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  • File :1242425013.jpg-(382 KB, 607x700, Frog_by_OGmouse.jpg)
    382 KB Anonymous 05/15/09(Fri)18:03 No.4560593  
    There was a thread earlier about how people more readily cared about their Fantasy characters compared to their Sci-fi characters.

    One opinion put forth was the idea that while Fantasy can essentially build characters up to defeat the biggest monsters, dragons, and demons etc while wielding unique and magnificent weapons etc, Sci-Fi characters essentially take on faceless corporations, parts of empires, monsters of a single planet, while throwing around generified weapons (a bit of customisation here & there, but mostly you could buy something from the shop that does the same job).

    So, how do you transfer that Fantasy "Heroics" into a Sci-Fi setting without turning the setting into a repainted copy of Fantasy?
    >> Anonymous 05/15/09(Fri)18:05 No.4560610
    Make your setting a place where inhabited planets with sentient life are more common than not and very little of the galaxy has been explored.
    >> Anonymous 05/15/09(Fri)18:08 No.4560647
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    Fantasy defiantly has a BIGGER base of games that give the chance fot the players to give their characters more "Face"

    alhtough sci-fi games with the same level of character interaction are low, i do believe people still care for their characters.

    i love my 40k armies, each has a story, quite often (or when i play a big battle) ill give them a few war marks, perhaps some bitz i trade at the LGS i apply, my Kharn has had to have a new base recently to cater for the wonderus pile of bodies i have under him (about 8 now)

    my ork waaagh boss has had his boss poles modified to fit more heads.
    >> Anonymous 05/15/09(Fri)18:11 No.4560663
    well you can do somewhat what star wars trilogy did where the lightsaber was a amazing weapon that was lost throughout time except to a very few people. Not to mention luke fighting the Rancor was a fairly epic enough battle. In my opinion it was a nice mixture between the sci-fi fighting the empire, with the fantasy epic battles against monstrous creatures and opposing forces.
    >> Anonymous 05/15/09(Fri)18:12 No.4560681
    Wow, that was my interpretation! I'm amazed it actually made a difference in the thread.
    >> Anonymous 05/15/09(Fri)18:14 No.4560693
    Space opera.
    >> Anonymous 05/15/09(Fri)18:15 No.4560701
    I think Necromunda gives its characters a good chance to be remembered. Mostly because it's humans fighting humans in shit end of a tower-city.

    Yes, Space is there, but nobody's getting there in the game. At best, Space is "where all the really lethal shit comes from" when you want to throw some genestealers into your game etc. There's fabulous technology out there, but all you're concerned with is shooting some dude who conned you over some turf. and then you have scars, and bionic replacements, rare bits.
    >> Anonymous 05/15/09(Fri)18:16 No.4560718
    I would say that there's a lot more to be distracted by in a sci-fi setting. Nobody really cares about the specifics of that doomsday spell, but you can nerdwank for hours over hi tech. The closer the players get to that tech, the more distraction they have from focusing on the characters.
    >> Anonymous 05/15/09(Fri)18:21 No.4560783
    >people more readily cared about their Fantasy characters compared to their Sci-fi characters.

    I still disagree with this. If you prefer fantasy to sci-fi, then yes. If you prefer sci-fi to fantasy, you'll care about those characters more. Their successes are more exceptional because they aren't legendary heroes with magic powers and "unique and magnificent weapons." Some people prefer stories about humans fighting corporations, etc., to stories about heavily armed demigods fighting gods.

    People who really like sci-fi probably don't want "fantasy heroics" in their setting.
    >> Anonymous 05/15/09(Fri)18:22 No.4560786
    Superheros are technically Sci-fi.
    >> Anonymous 05/15/09(Fri)18:22 No.4560788
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    Don't worry, I was just using anything so I could post that badass frog (who I like to pretend is a Slann). You're not Internet-famous or anything...

    Nah, I thought it was a good point. I'm sorta stuck on liking Sci-fi 'cause it's "the possible future!" while fantasy is "the non-existent past", but fantasy tempts me so.
    >> Anonymous 05/15/09(Fri)18:24 No.4560817
    Something else that is also relevant: In fantasy settings, you are often defined by the fantastic physical feats you can accomplish. In sci-fi settings you are often defined by your tech. This means that you end up pursuing money heavily, something which largely removes the heroic title character, and thus dehumanizing them by making them more human.

    If that makes any sense.
    >> Anonymous 05/15/09(Fri)18:33 No.4560842
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    Superheros very rarely leave Earth. There's really a small percentage with their own comic that actually focus on real Sci-fi stuff, instead of "superdude saves a bunch of normal dudes".

    Green Lantern Corps is probably the biggest "space adventure" comic.
    >> Anonymous 05/15/09(Fri)18:35 No.4560856
    Sci-fi characters tend to be expendable by default.
    Most games use "extra gritty" rules in order to make everything lethal.

    Corporations are meaningless opponents, because you aren't actually fighting anything. You occasionally square off against henchmen who are simply out for a paycheck, but they aren't satisfying when dealt with. Corporations are nothing more than a name that people put on their business cards. CEO, Manager, Security Guard, and the like, are all just titles given out. You get one of them, someone else simply dons the hat and it is business as usual the next day.
    >> Anonymous 05/15/09(Fri)18:38 No.4560878

    In a more general sense, in (many) sci-fi settings the characters are less exceptional than they are in fantasy.

    In fantasy, only the party can seal the demon, either due to DESTINY or CHOSEN ONE or simply being higher level than everyone else in the area. If, say, the local army tried to take down the demon, they'd die like bitches because they're all level 3 warriors.

    In sci-fi, the characters may be exceptionally skilled people, but they're probably not personally powerful enough to outfight the local army. Because foes sort of scale to the heroes, this can actually make calling in backup a much more viable option. In a recent Dark Heresy game, I solved the fuck out of a problem by telling a certain militant nobleman that a certain group of mercenaries were responsible for the death of his son. He rolled out with his house guards; all 30,000 of them.
    >> Anonymous 05/15/09(Fri)18:45 No.4560931
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    I think the "Frontier" in Sci-fi is generally used because it removes that civilisation aspect from Sci-fi. You're out in the wilderness, no support, just there to make your name on the local colonisers or whatever. And depending on what setting, it can allow lots of alien races to mix where they might not normally do so.
    >> Anonymous 05/15/09(Fri)18:47 No.4560948

    Fighting a corporation is more complicated than fighting a monster. You don't just kill what's in front of you and call it a day. You have to drive them bankrupt, arrange for them to be bought out, or otherwise influence policy.

    More lethal combat and the threat of losing a character (without resurrection magic available on every streetcorner) can also be a challenge, and, like many challenges, be more fun than the alternative. Instead of charging in, sword swinging and armor shining, trusting to your valiant heart and superior stats to see you through, you have to engage in combat like, well, real people, who don't want to get hurt, and are afraid of death. Tactics can be fun.

    Also, don't let the threat of losing a character prevent you from caring about it. You might get lucky, if you play smart. My DH game (in which we did indeed modify combat to be slightly more lethal) has run for something like 9 months with one player death.
    >> Anonymous 05/15/09(Fri)18:52 No.4561002
    Precisely. In Fantasy, the hero charges down the battlefield to cut a path to glory and adventure, to do battle with the main villain.

    In fantasy, the hero charges onto the battlefield and is vaporized by one of the enemies' Disintegrat-o-matic Tacnuke.
    >> Anonymous 05/15/09(Fri)18:54 No.4561018
    For one thing, science fiction is often alot more grim and depressing than fantasy. Which isnt to say that fantasy cant be grim, but you see more hope and so forth in D&D than Dark Heresy. Think about it:

    What bright-and-shiny sci-fi settings are out there? Star Trek is the most idealistic, squeaky-clean setting. Star wars, mass effect, firefly, Dark Heresy are all pretty fucking grim (the last one especially). Thus, sci-fi RPGs have a generally grimmer rules set, in which death happens more often.

    Ive gone 5-24 in D&D with a LN Devil-Summoning Sorceror, and I never really felt in any danger of dieing. I had enormous fun, and got to really develope him as a living, breathing, arrogant know-it-all dipshit.

    In Dark heresy, Ive played maybe 5 sessions, and in each one, someone has come close to death. Messy death stalks us at every turn, particularly from our two psykers, who seem to use their powers much more than strictly necessary.

    I'm a techpriest who uses grenades and plasma weapons. I expect to die at some point. I will miss Krell, and his crazy antics and sarcastic quips

    "yeah, the mechanus always immediately "destroys" any xenos tech they encounter. Like that time we "destroyed" a tau pirahna, and a few decades later, we "found" a STC for cheap, easy hover tech, and now we're selling hovercars like rat burgers to the upper hive richies. Now, if you dont mind, Im going to have to confiscate that disintegrator gun. So it can be 'disposed of.' "

    He will die at some point. and I'll bring in a new character, a kroot mercenary. And he will always be eating people.
    >> Anonymous 05/15/09(Fri)19:03 No.4561069
    You think Sci-Fi has it bad? Try making people enthousiastic for playing in an average every-day modern Survival Horror game.

    People don't want to survive or feel fear, they want to be awesome and win hard.

    Bloody people.
    >> Anonymous 05/15/09(Fri)19:09 No.4561104
    It's hard to do a lot of the wonder.. like legendary magic swords.

    Homeworld 2 managed it at ship-level with the Sajuuk, though. It was basically a fantasy storyline with battleships instead of elves and orcs.
    >> Anonymous 05/15/09(Fri)19:11 No.4561113
    Once they go bankrupt, they are bought out by another corporation, who will be doing much of the same shortly.

    It's theme baked into the grimdarkness of the genre, the evil of corporations(read as mankind) won't be stopped by anything short of civilization crumbling.

    Tactics are fun, but Sci-fi ups the lethality by leaps and bounds due to things like death lasers, smart bombs, and biological weapons. It's less about tactics, and more about luckily being the guy they didn't aim the railgun at when you ambushed them on the toilet. High-lethality doesn't just dosn't lend itself well to epic battles.
    >> Anonymous 05/15/09(Fri)19:15 No.4561146

    Again, it depends on the people.

    I know two groups. One group is people who don't like risk or character death. They play D&D.

    The other group like suspense, challenge, the possibility of failure. They play DH and Deadlands, and sometimes modern games. In the modern games, the DM grins and tells us to make normal people. We do so. Then, gradually, as things go to hell and people start dying, we learn what genre we're playing. Sometimes it's the zombie apocalypse. Sometimes it's vampires, or an evil cult. Sometimes it's nothing supernatural at all, but the Mafia is after you. Once, it was purgatory. Good times, man.
    >> Anonymous 05/15/09(Fri)19:17 No.4561163
    Yeah, I can't play horror at all.

    It normally requires me to act excessively stupid or the entire thing falls apart and becomes a massive railroad.
    >> Anonymous 05/15/09(Fri)19:23 No.4561200
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    Not all sci-fi is grimdark, and not all grimdark is permanent. If the DM decides that nothing you do will ultimately matter, well, there's not much you can do about that. In the games I play and run, though, you can make progress if you're clever.

    Also, as tech improves, defenses and medical technology improve along with weapons. Maybe you get a leg shot off and have to get a cyberleg. Maybe you spend several minutes technically dead until we get you to a med facility and restart your heart. I've spent my share of time floating in a tank regrowing my skin, sure. I've also (briefly) stomped around in power armor laying waste to all who oppose me.
    >> Anonymous 05/15/09(Fri)19:23 No.4561202
    D&D is for fags, Science fiction (sci-fi is bullshit faggotry) is simply the best kind of setting.
    >> Anonymous 05/15/09(Fri)19:24 No.4561212

    Well, that's just, like, your poor attempt at trolling, man.
    >> Anonymous 05/15/09(Fri)19:25 No.4561216
    d'awww that frog is awesome. :3
    >> Shas'o R'myr !!TZikiEEr0tg 05/15/09(Fri)19:29 No.4561241
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    >> Anonymous 05/15/09(Fri)19:29 No.4561245
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    A horror game needs a really good GM. Many GMs who are fine for other games can't pull off horror.

    I mentioned we sometimes do games where we make normal characters and the GM springs something on us? One of those, we wound up acting out a goddamn zombie movie. We were all experienced players, we'd all seen zombie movies before, and yet we still split up with two of us going to check out that noise in the woods while the others tried to fix the car! The GM kept us scared and confused, and it was 2 hours in before we realized what was going on. It was fantastic.

    But, yeah, Horror games are hard to run well.
    >> Anonymous 05/15/09(Fri)19:31 No.4561259
    Is this a cyberpunk version of Frog from Chrono Trigger?
    >> Anonymous 05/15/09(Fri)19:36 No.4561290
    Yea, I like a bit of BlueSky sci-fi.

    There's a sci-fi book by Terry Pratchet, where the "hero" basically gets killed (at the start of the book no less), but they manage to grow him a new body out of this green bio-tech stuff. The kid's from a rich family so they can afford it.

    Normally this tech is only used on the sorta gruff Navy-types who've lost limbs, so normally they priase anyone who has a limb made of the stuff. But this guy's whole body is made of the stuff so they're like "FUCK YEAH! You're Awesome!" even though all he did was almost die, with only his brain saveable.
    >> Meow the Magnificent 05/15/09(Fri)19:43 No.4561338
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    Alternate theory.

    SciFi has a lack of lawlessness compared to Fantasy.

    Fantasy often has that wild west feel. Actual law is confined to BIG CITIES. Step out of town.. even by a single step.. and you are no longer under the protection of the law. If someone slits your throat just outside the city gates then tough shit. The law ended right at the last building.

    There is no predefined structure or order to confine you. In a time where every corner or the planet has law? You have to answer to it even if you were the one in the right. You can't just go around playing BIG DAMN HERO without running afoul of the law. Sure, you stopped a tragedy, but you did so by murdering a slew of people. Or what will be called murder in a court of law.

    You also often serve some kind of organization. Your will isn't your own. You do what they say and fill out their missions. You aren't just a rag tag band of heroes trying to make a difference in a crazy near lawless world.
    >> Anonymous 05/15/09(Fri)19:46 No.4561361
    So start slumming, it's not that complicated.

    The Sprawl exists for a reason. Borderworlds exist for a reason.
    >> Captain Failmore Oh Shit He's Back 05/15/09(Fri)19:58 No.4561459
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    1. Stick to space opera as a rule. It's hard to go wrong with the bastard child of Sci-Fi and Fantasy.

    2. If your group is a bit more hard-nosed when it comes to realism and sensibilities, first ask yourself why you're gaming with them. Then consider how a world of the future can be made to lack the usual closure and overwhelming powerlessness and lack of identity most authors weave into their typical cyberpunk (w)underland. Do you think roleplaying with Big Brother would be any more entertaining than living with him? Oppression is boring. You know what else is boring? Getting shot.

    3. Alternately, avoid dystopias. Even post-apocalyptic settings need not be dystopian. (Adventures and conquests in the reconstruction era, etc.) Combined with a sufficiently flavorful 'why' for how the world got the way it is, you wind up with a world that's wide open where special people - made special by their own skill and determination, not the supply chains supporting them - can affect its future.
    >> Captain Failmore Oh Shit He's Back 05/15/09(Fri)19:59 No.4561464

    I said this before, and I'll probably get heckled for it, but I'll say it again: Modernity makes Sci-Fi boring. The notion that individuals are insignificant, non-influential, powerless, and functionally identical; how people define their characters by their supply chains and their benefactors as opposed to their skills or their personalities; how real and far reaching power is best left in the hands of an elite, only to be occasionally shaken by clueless revolutionaries who are actually playing directly into the hands of another cabal of elites. Kings fall in fantasy. Villages grow, and cities burn. Discoveries are made outside of well funded laboratories. People actually matter, and aren't just containers for deposits of wealth left behind by corporations for other corporations to vacuum up. Modernity is a societal expression of hopelessness, and resignation to comfort and ease at the expense of personal significance and personal experience. The modern world does not have heroes, it has celebrities.

    Avoid modernity. Maybe you're exploring new frontiers in a far away world full of danger, where you'll be separated from support for weeks or months. Maybe the world as we know it isn't there anymore, and a new one is being built with new challenges for you to face. Or maybe, just maybe, things turned out okay - and your struggles to keep it that way take you to parts unknown to fight forces unseen. Just do something, anything, that doesn't rob your players of their autonomy and their significance but instead fills them with it.
    >> Anonymous 05/15/09(Fri)20:06 No.4561498
    Speaking of Homeworld, still working on the Sands of Kharak setting... sci-fi + fantasy. Yes indeed.
    >> Anonymous 05/15/09(Fri)23:52 No.4563357
    Solution to powerless PCs in Sci-Fi: Retool the Exalted system. This will take ingenuity and about a month of carefully considered homebrewing, but I found it fun. There are plenty of ways to justify the PCs being so uber powerful, too. Maybe the group is composed of people who volunteered (or were volunteered) to undergo dangerous implantation of supersoldier/alien/bleeding edge technology and now you are technological Solars in a world of humans. Someone shoots you with an antimatter cannon? Bitch I have an impenetrable alien shield that uses absorbed antimatter to molecularly disassemble my foes. Now the story is not about gritty thugs getting shot in back alleys but instead about how you are going to start the revolution to overthrow/take over the Million Systems Empire or whatever. You don't fight henchmen anymore, you fight against nations.

    Note that the nature of sci-fi means that even death is still possible for PCs. Even a Solar will have a hard time when his ship is blown out from under him and he plummets into a star. And do you really think that you were the only ones who got the experimental implants? Or maybe other races who saw no reason to meddle in the tedious affairs of a bunch of monkies are suddenly worried about the monkies who could falcon punch their hypertechnological asses into the ground. Really, the plots and possiblites are all there and you just have to spend some time *GASP* not reading directly out of sourcebooks.
    >> Anonymous 05/15/09(Fri)23:53 No.4563364
    Seconding this. Excellent advice is excellent.
    >> Anonymous 05/16/09(Sat)00:00 No.4563411
    This sounds a lot more awesome than normal Exalted.
    >> Anonymous 05/16/09(Sat)00:04 No.4563437
    Y'know, OP's pic reminded me of how Bullywugs are basically the best Barbarians. -2 to all mental stats and +6 Constitution Frogmen are awesome.
    >> Anonymous 05/16/09(Sat)00:07 No.4563465
    I thought they had two +2s, same as everyone else (except humans of course)
    >> Anonymous 05/16/09(Sat)00:11 No.4563482
    I mean 3e, there's no Bullywugs yet in 4 as far as I know.
    >> Anonymous 05/16/09(Sat)00:11 No.4563484
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    >One opinion put forth was the idea that while Fantasy can essentially build characters up to defeat the biggest monsters, dragons, and demons etc while wielding unique and magnificent weapons etc,

    Because majority of fantasy RPGs played are D&D. Switch the system to something more lethal and grim and your characters are going to take on faceles marchant guilds, empires and few lethal but not dragon-impresive monsters.
    >> Anonymous 05/16/09(Sat)00:14 No.4563502
    For even more fun, every charm must be custom and provides an advantage and a related disadvantage. These are not normal or well understood powers, after all. Your invincible psy-shield that can deflect dreadnaught-level firepower might be awesome, but the migranes that give you negative dice to all rolls for 6 hours after use are not. Mind you this will require careful DM overview of each charm, but if you are rebrewing an entire system then you probably aren't afraid of some crunchwork.
    >> Anonymous 05/16/09(Sat)00:19 No.4563523
    You sir, are win. Post Future!Exalted, please?
    >> Anonymous 05/16/09(Sat)00:20 No.4563531
    oh, whoops, sorry. 4e is all I know. :)
    Someone here posted the stats for bullywugs, they're from the Monster Manual 2. there were 2 other races but i can't remember em
    >> !p28NxRuKMo 05/16/09(Sat)00:23 No.4563543

    You could just use something like BESM...


    Well said.
    >> Anonymous 05/16/09(Sat)00:23 No.4563547
    Kenku and Duregar
    >> Anonymous 05/16/09(Sat)00:24 No.4563551

    This is good stuff. It's pretty much sci-fi/fantasy instead of pure sci-fi, but whatever. The Deathstalker novels are actually really good examples of this style of SF.
    >> Anonymous 05/16/09(Sat)00:38 No.4563624
    Is there a system that is made for EPIC like Exalted, without being as unbearably crunchy and broken? And ideally, easier to modify for this idea?

    The closest I can think of is Feng Shui, and even that would need some scaling up.
    >> Anonymous 05/16/09(Sat)00:42 No.4563653
    It will take time, it's currently in a combination of a pile of notes and rules on paper and in-play revisions stored as margin-scribbles or within my brain. It basically boils down to, as I said, sci-fi Exalted. You could probably do the same thing I did in less time than it takes for me to assemble it all in a format that people other than myself could follow. Just do stuff like cribbing space combat rules from another system and blending them with the mass combat from Exalted; allowing you to select and 'wear' parts of your fleet and thereby use charms on those ships, with this being based on the quality of your command ship, discipline of troops, and how easy it is to personally micromanage the fleet actions.

    If there is demand I could see about typing it up in some sort of rulebook style and uploading it to RS. Would probably take a while with my current schedule, though.
    >> Anonymous 05/16/09(Sat)00:45 No.4563675
    It's possible to make this stuff work. Everyone take a moment to read some Schlock Mercenary. It has plenty of memorable characters, and plenty of memorable events. Note that Schlock has custom weapons. Tagon now has custom armor.
    If scale is no object, giving the PCs each a ship can provide for the customization. Having them fight planets and governments instead of corporations fixes the enemy problem. Giving armor and/or blood nanites makes combat less lethal.

    Giving short-term access to advanced fabrication facilities allows for some fancy physical shit. Allowing transhuman shit and aliens allows for inherently quirky characters.

    Seriously, guys, it's not a hard problem to fix.
    >> tl:dr 05/16/09(Sat)00:46 No.4563682
    Missed the thread so I'll throw in my NERD$0.02

    The big problem is simply that there's more fantasy games out there than SF, because fantasy is easy.

    Heroes and kings and things everybody understands.

    Urban fantasy a-la NWoD everybody gets as well.

    Both of these are very very easy to come up with relatable characters.

    Cyberpunk and space opera is the default skiffy ruleset. Space opera has a whiff of either GEE GOLLY ROCKETSHIPS or GRIMDARK about it, and neither one makes for relatability. Cyberpunk is mired in the 1980s EVIL CORPORATE NIPPON thing.

    Not all of that has the uberheroism thing.

    Another problem is that if you do space opera you have space ships, and if you have space ships your heroism will tend to be one guy piloting it while everyone else rolls to assist, or shoot gun turrets or whatever. The stuff you get in Firefly's pilot ep where people go and jury-rig the ship to do something else on-the-fly is one way to deal with the problem but it doesn't always come up. And anyway the sort of things you can use a spaceship for tend not to be heroic if it's a navy or space-fighter rip-off - you fly around, use built-in equipment and shoot things. No swinging from the chandelier while you scream insults at the Hated Orc.
    >> tl:dr 05/16/09(Sat)00:52 No.4563730
    So one solution is to cut out the starship piloting. Either you give everybody some kind of portal network or make it so everybody's just catching starliners everywhere rather than flying their own ships. Or do some crazy tranhuman shit and have everybody flying in space or whatever.
    >> Anonymous 05/16/09(Sat)00:55 No.4563751
    Hmm, Hyperion-style transportation systems seem like a good idea to me.
    >> Anonymous 05/16/09(Sat)00:59 No.4563789
    Its not that people don't like mutants and cyborgs. Its that almost all sci fi is either hopelessness you can never change or LOL FURFAGGOTRY.

    And moreover, there is no sci fi equivalent to D&D that involves awesome kick in the door adventuring and accumulation.
    >> Anonymous 05/16/09(Sat)01:03 No.4563828
    There can be.
    >> Anonymous 05/16/09(Sat)01:04 No.4563830
    Never had the same problem with my players, it must be a DM problem, you just gotta real them in. Keep making them feel intelligent and powerful for accomplishing the tasks set before them, and never be afraid to let the party just bounty hunt for a while. all good sci fi should allow bounty hunting, this allows the DM to make some pretty fearsome npcs to be taken down, especially if they have a crap ton of biomorphs or cybernetics.
    >> Anonymous 05/16/09(Sat)01:08 No.4563869
    So you guise don't think the dude who aims a turret is awesome? I don't know about you guys, but I'd assume the guy who shoots is more exciting to play than the guy who tries to not get shot.
    >> tl:dr 05/16/09(Sat)02:06 No.4564389
    Not true. The guy who shoots has one option and one option only: Shoot things. Admittedly you can shoot out terrain features, missiles etc but it's still pretty limited.

    Fighting in most FRPGS is hand-to-hand, so you get the option to hit the baddie but also you get to do things like swing off the rafters, throw sand in the guy's face & generally be all cinematic in your own self.
    >> Captain Failmore Oh Shit He's Back 05/16/09(Sat)02:11 No.4564431

    Another consideration to make for improving the action in your sci-fi:

    The Bullet Box.

    Replace magic wand with laser gun. Replace MP with energy, or better yet, a finite supply of blasties. Give your characters the ability to fight proficiently in close quarters, preferably in a superhuman capacity. Make managing your supplies including your ammunition a priority, not an afterthought. If that giant man-eating gronk just has to go down, shoot the fucking thing, but if the Putty Patrol comes knocking, do you really need to waste ammunition on them?




    If characters occasionally have an AT field and are impervious to all but close combat with someone else who has said AT field, WELL THERE YOU GO INSTANT EXCUSE TO KICK DICKS
    >> Anonymous 05/16/09(Sat)03:42 No.4565121
    >there is no sci fi equivalent to D&D that involves awesome kick in the door adventuring and accumulation.

    Star Wars?
    >> Anonymous 05/16/09(Sat)12:16 No.4567564
    not true
    >> Anonymous 05/16/09(Sat)12:24 No.4567624
    I didn't read the thread so I bet this shit already came up but: Star wars. either that or Mecha. If the game is really deep and involved and the GM is good something akin to dune could produce awesome characters too. Also, Superheros and Chtulhu mythos if those count as sci fi. Thats all I can think of.
    >> Anonymous 05/16/09(Sat)12:54 No.4567844
    Bump for good shit
    >> Anonymous 05/16/09(Sat)12:58 No.4567868
    BESM was here

    Magical girls are attacking your players.
    >> Anonymous 05/16/09(Sat)13:04 No.4567895
    People think Fantasy is more heroic, because Fantasy has things like ELVES and DWARVES and ORCS...

    That means it's easier for boring characters to become "special"! Take note of the "special".

    Fantasy in most cases is just a dumb quick thing to hang a lot of poor-thought-out concepts on.

    Scifi takes more trouble and therefore becomes more bland, because the retards can't give scifi some flavour.

    In short. Fantasy and scifi are the same. (Boring) elf archer becomes boring gun man.
    Get my point?
    >> Anonymous 05/16/09(Sat)13:14 No.4567942
    I think it has something to do with scale of the setting. Sci-fi is an infinite galaxy with each planet you visit having its own history culture and hereos you just don't care about because there are so many other planets you can't care about them all. You could be famous on planet Noofus but why would anyone care?

    In Fantasy its usually not just one planet but only one continent. The cultures and history are small. Its one place and one place only. You get famous there and you're as famous as anyone could be.
    >> Anonymous 05/16/09(Sat)17:30 No.4569622
    Bumping an awesome thread for the afternoon crowd.
    >> Anonymous 05/16/09(Sat)17:40 No.4569674
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    Has anyone else noticed that Fantasy heroes are always the cream of the crop, the best of the best badasses, and they always stand above the little guys.

    Meanwhile, sci-fi heroes always seem to be a collection of nobodies who manage to, against all odds, not only survive but defeat the thing that gave the rest of the galaxy so much shit?
    >> Anonymous 05/16/09(Sat)18:33 No.4570026
    This isn't really true. There's a shitton of fantasy where the underdogs win. Star Wars disproves the sci-fi part.
    >> Anonymous 05/16/09(Sat)18:38 No.4570067
    >Star Wars disproves the sci-fi part.
    The Empire falls to a planetary governor, the children of the Emperor's right hand, and the finest smuggler in the galaxy.
    >> Anonymous 05/16/09(Sat)18:53 No.4570186
    Solved in the current sci-fi campaign I'm in.

    Interrogator with psychic powers who has manoeuvred himself into a position where he has near complete control over the secret government agency he is supposed to be serving

    Mastermind scientist widely recognised as the de facto expert on nanotechnology. Responsible for the release of an ancient horror when he tried to integrate alien traits into human biology

    Special forces instructor come out of retirement one last time to save the galaxy.

    Prodigy martial artist no one knows the secret of his enormous power. Its actually the ability to teleport born of the same kind of mutations that gave my character the ability to read minds.

    Crazed mercenary with horrific facial scars but retains a way with the ladies. Completely proof against mind reading and pain.

    Combat medic who got pulled along for the ride, despite his relative inexperience has already proved vital to the survival of the team. Handy with a shotgun. Carries as many 'nades as med hypos.
    Just takes some imagination, we're really enjoying this game at the moment. I think the problem is that fantasy games tend to assume players are reasonably awesome right from the start, sci-fi, not so much. If you start sci-fi games with powerful characters it works a lot better. If you think of good science fiction novels or movies all the characters are "special" but that doesn't seem to translate into the games. Probably because people designing the games are much more simulationist in their approach. The game I'm in the process of making at the moment explicitly avoids that situation by invoking fluff.
    >> Captain Failmore Oh Shit He's Back 05/16/09(Sat)18:57 No.4570208
    how the bojangles is this thread still alive
    >> Anonymous 05/16/09(Sat)19:00 No.4570225
    Not exactly a "collection of nobodies" there.
    >> Anonymous 05/16/09(Sat)19:01 No.4570234
    Because it's archive worthy. More so than a lot of shit that actually gets put on suptg.
    >> Anonymous 05/16/09(Sat)19:13 No.4570303
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    Risus was here.

    Our Magical girls are teaming up with the Giant Robots and the Solars to fight the Vampires, Abyssals, and Sparkle-pires.

    The Vampires called in the Anti-Spirals for backup, too. Shit got real.

    And none of it took more then 30 seconds to stat out, it's cinematic as hell, and funky dice give an almost mindbogglingly wide array of power levels all fully integrated with the system. DID I MENTION IT'S FREE?

    In all seriousness, the Future!Exalted stuff sounds awesome, but I'm sick of the Exalted rules. The ST system more or less breaks down with that many dice, and perfects are silly and poorly implemented. The general theme and ideas are totally worth stealing though.
    >> Captain Failmore Oh Shit He's Back 05/16/09(Sat)19:31 No.4570431

    is it archived yet

    if not I'm totally saving it
    >> Captain Failmore Oh Shit He's Back 05/16/09(Sat)19:35 No.4570451

    and ewoks, tons of fucking ewoks
    >> Anonymous 05/16/09(Sat)19:40 No.4570494
    Pratchett book I haven't heard of? What's the title?
    >> Anonymous 05/16/09(Sat)19:41 No.4570504
    There's always fighter-pilots. Fly-boys doing bombing runs against a hail of gun fire and enemy ships.
    >> Anonymous 05/16/09(Sat)19:43 No.4570526
    Probably the other stuff.
    Johnny and the Bomb, Johnny and the Dead, Diggers, etc.
    What, you didn't know he did sci-fi? For shame.
    >> Anonymous 05/16/09(Sat)19:50 No.4570583
    I think I was thinking of a book I read at the same time as Strata, but not by Terry P. soz.
    >> Anonymous 05/16/09(Sat)22:33 No.4571720
    Fate was here.

    I have all the pros of Risus with none of the downsides.

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