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  • File : 1253567558.jpg-(95 KB, 600x750, 1244417467189.jpg)
    95 KB A Hypothetica Situation Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)17:12 No.5954268  
    There's this Paladin of Torm. He manages to get captured by the Drow. Fortunately, the matron who captured him turns out to be a sex crazed nymphomaniac and has three daughters who are also sex crazed nymphomaniacs so rather than torturing and kill him they make the Paladin into a sex toy.

    Now the Paladin is loathe to admit it but he's starting to like this arrangement. He doesn't have to work and he gets screwed into exhaustion every night by hot dark elf babes.

    At what point does the Paladin fall?
    >> Leman Russ 09/21/09(Mon)17:13 No.5954275
    The point where he breaks his oath to his god.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)17:13 No.5954276
    When he stops worshiping his god
    >> Vector !NEy29ODpvs 09/21/09(Mon)17:13 No.5954280
    rolled 7, 19, 18 = 44

    He's not helping evil by having sex with them.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)17:15 No.5954300
    I'm finding it difficult to get over my annoyance at realizing that both of those figures are male.

    >At what point does the Paladin fall?

    At the point he breaks his oath.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)17:18 No.5954342
    When he stops being ready to escape.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)17:19 No.5954352

    >At what point does the Paladin fall?

    I don't think Celibacy is a part of the Paladin's oath, so this situation doesn't cause him to fall. However, I doubt the Drow are allowing him to continue to worship Torm so he falls the first day he spends fucking the dark elves instead of praying to his god.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)17:21 No.5954377
    Faith is in your heart, you fool. Clearly these dark evil bitches are a gift from TORDEK, god of DORFS AND BITCHES, and friend to Torm.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)17:22 No.5954388
    A more pertinent question is how long he can keep the drow ladies satisfied before they get bored and kill him.

    I'm betting two weeks. Most Paladins have high STR and Con scores so they tend to be in good physical shape.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)17:23 No.5954408
    ah, but does he posess a +5 Holy Avenger... in his pants?!
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)17:24 No.5954410
    I doubt your god would punish you when you are physically unable to pray.
    >> Belisaurius 09/21/09(Mon)17:25 No.5954421
    It's less that he's fucking girls of a different alignment, it's that they have power over him.He falls when they ask him to.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)17:26 No.5954435
    Paladins fall when they lose faith in their oath and god.

    It is entirely up to the paladin when he falls.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)17:26 No.5954437

    This. Sooner or later, they're going to get bored, and sacrifice him to Lolth.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)17:26 No.5954439
    Depends. Reasonable DM? Nah, it's understandable.

    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)17:26 No.5954442
    >I don't think Celibacy is a part of the Paladin's oath
    It isn't, by core.

    I wouldn't be so sure.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)17:27 No.5954452
    Any god who requires me to not fuck hot drow bitches is no god of mine.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)17:28 No.5954461

    Paladins do not answer to gods. You can be a horrible Tormite and-

    Oh. Torm. Realms. Nevermind. Everyone answers to gods in the 'Realms.


    3.5, 3.P, or 4e? They're all handled very differently.

    But in any case, alignment follows action, not just your mindset. A paladin can't fall until he is actually presented with a choice and chooses to do something Evil (or chooses to do a LOT of things which are chaotic- i.e, enough to shift his alignment all the way out of lawful).
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)17:28 No.5954462
    is it wrong if he puts effort into it so he entertains them more and lives longer? He would be doing this to have more of a chance to escape but he is also co-operating to an extent.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)17:32 No.5954504
    I say no, anything he does to further the life of a servant of his god (i.e. himself) would be serving his god.

    In fact, you could look at this like a trial that tests his faith, if he can endure and escape without losing faith he would be that much better of a servant for it.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)17:33 No.5954516
    >At what point does the Paladin fall?

    >Now the Paladin is loathe to admit it but he's starting to like this arrangement.

    Right here. The OP supplies his own answer. The fact that he would rather be a boytoy to four bitches of Evil alignment than fulfill his oath to to gods means that he falls.

    On the plus side, he can become a blackguard and lead the Thrall armies against the surface dwellers in return for staying alive longer and receiving more hot drow loving.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)17:34 No.5954531
    But if he's good enough at being their sex toy, couldn't he just perpetually keep them in a sex induced daze, thus preventing them from causing any more evil for the rest of their lives? It may not be the best solution, but at least it works.

    "Paladins: cleansing the world of evil, 1 lifetime of HOT DICKINGS at a time."
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)17:37 No.5954560
    In a world without prevention I would assume they would eventually fall pregnant.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)17:39 No.5954579
    Only if he actually looks at it as doing his duty to subdue evil in any way he can and not "fuck yeah, lifetime of giving out hot dickings for me!"

    Now if he looks at it as "fuck yeah, subduing evil with hot dickings!" then we get into a grey area.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)17:39 No.5954580

    and what a test it is! I mean, would you want to escape from endless nights of sensual pleasure? From exotic temptresses who know just how to caress your flesh and excite every nerve? From an ocean of hot, writhing, ebony flesh sliding against your body? From the matron as she slowly crouches down to take in your engorged me....AHEM.

    Sorry, got a little carried away.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)17:41 No.5954611

    Fuck you, my manhood has become steel.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)17:42 No.5954625
    I'm sorry, I can only picture the paladin turning into their family psychologist.

    "... Why? What motivates you to do this?"

    The situation as it plays out in my head continues, revealing that the drow turn into well-adjusted, dark-skinned, white-haired, red-eyed typical Americans in the fifties. With the paladin stoically reading the Menzoberran Times newspaper and smoking a pipe in the den after tending the house's surrounding areas until it sprouts a healthy lawn.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)17:42 No.5954631
    I mean hey, as long as the pally doesn't "like" it, then he doesn't fall right?
    I mean, a guy can only do so much you know
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)17:42 No.5954632

    Keep going, getting carried away is fine on /tg/!
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)17:44 No.5954651
    >Why? What motivates you to do this?

    because they are a female ruled society and they like sex?
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)17:45 No.5954657


    Shield Womb. Magical vasectomy, motherfuckers.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)17:47 No.5954694

    There are certain herbs and roots that make a woman's body just poisonous enough that they don't get pregnant. That also isn't taking into account magic, and what not. I'm sure there's a spell out there, or three, that makes you sterile temporarily.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)17:51 No.5954732
    Aren't we forgetting something here? This is practically a death sentence. It doesn't matter how good the pally is in bed, sooner or later the drow ladies will get bored with him and start craving something new. Then it's off to the temple of Lolth for the Paladin.

    His only hope is not to give in and last long enough to successfully plot an escape.
    >> 40Kfag from /m/ !!t8iiyj3DIqR 09/21/09(Mon)17:53 No.5954773
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    fucking is falling
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)17:54 No.5954788
    You dont have to like you duty to do it. He falls when presented with the oprotunity to succesfuly escape and does not, because he would rather give hot dickings. He is alowed to give hot dickings, he is allowed to enjoy hot dickings, he is allowed to fail at his oath as long as it was not by consous choice. (aka he is alowed to try and fail, but he MUST try). My palidin is a chef also, he enjoys cooking. He wont fall because he enjoys cooking, he wont fall because he enjoys cooking more than defending the viliage from ogres, he would fall if ogres attacked and he ignored it so he could cook. Same thing.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)17:57 No.5954819

    It doesn't matter if he likes it. The gods don't give two shits about his sex life- he can plow those purple lips with gusto and scream Armageddon quotes while he's doing it.

    What matters is that he not commit an evil act, not commit enough chaotic acts to change his alignment, and that his actions don't stray from the will of Torm.

    Paladins also can't willingly associate with evil creatures. That means that if he is given the CHANCE to walk away and he chooses to be a drow fucktoy instead, he falls from grace (but is still LG, just an ex-paladin). However, if he is being FORCED to associate with evil creatures (not choosing to) then that line is moot.

    He basically falls at the point where he has some chance at escape and lets it slide past because he's grown complacent.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)17:59 No.5954845

    Faerun is not a world without prevention.

    I forget their names, but there are cheap substances which render both males and females infertile for one month. They're in the equipment chapter of the 3.0 FR Campaign Setting.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)17:59 No.5954847
    Quick Poll!

    How many of you fa/tg/uys have an erection after reading this thread?
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)17:59 No.5954848

    Breaking the oath to your god doesnt seem lawful to me, while maybe not evil.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)18:01 No.5954857
    I mourn for the paladin, but I have the Libido of an old woman.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)18:01 No.5954859

    ~monk raises semenstained fists~
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)18:02 No.5954867

    Breaking an oath is usually a chaotic act, yes. And while one chaotic act is never enough to make you non-lawful, the paladin code specifically requires him to 'keep his word'.

    But what oath is he breaking, again?
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)18:02 No.5954878
    None. As far as I know, there is nothing in the oathes about not having carnal knowledge of evil elves.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)18:06 No.5954901
    Well, if he is unable to escape how else could the Paladin avoid a very painful death in the Temple of Lolth?

    Become a Blackguard and lead thrall armies?
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)18:09 No.5954927
    > At what point does the Paladin fall?

    When he stops trying to smite evil with his penis, even though he has smites left and they are clearly evil.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)18:11 No.5954947
    It's fascinating to me to picture their pillow talk after a few months. Inevitably, he is going to question their evil ways and try to convert them (perhaps at their intentional goading), and they are going to bemusedly explain that they don't give a damn.

    If he survives this he is going to come away with a much deeper understanding of of intractable, irrepentant evil. Few paladins, I think, really understand what makes evil people tick.

    This could be both a blessing and a curse.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)18:20 No.5955042
    Hey !

    Urgent question.
    What color are the folds of a drow's vagina ?
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)18:22 No.5955064

    Depends. I had thought they, like a drow's nipples ranged from a deep red to a bright pink in contrast with their ebony skin.
    >> sage 09/21/09(Mon)18:24 No.5955091

    I hate you as a person
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)18:26 No.5955120
    Because I'm wondering about that or because I made you wonder about that ?
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)18:30 No.5955182
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    That's what the internet seems to think.

    Because their skin is pitch black, I'd always pictured the girlbits as being a dark purple (sometimes ranging into purple-red). But on the interwebs, the skin tends to be purple, so you'd lose contrast.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)18:31 No.5955186
    Why wouldn't they torture their sex toy ?
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)18:33 No.5955212
    by all that is holy, sauce please!
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)18:35 No.5955235
    Hm. Is their blood red, by the way ?
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)18:35 No.5955238

    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)18:35 No.5955239

    Both. Now I feel dirty...

    Post the picture when it's done you bastard. I think I just fell. :(
    >> Sergeant Alexandros II 09/21/09(Mon)18:36 No.5955244

    So Drow Tales.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)18:36 No.5955246
    I assume so; they're (relatively) recent descendants of elves.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)18:36 No.5955247
    drowtales, you need to subscribe to see the good bits and apparently the author threw a hissy fit and is not making anymore porn.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)18:37 No.5955252
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    did someone said paladin?
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)18:39 No.5955262
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    did someone say rape?
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)18:39 No.5955263
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    >did someone said
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)18:39 No.5955264
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)18:41 No.5955275
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    >> Heretical GM 09/21/09(Mon)18:52 No.5955381
    He falls at the point he would choose this life, over his divine appointment to smite evil.
    Though as others have said and suggested he has a bright future ahead of himself as a black guard. Plus with that man priestess of Lloth around getting a fiend summoned to make a deal with should be easy enough.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)18:52 No.5955386
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    >59 posts and 2 image replies omitted.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)18:53 No.5955399
    When he starts associating with them because they're evil -- I assume.

    So basically what >>5954342 says
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)18:59 No.5955465
    You are now aware of the fact that the OP's picture contains two guys. Manually.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)19:00 No.5955478
    It's true--it's on y-gallery somewhere
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)19:07 No.5955546
    Mage Slap!?
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)19:19 No.5955648

    That is seriously some of the dumbest shit I've ever read. And I liked the BoEF.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)19:25 No.5955711
    to the paladin it would be like sticking his holy meatstick in the crusty chuff of a bugbear.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)19:27 No.5955730

    The Conductive Kiss feat is kind of nifty.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)19:30 No.5955759

    And Smooch Spell for the arcane version.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)19:30 No.5955772
    Damn abbreviations... Which was that again?
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)19:31 No.5955779
    pic related, i´d cleave and smite it.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)19:33 No.5955800

    Book of Erotic Fantasy.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)19:36 No.5955837
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    fucking forgot my pic
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)19:36 No.5955839
    Problem with OP's pic;
    Define 'dickings'.
    Define 'variant paladin'.
    Please explain what makes variant paladins good/better at this.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)19:38 No.5955860

    It should have Hide Power as a prerequisite.

    I was talking specifically about the "shield womb" spell, though. In general, the author clearly isn't a very good game designer, but there are still some neat ideas here and there.

    But temporarily teleporting your ovaries to your god's plane of existence and leaving them there for the duration of the spell? Christ. I don't even know the name of the disorder that a wizard or cleric would have to have to invent this spell.

    I spend my life worshiping Sune, finally die in a crazy drunken orgy, and make my way to Evergold, and what do I find?
    Goddamn ovaries floating around everywhere.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)19:39 No.5955872

    Where the hell are her nipples supposed to be?
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)19:41 No.5955884

    Damn that's hilarious. Doesn't BoEF's Block the Seed or whatever do the same thing, but without the lulz?
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)19:43 No.5955910
    On her god's plane of existence.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)19:47 No.5955964
    Underneath the cloth that matches her skin tone that is anchored to that leather getup.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)19:47 No.5955966
    Say a chance was given to the said paladin of Torm to slit them drow bitches' throats in their sleep was given knowing the next day he would be sent to the temple of Lolth to be sacrifice

    if paladin kills them in their sleep does it constitutes into falling knowing if he does not do it death would come?
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)19:49 No.5955981

    Posting in an awesome thread.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)19:55 No.5956039

    Looking at the rules, that has some evil potential. Cast on pregnant woman, shove her into a portable hole. Hop to your deity's plane for a free baby, while the would-be mother is now barren.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)19:57 No.5956064

    Or you could poison the organs and/or baby.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)19:57 No.5956066
    I'll do one better:

    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)20:14 No.5956250

    The best contreceptive has a failure rate of 15%? I thought even then the good ones had a good chance of preventing pregnancy.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)20:21 No.5956342

    It suffers from copypasteitis. Things like a flesh to stone fluid burning stuff.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)20:38 No.5956538

    Alaric slumped back into the soft silken sheets. Two slender, ebony bodies slithered next to him. His naked legs were spread over the edge of the bed and the matron's middle and youngest daughters were eagerly licking the generous load he had blown off of each others naked bodies. The matron and her eldest daughter were on his left and right sides respectively. The matron ran her hand over his muscular chest, her snow white hair splayed out behind her, staring at him with her violet eyes. The eldest ground against his leg, growling hungrily.

    It took Alaric a moment to regain his voice. He stared into the matron's eyes. "Why do you do this?" He asked between pants. "Use people like this?" She languidly ran a finger over the Paladin's muscular chest before replying. "Why shouldn't I? You surface dwellers are all inferior. It is natural that the superior race should use you for abstinence and.." she giggled "amusement."

    "What if the roles were reversed, matron?" Alaric asked, "what if I had kept you a prisoner and raped you whenever I pleased?"
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)20:44 No.5956624
    Coulden't he just kill the two evil drow bitches while they try and get it on with him?
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)20:47 No.5956668


    "Oooh, mother! Maybe we should try that next!" The eldest daughter had stopped grinding on his leg and now moved up parallel with her mother, caressing the captive Paladin's face. Her pale, blonde hair caressed his chest as she moved her deep, amber eyes to stare into his.

    Alaric felt two heavy weights on his legs, he looked down and saw that the middle and youngest daughters had finished licking each other clean and now were sitting on his legs. The middle daughter sat attentively listening, her long aqua hair and pearl draped figure was a paragon of lust. The youngest sat to her left, not as well developed as her sisters and mother she was still quite shapely with her small, perky breasts and bobbed white hair. She pumped his limp member in one slender hand.

    The mother giggled in response to her daughter's eagerness. "Well, sir knight." She said. "I would not be so weak or foolish as to fall into your hands, were you so inclined. Besides, I am a realist. You would never do such a thing to me. It is against your Paladin's code." She shifted her position and kissed her way up his chest to his lips. "Besides," she breathed before plungeing her tongue into his mouth and withdrawing. "If you can still talk, I don't think you're completely exhausted yet."

    She ran her hand down his chest, his stomach soon she was reciting the arcane incantation he knew all too well. "Delightful Hardness." The daughters cooed in appreciation as Alaric soon became erect again.

    This was going to be a long night.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)20:49 No.5956692

    Gonna have to ask for more of this.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)20:49 No.5956693

    DAMMIT NO! You can't end there! I'm not finished yet!
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)20:54 No.5956744

    Quick, write moar!
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)20:55 No.5956758
    When they stop serving lawful good. Being a sex toy isn't opposed to this.

    Paladins do not draw there power from any specific god by core. They draw it from lawful good energy plane. Variant paladins draw their power from other planes, but regardless they are champions for the defined shit that goes on in the planes to which they are "aligned." Get it?
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)21:00 No.5956814
    >Problem with OP's pic;
    >Define 'dickings'.
    >Define 'variant paladin'.
    >Please explain what makes variant paladins good/better at this
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)21:17 No.5957014

    All divine spellcasting and divine SP/SU abilities in the 'realms are reliant on a diety.

    Even a ranger can lose his spellcasting.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)21:18 No.5957029
    ... Which is important because OP specifically said "Paladin of Torm" (that's the important bit).
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)21:19 No.5957040
    We all know that Paladins are all lawful homo. So whats the point of this thread?
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)21:21 No.5957061
    Torm is the "god of Paladins" in that he's their patron, however they do not draw power from him specifically; It might help to think of him as their font on the plane of Faerun to Elemental LG, ...but he can be bypassed.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)21:24 No.5957074
    Nah man, Clerics of Ao, Elemental Clerics, etc. It can be Planar as much as it can be Deific. Hell in the case of Dark Sun dudes were getting granted sphere access via Dragons.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)21:24 No.5957083

    No he can't.
    Not in third edition Forgotten Realms. Go read the book.

    FR specifically says that ALL divine classes must have a deity, and that that deity can take their powers away. This is an exception to the core rules.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)21:27 No.5957099
    >>5957074 Dark Sun

    Is that part of Forgotten Realms? I'm a little rusty on my settings.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)21:28 No.5957107
    In one edition out of many. In that specific point in the timeline. Spelljammer says otherwise; Blahblahblah. The point is that there are many different flavors and ways to look at deities, alingments, and "divine" casting in D&D and there seems to be a shit ton of "it's this way and only this way" regarding the concepts.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)21:28 No.5957110
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    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)21:28 No.5957111
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    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)21:30 No.5957125
    Dark Sun is a setting all it's own, and an excellent one.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)21:31 No.5957130
    Forgottem Realms/Faerun is like one crystal sphere amongst many. Dark Sun is another one. Spelljammer is where you cruise around between them. Planescape was the super-nexus city where all points come together. Ravenloft was some crazy mist that crawled between them or some shit.

    Basically the "core" rules to D&D and AD&D are about the greater cosmology of all the planes, the various "Settings" being beneath them and having their own tiny twists and variables. Any homebrew setting is suppose to be your own sphere with its own rules that can just sort of be dropped in.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)21:32 No.5957142

    And aren't we talking about the Forgotten Realms, meaning where paladins get their powers from in other settings is irrelevant?
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)21:32 No.5957144
    The problem here is that the paladin serves Torm, a deity found only in Forgotten Realms.
    In Forgotten Realms, a paladin must worship a deity.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)21:33 No.5957162
    The Paladin does not fall simply for being raped by evil beings, even if he comes to enjoy it after a while. That's retarded, and gods are not retarded.

    If a DM has to go through mental gymnastics to determine if a Paladin should fall, the answer should be, "no." The gods don't hang out watching their servants with big, shit-eating grins, waiting for the perfect moment to randomly take their powers away and loudly guffaw, "haw, haw! You lied when you told your mother you were thinking of settling down! No I don't care if you did it to make her feel better, you can't fucking lie so enjoy having no powers, mortal! Teach YOU to dedicate your entire life to serving me faithfully!"
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)21:35 No.5957185

    Couldn't the paladin Mata Hari himself, trying to get info while still enjoying himself?
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)21:37 No.5957204
    Yeah but if you'd been paying attention the details/rules of that setting vary amongst not only the settings internal timeline but the fucking editions of the game.

    So we have multiple answers.
    1.) He falls when he fails Lawful Good as its champion.
    2.) He falls when Torm decides it is so.
    3.) He falls when he loses faith.
    4.) He falls when his actions shift the balance the wrong way.
    5.) Who cares a good DM handles worse because this is a fanboy wankoff in a game we'd be embarrassed to play.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)21:38 No.5957209


    I started to say the same thing you did about paladins earlier in the thread, then I noticed that he was talking about Torm, and remembered what setting Torm was from.

    I assumed he was talking 3e because it's harder than that for paladins to fall in 4e and because no one on /tg/ plays 2e.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)21:38 No.5957215

    Depends on how anal his god wants to be. If his god is a big-time "NO DECEPTION YOU MUST CHARGE WHILE YELLING AT ALL TIMES" kind of deity, he might get pissed that his stalwart champion would resort to low cunning and trickery to get information. Most deities would be pretty pumped that he was willing to try to spin any situation for the greater good, though.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)21:41 No.5957244
    This is why in Faerun the variant Paladin you want to play is a Paladin of Ao. You're like Jean Claude Van Damme the Time Cop.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)21:42 No.5957246
    Maybe the god is some kind of warhammer aspie tard who throws a tantrum when one of his models "fails" him in a way and smashes it, even though he's spent hundreds of dollars on it.

    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)21:44 No.5957265
    Unless he didn't have the skills or really wanted to be a Paladin, he should just become a Black Guard.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)21:44 No.5957267
    Paladins of Faerun (and clerics, druids, rangers...) continue being able to cast spells even if they're not on Faerun at the time. So the idea that they're linked to JUST that world's god is wrong.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)21:45 No.5957279
    No, but I play 1E.

    In which case he falls when- and only when- his alignment actually changes.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)21:48 No.5957315
    I appreciate the non-linear thinking, but no, you're still wrong. FR is part of various meta-settings, but these meta-settings are not part of FR, and how things work in Spelljammer or Darksun or Oerth or Oz or Never Never Land has nothing to do with what happens to a paladin of Torm.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)21:48 No.5957316
    You know I think it's worth noting that (in Faerun especially) if you're not down with what the gods are up to, hey, not only the rules but the setting more than allows you to FIGHT THEM AND REPLACE THEM WITH YOURSELF.

    "Ao I got a problem with your boy Torm?"
    "Ugh how did you get this number. ...Wait where the fuck is Myrkul? Who is this little girl. medamit you guys. I am hitting my Time of Troubles button again. Figure your shit out. *click*"
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)21:50 No.5957338
    That reads more as a clarification that the rules of Paladins change between settings, and that all settings have a meta-cosmology that it helps to understand if you want to start arguing shit like alingment.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)21:50 No.5957339

    You do realize that deities aren't usually constrained to remain within the plane of existence their followers inhabit, right? They kind of hang around the planes, being powerful and distant. There's no reason Torm couldn't go, "huh, what the shit is one of my boys doing in Eberron? Well, fuck it, I'll send a little mojo his way so he can figure out how to get back."
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)21:52 No.5957364
    Which could be a whole crazy start for a planeswar! Torm is a demigod, he'd be going over a bunch of godheads and elemental laws!
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)21:53 No.5957375

    Unless that Paladin of Torm is actually a Spelljammer/Planescape/other metasetting character and he happens to be in Oerth when all this goes down, of course (sorry, I realize re-reading how inconsistent that sounds). And if the DM further doesn't rule that the metaphysics of his home setting travel with him (I have honestly no idea if or how this is addressed in the rulebooks for those settings).

    That's a nitch case, however; bringing that up is like starting a thread about what Link would do in a given situation and someone responding "He would just ask Mario or Sonic for help".
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)21:55 No.5957391
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)21:57 No.5957419
    I'd like to think he would ask Samus.

    But really you're touching on something I see as a fundamental misunderstanding/ignorance when we get all these D&D/edition wars threads. Depending on the particular author or edition Faerun DOES tie into other games, and it's hard to break down what is essential "canon" and what isn't.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)22:01 No.5957459
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    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)22:01 No.5957468

    It still exists as a distinct setting, and it's foolish to assume we are talking about a different/larger setting when someone mentions the 'Realms.

    Chiming in to mention that said character -might- actually be a planescaper and thus subject to different rules is okay, sure. But using it to cover your ass because you forgot how paladins work in the 'Realms is 100% bullshittery.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)22:03 No.5957489

    I think this is how most gods are roleplayed by most DMs.

    It's a power thing.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)22:03 No.5957493
    >He doesn't have to work and he gets screwed into exhaustion every night by hot dark elf babes.
    >He doesn't have to work

    This is not a pro to a Paladin. They are keeping him from vanquishing evil, saving world, etc. When he's okay with that, he falls.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)22:06 No.5957508

    Paladins fall for committing evil acts. ACTS.

    Christ, it would be so much safer to play a paladin in this world if people actually read the godamn rules once in a while.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)22:07 No.5957519
    The time spent screwing the drow keeps them from killing innocents.

    Problem solved.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)22:09 No.5957534

    This was honestly my initial thought.

    If they weren't slathering hot elfish lovings all over him, they would be doing something else for entertainment. Like torturing captives, or plotting conquest.

    The paladin distracts these villains with his dick, thus saving untold lives.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)22:09 No.5957539
    Here's a question: if the paladin manages to bang the hot drow matron in the ass, does Torm give him respek knuckles?
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)22:10 No.5957546

    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)22:11 No.5957550

    brb, converting to Torm
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)22:11 No.5957559

    Torm's knuckles are the size of basketballs and descending mysteriously from off-screen. Paladin returns said knuckles while striking kind of a wryyy-pose with his dick in a drow.

    Someone draw it.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)22:12 No.5957568
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    If he uses smite evil with his penis, yes.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)22:13 No.5957584
    Well sure. But chill the fuck out and realize "how Paladins work in the 'realms" is not a constant by any means.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)22:14 No.5957585
    Aiding or abetting evil in any way is grounds for falling.

    By providing entertainment and comfort to the enemy he is a traitor to the cause of his god.

    Unless it's rape, his ass needs an atonement.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)22:14 No.5957590

    "Smite" is a relative term. Maybe he's not dispensing fiery justice, but that paladin sure does have his dick buried in that drow matron's asshole.

    And fucking evil in its asshole is the truest sign of a hero.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)22:18 No.5957631
    .. Why am I suddenly remembering the "Pussies, dicks, and assholes" speech from Team America (Fuck Ya!)?
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)22:19 No.5957644
    Because you're a fucking idiot who can't tell when even simple minded libertarians are being ironic?
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)22:20 No.5957647

    Don't you have to actually attack to smite evil? You can't just, you know, smite while shaking someone's hand, so how could fucking someone be considered an unarmed attack unless your dick was so hard that you could break bones with it?


    >by providing entertainment and comfort to the enemy he is a traitor to the cause of his god.

    Noble paladin invites evil emperor to a peace meeting. Noble paladin decides to be a good host, and hires musicians and cooks so that he can try to persuade the evil emperor to turn away from his evil ways over a tasty meal, to the accompaniment of soothing music. PALADIN FALLS
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)22:20 No.5957654
    Yup, there can be no peace with Evil.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)22:21 No.5957658

    Not supported by the rules as written. Stop imposing your own arbitrary absolutism on a game which already has more than enough absolutes.

    And fyi, "you will be tortured and sacrificed if we don't find you fun" is rape by any modern definition, no matter how things actually play out.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)22:22 No.5957669
    Fair enough.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)22:22 No.5957670

    Do the trolls on /tg/ even try anymore? It seems like there are dozens of shitty "you're a stupid faggot you stupid faggot" trolls for each truly inspired or rage-inducing troll.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)22:23 No.5957680
    Actually, that's always been the understanding of how it works. You just don't like it.

    I will never understand why neckbeards have so much trouble understanding sticking to a code.

    >My paladin fell for setting fire to the innocent puppy orphanage? Fucking gms.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)22:24 No.5957689
    Well you see son, sometimes on the internet when they call you a fucking idiot, it's because you're a fucking idiot. Not because they want a response.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)22:25 No.5957695

    "Kill all the evil, no peace, no redemption" is pretty much exactly opposite to how Paladins work. Paladins can sense Evil, and there are lots of petty evil folks out there - selfish cutpurses, unscrupulous businessmen, oily politicians... by your definition, a paladin's only option - and the only sensible option - would be to walk up and stab them all in the face, regardless of how much social chaos and long-term suffering it would cause.

    Here's a question for you: an evil guy surrenders, throwing aside his weapon. Does the paladin let him go, take him prisoner, or execute him? Why?
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)22:25 No.5957697
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    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)22:26 No.5957699
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    He is implying that the paladin's cock is a fearsome instrument of righteousness.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)22:27 No.5957709

    What the hell is that?
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)22:28 No.5957720
    wait, whats the fuckin point of being a paladin if it isnt? I thought that was their top tier ability?
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)22:28 No.5957722
    People who took that fucking 'comedic' rant as the gods honest truth need to be put down like fucking dogs.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)22:28 No.5957724



    You have no idea how the paladin's code works. Also, comparing being imprisoned as a sex toy and not overly minding it to burning puppies alive is probably the strangest, and silliest, strawman argument I've ever seen.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)22:28 No.5957727

    Quote the part of the code that this paladin would be violating if he enjoyed being raped every night.

    Use any edition you like.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)22:29 No.5957739
    How wonderful.

    You choose to argue for your point by bringing up examples that are nothing like the first two examples actually being argued.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)22:30 No.5957757
    I don't think he implied that it was the gods-honest truth, any more that he implied "fucking evil in its asshole is the truest sign of a hero" was the gods-honest truth. Furthermore,

    u mad?
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)22:30 No.5957759

    Nobody took the dicks/pussies/assholes speech as anything remotely close to true. They just thought it was funny like every tired, stupid pop culture reference starts out funny. You sure are angry about a stupid scene from a stupid movie.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)22:31 No.5957775
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    >This was going to be a long night.


    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)22:31 No.5957779

    # A Paladin cannot associate with any character that persistently commits acts which would cause the Paladin him/herself to Fall - notably Evil creatures.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)22:33 No.5957806
    It wasn't a comparison you simple minded twat.

    It was an entirely different use of hyperbole to illustrate how people have taken this paladin falling business to the complete other side of craziness until there's not really anything special about the restrictions to playing one at all.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)22:34 No.5957809

    Examples are an important factor when a sweeping statement is presented as absolute. They help point out that statement's fallacies.

    For example, someone says, "there can be no peace with Evil." That's it. Examples or no, he's just presented that as absolute. Why, then, is it unreasonable to point out that there are lots of evil people living within, and contributing to, society, and that waging constant war against them would cause more harm than good?

    It was a dumb position justifying an even dumber paladin-falls scenario. I'm just pointing that out.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)22:34 No.5957813

    Doesn't it specify willingly associate?
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)22:34 No.5957814
    So being raped by Drow counts as association?
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)22:34 No.5957819
    Internet.. Its serious business!

    But more on the topic at hand, your paladin shouldn't fall unless he just gives in and lets himself be intoxicated by lust.

    For example, all three of the drow women, for whatever reason, are indisposed or gone or what have you, they forgot to lock his cage/collar/hand cuffs, and he has a good chance to get away. If he decides to stay instead for hot sexxorz, then ya' he should fall because he's willingly neglecting his code.

    That is my two cents anyway.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)22:35 No.5957826

    >backpedaling and an ad hominem attack

    u mad?
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)22:35 No.5957830
    I think any serious /tg/ browser or D20 type should know by now that any "absolutism" on this forum is just a trolling attempt.

    Unless we're talking about red things going faster.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)22:36 No.5957841
    It does not imply becoming a sociopath, it implies that you never stop working within the law to stop evil.

    Aiding, abetting, or in the evil emperor example the appeasing of forces of evil is actively caving in.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)22:36 No.5957842
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    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)22:37 No.5957855

    There is a problem with your argument. The Paladin is not associating with evil by choice. He's being held captive and threatened with a very painful death if he does not satisfy his captors.

    By that definition, any Paladin who falls into the hands of the enemy also Falls.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)22:38 No.5957877
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    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)22:39 No.5957882

    He didn't "associate" with them. He was imprisoned by them.

    The code does not say "If forced against his will to associate with evil creatures the paladin must not like it".

    The point where the paladin violates the part of the code which you quote is the point where he has a chance to NOT associate with them and chooses to associate with them anyway.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)22:39 No.5957884
    I think the latest incarnation of Torm might prefer his boy takes the painful death. After all, when you know your god is real and heaven's rewards are a definite, grey area decisions become a lot easier.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)22:39 No.5957885
    It doesn't actually, but yes, it would be crazy to force him to fall for unwillingly associating. In this example though, he is not actively seeking escape, and enjoying the "associations" in question.
    Where is the backpedaling?
    And yes. Very. Frothing. But mostly because you're here and not in /v/ with that tired meme.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)22:40 No.5957891
    >It does not imply becoming a sociopath, it implies that you never stop working within the law to stop evil.

    But then you're making compromises to maintain the peace while trying to work against evil. What happens if the law expressly forbids you from taking any further action against, say, an evil businessman? If you accept, you are accepting peace with evil and you (apparently) fall. If you refuse, you are breaking the law, and you presumably fall.

    >Aiding, abetting, or in the evil emperor example the appeasing of forces of evil is actively caving in.

    So inviting a despot to a conference to try to convince him to turn away from his evil ways and rule justly is "actively caving in" to evil?

    Hmmmmm. I take it paladins do not negotiate with terrorists. Oh well, I'm sure those slave-soldiers and indentured peasants won't mind the bloody war that's about to ravage their land and kill them all.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)22:41 No.5957908
    Not seeking escape, ENJOYING SLOTH (nevermind the sex), and enjoying the 'company' of some of the most evil creatures in his setting.

    Shit, this wouldn't even be an argument if he was fucking, say bugbears or something. Ya'll just want fictional pussy.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)22:41 No.5957909
    >The code does not say "If forced against his will to associate with evil creatures the paladin must not like it".

    Jesus Christ I lol'd
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)22:42 No.5957916
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    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)22:42 No.5957917

    You are the reason why unintelligent or inexperienced players should not be exposed to the alignment rules.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)22:43 No.5957929

    While it doesn't mention he isn't actively seeking escape, I think most of us agree that if he does stop trying, or doesn't take a chance if he got one, he would fall.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)22:44 No.5957933
    Enjoying sex won't make you fall. The point at which he passes up a chance to directly serve his god in favor of sex is the point at which he starts to fall. So, let's say the youngest daughter starts to fall for him and asks him about Torm, if he chooses to just ignore it and bang her instead of helping her, possibly converting her to good, Torm looks down on that. Remember, Torm is a god of duty.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)22:44 No.5957934
    >Not seeking escape

    Show me where the OP says this.

    Also, a paladin can enjoy whatever he fucking wants as long as he doesn't actively do anything evil. If he gets raped by fucking Lolth, it's his prerogative to have a smoke and sigh contentedly afterward. He didn't seek the drow out, they captured and enslaved him. The fact that he has a particular set of feelings on the matter changes nothing.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)22:44 No.5957942
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    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)22:44 No.5957945
    1.) No one ever said he wasn't trying to escape. In fact, what most of us are saying is that he falls the second he fails to make a reasonable (read: sane) effort to escape.
    2.) There are no rules saying what the paladin can or cannot enjoy. The rules also never mention sloth. You're making this shit up.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)22:44 No.5957946
    Here's an additional complication you can throw in. What if the Paladin in question is MARRIED?
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)22:45 No.5957950
    We don't know if the Paladin isn't looking for a way to escape. What we do know is that he is sexed into exhaustion every night.
    Maybe..you know, he has no time or is kept constantly chained or something.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)22:45 No.5957957
    Your first argument is ill defined. If it is considered a just law by his god, he can work around it through other means. If it is a law that simply says, ignore this evil, it is an unjust law and he can ignore it.

    There is no complicated contradictions here.

    Yes, in the land of D&D with a paladin of Torm, there is no grey area with the emperor. If he is big E Evil, then there can be no peace save that of absolute surrender.

    If the peasants suffer, that is on the emperor and their own souls, not the paladin.

    Paladins do not compromise. That's the point.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)22:46 No.5957961

    Makes no difference, except that he'd probably feel more guilty about the whole thing. He's being raped, dude. It's not like having a wedding ring suddenly causes that to be a mortal sin.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)22:46 No.5957963

    It doesn't affect the moral metaphysics at play one bit, I think. But it is going to fuck with his head.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)22:48 No.5957981
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    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)22:49 No.5957993
    >Paladins do not compromise. That's the point.

    No it isn't. Any remotely reasonable person can see that the absolute refusal to compromise leads to far greater evil and suffering than a reasoned, pragmatic approach to one's problems. If the evil emperor isn't going to surrender and your options are either, "negotiate with, talk down, and gradually reform the emperor, and create a just society over time," and, "swing sword at emperor, start war, millions die, empire becomes dystopian hell due to resource drain and civil infighting," and you choose the latter, you are literally the worst paladin ever and your god will cause you to fall so hard that you break the sound barrier.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)22:49 No.5957997
    The rules also never mention skinning a mother of three, wearing said skin as a costume, and then raping the children mercilessly while shouting "MY PALADIN IS BASED OFF OF FATAL".

    Yet we assume that these acts which are commonly viewed as "wrong" (to different degrees) are against a paladins code.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)22:51 No.5958011

    Hiring minstrels for your meeting with the emperor is not "compromising to evil".

    It is an act which will benefit an evil creature, but it is not an act which will further the cause of Cosmic Evil in ANY way, shape or form.

    Your views are stupid and are not supported by the rules as written. Crawl into a bag of shit and zip it up behind you.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)22:51 No.5958014
    If this shit is in your game, you fall as a DM long before the paladin ever does.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)22:52 No.5958015

    Well, he's not inclined to look for a way to escape. After all, "he's starting to like this arrangement." So that would imply a desire to stay with the four drow ladies and get hot sexings.

    The majority are correct that he falls if he ACTS on this desire. IE everything from passing up opportunities to escape in favor of more hot dickings to full fledged pledging himself to Lolth and becoming a Blackguard.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)22:52 No.5958021

    Now explain how being enslaved, or secretly coming to enjoy sexual bondage, is morally wrong. Go ahead, I'm curious to see how you manage to come out of this one without shoving your foot so far into your mouth that you get athlete's asshole.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)22:53 No.5958031

    What about anonymous RPs on the internet?
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)22:53 No.5958033
    You're probably long gone, but his act is allowing evil to continue and not doing anything about it. What kind of god imbues a paladin with powers and just lets him sit on his ass.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)22:54 No.5958043
    Or a God would be more pissed about giving legitimacy to an evil fuck who would use the bargaining time you gave him while you were dickering when you should have been smiting to expand his empire and began a war of conquest so vast and evil it envelopes the globe.

    Coming up with bullshit outcomes to silly examples sure is fun isn't it?

    You're not a paladin. You are not just. You're neither! You're an errand boy sent by grocery clerks....to collect a bill.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)22:54 No.5958045

    From the srd:
    " "Evil" implies hurting, oppressing, and killing others. "

    What you describe is an evil act by this definition.

    Enjoying your servitude as a sex slave of vile humanoids (but still trying to escape) is not an evil act by this definition.

    Despite how vague the core definition of "evil" is, these are two examples where there is no wiggle room either way. This is not a complicated discussion. You're just wrong.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)22:54 No.5958048

    What about them?
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)22:55 No.5958052
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    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)22:55 No.5958053

    So, getting enslaved and chained to a wall, then developing a guilty enjoyment of one's regular sexual exploitation, is exactly the same as hanging around in a tavern and banging whores all day?
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)22:56 No.5958066
    I thought Drow women liked to be on top.
    >> G. D. 09/21/09(Mon)22:56 No.5958070
    >Unless it's rape, his ass needs an atonement.

    That's exactly it; the Paladin of Torm was captured and is unwillingly being turned toward a "life" of depravity by his Drow captors. He falls when he completely submits to the entirety of the Drows' perverted will, therein turning him away from his god altogether (and only if he so chooses or is forced). He only falls when his last shreds of the value of righteousness are torn away from him in this case.

    On the other hand, he can keep progressing as a Paladin and turn the matron of the four women into his "Special Mount" at Level 5, if you know what I mean. If that's not "righteous" in every sense of the word, I don't know what is.

    This actually brings up a story from my own adventures in an AIM-based game of D&D with friends.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)22:57 No.5958077
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    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)22:58 No.5958084
    I stated, when he becomes okay with the way things are. Not the fact that he happens to like his dick being in a vagina all day.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)22:58 No.5958088

    I've played shit like this out with persons claiming to be females.

    It was fun.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)22:58 No.5958089

    Not fighting the sex every step of the way is helping evil by not actively fighting it when you can.

    Fuck you too. You don't want a interesting class with certain rp restrictions and visible goals, you want another fucking munchkin tool to fuck around with the dms game.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)22:58 No.5958090

    >Or a God would be more pissed about giving legitimacy to an evil fuck

    This is nonsense. Inviting a tyrant to talk about how wrong he is and how he should be nicer to his people is the farthest possible thing from legitimization.

    >who would use the bargaining time you gave him while you were dickering when you should have been smiting to expand his empire and began a war of conquest so vast and evil it envelopes the globe.

    Yes, because a single day's heated discussion is sufficient to raise an army, complete a giant evil ritual, and subjugate everyone everywhere.

    >Coming up with bullshit outcomes to silly examples sure is fun isn't it?

    Oh, I get it. You don't have a logical or reasonable answer so you've resorted to childish bickering.

    >You're not a paladin. You are not just. You're neither! You're an errand boy sent by grocery clerks....to collect a bill.

    What the fuck are you talking about? Is this supposed to be an insult?
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)23:00 No.5958101
    Red-headed centaur paladin of Sune as a mount?
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)23:00 No.5958105

    Kern always has, and always will be, a titanic pussy when it comes to these things.

    I still fondly remember the tentacle porn picture he had drawn, posted, and then only to be followed by a huge rant on morality about choices and... not chosing to vote for tentacle porn.

    Someone who has a screenshot of that should post it.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)23:01 No.5958109
    Lets put it another way then.

    The drow physically force him to operate guillotines on a national enemy. The moment he enjoys that act, is the moment he falls and is culpable whether or not he had physical control at the time.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)23:01 No.5958113
    >Not fighting the sex every step of the way is helping evil by not actively fighting it when you can.

    Not it isn't. Giving an evil person orgasms is not the same thing as helping Evil.

    Likewise, being a stubborn ass and getting himself sacrificed would not so much as inconvenience Cosmic Evil. In fact it would probably help it.

    Your position is indefensible. Fuck yourself in the ass with a sock full of molerats.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)23:02 No.5958121

    >Not fighting the sex every step of the way is helping evil by not actively fighting it when you can.

    How the hell are you supposed to fight the drow when you're tied down? Are you suggesting that yelling a lot and being a nuisance so that they enjoy raping you slightly less (or possibly more) somehow damages their attempts to spread their influence and do evil deeds?

    >Fuck you too. You don't want a interesting class with certain rp restrictions and visible goals, you want another fucking munchkin tool to fuck around with the dms game.

    Oh I get it, you're an embittered grognard who hates it when people play D&D without the proper Gygaxian level of DM dickery.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)23:02 No.5958128
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    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)23:03 No.5958134
    This thread needs more drow porn.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)23:04 No.5958142
    Willingly providing aid or comfort to evil, even through an orgasm is, guess what, giving fucking aid or comfort to evil.

    You want nothing more than to satisfy a sad sad fetish, you pathetic sack of shit.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)23:04 No.5958144
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    >220 posts and 22 image replies
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)23:04 No.5958146
    It's totality of your actions and their end results. What you are up to internally is of no consequence to either the elemental cosmology that defines "Lawful" and "Good" or Torm. Unless you feel like shooting him a message and letting him know what's up, how you feel, and that you are not sure how to proceed. And you know what? THIS IS FAERUN, DUDE CAN ANSWER YOU.

    Sitting around and banging whores all day is all well and fine as long as you are supporting the "Lawful" system the Pimps&Hoes exchange puts forward.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)23:05 No.5958156

    I think he's more likely a fledgling, honestly.

    New players use alignment as an excuse for shallow characters and stupid behavior. As time progresses, they either learn to handle it as it was intended or they (wrongly) decide that alignment is dumb and start playing without it.

    Most of the time, at least. I could be wrong. Some people just never smarten up.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)23:06 No.5958162
    Not the guy you responded to, and I agree that you don't need to fight it every step of the way. A paladin would need to be TRYING to escape though, whether that's through scheming, waiting for the right moment, or physically resisting he has to WANT to leave.

    When he stops opposing evil, he becomes neutral at the very least.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)23:06 No.5958167

    Every little bit to fight evil is what a paladin should do, even if it's pedantic by that point.

    And you want to turn all gaming into bizarre wow style wankfests.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)23:06 No.5958169
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    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)23:06 No.5958172

    True. However, I fail to see how providing an orgasm unwillingly under the threat of horrible torture and death constitutes aiding the enemy.

    Let's change the situation around. A female paladin falls into the hands of a tribe of orcs. The chieftan rapes her, does she fall for giving him an orgasm because he's evil?
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)23:07 No.5958177
    No see it's not "fighting evil," it's "Champion of Law and Good." Fighting evil is a component but the _bottom line_ is to champion law and good.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)23:07 No.5958180
    It is strongly implied in the op, by the paladins enjoyment, that at some point, he's not exactly unwilling.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)23:08 No.5958185
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    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)23:09 No.5958193

    Evil creatures =/= evil itself.

    Helping an evil creature is not evil unless you are helping them in such a way as to empower them to perform further Evil.

    Fucking the socks off of these drow bitches does NOTHING to empower them to commit further evil, unless there's some sort of screwy orgasm-fueled spellcasting at work.

    Much like the example with the emperor and the minstrels, what it does is endear them to the paladin without encouraging or enabling their evil in any way.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)23:09 No.5958194
    God forbid people play paladins, like, ya know, paladins, and not just hybrid class #342 in a generic wackfest.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)23:09 No.5958198
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    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)23:10 No.5958201
    >It's totality of your actions and their end results. What you are up to internally is of no consequence to either the elemental cosmology that defines "Lawful" and "Good" or Torm. Unless you feel like shooting him a message and letting him know what's up, how you feel, and that you are not sure how to proceed. And you know what? THIS IS FAERUN, DUDE CAN ANSWER YOU.

    None of this changes the fact that you are imprisoned, enslaved, and powerless, and that Torm would have to be a grade A piece of shit to doubt your faith under those circumstances, let alone consider stripping you of your powers.

    >Sitting around and banging whores all day is all well and fine as long as you are supporting the "Lawful" system the Pimps&Hoes exchange puts forward.

    Wait, you're not the same guy that argued that "anytime you're not actively attacking evil as hard as possible you're helping them," are you? Are you agreeing with me or disagreeing with me? I can't tell. For reference, I was being sarcastic with the guy to point out how retarded he was being.


    >Willingly providing aid or comfort to evil, even through an orgasm is, guess what, giving fucking aid or comfort to evil.

    The phrase "giving aid and comfort to the enemy" generally refers to giving them medical care, and is a relatively recent invention. It's a nationalistic concept, not a moral one. You are retarded.

    >You want nothing more than to satisfy a sad sad fetish, you pathetic sack of shit.

    If I wanted to satisfy a fetish, I'm sure I could find much better ways to do that than by trying to explain that being in the same room as an evil person without trying to rip his face off isn't an evil deed.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)23:11 No.5958214
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    contributing dark elf pronz
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)23:11 No.5958216
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    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)23:11 No.5958217

    ...knowing this board, I think I know how people will answer that question.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)23:11 No.5958218
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    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)23:11 No.5958221
    Sex, in addition to being very fun, can calm ones nerves, provide a clear head, and provide intimacy, even if insincere.

    Also, since this is the Drow, them having some sort of bizarre half breed child to enslave and turn into a horrible monster isn't out of the question.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)23:12 No.5958225
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    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)23:12 No.5958229
    >And you want to turn all gaming into bizarre wow style wankfests.
    >God forbid people play paladins, like, ya know, paladins, and not just hybrid class #342 in a generic wackfest.
    >hybrid class

    Oh, an angry edition warrior trolling to get his frustrations out. How adorable.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)23:12 No.5958230

    There is no debate here, and there is also no debate that he will -eventually- fall if things keep going like this because he will stop trying to escape.

    What some people are saying is that he falls instantly as soon as he starts to enjoy himself or cooperate, regardless of circumstances, and regardless of whether or not he is able to make any meaningful effort at escape.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)23:12 No.5958231
    I once had a paladin fall because I cure wounds on a dying mutilated orc child chained in the dungeon of an evil wizard. DM said I helped an evil creature.

    After that my paladins were all clerics who called themselves paladins.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)23:13 No.5958233
    I'd like a response to this.

    How is his enjoyment of an evil act any different, aside from being (hopefully) less sexy?
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)23:13 No.5958237
    >Sex, in addition to being very fun

    Not really. I think you may not experience sex all that often.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)23:13 No.5958238
    >The chieftan rapes her, does she fall for giving him an orgasm because he's evil

    Duh, because during the rape she discovers she's actually a sex-crazed whore that gets off on being violated repeatedly by cocks a size category larger than she's used to. She abandons her god and church to be the tribal slut of the Orc Clan and lives happily ever after.

    I mean..that's how things like this work right?
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)23:14 No.5958240
    I once made up a bullshit story on the internet.
    Then I fell as a paladin.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)23:14 No.5958246
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    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)23:14 No.5958249

    God bless the spambot.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)23:14 No.5958251
    You really find it hard to believe that he played with a DM that was a douchebag?
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)23:15 No.5958259
    Yes I do.
    If somebody did shit like that, then you walk away, you don't keep playing with that group.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)23:16 No.5958260
    Bitchy drow do more evil than content drow. This is a very, very weak case; in fact it's more likely to turn against you than for.

    The half-drow-bastard is actually an interesting and valid point. However, I'm inclined to say that if they want his seed, they're going to get it, and there are no meaningful efforts he can take to hinder that process (short of stealing a Wand of Shield Womb and sending their godamn ovaries to the Demonweb Pits).
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)23:16 No.5958261

    Those are all straining the bounds of credibility quite a bit. That's like saying that fighting honorably against an evil creature is helping it, because you're not depriving it of any dirty tricks it could use.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)23:16 No.5958270
    I might like eating good food but I don't like being force fed, even if it does taste nice.

    NEW scenario!

    A paladin goes to sleep after 18 hours of fighting evil. He is loathe to admit it, but he enjoys resting when very tired.
    Additionally, he's cursed to be assraped by the BBEG without it waking him up whenever he sleeps.

    Does the paladin fall for not staying awake 24 hours to battle evil until he dies from exhaustion?
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)23:17 No.5958278

    Methinks thou hath watched too much hentai.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)23:17 No.5958281
    Then you're doing something wrong.
    Seriously, just what the hell?
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)23:17 No.5958282
    The paladin should convert to Suni and enjoy the hot dicking.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)23:18 No.5958286

    I'm guessing you've never lived in a small town with only one gaming group in the area, which happens to be organized by a shitty DM.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)23:20 No.5958300
    >Does the paladin fall for not staying awake 24 hours to battle evil until he dies from exhaustion?

    Obviously. If the paladin willingly ceases his vigilance and allows evil to go unchecked, even for a single night, he has failed in his duty and falls immediately.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)23:20 No.5958303
    I have.
    He was the sort that had more powerful dmpcs in greater numbers than the pcs.
    I simply offered to take over one day and the group agreed.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)23:20 No.5958308

    I commend you for taking the sex out of the issue and simplifying it a bit, but I don't think that's any different. He would fall at the point where he has a chance to save someone/delay an execution/otherwise meaningfully hinder the forces of good and fails to do so.

    If your example IS different, it's because your paladin is being forced to commit an actual evil act, while the sex-slave paladin isn't (he's being forced to do something which his code would normally prohibit [were it up to him], but which isn't evil in itself).
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)23:20 No.5958311
    Well ME thinks you haven't watched enough.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)23:22 No.5958324

    It's good to hear that you salvaged the situation, but not everyone has the opportunity to do that. The solution to a DM making a single shitty call is not to pack up your stuff and say, "well, that's that, I guess I'm never playing D&D in this town again!"
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)23:22 No.5958328
    >meaningfully hinder the forces of evil
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)23:22 No.5958335

    Yo, >>5958146 here. Oh no, I am totally agreeing. Torm would absolutely be a piece of shit to do that, and I guess really my point is that (especially in this setting) a lot of this can be addressed directly to the DM as Torm is an active participant in the Paladins oath.

    No I was not that other guy arguing, I was just joking around about how "Evil =/= evil drow chick" (Which someone else got into above this post) and that we are talking about these concepts with capital letters when it comes to breaking oaths. Essentially that "Law" supports constructed systems, even prostitution, whereas the "law" may not.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)23:23 No.5958337
    This thread is like a train wreck that never stops.

    And I love it.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)23:23 No.5958345
    Well the example is meant to be the same thing, but I think the crux of the issue is that I find enjoyment and non resistance of sex, with mass murdering rapists, to be, well, evil.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)23:24 No.5958354
    Alright, so only idiots think that being FORCED to do something makes you fall. Lets move on.

    Does he fall when
    [ ]He enjoys the sex
    [ ]Enjoys the sex as much as purging evil from the world
    [ ]Stops resisting
    [ ]Stops looking for opportunities to escape
    [ ]Would only go back to purging evil if they let him go willingly.
    [ ]Would only go back to purging if they forced him to leave.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)23:25 No.5958362

    I think you've hit on one of the biggest problems with the alignment system.

    People don't care what the rulebooks actually say. If they think something is evil, they'll call it Evil in D&D. Not only that, but they'll do so somehow thinking that the rules are supporting them.

    This leads to all manner of bullshittery, online and off.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)23:27 No.5958377
    I don't think anybody in this thread claimed that being forced made him fall.

    [X ]He enjoys the sex
    [X ]Enjoys the sex as much as purging evil from the world
    [X ]Stops resisting
    [X ]Stops looking for opportunities to escape
    [X ]Would only go back to purging evil if they let him go willingly.
    [X ]Would only go back to purging if they forced him to leave.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)23:29 No.5958401
    He falls when

    [ ]He enjoys the sex
    [ ]Enjoys the sex as much as purging evil from the world
    [ ]Stops resisting (as long as he keeps actively looking for a way to escape, or defeat them should the opportunity arise, it's fine for him to let them think they've broken him)
    [X]Stops looking for opportunities to escape
    [X]Would only go back to purging evil if they let him go willingly.
    [X]Would only go back to purging if they forced him to leave.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)23:31 No.5958427
    [ ]He enjoys the sex
    [ ]Enjoys the sex as much as purging evil from the world
    [ ]Stops resisting (as long as he keeps actively looking for a way to escape, or defeat them should the opportunity arise, it's fine for him to let them think they've broken him)
    [X]Stops looking for opportunities to escape
    [X]Would only go back to purging evil if they let him go willingly.
    [X]Would only go back to purging if they forced him to leave.
    Have to agree. Not resisting the sex isn't nearly bad enough to cause a paladin to fall from grace.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)23:31 No.5958434

    Except that what you define as evil by modern laws, your upbringing, and whatever other lens you apply is not the cosmological capital E elemental "Evil" that Paladins are directly opposed to by a magical "charge" that they draw from another dimension.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)23:32 No.5958438


    There's some fucker in this thread who's been hiveminding me for the last hour, because I was just in the middle of typing a similar post, with an astericks in the "Stops resisting" box.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)23:32 No.5958440

    I really don't think you can directly compare the two situations.

    The paladin in OP's example is a man and what red-blooded male hasn't fantasized about an aggressive, sexy woman? Let alone four of them, at the same time. Honestly, if this happened to you would you consider it rape? Wouldn't you like it just a little?
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)23:33 No.5958451

    D&D is completely based on a western liberal modern philosophical sense of right and wrong.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)23:33 No.5958457
    Never quite understood that mentality.

    "Vote for what happens next in my drow porn comic plz!"

    (voters inevitably vote for hot drow sexings)

    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)23:34 No.5958466

    This is true, but I don't think you should be trivializing that poster's views as 'subjective'.

    If anything its the other way around. D&D is a god damned game, and the moral metaphysics which they define for their reality do not have to match up with your own, serious, real-world morals.

    Half of the shit in D&D alignments is defined the way it is for ease of play; for instance, the reason we don't nail players for thoughtcrime in D&D is because it is both difficult and unfun to police a character's inner feelings at the table. Hence, we judge by actions, not by thoughts.
    >> Guardsman Redshirt 09/21/09(Mon)23:37 No.5958492
    This thread was good.

    Then it turned into paladin dickery.

    But anon saved it with hawt xxx pics.

    Well done, internet.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)23:38 No.5958498
    Except we all know there's no absolutist answer here, and that you know as well as I do that the big "E" changes not only by edition but by whatever author is penning it.

    You want to go back to the alingment base, the Vancian, because that's so "Western Liberal" it's actually... just the Arabian Nights with some fancy laser wands and is already batshit enough.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)23:41 No.5958520

    I read the "you" in this to mean the Character/Paladin and not the actual, like, /tg/ poster making the post.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)23:43 No.5958535

    You might be right, but the dude he was responding to was talking about his own opinions, not the opinions of any character.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)23:49 No.5958619

    I love you /tg/
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)23:51 No.5958636
    Time to switch patron's to Sune.
    She supports conversion thru sex if I recall my realms mythology.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)23:51 No.5958641
    Someone screencap this thread.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)23:55 No.5958683

    If I'm going to be honest with myself, I loved every minute of this thread.

    Even the drow smut. Even the paladin bullshit. Even the drow smut. Even the metaphysics hurf-durfitry. But especially the drow smut.

    This is half of what /tg/ is about to me.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)23:57 No.5958703
    >>especially the drow smut.
    Especially the drow smut. <3
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)23:57 No.5958711
    So in the greater beyond-Faerun cosmology where does "Dark Elf Smut" align?

    It's easily Good.
    ...Note the capital G.
    >> Anonymous 09/21/09(Mon)23:58 No.5958723

    Fabulous Badass.
    >> Anonymous 09/22/09(Tue)00:15 No.5958976

    DrowTales has a stupid ass creator and a dumb as shit voting system, but damn do I like their artist
    >> Anonymous 09/22/09(Tue)00:26 No.5959145
    You're welcome!
    >> Anonymous 09/22/09(Tue)01:01 No.5959540

    Also, this exchange made me laugh pretty hard.
    >> Anonymous 09/22/09(Tue)01:10 No.5959620
    I still want to see drawfaggotry of a paladin being granted respek knuckles by Torm while courageously attacking a drow matron's anus with his Holy Avenger. The mental image is way too awesome to pass up, especially when I try to visualize the paladin's expression as he receives the brofist.

    "This... this is what I have trained for all my life. This makes it all worthwhile."
    >> Anonymous 09/22/09(Tue)01:14 No.5959655

    So when do we get the fapfic storyfag version?
    >> Anonymous 09/22/09(Tue)01:22 No.5959730
    Archived, hope nobody minds.
    >> Anonymous 09/22/09(Tue)01:24 No.5959739
    suptg right?
    >> Anonymous 09/22/09(Tue)01:25 No.5959746
    Does that posters view have multiple elemental energy planes behind him that let him pew pew golden light out of his eyeballs though?
    >> Anonymous 09/22/09(Tue)01:36 No.5959843
    drow smut makes life worth living
    >> Anonymous 09/22/09(Tue)01:39 No.5959867
    Eyeballs are dimensional pockets.
    >> Anonymous 09/22/09(Tue)01:39 No.5959872
    I'm going to third this even though I'm the one who firsted it.
    >> Anonymous 09/22/09(Tue)01:40 No.5959877
    rolled 74 = 74



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