Been working on a Puella Magi d20 system, and at long last after testing it out with a group of players for about 3 months, it's almost ready for a public test release. This system was inspired largely thanks to Magical Burst that's pretty popular. One thing that bothered me was the low-mechanic and high flavor nature of it, so I decided to create a system based on d20 which lends itself to being high mechanic, while also trying to keep it high flavor. Still, have to pay respect where it's due and because of that the main go to ability for attacking enemies is of course called, Magical Burst. Will be answering Q&A, hate, and taking suggestions for about the next hour, while posting teasers.
All witches from Puella Magi are being given stats and abilities that shows off powers they had in the show. This includes Walpurgisnacht, which would take a couple miracles to kill.The creatures to kill does not extend only to witches from the show, but many interesting witch ideas to give prospecting GM's ideas on how to spruce of labyrinths that while makes a awesome concept for a video game, can be a bit difficult to implement into a table top in a way that isn't simply a long corridor.
>>33332521I know the hate for d20 in these boards are high, but it'd be a bit redundant to copy a system like dungeon world or magical burst. Still those would make a excellent system if you want low mechanics, so I don't see any need to create another.
>>33332612I prefer high-narrative low-crunch... which is why I'm doing my own with FATE. Not PMMM but a generic mahou shoujo; and it is presently not possible to simulate PM because soulgem-like extras that require bookkeeping are not supported.
>>33332696My system, obviously takes puella magi as complete president over every ability. Anything a Witch or Magical Girl was able to do in the show, the system works to allow it in. Puella Magi have Stamina Points, and Magic Points. When a magi is brought to 0 stamina, all further damage goes into direct damage to the magi's magic points. Only when the magic points runs out does a magi die. When at 0 Stamina though, the magi is in too much pain to do anything besides healing, restoring their stamina fully.So all spells uses Magic Points, getting hurt too much transfers excess damage into magic points, and when a magi's magic points become too low, they die. Each time a witch is killed, drops a grief seed with two charges. This can either be used to restore all magic points, or be transformed into experience points. This creates a balance between staying alive and becoming stronger faster.
>d20Stop.Re-evaluate why you're using d20. Examine what you're trying to do and ask yourself "Is d20 the system I need to be using?"The answer is no. No, you do not need to be using d20. You shouldn't be using d20. There is nothing in the d20 system that is conductive to this kind of game.First off, and the most glaring thing: Levels. In a magical girl game.
>>33332898Ok, what about soul gems, and how they darken whenever you use magic?
>>33332944There has been very often differences in power between magical girls in puella magi. Sayaka was obviously no match for Kyoko who was stronger, faster, and had amazing technique. Again against Mami who was a veteran Kyoko Sayaka and Homura were no match against her. A difference in power is apparent often. Some witches are nothing to take out and can be done so alone. Other times you have several very powerful magi banding together before they succeed. Homura you can't say was as powerful as she was by the end, as she was when she first began.
>>33333019The lower your magic power is, the darker your soul gem is considered to be. You tend to just die when your magic power is all used up, unless you're special. There's a rule for karmic destiny, where magi with high enough karmic destiny will become witches no matter what.Another way for soul gems to darken is Despair. When magi's despair is greater than their hope, only a single trigger is all that's needed before going witch. The process isn't instant, giving players time to set up how the magi goes. The only way to lower despair is to resolve what gave the magi despair to begin with, which of course isn't something that has happened. Alternative players can make their magi more hopeful which can extend their life span a little longer.
Okay, wait. Let me ask something.What can your system do that Magical Burst can't.Why would I use your game instead of MG?
>>33333090I seem to recall an implication that you'll turn a witch simply by letting your soul gem turn dark - that is, use your powers too much.
>>33333043Did we watch the same series?Assume levels existed in the madokaverse.Time-repeating grindathon Homura SHOULD be a higher level than normal time continuum Mami. Yet she still reacts with fear around Mami despite that with a level system in place, Homura could fucking trounce Mami. Likewise, far more experienced Homura should have been able to break out of Mami's binding spell easily.I've never seen anything canonically stating that Kyoko was no match for Mami, and the alternative timeline manga (MAHOU SHOUJO MADOKA MAGICA - THE DIFFERENT STORY) implies that Mami and Kyoko were on relative footing. This is not a point against levels, and more just pointing out that this is not really jiving with the only source we have for this comment.Also, Madoka goes from level 0 to level 30 with an absurd amount of divine ranks instantaneously. The existence of power disparity between veteran rookie makes some sense, but the series itself is contrary to the idea of levels.Levels have no place in this kind of game.Really, they don't belong in anything that's not a video game
>>33333141This is never outright stated, but it's HEAVILY implied. So much so that it's effective stated.Emotional strain and overuse of magic while not consuming witch souls will degrade your soul gem.That's what happens to Sayaka. It's not just losing her lover that hurts her. It's not just finding out she's a zombie. She recklessly ignores taking care of herself. She thinks because her body is not alive, she does not need to take care of herself. Her soul gem does not darken wholey by despair, but also because she's shown to not give a fuck about cleansing her soul gem with Witch Eggs, allowing others to have them.It, combined with emotional stress (which could very well be linked), degraded Sayaka's soul gem until she hit the despair event horizon and snapped.
>>33333043Power levels in Madoka are not like D&D levels.The power level is determined during the contracting and never changes. The girls just get more skilled, which can't be portrayed by a level system. Level systems are too inflexible and tend to have exponential power gain.Try to modify WoD instead. The baseline of the char sheet is perfect. You just need to work out a few mechanical kinks.
>>33333108As I mentioned, Magical Burst lends itself entirely into flavor and a more generic magical girl world, whereas this system is primarily focused around mechanics of how abilities actually work rather than doing the same thing with a different flavor. Neither does the system lend itself well to advancement, with its advancement system. Leveling and earning experience I find to feel much more rewarding than "gain a + after each game session" approach magical burst does. Again, this does not replace magical burst, but instead offers a alternative to someone who wants some more clear mechanics to things. Magical Burst will always beat this system when it comes to purely text rp's I admit, and this system is made for those who want to play with a grid and via voice chat or personal meeting.At the same time, the system does try being rules light and pretty consistent. The main goal is making a system you can work with the mechanics while being easy to create a character within 10-20 minutes.
>>33333282so you...Your system is all about rules lawyering.... tldr.
>>33333250So, if they had used some grief seeds on Sayaka's soul gem to make it shiny bright, would it have been the equivalent of her tripping in the happy happy land? Because soul gem reflects mental state, and because it is bright after fed grief seeds, Sayaka cannot be in despair?
>>33333339It's a spiral.Soul Gems are a bit like depressions in that way. Depressions on their own are just "huh, I don't feel anything anymore". But then it stays that way for a while and you go crazy and start a downward spiral.Think of it more like getting a good night's sleep on an issue that really bothers you. It still exists the next day, but you are seeing it more positively.
>>33333374In the end though it mechanically presents a binary choice. Either Sayaka cannot turn into a witch because her soul gem is bright; or she turns into a witch while having a shiny white soul gem.
>>33333141Heavy spoiler territory here, read with caution.There's a lot of factors behind Sayaka's transformation. At the same time though the show, well, shows there's more than just not restoring your soul gem that effects this. We see Sayaka turn into a witch because she didn't care for herself. We see Madoka turn into a witch because she used up too much power killing walpurgisnacht. We see Homura turn into a witch because she fell into despair and didn't know whether or not Madoka was real. Again we see Magi with broken bodies just healing themselves. Kyubey himself says magi can restore a exploded heart as long as their soul gem is intact. Thus no stamina =/= death. It appears no magic = death, despair = witch. At the same time, no magic could = witch anyway. So death in battle in this system was created so if you overdo it you can end up killing yourself, or dying to a particularly nasty bite while your body is in no position to defend your soul gem (why health is termed stamina instead of, well, health.)>>33333210We dont really know how long Mami was a magical girl. [spoilers]We see Homura still lose against Homura in a fair 1 on 1.[/spoilers]Kyoko and Mami were pretty equal but Mami clearly had a edge. She was very good when it comes to being a magi, which showed when she took out Kyoko and disabled Homura within a second span during one of the timelines. Levels tend to get imbalanced when higher levels are brought into the equation. While original this system was only going to have 5 levels, upon testing I decided to up it to 10 to, well, give a more clear gap in strength from when a player first started to playing the game and when they are taking on walpurgisnacht. Give Magi that are in it for power to have a goal, and the means to become more powerful than the rest.
>>33332510>d20You are a faggot.If you want to make a homebrew, the choice are as such in the order from best to worst: d6 > d10 > d8 > d20 > other dice.
>>33333404Not exactly. Your mental state likely effects the maximum brightness.
>>33333431I would say a drain effect makes more sense.The gem always drains to keep your body alive (what about food?), but negative emotions increase the drain.If you want to be more optimistic, you can make a counter-effect from really good emotions. Like, you regain some purity from the after-battle high or because you feel like you managed to actually do something of importance.Actually, that's another factor that you might take from WoD. The willpower system is similar in that regard - You determine your personality and then get points back for fullfilling your personality. Like, a lazy person spending a day as a couch potato.
>>33333276D&D levels only become absurd between 10-20 where shit hits the fan. Thus my system is made so that leveling slows down greatly at level 5 and the chances of becoming level 10 costly but rewarding. >>33333305So you... would rather a system without a single rule in it. The system is about figuring out how you can do things, not as strict as something like D&D but not as you tell the gm you can do this because clam chowder is delicious.
>>33333423>We dont really know how long Mami was a magical girl.Actually, we have a rough idea. I am trying to recall the exact source, but something mentions that she was only a magical girl for a few months before Madoka shows up on the scene.> She was very good when it comes to being a magi, which showed when she took out Kyoko and disabled Homura within a second span during one of the timelines.Because a surprise attack is a clear indicator of relative power scale. It's not that Mami managed to catch both of them unaware, and blow away Kyoko's soul gem before she could react. Also I'd point out that she likely eliminated Kyoko first because Kyoko is actually a serious threat.I'd also point out that with a level mechanic, that scene could not have happened. Kyoko would have had too much HP.Also, since we're talking levels and that scene.>Bind trick works on earlier timeline Homura.>Homura resets time a WHOLE FUCKING LOT after that.>Bind trick STILL works on Homura. >Who after grinding, should be a higher level, with a higher reflex save.Also, as another anon points out. Relative powerlevel is determined at creation, not by experience. Strength of wish + Strength of soul = power level. Experience represents nothing more than how effective you are at using it.
>>33333469>D&D levels only become absurd between 10-20 where shit hits the fan. Thus my system is made so that leveling slows down greatly at level 5 and the chances of becoming level 10 costly but rewarding.It's still really fucking extreme.That's simply not how real-world skill progression works. And Madoka is a down-to-earth setting.Limiting it to five levels is nice and all, but most values should never increase. Stamina might get a minor boost after the first half year or so of magical girl life (I wonder how fit experienced magical girls look... I'm not a fan of musclegirls, but some serious fitness is definitely not negative) and health might get a minor increase due to the girls learning to optimize their bodies, but generally you will have a very flat progression.It makes more sense to have progression in specific aspects, instead of flat-out levelling up.
>>33333469I think you're misunderstanding the objection.A game based around heavy and hard set rules does not lend itself well to whimsy. And for all its dark themes and tragic events, Madoka is a whimsical series.Heavily defined rules are not conducive to whimsical behavior. Having a system that can determine success/failure based on factors is almost necessary to ensure some semblance of it being a game.
>>33332612The worst part about D20 is that it has no bellcurve. When you have things like dice pool systems like in the Storyteller system as an alternative, D20 just feels weird and clunky.
>>33333488>Experience represents nothing more than how effective you are at using it.Exactly.For Madoka, you want a two-tier system.Base stats and modifier stats (aka skills). Base stats never change, in contrast to what D20 does.Skills would actually progress and show the character's progression. A character can get either horizontal or vertical progression, depending on what their focus is. Like, for example, Homura levelled her power skill (abusing her time stop) for a while, but then started a horizontal progression to explosive making and gunner skills.
>>33333541As a fan of Storyteller, I'd tell you to stop being so high and mighty.The probability distribution in Storyteller is FUBAR, even if it's quite enjoyable and some supposed weaknesses are strength in my view. (Like failures at higher levels being more likely to be botches, because the likelyhood of failures in general goes down)
>>33333557That works a hell of a lot better than a level system where you get good at everything all at once because you killed enough witches.
>>33333431>>33333404>>33333339>>33333374The way I saw it (and the way the PSP game portrayed it, at least) is that soul gems don't completely reflect a person's emotional/mental state on a 1-to-1 basis; it goes more toward the rate of decay.Becoming magically stronger also results in a faster rate of decay, just not quite so dramatically. The idea is that as a magi grows stronger, she has to burn through more magic to use her skills, and thus burns through her soul gem faster- that's another way that Kyubey's system is stacked against magical girls. Those who survive for too long, and grow stronger than their area's grief seed supply can support, are just as prone to witching out as those who fall to despair (basically a less dramatic version of Madoka's instant witch-out whenever she contracts).In either of those cases, patching up a soul gem with grief seeds would work in the short term, but it wouldn't do anything to stop it from darkening too quickly. Purifying Sayaka's soul gem while she was spiraling into insanity probably would have delayed her turning into a witch, but it would only have fixed the symptom, not the underlying problem.
>>33333488Homura was a magi for only a few months, but she was always with others until the most recent couple time loops. Mami and Kyoko on the other hand were alone and had to become stronger to survive. Surprise attack, called shot soul gem. Reduced hit chance thanks to small target, increased hit chance to compensate as she's taken by surprise. Automatic critical strikes and instant killing of a defenseless target does exist. Of course the latter is a bit BS on a player of a game unless the person royally fucked up. Also reflex save is still a roll, still a chance of failure. She failed her reflex roll ,quite simple. Higher reflex =/= guaranteed chance of evasion. Also to take into account difference in powers of a magi's wishes, there are unique powers and abilities that come only from the wish itself that are being termed primary powers. As in my copy before, there 4 sets of powers. Standard which all magi have. General which all magi could potentially learn and get. Secondary that's unque to help give each magi a unique style, and finally primary to reflect unique powers magi have based on their wish. There isn't a power barrier as in the stronger you get the stronger spells that do more damage you get to unlock. Most of the powers are quite flavorful actually, and just as useful at level 10 than at level 1. The levels reflect the magi becoming more experience, quicker, and well more lethal. Honestly you can't compare the original timeline homura to being just as good and lethal to a final timeline homura.
>>33333869>Becoming magically stronger also results in a faster rate of decay, just not quite so dramatically. The idea is that as a magi grows stronger, she has to burn through more magic to use her skills, and thus burns through her soul gem faster- that's another way that Kyubey's system is stacked against magical girls. Those who survive for too long, and grow stronger than their area's grief seed supply can support, are just as prone to witching out as those who fall to despair (basically a less dramatic version of Madoka's instant witch-out whenever she contracts).But that's boring.I'd chalk it up to the girls being more liberal with their application of magic, because they know how much they can use.The same thing happens to me in vidja all the time. I start off hoarding ammo and grenades, until I learn the pace of restocks. Then I get more and more comfortable with making constant use of the stuff, to minimize my downtimes of not having grenades and ammo.If you are new, you'll likely summon one sword and try to save your energy to murderfuck the witch.Once you are more experienced, you learn how to summon a few dozen swords to pin down the witch and then a big one to finish it off, which is far more efficient but takes far more energy.But I'm also a big fan of soul gem and emotional status having effect on each other - Be happy and you'll get reduced tainting. Be *really* happy and even lose some taint.Be depressed and you gain more taint than usual.Have lots of taint and you start thinking in negative circles. Clean your soul gem and suddenly everything seems not as bad as you thought.
>>33333869For this I originally had as your magi becomes increasingly emotionally unstable, your Hope score decreases, and when you ran out of hope you became a witch. Unfortunately while neat in concept, it proved really not fun for the players as they were penalized for story. Instead I decided to make it into a separate despair attribute that accumulates besides your hope, and when it's too much then you turn into a witch. Losing hope was really neat in idea but just didn't work in practice as magi ended up being forced to do less and less in combat, and couldn't do fun little things with their magic to get themselves in and out of shenanigans. Heading out soon, might only make another post or 2.
>>33333920>There isn't a power barrier as in the stronger you get the stronger spells that do more damage you get to unlock. Most of the powers are quite flavorful actually, and just as useful at level 10 than at level 1.But that's not how Madoka magic works.Mami's guns were just creative applications of her ribbons.If you really want to use levels, let them level their magic and skills, not their base values.
>>33333789It became a point that the girls thoguht Homura was just interested in hoarding grief seeds because she just wanted to become more powerful. So it's obvious the amount of grief seeds = the more power. While this is implied she'd just restore her soul gem as it darkens throughout a battle, that's a bit boring and not very physical and immediately noticeable. Why I made it so soul gems = experience, to reflect the power gain rather than simply longevity. At the same time Kyoko mentions its pointless to kill a stray familiar as it does nothing for them. Made it feel there was something more to it than simply training as well. Thus the mechanics in the system reflects that. Finalyl we see Homura only trying to use 1 soul gem while fighting walprugis. What happened to the others? Perhaps magi can siphon power and grow stronger from that.
>>33334105>Made it feel there was something more to it than simply training as well.Well, yes, it's a net gain of taint as familiars don't have grief seeds.>Finalyl we see Homura only trying to use 1 soul gem while fighting walprugis. What happened to the others? Perhaps magi can siphon power and grow stronger from that.Looks like girls can fight for quite a while before they get so tainted that they'd use a Soul Gem.Also, how do you abstract loss of hunting grounds, which means loss of new grief seeds? EXP loss?
>>33333920>Homura was a magi for only a few monthsNever stated. We have no idea how long Homura was groundhog-daying it up.I want to throw this one out there, because it's never made clear: Homura could be 30. We legitimately have no way of determining how long she was in her time loop.>Honestly you can't compare the original timeline homura to being just as good and lethal to a final timeline homura.Sure. But this was largely due to knowledge of her abilities and mindset.Final timeline Homura isn't actually more powerful than initial timeline Homura BECAUSE IN THE MADOKAVERSE YOUR MAXIMUM POWER IS DETERMINED UPON THE CREATION OF YOUR SOUL GEM. She just has a greater understanding of how magic works and her own limits.Initial timeline Homura has the same abilities as final timeline Homura. Everything final Homura does, Initial Homura could have done as well. The difference is not in regards to getting more powerful, it's in regards to understanding how to magical girl.
>>33334145>Never stated. We have no idea how long Homura was groundhog-daying it up.We do know that it was a fucklong time, considering Madoka's power progression with each timeline (The second to last we saw was "planet size", while the last one was "rewrites the universe") and that there's at least one spin-off that takes place during an anomalous timeline.On that note, it's likely that Homura meets Oriko in every timeline, to check if she needs to be murdered.That might be quite a grudge that is contained in Valhalla right now.Homura also refers to countless magical girls that she saw dieing, which implies at least one hundred loops. And each loop lasts about two weeks.As for Homura being more powerful... Semantics.She is more powerful in the sense that she's more experienced and thus completely obliterates her original version. Especially as original Homura had no attack methods.
>>33334195According to the numbers, 400 loops would already be enough to make her about 30 years old. It would amount to 15 years.And she never left puberty during that time. Imagine the horror.
>>33334105>So it's obvious the amount of grief seeds = the more power.No, you retard.More grief seeds = more use of magic and/or longer life expectancy.>At the same time Kyoko mentions its pointless to kill a stray familiar as it does nothing for them.Again. You're a fucking moron because Kyoko's ramble explains WHY it's pointless to kill a familiar (not a stray. Fuck you, if you're going to make a game based on an IP, you should be using the right terminology.) A familiar does not have a grief seed, therefore, by killing a familiar, you are expending a resource (darkening your soul gem) and not seeing any return (soul gem to relieve darkness in your soul gem.) She's telling Sayaka in her own abrasive way that it's better to not risk burning yourself out over something that's not going to let you recover.To give you an analogy. Is it wise for a hunter to expend calories hunting an animal that they cannot eat? Because that's what that entire conversation is about.>Finally we see Homura only trying to use 1 soul gem BECAUSE YOU ONLY EVER GET ONE SOUL GEM YOU MASSIVE RETARDI assume you mean grief seed. At which point, yes, we only see her pull out one. Entirely possible that this is the only one she had on her person at the time, having expended herself previously preparing for this event.
>>33332510>a game where everybody is a loli lichfuck yessshhh
>>33334011The muskets =/= ribbons even if she could form them out of ribbons. Magi can create their weapons however to look whatever they want. Mami uses a musket, which doesn't appear more effective than madoka's bow like it should. That's because their weapons are entirely magical based and just a tool for them to excerpt their magical power. At the same time Homura was weak and didn't have much ability when it came to magic power. So I have also actual real world weapons in the game the magi could potentially use which are static and have nothing to do with a magi's power, but not exactly the easiest for a middle school girl to get a hold of and use without drawing a lot of attention. >>33334141Loss of hunting grounds = loss of ability to fight witches. Handled in game that means you're not getting strong as fast. Slap a time limit with walprugisnacht coming in 30 days and the test group began very aggressively fighting against other girls and trying to set up territory. >>33334145We saw Homura do it, about 4 or time lines if i remember right, so not THAT many months. Each timeline they went from beginning to end and showed how each time it came to the same conclusion leading up to the beginning of the first episode.Also yes, there are magi that are stronger than others from the get go. Thus why you roll for stats. Those with lower stats have lower overall potential than someone who rolls max for each stat, and this system it's only 1d6 per stat (there being 5 stats.) >>33334195There isn't a massive gap between level 1 and level 10 in my system though it's clearly there as players SHOULD be better after going through a lot of shit, than magi freshly out of the incubators belly. Though there are anomalies where magi are stronger from creation than others, thus why we roll for attributes with 1d6 each, and the maximum you can ever raise a attribute to is only 9. >>33334227I like how you argue a few words in a sentence than what i actual said.
>>33334259>Loss of hunting grounds = loss of ability to fight witches. Handled in game that means you're not getting strong as fast. Slap a time limit with walprugisnacht coming in 30 days and the test group began very aggressively fighting against other girls and trying to set up territory.You aren't making a Madoka game.You are making a Madoka TV boss rush mode.
>>33334195No. Not semantics. Because in this case, where we're talking about rhetorical power levels to actual, literal power levels, this shit matters.Yes, Final Homura could DEMOLISH Original Homura. Wipe the floor with her 99% of the time (as there likely is that one percent where OH timestops first and happens to smash FH's soul gem with a golf club.) This has little to do with her being inherently more powerful than her formal self and more knowing how to apply that power. There is no difference in level, as per a D&D mechanic. There is a difference in knowledge and mentality which cannot accurately be conveyed in levels.
>>33334259>We saw Homura do it, about 4 or time lines if i remember right, so not THAT many months.I'm starting to wonder if you are genuinely autistic.The entire show was built on the implication that she saw Madoka die far more than five times. Not to mention the spinoff manga that takes place during a sixth timeline.
>>33334291>No. Not semantics. Because in this case, where we're talking about rhetorical power levels to actual, literal power levels, this shit matters.I was only mentioning a potential miscommunication issue that might crop up with OP. Because he seems to be taking everything way too literally.
>>33334259God, you're a fucking massive retard.I only replied to those few words because I was addressing the entire point of your post, rather than doing a word by word analysis of how fucking thick your skull is.>We saw Homura do it, about 4 or time lines if i remember right, so not THAT many months. We also hear her describing watching it countless times. Four is not countless, it's four. We only SEE four, but the implications hint at far more than four timelines.>Also yes, there are magi that are stronger than others from the get go. I like how your reading comprehension is so fucking terrible that you missed the entire point of that sentence and went on some inane bullshit about rolling stats.THE POINTS IS NOT THAT THERE IS A DESPARITY IN POWER LEVEL BETWEEN, SAY, MADOKA AND SAYAKA. THE POINT IS THAT WHEN A MAGICAL GIRL IS CREATED, SHE IS AT HER MAXIMUM LEVEL OF POWER. SHE CANNOT GROW MORE POWERFUL. THEREFORE, A LEVEL MECHANIC DOES NOT WORK BECAUSE YOU ALREADY START AT YOUR MAXIMUM MAGICAL POTENTIAL.All caps so you won't somehow magically miss the fucking point this time, you chromosome abundant dipshit.
>>33333521Whimsy isn't really the word I'd use for a show about despair, suicide, euthanasia, wish minmaxing, infinite power loops, farming bajillions of explosives, and timestop abuse. In fact, that sounds -exactly- like 3.x.
>>33334363>THE POINTS IS NOT THAT THERE IS A DESPARITY IN POWER LEVEL BETWEEN, SAY, MADOKA AND SAYAKA. THE POINT IS THAT WHEN A MAGICAL GIRL IS CREATED, SHE IS AT HER MAXIMUM LEVEL OF POWER. SHE CANNOT GROW MORE POWERFUL. THEREFORE, A LEVEL MECHANIC DOES NOT WORK BECAUSE YOU ALREADY START AT YOUR MAXIMUM MAGICAL POTENTIAL.We don't particularly know that or have too much of a reason to believe that. I don't really know what kind of viewer would interpret that Homura didn't have some huge across the board progression.
>>33334278Honestly the resolution of the campaign can be done without gaining a single level. Like in the show, defeating walpurgisnacht in direct battle isn't how they're going to win. >>33334291Level is being used mostly in term of experience, the magi figuring out what they can do, unlcoking a few new powers, having more stamina, etc. It's more of a abstract concept in my game. Like I said the maximum difference between a person who's level 10 and a level 1 who rolled well is literally 3 points. The attributes are decided through 1d6 roll with a maximum of 9 into any attribute at level 10. You guys are acting like I'm doing DBZ levels when I repeatedly say and show samples from the system that gives very little difference between starting strength and ending strength. >>33334363Read above and look at the samples of the system than think the difference between a bottom level and top level in my system is the same as a level 1 and a level 20 in D&D. Like I said, maximum 10 levels, and maximum 9 attribute points in any skill when you can start with 6 if you happen to be a lucky magi. Anyway brb again, still tinkering with the insides of a computer.
I feel like this needs to be said. The creator of the Madoka series commented that the number of loops that Homu did was approaching 100. Also, every loop was 1 month in time and Homu was close to 22 years old by the end of the final timeline.>>33333557You, I like you and your idea.
>>33333521>Madoka is a whimsical seriesthe first chapter and the intro areeverything else is about people suiciding at the command of witches and loli zombies with magic powers fighting them only to later become them, all the while some amoral aliens farm their souls for ansgt
>d20 sperging>PMMM spergingMy god...
>>33334493>Honestly the resolution of the campaign can be done without gaining a single level. Like in the show, defeating walpurgisnacht in direct battle isn't how they're going to win.So you are doing a retarded bait and switch that can only be resolved by people who know the show.Wonderful.>>33334494>You, I like you and your idea.It's basically Storyteller, just slightly modified.Nice to know that it was a month and not two weeks. 100 loops would add about 8 years.>>33334499>loli zombies14 isn't loli. And Mami is definitely not loli.
>>33334564ok then, teen zombies
>>33334514It's like Cutie G assembled because there's no thread up.
>>33334583God(dess) help us all.
>>33334494Good point. Still Mami apparently had a higher potential than Homura did, we could assume they're both max level and Homura simply didn't cut it. Still their level of powers seems pretty similar. >>33334564... It's a system created that's literally NAMED after the show. I did post the cover page, it's kinda the target demographics. Posting the cover page again in case you missed it? Also defeating Walpurgis is indeed a final oh shit option.
>>33334697>... It's a system created that's literally NAMED after the show. I did post the cover page, it's kinda the target demographics. Posting the cover page again in case you missed it?A system named after a show normally exists to allow people to play in the setting, not to retread the show.
>>33334564It's also a system that doesn't have to follow the show. You can make your own teen lich adventures.
>>33334759Not retreading the show except for using Walpurgisnacht and a time limit. The true way to win is figuring out why Walpurgis is coming in the first place.The setting used in the city of Mokushi where shortly after the first girls become magi, they are stopped by a magi (Kazuki) who warns that walpurgisnacht is coming in 30 days. She's planning how to deal with it but needs their help. Instead of giving the grief seeds to a kyubey figure (this settings version is Aetir), they're to give it to her once they cannot purify their soul gems with it any longer.Meanwhile there are local experienced magi bullying the girls and getting into a turf war while using their powers for fun. Earning the place on news, being chased by cops, breaking into banks and all the good stuff. All the while there's now 1 week remaining, humans are seeing a super storm out at sea, but by the looks of it, it should miss. About to throw in a dark Magical Girl who wished for the death of her little brother who she felt was a whiney brat hogging all the attention, and is serious a twisted lil 10 year old. Eager to see how they'll handle a Magi who can kill their parents upon uttering a single command, and blackmailing them for their grief seeds.
>>33334487Kyuubey outright states it.And while Kyuubey is deceptive, he never actually lies. Everything he tells you is true, even though the information is not presented honestly (such as omitting information.) This is part of his character, and what makes him such a bastard. He told you the truth, but he still deceived you by only telling you PART of the deal.So yes, we DO know that, because it's outright stated>>33334493And you're performing some amazing mental gymnastics. Congratulations, you've impressed the Russian Judges.The point I'm trying to make is that there IS NO GROWTH IN POWER AS A MAGICAL GIRL. YOUR IDEA OF GROWING FROM A SIX TO A NINE CONTRADICTS THE STATED MECHANICS OF THE MADOKAVERSE.IN A GAME THAT IS EXPRESSLY SET IN THE MADOKAVERSE.ARE YOU SEEING THE PROBLEM YET?!
>>33334470>>33334499See. You've made the mistake of thinking whimsy has to be happy.Whimsical can be horrifying. Fairies that make you dance yourself to death by wearing your legs to stumps and then making you bleed out are still whimsical.Whimsical does not mean happy. While they're often associated, once does not require the other.The series is full of whimsy, but it's whimsy existing in a world of tragedy and despair.
>>33334697>Still Mami apparently had a higher potential than Homura didSource, please.Also, potential is realized upon wish.
>>33335207>Kyuubey outright states it.Their magical power doesn't increase, the degree to which they use it effectively certainly can. There's a world of difference between a nerdy 14 year old with time stop and few clues and a fanatical 22 year old self trained type, with a greatly improved physique (to the point of corrected vision), and especially with regards to a timing/skill based power set.Madoka is probably the wrong setting for a conventional RPG though, as the progression works in an utterly ass backwards way.
>>33335364It's canon that she used her magic to correct her vision and heart problems.
>>33335207Honestly you must really hate Magical Burst too.Originally the system didn't have levels, but surprise surprise, no one wants to play a game for 3 months and have their character no better than when they first created it.The leveling system is an abstract concept experience, now a power levels in dbz kind of deal. It's here so you can see how your character is getting better at taking a hit in a way that wont mutilate them, how they're more precise with their strikes and able to maximize their damage. Now if you going to kill something, in character say "oh yeah I just leveled up and with my new point in skills I got this awesome new spell" unless the system makes it impossible for you to do that, I'm sorry but I think that's a issue with how you play more than any system.
>>33335257I don't consider whimsy = happy.Child soul based fuel, save scumming and inventory scumming, and bizarre forms of level grinding don't strike me as particularly whimsical.The grimdark fairy tale would be more along the lines of wishes that screw over the wisher via monkey paw type effect. Don't tell me Sayaka was screwed over by her wish. I don't see anything whimsical in the grimdark fairy tale sense.Of course, one could consider RPGs in general to have naturally whimsical mechanics I guess, and PMMM is extremely mechanics-oriented (albeit in the direction opposite from making it a normal RPG).
>>33335387considering her body is basically an accesory that seems easy to do
>>33335364>Greatly improved physiqueTechnically, the only thing about her physique that has improved is her vision, which required her expending magic.She's not any stronger or faster. She just has the mental knowledge that she can ignore things. To the end, she is not stronger, she just knows that the condition that was making her weak is something that can be ignored because pain and physical exhaustion aren't real to her any more.But yes, there is a difference between original Homu and endgame Homu. Endgame Homu knows way fucking more about herself, her powers, weaponry, being a magical girl etc than starter Homu. But the point is that Homura never become a more potent magical girl. Her power level, as far as actually being a magical girl, remains the same.This is why a level system does not work. Because a level system demands she grow more potent as a magical girl, which is not what happens. She has the exact same "power level" from start to finish. She becomes better at making use of it.
>>33335015>a kyubey figure ( this settings version is Aetir)topFUCKING>KEK!They are all QB. They are all puppets of a single...alien. He is the only one on the planet. It's like you didn't even do any actual research and only watched the show.
>>33335482ok then how about we start by defining a maximum power level for each magical girl at the moment of their contract, based on the nature of the contract/wish and some intrinsic attributes of the girlthen, he define the starting capacity of that girl to use her powers, if she had range practice, martial arts hobby or something else not only would her powers be related to that but she would also have a bit of an edge in stuff related to sharpshooting or meleeas she ages she accumulates angst, introduced by event the GM brings and affected with how the player roleplays the girlhowever, as she ages the player also has the chance to investigate into the nature of magical girls, thus learning more about it an his/her character's own poweror to specifically train the girl in some wayalways toward reaching the power level peak, never surprassing itlike in WoD, where there is no way you can get like 60 willpower, except in our system the caps are defined at the moment of contract
>>33335391>Honestly you must really hate Magical Burst too.Apples and oranges. But no, I enjoyed Magical Burst despite some of its mechanical failures. But I'll cover why this is irrelevant.>Originally the system didn't have levels, but surprise surprise, no one wants to play a game for 3 months and have their character no better than when they first created it.And the rewrite that brought in levels (and classes) is fucking terrible. But that's little to do with themes and more to do with it genuinely being badly designed. Also, there were forms of character progression in the original game, so you actually did get better.>The leveling system is an abstract concept experience, now a power levels in dbz kind of deal. It's here so you can see how your character is getting better at taking a hit in a way that wont mutilate them, how they're more precise with their strikes and able to maximize their damage. Correct. However, part of the leveling system you designed is an increase in magical potency, which conflicts canon.>Now if you going to kill something, in character say "oh yeah I just leveled up and with my new point in skills I got this awesome new spell" unless the system makes it impossible for you to do that, I'm sorry but I think that's a issue with how you play more than any system.Why hello Strawman, how are you today.As for why this argument doesn't apply to magical burst:Magical Burst is not set expressly in the madokaverse. While it takes inspiration from Madoka, it isn't saying "This game is 100% based on Madoka, and is meant to accurately portray being a magical girl in the madokverse."This is why you are being criticized. Because your game design conflicts canon of the universe you're using.
Why not have higher levels just learning new techs and, rather than increasing magic usage, you increase in management of it? Like spells that would use up much more at a lower level would use less at a higher level. You'd still have the same Magic Cap but you'd just be better at utilizing it.
>>33335741it could also define athletics and how you could enhance them with magicperhaps right of the bat the girls is a good runner, but like you said could burn a lot of Magic to dash quite fast, although losing maneuverability. then possible upgrade include reaching her speed limit, being more maneuverable, using less magic to do thatThe Magic Capand her maximum possible speed limit are set and do no change
>>33335207>he never actually lies.>wakarimasen lol>thermodynamicsFuck you. He lies his ass off when he's asked direct questions.He just tends to be comparably honest when it comes to non-critical information. Like the fact that magical potential is based on karma.
>>33335391>Honestly you must really hate Magical Burst too.I do.Note how no one mentioned TAKING OUT PROGRESSION.We are talking about MAKING PROGRESSION SENSIBLE IN THE CONTEXT OF THE SETTING, which means PROGRESSING YOUR SKILLS, NOT YOUR STATS.
>>33336108Please give an example of lying outright rather than by omission please.Also, the girls don't get to choose how their powers manifest, do the players choose how their characters powers manifest? Also, how does character creation work. Is the wish already made and put into their back story, or do they describe their back story and then you tell them when QB tries to make a contract with them and from then on they play?
>>33335466She does it at the beginning of every timeline, except the first one or two.
>>33336108Except those aren't examples of him lying. Those are examples of him not telling the whole truth.Give a solid example of when he actually says something that's not true.
>>33333517>magical musclegirlsheh. i sort of doubt it's physical. doubt if it's determined either way by canon, but i'd imagine you have a "you think that's air you're breathing?" scenario. once you're in magishape, i doubt it's the strength of your muscles that determines how fast you can move.
>>33336194>Please give an example of lying outright rather than by omission please.90% of all instances of "I have no idea". Multiple times he flat-out says that he doesn't know something that he actually knows.And his thermodynamics explanation was just pure bullshit.There's also the preaching scene about humans being cattle. I feel that he's likely to have spouted lies in that one, but I'd need to rewatch it to find out.Power manifestation is best done by making the DM interpret the wish according to the character's backstory.
>>33336298I would wager that natural muscles, fuelled by food, allow for quite a bit of taint minimization, as they are a mundane way of increasing their combat power without spending even a little bit of magic.
>>33336316>And his thermodynamics explanation was just pure bullshit.not saying that kiubey is not a lying whore, but please be reminded that the inconsistencies with science concepts in any work of fiction can be the result of the author(s) being ignorant and not hiring a science consultant
>>33336263>Give a solid example of when he actually says something that's not true.Sorry, but I don't have the time to wade through twelve episodes to find the lines that actually have him lying.I only remember rewatching the show and thinking "what an asshole" when he lies about things that are later explained.
>>33336391AFAIK he never lies directly.he omits alot though. he is never asked directly about any of the things that commonly happen to magical grills, what the survival rate is, or about how soul gems function in detail. certainly, alot of what he says is unverifiable. his explanation of the magical grill ----> witch = energy thing, for instance. maybe he just really hates girls after being rejected in kyubey middle school or something.
would you cuddle a kyubey?
>>33336316After consulting the wiki and Google on this, I have found one example of him outright lying. He says that he is incapable of manipulating humans. That is a lie, because he is manipulating them all throughout the series.I apologize to you and all others that think he lies, I was mistaken, but so are you. He only lies once in the entire series, so this means he is capable of lying, though that may not be a lie from his view point in that he doesn't manipulate humans, but rather he manipulated magical girls which he doesn't see as human anymore, though this is purely speculation.
>>33336391You're right. He IS an asshole. He's deceptive and manipulative.But he never actually LIES. That's the important thing. All the information he gives you is correct.The thing is that he doesn't tell you everything. He omits, obfuscates and downplays information that he thinks will make you not do what he wants.Everything he says is true. It's just given to you in a very dishonest way.
>>33336688See >>33336663This disproves the "he's the paragon of half-truths" thing.
>>33336663>>33336703Actually, in that episode, he says he doesn't lie to them (as per the official translation)What he says, and I quote:We aren't able to comprehend what you mean by "tricking." Why is it that when humans regret a decision based on a misunderstanding they feel resentment toward the other party?So yeah, no, Kyubey never says he doesn't mislead them. He says he doesn't understand the human concept of trickery.
>>33336958...I may have to start a collection of wakarimasen screenshots.
>>33337001>Look at how weeb I am
>>33333920>>33334145>>never statedgen said about 100 loops. Homura is a bad ass. and is at least a good handful of years older than her peers.
>>33334145>Never stated. We have no idea how long Homura was groundhog-daying it up.Word of god is around 100 times.
>>33339947Yes. Thank you. It's only the third time that someone answered this, including the dude above you.Stop it with the stealth bumps.