On the one hand, swordfights and shit sound fun.

To counterbalance this, it is LARPing and I can't get myself to larp.

She's not a real weeaboo without double katanas.

How narrow are the grips? Wider grips should be more comfortable.

Have her use a glaive, it's the same principle, slightly different design, and 100% less weeaboo.

JUST USE A SPEAR AND SHIELD

SPARTTTTTTTTTTTAAAAAAAAAA

Check some books out from the library on swordsmanship, and make sure everyone is clear on the rules so you don't have accidents like that again.

If someone's hands are hurting, it's likely they are gripping too hard, the sword is too ridged and transmitting shock to them too readily, or they simply aren't used to the effort.

If your local LARPers are of typical quality, then just some basic practice should prove enough to see you to victory. Expect to get your ass kicked by any serious SCA people.

>>1451120
Too tight a grip. Either lighten up a bit, or take a finger off the grip. Popular choices are the index finger or the pinky, but be careful not to let the weapon slip from your hands.

>>1451122

What we're doing right now isn't LARPing, we don't have rules (other than safety rules) or characters. Seriously if you feel like it buy a pair of swords and start practicing, it's a really great workout.

>>1451132

As you can see, they're big and padded. Her hands are small enough that her fingers don't wrap them as thouroughly as mine though, I wonder if that matters?

>>1451135

Aww, if she enjoys being weeaboo that's fine by me. Besides I'm obsessively eurocentric enough that it balances out.

>>1451141

Yeah, I give everyone a briefing the first time we fight them, but now I know to repeat it on each occasion until I've really drummed it into their heads.

Gripping too hard seems like the most likely problem. And, yes, I know a couple of serious guys who fight with metal weapons and think nothing of breaking knuckles in the course of a demonstration, I have little desire to fuck with them.

Remember to abuse your guard, it's not there just for protection.

As a reward for such helpful responses, more pictures. Here are my goggles, they were stupidly expensive but I feel so much more confident wearing them.

And parrying dagger. I had this one custom made from a saber hilt and dagger blade.

>>1451249

Can you elaborate on what you mean by abusing it?

Is there a reason you're not, you know, actually fencing?

>>1451286
Use it all the fucking time.

>>1451286
Not >>1451249, but I assume they mean actively using it as opposed to hoping it'll protect you. Instead of trying to block or whatever and assuming that the guard'll catch the blade if you fail, intentionally use the guard to block the other blade whilst attacking with your own? Basically don't just use it as a backup, rather use it to enable attacks.

>>1451289

Actual fencing doesn't look as cool (Even Picard looks less suave in those suits) and tends to involve more expensive equipment and classes?

Probably fewer cracked ribs, but then where would be the fun?

>>1451289

This is more casual. I like the cartoony swords and the prospect of taking on local LARPers. I like that we can just say 'hey, want to practice?', grab our swords and go out in the garden for ten minutes rather than having to put on safety gear. I like that it isn't a sport. I suspect the gear is cheaper too.

Which isn't to say I haven't considered fencing, too, but it's quite a different thing.

>>I'm wondering if there's anything I can do to the grip to make it easier on her, but it's a very elusive problem.

Get her a fucking axe. Seriously, it'll be awesome, and give you something else to fight against.

>>an affinity with polearms.
Or a bohemian earspoon.

I was thinking it would be nice to have an axe to fight against, but I don't think it's really her thing.

The other thing we might get her is a plain old quarterstaff, she's a Xena fan on top of the crime of being a weeaboo.

Expect to find yourself in the middle of the road.

We LARPfags range from "Um, is this the right end to hold?" to "You're already dead. What, were you trying to swing?"

"First blood" or "X number of strikes" is how most LARPers spar for practice, anyway. Also, enjoy your first melee. Saber training doesn't do much for dealing with multiple angles of attack or back strikes, but it'll be fun.

(That and non-latexish LARP swords are often perfectly safe for thrusting with.)

>Also, enjoy your first melee. Saber training doesn't do much for dealing with multiple angles of attack or back strikes, but it'll be fun.

Yeah, I've been thinking about that. Even with a shield and spear I wouldn't want to have three people hitting me from different directions at once. I figure I'll either want to stay on the edge of the melee, or just go in a group and cover each other's backs.

Also, this thread is now about commenting on LARP Youtube videos.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oHg5SJYRHA0

I think this is a great one, very good spearwork in the first fight, but just watch teh guy with the daggers, crazy.

And wtf is with the goblin costume at 3:40? Looks like his mom made it.

stop fucking acting like LARP combat makes you a saber master jesus

It's just you and a few fifteen year olds from the neighborhood whacking each other with padded shit, there's no "styles" you fuckwit

>>1452105
C'mon, too easy.

>>1451120
At first I was like "Wow, this is dumb"

But then as I read on, I realized that I was stupid.

>>1452134

rage much? hes practicing to fight other larpers...

If you want to kick ass with a sabre, join a fencing club or class. Sabre fencing matches go faster than most judges can keep track of. You will rape LARPers in a couple weeks, and learn what the fuck you're doing.

>>1452292

Oh, and Epee (Rapier) fencer here: Sabres are for cocksuckers.

>>1452134
April Fools!

>>1451120
I practice with my gunblade at my localHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

>>1452292

As I said, I'm considering it. I'm pretty lazy/busy though.

>>1452301

I don't know about the real thing, but in LARP foils are very difficult to make because of the need for padding and lack of direct thrusting attacks.

Which isn't to say I wouldn't like something even lighter and more slender than my existing sword if the foamsmith can make it safe to use.

>>1452394

Foils bend when you thrust with them, and so I frequently fence Foil with my friends for practice with no protective equipment (not even masks). To make it safe, all you need to do is put on a more substantial tip and maybe wrap the thing in a bit of foam so that you can also do slicing attacks with it (yes, arming swords and rapiers had cutting ability, too, but thrusting is a much better way to kill someone).

Oh yeah, fencing swords break sometimes, making them sharp at the ends... Don't let that happen. Prevent S-curves in your foils/epees/sabres and such and don't do anything blatantly stupid that would stress the metal... That or buy an FIE Blade. They're expensive as hell, but that's because they are required to be forged to certain standards.

>>1452031

http://www.wired.com/culture/lifestyle/multimedia/2008/03/gallery_larping

Not quite Youtube videos, but it's about as good a example US LARPing as you get in the media without the "lightningbolt!" crap.

>>1452301
>>1452292
Foil fencer here.
Epee and sabre are for cocksuckers.

>>1452444

Damn yeah, when it breaks, even if it is just the normal padding on the tip that is gone it hurts tons to get hit by a thrust with that even with normal protection ><

That was a very rude awakening during my first ever fight.

>>1452692

Er... If the rubber is gone, it's kind of annoying; annoying in the same way as getting hit with your friend's BB-gun. If it breaks, it can lethally impale you.

>>1451120
You're really fat, aren't you

I mean, I can tell through your post. And your descriptions of swordfighting are almost insulting.

>>1452731

Fat LARPers? Redundancy much?

I don't LARP i Claw Battle
me and a few friends grab a shitload of coathangers and make hooks out of them, basicly its a knife fight, we get too serious sometimes and one time i got one of them in the neck, gauzed it up and we were ready to go again

also i've beaten a 2 year fencer with longsword length stick

>>1452788
Oooh, a 2-year fencer. That's what, CR 1/10?

>>1452679

Foil > All other fencing blades. You could teach a monkey to ref Epee.

Where can I get a jian or dao for this kinda shit?

>>1452798

Have fun when I grab your shitty foil and snap it between my fingers while impaling you with a real sword

damn, gonna get some wire coathangers now

>You're really fat, aren't you

Yep. I've gained ten pounds in the last 2-3 years, putting me at an oafish 135lbs.

>I mean, I can tell through your post. And your descriptions of swordfighting are almost insulting.

Only almost? I obviously need to try harder.

>>1452798

That's because Foil has lame Right of Way rules. Sure, I understand the premise: You should defend your life before your kill your opponent in a real duel. Also, you're required to have electric equipment, since the target area is only on the lame`, which means you can't stab people in the throat or face. Not as fun. Harder to ref. Less applicable to the real world.


>>1452795

Was the fencer using a sword? I've been fencing for six months, and I wouldn't let you anywhere near close enough to me to land a blow with a large, heavy sword until I was damn ready to finish you with a well place lunge or fleche. You're either you or the "experienced fencer" you dueled was full of shit.

>>1452810
I say almost because it's not nice to be mean to children and retards who can't do any better because of their natural limitations. But you try so hard, it's very brave.

>>1452869

Why thank you

>>1452896

You're not me, so why are you responding to this chucklehead?

>>1452942

I beg to differ my good sir, I am you!

>>1451301
Bit late, but yes, i meant that. I don't have any saber practice (i do hand and a half/longsword/bastard sword/choose whichever name you like, and had two rapier lessons), but i hear blocking a cut with the cup while cutting works provided you move as you should (which would be around your opponent in the right distance). Hard to tell from the pic, but i guess they might be too short for the cut to land, but at least your weapon should be closer to them than theirs to you, so following with a thrust (or cut if they're too rigid for that to be safe) should work.

As a general rule try to move around them so their sword isn't pointing at you while staying at an appropiate range. Grabbing their sword arm if you end up close enough works well too, but that's more about reflexes than any kind of technique.

Also have to say your sabers look quite good as far as "larp" weapons go. I preffer "real" swords, but yes, the protections are a pain in the ass. I would at least get fencing masks though, even if just cheap ones. Would allow you to hit the head without any danger (even thrusts) and prevent nasty things from happening.

I've went to LARPs several times with real weapons and stabbed many people in the back while they were all gathered into their gay clusterfucks or nerdiness.

It was fun.

Any retailors anywhere sell chinese LARP weapons?

>>1452958
Forgot to add, when there are several people involved... get shields and use a shield wall formation. They were used for very good reasons (as i've learned in medieval reenactment). Just be wary of "rambos" flanking (that's a good reason to have at least two lines instead of just one ultralong line, though i don't expect anybody in a larp to accept being in the second line).

Also when fighting with a shield remember to not use it in a way that blocks your view. The only exception could be when blocking arrows, though i'm not sure if there's any of that in larp-style battles.

>>1452979

http://little-raven.com/RS/MA/Gim.html

Best I've found

>>1452994
Not sure about the US, in EU for about twice the price of those you could get a good one handed "real" sword. And tbh, wood is usually too light and hits too hard to fight unprotected. Steel would be worse of course, but wood can still break bones.

There are a lot of great fencing clubs out there that would love to have new members. I realize that most 4 channers are fat, weeaboo, disgusting pedophiles, but that doesn't mean you have to join a Larping crew.

There is absolutely no skill comparison between those that larp fight and those that actually compete in the sport. That is because fencing clubs and programs will actually TEACH you to do it. And yes, there is a lot of intricate things you should know. Even in ye olde pissbag times there was a difference between a peasant who played with swords as a kid and a knight who has spent a large part of his life practicing and learning the art from trained teachers. The same thing holds true today. Larpers are peasants playing with swords, fencers are those actually being educated in it. The larper who thinks he can take on a fencer is the same as the 1300's peasant kid who thinks he can take on a knight. It didn't work back then, it doesn't work now.

Compare it to boxing. Tough guys think they can throw a punch and take on a boxer, but there is no competition. The boxer would absolutely destroy the thug. Swinging a sword and swinging a fist are the same. Amateurs think they can do it, but to really do it you need to be taught it.

Don't give me shit about that "real sword" crap either. A real fencing sabre is hefty and potent, and is actually designed to me used. I'm sorry if that isn't "real" enough for the fat larper with his $20 display sword that breaks on his first swing, or his foam weapon that he swings wildly. The foil is a light weapon designed to bend. Laugh at it if you want, but a trained foil fencer is so fast it out-touches nearly every other martial sport in existance. It can beat out epee, sabre, lolkendo, etc. Don't whine about how it's just a touch when a real one would be sticking through your liver. And contrary to the movies, nobody fights effectively with a sword through their liver.

OP here, I get my stuff from www.eldritch.com, they'll make pretty much anything you want to order. It's all in that foam+latex style, suitable for touch-fighting LARP or practice, not good for thrusting.

>>1452971

Oh, look! It's the Internet Tough Guy! Please, stay in the basement and continue to inhale the fumes from the insulation while fapping to South Park.

>>1452979

If a maker does custom work, getting something along the lines of a naginata should be no problem at all. I'd check the European sellers first. Light gloves may make it a mite easier on your wife's hands, as well.

>>1453041

Wife's hands? lolwut? I'm looking for either a chinese straight sword, or a chinese saber...for myself

>>1452833
I agree, foil is much more of an abstracted sport than either saber or epee. But I feel like the abstraction adds more than it takes away. Epee seems focused so much on pure reflexes and saber seems rather painful (maybe I'm just a wimp), while foil lets you really use strategy. Mindgames almost always trump physical ability in foil; I don't know enough about the other two blades to make any statements on their account.

Really, "less applicable to the real world"? Since around 1900 sword fighting hasn't been at all applicable to the real world.

>>1453041
Agreed on the gloves. In fact i'd say gloves for everyone. I'd go for padded leather gloves, something like this: http://www.thetimeseller.com/eng/item/SAR_101N.html

It's probably plenty protection for "soft" weapons, and as long as they're properly sized shouldn't annoy in any way (unlike mine, since apparently my hands are too thin for their length, so i have gloves that fit well except the fingers are too short). If you need more protection the next step is police equipment, though that's a bit more expensive and uncomfortable.

>>1453033

Then again, LARPers aren't out to do anything except simulate swordplay in a way that's safe in an unstructured environment.

Yes, your average fencer is aces in a one-on-one fight.

I find from years of experience it doesn't mean much when you sneak up on one and backstab them with a boffer knife. Or stab you with a long spear. Or in a line fight where the fencer isn't stuck in a pretty little lane with a single opponent that they can fight with no distractions whatsoever.

In that, your average "peasant" tends to have the advantage. They don't fight "fair" by fencing standards, in any way shape or form other than certain areas being off limits for strikes.

You'll clean house on a duel, of course. Most boffer/fantasy LARP fights aren't duels however. I've seen plenty of folks with kendo, fencing, and formal weapons training- it's helpful and useful, but it's not the same when you have 30-40 people in a rough line, attacks come in from any direction, and total focus on a single opponent is impossible due to the environment. Muscle memory is always a good thing for a fighter. Situational awareness on a melee field is another animal entirely, and fencing doesn't teach that well.

You are "reading" a single opponent, their stance and grip, with the intention of landing a single strike before being struck.

Your LARPing opponent may not even care if you "kill" him, as he's playing a blood-raging orc NPC whose gawds will give him paradise if he dies in the process of cleaving you in two anyway. Or he may be wearing enough protection to turn that initial stab aside from being lethal, while your fancy foppish shirt gets a new slash in it as the axe your opponent was using takes an in-game chunk from your arm.

In before LARPing = serious business (which it isn't, it's a freakin' game and fun).

>I realize that most 4 channers are fat, weeaboo, disgusting pedophiles, but that doesn't mean you have to join a Larping crew.

Fuck you for making me laugh enough that my rib hurt.

You're still missing the point, one of the reasons I'm not fencing is that the amount of dickwaving puts me off, and the sabre < epee < foil < coathangers debate itt hasn't done much to change my opinion.

And you're basically trying to lure me into fencing by promising me a bigger dick to wave, like I'll be one of the knights and not one of the peasants. That's not a selling point for me.

>>1453052

Sorry, was talking about the OP who mentioned his wife's hands were hurting. Even soft leather gauntlets help, but if you have low wrist/arm strength, something with a bit more reinforcement is a good idea.

As for you, I've seen folks do Eastern style weapons- mostly boffer since that's the popular type where I play, but I've seen latex/ultralights made along those lines as well.

>>1453110
the sabre < foil < epee debate is mostly in jest. It's just a friendly rivalry; it's all the same sport really. People who are actually good at fencing (ie not me and I suspect not very many in this thread) practice all three.

>>1453110

Most fencing clubs consist of very nice people. They enjoy the sport and almost always LOVE to introduce a new person into it. You'll be quite surprised. They also tend to have social skills, so it's a bit less awkward than intorducing yourself to a larp crew.

I've only met one dick during fencing, and that was one guy who went to the junior olympics. He was a smug bastard, but still taught me tons of stuff.

A total fencing outfitting will run you about $100 for EVERYTHING quality gear. For a sport that really isn't that much.

>>1453109

Lol, enjoy backstabbing people with your boffer knife. I'm sure you do it all the time haha.

If you think the fencer can only operate in a tiny landing strip you're fucking retarded. It's there for scoring, and regardless, fencers do about 600% more movement in a fight than any larper does (or could physically do).

If you think reading other fighters has no bearing in a melee you've never tried it.

All the fencing clubs I've been involved with have done some Melee from time to time. I've been in one that contained 30 people, fun stuff. It's a lot funner when it's a melee with competent, wary people, and massively intense. So enjoy your melee with your friend's 12 year old brother his mom made you take along. Truely your combat is the purest in history.

Here's a hint, real armies trained extensively to fight in large battles. You're arguement that you don't need precision in a melee is why you're an idiot.

To throw another option in there, european martial arts can be dangerous to practice but are quite fun. The biggest problem is you have to invest lots of money at first in getting a good sword and protections unless there's some kind of group near you with stuff to lend to new members so they can try it.

There's also loads of variety in there, everything from sword and shield to the smallsword fits in there, with longsword, spear, maces, axes and variations of all of them in there. Finding a good master for the one you want is another matter though. Few if any remain for most weapons, so the most you can do is read old manuals (which can be quite a pain in the ass even if you find one in english) and try to guess what that picture actually means (since they weren't that great at drawing realistically). Then you practice it, think about it, and find what works. Then again thinking "moves" and trying them is quite fun too, and when you get something right gives you a nice feeling of acomplishment.

>>1453110

First you make a post about how you want to learn to be a better swordsman with your sabre, then you claim that learning to fence sabre will only give you a bigger dick to wave? The point of that post wasn't that you should be a knight and not a peasant for the title. It was that a knight is a well-trained expert in swordplay, while the peasant is a hapless fool by comparison. Take that as dick waving if you want:
If you want to learn to use a sabre, learn to fence.

Also, the Sabre, Foil, and Epee thing is mostly rivalry and inside jokes that come with the sport (Sabreists not knowing what "retreat" is, Foilists being pussies, Epeeist's weapon being derived from "First blood" rules, etc.) I fence Foil and Epee with my universities club, and have come to see these as IRL-memes.

PS: Epeeists have the largest dicks.

>>1453191

Too bad Epeeists are spent after one touch.

Now Foil, you can do a lot with speed and a bending weapon.

I used to fence an I can say this is true. They were all great people, we only met other good people at tourneys (with the obvious few exceptions, but they were rare), and the jibbing about sword preference is all for fun. We had all three in our class.
Quit fucking larping and join a fencing class.

>>1453191

That is not in fact what my initial post said. Nor did I ever say your point was that I should be a knight for the title. I'm sure I could learn a lot from fencing, but I've already explained my reasons for not fencing and the fact that I could learn useful techniques is something I've already taken into account. You can't tempt me with it.

And sure, I realise the Epee/Foil/Sabre stuff is in jest. The 'stop fucking larping join a fencing club' shit isn't. Sure, I bet most fencers are perfectly nice guys but the fact is the larpers on the whole are not acting like cocks itt. That leaves me more inclined to play with them, although some of you fencers have been very helpful, no reflection on them.

>>1453291

Just because we're assholes on 4chan does not mean we're assholes in real life.

>>1453342

Dammit, you made me laugh again.

>>1453291
see:
>>1453342

All the fencers in my club are noble and chivalrous. If you won't be tempted by Martial Weapon Proficiency: Sabre and a Weapon Finesse feat, then maybe the appeal of meeting some good people will.

>>1453223

Considering that I enjoy LARP, and you swear about LARPers, why should I believe that the rest of a fencing class will be any less elitist?

>>1453418

Though I'm not the poster to which you respond, I can answer with a question: Is elitism always misplaced? The elitist claim is that fencers are better at swordplay than LARPers. It's not as if this is a fabrication, or that we are lording it over LARPers (most people don't know what LARPing is). But the issue came up, and the truism has been stated. I see no offense with it.

And besides, in what other possible context would the issue of "I'm better at swordfighting than ____ group" come up? You're picking nits: It's not like the elitism (if you can really call it that) would ever manifest itself in real life.

Oh, also, no one ever said "quit LARPing and go fence." We merely suggested that if you learned how to fence sabre, you would be magnificent upon the field of LARP.

Kendofag here, figure I'd throw my sport into the discussion.

Yea, much of it is based on form and conduct, but most of it is speed, endurance, and intimidation. I mean, it's the only sport like this where you get points for yelling. It's also pretty damn painful, since a missed hit off of your armor means getting hit with a piece of wood being swung at full force.

i dont think you have a wife, enjoy your delicate hands

>>1453442
That or he'd get his shit ruined by some fag with a spear.

Brace for Explosion:

Who would win a fight in real life, supposeding two equally skilled combatants fought with real weapons: Kendo or Fencing (any weapon)?

I study sabre fighting, and am a sabrefag myself. And I activley LARP. And I will say it does improve your combat skills greatly. But LARPing isnt just about combat.

>>1453442
meet
>>1453223

Yeah, there's always one, isn't there?

I agree with your point thought, and I will consider it. I've just got a lot on my plate as it is, and there's also a certain enjoyment to working out how to do it without any help.

>>1453455

Foil is way too quick for Kendo to compete. It's almost impossible for the Kendo player to not get stabbed to hell. There are some youtube of kendo v foil fights.

If you want to "win" a LARP, use Greek/Roman tactics. Tower shields and 10 foot spears. Short stabbing sidearms as backup. Make sure your formation is tight.

>>1453455
Truth? They'd both be dead. The Fencer would win first, but since fencers are trained only to get the first fatal strike in, the Kendo user would almost certainly be in the middle of a killing blow as well.

>>1453470

I would think the Kendo practitioner would just hit the fucker in the side all the time and every day, due to the Bamboo being far stronger than foil, and could rather easily just carry on through.

Then Again, the fencer could dodge...

>>1453455
I loev katanas, but fencing wins hands down. It's too fast and to thrust-ish for kendo.

>>1451141


SCA REPRESENT

>>1453485

This.

>>1453455
It would really depend on how the first attack played out. The kendo guy would have a hard time blocking the fencer because of his speed, but on the other hand the fencer couldn't block the kendo guy easily because of the sheer power he could put behind his blows. Plus the kendo user has a slightly longer range.

It's a toss-up, really. I could say more if I had any experience with fencing, but all I know is kendo.

No idea about shinai vs foil, but katana vs rapier would have a few problems with range since katanas are short for european standards (from what i've read they're the length of an european one hander).

I don't know enough about either to give a veredict though, and it'd also be important if they use armor of any kind and the specific weaponry (smallsword, rapier, with dagger, buckler, cloak, nothing, etc). Also the knowledge of the opponent's style would be VERY important. If neither has ever faced an opponent of that kind i think i'd bet on the fencer, if they have it would likely be more even.

It's funny really, it seems to me it's even more important to know what your enemy's weapon is capable of than what yours is.

>>1453517

Except the foil is just so much faster than the Katana. To hit someone with the /katana, you've got to put it into place, and then perform a long sweep. To hit someone with a foil, just poke.

The Katana guy only really has one chanc.e They have to ignore the repeated stabbings and just sweep at the Foil guy's head. He can't block it. Then, you just have to hope that none of his four or five stabs to your chest were lethal, which against a skilled swordsman, they probably would be.

The mutual death theory is mostly bunk for two reasons.

1. Weeaboos think that a kendo/katana user can continue fighting, or even finish his move while impaled.

2. Weeaboos think that the fencer cannot possibly dodge a katana strike.

Remember, fencing is all about deflecting, not blocking.

I can't be bothered to look it up right now, but there are multiple video's online of even relatively skilled combatants on both sides. The kendo player gets frustrated because they cannot do a thing. They simply cannot swing and defend themselves fast enough to avoid the foil fencer.

I think it would mostly come down to positioning and footwork. The fencer isn't going to let an opponent get in striking distance if he can't easily parry him, and since the Katana is a substantially heavier weapon with more force behind it, it would be difficult to do so. The fencer could probably land a fatal attack, but would then be subject to a final blow from his Eastern opponent. The Kendo fighter could land an attack at the expense of his life.

I think it would end with two dead martial artists.

ITT:

1. People who think you can learn swordfighting in their backyard with dowels from home depot and bike helmets
2. People who have watched "Seven Samurai" argue with people who have watched "The Three Musketeers"
3. People who think LARP/AMTGARD combat in any way reflects how people actually fight
4. People who have never been in a fight in their lifetimes
5. People who think that swordfighting will ever be a useful skill
6. People who think that the books they've read make up for a complete lack of experience

which one of these are YOU?

>>1453547
You've obviously never seen how fucking fast some people can move a katana. Long sweeps aren't necessary, since a short "flick" of the blade can deliver a quick hit with very little actual movement of the sword; plus, you can actually thrust with a katana.

I practice historical fencing


rapier > foils, epees, sabres, etc.

A fencer wouldn't block a kendo blow, that's not how you stop a blade. A fencer deflects the other blade so it's cutting past them, then -with the insane speed a light sword allows- they would go bam under the arm into the lung.

I used to fence a bit, and I can't really see how a kendo fighter could beat it. A fencer is crazy fast, and a man wielding a larger sword could never make a clean strike because they'd always be deflected by the slightest margin.

On the other hand, if you just rushed at a fencer and grappled him he'd be fucked. The long thin sword is a disadvantage if you're right on top of him. With a big, sharp edged slashing sword, you could run in, smack the fucker with the pommel then draw the edge along them, opening them up while they flail hopelessly. This is why foils suck IRL without dagger backup. And dagger backup means no shield, which makes a rapier an impractical weapon when people are firing bolts.

bitches dont know about my talhoffer

Can anyone go pull up those kendo v foil videos I previously mentioned? You may be able to even find them on jewtube. Make sure you don't post some faggots who have no idea what they're doing.

In most cases the kendo person is tagged before they really begin their swing, which is why I don't quite buy into the mutual death idea.

>>1453550
>>LOL THEY SAID KATANA LET'S CALL THEM WEEABOO THEY MUST BE WRONG

Modern Fencing and Kendo are to actual Fencing and Iaido what Boxing is to Bar Fighting.

Sure, someone can get hurt in the modern variations, but it is still bogged down with numerous rules that are dangerous to have ingrained reflexively in a real world situation.

Do it for fun. Do it for fitness. Do it for philosophy. Don't do it because you think you are actually becoming a swordsman.

>>1453563

5. I carry a small folding knife with me to defend myself when I venture to sketchy places. I'm quite confident that fencing, and by extension, swordfighting, has taught me better how to use it. I can now strike faster and with much more precision, and should I ever find myself in a knife fight, I am well versed in positioning. Parrying is mostly useless with such a small blade, but the experience in knowing how to intercept and disrupt an attack is no less applicable.

fencing foils are floppy and you score with pretty small flicks though.

>>1453634

AGGHRHGHG. I hate flicks, but I had to allow my RAGE to wane when I learned that there is historical record of rapier duels involving flicks. They weren't common, and it was a lot harder with a much more rigid blade, but it was still possible.

>>1453618

Disqualified for comparing a -do to actual fighting. Plus Iai* and Ken* have two very different applications. One involves battlefield situations with a weapon already drawn, one involves quick draw techniques that are more applicable to fighting off an assassin.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u8ZivVlZK90&feature=related
Weaboo gets his shit fucked up.

>>1453712
Ugh.

That's supposed to be sword and shield. There's no shield and a shinai is hardly shaped like an european one hander.

>>1453712
That was pretty pathetic. On both fighter's parts.

On one hand, the kendoka was really slow and had really bad form-- you see the way he followed through after the strikes he hit? Bad. Also, knowing that he was fighting someone who would not be using the standard kendo strikes, he should have been a bit more flexable with his strikes and blocks-- but then again, it wouldn't have helped, as slow as he was.

Can't say much about the other guy, since I don't know the technique, but he still somehow let the slow kendoka make a bunch of hits on him.

It's pretty much impossible to really compare modern sports like kendo or any fencing variant since each is relatively inclusive. They don't teach you how to defend yourself or attack against anything but people using the same style of weapon and techniques as you are. Placed against each other, the winner is whoever's sport has a strike which hits in an area that the other sport has no defense for.

How would a good fencer face up against a kung fu player skilled with the chinese straight sword?

>>1453823

I'd cast fireball on him.

wouldn't saber vs kendo make more sense?

both slashing weapons

>>1453835

Did we mention good fencers know magic?

>>1453712

God damn it, I told you not to post videos of retards trying to fence. Give me a while and I'll post some ones that aren't laughable.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_ST1wRzfgmI&feature=related

Here's one, not that great, standby.

>the specific weaponry (smallsword, rapier, with dagger, buckler, cloak,

That's a thought, does anyone know anything about the use of capes/cloaks in combat?

>Your LARPing opponent may not even care if you "kill" him

This is what I'm most worried about - that the thread of getting impaled will not be enough to keep the opponent at bay in a LARP context.

In an unarmored fight i'd say rapier/smallsword will be at an advantage (though that doesn't compensate skill). They were dueling weapons after all.

Having a second weapon (dagger usually) is also a big advantage. If you know how to use it of course.

I have no idea about the chinese sword, i'd guess from the shape it's more of a cutting weapon than the rapier/smallsword, so it'd be at a disadvantage in range, so i'd give the advantage to the fencer.

Keep in mind all i said is about advantages, skill and knowledge of the enemy weapon would play an even bigger part.

>>1453823

the guy with the jian would the destroy the fencer

jian's are thrusting swords

dao are single edged, usually cutting swords

>>1453857
Wish i had more rapier training, but there's no master in my city. I know it's studied in spanish fencing (and italian too i think), it wasn't a "primary" weapon, more of a better than nothing thing used to catch the enemy sword, hide your movements, and provide some protection to the hand if you had to block with it (which was done even without cloak, ideally with an arm protector, but even without it beats getting stabbed i guess, though in the katana case it might not work that well).

I think the most common case was the dagger, but at some point it became something a gentleman shouldn't do, so they tended to use rapier alone in duels. Can't say i understand it, the rapier and dagger class i took was the most fun i've had in any kind of fencing. Probably somebody didn't have good coordination and decided to speak against it and it spread.

>>1453890
In that case it wouldn't be as big an advantage, though i think the rapier's guard is better suited for the job. A bit less so for a smallsword.

I'm guessing a lot here, if you have any videos to see how they fight perhaps i'd get a better idea (also i don't pretend to be a great master in fencing, i've tried it a bit and learned the basic idea of it, so i can give a somewhat educated opinion, just don't take it for the absolute truth, i might and probably am wrong on a few things).

>>1453882
weaboo alert: unexplained favoritism of an eastern counterpart to a european equal.

>>1453788
He had really bad footwork, as far as modern fencing goes.

He kept on stepping in positions which would have put him off balance.

>>1453563

QFT


Reality: Fencing/Kendo are sports. They're not ment to be real combat.

What should you do if you want to fight as close to real qith melee weapons without the fear of dieing horribly? JOIN THE SCA

We had a guy who did line fencing for 4 years come to SCA rapier. Because he learned to fight on a straight line he would rush at you. if you stayed still he'd kill you.

We had a brand new fighter..you know how he beat the fencer..over and over? He side stepped once.


Kendo: You don't follow through with attacks, you have to yell every time you hit, all the useless gesturing and ritual. Its a sport and a cultural tradition but not self defense people.

Plus lack of back edge makes Katana fail in comparison to European two handed weapons.

In SCA we had a KENDO FUCKING COMPETITION WINNER come and fight with us using 2 handed swords.

He would be repeatedly owned by the opponet fouling the weapon (hitting it away) while stepping in and using the back edge of his blade to score a kill.


AMTGARD/LARPER KIDS: Your soft as a 14 year old girls feet touch kills are lame. Your quarter pound weapons are lame. Your mindless flailing tos core the softest touch is lame. That is not fighting. That is tag with sticks.

After doing SCA heavy weapons combat training with a competent guy (Duke in the system won King twice) went back and fought with a long time amtgard friend. In his circle he was untouchable. However when you allow the hit to the head and he has to deal with someone whos trained with realistic weighted weapons and realistic attacks. He was schooled. Over and over and over.


TL;DR : SCA = Your portal to semi-realistic medieval combat/dueling. GET IN THE GAME.

>>1453949

Your fencer of four years sucks, then. The fencing strip is a meter wide, and an attack can be done and still count as long as it is performed before you step a meter off of the strip. This means that there can be quite a bit of lateral movement without halting action. Also, any decent fencer should know that immediately following a failed fleche, you will pass to the side of your opponent and then run past him, at which point you must be prepared to defend against a riposte.

Conclusion: Either you or your fencer of four years are inflating the truth to make a point.


And FINALLY: A lot of fencing clubs do completely unruly games from time to time. Just a couple weeks ago, my fencing club did five on five Capture the Flag (actually, Capture the Sabre) in a moderately small room using Epee rules to determine "tags". This had nothing to do with strip fencing, involved team cooperation, and it quickly flourished into its own strategies and dirty tricks. Fencers aren't idiots. We are taught to adapt to opponent's strategies and a to adjust ourselves according to a situation because of the sheer volume of different styles that an opponent can utilize within the rules.

>>1453949
Around here (Spain) the SCA is mostly about hitting each other as hard as they can with rattan sticks from what i hear. Is it like that everywhere?

I learned Kobujitsu and Haedong Kumdo, it teaches the art of Jingum, a korean "katanalike" sword, is kinda bad ass, also you get to learn a lot of another weapons, and in fact, youa also get more inner taekwondo, is like beeing a fighter/monk gestatl.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HjLmsVPVvwA

These guys kinda suck, but yeah..has some jian use in it

>>1453987

Guess it depends on the Kingdom. I used to be in Trimaris and you'd get lit up pretty hard sometimes, but if it bothered you that much you'd build armor for that spot quick.

Now I'm in Meridies and they're alot softer hitting. Its kind of nice to not have people going "FUCK YEAH *WHACKKKK* YEAAAH" But having come from Trimaris its frustrating to have to make calls for blows that really don't feel good to avoid angering the natives.

>>1453949
Your fencer fucking sucks, then. Seriously.

And Kendo is a silly thing anyway.

>>1453995

Fuck your shit nigger!

Here is some EXTREME straight sword use: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XQGvm-7WYFY&feature=related

>>1453949soft as a 14 year old girls feet touch

I want to

>>1453949

Oh fuck off. LARPing as RP and fencing/kendo as sports both qualify as traditional games. Being an internet tough guy on the other hand is not a game, it is a character defect.

I can pretty much guarantee you that nobody is going to join the SCA because of your post, because it made you look like a stupid cunt. Get out of my sight.

>>1454003
Actually i was wondering about the sticks. I practice longsword with steel swords (2mm edge), with appropiate protections and the common sense to not hit at full force (also because doing that with a longsword is usually stupid, you'll get dodged and left wide open), so i was wondering if the SCA also used "real" weapons, or was everything rattan or other "safe" options.

I'm mostly curious because i've found even if weight and balance are right the material can make quite a bit of difference in what works and what doesn't. I've tried nylon, wood and aluminium and the difference is really noticeable (i'll admit most of those are too light compared to steel though).

I'm not trying to bash it mind you, i don't disagree with the idea being able to hit at full force makes for a more accurate simulation of combat, but i feel sacrificing the weapon for that doesn't pay off.

>>1454013

I'm going to rape you dead

>>1453949

the BLATANTLY OBVIOUS that people will still argue over anyway...

classes are different than sports are different than games are different than larp are different than sca are different than actual war

things you learn for one may or may not carry over into another. all of them have their own rules.

it's all fun and games until somebody loses an eye. put that foil down!

Well I don't think anyone can be in any doubt that we have had tonight a full and enlightening debate on the topic of fencing, kendo, and their relevance to LARP combat in the modern world. Thank you, Professor F. J. Lewis.

>>1454013

Or rather, relaxing tai chi sword use. Even when they're used with ridiculous skill, I don't see so much of an advantage of a jiang over a rapier or court sword: the Western counterpart. They still require positioning, defense, and offense. Neither style or weapon lends itself to victory.

>>1454150

Chinese swords are flexible, which means you can make them out of magnetic ore and pour iron filings on them and turn them into a deadly metal whip.

Seriously it's awesome.

So... Bo vs English quarterstaff?

>>1454186

Your the Chink in my Chain

>>1454193

Three section staff, motherfucker

>>1454193
That one i won't touch with a ten feet pole.

... Because we want to play in LARPs?

Holy fucking crap guys I didn't think /tg/ could fail any more, but here we are. Talking about fencing, kendo, fucking larping!?

Why don't you guys join a local gang like young-adults and stop playing with those sticks of yours.

>>1454259
Well oddly enough i like fighting with swords but i don't like harming people, so i can't join a gang. Any other ideas?

>>1454282
join a gang that only targets furries, cod knows those are not persons.

>>1454282

Stop playing with swords because you'll eventually injure someone with a slip up anyway.

>>1454220

... I admit to having stumbled over youtube footage of those things and thinking they were cool

>>1454306

Dude, all chinese weapons are cool (oh, and most europeon weapons kick ass also)

It's the fucking fat headed jap weapons that suck

>>1454318
Nah, it's just the weeaboos screwing them with bad press by excessive good press.

Don't look at me that way, it makes sense!

>>low blows

Dude, low blow

>>1454318
Chinese weapons are terrible, and the Han can't fight there way out of a wet paper bag.

>>1454335

NO U!

>>1454259
Fencing is with metal blades ignorant ass.

A true soldier is not limited by their weapon or their battlefield.

OP D00d, you've just become my hero. But I'm saddened to hear about your ribs; why didn't you buy paddles and protection gear??

>>1453949

SCA fighting is done in a specified area, at a specified time, doesn't allow blows below the knee, and generally requires that you face your opponent for the sake of chivalry.

That being said, SCA fighters generally do fine LARPing, once they realize the head is no longer a target area in most games and you don't have to smack people hard enough to leave bruises because it IS "sword tag", not "break the unarmored player"...and you don't get the typical rhino-hiding SOB's as a result.

It's dealing with the fact that at a LARP, combat isn't generally scheduled or at a place of your choosing. Coming back with your lady from feast to find yourself surrounded by a gang of bandits armed with bows? Yep, good luck getting them to fight fair. :)

>>1453475

Great in a magicless system. Otherwise, enjoy your tightly packed non-magic-proofed large target...not taking into account things like alchemy (oops, poison/alchemist's fire).

LARPing formations tend to be shield walls, but looser and with more manueverable weaponry- rather than 10-footers, think 5-6 foot spear/polearms. Also, pikes in wooded areas or poor terrain = comedy. Trust me, it's bad enough trying to move with something as tall as you are and a tower shield...LARPing and having to squeeze through small spaces, by traps and through overgrown paths it'd be hell.

Find me a nice open battlefield, sure. I like having a 10-foot pole to keep the enemy at the other end with.

>>1454466
Damn, why was Boss so badass? Hardly have you ever seen a more worthwhile "villain" in a game. A close second in that regard would have to be Darth Treya.

>>1453857

Generally, entangling an opponent's weapon is considered a no-go simply due to it often entangling the player as well, or breaking a weapon in the process of freeing it.

Many LARPs don't have a "stop hit" rule, or you may simply find that the opponent in question has some means of taking the hit without damage (armor, magical defenses, character is given a limited number of "parry" skills to represent something more badass than the actual player)...which can mean a smart duelist does well pinking an opponent and deftly getting out of the way of a response. LARPs often go the route of "be all that you -can't- be". That being said, a skilled and mobile Florentine fighter can do just fine even playing the most humble of newbie characters, barring something they're not supposed to win against (steel vs. undead ghost-thing might not work too well unless that saber's enchanted, nor may those NPC's playing the Ducal Guard be so easily dispatched). But mobility in a LARP fighter is a very handy thing. Being able to dodge, weave, and move matters and most LARPers tend to wear lighter amounts of armor, rather than clanking along in heavy gear. Why? Missiles and magic. Finding out you can take a dozen swordblows is wonderful. Finding out you're too slow to dodge the scrawny elf-woman with a Paralysis spell isn't. Nor is it easy to hop across a series of small rocks on the way over a lava pit. At a LARP, it's not all about fighting after all, and not all physical challenges involve your sword.

>>1454604
Oh yeah, Darth Traya...the one who betrays you for no fucking reason because the developer was rushed.

And whose battle skill is throwing shiny swords at you. Huh.

>>1453629
This post is an example of why I hate this thread.

My response to this sort of thing is: "Looks like someone brought a knife to the gunfight."

Bang.

>>1453164

Actually, happens all the time. It's something most fa/tg/uys know from D&D. Sneak attacks, backstabs, ambushes, bar fights? This isn't a nice, predetermined field where one side lines up at noon, the other side at 12:05 and you go at it with a marshal whistling people dead as they get hit.

It's a LARP. Combat isn't just on a battlefield. It's a foggy night at 10 PM after you finished feasting and the local bandit gang thinks you're an easy mark. Waking up to a pack of goblins sniffing around outside your tent while you're in your long johns. A brawl where the half-orc on one side of the tavern decided the dwarf on the other needed his beard shortened, so he threw a hatchet at him and now there's a dozen people pulling steel and the barkeep's digging around behind the bar for a crossbow. You're in the middle. Your halfling buddy just ran down the other fork in the maze, and the enraged minotaur is 3 feet behind him with a muckin' great axe....good thing he missed you passing by. Your best friend just got charmed by the vampire you were going to stake, doing something before he turns around and guts you?

LARP combat is chaotic and unscheduled. I get plenty of times where a knife in the back (or a sap to the "head" (back in real life) comes in handy.

>>1453838

As noted earlier, at a fantasy LARP you do end up having to take that into account. The PC or NPC you may end up trying to poke with your sword isn't always human, breathing any more, a mithril golem, a regenerating troll, angry fire mage with a head full of "cook fighter" spells, alchemist with a few handy vials full of area-effect gasses, etc.

>>1454657

It's better to bring a knife to a gunfight than to bring nothing, and I'm not a red-neck gun-concealing douche. Besides, a gun is only better than a knife if you're out of arms reach.

Wasn't the katana used against armored opponents whereas the rapier was a weapon used following the decline of armor in europe? The light blade was a renaissance weapon introduced after guns more or less made the use of heavy armor obsolete. The Katana, on the other hand, is more comparable to a european style sword, such as the aforementioned sabre.

A guy I know once got a group of seven people together for a Larp. They all made Orcs, and drilled every week for an entire summer in small-team tactics. There were four guys with shields and swords, two with bows and I think the last was a caster.

Halfway through the larp, they were asked if they could please stop utterly destroying everything they came across.

>>1454793

Only inasmuch as the katana was used against relatively light armor compared to European mail and plate. The things were cutting weapons -- they weren't designed for real heavy use. They're vague analogues at best.

>>1454793

The Katana was used widely against both armored and unarmored opponents. Many duels were done unarmored.

Rapiers were adopted because of a combination of guns making armor obsolete, and gentleman viewing older swords as uncouth and barbaric; just as heavy armor was viewed the same.

Of course, those same gentleman thought older models of swords weighed 20lbs, and were unwieldy bludgeons, only good for bashing at armored opponents, like one would with a mace...yeah.

Both (mis)perceptions persist to this day, though the latter has much wider acceptance.

>>1454861
Plate armor wasn't widely used until the invention of the gun, because the first crappy muskets and pistols could be stopped by plate.

>>1454861
a ktana would break into pieces if you tried to hit a metal breastplate with it

>>1454959
the use of armored suits declined at the same time as guns became more prominent. the full body suits were replaced by a cuirass and a helmet

>>1455001
Only if you hit it improperly. It would just dull your blade if you were using the katana properly and drawign the cuts rather than trying to chop your opponent to pieces like you do with a broadsword or longsword.

You still wouldn't get any penetration, but you wouldn't break the blade.

use a knife girl

>>1455001

What about an...adamantium katana?

>>1455212
Titanium would work better. It's more flexible and much harder than most any steel.

>>1455212
You can't have a katana made out of anything but katana.

>>1455219

TELL THAT 2 MAH NEW DRAGOON FORCE KATANA MAH MAM GOT MEH FOR MAH BIRTHDAY

>>1455291

1/0

>>1454517

Don't worry about me, protective gear normally isn't needed for this kind of LARP fighting, I was just unlucky. I'll be taking more care to drill the newbies on safety in future.

It feels pretty much fixed after two and a half weeks, if it was a crack it wasn't a bad one.

Anonymous,

May I present ARMA- the Association for Renaissance Martial Artists.

SCA is okay, but its nowwhere near actual sword play. A stick is not a sword. Its an excellent club though. I wouldnt want to be hit by a competent SCA fighter using a stick. But I WOULD NEVER, FUCKING EVER call him a swordsman.

Lmao.

SCA boy, remind me the rules to stop polearms wielder to repeatedly rape fencers ? Oh yeah, no blow under the fucking knee, great idea !

What I like in LARP is that they were never pretending to be realistic and thus imposed rules of behavior for the mock-fights. I got disgusted of LARP thanks to NPCs not respecting rules of engagment (especially the quite common one "do not charge your opponent").

>>1456597

No blow on the shin/foot stops people from swinging near the knee. Even then you still occasionally get nailed in side of the knee. Even with armor..KNEE NOT MENT GO THAT WAY.

Its a small thing to stop people from getting blown out legs.

Foilist here.

Saber is for retards with the attention-span of a mayfly and Epee is for gorillas with too much brawn and not enough brain to master the delicate art that is fencing.

That is all.

Needs less foam, sticks and swords, more metal and polearms.

>>1452444

You are an idiot. Die. People get Foils through their heads sometimes even with masks on. If you pad the end you're also an idiot because you'll break your foil because you hit too hard and then kill your opponent with a broken blade...

Three words. BLACK. CARD. YOURSELF.

>>1456817

Rubber Tip = Hit Harder? Surely you jest. Nay, you are just stupid.

>>1454806

And there you have the power of tactics. One of the characters I play regularly is a sergeant in a baronial army.

I'd take half a dozen of the folks I regularly fight/train with over a mob of three times their number, any day. That applies in any kind of combat, much less LARPing.

---

As for the whole sword/rapier/katana thing- remember each was made for the environment they came from- and aren't going to work as well elsewhere. Katanas were not meant to chop through plate. Broadswords weren't designed for gentleman's duels. Rapiers were hardly built to stab some guy in samurai armor.

>>1454259

>Why don't you buy an assault rifle and shoot up your school like young-adults and stop playing with those sticks of yours.

Fixed

>>1454861Rapiers were adopted because of a combination of guns making armor obsolete, and gentleman viewing older swords as uncouth and barbaric; just as heavy armor was viewed the same.

fencerfags were the ones that started the "medieval swords=shitty" rumor

>>1457428
And over a century later we're still having to re-educate people about this shit.
That said some adults have to be taught about real fire and its dangers, and that you can actually cook with it. And the danger of picking up a baby, thinking its a prop.
Some people are just plain thick.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=ENfiUlbtlDc

I'm posting this to show how powerful a well forged broadsword is, not to rekindle the Katana versus Broadsword debate (because it nullifies that argument).

The reason rapiers are seen as much superior to broadswords is because of the conditions they were used in: A rapier was generally forged for a noble to be used in court duels and the like, and their more war-prone counterpart, the sabre, was likely to be used as a sidearm from a horse-borne leader (and this carried in symbolically in many military traditions up until the present day).
Broadswords and longswords, on the other hand, were pitted against heavy armour. They were mass produced, and so the average quality was probably much shittier than the average quality of a noble's weapon. A broadsword may well have been worn down to a blunt piece of steel by the end of a battle, while a rapier was kept razor sharp with only minor nicks put in the blade from blade contact.

>>1458164

Razor sharp rapier? lolwut

>>1458164


I prefer my Glaive (the pole arm) and a long knife, when killing those of higher born social and economical rank.

>>1458176

razor being a exaggeration, of course. Though it is a thrusting weapon, rapiers were usually sharpened on at least the third of the blade compromising the foible. It's not what the weapon is truly meant for, so Epee fencing only scores points with thrusts.

Fuck this, guys. Thought I'd check out /tg/ for once in my life; this thread was on top and jesus fuck I hate you.

What kinda saber are we talking about here /tg/?
Those thin rapier-like sabers, or something like the blucher saber?

>>1458164
That vid is a load of crap. Brute strenght my ass. Not to mention that sword design was rather... imaginative.

Just weeaboo propaganda. Yes the katana cuts better, but straight swords thrust better. All martial arts are based on skill, the only thing similar to brute force would be when trying to pierce armor, be it with sword, axe, mace or hammer.

>>1458188

<3 polearms in situations where I can have someone else keep whatever I'm stabbing/chopping back- a "scorpion trio" of sword + shield, sword + shield, polearm behind the first two is a nice small-scale formation for LARPers, especially since it's a mini-shieldwall for a healer/mage type to hide behind or an archer to shoot over.

>>sabres
>>florentine

lol wut

>>1458551

Florentine fighting to most folks is the classic "rapier and dagger/main gauche" style. The term is more widely used in the SCA and other live-combat games as simply a two-weapon style, which is historically correct (Florentine style combat not merely sword + dagger, but also had two longer weapons as an option.)

Modern live-combat games (and the SCA) often use the term to describe any kind of "using two one-handed weapons" fighting. Saber + dagger qualifies, even if the historical definition would take a rapier, long sword, or foil.

>>1458582

I find it convenient to use the term 'florentine' to refer specifically to sword & dagger, even if historically it was broader in scope.

Riddle of Steel uses the phrase 'Case of Rapiers' to describe a two-sword style, which I rather like too.