What are some good drawbacks to immortality that aren't just 'hah hah you forgot to say eternal youth as well?'
>>51824115You run out of "room" to remember shit so you need to forget something to learn/remember something new.
Limited practical memory storage. Gods have beefs with you over shit you forgot eons ago.Depression of seeing the world passing you by, and becoming increasingly bereft of compassion as a result of seeing everything cycle so many times.The ability to be tortured indefinitely.
>>51824115Live forever does not mean cant die
>>51824115Every ounce of life gained must be taken from another. Potentially in the form of blood, souls, internal organs, "life energy," etc.
>>51824183So, wishing for immortality would result in a multiversal genocide?
You know how older generations frown upon the newer generations? Being immortal you will see society and the world advance around you while you will remain caught in the wind, in a world with a language that is like yours but not truly yours, with people that no longer understand you, with fleeting fashions that will mean nothing to you. Eventually you will become so out of touch with the modern world you will isolate yourself with the reality you managed to get a grip on, a reality that has already faded to being little more than an antiquity. A world of memories, of mummies and ghosts that is all in your head. And this isolation will become bigger until you realize you truly don't want to keep on living.
>>51824115>Wowbagger The Infinitely Prolonged was - indeed, is- one of the Universe's very small number of immortal beings.Most of those who are born immortal instinctively know how to cope with it, but Wowbagger was not one of them. Indeed, he had come to hate them, the load of serene bastards. He had his immortaility inadvertantly thrust upon him by an unfortunate accident with an irrational particle accelerator, a liquid lunch, and a pair of rubber bands. The precise details are not important because no one has ever managed to duplicate the exact circumstances under which it happened, and many people have ended up looking very silly, or dead, or both, trying.To begin with it was fun, he had a ball, living dangerously, taking risks, cleaning up on high-yield long-term investments, and just generally outliving the hell out of everybody.In the end, it was Sunday afternoons he couldn't cope with, and that terrible listlessness that starts to set in at about 2:55 when you know you've taken all the baths you can usefully take that day, that however hard you stare at any given paragraph in the newspaper you will never actually read it, or use the revolutionary new pruning technique it describes, and that as you stare at the clock the hands will move relentlessly on to four o'clock, and you will enter the Long Dark Teatime of the Soul.So things began to pall for him. The merry smiles he used to wear at other people's funerals began to fade. He began to despise the Universe in general, and everybody in it in particular.This was the point at which he conceived his purpose, the thing that would drive him on, and which, as far as he could see, would drive him on forever. It was this:He would insult the Universe.That is, he would insult everybody in it. Individually, personally, one by one, and (this was the thing he really decided to grit his teeth over) in Alphabetical Order.
>>51824200Perhaps, but it'd probably be more dramatic if as the bearer of immortality continues to live beyond the time they would naturally, they gradually (or in sudden bursts, if they survive a normally mortal wound due to the power) drain the world around them of life in an ever-increasing radius. After all, they don't need all the life, like, right now.
You're immortal, but your body isn't.So imagine your body gets killed. Your soul is still around in your body. But it cannot use your body because it is dead. The body requires energy to be alive again. So the soul lingers around, trying to gather energy to revive the body. But the body is already rotting away - it is dead. So it takes more energy to revive the body.By the time your soul has enough energy to revive the body, the end result of the revival of your body looks more like a golem made of graveyard soil than a body.So now you can spend the next few years eating huge amounts of meat and bone, so you can reconstruct your fleshy parts - and you better hope no one thinks you're some undead zombie, or you'll have to start all over.
>>51824115>you will see all your loved ones pass away>after a while you'll probably be afraid of getting close to people since you know you'll just outlive them>you will feel out of place as the world changes, empires rise and fall, cultures evolve>eventually mankind will likely be destroyed, then you'll have to walk the earth alone for millenia>eventually all life on earth will be snuffed out as the sun expands>after untold millenia you will witness the heat death of the universe and have to live in a world of permanent darkness, where nothing grows or changes
The rnd of time will fucking suck.
>>51824165Actually that's exactly what it means you dolt. You can't very well keep on living if you die, can you? No, no you can't, and you're not clever for deliberately misinterpreting the definitions of words. In fact, that makes you an idiot. An illiterate idiot. So stop it.
>>51824183>>51824200I like this idea. A sort of conservation principle. There's only so much life to go around, so a the fact person who lives forever would conversely mean that all life is gathered in one place. The reason everything doesn't die instantly is because the lifespan is not made infinite from the start, it is extended in real-time by the continuous siphoning of life force.You could take it further by making it cyclical. All life is gathered in one person. That person is functionally God, as all life ends and begins with them. Through division of that singular life, the world is reborn. But if the same principle of gradual concentration of life still applies, you end up with the same result as before, ad infinitum. It reminds me of the creation myth of Kill Six Billion Demons.
>>51824362What's it called when you have a potentially unlimited lifespan, but can still get killed? I don't think I've heard any word for that but "immortal."
>>51824480That's biological immortality. It's a different thing altogether than what we're talking about, which is just plain, regular, actual immortality.
>>51824115Eternal growth? Not that it works like that IRL, but who cares. An infinite growing period sounds pretty bad. You could make it worse by saying the brain doesn't develop to keep up motor control.
>>51824115 Really simple, but also profoundly fucked if you think it through and it would just occur naturally with out any gotcha clauses like forgetting to ask for youth. Perception of Time. Think of the difference between how you perceived time as a child, then a teen, then someone in their twenties and then thirties. Now carry that over to your eighties still normal more or less. Then your hundreds weird but manageable, ideas like 24h days kind of start to lose their meaning. Then your thousands of years when things like weeks and months just blur together and even years kind of seem to get jumbled up, maybe something like generations are you new 'basic' unit of measurement. You could still interact with people in the moment, when they're right there in front of you. But otherwise? Your perception would be so screwed you'd have to take really meaningful measures to ensure the concept of time as other people know it doesn't become irrelevant entirely. From your perspective, it'd be like having having an annoying alarm clock wake you up every two to three minutes, otherwise you end up with situations like."I just saw you, what do you mean it's been ages!? And since when is baby Timmy 6 feet tall?"
>>51824115Getting trapped would be pretty shitty in this situation.
>>51824115Maybe Benjamin Button syndrome, but back and forth? You're born, you grow old, then you hit a point where you start growing younger, then you grow old again, and repeat it like so.
>>51824115Everyone you've ever known will grow old and die while you don't age a day.
'You' can't die, but 'you' for the purposes of this magic is 'your cells', which can still be separated from your body like normal. Attempts to kill you usually result in you regaining consciousness centuries later, as soon as one of your followers or some mage who just wanted to learn your Most Ancient Wisdom manages to painstakingly stitch enough of you back together, cell by immortal cell, to wake you back up.You've managed to keep most of your original bone marrow in one place, but the bones themselves are a regular Ship of Theseus, an awkward patchwork of calcium you've had to magically knit together in just the right way or else suffer incessant, infuriating aches all over your body. The little bones in your ears are an absolute bitch to get right, and you've spent many a deaf century tracking down the spirit or descendants of the person responsible for destroying your last ones and extracting vengeance upon them (and/or a new set out of them).You've spent Gods know how many hours removing tumors from your body, but, constrained by the tools and knowledge of Medieval medical practice, it'll be a long, long time before you even know just how thoroughly you'd have to cleanse yourself to be rid of the entire cancerous lineage whose progenitor was in your body the day you drank the Draught of Life Eternal. Said tumors have to be carefully contained away from any material they could grow in, and on occasion you'll remember the ever-growing pile of You sealed away in an airless, waterless, demiplane, and groan softly to yourself.
>>51824564>go to take a nap>wake up and a bunch of regressed primitives have taken to worshipping you as the Sleeping God, who will lead them to a golden age upon his awakening>"This was a diner moments ago, what happened?"
>>51824115It is it's own drawback. Everyone and everything you know and love and care about will die.New life every generation or so, because people will notice you not ageing.Centuries of memories to sift through, associations everywhere, everyone reminds you of someone you knew, progress everywhere trying to outpace you.
>>51824578>get to have sex with teenage chicks for a few years once or twice a centuryEh sounds pretty good.
>>51824772>loses bowel control for decades at a timeIt's not ideal.
>>51824115You'll live to see a world without [insert your ethnicity here] people. You will be the last of your "kind" eventually.
>>51824727Pity the immortal man, for he is humanity's janitor/handiman, No sooner did he finish putting up another get off my lawn sign, only for another herd illiterate knuckle dragging primitives start traipsing through his garden the very next day.
You get really bored. Because you've been there and done that.
>>51824267Heh, like that part
>>51824115Being buried alive
>>51824841If you were immortal, why would you eat in the first place?
Having to eat a still warm and bloody heart once a month was my personal favorite proviso I ever dropped on someone.Party Warlord: 'I want to be immortal!'Fey Sorceress: "Great, get in my fey party van, this'll totes go the way you want.">10 minutes laterParty Warlord: 'How did this go so wrong!?'
>>51824715Mercifully, sexual gametes don't count as 'you' per se, which means you can safely pursue the biological function you rendered irrelevant all those centuries ago. You're not up to the emotional turmoil of mortal lovers and the children that come with them, though, which means you're pretty much stuck with succubi and incubi (the summoning of which is the only other reason people become wizards anyways), and that works out surprisingly well. Your Infernal lover can at least respect that a contract's a contract, and that Devils don't really have a right to complain when someone gets stuck in a deal that doesn't pan out the way they were expecting. After all, they were the ones who set the terms, 'I shall serve you in all ways until the day you die, whereupon your soul becomes mine for all eternity.', and you haven't done anything to violate your end of the bargain.Sure, they were horrified when they realized what they signed up for, but they never really took it personally; That's just how things work in Hell, and they were mostly upset they were the loser this time. After a while of getting used to it, though, you can tell that something's changed deep within them. They've been permanently taken out of the endless cycle of ambition, betrayal, and paranoia that is Devil society, and as rage faded into despair into boredom, they've slowly taken an interest in the trivialities of the life they're now stuck in, and are coming to appreciate human existence. On your end, back in those first few years, when you were still mentally the hot-blooded young mage who you will physically remain forever, you of course pursued every debauched and deranged fantasy the Bargain entitled you to, but as that inevitably got old, you came to value them more as an assistant, and eventually as a genuine companion. In the end, you both ended up in the only remotely healthy relationship you could have ever achieved, and eternity seems a lot more bearable.
>>51824115Given enough time, you'll become a living fossil a la Encino Man.
>>51824115You're body still continues to degrade without ever properly dying. Even if you are perfectly meticulous in maintaining your body, it will start to fail.>Your teeth will rot away, making it impossible for you to eat anything that isn't liquid or not mashed into a fine pulp>Your eyes will cloud until all vision is eventually obscured by cataracts. Removing them affords only a temporary respite>Your memory will degrade, until you forget even the most basic functions. You will not recognize people around you, and before you forget how to speak, you'll be left reciting nursery rhymes when you were a child, the only thing left your brain refuses to lose. Eventually that too will leave, and you will be trapped in a body that refuses to move, your nervous system to degraded to properly respond.>Your bones will erode and become fragile, breaking much easier. Immortality means this will never kill you, but it also means you will find no relief from the pain
>>51824975Does it specifically need to be a human heart?
>>51824954Have you tried not eating? It sucks.
>>51824851Not if you're an active player in world politics.Many stories of Kings of Old kept their people alive and strong. See: Armenia, Greece, Crimea etc.The only problem would be a cultural shift that the immortal forgot or did not appreciate as being significant.
>>51824991If you want to know the future, imagine a mighty wizard standing at the door, asking a succubus reading a book in her jammies, if she wants him to pick up eggs while he's out. Forever.Okay, I don't know or care if anyone else read this, this thread let me come up with a character concept I love and am putting in my games sometime. Thanks for existing, /tg/.
>>51824115>massive natural disaster wipes out entire human population/planet/etc.>you are forced to drift endlessly alone through the universe, hoping you'll happen to land on pleasant enough planet instead of getting sucked into the gravitational pull of a gas giant or a sun or a black hole>completely immortal>meaning that after the heat-death of the universe you're damned to eternal conscious limbo
>>51824165/tg/ has some of the dumbest dregs of humanity sometimes
>>51825028I have. First couple days suck but when you overcome them it doesn't really feel bad at all. Well, that is until your body begins to wither from the lack of nutrition.
>Immortality MUST have a drawback because I'm a mortal human and the idea of someone else getting to live forever hurts my feelingsAnyone else tired of this shit? It's all over fantasy and fiction.Why can't you have simply unconditional immortality from high technology and sheer number of fail safes?Same with those fags who think death is some moral righteousness or some bullshit like that and therefore rail against others attempting researching into stuff prolonging age.
>>51824115You mean aside from the existential dread and eventual loss of everyone you've ever known or cared for?
>>51824115I could only imagine that you'd eventualy get tired of humanity in general. And to expand on what I mean exactly by that, a lot of people have been talking about memory being a problem, but with your body being immortal I would think your memory cells in your brain would also be immortal, or at least wouldn't deteriorate. So you would run into the nasty end of the old saying that History repeats itself, but on a grand scale; you would not only see the world repeating itself but you would be stuck in the infinite loop of watching it happen with new peoples in new places. It would almost be like watching the same season of a show over and over. It doesn't matter how much you liked the show it would become boring. Likewise; an immortal being may try and learn about different people and experience life in new ways with each generation as a way to stave off this fatigue but eventually you'll notice the patterns as people repeat what's come before with only light thematic changes. Eventually you'd just fall so out of touch with the rest of humanity that you wouldn't be able to effectively communicate anymore. I mean imagine a Templar trying to have a regular conversation with a modern man his age and you'd get the picture.
>>51824115The human body INEVITABLY develops cancer soooner or later. It obviously won't kill you but it will hurt like a bitch
>>51825156thisLet me go one step further and say that I also get pissed off when time travelers are forbidden from "changing anything." Motherfucker, why does it make a difference if something was changed in the past, or if I decide to do something right now which changes the world.
>>51825156technology obviously doesn't make people unconditionally more happy in general, so why would technological immortality make them happy?humans weren't made to live forever, no being was. forcing unending life on yourself would probably be a huge strain on your body and especially on your mindit's clear that technology generally creates as many problems as it resolves, so why not apply that to immortality?
>>51825025Nah, credit where it's due, he got around it by capturing a troll and chaining it up in his sex dungeon for the rest of eternity as a supplier of hearts.Still, I managed to convince him to eat more than a few hearts during battles and eventually he degenerated into a Vlad the Impaler tier monster.All in all, a win for the bugfuck insane fey.
>>51825017Wow, way to read, bucko.
>>51825225>technology obviously doesn't make people unconditionally more happy in general, so why would technological immortality make them happy?false dichotomy. Immortality could result in no net change to happiness, rather than either making you unconditionally happy or having drawbacks just for the sake of it.>it's clear that technology generally creates as many problems as it resolves, so why not apply that to immortality?No it isn't. It creates some problems but it solves far more.
>>51825227I want to say our games never really degraded into body parts consumption. I really do...
>>51824115Kallor from Malazan Book of the Fallen.He's cursed to live forever, but never get what he actually wants.
>>51825274>immortality could result in no net change to happiness,Notwithstanding the fact that happiness is not objectively measurable.
>>51825287Bah, you haven't lived until you've had one of your characters be compelled to eat the hearts of his enemies.Watching the look on the other players faces when my supposedly mild mannered mage snapped like a twiglet and tore the bloody heart from the (female) BBEG and eating it because he'd secretly been a predatory fey monster for the past 2 years of playing and they never really 'got' it until that point was amazing.He totally lost control after he found out she'd pulled some NTR tier shit involving his Nymph lover who'd disappeared 5 years previously in character, pretended he had it all under control.Next thing they know he's standing with his boot on her throat, is coated up to the elbow and down to the chin in viscera and she's had her chest cavity cracked open like a walnut, great scenic moment.
>>51825321whatever, there are more choices than just "I'm immortal now so all my worries are gone" and "oh god no what have I done"
>>51825156Narratively, immortality isn't particularly interesting unless it has a drawback, fucko. That's the entire point of this thread. I know you want an excuse to be angry about the whole 'Mortal's Sour Grapes' thing, but we've all heard it a million times before and that's not what this thread was supposed to be about.Don't be a faggot.
>>51825225>technology obviously doesn't make people unconditionally more happy in generalSpoken like a true flesh primitive.If I reeingneer your mindspace to unconditionally generate happy hormones then yes you will be unconditionally more happy.
>>51825359>Bah, you haven't lived until you've had one of your characters be compelled to eat the hearts of his enemies.In WoD: Vampire that's kind of given...
>>51825410Unless your perception of those hormones numbs down over time... I don't have enough neurobiological knowledge to tell either way, but it's certainly a consideration.
>>51825383>Narratively, immortality isn't particularly interesting unless it has a drawback, fucko.>implying death in a society of immortals doesn't have far more weight than a society where hundreds of thousands die every day
>>51824115Eventually running out of new things to try will suck, food eventually tastes like nothing, sex loses its appeal.All your days blur together, because you have so many, and you've seen so much that it all just seems like one long day.There's no suprises.At a certain point, you just start cursing immortality, wishing you had succumbed to death like everyone else you knew, long ago. You fall into depression and soul crushing boredom, and occasionally something big will happen that snaps you out of it, but that's just for a while, right until you remember that this is just a blip, a momentary distraction in an endless life of misery, loneliness and boredom.
>>51825051i thought it was good anonjust so i understand, the body itself and the soul have two diffrient immortal states. the soul is your awareness and is directly working (awake from a perspective of living) when the body has enough of it together to start working. the body cells are infinite in durability and living length, and can be seperated from each other, but will fuse back together if they get back together. unless there is enough of a mass of 'you', you can't actually wake up. any missing parts you do not have will impede your ability to function, but as long as you have the bare minium of organs required for life, you can keep chuggingdid i get that right?
>>51825321>Notwithstanding the fact that happiness is not objectively measurable.the same can be said about this>It creates some problems but it solves far more.technology doesn't make people happier. it may increase the living standards, cure diseases etc. but people will always find new things to worry about, if it's not malnutrition and diseases it's loneliness or a life devoid of meaning.if humans are miserable they're miserable because they're humans.
>>51825448Well, now you're just being contrarian, but at least you're being contrarian in an interesting way.
>>51824267Douglas Adams is a treasure.
>>51825017That's exactly what OP said he didn't want brought up.
>>51825469I dunno, I'd rather be really bored and disconnected from society than dead.
>>51824115You carry a bunch of ancient diseases.You properly build up resistances to new ones, but anyone who isn't used to being around you eats a loads of exotic plagues.Think colonial Europe spreading European diseases everywhere, etc.
>>51825529>endless misery>a state without consciousness in which you do not feel anythingthe choic is quite simple I'd say. it's not like you can FEEL death anyway, it's just like going to sleep but never waking upyou die every night in a way
>>51824564I've no idea why that's so commonly repeated idea when it's so easily proved wrong by actually talking with actual old people. They still have a fucking sense of time and won't reply to you hours later because they zoned out.Note that people over 20 are not old. People over 80 are getting there.
>>51825529I imagine you already have your wish
>>51825563Any feeling at all is better than death, in my eyes.Give me endless suffering over death. Show me two buttons, one says 'Immortality but get tortured forever', the other says 'Die immediately', I pick the former, every single time.
>>51824569Wait a short while for the trap/room/mountain to crumble to dust.Even black holes evaporate, eventually.
>>51825611interesting. most people would generally prefer death to eternal hell. do you have some kind of phobia regarding loss of consiousnes?
>>51825060Then you fucking imagine a new universe.
>>51825657Well, there's a theory that given enough time you get used to even the worst of the pains...
>>51825178Shouldn't you say the loss of existential dread?
>>51825657Permanent cessation of consciousness is terrifying.I literally don't understand why everyone else seems to be 'okay' with the idea that they will eventually die. I really, really don't want to die, and would accept pretty much any form of contractual immortality as long as my consciousness persists indefinitely. Sleep doesn't count, I wake back up when I'm done with that.
>>51825697"One can eventually get used to everything, except an icicle up the ass. It will melt first."
>>51825740Well, to be fair mate, none of us are really cool with the idea.Basically when you get down to it, the reason we always look for stories where immortality sucks is because of Sour Grapes.'Oh, it wouldn't be that great, who really wants to not die, I bet it sucks, having a chance to see the rest of eternity, right?'No one believes it but by god can we try and convince ourselves.
>>51825740>Sleep doesn't count, I wake back up when I'm done with that.Except for once when you will not.
>>51825611>every single timeIs this some sort of psychological torture where you get forced to make the decision over and over again?
>>51825740I mean it is a bit scary but it's just such an irrational fear. Why would you be afraid of something you won't even notice and that will happen anyway at some point?It will most likely happen when you're old, way past your prime and your health is shit anyway, so why the hell not?
>>51825740I think maybe you don't comprehend what it'd be like to be eternally tortured. There's nothing wrong with that, mind. I don't think most people can comprehend what it's like to be tortured. I know I can't. But I do think after a much shorter time than you'd think, you'd really wish you'd chosen oblivion instead.
"The hardest part about being immortal is that it is difficult to find something to do, the first 2000 years I did nothing, the next 2000 I did good things and the last 2000 I've done bad things"Mr. Mxyzptlk from Whatever Happen to the Man of Tomorrow by Alan Moore & Curt Swan
Anyone watched The Man From Earth?It's about a guy who claims to be alive for some 14k years, and he discusses with professors from many areas about how that could happen and the consequences, like:>everyone you know dies, their lifes passing in the blink of an eye>everything you know changes until it's unrecognisable>you wonder why you're like this, if you're cursed, blessed, if anyone is doing something wrong>have to move on every now and then because people get afraid that you're stealing their life energy or something>get tired of people making the same mistakes over and over>spoileruyour attempt of teaching some human fraternity is deformed into a religion, and you watch it spreading across the world for two thousand years
>>51825851>watch your son have a heart attack and die in front of you
>>51825448Yeah but a society of immortals is going to have difficulty because reproduction would have to be highly regulated. Also, in the words of Max Planck, "science advances one funeral at a time"; technology would get in a rut as old people slowly change their ideas of things. It may even end up like elves in pic related. A whole society of mortals downplays the loneliness and increases the stagnation. I'd snap personally.
>>51825844I can confidently say that I wouldn't.You don't understand the lengths I would go to if it would let me avoid the inevitability of death. Like, I've known pretty severe, prolonged pain in my life, and it was basically nothing compared to what I would willingly endure if it meant living forever.I don't want to die. If I could be immortal, nothing else is relevant.
>>51824251>What is the plot of Anne Rice's vampire series.
>>51824115Eternal suffering once the sun goes supernova and you're drifting in space with no oxygen
>>51824138The alternative isn't that attractive either.
>>51825598People do perceive time pass faster the older they get.Not in the "delay when talking to you" sense, but in the "oh, it's been 3 years already? feel like it was last month" sense.t. psychologist
>>51825906>If I could be immortal, nothing else is relevant.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e-KRw40Rwy4
>>51825740Nice to see someone else agreeing with me.
>>51825996If he's still conscious as a silver statue, that is perfectly fine.
>>51824115The lives of all mortals are Life's archives of history. The truest and most objective account lies in the blood and genes of each mortal, who thus mates, begets, and congregates so that the Story can be refined, preserved, and expanded. In dying, the Story is able to shift focus and progress as the descendants of the dead take up the quill.One who sheds his mortality has abandoned this. Mortals are fertile and passionate, he is sterile and burned out. Mortals are avid and productive, he is stagnant and irrelevant. Mortals have greater perspective and can work for the sake of future generations. He is, and will always be, alone.
>>51825133Fasts actually get pretty pleasant once you get to the third or fourth day.
>>51825469Why would you worry about such mundane pleasantries when you can witness forever the development, the ebb and flow of history from a perspective never achieved before? Just being an eternal spectator is pretty worth it when you get used to it.
>>51825740I'm terrified, too. I just don't see the point in trying to fight it. Something'll get me eventually, and right now it's looking like either a heart attack or me are the most likely candidates. Even if that passes, /something/ is going to decide it does not like me and put an end to me.Not even Odin could avert Ragnarok. What chance could I ever stand?
>>51825981What the fuck has that to do with perception then?Not keeping track of something is not the same thing as not perceiving it.
>>51824115You die, time resets.Think Groundhog Day.
>>51826125So you're going to do what?Just roll over and die?spoiler: It hasn't happened yet, so I think he's doing pretty good actually.
>>51824772What's stopping you the rest of the time?
>>51824115All the kids have SHIT TASTE. In everything. Music, clothes, food.This is the only realistic downside to immortality, and all people feel it happening to them as they age.
>>51826184What do you mean?
>>51825981The reason humans perceive time to go faster as they grow older is because the time perceived becomes a smaller and smaller percentage of your total experiences as you get older.A year is 25% of a four year old's entire lifespan. But it's only 2% of a 50 year old's experiences.
>>51826251>just roll over and die?Assuming I never become omnipotent, yes.Also, good point about the spoiler.
>>51826037He asked a downside. The downside is extended torment by being paralyzed while suffering and unable to die.If you want something longer, tossed into the sun, or fired at low speeds through the vacuum of space, on a trajectory that won't collide with anything or get scooped up into an orbit for a very long time.
>>51826286this is pretty much the only lasting downside of immortality.You can wait any other problem, including entrapment, out.You can't wait out the kids being retards.
>>51826291I mean that the perceived rate of time passing has not fucking changed.>Oh it has been 3 years since X. Feels like 2 weeks.Good thing you obviously had better shit to do than reminisce about doing X.
>>51824115>What are some good drawbacks to immortality that aren't just 'hah hah you forgot to say eternal youth as well?'This video sums up everything.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KIMUmmbXOKw&t=305s
>>51824975Does "still" apply to both "warm" and "bloody" or just "warm"? Because if it's the latter, then I'd go for it in a heartbeat (heh).
genuine, you cannot die immortality? Your timeline is infinite? It's inevitable you get stuck somewhere or buried on an infinite timeline. Either that or you survive the death of earth and are stranded in space.
>>51826435being stuck somewhere or being trapped in space are mortal concerns.An immortal can simply wait until they are no longer trapped.Even the strongest of materials will break after a hundred thousand years of exposure to human enzymes.
>>51826412>mfw i didn't actually realize how many chickens actually die to get the food on your plate until you eat a few skewers of chicken heartthat is the only time that i have ever felt guilt at eating meat. even when i kill my own seafood, i have never actually felt guilty about it
>>51824138>>51824158You could just forget stuff like regular people do, but what if it was something more deliberate?You live for a while and accumulate memories, but after a while things start to get bad (you have a hard time telling the difference between the past and the present, like iirc people with eidetic memories do after a while?) and so you choose to forget.This means you lose most/all of your memories and have to start over (probably pretending to have amnesia). You might become an entirely new person in the same body, or you might retain your personality and some basic memories, but either way you have to learn new skills and meet new people.You might retain some portion of things you do a lot of in most/all of your lifetimes, like fighting or social interaction, or some language you spoke a lot, but that would be it.It would get you around the whole "watch everything and everyone you love wither and die" and turbo-gramps syndrome, but it would come with it's own problems.
>>51826461don't feel bad about eating chickens, they are delicious.
>>51825598No shit retard, the very point you brought up was already addressed and accounted for. Maybe you should read what was actually written before attempting to 'debunk' it. It's not your sense of time in the immediate that would be affected, you could hold perfectly normal conversation. But rather your sense of time in general. A week is a week, but that week feels longer to an eleven year old than it does to thirty year old. Your perception of time becomes skewed as you age, if you don't believe me look it up.Stretching that effect out over centuries and millennia of life as opposed to just decades would lead to the immortal dude having perception of time that is almost entirely alien when compared to the normals surrounding him.
>>51825906Like I said, I don't think you can comprehend what torture is like. Chronic pain issues are one thing, but classic hell is being burned alive. Have you ever given yourself a serious burn, so bad that your skin blistered? I can, and it was awful. Now imagine that sensation over your entire body, but far worse - because you're getting a full fourth degree burn, not a pissant second degree. And it doesn't stop, ever. You'll never get the warm rush of endorphins, you'll never get the merciful painlessness of your nerves burning away. I can't imagine it. My imagination isn't good enough. If yours really is, and you really think you wouldn't rather die, then I'm amazed. But that's just classic hell. A creative torturer with an eternal victim could come up with far worse over eternity. And I think anyone who actually experienced that would gladly take the sweet embrace of oblivion.
>>51826487I've given myself blister burns so often that I am used to it and do not care.You can get used to anything.
>>51826184>>51826362Don't be a pedantic fuck. It has everything to do with perceiving.To perceive:2. to recognize, discern, envision, or understand>>51826308Yeah, that's it.
>>51826480How long should I fucking wait before I notice this fabled phenomenon?I can still fucking tell if something happened a day, week, month, year or a fucking decade ago.Consider not doing so much drugs if you can't.
>>51826398Not sure I get your point here, the most painful thing there appears to be the combat system...
>>51826555This site is for people over 18. Come back in a few years.
>>51824115You learn everything there is to know. Nothing surprises you and you lose that wonder of discovery. You could try and impart some of what you know onto disciples but they would forget it or not be able to grasp it. You're the repository of all knowledge and people travel from far and wide to ask you questions or use your knowledge to help them...even when there's nothing you can do for them.To avoid people coming to find you and learn your secrets, you travel to a dark cave and start to transcribe all knowledge.
>>51826461I dunno; a food chicken lives for a handful of weeks at most from hatching to slaughter, and they spend all of it lazing about and eating for free. I figure it's not the worst life in the world, for an animal.
>>51824115The best drawback to immortality is that you forgot to feed your pet civilization, and now they all died and stopped making video games.So now you have to grow a new one, and it will never be just like the one you had.You'll never be able to get that fucking turkish flavor out of your video games.
>>51826487Yes, I have. I only have about 50% function in my left hand because I burnt it so badly. I've also broken my collar bone in multiple places, and had severe chemical burns across most of my torso. I've had kidney stones, I've had severe food poisoning, I've had broken ribs.None of these are equivalent to actual torture, of course, but I'm no stranger to pain, and I was serious when I said that I would willingly endure all of those at once, multiplied by ten, if it meant I could live forever.
>>51826608Oh snap what a witty comeback.I'm not a retard who can't keep track of time so I must be underage?Makes complete sense.
>>51826487Classic Hell is destruction by fire. The wicked burn, and then they are no more. This "getting tortured for eternity" garbage needs to stop.
>>51826670Either you're underage, or you're just so dense you're incapable of noticing a natural phenomena most people get wise to by their last year of high school. Take your pick.
>>51825060anon, if you are completely immortal, heat death of the universe will never happen.You can just slit a wrist and keep it going until such time as a planet or sun (your preference) forms from the collected mass.Then it's just a matter of swimming to the surface as more mass accumulates over time.Then you just arrange circumstances in the right manner for life to develop, and curate that life until it is intelligent, and teach those intelligent creatures until they are your bros."being stuck in space" is only a problem for mortals who do not have infinite life and blood.
>>51824115You get spread too thin across time. People only get so much 'existence' to themselves, and stretching out lifespans means stretching out your supply.You become 'less' than yourself. Not really weaker or duller, but more like only a portion of a prospective immortal's full being is present at any given time. And the longer they maintain it, the worse it gets, until things get strange.'Existence' has a certain rubber-band like quality to it, stretch it too far and it'll snap back from its anchors in the past far too fast. Immortals will, inevitably and retroactively, cease to have had their 'original' lifespans. To everyone around them, it seems like a transcendentally powerful being just popped into existence and then rapidly lost that power. The constant stretch and snap dynamic of immortality doesn't leave most of them in the best state.
You're inmortal, however your body can be damaged and acts almost like a normal body except that if your arm is severed, it can be re-attached by a skillful surgeon, however no surgery is ever perfect and you'll lose some control and mobility. Every wound, every injury incapacitates your body more and more, every disease weakens you, including those that have no known cure (AIDS forever my boy, hope you enjoyed fucking that hooker), if a hit to the head damages your brain in some way that the body cannot repair naturally then it stays. After a few hundred years you'll be basically a zombie, except fully alive.
>>51826670Saw the opportunity and couldn't let it pass, just taking the piss here m8.But believe me, it isn't a fabled phenomenon. It's in fact a well researched topic and you'll eventually feel it as well.It's like >>51826308 said, and also because there's less and less memorable events that get marked in our minds, like first kiss, first date, first time driving etc. Eventually those stuff just drift by. When was the 14th time I had sex? Hell if I know, but the first time always shines bright on the mind.Just give it a quick google and there'll be quite a few articles that can explain it better to you, with proper references to boot.
>>51824564Shit nigga, I don't think I'd mind. If "baby Timmy" didn't do anything interesting like build a nuke in his backyard or start a big genocide then it's his own fault I don't remember him.
>>51824115>Every so often death will make an appearance and debate with you how exactly your immortality works and try to find loop holes in itor >A manifestation of your opposite, a being completely opposed to you is created through the immortality process and acts as your eternal rivalor>The god you bargained with now owns a portion of your life and can control you to do task for him
One problem would be knowing how something is going to work out and be giving the right advice, knowing that it will not be followed any more than the previous hundred times. You just think watching a friend make the same mistake over and over is bad. Try watching a friend's family commit the same stupid stuff for eons knowing its genetic. Learning to spot diseases in the early stages and recognizing the likely time a child will die while it is learning to crawl. Now think the hell your life would become if others found out your curse.
>>51826308>The reason humans perceive time to go faster as they grow older is because the time perceived becomes a smaller and smaller percentage of your total experiences as you get older.This can be tested1-Divide your age by 42-Compared how fast the second quarter passed, to how fast the third and fourth (together) passed.Each one of the two parts I said, are half of your life.So if your age is 40, you compare the time needed to go from 10 to 20, to the time needed to go from 20 to 40
>>51827026Those are all very livable.I already have one of them.
>>51827019>A manifestation of your opposite, a being completely opposed to you is created through the immortality process and acts as your eternal rivalIf (s)he's your complete opposite wouldn't they be extra-super-duper mortal given you're immortal?Also, how to deal with probable hate-sex incest (or would it be masturbation since they're not!You) after centuries boredom if the above isn't the case? Are children super inbred, not inbred at all, do they inherit immortality since both path are immortals?
>>51826667>eternal kidney stones>endless food poisoningbitch just cessate my existence already holy fuck. i suffer from stones in each kidney every year or so, and would gladly take non-existence over those tine-filled calcium fuckballs. same with food poisoning; i am NOT spending the next trillion years burping up what tastes like a foul mixture of rotten meat and Cheerios just so i can smile and say "its better than nothing!!"like a previous Anon said, cessation of existence is something that'll blindside you more often than not. forgive the tautology, but you won't worry about not existing since you won't be existing. the only terror you feel is THINKING about the nothingness after. if you can put that out of your mind, or better CONQUER THAT BITCH FEAR, you'll be able to move past your fear of death.learn to let go. its a really shitty copout, considering the Jedi use the same idea, but it works. alternatively, you can just follow the simple advice of Dr. Samuel Johnson, the greatest man of letters in British history: He who makes a Beast of himself gets rid of the pain of being a Man.
>>51827100I wasn't very clear in what i meant. Its your ideological opposite. If you have any grand plans with what you want to do with eternity it wants that not to happen. Its a spirit of sorts so would not grow bored of opposing you and would not care for the traditional downfalls of immortality (memory, everyone dying)Physically it could manifest as anything, a copy of you or a dog or a dragon. Always it will have intelligence and the ability to communicate and can only die if you do.If you somehow managed to breed with the thing the offspring would likely be holes in the fabric of the universe.Before any bards ask, no, not the kind of hole you can stick your dick in.
>>51827249Interesting argument. My response: Fuck you. I want to live forever. I never want to lose my ability to experience the world.
>>51826476>turbo-gramps syndromeNot sure why but this has me laughing uncontrollably.
>>51827306What if I have no ideology beyond 'I'm immortal bitch'. You just want to be lazy for the rest of time.Is it gonna force you to get up and exercise or what?
>>51827387This is starting to sound like one of my Japanese light novels.
>>51827306What if your grand plan is watching history unfold like a giant reality tv show? Would it push you to influence the world, would it influence the world itself to ruin your 'genuine' experience, would it just pull up a seat next to you and just cheer for the opposite result?
>>51827347i was going to write a spite-filled reply in the same knee-jerk fashion i felt you gave in yours, but cooler heads will prevail.instead, i'm curious: are you a religious or spiritual person, or lacking thereof?
>>51827453Agnostic, leaning atheist, mostly nonspiritual.
>aboo hoo painFuck I wish you guys could come up with worse things than being hurt.I would gladly take pain over, say, a shitty anime season.Maybe having several chronic pain disorders for my entire life colored my perceptions some, but getting limbs broken or having pain is not a big deal.
>>51827472interesting. any beliefs about the afterlife, or lack thereof? i will admit i suspect you have none.
>>51827489>having several chronic pain disordersOkay, since that's your experience it seems normal to you, but for the rest of us what you're going through is literally Hell.As in, literally what is supposed to happen IN Hell.
>>51824115Reed mor boks.
You slowly become disconnected with life and culture, leading to isolation. Even if you're in the midst of all of it, you are most likely not part of sweeping cultural changes. Eventually, even your language might change enough that you sound like a gibbering weirdo to the modern culture.Also, a realistic thing. Getting trapped if you're immortal is a serious problem. Assuming immortal means immortal and just "won't die of old age" if you fall in something like a chasm and can't get out, you're just stuck there forever.
>>51827546I think that is a real lame fucking hell.I figure a hell would be more interesting than "ow it hurts, oh no". You can live with that. I live with that. I've had serious medical conditions because I didn't notice actual endangering injuries over my chronic pains, and I'm still here.
>>51827546If he can get used to it in a handful of decades then I'm sure "the rest of us" could manage to cozy up with an eternity to work with.
>>51827387Pretty much. If you just want to relax for all eternity it would try to get you to do things. It might start an evil organisation and be very loud to the media that your involved so you have to do something or be arrested or mobbed by paparazzi.>>51827417I could see that. In old times mighty warriors would become immortal and their antithesis would come to do glorious battle. Now somehow generic NEET protagonist gets mixed up in the ritual and a tsundere spirit comes to see what mighty warrior she will face to find a pathetic chump. Que her trying to get him to go on quests and get him in the mythic world since the greater he is the greater she will be, all the while she slowly falls for him and hes oblivious to it.Damn i just went full weeaboo didn't I
>>51827432He'd be that asshole that spoils the fun saying "You know its all staged right"?
>>51827606You need to learn Japanese quickly you could pump out best selling LNs like nothing.
>>51827606Please stop. I can already imagine the awful ESL-edited machine translation.
>>51827566>foreverNope.If you're IMMORTAL immortal, you can just scrape away the boulder pinning you down over the course of like50 years.Getting trapped in space is solvable by creating your own stellar objects with blood, or using your blood as a propulsion mechanism.If you are fucking immortal, you break physics by having infinite energy and mass. You can escape from pretty much anything.
>>51826476>You could just forget stuff like regular people do,Technically, most people don't "forget" things. The knowledge is still there, it's just lost in untrimmed neural patterns.
>>51824183Like Armstrong from Archer and Armstrong
>>51824510>immortality isn't immortality unless I say soBig hint, you still called it immortality.
>>51827754anon, differentiating biological and true immortality is fucking key to immortality discussions.One you die if you are killed, and follow physical rules.The other you literally violate physics.
>>51827606>I could see that. In old times mighty warriors would become immortal and their antithesis would come to do glorious battle. Now somehow generic NEET protagonist gets mixed up in the ritual and a tsundere spirit comes to see what mighty warrior she will face to find a pathetic chump. Que her trying to get him to go on quests and get him in the mythic world since the greater he is the greater she will be, all the while she slowly falls for him and hes oblivious to it.>Damn i just went full weeaboo didn't IKek. You just ruined the lets ruin immortality thing. Sign me up.
>>51824115"No one said anything about you not being subject or immune to the long-term undiscovered possibilities of living too long."AKA Face of Boe.Or you know.Great Old One/Horrible Eternal primordial irradiated mutation that is a clump of flesh by that point.
>You don't know who I am, do ya? Remember my party? Your lair? Your undead skeletal army?>I was involved with that?>You and me, we were sworn enemies>We were?>Yeah?>Hmm. Well, that's nice.
>>51827803No Immortal, you were the Great Old One all along.
>>51824329>after a while you'll probably be afraid of getting close to people since you know you'll just outlive themHow does it feel to be a raging faggot too afraid to live? Try not to eat your dinner, it won't exist after you do
>>51827714That's not how it works. If you have infinite money (mass and energy) but it comes in the form of an infinitely regenerating dollar (the limits of your own body) that you can only save smaller and smaller fractions of (diminishing returns on reaction mass) then you'll still never be able to afford a luxury yacht (escape velocity).
>>51827934Anon, you use your blood to get INTO a planet, not out of a planet.To get out of a planet you use the planet.Blood is in-space reaction material, not launch material. You'd have to use blood that has had a bunch of chemistry shit done to it to make it into rocket fuel.
>>51827959But what if you get pulled past an event horizon?
>>51828033Then physics 404s as it attempts to manipulate your bodies in ways your immortal form is immune to.Either that or the universe 404s because a black hole now is gaining infinite mass per second.
>>51828073It 404s in a very, very long time. Functionally speaking, the black hole is not gaining infinite mass per second. At best, it's gaining [your mass] per second, and depending on how your immortality shit works, it might only gain it once, when it pulls your miniscule mass wholesale right down into the center and leaves you there.But even if it is gaining [your mass] per moment, that's not enough to meaningfully impact physics until the black hole has already sucked up everything else it could possibly suck up from its universal neighborhood and then a long time after that for good measure.
>>51828134see, if it is getting (your mass) an infinite number of times per second, then it ends immediately.I see no reason why this wouldn't happen as your body continuously reforms and is black holed.
>>51828155That assumes that your immortality is the sort where anything that ends you is immediately undone via replacement.It could be that your body reforms to life as soon as there's an opportunity, or at a certain rate. In which case, you get squished into a teensy ball until such a time that you are no longer being crushed, then you unfurl like a sponge. Or it could be that your immortality just stops things that would end you, so you don't get crushed, but end up sitting in the middle, unable to move until such time as you are no longer being crushed.
>>51827775>you die if you are killedThanks for the insight Shiro
>>51828244yeah, there's a lot of ways this could go. And some areas of physics we do not understand.So I can't really give you a good answer besides "everything fucking breaks"
>>51824115I suppose it might depend on the kind of immortality you're referring to. I mean, being stuck as a spirit trapped inside a tiny pebble is one form of immortality, but I reckon that might not be what you're thinking of.
>>51825383I suppose one disadvantage of immortality is it seems to make some anons on 4chan really salty.
>>51828033I'd... wait for it to evaporate from Hawking radiation? Black holes aren't forever.
>>51824251Ever read The Forever War? It's basically intergalactic Vietnam, where soldiers are shipped out at light speed to go fuck up some aliens. Every so often, what feels like maybe 8 months or a few years for the soldier protagonist, he ships back home. His family dies, but he was never that close to them, but eventually society is just so different that he can no longer relate to them; everyone is a gay clone(for population control) and no one speaks 21st century English. He only eventually finds solace with a community of the last few survivors of the war from his time.
>>51825740I'm with you, but if it helps at all anon, it occurs to me that the cessation isn't INHERENTLY terrifying; rather it's that any naturaly evolved life is genetically very likely to have a huge antipathy for it. (Any ancestors cool with death would be less likely to pass on genes blah blah.) I can imagine an AI not fearing cessation at all.
>>51828378You are immortal but have no form. You are bound to 4chan forever, your only perception and input on the world is shitposts
>>51824115>good drawbacks to immortalityThe specific details mean that you lack a soul, so you end up going crazy and eating people like a grim mockery of the person you were before.
>>51828598That isn't so bad.
If eternal youth isn't present, t'd imagine living as an incredibly feeble, barely breathing,brittle-boned, eventually blind and deaf, shriveled old husk of a human whose organs function still only to keep one alive not even 200 years down the line would be bad enough. Unable to do anything for yourself and having to be cared cared for at all times must be bad, especially if your immortality means you don't need food, water, or air to live but can still suffer from endless hunger, thirst, and lack of air.Like this poor guy, but 100X worse than longer you live.
>>51828598This is basically how I live right now minus the binge eating and masturbation.
>>51828019Mr Mxy is very scary when you think about it
>>51824158There's also the possibility of becoming withdrawn and feeling separate from humanity a la Doctor Manhattan. When you've been an immortal for long enough, you may start to feel like you have nothing in common with mortals anymore and ultimately don't view yourself as part of them anymore.
>>51824115You can never benefit from cybernetics and bionics and are doomed to become redundunt as technology advances.
>>51824115It comes at the cost of your flesh. You will never taste again, never sleep or dream again, never feel your heart beat again. Never grow hair or nails again, never use the restroom again.Even if you look "human" enough, like pic related, you're little more than a self-moving doll.
I didn't expect to feel so depressed and disconnected to reality after reading this thread.
>>51825696>Imagine a new universe
>>51829589Welcome to 4chan
>>51826794How would a stare form from an infantry amount of blood? There would not be enough hydrogen or helium
>>51829789Fusion from excess gravity. Just like a real star.You can start one with any ol' matter, as it'll fissure and fuse into all elements.
>>51827606sounds like some top-tier weebshit
every 60-80 years you revert back to a baby and have to grow up all over again.
>>51824115You get really, really bored.Nothing is stimulating, you slowly stop thinking.
>>51830053Thats a low price for immortality here lets do it properly.You revert every 16 years. You get to go through puberty over and over again with little time to reap the reward. If you in a fantasy setting you will never reach your prime so will be weaker than orher fighters. In a modern setting your fucked over by age restrictions and few people will recognise the knowledge you hold from being immortal.
You get really UGLY.
>>51824715>>51824991>>51825051I read it Anon, and I liked it too. BBEG is actually living in a 1950's white picket fence existence, with a happy succubus wife and loyal Demon servant/butler.
>>51824115Shit still hurts, and you don't necessarily heal any better. If you get stabbed, shot, dismembers, etc. it hurts like fuck, and you'll still live in incredible pain forever.
>>51827754They are different and the distinction is incredibly important. You'll be thanking me when the genie tries to gyp you out of actual eternal life.
>>51824115The body is immortal, the mind not so much. Time and cranial damage can cause memories to fade, and eventually the person that once was will be no more, immortal in name only.
>>51824115how about eternal life and youth while you're still as naive as your typical Reddit poster
>>51831215Vaguely how my elves work. Timeless bodies, mortal minds. And given how much magical power an elf grows to possess over eight hundred years, by the time that they snap they basically turn into lesser eldritch horrors that devote themselves to some fragment of a story, some idea, some faded memory that becomes their prison as they become the playwright, their home the stage, and their tribe their actors. Fables be dangerous shit, yo.
>>51827249Bitchin' guitar riff plays
>>51824115The good drawbacks I've seen in immortal characters are that they have to watch all of the people they care about die, and sort of lose their drive to find enjoyment in life because none of it matters, they've already done everything before.
>>51825225>it's clear that technology generally creates as many problems as it resolves
>>51824115After gaining immortality you learn of the true nature of the afterlife. After a mortal dies they become a spirit capable of endless self-improvement, they may have lost their body but they now have an eternity in which to learn and grow without limit with their power constantly increasing. You now get to watch the mortals who die around you become gods after death while you remain the exact same power you currently have on the mortal plain, while knowing that you have given up the chance to be a god because of your fear.
>>51824115People you loved will slowly age and die.Wounds and scaring you sustained remain with you.You remember everything in detail and may eventually go insane from it.
>>51827931You're still going to see any human relationships you have as more like keeping a pet rather than dealing with another person.
>>51824115Your body will physically be the same no matter what when you attain it.Think you can get a new heart for your failing one, and exercise your body with the free time you have? Nope, any replacements gets forced out by a new shitty heart, and I hope you were fit beforehand.
>>51832233I am actually fit enough to not mind this.I mean, yeah, I'm a scrawny skeleton man, but I'm not so awful.I can be a slightly less cardio intensive Dr. Who.
>so no one's gonna mention it>ok
>>51824115Read "The Picture of Dorian Gray"
the force that granted you immortality sees you as an investment and it wants a return on that investment, one way or another.
>>51824301I remember reading a volume of 'Phoenix', or whatever the title was, by Osamu Tezuka. In the story I read (well, skimmed, since I skipped past the whole 'end of the world' part), the whole of Earth has died, except for one dude who is made immortal. Except that he waits around for life to evolve again, which takes millions of years. And in this time, his body has decayed to nothing, but his spirit is still there. This seemed like the most ass-backwards definition of 'immortality' I'd ever seen, especially since his passing into the afterlife seems like an 'oh, yeah, I guess I could go do that' moment.This feels at least a bit more reasonable.
>>51825156This nobody brought up your transhumanism fetish but you.Go stick your dick in a toaster on your own time.
>>51824115Killing someone and getting a life sentence in a country that banned death sentence.
>>51824115After enough time your species will have gone extinct, or evolved into another species you barely recognize. You will be a living fossil.
>>51826865>HURR EDUACUATE URSELF ITS NOT MY JAHB TO EDUACUATE Ugo fuck yourself
>>51825740>Permanent cessation of consciousness is terrifying.Is it? I certainly don't want to die, but I'm not scared of dying. It's just something that happens. Why worry about it?
>>51824115Your nose and ears never stop growing. Ever.
The sadness of having everyone and everything you care about die/be destroyedIncurable boredom that will eventually set inAlienation from reality and memory lossThe stress and labor that comes with the necessity to hide your immortalityPossibility of being subjected to extremely long amounts of relentless pain/torment by enemies or by getting trapped in cosmic events such as the death of a starBeing flung into space when the place you live on is destroyed, and choking unendlesslyBeing reduced to a dot when the big crunch happens, or being left in the middle of a literal void after heat death
>>51828944>/co/ once decided that the best way to animate the scene to illustrate what Lois is saying was to animate Mxy at 200 fps without motion blur, have him osculate in colour an shape every 10 frames, and have his voice being a multitude of people each fading in and out using surround sound with 5 people per each speaker, but never the same ones.You have no idea.
Getting to the point to where this doesn't bother you.
>>51824183.... so, vampires
>>51824115Millions long for immortality who don't know what to do with themselves on a rainy Sunday afternoon.
Alright. So. For a moment lets say->Immortal>Eternal youth>Mind is set to work with this so you don't just forget shit>Hell you'll even go into the next universe if the one you're in ever endsWith all that, when does an actual number on your age stop losing meaning? Like when do you just stop counting? Ten million? Twenty billion? Thirty trillion?
>>51836649Sooner. A lot sooner I think. Especially if your mind is set so "you dont forget things". Because not forgetting anything ever is the biggest downside to being immortal ever. Can you imagine the infinite boredom of a person like that? Someone who literally ran out of things to do in a millennium or two because he tried everything and still remembers it?
>>51836649I think it will have less meaning at the start or not caring at all.
>>51836802>Still have desire for compassion>Remember every love that crumbled from old age>Eventually scarred by the experiences so much they'd only ever roll the dice with other ageless beings.Ageless doesn't mean immortal and they eventually fall in battle.
>>51833817>they become more retarded looking the more incestuous it becomes
>>51825611>>51825740you're being a faggot and you would change your tune immediately if you suddenly became a little blob of flesh in the torture tank of dark eldar for eternitythat is by far the worst thing about immortality if you can't turn it off. if you live forever, odds are you are going to end up in a turbo shit situation, like the destruction of the planet you are on, spooky xenos experimentation, or some other cosmic fuckery. it's shit. of course if you're resourceful enough in your ancient age you will hopefully be powerful enough to minimize such risks, unless you just get roflstomped by an exploding sun or alien pirates and can't deal with it. might as well just find a way to technologically turn off your pain sense, since you don't even need it anymore (to protect you from death) although I guess it could be turned back on.not existing aint even scary, it's literally just like going to sleep forever. the primal fear normies have of death makes me sick, it is an intense narcissism and lack of perspective that makes them cowardly animals. eventually transhumanism will see plenty of people who will live much longer than humans of the past, and will view 80 year olds as children, their previous child domain over the world a tragedy of nature. I guess you and most of us will die a retarded kid, which has no dignity.
>>51824115You get a micropenis.
>>51824115Most wounds never heal.
>>51824115Diminished returns.The longer you live the less meaningful things are.Eventually everything becomes fleeting and you are stuck in a eternal flux of "meh".Given infinite time you will run out of things to do.
>>51836802this is a poor argument because everyone ITT is looking at this from the perspective of a mortal human. a person who lives that far into the future and has gained that much knowledge will have an alien worldview, and will most likely become some kind of transhumanist non-human. technology is already become better and better at replacing inferior human parts, so if this continues people will cast away their shitty natural forms when the tech is x100,000 better. such a person's intelligence could be enhanced by a technological singularity, so basically immortality is the path to godhood. I would never be bored because I'm not a non-STEM peasant, so I know just how much there is to do in this universe.
>>51824480Eternal youth. Eternal life means you can never die, thus immortal. Eternal youth means you never grow old, but sucks to be you if someone manages to successfully shank you in your kidney.
>>51837493>Not going around insulting every person to ever live>In alphabetical order
>>51825563How do you know that's what death is like? How do you know you won't be reincarnated? Or go to some heaven/hell? Or move on to a higher plane of existence?
at some point you will have had every single possible thoughtand then you will have had every single possible thought in every single possible orderand then you will do it againand againand then once moreforeverand it will never stop
>>51833817I don;t think he even got that old for that to happen, he was just messed up and fucked em young. (Killing one in childbirth because I THINK [HOPE] he's supposed to be the villain.)
>>51837498>>51836802>mfw when hyperintelligent STEM transhumanists slave away so lazy baselines can wirehead on lotus-eater machines
>>51824115none it's great!best wishes from you great grandad
>>51837755and then you do it again, this time from Z to Aand then you do it again, with another sequenceand then you do it again, in every possible sequenceand then you do it again, in every possible sequence of sequencesand then you do it again, in every single sequence of sequence of sequencesand then you do it againand againbecause you are here forever
>>51837755Some guy is already doing it, you'll just be called a unimaginative cuck.
>Living for so long you technically aren't even you>As you gain more and more experiences, they keep on piling on top until you can't appreciate their worth anymore>old memories will get mashed away to make room for new ones which will one day become nothing>you will inevitably become many different people>sometimes you'll get a bit close to who you originally were or wanted to be>maybe an exact match>but you'd stray away from it each time, losing progress even as you kept on going
>>51838130On the other hand, you'll have a bitchin collection of history as long as you write down something in a journal each day, compress them into another every decade, then compress those decades into the century collection, so on and so forth.
Why does immortality need a drawback? What if it's just awesome to live forever? Is this like people making up all sorts of reasons why it sucks to be rich because they want to feel better about how they'll never actually know what being rich is like?
>>51838224>Wanting to helplessly sit through everyone you ever have or will care about die to injury, disease, or age>Forever>Wanting to be alone with the starless void when the universe itself finally diesThere's a reason immortality is typically viewed as a curse, you know.
>>51824115Everything you know and love dying in front of you.You live so long that even the longest lived person isn't worth the investment in time or energy to befriend because they're basically a ghost anyway already.Society isn't static. You're going to be around with the same moral hangups and taboos of your youth. Imagine if someone from the 1200 was around today.You're going to be a science experiment one day.
>>51838460>>51838224I have played as two "immortal" PCs during the many campaigns I've been in, and both of them liked their immortality overall, even if their overall attitudes towards it weren't the same.The first was a mummy knight from the setting's Dark Ages [it was now more bright and high fantasy] who let himself become undead because his kingdom had finally unified into one and he wanted to see its future. This gradually evolved into a desire to always see the future, a lust to continue new experiences forever. His life goal was simply survival. When the universe finally came to a dark and depressing end, he wanted to be there to turn off the lights and lock up afterwards. He was also boisterous, boastful, and enjoyed the hell out of life.He also had crippling PTSD from the many times he had died, couldn't sleep and therefore NEEDED someone to stay up with him so he didn't fall into depression, couldn't eat without vomitting it up later, and his ability to form long-term memories was sometimes spotty due to his inability to sleep. He still considered it overall 'worth it' but was completely familiar with the shitty side of immortality over the last thousand years The other was a Mesopatamian god-king who managed to actually become a 'god' [Norse/Highlander 'live until you are killed' immortality]. He viewed divinity as his right, enjoyed the hell out of life, had aspirations of world-conquest, and viewed immortality as objectively superior to mortality [it helped that there were other immortals in the setting, and that he was only 124]. Its also worth noting he believed in the Mesopatamian afterlife of a dark cold underworld ruled by ennui, and wanted to avoid it at all costs.
>>51825740>Permanent cessation of consciousness is terrifyingThat's why most religions have afterlives, save for Hindu and Buddhism since those two are really depressing
>>51825740Shut up Pat, you are a toilet, and everything you say is wrong
>>51825534That's why you develop vaccines and take it upon yourself to vaccinate people in their sleep. Or not, you're immortal. They'll fear you at first, but eventually, those who get your needle live and those who don't die, even primitives will figure out to subject yourself to the needle ritual.
>"Christians" afraid of immortalityThen why do so many want to go to heaven?
>>51839293Because immortality in absolutely perfect paradise where it's always rainbows and sunshine with only people who share the same beliefs and a God that loves everyone (even those orphans that he gave cancer and/or AIDS) is more appealing to them than an often rather harsh world where not everyone is nice and where people are allowed to like things that they don't like.
>>51839293I'm not afraid of immortality. I'm more afraid of greeting death than living forever. Cessation of conscious thought is morbidly terrifying for me too.
>>51826865Will take a look. I can agree with there being less memorable 'firsts' later on in life, but I still maintain my position that time itself doesn't seem to pass any faster.Propable reason this annoys me so much is that I've seen idiots claiming that time passes faster the older you get; i.e. you literally slow down.Also; I'm not this guy: >>51833115
>>51827621Or worse, spoils the season finale.
>>51829170Where's the catch?
>>51824115Each time you would have died, you lose a memory. The more you die the longer or more important the memory.
>>51824578That's actually the best way to make Immortality not horrible.
>>51824115Time is in a loop. After the entropic heat death, a new big bang occurs. But all the immortal yous stick around. There's ten, and you're number eleven.
>>51842313Say your mind changes as well. You experience senility, Alzheimer's, infancy, and so on just like an ordinary person. You're staying alive, but your mind cyclically degenerates and gets revitalized. It's a good thing in that it lets you not become a vegetable and probably helps you stay sane, but you lose a lot of precious memories and such in the trade-off.
>>51824183This is what is the price for the Nameless one's immoratlity, every time he dies some other person takes his place.
>>51824115If it is a culture of immortals it is unavoidable generational conflict. Vtm goes into this idea very well.
>>51844596Not to mention genetic stagnation and declining general birth rates
>>51844710>declining general birth ratesIn Vtm, which is about vampires, the 'birth rate' is in fact high. But most new vampires are killed very soon. Each new person could be allies or a rival to the sire or other in the community. Simply by being the ally to the wrong person that gives you a enemy. The parent understands the difficulty of fitting a new person into the community because of that. Thus they want the best they can get out of each child. They want perfection or close to it. Replacing the child may well be easier then dealing with the short comings and thus the sire has the first year to kill his child if he feels like it. Even after that the community is not done with giving the new kid the lessons from the school of hard knocks. Most vampires do not make it passed their first tens years. Seeing as that most were were in their 20s to mid 30s that puts the over all life expectancy lower then what Afghanistan has.Children are a investment of time.What does time mean to a immortal?
>>51845148Well assuming we're not dealing with vampires there's still the general issue of immunity. A guy from 300 years ago would keel over and die from germs we won't even take a sick day for today
>>51826555Anon, I'm 21 and not the anon to whom you responded, I don't have any form of qualification to judge the internal perception of time of a random stranger on the internet, but I believe that what he is referring to is the sensation in which you fondly remember an event, and then realise that it was a few years ago. Such as: I look back at the week I spent in Iceland, thinking it was only last year, then I realise "holy shit that was four years ago"
>>51845148Anyways that same logic can be put onto immortal of a different type. A lot of early pantheons had stories of the generational conflicts coming to a head. Greeks just have the most well know cases of it. Hinduism is full of that type of thing among its gods and demons. Egypt had Nut and Geb with their issues with Shu (later versions had Ra replacing Shu but were otherwise the same).Myths about gods are a gold mine for the subject of immortality down sides.
>>51825225Although certainly not common, biological immortality does occur in nature. It's not that immortality was never meant to be, it's that immortality is not necessary for the survival of a species.
>>51838079How did /pol/ achieve immortality first!?
>>51826476This is more or less how I do elves in my settings. Every 120-150 years or so, they go into a fugue state while they rejuvenate, losing pretty much all acquired skills beyond the basics expected of any minimally-capable young adult, as well as the majority of their event memory. What memories of events remain are hazy and indistinct, hopelessly mixed up with the various dreams experienced during the rejuvenative fugue.This "Dreaming" process plays a major role in their culture and worldview. Elves typically measure their age in Dreamings, and there are a number of rituals and traditions surrounding the Dreaming to prevent the rare cases of a Walking Dream. Normally an elf is listless and torpid, if not outright unconscious, during the Dreaming, but on rare occasions they may be quite active, which in the grip of the strange visions that beset them usually makes them a danger to themselves and others.The experience of having their memories regularly fade into hazy dreamlike fragments also inclines elves to regard reality, and particularly the past, as fundamentally fluid and unreliable. They don't bother to clearly differentiate factual history and fanciful legends, because as far as they're concerned it's all the same. Very old elves who've experienced many Dreamings become more and more detached from reality, sometimes in a zen-like spiritual way, sometimes in a more unhinged fashion, depending on temperament.
>>51846637This is amazing.
>>51826555Well, you're about 11 or 12 now, so another 8 years maybe? And when you've doubled your age, you should notice that time becomes a mundane blur. Every memory you have will feel like it occurred much more recently than it did.
>>51848741>Well, you're about 11 or 12 now