Angry Tholians EditionPrevious Thread >>53347835A thread for discussing the Star Trek franchise and its various tabletop iterations.Possible topics include Star Trek Adventures - the new rpg being produced by Modiphius - and WizKids’ Star Trek: Attack Wing miniatures game, as well as the previous rpgs produced by FASA, Last Unicorn Games and Decipher, the Starfleet Battles Universe, and Star Trek in general.Game ResourcesStar Trek Adventures, Modiphius’ 2d20 RPG-Official Modiphius Page>http://www.modiphius.com/star-trek.htmlPlaytest Materials (via Biff Tannen)>https://www.mediafire.com/folder/36m6c22co6y5m/Modiphius%20Star%20Trek%20AdventuresReverse Engineered Character Creation.>https://docs.google.com/document/d/1g2ofDX0-7tgHojjk7sKcp7uVFSK3M52eVP45gKNJhgY/edit?usp=sharingOlder Licensed RPGs (FASA, Last Unicorn Games and Decipher)>http://pastebin.com/ndCz650pOther (Unlicensed) RPGS (Far Trek + Lasers and Feelings)>http://pastebin.com/uzW5tPwSWizKids’ Star Trek: Attack Wing Miniatures Game-Official WizKids Page (Rules and Player Resources)>http://wizkids.com/attackwing/star-trek-attack-wing/Lore ResourcesMemory Alpha - Canon wiki>http://en.memory-alpha.org/wiki/Portal:MainMemory Beta - Noncanon wiki for licensed Star Trek works>http://memory-beta.wikia.com/wiki/Main_PageFan Sites - Analysis of episodes, information on ships, technobabble and more>http://pastebin.com/mxLWAPXFStar Trek Maps - Based on the Star Trek Star Charts, updated and corrected>http://www.startrekmap.com/index.html/stg/ Homebrew Content>http://pastebin.com/H1FL1UyP
First for FASA predicting the future.
>>53444213A valuable lesson in picking your battles, all the same
So if Enterprise is non-canon to the prime timeline, JJTrek is ENT's sequel, and Discovery is a prequel series to JJTrek, are we completely clear of retcon territory since Threshold?
>>53446167Possibly. It would be an elegant way of doing allowing a reboot with a reasonably modern (post-9/11) base instead of trying to handwave over 50 years of TV evolution. It also makes the episode title of VOY:Endgame bittersweet in retrospect.
>>53446167Surely Enterprise is the precursor to both timelines, seeing as the split happened a century or so after the events of Enterprise.
>>53446743We were discussing this in the tail end of the previous thread. Enterprise was strung through at least four different timelines over the course of the series due to the Temporal Cold War. Daniels said the war got erased from history, but that still leaves questions. All we know for certain is that the NX-01 is never referenced in the Prime series, even in a collection of Enterprises that pictured both the Space Shuttle and the XCV-330 ring ship, but that there's an NX class model on Admiral Robocop's desk during Into Darkness. Now granted there are obvious IRL reasons for this, but it does bear considering in universe.
>>53446825Regardless of how shit it was, the finale firmly sets Enterprise as happening in the prime timeline.
>>53447129No reason it can't be both. To be honest I hate all but 4 of time travel episodes in all of Trek so I try to think about them as little as possible.
>>53447129Or in a timeline where those events happened anyway. The events of First Contact may have damaged the timeline like that one anon said. Or gone full retard into the Abrams timeline. 50/50.
>>53446167I don't think we can firmly establish this. The issue is that, while much of ENT is stupid (4 days to Qo'nos, the Temporal Cold War), any stuff that is set after VOY , assuming such a thing will happen, will likely acknowledge at least something of ENT.>>53446825I'm sure someone, somewhere will throw in a "the Enterprise 1701 refit left spacedock before the NX-01's commemorative tile was hung up" as an explanation.Ultimately, I think we just have to accept ENT is canon for both Prime and JJTrek, and disregard the bits the contradict, like has been done with every series.
>>53447487Actually, now that I've thought about it, there are so few Vulcans in TNG and later series, that if we overlook mentions of Vulcan itself or take it to mean a "New Vulcan" or whatever, TNG can fit into either timeline without a huge issue one way or the other. Freaky.
>>53447623Except for Classic Spock, Classic McCoy, the first TNG movie and the nagging question of why the bridge looks like a lounge from the 70's rather than the almighty Apple store.
>>53448530Yesterday's Enterprise Year of HellTrials and TribblationsCity on the Edge of Forever
>>53449643But Muh The Visitor, All Good Things and Yesteryear.
>>53449778I'll allow All Good Things
>>53449643>Year of Hell
>>53450174>Voyager but when they're outgunned there are consequences. Yeah, pretty much
>>53450302Except there are no consequences because of the reset button end that murders any interesting consequences and character development.
>>53447129The only thing the finale sets in the prime timeline is NX Enterprise's final mission, unless Riker was Chef for the entire series.
I've been enjoying STO much more when I use the actual Captain's Log feature after missions to write up after action reports. Am I autistic?
>>53450953You know what I meant and you're just being contrary.
>>53450995That explains why the female crew were all so attractive, and the decon scenes. It was a Riker holodeck program. But wait, if Riker was present for the entire thing, he'd know about the Borg being present at First Contact, which makes that movie part of a self aware stable time loop. Dammit Riker.
>>53450995I'd watch that, honestly.
>>53451033I just find the ending nullifies pretty much everything about it being a good episode except for certain performances and and the concept. To me, that episode is the absolute best example of the giant FUCK YOU that Voyager pulled on the idea of what it could have been, what the writers wanted it to be, as a show rather than what it actually was actually: mired in executive meddling, making the story as a whole worthless.
>>53451071Is the chef actually mentioned at all in the Borg episode? If not, maybe it happened when Riker was called away and forgot to turn the holodeck off so he missed it.
>>53446167>>53446825What I remember off the top of my head as to Enterprise's connection to JJTrek:There are a few references here and there (Scotty saying something about beaming admiral Archer's prized beagle, the NX model admiral whatshisface had, probably a few others).That said, the ship they found in Beyond (the Franklin, I think) was NX several hundred, and yet someone dropped some comment about it's top speed being less than warp 5. The whole deal about what made Enterprise special in Enterprise was that it had the first warp 5 engine built by Humans. The fact that it was NX-01 means either Humans stopped putting warp 5 engines into their ships sometime after the events of Enterprise, or something got retconned.Honestly, it was done before JJTrek and it's in the classic ST style (more or less) whereas JJTrek has it's own style, so I consider the two to not be separate even though the separation point is officially after the end of Enterprise. JJTrek will probably continue to make vague references and the like to it, but I seriously doubt JJTrek is going to try to stick to any canon it set up.Also, I asked this at the end of the last thread but no one answered so I'll ask again: what canon sources explicitly set Enterprise (or chunks thereof) as non-canon (aside from the occasional episode or 2-parter that got retconned immediately via time travel or being just a dream or some shit)?
>>53451935The warp 5 engine may be highly expensive to build, it's entirely possible they'd load lower warp engines in a ship, or it could have been based on an alternative engine that didn't turn out all that great but worked good enough.
>>53452099There are any number of possible reasons, but that's not typically how Star Trek works.
>>53451935One fan theory is that after the formation of the Federation, pre-NX ships (like the Franklin) were re-registered under the new Federation Starfleet, which would explain the sudden increase in registry numbers.Alternatively, if you take the view of people like Simon Pegg and believe history was changed even before the actual arrival of the Narada (because events changed by the 1701 crew (and later crews) going back in time may no longer happen the same way/at all), then while the NX class may still exist to display as a model, the actual events of the Enterprise era may have happened in different ways, including the inclusion of earlier ships under the NX registry.
>>53452348NX just means the ship is experimental. The first NX ship in the franchise was the Excelsior with its Transwarp. Enterprise fucked it up by using the term NX Class in some episodes and remembering NX is not a class in others.
>>53451935>>53452099>>53452348The sound barrier was first broken in 1947 but that doesn't mean every fighter jet in the 1950s could.
>>53451003You're on /tg/. You're autistic.>We'reallmadhere.png
>>53451097Year of Hell is the worst case of blue balls Star Trek has ever given me. The amazing buildup, the promise of far reaching consequences, all culminating in the show basically going "haha psyche, back to the status quo!"Imagine you're getting a blowjob from Natalie Dorner, but right before you cum she rips off her mask and it turns out it was your grandmother. Was it great up to that point? Absolutely, but the ending just completely destroys it.
>>53452458NX Enterprise wasn't so much as a test ship but rather a prototype, aimed at going into full production (the second one floated out of the shipyards a few seasons into the show), so that's not quite an accurate comparison.Also, as I said in >>53452260 that's not typically how things in ST work. Someone invents something, tests it a bit, and by the time they're building it into new starships it's standard.
>>53452915>Someone invents something, tests it a bit, and by the time they're building it into new starships it's standard.That's not true at all. No other ship had the ziplock bags of sperm tied to the computer like Voyager did, not even the other Intrepids. Or how Quantum torpedoes weren't given to every ship, or how powerful Galaxy class turbo warp cores weren't mounted on every ship after, or how no other class of ship received ablative armor aside from the defiants.
>>53452981>VoyagerThat was a spy ship.>Galaxy warp cores and ablative armorThose simply didn't fit on most ships. I'd be willing to bet the Sovereign got both and the Phalanx got the warp core.>quantum torpedoesThose were standard issue by 2390.
>>53452981>No other ship had the ziplock bags of sperm tied to the computer like Voyager did, not even the other Intrepids.How do you know this? >Or how Quantum torpedoes weren't given to every shipProbably have a different launcher or something. Easy to explain.>powerful Galaxy class turbo warp cores weren't mounted on every ship afterWhy would they? Not every ship is as big as a Galaxy, for one. And for another thing, how do you figure the later ones aren't better?>how no other class of ship received ablative armor aside from the defiantsWe don't know that other Defiant-class ships even had the armor, though it can be supposed that they did. Also, they did put it on the Lakota, and the Prometheus had it too.
You sent in your screenshots for the screenshot contest, right? Pic unrelated.
>>53451935>Also, I asked this at the end of the last thread but no one answered so I'll ask again: what canon sources explicitly set Enterprise (or chunks thereof) as non-canon (aside from the occasional episode or 2-parter that got retconned immediately via time travel or being just a dream or some shit)?I personally don't think it's nom-canon, but I could see a lot of inconsistencies, that could lead people to think that way.>Romulan Warbirds and Mines have cloaks, despite them not being invented until Balance of Terror>in Balance of Terror it was stated that the Earth-Romulan war was fought with lasers and nukes>the NX Enterprise makes no appearance in other prime works, despite the appearance of the Space Probe Enterprise.>The D7 appears in one of the worst episodesThese can all be explained away relatively easily. Personally, I wish that the NX-01 hadn't been named Enterprise.
>>53455795Wouldn't those be retcons not inconsistencies? There is a ton of retcons from TOS, one of the biggest is the miss use of the word "galaxy". But I agree that the NX should have been called Pioneer or something. (Though I should say that the NX is my favourite Enterprise in the series)
>>53455795At least we dodged that 'boy bands on the NX-01 every week' idea. TV producers must be actual incarnations of Satan.
>>53457589>boy bands on the NX-01 every weekI'm not sure what saddens me more, the fact that someone thought that was a good idea or the fact that it doesn't surprise me.
>>53457544Cryptic is holding a screenshot competition.
>>53453719>We don't know that other Defiant-class ships even had the armor, though it can be supposed that they did. Also, they did put it on the Lakota, and the Prometheus had it too.The armour was non standard. In "Paradise Lost" the captain of the Lakota says of the Defiant something to the effect of "Seemingly somebody neglected to inform Starfleet that she has ablative armour."
>>53458001Well it's not like I can submit my edits. Good luck to everybody that has a non-dogshit graphics card.
>>53451935Keep in mind that the 'Hundred-Series' fightercraft from the 1950s-60s are less advanced than the 'Teens-Series' of today.The F-22 is several generations ahead of the F-100 Starfighter, so NX-01 being named NX-01 has no bearing on the Franklin's NX-326 designation.For all we know, Franklin may have been the 326th ship since the Phoenix's retroactive designation as NX-1, and NX-01 is a marketing gimmick.
>>53459689The NX-01 predates the Federation and, if we assume Enterprise is canon, the first of that style to be built. We don't know how old the Franklin is, but it was active after the founding of the Federation so it's not likely to be older than the Enterprise. We also see no other ships of that approximate design in Enterprise (except the Columbia, I think it was called, which was the exact same design as Enterprise).That said, Beyond tells us nothing about when the Franklin was built, so they may have retconned it into being older.
>>53459819>We don't know how old the Franklin is, but it was active after the founding of the Federation so it's not likely to be older than the EnterpriseWhy? The Columbia class is new enough. Earth is still happy using the NV and Delta series ships after Columbia's launch. And given the fact that the Franklin was the first warp 4 engine, it's entirely possible, if not extremely probable, that the Franklin predates the Columbia. The obvious fix for the Franklin having NX-326 as its number is that she was given the number as part of Starfleet's attempt to normalise their various design series within the new combined Starfleet. Like the Intrepid going from NV-whateverthefuck to NX whateverthefuck, with the limited series of Columbia class starships taking the lower numbers.
>>53458767That was Sisko's work. He took the Defiant out of mothballs and tinkered with it.
>>53461588Sisko's handling of the whole Defiant situation was hilarious minmaxing. I can just imagine /tg/-Sisko trying to explain that to the GM at chargen. D20/DnD terms used for convenience.>Yeah I'm going to roll a BoP sized corvette with more speed and weapons power than a Galaxy class and fancy armor.>That'll be pretty heavy. Are you sure you have the engine budget to keep it maneuverable?>Fine, stick the biggest warp core you have in there.>It's going to tear your ship apart at anything over warp five.>THE BIGGEST. WARP. CORE. YOU. HAVE.>*sigh* Fine.>Oh, and give me a cloaking device.>You do know those are banned for anyone but Romulan ships right?>So stick a Romulan bitch on there, I don't give a fuck. Put her in a chainmetal bikini too.>Goddammit this isn't your magical realm, Ben. Standard uniform.>Fine, fucking buzzkill GM.>[session begins]>I roll to have my chief engineer fix all the engine problems.>Bullshit, you can't.>The hell I can't, this is STAR FLEET. *sisko crazy bug-eyes*>Fine, roll for it.>Nat 20, bitch.>Goddammit. Well, at least you still have the Romulan spy, I mean cloak technician.>[next session]>So we took damage. The Romulan dies but I keep the cloak.>Fuck you, roll for it.>Nat 20.>[Dominion player gets up and leaves the table in disgust.]
>>53459519I sent one but I've been thinking that it was probably a poor choice.Pic related.
>>53461822If I recall, you had a nice shot of your ship passing by a planet, with a star in the background creating a nice halo. I'd probably go with that.
>>53461728The Romulan chick didn't actually die, the writers just forgot about her and the actress got tired of waiting and went on to do other projects.
On STO how would you go about making the most beat up looking ship?Given the amount of salvaged and mismatched parts you get throughout the game your ship should be an ugly as sin chimera. How would you go about making it look like such a thing?
>>53462135You mean this one?Maybe next time they hold this thing.I don't want to swamp them with pics, even if it was only two.Also i have no idea how many pics one can send them.>>53462818Either mount all borg equipment you can find on your ship and leave their visuals on, and/or get a sovereign and kitbash the crap out of it.
>>53463066>tfw no picDo you have an album with your screenshots? I'm thinking I might be able to get a few wallpapers out of this.
>>53463066Forgot image of course.
>>53463118They are kinda mixed in with the rest of my STO and star trek images.But i can post some if you want to see more.
>>53455466I chose not to send anything.
>>53463143Nah man, it was from the front, maybe a little further on from the same planet
>>53463715Gone looking through my album and all I've got is my edit of it. So the unedited version of this.
>>53463960I don't think that one is mine.
>>53463652It's mine. Here's the original.
>>53464429That is weirdly accurate
>>53464583Here's another one of mine. I have a bunch.I would also be willing to take requests. I could make a pretty nasty looking ship with the Breen shield and some Borg kit parts (once I get the rest of the Omega stuff anyway) at some point.
>>53464676Another just for good measure.
>>53464676Wouldn't happen to have a Dauntless? I reckon it'd look good with either a Sol Defense or Delta set.
>>53462657Wasn't she Seska in Voyager?
>>53461728>all those alternate timelines where the crew get killed are the GM trying to kill off a players Mary Sue OC Donut Steels
>>53464676You should do that beat-up look on a T6 Miranda using the original Miranda parts for good measure.Or wait, maybe on one of the T6 temporals using the TOS skin?
>>53464980I don't have the Dauntless, sorry.>>53466021I don't have the T6 Miranda (got the battlecruiser pack instead), but the T1 Miranda has the original parts and would look just as authentic.As for the T6 TOS ships, any you'd prefer?It may take a bit for me to get back to you on the requests. Just be patient.
>>53466073None in particular, just thinking of that one old-ass Vulcan captain's ship, from TOS times, recovered from the scrapyard and held together by spit and baling wire, and packing 5 different kinds of galactic atrocity-causing weapons.
>>53463715Fuck that's nice
>>53466073Miranda looks pretty great with the Delta Set
>>53464676Where do you get the Borg kit parts?
>>53471759Task force omega rep list.
>>53471759It's from the Omega rep. They're bloody expensive too. In fairness though, the impulse engine is the fastest (sector speed!) in the game.
>>53466637That has to be one of the most endearing of the recurring STG characters.It combines images of badass grandpa, plucky underdog and dangerous maverick.Also a drunken chimera of a ship that feels like an old ship rather than just being told that it's an old ship and it looking like a luxury liner.
>>53471856I'm working on the impulse engine now. Almost threw my hands up and quit playing when I saw how many fucking marks it requires.
>>53473844Every bit of space set requires the same amount of marks, dilithium and other assorted such.
>>53473844I remember when it was from the STFs only, and you were lucky to ever finish the fucking thing.
>>53474410Yeah, that was just downright inhumane.>Do a STF>It has both the ground and space part to it, making it an hour long slog>During it there was a tiny chance a requisition mark could drop and it was random>At the end of the whole thing there would drop one random requisition mark which the whole team had to pass/greed/need for and everyone always pressed need>Once you had such a token you needed it and some dilithium to buy a piece of tech from those STF merchants at DS9I sure as hell don't miss those times.
>>53474489You're thinking of the second rank of the pieces. You could get your first level of the set just redoing the quest over and over. I still have it in my log from when I stopped for a while. But yeah, that requisition drop sucked.
>>53474489I'd like the old STFs back as actual in-game missions, even if they're shitty. They're no less shitty than all the other old content still in the game.>devs have outright admitted that Defera will never be fixed because getting rid of it and remaking it from scratch would be less work
>>53474515There we go, loaded the game up.
I know everyone will probably hate me for this post, but I care not; my parents pre ordered Starfinder for me for my birthday and I plan on running a Star Trek/Sailor Moon crossover game, where the players make their own sailor scouts/tuxedo masks who are bridge officers on an experimental new ship. The transformations will give the pcs more combat abilities an whatnot (super charging the phaser arrays with fire, using the power of friendship to cause the shields to hold longer, etc. I have a lot of story planned out, but much of it is very star trek-y. How do I add in more magical girl?Pic related
>>53462818I exclusively fly Breen Christmas ships. The raider and the carrier. Both look like garbage scows
>>53476001Do you have the giant space lobster that is the Breen dreadnought?
>>53476035I have all of them. Unfortunately I just got a new pc and haven't installed sto yet. Dreading how long it will take
>>53475912>all the main characters are magical girls>How do I add in more magical girl?Have you considered just running a game about magical girls?
>>53475912Mess with the Klingons. Instead of the Hurq, their old gods were Negaverse creatures. Kahless was a Tuxedo Mask equivalent. Those three-pronged Klingon daggers should be henshin tools. Klingon female wear should be a cross between the Duras Sisters and a seifuku. STVI can be re-spun as an OVA where the Starfleet and KDF solved their differences and teamed up for the good of the galaxy.Now of course Klingons are still Klingons, so even as magical girls there will be lots of bloodshed, disruptors, bladed weapons, cloaking devices, gagh, etc., but balancing that should be fun for you as a GM.The Romulans are already cartoonishly sneaky, devious, and yet gray and boring, so it makes sense for them to be the baddies for the campaign, and of course the Borg and the Dominion would both work as anti-senshi factions if your players ever bring the Romulans back into the fold.
>>53475912Just give all the characters big tits and dumb anime speech impediments. Lots of nyu and whatever that's all about.
>>53476783Thanks, most of the setting I have down, my only problem is making some of the "episodes of the week" so to speak, more in tune with the anime side if things while maintaining the star trek moral "it seems humans are capable of advanced emotions such as mercy" shtick
>>53477157That's easy. Just ramp up the cheese factor and "advanced emotions such as mercy" segues neatly into "pretty warriors of love and justice."
>>53477211I'm thinking about trying to turn the moral realization into that end-of-the cartoon sailor moon/he man/gi Joe says segment about how books are the real treasure and to always spay and neuter your pets
>>53477253Kek, that would work. Shit, I just realized how close Voyager treads to this trope sometimes.>Janeway, B'elanna, and Kes/Seven as the senshi team, and Chakotay or Paris acting as their Tuxedo Mask depending on the scenario>Seven even has a transformation into a skintight bodysuit>Neelix as the annoying fuzzy mascot character that showed up with one of the team and never left>trading a digital copy of the complete cultural works of humanity for the macguffin of the weekAll you'd need to do is genderswap Harry Kim (Hari Kim) and Tuvok (T'vok) to have a full roster of five girls.
>>53477347how do you think I got the idea to come up with this lol? I think the two franchises dove-tail quite well together; the theme of friendship is replaced with camaraderie of the crew. The bridge positions all mimic roles of the senshi (moon/venus as captain, mars tactical, mercury science, etc). If the characters themselves were a bit more mature, and there was a bit more violence, it'd be an incredible series. Despite the fact that none of my friends are huge into star trek (most have only seen TNG) and only watched sailor moon/cardcaptor sakura/whatever when they were younger, they all seem pretty enthused on the idea.
>>53477468One more thought: SM is full of superpowered, high-empathy, human-looking yet incredibly long lived characters. That sounds a lot like the El-Aurians. Guinan was on earth during the 20th and 21st centuries, so you could have her pop up and personally remember the events of the SM series without any further deviations from canon other than Guinan taking a trip to Japan in the 90s.
>>53451935The Warp scale shifted dramatically from TOS to TNG. It may not have been the first time.
>>53457589Wait, what? What idea was this exactly? Someone explain the madness.
>>53478211UPN, the network responsible for producing Voyager and Enterprise, was run by complete assholes.In an early idea pitch meeting with Berman and Braga they asked such stellar questions as "what's a hull?" And "is a warp drive like a rocket?". They apparently wanted to sex-up Enterprise, hence decon-chambers and Hoshi getting semi-nude on the reg. one of the other ideas they tried to get through, and fortunately were fought away from, was a band of the week playing a song in the ness hall, instead of 5 minutes of dialogue/progression of the story. UPN were just the worst.
>>53478152Something occurs to me: do we know which warp scale they're using in JJTrek? What about Enterprise?It looks like TOS warp 5 is a relatively small amount faster than TNG warp 4, so that could explain it if Enterprise used the TOS scale and JJTrek uses the TNG scale.Also, TNG warp scales are stupid. I miss the 'simple enough to calculate in your head' TOS scale.
>>53478832The TNG scale is helped by the subset of the transwarp scale, allowing them to apply the same log-scale over a much smaller area. But yeah, the linear TOS scale makes more sense. As limiting yourself to 10 increments between the speed of light and infinite speed is just stupid.
>>53478832>scale>JJTrekThere is no warp scale for it. Shit just goes and sometimes it is there and sometimes it takes a little while.
>>53478916>allowing them to apply the same log-scale over a much smaller area.See, that's the idea.As I recall, it was done in an attempt to keep writers from constantly one-upping each other with higher and higher warp scales.Problem is, it just led to increasing fractions of warp 9 and ended up taking way more to say (compare warp 9.975 to warp 13, similar speeds). A better solution would have simply been to set some kind of canonical limits on the speeds of various ships and enforce them (which is a good idea anyway).
>>53479278Forcing the writers to obey continuity would have solved so many problems.
>>53479440>Forcing the writers to obey continuityI've been rewatching Voyager recently I know, I know and they had an episode (technically a two-parter) where they went back to the 90's and commented on how they had to take a moment to adapt their computer to interface with the binary system used then. Around 5 episodes later, some aliens were on Voyager and commented on how it used some sort of "primitive binary computers" or something similar.On top of the more obvious problems like them firing photon torpedoes like they're going out of style despite the fact that they never seem to get any more and iirc it was stated early on that they didn't have the facilities needed to make new ones.
I haven't really been following the progress of Discovery. I've seen the trailer, but that's about it. But I just got through watching the following video, which doesn't make Discovery's prospects look promising. The visual similarities in the trailer to JJ Trek made me uncomfortable, but this seems to indicate real trouble for the show. What do you suppose are the chances that it actually ends up being pretty good despite all this?https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3I3y3_QmBsQ
>>5348067310% tops. It's got the stench of studio meddling.
>>53446167>ship grappled by alien tentacle thing>phasers literally smashed out of the hull along with a few sections of the hull itself by said tentacles>port nacelle literally being broken in half, with the power conduits to the aft section already clearly broken>several maneuvering thrusters already inoperational>phasers so far have shown no sign of deterring monster>hurrr well our weapons are operational, so we will not launch the escape podsThis ladies and gentleman is why Starfleet looses an estimated 1585700 redshirts every year.Save some redshirts! Know when to evacuate!
>>53480729I'm not really that much of a traditionalist, and I could give a fuck how something plugs into the Star Trek timeline, or if it contradicts certain events in other shows, but I really would like it to not completely piss all over the spirit of Star Trek, or to be a random sci-fi action show that only taps into the intellectual property of Star Trek for the sake of publicity.
>>53480673Jesus this sounds like a fucking nightmare, especially if Discovery is in yet *another* alternate timeline. Fucking bullshit, just toss it into the Kelvin timeline already.
My graphics card is shit, and the angle is awful, but this was the most fun screenshot i've ever made.
>>53480673>20 Minutes of Clickbait: The VideoYeah, no. It's retconning the visual design of the era, not a complete reboot of the continuity.As far as the trailers are concerned, Trek trailers have rarely been accurate in their portrayal of the actual episodes, typically overblowing the importance of minor scenes or just taking things out of context just to make things seem more action-packed.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3hMuQI5PA1c
>>53481022oh coupled with this one.
>>53449643>Yesterday's EnterpriseI think the main selling point of this is that they finally took combat seriously in it. Usually, the captain would sit there pondering while the Enterprise got repeatedly hammered by enemy fire before reluctantly giving the order to return fire... once, and then see what happens. I appreciate TNG's more diplomatic focus, but your ship is in danger of being blown apart, for fuck's sake; please take shit seriously.>Year of HellIt was nice to see Voyager actually have to deal with consequences. Again, I think a lot of the enjoyment comes from actually addressing weak points of the show.>Trials and TribblationsThe time travel aspect often has annoying implications for the show, but that really wasn't a factor here, as the episode really didn't take itself seriously. I certainly wouldn't call it one of the best stories in the series, but it was amusing.>City on the Edge of ForeverI've gotta be honest; this one always kind of bored me. Then again, I find the prospect of returning to historically-modern Earth to be lame from the get-go.>>53449778>The VisitorEh. It's okay, I guess.>All Good ThingsI liked it better upon rewatching it, but I hate the obnoxious walking plot device that is Q, so that at least somewhat limits my appreciation of anything with him in it. This and the one about Picard getting stabbed in the heart are probably the two best episodes involving Q.>YesteryearThat's the animated series? I've only seen a couple of random episodes of that. Back in the day, I couldn't stomach the animation, but I think I could at least somewhat overlook that now.
>>53480991I'm okay with not really worrying about timelines too much, but letting the show do its own thing... just as long as it doesn't go too near JJ Trek.>Fucking bullshit, just toss it into the KelvinSee, at that point you lose me. I'm really not a fan of JJ Trek, and the closer you bring the show to it, the less like actual Trek it is.
>>53481033It's worth remembering how shitty that episode was. In fact, much of season 1 was rather lackluster.
>>53481283It already looks like the Kelvin timeline and sounds like the Kelvin timeline, so just accept it, embrace it, and make it part of that timeline. We don't need a *third* timeline that's off doing who knows what just to sell merchandise or whatever. Note that I dislike JJtrek too, but if that's what they're going for, they should own up to that.
>>53481283I do, however, hate the concept of creating an in-show explanation for the creation of yet another timeline. Just fucking make the show and don't worry about that shit. Don't get into the nuts and bolts of previously-established and it shouldn't be that much of a problem. Shit, classic Trek contradicted itself a decent bit, and that was never a problem.
>>53481323>Note that I dislike JJtrek too, but if that's what they're going for, they should own up to that.The producers distinctly don't want to own up to that, because if they do, the grogs and people who prefer mainline Trek won't touch it. Of course, since they've decided that the original aesthetic was bad and that we need LENS FLARE! over miniskirts, CBS has probably thrown up their hands and said fuck it.
>>53481323>Note that I dislike JJtrek too, but if that's what they're going for, they should own up to that.Yeah, that makes sense. I guess I'm just hoping that if they pretend it's not JJ Trek, then maybe it will retain some elements of the original show.
>>53481382>we need LENS FLARE!Only if you're American. Netflix version of the trailer has notably less than the CBS one.
>>53481447>Only if you're American. Netflix version of the trailer has notably less than the CBS one.That's fucked up.Honestly, the lens flare bothers me more as a symptom of something I don't like, than as a real issue in and of itself.
>>53480673Well that was depressing.On the positive side I didn't even know The Orville was a thing and it looks good.
>>53481515Given the lack of it in the Netflix trailers, I don't think we have to worry about it being in the episodes themselves.It's just another example of CBS' marketing department being completely out of touch with both the audience and the people actually working on the show.
>>53481537On the bright side, Kurtzman being out could only be viewed as a good thing, in my opinion.
>>53481382>The producers distinctly don't want to own up to that, because if they do, the grogs and people who prefer mainline Trek won't touch it.Cunty bastards. Just own your shit, CBS. If JJtrek wasn't profitable (it wasn't) then don't make more of it. Instead, what you should do is make prime Trek, the one everyone wants but you refuse to make. It boggles the mind.>>53481387>I guess I'm just hoping that if they pretend it's not JJ Trek, then maybe it will retain some elements of the original show.A respectable but naive hope. It won't and we all know it won't. I really wish it would, but CBS has shown little to no interest in prime timeline Trek and even if they had interest, I doubt they have the ability to produce it, since no one associated with primeline Trek wants anything to do with CBS any more.
>>53480673I think it'll be as good as the first season of any other Trek show, which is to say mostly garbage with a good pilot and handful of decent episodes. But because it's 2017 and not 1987, it won't get the chance to last long enough to find it's footing, and people will whine about SJW boogeymen instead of realizing this shit has happened with every Trek show.
>>53481800>But because it's 2017 and not 1987, it won't get the chance to last long enough to find it's footingIf it was purely a CBS show I'd agree, but since Netflix are so heavily invested in it I think it has a chance to last two or three seasons at least.Also the lack of Rick Berman might allow it to git gud without having to blow an entire season first.
TL:DR, just watch Star Trek: Continues instead
>>53481902Netflix having bankrolled the series to be available for everywhere that isn't the U.S. and Canada is probably the only thing that is going to give Discovery a chance to get good.Even then, if CBS All Access is a flop, who knows what the execs at CBS will do. I guess I'll be waiting and seeing, and when the non-Canadian and U.S. anons see it, I'll at least get to hear their thoughts about it.
>>53483017They'll kill the series out of spite.
>Star Trek: Generations is on TVFuck I forgot how the atmosphere of this entire film is just sad, like it's the only film in the series where you get this inescapable feeling of sadness through nearly every scene. I don't know if that's the work of the film itself, or the meta-knowledge that the film is the (second) end of both the original and the next generation series.
>>53486383Discovery being a prequel/AU makes the melancholy of Generations worse in hindsight. It's the end of the line for the starships Enterprise in prime timeline series. The Enterprise B we know was doomed from the fact that a C was commissioned a bare 30 years later while USS Excelsior is still around in DS9, and we already saw the Enterprise C die. The Enterprise E got three bad movies in a six year span, and that was that. There have been no more onscreen heirs to the NCC-1701 of TOS, and there may never be again.
>>53486535>The Enterprise E got three bad movies in a six year spanEh, more like one decent movie, one meh movie, and one utter shit movie.
>>53486535According to the TNG Tech Manual, 1701-B was decommissioned, rather than destroyed. Beta canon has her destroyed in 2329 by an "unknown infection", with the source being the Haynes manual, but I'll take the TM over that any day (seeing as how the TM is essentially a cleaned up TNG series bible).
>>53486689>Eh, more like one decent movie, one meh movie, and one utter shit movie.First Contact, Insurrection, and Nemesis in that order?
>>53486689Not the guy you're replying to, but I'd consider all the TNG movies bad. Some are less bad than others.Generations is just dumb from the word go. Only Picard gets to do anything of note, and he has to drag poor Kirk into it so he can win a fistfight rather than go back and just prevent Soran from ever being able to launch a missile in the first place.First Contact is just a dumb action movie, whose only real nod to the series is continuing Data's search for his humanity and Picard's Borg PTSD. The rest of the crew has slightly more to do than they did in Generations.Insurrection is the most like an extended episode of TNG, and the crew has the most to do rather than being entirely Picard and Data centric. This doesn't really improve the movie, but at least no one crashes the ship, or misuses time travel, nor do we have to suffer the awfulness that is the Borg Queen.Nemesis is a trainwreck of terrible decisions, characters no longer acting like themselves, has a literal who for a villain that comes out of left field (surprise! I'm your clone!), the Romulans/Remans build a Soong type android and leave it on an undeveloped world in the off-chance the Ent-E will happen by and pick up the positronic signal, take the android aboard, reassemble and reactivate it, and then Clone Picard will use it as an agent from the inside so he can kidnap The Real Picard and get his blood in one of the most convoluted and stupid plots I've ever had the displeasure to think about. Also psychic Troi rape was a thing, as well as overweight Riker somehow overpowering Ron Perlman dressed as Count Orlok, and Data dying because actors get sick of doing a thing forever.It gave us the Mogai in return. Which is not a fair trade despite how great she looks.Of them all, First Contact is definitely the most watchable. Does it rank as high as decent? Probably. I suppose it depends on how much you like some of the gags or the action sequences.
>>53487383I really do love the Valdore/Mogai. Shame how they only show up to job for the Scimitar.
>>53446167>So if Enterprise is non-canon to the prime timelineBut that's not true. It's canon.>>53446825>We were discussing this in the tail end of the previous thread.You are all of you terrible people.
>>53487383All fairly accurate, with one exception. First Contact is smudged by missteps (Headcanon is the Borg needed a central command at the time because they were functioning off short-term commands pre-time jump) but it does great character stuff with Picard even if it contradicts post-Descent stuff. What doesn't make any sense in-universe is the Defiant getting its shit pushed in facing an enemy it was specifically designed to put down quickly, the Borg actively disregarding the Gamma Quadrant wormhole and/or occupying Dominion forces in the AQ at the time, and the fact that NOTHING the TNG crew did had any effect outside a throwaway line/episode in ENT. That said, who greenlit Generations when it wasn't even a necessary move to begin with? Exploring Data's emotions could have been better done with FC if they took some of the interactions and put them there instead, with a legitimate inner struggle between betraying his friends and realizing his dream via the Borg. Seriously. Kirk didn't need 2 fucking send-offs.
>>53487513They're really just reaching. I don't know how you can be a Trek fan and not find a way to accept that it's going to be inconsistent thanks to 50 years of material, potentially hundreds of writers, and little to no quality control.
>>53487620What I understood, adding all the TOS stuff and Kirk in the Generations was higher ups believing a movie with just with TNG cast would not do so well in the box office . Which was kinda retarded as TNG had been quite succesfull series by then.Secondly Generations was written just after they had finished All Good Things. It had rather difficult writing process as the lead writers where exhausted after doing the two parter.
>>53487620>DefiantFrom what I've read, it was a convenient way of reuniting Worf with the rest of the cast. Not really believable, but it served the needs of the script.I'm in the minority in that I just don't like First Contact much. For me, the time travel plot, the Borg Queen, the anemic fight at the beginning, the absolutely retarded way in which the Borg manage to take over key parts of the ship, the uninteresting way in which humans and Vulcans achieve first contact... It just doesn't work for me.
>>53487636Also some diehard trekkies just don't like Enterprise at all and in their head cannon think it's "NOT CANON"
>>53487921I can sort of understand the hate for ENT. I'm not a huge fan of the series, and I feel that it made very poor use of the ideas behind it, and the era that it was supposed to be set in. But it's not the worst offender in all of Trek, and it's not entirely bereft of value to the prime universe.But then, we've had people declare Threshold non-cannon with zero evidence, so... I don't know. Head canon =/= official canon.
>>53483649No.It seems that most fans want it to be good because we just want more good Star Trek and will settle for adequate Star Trek should good not be available.We expect it to be shit, and that makes us sad and slightly angry. Or at least that seems to be what I'm seeing.I will be watching it with increasingly low expectations and hoping it won't be garbage.
>>53471851Thank you.I had no idea what that screen/tab did. How much grind is needed to achieve the full Borg set and is it worth it?
>>53488286It's a pretty significant grind. The impulse engine (for some reason) sets your default sector speed to 14, which coupled with the sector speed skill choice for the science tree, is the fastest non-slipstream speed you'll ever get in STO.It used to be a really good overall set for your ship, but these days it's space barbie. How much time and effort that's worth is subjective.
>>53488286More than it should be, since the borg set stuff costs 900/1000 marks compared to the 750 of every other set. But ISA actually pops, even during events, so the marks are some of the easiest to get.
>Bashir's holonovels are essentially 24th century RPGs
>>53489859>with a holodeck all tv is now vidja>even the porn>especially the porn
>>53488087>we've had people declare Threshold non-cannon with zero evidenceWasn't there an episode later in the series, where Tom Paris remarks that he's "never flown transwarp" before?
>>53490825Nope.>PARIS: I've never navigated a transwarp conduit. Any problems I should be aware of? From "Day of Honor">http://www.chakoteya.net/Voyager/403.htm>http://memory-alpha.wikia.com/wiki/Transwarp_threshold>http://memory-alpha.wikia.com/wiki/Transwarp_conduitA transwarp conduit is different from the the transwarp threshold, even though both sound like they might be related. They're not. One is Warp 10 "gone to plaid with lizard sex/infinite speed" and the other is just faster than traditional warp drives.If you find evidence somewhere that "Threshold" was declared non-canon, I'll admit I was wrong and be the first to bookmark it for future reference. But until then, it's the equivalent of a Trek urban myth.
Maybe I'm getting this all wrong but I though Transwarp speeds operated on the same logarithmic scale as standard warp factors, except taking their baseline speed as the speed of subspace. Which is crazy fucking fast (warp 9.9999...etc.) but still isn't infinite lizard speed.
>>53488385I remember getting the borg set back in 2011-2012 or so. Running Infected: Conduit over and over to farm encrypted data chips. Haven't played in about a year. How's the game now?
>>53487915My main beef, other than the Borg queen (which was some stupid shit), was the action movie feel of the thing. It just didn't feel like TNG to me. Though to be fair, none of the movies really do.
>>53487921I've never understood why Enterprise seems to get more flack than Voyager. Is it just because Voyager is easier to ignore because it's not tied into the past of the other shows?
>>53492994Because Enterprise had a lot more blatant stupid in it right from the start.
>>53492994Basically >>53493162 this. "Broken Bow" would have you believe that Qo'nos is four days away from Earth at Warp 4. Additionally, this episode introduces us to the Smugcans, the Temporal Cold War, and a bunch of other stuff I'm forgetting likely.>>53492965Right there with you anon.>>53492201Nah. You're more or less right. Transwarp is just really high warp approaching but never quite hitting 10 (or is effectively the same, even if they don't use a traditional warp engine to get there).Just another reason the TNG warp scale needs to be taken out behind the shed and phasered.
>>53489970Heck, the Doctor in Voyager actually created a holowaifu for some Vulcan to help him deal with the Pon Farr.
>>53493899Paris made a duplicate of Tuvok's wife.
You know what is odd here?That the firing got even heavier and that i survived through that AND that it all lasted for 5 minutes, during which i was playing this on the background.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z9n9twv_bUo
>>53493162I guess I never really took Enterprise seriously from the standpoint of continuity. To me, it's more or less it's own thing. It's sort of like the Star Wars prequels. Those things sucked all manner of dick, but issues of continuity accounted for maybe 1% of that. The Anakin in the prequels is not the same character as Darth Vader in the original trilogy.And as a self-contained thing, I think Enterprise stood up a lot better than Voyager. Not, mind you, that it didn't have some significant flaws (overall, the casting was pretty flawed, for instance).
>>53496362Huh, i guess i now know where they got the idea for these things.
>>53478625Proving once again that networks are almost perpetually the death of Star Trek.
>>53478625>They apparently wanted to sex-up Enterprise, hence decon-chambers and Hoshi getting semi-nude on the reg.To be fair, they pushed women's costumes as far as the network would let them in TOS, so it's not like catering to sex appeal is in any way anti-Trek.
>>53496834Difference being in the 60s it was the cast members who hiked their skirts up and the media execs who told them to pull them down, not the other way around.
since this is often /stog/, anyone else hyped as fuck for Bridge Crew release tonight?
>>53496362I, uh, what?Seeing this makes me wish Enterprise's writere had the balls to depict a post WWIII starship with lasers and nukes, without a universal translator or viewscreen, where the ideals of United Earth were actually being put to the test on the regular because you can't see the aliens you're hailing and have no guarantee that they're not trying to ambush or take advantage of you. Each first contact would be tense and frantic, with Hoshi working to hammer out their syntax and Reed second guessing their intentions while Archer tries to formulate a course of action, and if they went to battle every battle would be nail biting as lasers and nukes barely scratched alien shields, and return phaser and disruptor fire savages the fragile NX-01 every time. Such an Enterprise would be worth spending the first season assembling the team and rushing to get the ship completed, negotiating with the Vulcans and occasionally ripping off or stealing their tech because humans literally cannot be suppressed from exploring. Makes me sad we'll never see it.
>>53497262That should have been the first half of season 1.Entire 2nd half should have been the months long journey to reach the Klingon homeworld because nobody actually wants to push the engines to the theoretical upper limit of warp 5.Also the distinctive secondary hull shape that would be forever copied for eventually nothing but tradition's sake was originally because the Warp Core gave out strange radiations that couldn't be entirely blocked. The team responsible for the warp engines receiving notably higher pay and more than twice the anti-radiation treatments of any other group on the crew.Also teleporters that can safely be used on living things should not have been a thing until they were obtained and adapted from a secondhand freighter NASA/Star Fleet paid what to them was an extortionate amount of cash in the form of mixed jewels for some time towards the end of the 3rd season at earliest. Even then they would give you cancer of some sort but with any luck it would be something treatable, that's why they only get used in real emergencies.It would also, in an ideal world, have started with the funeral of Cpt. Archer's father. Funeral attended also by Vulcan officials on Earth, despite Archer's prejudice of them. But not by Zefram Cochrane. This is the first anyone realizes that he as vanished. His disappearance is speculated upon, discussed, investigated but ultimately nobody ever finds out why he vanished.
>>53497262>Have to return to Earth every half season to resupply on crew from the rampant deaths>Archer starts out a normal person but becomes more unhinged every time a bulkhead is vaporized taking an entire crew department with it
>>53451003I've been playing for years and I've never seen this, where can i find it?
>>53497635I thought transporters were explicitly a human invention and that no race that they had met at that point had them?
>>53498859That would actually be great - it would make the redshirt death rate in TOS look reasonable by comparison.>>53499129Correct.
>>53499129At least in local space. Plenty of other races seem to have developed independent transporter tech with no way of having taken the tech from Earth. The Voth, Dominion and Borg, for instance. It's probably a rare technology to develop naturally within a society though and the 3 examples I gave had much longer to develop their own technology.
>>53487383>Not the guy you're replying to, but I'd consider all the TNG movies bad.Sure, I just don't totally agree. I liked First Contact quite a bit. Insurrection was more boring than anything, and aside from the ship combat Nemesis was just garbage. I didn't mention Generations because it doesn't have the E-E.
>>53499041Go to Logs (a tab in the mission window), filter to Personal, hit New.
>>53498859>>53499263Unironically what I'd like to see. Dangerous local space, before it was tamed by the Federation. Make the founding of the Federation a huge deal because these local powers who were fighting bloody skirmishes with each other with nukes and phasers and planet busters have now come together in peace.
Earth to Qo'noS should have taken the better part of 9+ months if done under the unbelievable conditions of going without stopping at warp 5 the whole way.That's how slow those low warp factors are.
>>53501285Should have been a season-long ordeal, basically. Not to mention the return journey.
>>53502461>twenty-four episode road trip across the galactic neighborhood>every civilization with a decent subspace receiver picks up their unfamiliar warp signature and diverts patrol ships to investigate / study / initiate first contact / pull over and ask for license and registration / demand fealty and tribute to the BiSolar Hegemony of Zzzzrqwanoskqr>inevitable combat during stops by the more paranoid aliens leaves the ship punched full of holes and desperately low on spare parts and non-named personnel>security officer grows increasing eager to privateer the shit out of passing unarmed cargo vessels>idealistic comms officer keeps trying to convince vessels full of refugees to sign on as crew>chief engineer doesn't care what comes aboard as long as he can use it to plug the hull breachesWe could have had FTL: The Series, but nooooo
>>53504164>We could have had FTL: The Series, but noooooSomeone should still make that, even if its not Trek. I'd pay to watch that.
>>53500729>we don't agreeThat's fine. Have a Sovereign you reasonable bastard, you.
>>53504164So basically a rehash of VOY? Except good?
>>53504164>>53502461>>53501285>>53501227>>53498859>>53497635>>53497262>>53496362All in favor of drafting a five-season script for Enterprise based on this that doesn't suck ass (i.e., no Suliban)?S1: Road trip, Klingon on boardS2 through S4: what have those pointy-eared fucks been hiding?S2: Shran Surprise!S3 Tech time (teleporters, holodecks, etc.)S4: Romulans 'round RigelS5: Grand Alliance to fight the psycho Vulcans from S4, finale=birth of the Federation
>>53504416>USS HonorWorf got a Sov? Riker only got a little Luna, Frakes barely fits on the bridge...
>>53504637Squeaky wheel gets the grease. Worf never, ever stops talking about honor. Riker was content to not have his own command for 10+ years.
>>53504609>holodecksTOS didn't have holodecks. Plus, they're retarded and make for shitty episodes.
>>53504609Also, my vote for the NX-01:https://3dwarehouse.sketchup.com/model/uf3b1b12e-bce1-4130-9241-87a0ebfeb4ca/NX-01-Alternativeand they get a refit mid-S3 because of>>53497635that introduces the classic Enterprise shape with a secondary hull to cut down on the cancer rates...
>>53504674Fine, it was just an idea: how about replicators and tractor beams, maybe photon torpedoes and phasers too...
>>53504609That could lead to a spinoff if successful"Star Trek: Enterprise-Romulan War" would have a few seasons of good content to it, especially if the POV switches away from Archer and company every now and then...
>>53497262>>53497635>>53498859>>53499129>>53501227>>53501285>>53502461>>53504164>>53504609>>53504695>>53505194And while we're making a clean break from anything a UPN exec would approve, I'd like the NX-01 to be the XCV-330 ringship. Ties up a visual plothole and drives home the point that humans are basically feverishly copying Vulcan ring warp drive to get out to space as quick as possible. And just looks so goddamn cool.
>>53505868>redshirts manning casing-spewing railgun turrets like Heuy door gunners to shoot down Orion fighters>Reed frantically calculating firing solutions for nukes and railguns like it's Halo: Fall of Reach>Archer learning the diplomacy skills he'll use in founding the Federation by bluffing out his ass to prevent enemy of the week from steamrolling them with photon torpedoes>Phlox treating a truly ridiculous amount of crewmen for severe radiation poisoning, his species' hat is that they're rad resistantEnterprise could have been so metal.
>>53506196Star Trek's inherent optimism would prevent that. We know it all works out in the end.
>>53506475In the hands of decent writers it could be an interesting balance of sacrifice vs. principles, with inexperience and attempting to hold things together for the sake of not just the present situation providing conflict outside of just the direct demands of running the ship.Oh wait... that's what was supposed to happen instead of idiot plots where everyone is a moron.
>>53506669Would've been nice if Voyager was like that too, instead of infinite Photon Torpedoes/Shuttle Craft and aside from the occasional mention of replicator rations.
>>53507047It's almost like a new ship that's top of the line but still not capable of taking on everything that's out there by a long shot, being stuck on a long and dangerous mission, far from home, having to find friends along the way or at least not pissing off everyone in their path, with a crew that's got problems due to the environment and others that are picked up along the way not integrating perfectly... It's like it's a really fucking solid premise for dramatic storytelling, perfect for star trek's setting given the established concepts and tropes in place, especially the morality of Star Fleet from being forged in cooperation and hope and trying to be better people (which is immediately antagonistic to the demands of being on a frontier). And it's a premise that can be re-done in slightly different ways repeatedly and still work, particularly just from changing up the main characters to explore how they handle the shit or changing the tech available to shift how problems can be dealt with. /bittertheyfuckeditupstill
>>53507445If they released it on Netflix in the US it would be a natural fit, too, but CBS continues to ruin everything.
>>53507445Third time's a charm, right?
>>53505868>>53505989>>53506669And once more /tg/ makes me want things that can never be.I would have the ring-engines be on all the Earth ships pre-Enterprise as the designs could have been gifts from the Vulcans based on 120 year old designs. They were given by the Vulcans because they saw it as necessary for humanity to be on at least more than one planet so that in the case of an extinction level even they might in some capacity survive, if the humans ever invent anything useful they might repay them and share and also even with 120 year old warp engine designs they would never be threat.Humanity was still getting over WW3 and quite eager to find new green pastures that didn't glow in the dark.Enterprise was based on the designs on the Zefram Cochrane and refined with the knowledge shared by the Vulcans. Archer's dad being Cochrane colleague friend and also instrumental in making the nacelle style engines a viable possibility.Also the ship shouldn't have phasers until some seasons in when they get the photon torpedoes. They should have rail guns and lasers when they set out to really drive home how primitive this shit is.In a similar manner hand weapons should be a bullet firing gun powered by magnets so it works in vacuum and weird atmospheres and, for the stun option, a taser.Also more than one doctor.
>>53505868I'd still have gone with the NX design and just not called it the Enterprise. I'd have other Earth ships as ringships, with Starfleet generally claiming that the technology is a dead end, much to the chagrin of the Vulcans.
>>53509432>>53509452I do concede, it would be better thematically for Starfleet to throw out Vulcan warp ship plans for the NX-01 and say they're garbage and go with this new two nacelle design. Cue buildup to the season finale where we see whether it's any good or the Vulcans were right and we're not ready to become an interstellar power. Spoiler: it is better, driven home by performing some sort of rescue that Vulcan ships can't do (turning 45 degrees? lmao)
>>53510700Some sort of subspace shenanigans, where the Vulcan's larger but ultimately weaker subspace bubble collapses and it's up to Commander Archer (now still XO to Forrester) to take control of the NX-01 and save the day. Embarrassing the Vulcans is just icing on the cake for him.
>>53511344These threads always depress me because there's always a discussion of what Enterprise or Voyager could have been.
>>53497262>without a ... viewscreenWhy? We have that technology now.
>>53512370You mean we have magic cameras which can zoom into crystal clear HD quality pictures from several light seconds away?As well as screens which can connect to unknown alien technology screens?
>>53512370Yeah, and you can't cut the viewscreen out without massively changing the way Star Trek likes to present encounters.Though I feel that some dumbing down of the view screenn would be necessary to fit with a lower-tech setting. It'd be cool if the "Entering visual range - On screen!" dialogue just resulted in a small warp distortion effect or tiny light moving among the stars.
>>53512513Or a map. They're always cool.
>>53512513Or how about showing colored geometrical shapes on a 3D map with nearby area also rendered in single colored geometry way.
>>53512902I wish we'd seen more of this viewscreen mode.
>>53512474I thought it was pretty clear in the show that the view screens themselves weren't sensors.
>>53513512But they are linked to sensors and sensors are currently on the level of showing a physical object at certain distance away from you.Cameras on the other hand can show images, but i highly doubt that there is any camera strong enough to show us another ship at ranges where star trek ships normally meet each other.Unless of course they decide to mount a hubble telescope sized camera on the ship and move it in a turret.That would actually make for some great episodes where aliens think the giant lens thing we aim at them is a weapon when in fact its just our ghetto sensor system trying to get a clear picture of them.
>>53512031Until someone goes and makes a science fiction book/show using similar concepts and we can claim to be prescient.
>>53511018that is sexualthose nacelles...wew
Remember guys, never eat at Bolian restaurant.
>>53515904At least you don't have the Gul's Itch...
>>53512031It's okay Anon, soon we will be able to add Discovery to that.
>>53512902This is way more uselful for the bridgecrew anyway. Weapons ranges, clear distances and information.
>>53516948>>53516772>>53516606http://the-guls-itch.tumblr.com/For all your Gul Brannigan needs.
>>53519588Going to have to counter that one
>>53513942This is how I know you have zero remote sensing background.
>>53520572You depressing motherfucker.
>>53513942It could make an interesting First Contact with the Andorian Empire, via Commander Thy'lek Shran, was when they find the Enterprise orbiting a world they had earmarked for settlement and they want to know why. Mostly the Enterprise confuses them and they don't like being confused when national security is concerned.The Enterprise is more or less completely unarmed (lasers and what look like ye olde asteroid mining supplies aren't classed as weapons)It has dangerously flimsy design so it must have been deployed by a larger ship (because nobody would be stupid enough to try and fly that interstellar)No energy shields of any sort.It has what appear to be minimal sensors at best.The communications system appears to be a subspace Morse Code machine of the sort he hasn't seen since he was a child. A child visiting a museum.The Inspection crew took one look at the warp-core and NOPED the fuck out of the room. It leaks delta radiation and the crew know it and havent done shit about it other than take anti-rad drugs and line the core with lead. ProTip; lead has minimal effect on delta radiation.Crew armed with devices that fire bullets like something from the old sagas.His mission is to determine what the fuck these round eared vulcans want because this is clearly a rather stupid ruse. Clearly. Nobody would be stupid enough to actually travel in a ship like that willingly. Nobody could be that naive and ignorant about the galaxy and not be dead already. This has to be a prank of some sort. Nobody could be so fucking insane as to be using a computer so fucking primitive their own ship couldn't interface with it. It's clear that this has to be some sort of trick. It must be. There can be no other explanation. The other Captain told him the ship can make warp 5 and he said it like he was proud.
>>53519094I figure it'd be set to that most of the time anyway.
>>53521326Jesus, the episodes we could have got.
>>53523772Nah man, gotta have a screen showing a star-field and some space debris going by really fast, for reasons. Why would you display pertinent information in the command centre of a ship?
>>53521326Come to think of it, even though there's an Andorian Empire, I don't think we've ever seen anything like an imperial family or even nobility among them. Maybe that could be worked into this new theoretical Enterprise series.
>>53525648It may have been a constitutional monarchy, like Britain. Wherein the royal family has a limited, ceremonial role in state leadership.Alternately, I know at least one of the beta-canon series had the Andorians throne vacant for over a Millennia. Owing to some former Emperor completely screwing things up during his reign and essentially calling quits on the the monarchy.
>Shran is best enterprise character
>>53526409Sold solely by the fact that Jeffrey Coombs is a damn good actor. Same reason Brunt (FCA) and Weyoun were elevated above their limits.
>>53521326>>53524913From the human perspective, primitive Trek would be /k/ as fuck by necessity. When brute force doesn't win the day, it's time to OPERATE. Physics hax, antimatter IEDs, EVA suited boarding parties ("space marines" in the 18th century naval marine infantry sense), and sheer competence would make up for a lot given how dumb most Trek races are about war. Take the MACOs, remove the phasers, and turn the OPERATOR up to eleven.Actually this is starting to sound a lot like SG-1 minus the stupidly fast hyperdrives and Asgard hax.
>>53527052Given it's still star trek, they'd get technical first then go to brute force rather than have it the first option.
>>53528062I dunno, Cochrane's warp test was built off an old ICBM. Early Starfleet would be built off the ashes of Earth after all, they should operate like that.
>>53512474>zoom into crystal clear HD quality pictures from several light seconds awaySensors and TV handwaving>connect to unknown alien technology screensSoftware, probably hooked into a universal translator type thing.Viewscreens are literally just a big-ass TV with a fancy webcam (probably also sensors) set up for webcam-type streaming and also looking at camera/sensor feeds of outside the ship. We also have facial recognition and tracking software (hell, some came free with a $20 webcam I bought like 5 years ago).TV in general tends to have problems with thinking you can zoom in crazy far on images with little to nothing in the way of problems, and that's a fair thing to be complaining about, but it's hardly a key feature of ST style viewscreens. Also, we don't know how good their sensors are (and we typically don't get all that much in the way of concrete distances to any given thing unless it's right next to them).Same with handwaving the first contact difficulties in favor of jumping straight into the story.
>>53528164Except if they go brute force first, then it's missing the point of the setting.And would be really fucking dumb at the time where humanity are the new guys on the scene.And the whole thing with the ICBM was that it was hugely symbolic in that a thing built with the purpose of destroying on a huge scale was re-purposed into a different thing that ushered in an era of peace and prosperity for humanity after they'd been brought to their lowest by a limited nuclear war.
>>53444133how do people feel about star trek online storyline?about temporal cold (and hot) war, iconians, fates of voyager crew, romulan republic and recently the lukari?
>>53530234Giant mess, terribly written.
>>53528964I feel like going full OPERATOR should be reserved for when shit really hits the fan, like the Orion Syndicate hijacking a colony ship to sell the passengers off into slavery.When you keep those instances limited, you can also have the crew go through some morality spiel where the captain ruefully asks whether they'll ever be able to leave their past behind.
>>53530234Everything related to TCW is terrible. Just like on the show. It was nice to get the characters and such, but it could have been done better, with just normal time travel fun times. They didn't need to throw in four different enemy factions there. If they had just done the Not'Kool storyline, with or without time travel, that could have been a decent thing. But including everyone else was terrible. Iconians also shouldn't have been a thing. I mean, it was ok as a series of missions and the like, but having the backdrop to those missions being this big apocalyptic war was silly. If they had treated them as just another bad guy faction, even if they were the masterminds behind the rest of the game plot up to that point, it would have been fine - powerful enemies are a diamond dozen in Trek - but being bbeg-tier when the game isn't even close to ending is more than a little silly. It's also silly lore-wise, but it's worse for the plotting of the game. Otherwise, I think STO is a fine addition to Trek lore, and honestly far prefer it to the novel canon.
>>53530537That would have been a good episode.The Alpha Centauri Colony and the people heading there. Zefram Cochrane could have settle down there in his old age but before his disappearance to tie in with the other fluff about him.
>>53530234Overall? A shitty mess that took the setting in directions I'm not fond of.The TCW is stupid, and no amount of fanservice can fix it. The Iconian arc was also stupid, but I guess we gave them their ball back and now all those trillions of people can rest easy knowing we did the right thing.Voyagers crew I mostly don't have issues with. Tuvok I don't mind. He's based. Neelix is less shit somehow (probably because the writers are different and Philips got to play an older more mature Neelix). Harry finally getting a command and being a pretty decent voice of reason was a nice touch. Paris was phoned in. The Doctor was there. Not much to complain about one way or the other.As for Seven of Nine? Bullshit the Vaadwaur are her fault. Did the writer's watch the goddamn episode? It was Janeway's fault the whole way through. Then, she has the audacity to pin it all on Seven like her hands were clean? Fuck Janeway.The Romulan Republic stuff is okay, but it's kind of your generic "good guy rebels fight off the evil empire!" and it could have been more interesting than that (though, I guess, not in an MMO, and certainly not a Star Trek one). As far as the Lukari? It seemed cool in the beginning, but they're turning into real Mary Sues with their protomatter space magic shit, and the "ebul" military industrial complex Kentari with their rather convenient reformist leader.But, Kuumaarke a cute. I'll give her that.
>>53531611>protomatter space magicThis is the only issue that's been bothering me out of the whole lot desu. It's a bit too much for a freshly warp travelling culture to utilize protomatter with such proficiency. Starfleet made the genesis project in Kirk era and they still fucked it up.On the other hand, they did have help from the federation/alliance at that point.
>>53531611>>53531742I actually like the protomatter thing:1. It shows how technological progress isn't a linear thing. The Lukari can barely into warp tech, and don't have transporters, but that doesn't stop them from being more advanced in other areas.2. They probably had a lot of the same problems with protomatter that the Federation did. But they didn't just give up because of a bit of a setback, or political pressure (I'm sure a big part of the failure of Genesis was political pressure from the Klingons and the more passive Federation members). They kept working on it until it was almost routine.3. It goes against the general Trek theme of "bad tech is bad". Just because a protomatter thing can be a weapon, doesn't mean it's a bad technology. >It's a bit too much for a freshly warp travelling cultureThey aren't a new warp species. They just didn't, until now, go out, so they didn't have a well-developed ship design tradition. The Lukari got to their planet somehow, and I doubt it was generation ships, judging by the tech level of the Kentari. And the fact that the Lukari were able to pull an advanced vessel (even by Alliance standards) out of their rears in a matter of months is testament to the fact that these guys aren't simpletons.
>>53531840I get where you're coming from with this, and I agree that it's not a terrible idea on the whole... but, I'm waiting for the other shoe to drop with the Lukari. They seem too perfectly nice and non-aggressive and advanced. They have a perfect little society where no one would ever misuse protomatter, and they've managed to get along without colonies or space weapons and not get their faces stomped in by someone meaner.It's asking me to accept all of this with very little info to go on.
>>53531840The protomatter thing irks me; it's pretty clear that STO's writers weren'nt paying attention to the canon.Protomatter does not magically regrow things. That was the Genesis Effect. Protomatter just accelerated the effect to something less than geological timescales.
>>53532074well that's also what it does in the recent episodes when used by the tzenk whatstheirname evil lizards of the dayalthough unlike genesis torpedo it seems to only affect the planet surface rather than disintegrating the entire body
>>53532172The torpedo was originally supposed to just affect the surface of a planet. That was probably what messed up the Genesis planet - improper use. The cave was just fine.
>>53532222David said he cheated. The matrix was unstable. It's probable that in order to make the Genesis Torpedo affect such a large area, that they cut corners, and it couldn't last.
>>53530234Iconians should never have been something you could fight, should not have been something directly observed and sure as shit should not have been introduced by them beaming into Klingon HQ, murdering the entire council, twiddling moustache and beaming the fuck back out. They should have been the ever present, never seen creeping primordial monsters. The puppet strings disappear up into the darkness and the hand is obscured, you can find reports of them from their puppets like Hakeev but never will they reveal themselves.TCW would have been better if Daniels and Co. intentionally never explained shit beyond what you needed to know because temporal contamination, didn't let you keep most of the shit you pick up from the future (mini-game for how much you can hide in the transporter buffer and rematerialize later). Chekov and the other turn up and vanish from your story with barely an explanation because they are only slightly less in the dark than you are. Nothing is confirmed, truth only found by inference.Voyager Crew were for the most part a mistake to me how they were used. Most of them seem to have been given a ship based on "these are named character" rather than an in-universe reason.Romulan story was Rebulz gud --> Empire Ebil!!1!!! It even had the bit where you come back to the moisture farm to find Owen and Beru Lars burned.Lukari started out as a very good idea. You get to be big brother to a species taking it's first real steps towards the stars. Now it turns out that they are some sort of survivor civilization that is super good with proto-matter for no reason and are here to teach us about the good news of Captain Planet. They're going to turn into the fucking Defari.
>>53533243>Most of them seem to have been given a ship based on "these are named character" rather than an in-universe reasonYou do know that it's been 30 years, right? That's plenty of time for an officer to get a ship, if they are so inclined. We already know Poor Dumb Harry can get a ship in less time than that. It's not a reach that Tuvok and Paris can too. Heck, Janeway was a science officer, and got her own ship in her later after less than 20 years in Starfleet.
>>53533520One thing I like about Tuvok making Voyager his command is that there's literally only one reason for that: Nostalgia. Tuvok is nostalgic about Voyager, and it is his home away from home. That and all the crazy weapons and dumb tech they begged, borrowed, stole, or invented while in the Delta Quadrant.
It seems that notion of civilization that's destroying its own environment, and what's more, a political faction fights to keep the practice up in order to gain political power, hits a sore spot with some.
>>53533892Only because it's a tired narrative that's been screeched at everyone for almost a century now.But aside from that, the issue is that the Lukari are too perfect, and the Kentari are too foolish. Given the way that their entirely Saturday morning cartoon/the Lorax society is portrayed, it seems silly that they elected or installed a reformist leader.But I guess it was too much to hope we might get nuance from STO. Instead we can have strawmen and the strident haranguing of writers with an axe to grind.We get it. Pollution is bad. Our species might go extinct if it continues. I'm not the guy you need to convince. I don't make economic policy, and apparently my political views are valued on a national or even international stage.All I can do is vote as responsibly as I can in local elections and not breed so that I won't curse my descendants with living in a Mad Max tier hellhole of existence.Happy?
Welp, we got an image of the upcoming summer freebie ship.
>>53534007*my political views are not valued, ratherI've been up all night and my typos are getting worse.
>>53533892It hits a sore spot with anyone who had the audacity to be born white, male and western and be in the 5 to 14 age bracket in the late 80s and 90s.Captain Planet was shit and this "Lukari Escalation" plot is Captain Planet IN SPAAAAAAACE!!!!!
This looks hilariously excessive and unnecessary.I need it.
>>53534218That's a pretty sweet GM screen. But yes, definitely excessive.
>>53534218Oh shiggy diggy, that looks like an update of the Starcharts map.
I wish the miniatures were generic Starfleet crew of various races and uniform styles, for new player characters, and not the canon crews.
>>53535095I didn't see that on first glance. That is disappointing. Looks like there's a female klingon with a bat'leth though.
>>53534218Yup definitely getting this. I'm gonna go and run my own Discovery. With Cardassian pinochle and Orion Slave Girls!
>>53536332And kanar on the rocks!
>>53537245>ice in your Kanar. Not in my High Command, son.
>>53534010I don't even recognize that ship.They're really digging deep into the back catalogue aren't they?
>>53538707Or they just made it up.That is always an option.
>>53530697>a diamond dozenwhat did he mean by this?
>>53538707>>53538727All the Vorgon ships are made up for STO. Last year it was an escort (and not a terrible one, at that). I don't think we ever saw a Vorgon ship on screen.
>>53538772He misspelled "a dime a dozen".
>>53539489As a poet and someone with a degree in English, this makes me shake with rage. Please do not do this.
>>53539515>As a poetWhat is life even like?
>>53534007>Given the way that their entirely Saturday morning cartoon/the Lorax society is portrayed, it seems silly that they elected or installed a reformist leader.Even STO is more subtle than that. When the voting populace perceives the general situation as bad enough, they will elect the opposition party. If you lived in the slums in a standard cyberpunk dystopia, you'd want change too. The only reason the Traditionalists are able to retain power is because they control the media, and probably have bureaucratic control via inertia and corporate interests, etc. Some devs probably were playing Deus Ex and wanted to put that stuff in there.
>>53540771Very poor. Fulfilling though.
How are you other captains doing?
>>53540950Finally scrounged up the Dilithium for a Dauntless.
I enjoy Insurrection when I watch it from time to time.Never got the hate.
>>53542125It's an overlong episode, and a preachy one at that. The worst thing about it in my mind is that the movie could have been so much more.
>>53535175Yeah it's four sets of minis. Full TNG bridge crew, full TOS bridge crew, pack of Romulan enemies, pack of generic Klingon.
>>53542125The main problem I had with it was that the Enterprise was on the wrong side.On the one hand we have 200 Luddites hogging eternal youth, health and life.On the other hand we have the trillions in the galaxy getting old, ill and dying.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xa6c3OTr6yAGoing to have to side with Spock with this one.
>>53542225>the Enterprise was on the wrong side.But the So'Na were literally producing Ketrecel White.Also the slippery slope.
>>53542166>The worst thing about it in my mind is that the movie could have been so much more.How so?It's better than garbo like Search For Spock.
>>53542306The original intent was something closer to Heart of Darkness with Star Trek, where the Federation is selling its principles down the river to finance the Dominion War. An old Academy mate of Picard's goes native trying to stop the events, and after Picard meets him, he decides to assist his friend. Also, no face lifting shit.Also, Search For Spock was at least a good character study.
>>53542292>But the So'Na were literally producing Ketrecel WhiteSo? That has sweet fuck all to do with the shit going on in the Briar Patch. Dominion War and the deals that get done during it are not the concern. The concern is the Fountain of Eternal Life.How about after the UFP has acquired functional immortality the So'Na be asked questions about whose side they are on in the war.>Also the slippery slope.Picard already surfed down that like a slip and slide when he tried to abduct a colony of people for far lesser reasons in the episode where Wesley gets into the Inter-dimensional Creepy White Van to the sound of panpipes.
>>53542373I could see how that would be good, but I think the TNG movies in general just get too much hate.Insurrection such as it is is a pleasant time waster, and I think Nemesis is one of the best movies in the franchise.
>>53542409I think it comes down to what Picard talks about.How many people before it becomes wrong?
>>53542413I never said it was terrible, it's just a preachy episode, rather than something like In the Pale Moonlight, or another highlight episode.
>>53542443Oh I agree.Just watched Pale Moonlight again recently and it is very good.However, the best episode of DS9 is It's Only A Paper Moon.
>>53542427How many people were on the Injun Panpipes planet?Probably more than 200 Luddites.
>>53542481My dude, even the show doesn't follow itself that closely from episode plot to episode plot.I think that the story the writers of Insurrection are telling (the dilemma I mean) is a valid one, regardless of some other writer doing something else in the show.
>>53542479If there were a history eraser button for holodecks, I would push it in an instant. I hate that shit and can't think of a single good episode that prominently featured a holodeck.
>>53542508Not when the stakes are that high.When on one hand you have>A few hundred hippies that want to selfishly hog eternal life and health for themselves when they lucked upon it 70 years agoAnd on the other you have>UFP who want to give this blessing to all their hundreds of billions of citizens and allies because space is wide and good friends are too fewI'm going to side with the UFP. I might find it distasteful but you know what else is distasteful? Watching a friend die of cancer (or future equivalent).And the Baku would probably have been given the immortality again in any case because this is the UFP.
>>53542728Eh, I disagree.I think the central question >How many before it becomes wrong?Is completely valid as a concept in the film, putting aside whatever some other writer did with Picard in the show.
>>53542663rip the EMH doctor.
>>53542816I'd say when the needs of the many and few ratios shift to something more controversial than1 Selfish Beige Hippie to every 100,000,000,000 civilians whose lives could be saved.There might be, and indeed certainly is for me, some point where I will admit that shit becomes morally very grey. This is not it and that was the situation Picard & Crew were dealing with.
>>53542846Doctor didn't live in the holodeck.
>>53542921What makes you think holo technology would have progressed to the point the EMH was possible if holodecks never were? For all the episodes where the holodeck fucks up, it is a powerful tool to be able to create simulations that are sophisticated enough to be indistinguishable from reality.
>>53542900Let's agree to disagree, Mike.
The Federation was wrong to try and take the magic planet by force.But the Baku were wrong to not offer to share freely.
>>53543257why would they need to share? just sit your dick on the other side of the planet and fuck about for a while. they were only a small settlement
>>53543303IIRC the plan was to use science to slurp the antiaging stuff out of the rings or wherever the space magic came from.
>>53543128>What makes you think holo technology would have progressed to the point the EMH was possible if holodecks never were?It's a TV show. It's not like holodecks are around because they extrapolated the progress of technology to the point where it became obvious they would exist. They just thought the idea of holodecks would be cool, so they created them. They could do the same for hologram doctors without them needing to be preceded by holodeck technology. But while my complaints are with the holodeck and not (for the most part) with the way the EMH works, I would take the trade if I had to sacrifice the doctor to get rid of holodecks.
New Thread >>53544385>>53544385>>53544385>>53544385
>>53479701>firing photon torpedoes like they're going out of style namely:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PIGxMENwq1k