Welcome to the XXIX installment of "Disney Villains Victorious."Disney Villains Victorious is a new /tg/ homebrew project based on the idea of a world, not entirely unlike our own, in which all the villains from all the Disney animated feature films were not defeated at the ends of their movies but were instead victorious, completing their goals in part or in whole.It is a world in which Ursula rules the seas, defied only by the uncatchable Pirate Lords, the cutthroat merchants of the East India Trading Company and the might of Atlantis and its magitech-toting mercenaries. It is a world where the grasslands and jungles and forests are prowled not only by fearsome primal beasts like Shere Kahn and Scar but also by the ruthless, tireless hunters that stalk them. It is a world where Europe has been divvied up between evil sorcerous monarchs like Maleficent, the Horned King, Grimhilde and Jafar, mad, inquisitorial clergymen like Frollo, and Dark Gods like Hades and Chernobog.It is not, however, a world completely devoid of courage, heroism or hope. Around the world, the PCs' characters and their allies plot and plan, fight and strive and win their own victories against the villains that would rule them. The time to fight and to be free is now.http://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive.html?searchall=Disney+Villains+Victorioushttp://1d4chan.org/wiki/Disney_Villains_VictoriousAssembled pastebins:King/Land/Rule: http://pastebin.com/Z8wFJrhhBeast Species: http://pastebin.com/6YzhDaPiSetting Traits: http://pastebin.com/8RRbwMQTTRAITS: http://pastebin.com/uHCXg4EVPOWERS:http://pastebin.com/pQDDqisUGeneric Traits: http://pastebin.com/MZwvGsyXFluff Catalogue: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1qj_IIuF_rqh_F2L-SeYn-dBiwDTtwWFpnbcXyfcgeE8/editSong Catalogue: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1oQniqbLaTCF7V19fnXP0_zUW7GFr3ESziGM6U5mEcC0/editFirst Playtest: http://pastebin.com/Vy1E0sHB
Let's get this polling thing out of the way so that nobody will get into a salt-storm, including me.Since we mentioned these as things that should be looked into, let's just have a vote on them instead of a 50-post argument, and avoid all the name-calling. Dual wielding: http://strawpoll.me/3012188Ability to change Ideals: http://strawpoll.me/3012175Polls close in, oh, 30 minutes.
>>36228861Daily reminder: Swordicorns are now canon.
>>36228959>+1 to your weapon skill for the offhand weapon.This means you get a bonus to your single attack roll, right?
>>36229000Yeah. No extra rolls. so if you're dual-wielding nice swords, you get 2+1 = 3. Or if you're just dual-wielding whatever weapon you can find, 1+1 = 2.
>>36228961Only in wonderland i hope, i don't think they fit anywhere else.
>>36229055Perfect: now we know where they live.
Will the map update to remove Ghibli come sometime soon?
>>36229081It's been updated. Nob just hasn't updated the 1d4chan page yet.
>>36229081I think it's been done already, anon.
>>36229081Didn't we already get a new map? We should update the 1d4chan page.
I don't even know why I had to specifically edit this, I changed like 20 words. ‘Sing’ to the tune of “Beelzeboss”CHERNABOSSI AM COMPLETE!ALL PARTYFuuuuckCHERNABOSSYES YOU ARE FUCKEDSHIT OUT OF LUCKNOW I’M COMPLETE! AND MY COCK YOU WILL SUCKTHIS WORLD WILL BE MINEAND YOUR FIRST IN LINE!YOU STARTED THIS SHIT AND NOW YOUSHALL ALL DIE!PARTY LEADWaaaait waaait wait you damn bloodsuckerSMART/SENSIBLE GUYWe challenge you to a sing off,ALL PARTYGive us one chance to rock your socks offCHERNABOSSFUCK! FUCK!FUUUCK THE DEMON CODE PREVENTS MEFROM DECLINING A SING OFF CHALLENGEWHAT ARE YOUR TERMS?WHAT’S THE CA-A-A-ATCH?PARTY LEADIf we win,You must take your sorry self back to hellAnd also you will have to pay our rentCHERNABOSSAND WHAT IF I WIN?PARTY LEADThen you can take the mascot back to hell.CHARISMATIC/NIMBLE GUYWhat!?PARTY LEADTrust me mate it’s the only wayCHARISMATIC/NIMBLEWhat in hell are you talkin about?PARTY LEADWe gonna end this quickCHERNABOSSFINE!LET THE ROCK OFF BEGIN HAHAHAHAI’M THE DEVILI LOVE METALCHECK THIS RIFFIT’S FUCKING TASTYI’M THE BOSS I CAN DO WHAT I WANTEVERYTHING I’VE GOT IS WHAT I CAN FLAUNTTHERE’S NEVER BEEN ANYTHING NOW THAT I’VE EVER LOST!I CANNOT WAIT TO TAKE YOU BACK TO HELLI’M GONNA FILL YA WITH MY HOT DEMON GELLI’M GONNA MAKE YOU SQUEAL LIKE THE SCARLETPIMPERNEL!FINALE NEXT POST
>>36229098I come back irregularly, just checked the 1d4chan page, which as >>36229097 stated, hasn't been updated.
>>36229112PARTY LEADNOOO! C’mon guys, bring the thunder!STRONG GUY/STRAIGHT MANThere’s no way that we can win that was a masterpiecePARTY LEADListen to me-SMART/SENSIBLE GUYHe rocks to hard because he’s not a mortal manPARTY LEADGod dammit yoHe gonna make you his sex slaveYour gonna gargle mayonnaiseCHARISMATIC/NIMBLE GUYNooooSMART/SENSIBLE GUYUnless we bust a massive monster manajamNIMBLE/CHARISMATIC GUYDudes,We’ve been through so much shitDe-activated lasers with only our dicksALL PARTYNow It’s time to blow this demon downPARTY LEADC’mon everyone now’s the time to blow them downALL PARTYI hear you now it’s time to blow every door downNIMBLE/CHARISMATIC GUYLight up the stage cause it’s time for a showdownSTRONG GUY/STRAIGHT MANWe’ll bend you over then we’ll take it to brown townNow we’ve got to blow this demon downCHARISMATIC/NIMBLE GUYHe’s gonna rape me if we do not blow him downPARTY LEADC’mon everyone now’s the time to blow them downSMART/SENSIBLE GUYOOOOOOh we’ll piledrive ya, it’s time for the smackdownPARTY LEADHey desecrater, CHERNABOSSWe know your weakness, the light in our heartsWe rock the universe, we’ll blow your mindWe will defeat you, for all mankindYou might hold the scepterBut we hold the keyYou might be the devilBUT WE ARE THE DALL PARTYD WE ARECHERNABOSSYOU GUYS ARE FUCKING LAME COME ON THENYOUR COMIN WITH METASTE MY LIGHTNING CUNTSPARTY LEADNOOOOOOO!(scuffle)CHERNABOSSOW, FUCKMY FUCKING HORNSOHH NOOOPARTY LEADFrom whence you came you shall remainUntil you are complete againCHERNABOSSNOOOOOO!FUCK YOU GUYS AND FUCK YOUR JINGLESI’LL GET YOU YOU GODDAMN SKEES
>>36229112Can you start putting these in pastebins or something?
>>36229141Yeah, that's probably a good idea. I'll start pastebinning from now on.
>>36229112>>36229136Glorious.>>36229111>>36229097>>36229081If someone's got the new map I'll do it right now.
So what fluff still needs to be made for the setting?
>>36229339Ghibli successfully removed. Also, is Cherrybomb still on the move or is it just me? >>36228959Polls are closed. And being able to change your ideals through hard work has won, unanimously! But how will we allow it?Dual wielding is also nigh-unanimous in it's support. Into the rules it goes. >>36229488We need a lot of King/Land/Rules, I think the 1d4chan page is actually up to date on that.
>>36229541>or is it just me?IT'S JUST YOUR IMPRESSION, YOU FEEBLE MINDED MORTAL!
>>36229541>But how will we allow it?What if the player asks REALLY HARD to change his Ideals and then he does exactly that?
>>36229625How frequently should we let someone do that? Once a session? Once every five sessions? As often as they want?
>>36229656Whenever they feel like their character's ideals have changed, but maybe only between campaigns.
>>36228861Hey, I posted this in the last thread, but I didn't notice that it done the deadhttp://pastebin.com/XjAh7X6iEnjoy!
>>36229677Yeah, after a serious event or something.
>>36229185This is the latest map. Everyone please take note.
>>36229691Maybe after they feel they really need to change them because they don't fit their character anymore.
>>36229541CHERNOBYL IS RIGHT WHERE HE- I MEAN IT- BELONGS! YOUR EYES PLAY TRICKS ON YOU, TRUST IN ME IN THEIR STEAD.
What are we doing about that lost Disney film?
>>36229736The nazis are skellingtons now.
>>36229736Learn the back story of Rourkes second in command
>>36229736Not canon: the nazis are all skeletons, not zombies. Duh.
>>36229678Shit>It turns out, the Snakeshot gang had been recruiting recently, and Lazarus counted nearly thirty men.This should be Jeremiah
>>36229678Keep up the good work.
>>36229678Fuck I really ought to proofread these things more closely>I've been doin' freelance work, ain't nothin' wrong 'bout that.
>>36228861I just thought up a power>Well-Traveled: You may use the travel attribute instead of Occult or insight
>>36229878I was hoping we would get more broken powers, yes.
>>36228861Question: Did all the original humans in scotland get transformed into bears?Can we have Bearida Merida?
>>36229910How is that broken?
>>36229915In that they were eaten by a bear and use to provide amino acids, corbohydrates and other nutrients necessary for the growth of that bear, yes.
>>36229938Well, turning three skills into one skill is very, very strong. Maybe if it was just Travel to Occult, that would be fine, or of you have to spend a Will point to get it's effects.
Made a character. Probably misinterpreted the rules here and there, but here goes. God, it took forever to come up with the cheesiest name possible for this character.Name: Zhang KaitoRole: Nimble GuyCountry of Origin: Hunnic EmpireSize: MediumSpecies: Human---Attributes---Robustness: 8/12Agility: 10/12Intelligence: 7/12Sensibility: 7/12Charisma: 8/12Will: 6/12---Skills---Acrobatics: 1Athletics: 1Melee: 1Ranged: 2Brawl: 1Prevent Harm: 1Endure: 1Stealth: 1Legerdemain:Deceive: Persuasion:Intimidate: Academics:Science : Occult: 1Mechanics: Linguistics: Travel: 1Driving: Insight: Music: Craft: ---Traits---Small Gods SpeakEverything has a spirit. Gatehouses. Gravestones. Stoves and hearths. The walls have ears, and if you know how to bribe them- with stories, with alcohol, with simple respect- you can hear what they've heard. Massive bonus to information gathering, but you need to be in contact with what you're talking to, which might be tricky.Let Me Show You How It's Really Done+2 to combat rolls is the foes are using the same type of weapon or combat styleBig Game Hunter+3 on ranged rolls against large, dangerous animals. Particularly mean kittens don't count.---Powers---Quick Draw KingYou may always make one attack in the surprise round, and never suffer penalties in the surprise round.Achilles HeelIdentify one target enemy. You are able to spot a crippling weak point. All allied attacks against this enemy get +2 to cause a physical Strike or whatever the terminology is.---Ideals---Respect Nature's LawDo Trick Shots When PossibleMake Witty Banter---Goals---Zero: Get your name out there as a renowned marksman.On-a-Roll: Find a way to prevent your village from getting destroyed by pirates/sea monsters/pirate sea monsters.Hero: Reunite Japan as peacefully as possible.---Equipment---BowQuiver & Arrows
>>36229967The best way to become a bear: from the inside.
>>36229975'bow' is a weird way to spell 'rifle'
>>36229995Oh look, it's this guy again!
>>36229995Relax, he can use a bow if he wants. It's only -1 point, and it's silent.
>>36229975Skills go from 0 to 3 and Nimble Guys get both their bonus Skills, not only one, but otherwise it's very good.
>>36229967Are you telling me Mor'du is a bear made up of tinier bears
>>36229995Sorry if he doesn't want to call down on himself every enemy in a several miles radium, anon.
>>36230021>Bears on a molecular levelWalt save us all
>>36230021It's bears all the way down!
Alright guys I don't know what is even going on, but I gotta write something.I'm gonna write my version of how Frollo should be defeated, anyone got any requests or something? I don't trust myself to write about other people's characters
>>36230021Scottish nesting bears
>>36230100Something to do with his faith: either losing it or getting it back.
>>36230115Perfect. On it.
>>36229975Could we start putting these in pastebins?
>>36229975BACKSTORY:Kaito is a citizen of Hun ruled Japan. This means he has to live under the constant threat of raiding pirates, pissed off megafauna, and bitching from his ancestors. One day, instead of ignoring it as usual, he decided to go out into the world and make a name for himself. That way, he could use his gained fame and fortune to better the lives of the people in his home village.He has a little sister named Yumiko, whom he trains in archery whenever he can. 10 might be a bit early, but you never know when something needs to be covered in arrows. Unless you're Kaito, in which case you know everything needs arrows in it all the time.Likes: Adorable forest creatures, shooting things with arrows (the two clash on occasion)Dislikes: Pirates, taxes, misplacing arrows when he really needs them
>>36230199Very good, very good.
>>36230242Thanks, but I still feel horrible about the punny names and the fact that his Ideals are a Haiku.
>>36230275Ah, it's cool, it's cool.
>>36230275How are they a pun? I can kinda see one in portuguese but english is elluding me
Alright. I've FINALLY finished my not-so-little story "The Hunt" about one of Gaston's lackies tracking down Clarisse, the daughter of Belle and the Beast.I hope that you might find it enjoyable.>http://pastebin.com/Z0m3kUS1
It must be pretty frozen.>>36230324Niice.
>>36230307I didn't do any in portuguese intentionally, but I am interested in what you thought it was.Answers:Yumi is the name of a Japanese bow.Zhang means "bow stretch" in Chinese.
>>36230449The entire last name of my character is a Norwegian pun.
>>36230449Zhang Kaito, said really fast as "Zangaito" sounds like "Zangado", which is portuguese for "Angry". Doesn't fit the character but I thought it was neatAlso, the name of the grumpy dwarf in Snow White's story
>>36229706Why is New England under the power of the Animal Spirits? It was one of the first areas settled, it makes more sense to me for it to be part of the royal colonies, while having some of their more interior possessions such as Michigan, going to the Spirit Realm, along with the Great Plains Territories that are somehow under the thumb of the jive talkin charlatan from New Orleans
>>36230521>>36230474The more you know.
>>36230555A good point.
>>36228861I would fuck grimhilde until she shot magic fireworks out of her mouth from orgasming so many times. Definitely best waifu, IF, and only IF, you can keep her from finding you useless and being rid of you. She is a powerful caster after all.
>>36230664First person to fug Grimhilde in-game wins a prize.
>>36230702Well, now I want to make seduce-based Tarbosaurus or something just for that goal.And so I can declare myself to be A GOD DAMN SEXUAL TYRANNOSAURUS
>>36230702What's the prize?
>>36230751You get to fug Maleficent later
>>36230818And then both of them, at the same time!
Did we ever decide what to do with tiers? I'm going to go on what I remember from the last time we talked about it ~3 threads ago.First option; Tiers increase your attribute caps by two, your skill caps by one, and you gain one Strike. Low-power, generally.Second option: All of the above, and you roll 5d6k3 on your main stat in On-a-roll, and 4d6k3 on all your other stats in Hero.Vote on Tiers here!: http://strawpoll.me/3012751(4d6k3= roll 4 keep three highest, 5d6k3 roll 5 keep three highest)We were generally agreed that there would be Heroic traits and powers at Hero tier, but I'll put up a poll for that too.Heroic Powers poll! http://strawpoll.me/3012755Polls will close in 30 minutes.>>36230748Charisma is actually not one of the Carnosaur's weak stats. Go for it.
>>36230835Allowing more die rolled is a good method of giving characters a bit more control and power without making them TOO much more powerful. I like the second option.
>>36230835Voting anything but the most HEROIC option is foolish!
>>36230835>>36230876Oh yeah, that also reminds me we need more and updated traits and powers. The lists could be expanded some more, and we don't have those initiative-based traits we thought would be cool in yet.
>>36230919Here's a few ideas:Trait: Blood of Heroes: In any round where you spend a Will point, gain +1 to all attributes. (This one could be a power if you let it stack. I'll let people judge it.)The Quick And The Dead: Power: Take a (strike/spend a will point?) to immediately go first, regardless of your place in the initiative order.Better to walk than curse the road: +2 to Travel when on foot.Well-travelled: +2 bonuses on Insight checks to find your way around in cities and avoid being lost.Thoughts?
Hot damn, I have two whole threads to catch up on now.
>>36231059The first one should stay a trait, and they're all pretty good.Just checking, can people make their own traits as long as they verify them with the GM? I believe that they can. If so, we should make that clearer in the 1d4chan page.
>>36231095They should be able to-- that was the entire point, we'd provide some generic ideas to allow people to balance around them, but generally traits should be made by the players. Want to tighten up the wording or should I?
>>36231120Better you to do it, in part because I'm going to go make dinner for some people now.
Since last thread we were talking weapons and dual wield, will animal characters be able to pull off a Maximus?
>>36231319I hope so, or I'm out of here.
Alright, I whipped up something for how I think Frollo's ending should beI used Quasimodo because, why the hell not. It's probably not that in character, it's been forever and a half since I"ve seen that moviehttp://pastebin.com/JgXTbLp5
>>36231319Anon, there is no way this can't happen. It simply has to be.
>>36231319I'm not seeing them wield weapons any other way. Unless they're specially designed steel claws or mounted Atlantean laser cannons or whatever.
>>36231319>>36231340It's DISNEY. If you can explain it, you can do it.
>>36231390And if you can't explain it, fuck it, we are doing it anyway.>>36231368>The nightmare was me!
>>36231384>Mounted Atlantean laser cannonsThe idea of mounting lasers on bears or any large beast both amuses and scares me at the same time
>>36231319I don't see why not, but the awkwardness of holding a weapon in your mouth might require a penalty of sorts.
>>36231319They can, but you still have to justify how you're doing it. This would be a fine example.>>36230835Polls are closed. High-power tiers won, and HEROIC TRAITS was a unanimous decision.
>>36231473What about mounting them on Mor'du?
>>36230835Well, fuck, I've half a thread to catch up with and now I also missed the poll.But nevermind that.Good news, everyone! I finally convinced my group to try our system out!It's going to be a one time only occasion, since they don't really like Disney or narrative games as a concept, but they promised they'd take it seriously and I think this is the kind of crash test we need: showing it to outsiders.I also gathered some ideas I posted this morning and compiled them into a cheat sheet for Mooks and Lackeys.Here: http://pastebin.com/VxSgrTfTOpinions, please.Higher Tiers enemies, on the other hand, are more problematic: where should we start giving out Powers and Specific Weaknesses? Inner Circle or higher?
New polls; Should we allow Fae and Genies as character options? I've got the actual profiles for the races around but they're gonna need heavy editing before they're ready for play. http://strawpoll.me/3012989Also, I've been looking over our skill list; Barter's kind of... there. Everything it does could be easily rolled into Persuasion and Deceit. Poll; Keep it or roll it into the other two skills?: http://strawpoll.me/3012996Polls close in 30 minutes. >>36231626I've got a stat spread for the enemy characters; I'll bin it and throw it up here for you to take a look at.
>>36231626>Good news, everyone! I finally convinced my group to try our system out!Oh, that's nice, I ho>I also gathered some ideas I posted this morning and compiled them into a cheat sheet for Mooks and Lackeys.>cheat sheet for Mooks and Lackeys.>Mooks and Lackeys.NOOO, YOU FOOL! WHAT HAVE YOU DONE?! WHY DIDN'T YOU READ THE THREAD FIRST?| WHYYY?!
>>36231663Relax, we came to pretty good consensus on mooks+lackeys last thread. He's a bit out of date, though.
>>36231626No, wait, nevermind: this is what we already agreed on.Sooo...I like the +1 to initative to the lackeys?
>>36231663>NOOO, YOU FOOL! WHAT HAVE YOU DONE?! WHY DIDN'T YOU READ THE THREAD FIRST?| WHYYY?!Oh, shit, what did I do, what did I do?>>36231692>>36231695Oh, so you already talked about it.How much screaming did I miss, and do I want to actually go and read the thread?
>>36231724Fuck it.Give me ten minutes, I'll speed run through it.
>>36231724Well, there is some significant argument in there but it eventually settled with no issues. I'd recommend it, but have a drink handy, particularly when we start talking about guns.
>>36231751Youre not going to survive
>>36228861Can I make a sorcerer? How about magic weilding characters?
>>36231849FUCK. MAGIC.No, but seriously magic is evil as hell in this universe since only the wicked magicians survived their movies.Pastebin with example characters; Let me know what I missed! We'll need at least one update on it before it goes in the OP If it even does.http://pastebin.com/THMh0PhF
>>36231849The closest you could probably get would be fluffing your powers or traits as some kind of magic. Run it by your GM.
>>36231870Example enemies, sorry.>>36231849We can explain more why we don't have wizards, if you want. We'd be happy to answer any questions about the setting.
>>36231887Yes, please. It seems unreasonable.
>>36231870It looks really good to me, is very clearly written and is easy to understand.
>>36231753I'm back.So, first things first. I actually wrote the"Extremely well done or just straight up advanced weapons, like the sword of a prince or a revolver from the New World, grant a bonus one point higher than normal"sentence to mean that every weapon more advanced than a flintstock gun should always get the +1 from being a well made weapon. They are not bonuses you should be able to stack.The .45 Colt, for example, is already an excellent weapon, so you can't make a better version of it.Then, we should totally give Mooks and Lackeys a 5 in Endurance: I forgot about that.Also, yeah, I guess a 3 in Melee, Ranged or Brawl is good for Mooks, if we can let them use normal weapons.And finally, I'm not sure what was the consensus on Lackeys' Skills. I gave them 5 in Prevent Harm (and now in Endurance) and 4 in the other Skills, but I'm not sure if it should stay or go.
>>36231887>>36231872>>36231870I guess I'll just go with the "He thinks he's a wizard but is actually a Demoman"
>>36231902Well, for the fluff reasons; People are oppressed by their horrible dictatorships which, more often than not are headed by a Magician or some sort of magic-wielding figure; The Shadowlands, Mexico, the Sunless Empire, the Fae Lands, the Mirror Kingdom, Britain, Neverland, Arendelle, and BALD MOUNTAIN.Magic, as far as most people know, is only done by the wicked. And let's be honest, the magic types remaining are; Demonic bargaining, sorcerous power via Genie Magic (Jafar), Fae Magic, Necromantic power (Horned King), and black magics. There's just not a lot of wiggle room for magician characters; Imagine dark heresy or the other 40k systems except instead of Perils you get lynched by an angry mob.>>36231934Take a look at the revised paste I set up a few posts up there. I've got the consensus based on what was voted on last thread there.Please vote on the polls here! >>36231657
>>36231902As for the crunchy reasons;Magic destroys game systems. It is the ruiner of balance, the destroyer of fun, the gnawer at the souls of gamers. There are like, two, three games out of the hundreds of RPGs where magic isn't a gamebreaker, and those are very rules-heavy simulationist systems as compared to our rules-light narrativist system. But you'd want to talk to someone else in this thread for a bit less... biased of an opinion.
>>36231987I agree with the crunch and fluff reasons for not putting magic in, but I'd like to point out that Elemental/Emotion-based magic is totally a thing, which isn't inherently evil like the other types listed.
>>36231987>BALD MOUNTAINYou know that would actually be a pretty interesting character concept thinking on it."You where a normal human. Then you got stuck on bald mountain. Somehow you survived there and seem to have gained magic. What the hell is going and and why do you feel like killing a king?"
>>36232040>Shadowrun>Lord of the rings>FATE>HERO
>>36231987I didn't even realize we had a Barter Skill: I was always said haggling should be done with Persuasion and Deceit.Also, about Mooks:>3 in a Weapon skill dependent on the region, equipped with a +1 or +2 weapon of appropriate type.>3 in two other skills.I don't agree with this: I think they should just have as many Skills as it makes sense, without forcing the GM to pick out which ones they should get. Leave it simple and all that jazz.And what about giving 4 in Skills to the Lackeys? Can we talk consider the option.Everything else is actually how I left it, so I suggest this version:http://pastebin.com/Au44uiQH>>36231849Oh oh oh, wow! Welcome, friend! Here, take a seat.
>>36232100>Shadowrun>remotely balancedmagic fucking destroys that system.>lord of the ringsMagic exists in that system? like, five people in the entire world have it.>HEROnever heard of it.>FATEfate doesn't really have magic. don't be obtuse.
>>36232040What the fuck are you talking about, it's Disney, magic should be everywhere. Are you trying to make a gritty version of Disney, fucker? What, now the animals don't talk or think? is that not gritty enough for you?
>>36232057 Because the nobles betrayed me.
>>36232141>are you trying to make a gritty version of disneyAlso, magic IS everywhere. It's just that 'everywhere' means 'everywhere evil'.
>>36232130>>Shadowrun>magic fucking destroys that system.Magic barely works on technological systems and mages fuck themselves for overcasting. Also, they're known at large to be the first target to go for in a fight and can't defend themselves from bullets particularly well.
Alright, so.Bearzooka Vs Swordicorn.Who wins?
>>36232114>And what about giving 4 in Skills to the Lackeys? Can we talk consider the option.Let's consider it. Sure, okay, it's just one more. makes them more dangerous. +1 to initiative is good, so the lackeys go fbefore the mooks.
>>36232114We discussed the bonus skills for lackeys thing and rejected it, IIRC. Also, the modifications the thread asked for are already in the pastebin I linked. Mooks just... aren't important enough to need long skill selection, they die in one hit for christ's sake.>>36232100Not even going to get in to that one. If you think those systems are balanced you need to evaluate them further.>>36232141The beast races are right there at the top. How many disney protagonists used magic, other than mickey mouse in fantasia?
>>36232141Anon, there isn't a part of the British Isles that isn't saturated with magic and spooky scary skellingtons
>>36232189>Mooks just... aren't important enough to need long skill selectionYeah, that's why we shouldn't say "pick two skills": it makes it into a list.If instead we say "every skill that relates to their activities", then GM doesn't need to actually choose them beforehand: he can just decide as they come up in game. It's actually easier and faster for him.
>>36232238Alright, I'll modify it for the next paste. It originally said "And +3 in all skills pertaining to their job."
>>36232180The swordicorn, clearly: bearzookas aren't even cannon yet.
>>36232215Yeah, but its filled with scots, bears and scot bears
>>36232304There are very scots left, and there's only one bear.
>>36232266I know: I wrote that.I remember all, Nob.Also, what about the +1 to Initiative? Because I think it's pretty clever: it makes sure you don't bundle Mooks and Lackeys together.
>>36232304WaitAren't all scots bears?
>>36232318Are you...a wizard?
>>36232359IT'S ME NOB! I WAS THE WIZARD ALL ALONG!
>>36232318... Generally, at the scale at which Lackeys are going to be involved, it's probably best to just have them all go at once because there's at least 6 enemy combatants. But sure, it's a small enough change, i'll tack it on to the Lackey trait.
>>36228861Reminder that the first Rumor Mill is up. Please put it into the header next time.link: https://docs.google.com/document/d/17CzFrAblibwD__7sEYorqXSz4ILYVp1O4tcQ-mGyYiI/edit?usp=sharing
>>36232274>bearzookas aren't even cannon yet.i see what you did there
>>36232388This list is damned near exhaustive! You should feel proud for compile all this!
>>36232388Kristoff should be in there too.There was one post a while back about him still acting as a guide in Arrendelle, or ded
>>36231657Fae make sense. Elves don't ruin systems. Genies, however, can do whatever the fuck they want.
>>36232318Here's the edited paste. Let me know if you see anything that needs to be changed.http://pastebin.com/pBDhafsyI decreased the Lackey bonus to Weapon Skill by one because it made their average attack roll +15, which was a bit too high for a cowardly enemy only leading due to strength of numbers.I'd be interested to know your thoughts on Inner Circle and Villains, by the way.>>36231915Thanks.>>36232383DAMN IT, I KNEW I COULDN'T TRUST YOU! WIZARDS! WIZARDS EVERYWHERE! I LIVE IN A WORLD OF MAGIC!>>36232511Genies have been released by Jafar and had their power bound so that they can't oppose him. That was decided in like, thread four though IIRC so if you haven't read all the archives i'd see how you'd have missed it.Also, Fae includes pixies like Tinkerbell but also the Fae Folk of Maleficent's kingdom.
>>36232189>Not even going to get in to that one. If you think those systems are balanced you need to evaluate them further.Most are imbalanced but not due to magic at least.
>>36232178Task spirits with machine guns.Fuck, Spirits.
>>36232388Gurgi should probably have a --->Dead option as well.
Am I the only one getting tired of this "FUG MAGIC ANTI-WIZURD INQUISISHUN ECKS DEE DEE" may-may that these threads seem to have become filled with? Not that I'm against having non-wizard protagonists. It's just that is it really that bad to have a protagonist from a non-human, supernatural species? Ariel existed, you know.
>>36231657You know thinking on it aren't all Gennies really Djinn? That brings up some interesting ideas there.
>>36232594It might be difficult for someone to play a mermaid in a mostly terrestrial campaign.And 'no magic' has been filling threads since about number four.
>>36232582Oh there is so much worse you can do. I remember a Rigger who had something like 6 drones that all had Heavy machine guns. Cue absolutely everything dying.
>>36232628I wasn't specifically saying mermaids, just that supernatural protagonists can, in fact, be Disney As Fuck. As opposed to wizard protagonists, which we were against from a fluff standpoint because it's not Disney and from a crunch standpoint because magic automatically breaks games apparently. (Not going to argue about it, we'll get nowhere.)
>>36232594Eh, It's honestly pretty common for /tg/ They mostly tend to go for the farmboys and the likes. I think it's the dark heresy roots coming out.
>>36232642Then you clearly aren't abusing spirits enough.Task spirits have a skill rating equal to their force, and you can choose any skill.Give them heavy.Give them a machine gun.Make them, oh, force 9. Doable with Magic 5 and 4 ranks in Conjuration if you edge it. Bind them until you have enough to fill up your charisma.Set them loose. Immunity to normal weapons+incorporeal+9 ranks in their weapon skill.
>>36232653I guess you could play trolls?
>>36232697Can I play as a talking mouse?
>>36232546I think their defenses are too low now: 23 is barely above Mooks.Also, consider that you only get a +2 with a two handed weapon or with a very good or very advanced weapon. I think most Lackeys would only get a +1 from their weapons.Personally, I'd leave them a +3 to attack and defenses and leave them as a slighlty more threating enemy.Then there are the Higher Tier enemies, which are indeed a problem: should we just go the wat of Mooks and Lackeys, just bigger and with some Traits, or should we make some special rules with them?For example: I think they should get more Moves than Player Characters, since they are supposed to stand up against them on their own.And then there is the question of how to defeat them: where do we start giving them Special Weaknesses that must be fulfilled?I think we should make several polls for that, all across tomorrow, and see what the majority wants here.
>>36232725Talking animals are playable yes, i think it's in the pastebin and the first testrun used a talking crocodile
>>36232740Said talking crocodile here, it was fun.Especially figuring out how the heck I ran into the party.
>>36232729>I think they should get more MovesThis, really. Action economy is important for solo monsters.>>36232594It's getting tiring and hurting the game a bit, I think
>>36232653We're having a poll on Fae and Genies literally right now, mate.>>36232725Yes. Beast races are in a pastebin in the OP. You'll have to deal with lower Robustness than average though.>>36232729>23 is barely above mooksThat's... kind of the point, innit? They're barely a step up, they just take longer to e defeated.+3 to defenses puts them at defense 25, which is unreasonable because non-combat characters would seriously struggle and possibly die to them.>higher tier enemiesYeah, we don't have enough on them. I think 3 actions a turn for Inner Circle would be good, and 4 for Villain. Special weaknesses is a case-by-case thing, not every boss is a puzzle boss.
>>36232752Yeah that was pretty great, whole thing was a fun read. I'm pretty excited to read the next playtest
>>36232484Aw shucks...Anything to help out the worldbuilding here.I will update it from time to time, but now I need to start work on the Adventurer's Almanac and the Villain Rumor Mill.When I find the time
>>36232765>hurting the game a bitas opposed to what, tacking in a new mechanic for character creation that radically changes the class balances as the game's about to enter beta? in a subject that most people have agreed on, multiple times, to not include? man the fuck up and admit that you're in the minority.
>>36232770I thought we had put Lackeys at TN25.Maybe they could get a little tougher as the game goes on to make sure that non-combats can assuredly take one alone, but that they're actually not insta-hits at hero tier?
>>36232775I've missed the last couple threads. What is the Adventurer's Almanac entail?
>>36232770I don't know, I think Lackeys should be a little bit more. . . MORE, compared to Mooks.We can make a slighlty better Mook by giving him ROBUSTNESS! 9, but the Lackeys are those that lead the Mooks.They should give non combat characters a struggle, is my point.Wait, do we even have non combat characters? Everyone can attack with everything! How would you make a non combat character?
I'd like to remind everyone that Fantasia is one of the best known and well liked Disney films ever made and many of the protagonists within used magic.
>>36232594>>36232765You can basically play any race you wantNo spell casters though. People tried to shove it down our throats at the beginning and have been insistent pricks about wanting fagelves and casters, to the point where everyone hates it now
>>36232833It's also the only Disney animated film ever in which the Protagonist is a magic-user of any kind.And the protagonist is Mickey Mouse.
>>36232833But balance is more important than staying true to Disney.
>>36232846Including Fantasia 2000, there's also that dryad with blatant nature magic.
>>36232829Honestly this is kind of a good point. Right now Lackeys are basically just mook 2.0. Which kind of leads to why would you ever use both?
>>36232846>Mickey MouseWho isn't in the setting.
>>36232829>Wait, do we even have non combat characters? Everyone can attack with everything! How would you make a non combat character?Tell that to the I-want-to-always-hit-with-11 faggot
>>36232821Nah, Lackeys were at TN23 last thread, at least at Zero tier.>>36232829Intelligence. Some forms of Charm Hannah only rolled +14 on attack, which would make TN25 difficult to defeat without taking multiple strikes.Also, we don't actually have mooks with changeable stats, that caused a bit of a shitstorm last thread so let's try to avoid that.>>36232867Because lackeys are literally sergeants to lead mooks, not a serious threat? The ENTIRE POINT was a marginally tougher mook to make combat encounters not 'oops they're all dead in one hit'.
>>36232833Its also the origin of Chibby Logs. He ate all the good magic.Also, where and when the fuck is any PC gonna learn magic?
>>36232829>>36232884We have made non-combat characters and they are pretty vital - if you don't have a Sensible and/or Smart guy who can decipher things, read occult shit and operate mechanics you're fucked
>>36232872>Disney setting>no Mickey MouseDo you even read your own posts? Seriously. Making a Disney setting without THE iconic Disney character is... I can't even describe how dumb that is.
>>36232770Quick question how would you interpret the poll at the moment? Technically no magic races is in the lead, but the small majority favors magic races, even if they are split into 3 different categories
>>36232884Shit, I remember that guy. Yeah, fuck that, we already know you can't go lower than +15, TN 25 is good.
>>36232848>Balance>This game so far.Thanks for the laughter.>>36232845More like a pretty large portion of this place hates them in general and likes to talk about how much they hate it in general a lot. I don't really care either way but it is hilarious to see.
To all the people who voted in favour of at least one of the magic races in this poll:Would you accept both races as a compromise, or would you rather nothing at all?
>>36232913He got beaten to death by household appliances, anon.
>>36232913He's dead.Yknow, like almost all the heroes.>>36232917Fuck it, they're going in. PUNCHFAERIE was a thing back in thread 6, I see no reason to exclude that. The poll about Barter is getting dropped for now, though. Not enough voters.>>36232924Hannah was literally at +14. What are you on about? Playtesting is a thing.
>>36232896>>36232912But every character can attack with basically any Attribute and Skill.It's the entire point of our system: everyone is a combat character.
>>36232913He drowned in the Wizards' Tower. Couldn't stop the brooms.
>>36232954The game is actually pretty goddamn balanced right now.A lot more so than a lot of accepted systems out there. Every character has significant use in and out of combat, and every role is needed for a cohesive party.
>>36232980There was a big old debate about how Intelligence being used for social stats was against the spirit of the skills system, and thus, short of your Powers has no means to attack directly with that attribute.on the other hand, it governs like, 75% of the skills in the game.
>>36232975I definitely approve of the idea of "Magic Races," and loved the ROBUST>>36232975Punch Fairy that was brainstormed up so long ago.
So, if we vote no fae, does that mean no punchfairies? Because if that's the case, I don't know about you guys but I'm out.
>>36232826It's another of my compilation projects, which I started mostly because there were a lot of interesting setting posts which didn't quite belong with the KLR's or the fluff.Basically, it has all the maps, KLRs, and setting rumors/fluff/miscellaneous tidbits about each of the Realms and life there. (Not the actual rulers, mind, that's for the Villain Rumor Mill.)It's kind of inspired by Shadowrun's Sixth World Almanac.
>>36233018Aren't fae different from pixies?
>>36232975>>36233008Ok, I see the problem: you think a character with +14 as his best attack should be able to hit a Lackey more than half the time.I think that's too much: a character with absolutely no combat focus should have some problems hitting a Lackey. Especially if Intelligence rules everywhere else.Should we just poll it and see how string Lackey are supposed to actually be?
>>36233029Pixies are faeries. Faeries comes from fae. I'm sorry you had to find out this way, anon.
>>36233018read >>36232975You can be the PUNCHFAERIE you wnat to be
>>36233018>>36233029Fae are indeed different from pixies.Fae are kind of harder to describe.
>>36233042>Should we just poll it and see how string Lackey are supposed to actually be?One poll more, one poll less, same thing
>>36232896>Because lackeys are literally sergeants to lead mooks, not a serious threat? The ENTIRE POINT was a marginally tougher mook to make combat encounters not 'oops they're all dead in one hit'.Most GMs would just take a mook and make it stronger for that. In general the "Here is a mook, Here is a stronger mook, Here is the PC rivals and here is the bosses." Almost always just adds more clutter compared to "Here is the mooks and here is ways to make stronger mooks for your game. Here is the PC level foes and here is the bosses."In the end the roles are so similar that adding new rules just for another one creates a waste of time.
>>36233042Go for it. Court of public opinion matters, but TN25 is going under a trial of fire come tomorrow if it wins.
>>36233044Pixies are Tinkerbell, Fae are Maleficent and kin. Comparing the two is like comparing paralytic dwarves and giants on steroids.
>>36232866>I'll take npc for 400
>>36232913Wait for the Toontown expansion anon.
>>36232963To be honest, I voted for genies but no fae because I tought we meant only Maleficient-style faeries, since PUNCH FAIRIES have been a thing since almost the beginning. If it comes to a tie I'm not really attached to the idea of either.
>>36232963I'd go for both races.
>>36233076Well, then you should have that conversation with the people three threads ago argued for a while over this exact thing. Lackies are the gap between Inner Circle (a minor but substantial threat) and Mooks; A screaming wall for you to stab that occasionally you can talk down.
>>36233109>>36233115Would you be opposed to us counting the votes for one or the other alongside the votes for both, in that case?
>>36233025Very nice. The KLRs are good, but it's great to have a resource that will let GMs and PCs get a real feel for what it's like to live in or travel through each of the nations in this setting.
So, let's see how hard it should be to take down a Lackey.
>>36233146Eh, genies as they were presented some threads ago didn't seem gamebreaking and fairies should definitely be an options, I just think "proper" fae should be NPC only, what with being mysterious and alien assholes.
>>36233195Damn it!The link to the poll:http://www.strawpoll.me/3013384
>>36233210I wouldn't see the fae races as being actual, Maleficent-tier fae. More like pixies. Which are a magical race that everyone seems okay with.
>What do all of these characters have in common, /tg/?Alex RussoJustin RussoMax RussoMickey MouseMinnie MouseDonald DuckGolden HarpWillie the GiantFlora, Fauna, and MerryweatherBlue FairyMerlinGenieTinker BellMama Odie RapunzelFairy GodmotherYen SidRabbitKing TritonPocahontasZeusKidaElliottEsmeraldaRafikiSpring SpriteThe Great SpiritsTananaInnokoBalthazar BlakeQueen ClarionAslanChessurThundraSoraRikuKairiTerraAquaVentusRoxasXionMaster EraqusDave StutlerClopinThor OdinsonZummi GummiMorgana McCawberElsaDipper PinesArielMarnie PiperAgatha CromwellThe Pied PiperEmma SwanGlinda the Good Witch of the SouthKida Nedakh>Answer: They use magic and are on the side of good>Alternate Answer: LALALALALALA I CAN'T HEAR YOU NONE OF THOSE EXIST
>>36233248Fuck off, faggot, we already said we don't want magic here.
>>36233248Most of them are dead, out of the running or not part of the setting.
>>36233248Apparently, they aren't the main protagonists and therefore don't count. Trust me, we've tried and tried to get magic involved. Let's just wait until the expansions start getting made, then we'll get magic as optional.
>In the Sunless Empire, all obey the laws of Empress Yzma, first and only ruler of her land.>However, there is an undercover order of llama herders that know the truth of her rise to power.>There was an Emperor before her, and his power was taken from under him by his traitorous advisor, Yzma!>For many years they have been working to bring about her downfall.>These infamous cult members are marked by the red and black llama tattoos found on their bodies>Though their origins and early history were lost to time, the Cult of the Llama is still strong to this day.>HAIL EMPEROR BOSCO!
>>36233267So it's only possible to play as characters who are alive in the setting? No making your own character based on Disney tropes?
>>36233248They're all supporting characters (With the exception of Mickey Mouse who we can't include in the setting) or villains, of which many have magic in this setting?
>>36233278We tried to get magic involved and we were shut down by the same three namefags that keep turning everyone else away>>36233267They are dead because we made them dead, but they don't have to be.
I guess that in order to describe Feys and Pixies, it would be a kind of power level jump.Let's assume both kinds don't care much for the well regard of othersPixies are mischievous tricksters. They like to annoy people, play pranks, whatnot, but they are rarely ever lethalFey, on the other hand, can get a lot more bastard-y. They either have so much power, or are so damn disconnected from our reality that they simply think that we can't really do anything about it, faggot, so deal with it. And so they get carried away and their mischievousness turns to malice.Fey are pretty much what pixies would be if you gave them phenomenal, ethereal power: They go mad with it and just do whatever the fuck they want, because they can, because they have the power, and you puny humans are the playthings because you're all magicless, always-solid faggots.Until you take some cold iron to slap on their faces, that is. Fire works well, too. Then you laugh back.
>>36233296You'd be breaking Disney Tropes if you made a protagonist or deuteragonist who could use magic.
>>36233248>Russos...ARE we using any of the live-action Disney Channel series?Heck, what about the cartoons?I remember we decided we were NOT using Kingdom Hearts.
>>36233212Wait, how long should we keep this going?Half an hour?
http://disney.wikia.com/wiki/MagicThere's a hell of a lot of content here. Most of it is about how magic is neutral and it's only the people who use it who make it good or evil.
>>36233293I like it.
>>36233302And also a couple of anons. But I see your point.You know what? Fuck it. The system's basically finished, it's expansion time. Let's make us some magic.We need to establish some ground rules first, though. Firstly: No reality bending. Whatever level you reach, you will not become as powerful as the magic-using villains. We let our wizards become Pathfinder's wizards and we prove the namefags right.
>>36233321Except for the ones who actually do, which we are ignoring or blacklisting as not-Disney.
>>36233366Name one that's not Mickey Mouse.
>>36233343Again, go away, we already talked about this, no magic.>>36233357No, go away! Stop it, you're only going to break the system and make everyone want to be a wizard!
>>36233357Maybe you should wait until the main game is actually tested more than one or two times.
>>36233385No.>>36233366Magicbro, don't argue with them. The Anti-Magic Inquisition doesn't use logic. If it has magic in the name, it's automatically going to break the game. Ignore them and work anyway. If necessary, we can move out of the thread.
>>36233357Stop saying this, Nob is the best thing that ever happened to our threads! Just go away, we didn't make this system so you could break it!
>>36233357Nigga, we in alpha yet.When we get this shit into a pdf and move into beta, then we talk about magicUntil then, hold your mamaries>>36233403She didn't use magic. That healing she did was the power of the crystal, not her own
>>36233357>the system's basically finishedWe've run one playtest and aren't even officially in beta yet>>36233403>Atlantean crystals are magic
>>36233422We're not officially anything.
>>36233415>If necessary, we can move out of the thread.maybe we should really make more than one game: one for Nob and his friends and one for us. I'd like to get some ideas in
>>36233410You know how some vidyagaems release DLC on release day? Think of it like that.>>36233422>Atlantean crystals are magicThey're vaguely explained Macguffins that break the laws of physics and are used to explain multiple further physically impossible things. Sounds like magic to me.
>>36233444We can make an expansion, and then post it here occasionally to see if anyone not against magic due to bullshit is interested in using it.Of course, Nob will probably kick anyone using out of the playtests. But still, we can run our own.
Before anybody starts statting up magic (which I am against), how are you going to have a good spellcaster in this setting? It's not like Jafar is handing out wands and spellbooks like it's Free Magic Day. Even if he did, it would only be to his most trusted underlings. The same goes for other villains as well.
>>36233445And you know what else they are?Not a person and totally usable by the player characters.Still waiting on that one character.
>>36233421>>36233422Oh, so now it's all about the SOURCE of the magic, rather than the actual magic itself, huh? All of that healing and immortality and shit? Totally not magic, guise. We've got the OK to make Magic Item users, with whole repertoires of abilities, as long as those abilities stem from an outside source instead of from learning it or anything. So yeah, all those disney magic users who gain their power from fairies or other fae beings? A-OK to play as because it's not inherent magic.http://disney.wikia.com/wiki/Kida_Nedakh>Abilities>Atlantean magic
>>36233465>>36233444You really need to get that butthurt checked, guys. Stop wailing on the guy that's actually helping the god damn game
>>36233490>all those disney magic PROTAGONISTS who gain their power from faeLike WHO.
>>36233465>kick anyone outAssuming it's not horrendously imbalanced (lol), I'd accept them in. That's what PLAYTESTING is for, mate.>>36233490You're gonna need to find another source; Atlantean magic is tightly controlled by Roarke. I'd recommend either the Friends from the Other Side, elemental magic, or empathetic magic.
>>36233465It's not only magic, I'd just like to go back to the first threads, when everyone was pitching in with ideas. Now it's alway the same three or four namefags and one or two anons with a lot of patience. i'm just tired
>>36233481Here's the way I think we make it work:You have Sorcerers, and you have Mages. Sorcerers are the big guys like Jafar and Ursula. They throw lightning bolts, they summon fireballs, they click their fingers and suddenly you're ashes.Mages, meanwhile, are just wise people who have minor magic items or some skill in alchemy. Their magic doesn't come from extensive knowledge or divine power, it comes from smaller things, like communing with spirits or a wand. For a Mage, magic will be very much based on items. As opposed to a Sorcerer, who just summons whatever out of wherever.>>36233517Thank you, Nob. I apologise, it's just you've been pretty obsessed with this whole "NO MAGIC" thing.
>>36233512Peter PanTinker BellArielAlladinKing TritonAnd anyone else on this list who could count as a protagonisthttp://disney.wikia.com/wiki/Category:Magic_UsersBasically, if you're going to restrict magic for not fitting "disney tropes" then you're going to have to restrict a LOT of character concepts for not having been done in Disney first.
You know, all this talk about magic and shit has got me thinking.Would Rafiki qualify as a mage? He DOES speak Spirit
>>36233491Hey, I appreciate all Nob's done to help us. He's one of the biggest contributors in all of these threads, and I'd happily let him help design magic so he can make sure it's balanced. Still, he's not perfect. I'm fairly certain even he knows that.
I see you're all busy with this interesting conversation, so I'm really sorry to butt in, but here, have another poll.http://strawpoll.me/3013449This one is for the average attack bonus of Lackeys.And you're still in time for the last one:http://www.strawpoll.me/3013384
>>36233522The first couple threads were a chaotic mess until the namefags came to each fulfill a specific purpose.
>>36233445theyre more like a magical power sourcelike how crash bandicoots power crystals.
How much would it throw a wrench in the gears to put The Secret of Kells into this setting, as an alternate Realm in Ireland? I know its not Disney, but it is a very good animated film and could mesh well
>>36233600Alright, Peter Pan. You named one. None of those other four use magic in their own right or aren't protagonists.Still, that's one valid protagonist, so I suppose you do have at least SOME ground to stand on here.
>>36233606But all he ever does is shut down ideas, argue with everyone until a poll tells him to shut the fuck up and then act all butthurt abou it.>>36233612Put back your name, nob.
>>36233572If you can actually pull it off, I salute you. I just don't have much faith given 95% of game systems and how it only barely fits in the fluff. Hell, I've been known to play bard back when I was still being abused by 3.pf. Btw, Alchemist is already a smart-guy thing if you want to fluff that out.
>>36233522there are 37 posters in this thread.don't get assravaged because things aren't going your way. you know what we didn't have before nob? a fucking game system. it was all fluff spitballing till he showed up. sure, he's kind of a jackass and he's got a weird pathological hate of magic of any kind, but he's responsible for, like, 50% of the crunch mechanics in this game; and that's a conservative estimate. like it or not, the game would be in it's baby steps without him. and, at least he can take criticism and bow to the will of anon, so he's better than 80% of namefags.
>>36233604He officially does count as a magic user by Disney.I don't understand why you all seem to think "can use magic" means "is automatically a level 20 D&D 3.5 Wizard/Cleric gestalt with full 3rd party support."
Friends, Contributors, Lurkers,Why can't we just finish the base game as it is and then, as has been suggested by a number of Anons, make our very first "expansion" based around the use of magic and magical creatures? That way it still gets done, but remains completely optional and independent from the base game.Or, disregarding this idea, how about we all just try and remain civil?
if. were going to have magic could it fit in with the setting(s) style of magic, instead of it basically being d&d magic in another rpg?thats really my only worry/complaint about it
>>36233667Many people have been vouching for that but some hardheads can't seem to get the message.PATIENCE, PEOPLE
>>36233651>Use magic in their own rightNeither do a lot of villains. There are many sources of magic in Disney, and the vast, vaaaast majority of them come from sources outside of the actual magic user.
>>36233604Exactly what the Mage class would be like, in my opinion. Wise old men, hermits, monks not in service to Frollo. And yes, Kidagakash, because she uses the crystal for magic the same way a mage would use a wand or a charm.Also, magic would by no means be the Mage's main thing. He'd pretty much be an alternate Smart Guy.>>36233661We could use Alchemy for a Mage. That's exactly the kind of thing they'd do.>>36233658You do have a point. Still, /tg/ projects have never gone well when it's just been anons. Nobody knows how many people want what. At the same time, if it's all just the namefags then why are we here?
>>36233692You can name MANY more villains that personaly use magic than anybody else though
>>36233600>pretty much a fae>literally a fae, and just a supporting character in the original movie?>she's a fucking mermaid, what incredible powers does she have except "breathes underwater" and "cannot into walking"?>what magic powers?>mermaid AND supporting character
Fuck this I'm writing a song
>>36233715We should just stop Nob from putting in any ruels we didn't make a poll for.
>>36233248Dead, non-existent in this world, or on the rubGet rekt wizard
>>36233661Actually, Bard might be quite a good inspiration for this kind of character, in the whole "utility magic" field.Of course, most spells would just work as powers and skill checks.
>>36233737Can you write "Friends on the other side", but with the protagonists singing it as a rousing speech when they find themselves in Bald Mountain, to remind themselves and Chernie bigogg that they have friends out there and are not alone?
>>36233692so what if the types of magic were about being drawn from sourcesand what if (like a lot of magic in disney) uses emotions as a source or conduitjust like how neverlands and other disney fae magic rely on joy, a lot of villains magic happens whenever theyre pissed off, furious or just plain evil.
>>36233753We should stop ANYONE putting in any rules we didn't make a poll for.
>>36233766I always have room to fill a request.
>>36233719Not really. Officially (Meaning from Disney) speaking, most magic users gained power from fairies or demons or mysterious artifacts. Not very many of them have it inherently.Apparently, heavy use of magic items doesn't count as "magic" despite being the MO of many Disney characters.
>>36233789Speaking of which, did that "What's This" rendition ever happen? I saw it put forth a couple of threads back and thought it was pretty cool.
>>36233715Still, most of Jafar's hypnosis in the film seemed to come from his staff. Maybe he was just channelling his magic through it? It could make casting easier, or it could make it more effective. Then again, Jafar probably just couldn't be assed with a simple hypnosis spell so got a magic item to do it for him.
>>36233609Am I the only one that wants a good, old, nice 7+3+3+Weapons?And the option with more votes is +14!Didn't see this one coming.
>>36233823Yeah, I wrote it a long while back and it's in the song catalogue.
>>36233825More like the staff is magic and he himself isn't.Just like many, many other Disney characters who use magic.
OKay, guys, I have an idea. But this shit is only for the god damn expansions, because I really realy really think we should just get the base game rolling.What if instead of making it a whole class, we make it like that:You have the option to discard one or more of your powers and take levels in a certain skill that could, maybe, be considered magic or at least mystical.For example, you give up one of your powers to unlock a rank in Linguistics: Spirits. Rafiki could understand Mufasa in the wind, couldn't he? Maybe the spirits that have already passed on, unlike the Chinese Ancestors, speak in a similar fashion and you can get glimpses or small tips from them if you make the roll.But again, this is just an idea, and I really really vouch to only make this for the expansion. Much much later.
>>36233248The vast majority of those aren't Disney Animated Canon. The rest are either gods, spirits, fae, or genies and thus not playable. Pixies, Shamans and folk who get their powers from magical items are playable - check traits and powers.
>>36233826I just want lackeys to be stronger than mooks, or I would use mooks.>>36233859OH MY GOD NO, NO MAGIC FOR THE PCS! DAMN IT, YOU DENSE MOTHERFUCKER!
>>36233691But the game needs polish. Lets wait a bit longer
so should we have a poll as to whether magic must be channeled through an object(bearing in mind the pcs are heroes not demigods or gods like zues who can just spam magic like crazy)
>>36233877You are so desperate anon. So, so desperate.
>>36233826>+14 without weaponsWell, that's going to be terrifying. Let's see how it goes tomorrow.>>36233859We've got the power Shaman despite my better judgement, which does exactly that.>>36233787Well, that's the general idea, yes. Do we want to rescind rules already in place, though, or just debate them on a case-by-case basis?>>36233756Doesn't that sort of fit under the 'performer' archetype for Charming Guy, with Music being a big thing?
>>36233894Why don't you make your own system, then? With magic, blackjack and hookers?
>>36233855Then he counts as a Mage, I guess. That's pretty much what I'm thinking for their MO - not magic themselves, but with magic items. All Jafar really does in the early film is hypnosis, that shouldn't be beyond them. Especially if they take levels in sensible guys.Until he turns into a Sorcerer by making a wish with the Genie, anyway.>>36233884Don't bother, you know the Inquisition will prevent it. Because apparently any mention of the word magic, even if you can easily prevent said magic from being used just by taking an item away, is bad.
>>36233884or even if pc's should be allowed it at all?
>>36233884Most Disney characters with any kind of magic only have a handful of "spells" anyway, and of those "spells", many are from magic items attuned to the character.
>>36233904Don't put in too many lackeys, retard: they are not mooks.
>>36233904I said the Bard's an inspiration for that kind of magic, not for music.>>36233922So the Mage class violates no Disney tropes whatsoever. Or we can call it something else if it makes people feel better about themselves.
>>36233884Not to mention how to go about the role of magic, sinse the bigger complaints about tabletop magic is that wizards just become living nukes. let's just see how the game after a few more tests and then try to figure out if magic can have a niche in the system
>>36233907Because Disney did it for me by putting magic, a variety of gambling types (like pirates) and Tinkerbell in their settings.
OKay, seriously, you dense fuckers.Can you at least wait a week to discuss magic so we get the core game all sorted out? THEN we start building around it
>>36233961The more you build without it, the less integrated it will be. I'd rather not have people go "see, it doesn't fit!" after they purposely built the game to make magic not fit.
>>36233961I have a solution.We magicfags shall go and discuss our magicfaggotry, and when the system is finished, we will return with what we've worked out.
>>36233864Oh, or have high Legerdemain.
Uh oh. We coming up on thread 30.
>>36233904Surprising, to say the least.That's 7 + 3 + 4 + Weapons.But their defenses are still 25.So, 7 + 3 + 4 + Weapons.Basically, they have a +4 in their Weapon Skills.Well, I don't want to say I told you so, but. . .Good luck for your playtest.
>>36234003>Thread 30Walt freaking Disney, it hasn't even been two weeks yet. Or has it? I don't even remember
>20+ threads of relatively smooth sailing>Suddenly everyone wants weabbo shit, generic fantasy shit, steampunk goblins and magic for PCsWhat the hell happened in the last three days?
>>36233982We can go in the threads while we make our magic, then we'll be there to keep them in check.
>>36234027It's been seven days, anon.
>>36234035By that I mean we keep you guys from making it anti-magic, not we talk about it in the thread. That's a no-no. Anybody discussing magic here will be redirected to an IRC room or wherever we're doing this.
>>36233982Yes, see? That's the porblem: we should begin to put it in the system now, or of course the wizards are going to be unblanaced, for better or for worse.
>>36233691agreed completely. though magic would kinda be relevant enough for the base game considering the large amount of magical characters we have.Ok i believe we can settle this in a civil wayplease state why1) Do you think it is possible for pc's to ethier start with or gain/use a form of magic in the campaigns.2)should magic be treated like powers, or be channeled through magical objects3) how limited should magic be for the pc(s) and/or villains
>>36234043You're jokingIt was a week ago like three days ago, no way we did 30 threads in seven daysHoly fuck /tg/, what is this evenIs this the power of Disney?
>>36234030A bunch of retards came in to the threads, saw namefags, and started wailing despite them having a valid reason to namefag.
THIS TWENTY-NINTH THREAD HAS NOW BEEN ARCHIVED ON SUP/TG/.http://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive.html?searchall=Disney+Villains+Victorious+XXVIIIPlease remember to vote the thread up!
>>36233933>dont put in too many lackeys, retardThey're meant to lead mooks, especially groups of five or more.The average Prevent Harm roll is ~8+3 = +11. (Assuming average stats. If the characters aren't dense as hell, it'll probably be 9+3 = 12)That's... going to be lethal. Someone is likely going to die.
>>36234062So we have to move to the ghetto? Are we black wizards now?>steampunk goblinsWhat?
>>36234043Shit you guys cranked out a system that needs a touch of tweaking and adjusting in a week. That's pretty impressive
>>36234067>So this is the power of Walt....It's quite something..
>>36234067>Anonymous 11/05/14(Wed)12:00:16 No.35976464
>>36234080Then don't put in too many of them! How is hard to understand? Maybe there should be a lackey every 10 mooks, why every five?
>>36234030People assume that "magic for PCs" means "D&D magic for PCs" when it actually means "Disney magic for PCs". Because we all know that Disney Magic is completely unbeatable, right? That's why none of those antagonists with magic have ever been beaten by protagonists without magic, right? Right?Or is that the problem? You made magic antagonists TOO powerful and assume that any magic protagonist must have equal amounts of magic power?
>>362340651) I believe magic should be possible because in a universe with as much magic as the Disneyverse, where it's been established that magic is neutral, not good or evil, it doesn't make sense for there to be no good mages. We should have rules for making them as a GM, at least.2) It should be channeled through magical objects. The creation and usage of said objects should be a power.3) PC magic is always utility, villain magic is where it gets crazy. However, strong magic almost always relies on an object - Ursula could do alchemy before, but she needed Triton's Trident in order to use the power she has now.>>36234085Only temporarily, anon. Only temporarily. Soon, we will rise. Just give us some time to prove what we can make, and we'll show them.
>>36234080Well then, people better start doing awesome shit in-character to regain those strikes.Or, the Smart/Sensible guys better get to work on that healing
please may everyone answer the questions in the following post, that way everyone can get an organized consensus on what everyone wants>>36234065>>36234065>>36234065thanks.
>>36234107Didn't we say that 3 threads ago? Or did Nob decide that?
>>36234118The worry has always been a magic user invalidating the existence, and indeed necessity, of other classes.
>>36234146Why not make an actual poll?
>>36234176He's asking "why" and stuff. Can't really make a poll for that kind of question
>>36234107Look, mate, they're up +4 on people. On 3d6 that's a LOT. They should probably take the place of Inner Circle characters now.>>36234157It was ~3 threads ago. I wasn't there for it so you can stop wringing your hands over me ruining your precious game.
>>36234128I HAVE A DREAM!>>36234157WHAT? Nob deciding something on his own? IMPOSSIBLE!
>>36234065>1)Yes>2)Powerful magic needs powerful items. Without powerful items, magic is rather weak and piddly. That's how it's always been in Disney.>3)Almost nobody in any Disney media has more than a handful of magic powers, and when they do, it's always thanks to some powerful item(s) in their possession. That being said, villains always have the upper hand until they get their ass handed to them. That's just how Disney goes.
>>36234176Okay, wait a moment. We have a lot of polls going on around here, right now.Are we done with the last two?Do the Lackeys get 25 to their defenses and +14 to their attacks?Or should we keep going for a little more?>>36234197Nob, may be people want The Inner Circle to be stronger.
>>362340651.) Yes, but with little to no tutors, heavy magic distrust from the populace and the paranoia of the villains, and other factors it's going to be bloody difficult for anyone to be good at it.2.) Yes, like with the shaman power. And the more powerful that power is, the less you can use it. Hell, I'd be up for you just fainting if you used one. As for magic artefacts, nicked from the villains only3.) PCs - heavily limited. Villains: un-.I would not lose any sleep over PCs not being able to cast spells, and if making it balanced is going to be a difficult task, it should be thrown out entirely and left up to your own fluffing of powers or traits or possibly Legerdemain.
>>36234085Some guy in thread 19 or so barged in and proposed a civilization of steampunk goblins and generic fantasy elvesor some shit. Everyone said it didn't absolutely fit with Disney, and he went on a tirade about how we should all start adding any shit that comes to mind because more things mean more variety and thus make the setting objectively better. I rememmber Knightfag was here then.
Oh god who set Lackey attack to +15 for zero-tier?Jesus Christ that's really high. I guess we'll see if it works in the second playtest though, I suppose that setting it so high could potentially work out. I was thinking they'd get +15 at on-a-roll, maybe.
>>36234196>>36234176exactly knowing WHY people want x is as important if not more then simply knowing they want xin the wierd yet again anons vs namefags debacle, (despite namefags just basically being anons that didnt want their posts to get misinterpreted with other anons to save confusion) i yet again dont see what the fuss is aboutjust use polls and stuff like this so we can prevent nob and any other anon from going crazy
>>36234253Wait a bit.>>36234197>I wasn't there for it so you can stop wringing your hands over me ruining your precious game.We never said every five mooks there must be a lackey: lackeys should only be there every dozen of mooks, and that's a serious encounter, not something ypu rpecious intelligence guy shoiuld solve on his own.
>>36234253Yep, time to start crunching out some options to make Inner Circle stronger. There'll be a post and then a poll for the choices. Lackeys have moved up from 'squad sergeants' to 'miniboss' status.>magicEveryone's assuming the bad joke about me being terrified of wizards due to Pathinder is due to an actual, literal hate of magic mechanics. I think magic could be balanced well. I also think that if balanced improperly it could easily collapse the class balance on it's own via option overload.>>36234290Fair enough. I guess we're going to make Lackeys more powerful, we'll see how that goes in the playtest when the players face two of them (in the entire test)
>>362340651.) Yes, for several reasons: the PCs will almost certainly gain magical allies over the course of their adventure, defeat Villains who have magical loot, etc. If all else fails they can sell bits of their soul to the Other Side. You know someone is going to try that. 2.) As items. Treating it as Powers would just be sort of redundant. 3.) For PCs, limited in power. For Villains, limited in application; Ursula controls the sea and nothing else, the Horned King creates undead and little else, Grimhilde has her poisons and mirror but is useless in a stand-up fight, etc.
>>36234290So let's make it every ten or twelve mooks, Jesus! Lackeys should be way more powerful than mooks anyway.
Yo, Sverd, any songwriting tips for a newbie?
>>36234065It's Disney, everyone is magic.Both, powers and objectsLimited for PCs, but not too much
>>36234328That's really not their pointImagine a small band of five mooks. They just hang out and usually work together, have a good team dynamic going, you know?There's the brain, the common sense, those two comedic relief guys, and the one that says "Okay guys, let's roll!"That last one? He's the Lackey. He's like, the slightly bigger guy that the other guys just happen to listen to. Sometimes he's the actual boss of the small gang, but most of the time the other guys just kinda follow his lead
>>36234312>Everyone's assuming the bad joke about me being terrified of wizards due to Pathinder is due to an actual, literal hate of magic mechanicsWhy are plying a system based on Disney? Fuck, why are you trying to put your ideas everywhere in a system based on Disney?
>>36234369No, that's just a bigger mook, a mook with more robustness than usual! Lackeys should lead at least ten mooks and be clearly higher in rank than them, more powerful. A lackey should be able to go toe to toe with one PCs and maybe, one time out of four, even win.
>>36234065>1) Do you think it is possible for pc's to ethier start with or gain/use a form of magic in the campaigns.Never begin with. No main protagonist starts with magic, and neither should players. Old wizened wizards are NPCs at best, dead at worst. Apprentice is the MOST i would be willing to let them stat as, and no powers. Later on, if some player spends retarded amounts of time studying (years in game) than yeah>2)should magic be treated like powers, or be channeled through magical objectsMagic tools, weapons and artifacts are a must>3) how limited should magic be for the pc(s) and/or villains?Players? Highly. At the highest point a wizard can be, they will never surpass Merlin without evil helpVillain? Nearly Unlimited. They have no qualms about morals
It's done. It's kinda short as it stands but I could see to make it a little longer later, just decided to turn it in now so that I can move on to other stuff for a bit.Sing to the tune of “Friends on the other side” – Princess and the Froghttp://pastebin.com/KyGTgxFh
>>36234420Pretty nice, I like it.
>>36234274>in the wierd yet again anons vs namefags debacle, (despite namefags just basically being anons that didnt want their posts to get misinterpreted with other anons to save confusion)A namefag slights an anon in the tiniest way, and instead of moving on like any adult with a moderately sized ego would, the manchild anon with a vastly inflated sense of self-worth decides that the namefag must suffer! Not comprehending that his posting style is quite recognizable, he shitspams threads the namefag posts in. He starts arguments at every opportunity and continues them beyond all reason, ruining the thread for everyone.It happens all too often.
>>36234420That's pretty awesome, thanks man!How do you do it? An anon up there asked for tips and I'd like some too
>>36234462To be fair, I have slighted a lot of people. My debate style is sort of inherently vitrolic.So, the general consensus is that Lackeys are at TN25 for Defense and +14 without weapons to hit? I'll be editing the stats if that's actually true.
>>36234415Lackeys ARE bigger mooks! Just fucking read here: http://pastebin.com/THMh0PhF
http://disney.wikia.com/wiki/Magic#Types_of_MagicDisney magic is rather well defined.Assume that Wizard/witch equivalent characters use magic items for the most part. I actually can't think of any (Besides literal gods) who pulled off magic without some kind of special item. Hell, even Sorcerer Mickey had the Hat and a wand, Ursula had her magic ball, the Queen had her mirror and the stuff she used to make the sleeping potion, the Atlanteans had their crystals, Jaffar had his staff, and later, the lamp, ect.Then you've got Voodoo, which has some limits built into it.Then there's Dragon magic, which is, well, dragons only.Fairy magic is like witchcraft, but from nature instead of arcane forces. Pretty much limited to fairies and the people they like enough to share their power with.
Just a friendly reminded: we've reached page six, the current thread is archived, and a new thread will need to be started shortly.Also: magic or no magic, it's been a pleasure working with all of you on this.
>>36234484>http://pastebin.com/THMh0PhFThat was written by me and is apparently inherently invalid. The will of the crowd has decided that Lackeys are minibosses, which could actually work. I'm going to give it a go, see what sticks in the playtest. That's why we test the game.
>>36234490Horned King can teleport. Maleficent is magic as all the powers of hell.
>>36234498>RemindedI feel like in idjit.
>>36234484No, they are those who lead the mooks into battle.http://pastebin.com/Au44uiQH
>>36234498Thirty threads in a week.Dear Walt.
>>36234467Well, when someone doesn't give you a song to work with, I find a good showtune from my portfolio which is by far the most important part. Finding a solid tune with good melody and an appropriate chorus is key. After that, you need only to write as if you're writing a normal song, but keep in tune with the sound of the showtune and keep in thought the mindset of the characters you're writing versus that of the characters that existed in it previously.If that made any sense. Sorry if it didn't, it's the part of me that was forced into head roles into every musical in our high school (But not in the nerdy way) and then some in college speaking.
>>36234515Trust me, compared to Arawn, the Horned King is nerfed.
>>36234515The Horned King has the titular Black Cauldron.Maleficent has her staff.Those are also Major antagonists, with Maleficent being described as "one of the most powerful villains in Disney history."
>>36234369>>36234415well the answer to this problem is simple1 lackey for every 5-10+ mooksand whatever that specific no is, is up to the GMok so current consensus is that magic should stick to items or sources like the other side for powersand that it should be limitedThis method seems to be working so il stick with it(apologies if its turning into 20Q)1) should magic make a situation more effective always or only when the player succeeded in that task anyway2) Should magic give bonuses to rolls in action related tasks (combat/social) or extra rerolls?3)should magic items have huge or small consequences when you fuck up using it4)should powers be used all the time, in specific curcamstances, or when youre on your last strikes?
>>36234522I immediately regret ever writing that introduction to the Lackeys. Please leave me out of this, I don't want to ruin my friendship with Nob.Still, the polls are done.Do I need to make another one for magic or should we wait until we are all more composed?Because I think you're all losing you mind here.
>>36234592*your mindFuck, I'm tired. It's late here.
>>36234579Black Cauldron only works with creating undead. It has nothing to do with his teleportation or other abilities.>>36234567New thread here. I could have sworn I stopped this thread going up, but apparently it did, errors and all.Nighty-night.
>>36234592>>36234610dont worry about it, me and other anons are sorting out damage controlyou get some sleep now
>>36234590Alwaysbonusesconsequences are gooddepends on the power
>>36234625Teleporting is the only ability he has been shown to have aside from what the Cauldron itself does.And again, Major Antagonist. That's one single spell with no apparent item associated with it. The vast majority of other magic effects are associated with specific items.
>>36234610Don't worry, we're still friends.Everyone is my friend, even if they don't want to be. Because we're all trying to make a system together here, and even if people hate me for it I've enjoyed working on it with everyone.
Are there any updates needed to be made to the OP before we are able start the next thread?
>>36234838Bit late for that. And as the guy who posted it, we'll need to take shit out before we put more in. We reached the character limit when I put that last google doc in.
>>36234860Oh! My apologies! I'm just glad to see the new thread started!
>>36233248Dude, if you want magic so bad, just make rules for yourself. The rest of us don't want it, so we're not gonna have it.
Hey guys, what's been going on since I've last been-Well, I'll be back when I finish the next DTP. Let me know if the map needs updating.
>>36235457RUNRUN WHILE YOU STILL CAN
>>36233633Since there are Vikings in it, we could save it for the Dreamworks expansion that has the HHTYD vikings. That'd be interesting.However, even though I really love that movie, The Secret of Kells wouldn't fit in very well to the basic Disneyverse as a whole.Ernest and Celestine, on the other hand...