writing.
    The substance versus trolling ratio is getting crazy.
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)17:43 No.7758936
    >>7758886
    Stubbornly refusing to back down from a moral high ground? Standing alone against waves of raving, mad trolls? Enduring ceaseless, irrational hatred for years on end?

    Touhoufag is a goddamn paladin.
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)17:45 No.7758957
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    >>7758803
    One person?
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)17:47 No.7758986
    >>7758957
    >Dat Pic
    HHHHNNNNNNNGGGGGGGG
    Makes me want to give my wizard Improved Familiar and get a recrunched/fluffed shocker lizard.
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)17:49 No.7759010
    >>7758936

    Touhoufag, Paladin of Gensokyo?
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)17:50 No.7759035
         File1264373428.jpg-(281 KB, 600x750, touhou1260282496142.jpg)
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    >>7758889

    Touhou is serious business.
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)17:50 No.7759042
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    Oh boy, oh boy. All this talk of "shitstorms". It's quite silly really, even at best they're storms in goldfish bowls. Trolls or no trolls, TF always delivers his stuff succesfully, and the people who follow his threads more or less actively - myself included - get to take what they want of them. Arguing if it's right or wrong to troll these threads is very much idle faffing. There will always be trolls, there will always be people who like touhou, and there will always be people who like 4E. Everyone gets what they want, more or less. That is, except for those that regularily latch on to the same bait, thread after thread. But not every man is capable of learning. Rather like the quebecois.
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)17:54 No.7759100
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    >>7759035
    Wait what-

    that's not a yukkuri! D:
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)18:24 No.7759502
    >>7758744
    >He posts touhou, which people don't like, which brings in trolls.
    >brings in trolls
    >implying there wouldn't be trolls anyway, lik there are in pretty much every fucking thread on /tg/.
    Look, I'm not saying rape is good, but the bitch was asking for it, if you know what I mean.
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)18:48 No.7759838
    >>7759502
    >which people don't like
    Negative, Ghostrider
    >> bumpan Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)18:49 No.7759864
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    > All this talk of "shitstorms".
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)20:30 No.7761398
    For what it's worth, I think this is a great creation.
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)20:33 No.7761449
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    > Encounter Attack Powers:
    > Level 1: Dazing Strike, Player's Handbook, page 118
    > Level 3: Low Slash, Martial Power, page 76
    > Level 7: Guardian's Pounce, Primal Power, page 97
    > Level 11: Darting Strike, Dragon Magazine #381, page 80
    notatations inline

    Are your encounter powers sources unbalanced? RAW if Rogue is Level 1 (Dazing Strike) then Level 3 must be a Warden power, shouldn't it?
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)21:05 No.7761996
    >>7761449
    You can do some retraining tricks to get your encounter powers that way as a hybrid.
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)21:06 No.7762013
    >touhou
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)21:17 No.7762179
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    It occurs to me that Duelist's Prowess from page 68 of Dragon Magazine #381 would make for a far more potent level 5 daily attack power.
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)21:26 No.7762326
    >>7761996
    ah, thanks for making me go back and re-read the hybrid article. yes, it sounds like my mistake. after acquiring 2 powers (in each category: at-will, encounter, daily, utility) from each hybrid class, any power combination is allowed after that as long as one power from each hybrid class remains present.

    shite. I totally need to redo my hybrid character now.
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)23:02 No.7763712
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    Level: 11
    Race: Half-Orc, Player's Handbook 2, pages 14-15
    Class: Hybrid Rogue|Warden, Dragon Magazine #383, Player's Handbook 3 Debut: Hybrid Characters
    Paragon Path: Shadow Assassin, Player's Handbook, page 128

    Ability Scores:
    Level 1: Strength 16+2, Constitution 11, Dexterity 16+2, Intelligence 10, Wisdom 13, Charisma 8
    Level 4: Strength 17+2, Constitution 11, Dexterity 17+2, Intelligence 10, Wisdom 13, Charisma 8
    Level 8: Strength 18+2, Constitution 11, Dexterity 18+2, Intelligence 10, Wisdom 13, Charisma 8
    Level 11: Strength 19+2, Constitution 12, Dexterity 19+2, Intelligence 11, Wisdom 14, Charisma 9

    Feats:
    Level 1: Hybrid Talent (Warden's Armored Might [Lifespirit]), Dragon Magazine #383, Player's Handbook 3 Debut: Hybrid Characters
    Level 2: Versatile Duelist, Dragon Magazine #381, page 70
    Level 4: Weapon Proficiency (Bastard Sword), Player's Handbook, page 201
    Level 6: Weapon Expertise (Heavy Blades), Player's Handbook 2, page 190
    Level 8: Weapon Focus (Heavy Blades), Player's Handbook, page 201
    Level 10: Backstabber, Player's Handbook, page 194
    Level 11: Reserve Maneuver, Player's Handbook 2, page 191

    At-Will Attack Powers:
    Level 1: Riposte Strike, Player's Handbook, page 118
    Level 1: Thorn Strike, Player's Handbook 2, page 154

    Encounter Attack Powers:
    Level 1: Dazing Strike, Player's Handbook, page 118
    Level 3: Low Slash, Martial Power, page 76
    Level 3 (replaces Dazing Strike): Thunder Slam, Dragon Magazine #383, Class Acts: Wardens of the Breach
    Level 7: Guardian's Pounce, Primal Power, page 97
    Level 7 (replaces Thunder Slam): Dazing Strike, Player's Handbook, page 118
    Level 11: Darting Strike, Dragon Magazine #381, page 80

    Daily Attack Powers:
    Level 1: Form of Winter's Herald, Player's Handbook 2, page 156
    Level 5: Duelist's Prowess, Dragon Magazine #381, page 68
    Level 9: Form of the Vengeful Storm, Dragon Magazine #383, Class Acts: Wardens of the Breach
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)23:04 No.7763734
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    Utility Powers:
    Level 2: Sneak in the Attack, Martial Power, page 75
    Level 6: Treacherous Ice, Primal Power, page 96
    Level 10: Combat Tumbleset, Martial Power, page 79

    Equipment:
    Main Hand: Jagged Bastard Sword +3 (Level 12, Free), Adventurer's Vault, page 71
    Off-Hand: Heavy Shield (Level 0, Free)
    Armor: Summoned Hide +2 (Level 6, 1,800 gp), Adventurer's Vault, page 53
    Neck: Amulet of Protection +3 (Level 11, Free), Player's Handbook, page 249
    Arms: Iron Armbands of Power +2 (Level 6, 1,800 gp), Adventurer's Vault, page 117
    Hands: Parry Gauntlets (Level 5, 1,000 gp), Adventurer's Vault, page 136
    Wondrous: Salve of Power (Level 10, Free), Adventurer's Vault, page 176
    Loose Change: 400 gp

    Miscellany:
    Initiative: +10 (5 half level + 5 Dexterity modifier)
    Size: Medium
    Speed: 6 squares (8 when charging)
    Vision: Low-light
    Passive Insight: (10 base + 5 half level + 2 Wisdom modifier)
    Passive Perception: (10 base + 5 half level + 2 Wisdom modifier + 5 training)
    Trained Skills: Acrobatics, Athletics, Perception, Stealth, Thievery
    Languages: Common, Giant
    Special (Half-Orc Resilience): The first time you are bloodied during an encounetr, you gain 5 temporary hit points.

    Hit Points:
    Hit Points: 86 (74 rogue|warden + 12 Constitution score)
    Bloodied: 43
    Healing Surge Value: 21
    Healing Surges per Day: 8 (7 rogue|warden + 1 Constitution modifier)
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)23:04 No.7763744
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    Defenses:
    AC: 27 (10 base + 5 half level + 2 enhancement + 5 Dexterity modifier + 3 hide + 2 heavy shield)
    Fortitude: 23 (10 base + 5 half level + 3 enhancement + 5 Strength modifier)
    Reflex: 26 (10 base + 5 half level + 3 enhancement + 5 Dexterity modifier + 1 class + 2 heavy shield)
    Will: 21 (10 base + 5 half level + 3 enhancement + 2 Wisdom modifier + 1 class)
    Second Wind (Parry Bracers): When you take the total defense or second wind actions, you gain a +2 item bonus to all defenses until the beginning of your next turn.
    Special (Shadow Assassin's Riposte): Any adjacent enemy that misses you with a melee attack takes damage equal to your Dexterity modifier.

    Attacks:
    Attack Bonus: +17 (5 half level + 3 enhancement + 5 Strength/Dexterity modifier + 1 Weapon Expertise + 3 proficiency)
    Damage Bonus (Melee): +12 (3 enhancement + 5 Strength/Dexterity modifier + 2 Weapon Focus + 2 Iron Armbands of Power)
    Damage Bonus (Close): +10 (3 enhancement + 5 Strength/Dexterity modifier + 2 Weapon Focus)
    Damage per [W]: 1d10 (Jagged Bastard Sword +3)
    Extra Critical Damage: Ongoing 10 damage (save ends), critical hit on a natural 19 or 20 (Jagged Bastard Sword +3)
    Action Point (Shadow Assassin's Action): When you spend an action point to take an extra action, you also gain a +4 bonus to attack rolls until the start of your next turn.
    Special (Sneak Attack [Hybrid]): This class feature functions as the rogue class feature (Player's Handbook, page 117), except that you can deal the extra damage only when you hit with a rogue power or a rogue paragon path power.
    Special (Backstabber): The extra damage dice from your Sneak Attack class feature increase from d6s to d8s.
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)23:05 No.7763761
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    Marking:
    Marking (Nature's Wrath [Hybrid]): Once during each of your turns, you can mark one adjacent enemy as a free action. This mark lasts until the end of your next turn.
    Immediate Interrupt (Warden's Fury): When an enemy marked by you makes an attack that does not include you as a target, you can use Warden's Fury against it as an immediate interrupt.
    Immediate Reaction (Warden's Grasp): When an enemy marked by you that is within 5 squares of you makes an attack that does not include you as a target, you can use Warden's Grasp against it as an immediate reaction.
    Second Wind (Lifespirit): When you use your second wind, an ally within 5 squares of you can spend a healing surge and make a saving throw.
    Second Wind (Parry Bracers): When you take the total defense or second wind actions, you gain a +2 item bonus to all defenses until the beginning of your next turn.

    Item Powers:
    Summoned Hide +2 (At-Will): Minor Action. You banish this armor to a secure extradimensional location. At any point in the future, unless you are wearing armor, you can use another minor action to recall the armor. The armor appears on you as though you had donned it normally.
    Salve of Power (Daily): Minor Action. When the Salve of Power is applied to a creature, the target can expend one healing surge to regain the use of one daily power of 5th level or lower (instead of regaining hit points). If the target has no healing surges remaining, it cannot benefit from the salve.

    That should be the updated version.
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)23:07 No.7763794
    No, this thread isn't coming back.
    >> Anonymous 01/24/10(Sun)23:29 No.7764115
    >>7763794
    Well, for that it is.
    >> Anonymous 01/25/10(Mon)01:59 No.7766087
    Do you plan on using the Salve on Form of Winter's Herald or Duelist's Prowess?
    >> Anonymous 01/25/10(Mon)02:00 No.7766097
    Please post your stuff on /adv/, the new general advice board.
    >> Anonymous 01/25/10(Mon)02:27 No.7766443
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    >>7766087

    Form of Winter's Herald would be a significantly more beneficial daily attack power. The aura of difficult terrain that it creates improves your "stickiness" as a defender and prevents enemies from breaking flanks. The +1 AC and cold resistance 5 are fringe] benefits. While Duelist's Prowess, unlike Riposte Strike, does not demand a hit from Riposte Strike and is more accurate due to it targeting Reflex rather than AC, it is a moderately redundant power nonetheless.
    >> Anonymous 01/25/10(Mon)03:31 No.7767242
    >>7766443
    Ah, okay. Was just thinking that Duelist's Prowess was more strikery.
    >> Anonymous 01/25/10(Mon)03:55 No.7767500
    I, for one, really like the custom format that you use for your builds. It's more pleasant to see than just another Character Builder dump.
    >> Anonymous 01/25/10(Mon)06:45 No.7768893
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    >>7767500

    Use it wisely.

    Level:
    Race:
    Class:
    Class Feature:
    Paragon Path:
    Epic Destiny:

    Ability Scores:
    Level 1: Strength
    Level 4: Strength
    Level 8: Strength
    Level 11: Strength
    Level 14: Strength
    Level 18: Strength
    Level 21: Strength
    Level 24: Strength
    Level 28: Strength

    Feats:
    Level 1:
    Level 2:
    Level 4:
    Level 6:
    Level 8:
    Level 10:
    Level 11:
    Level 12:
    Level 14:
    Level 16:
    Level 18:
    Level 20:
    Level 21:
    Level 22:
    Level 24:
    Level 26:
    Level 28:
    Level 30:

    At-Will Attack Powers:
    Level 1:
    Level 1:

    Encounter Attack Powers:
    Level 1:
    Level 3:
    Level 7:
    Level 11:
    Level 13:
    Level 17:
    Level 23:
    Level 27:

    Daily Attack Powers:
    Level 1:
    Level 5:
    Level 9:
    Level 15:
    Level 19:
    Level 20:
    Level 25:
    Level 29:
    >> Anonymous 01/25/10(Mon)06:47 No.7768913
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    Utility Powers:
    Level 2:
    Level 6:
    Level 10:
    Level 12:
    Level 16:
    Level 22:
    Level 26:

    Equipment:
    Main Hand:
    Armor:
    Neck:
    Loose Change:

    Miscellany:
    Initiative: + ( half level + Dexterity modifier)
    Size:
    Speed:
    Vision:
    Passive Insight: (10 base + half level +
    Passive Perception: (10 base + half level +
    Trained Skills:
    Languages: Common,

    Hit Points:
    Hit Points:
    Bloodied:
    Healing Surge Value:
    Healing Surges per Day:

    Defenses:
    AC: (10 base + half level + enhancement +
    Fortitude: (10 base + half level + enhancement +
    Reflex: (10 base + half level + enhancement +
    Will: (10 base + half level + enhancement +

    Attacks:
    Attack Bonus: + ( half level + enhancement +
    Damage Bonus: + ( enhancement +
    Damage per [W]:
    Extra Critical Damage: +

    Item Powers:
    >> Anonymous 01/25/10(Mon)10:12 No.7770666
    >>7768893
    >>7768913
    Everyone else is still preferring to use the Character Builder because they don't have insane D&D memory.

    But thanks anyway.



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