All previous threads are archived, just search for 'Mourning Sons'.Obligatory:During the so-called ‘Cursed’ 21st Founding in the 36th Millennium, after the now destroyed planet Inculaba yielded mysteries still unknown to the majority of the Imperium, the 999th Space Marine Chapter was founded. In stark contrast to the other cursed Chapters, which have been plagued with gruesome mutations, often forcing the hand of the Inquisition, this particular Chapter was only disadvantaged with a faulty Occulobe. This fault meant that the eye and Occulobe implant would only work as normal with extra fluid; which in turn led the bodies of the Marines to overcompensate and produce more tears and as such, gave the Marines a constant look of sadness and sorrow.Thus, the Mourning Sons were born.Please note, that this is not the Crybaby marines, nor is it emo-wankery or anime bullshit. The Marines main ability is that they are perceptive, the more experienced among them gain the ability to perceive things on a completely different level, and as such are able to see the real misery and suffering of the galaxy in the state that it's in.
Do you have any new write faggotry OP?I didn't read the previous thread because it wasn't made by you.
>>24456795Oh hey, you're back earlier than expected. The previous thread had a lot of good art produced.
>>24456795Some fluff, I will eventually get around to putting all this together into a couple of paragraphs, but for now it's just greentext.>999th Chapter>Progenitors are Alpha Legion - we feel the need to make up for our Traitor brethren.>Fleet based Chapter>Faulty Occulobe - needs more tears to function properly, not full on blubbering, just constant stream of tears down the face.>Advantages of Occulobe - all Brothers can perceive things much clearer, new recruits can pick up on body language like an expert, older and more experience fighters can use this information in conjuction with their skill to determine the opponents (and the armies) fighitng style. Chaplains have the ability to peer into someones mind/soul and see their true nature.>Due to the Chaplains abilities, we recruit anyone who has strong enough moral fibre.>Figure of Legend - Brother Jeremiah, during a battle fought against Chaos he witnessed a cultist with truly brilliant potential, and caused him to weep tears of fire (will be fluffed out).>9 Companies - based on emotions each Company Captain saw in the eyes of Jeremiah after the fire incident.>10th Company is a massive support unit, comprising of scouts and Dreadnoughts and the like.>Dreadnoughts, as their eyes are useless in the Sarcophagi, are all assisted by 2 Scouts each.>We get on well with the Mechanicus due to our fleets needs, and we get on well with the Salamanders due to our stance on civilians.>We don't get on well with the most of the Inquisition, some of the more radical members like us.I have just done a quick paint of the armor, I think I've nailed the 'bronze' colour we were going for.
>>24456843I'll be posting a little bit later on.>>24456875I checked out the other threads earlier, which is where I got the OP pic, it was glorious so I had to use it. I think we should have the Chapter information on the left hand side of it.
>>24456895Darker grey would probably look better, but yeah, this is pretty solid. I wouldn't describe the mutation as "constant streams of tears", it's more that there's always that thin trail of moisture that 's left behind as a tear rolls down your face. People are going to overexaggerate based on that phrasing.
Misc:Notable Figures so far:>Chapter Master Fovus>Brother Jeremiah, the Silent Arbiter/Weeping Prophet>Venerable Dreadnought Plutus>New recruits are called 'The Blind'>We may have vision quests to ascend to higher ranksMisc Speech>You ask why we weep for heretics neophyte?>We weep with sorrow, for the men they could have been>We weep with rage, for the suffering they inflict in their heresy>We weep with joy, for through our hands they will sin no more>We weep for ourselves, for the cruel justice we must dispense>Emperor protect us allI'll sort out the Company layout and post it now.
>We still need Company names and solid Captain names as well.>Companies are kind of based on the emotions that each Captain saw in the now-mute Jeremiah's eyes.>Suffering, anger, pity, grief, guilt, dissapointment, happiness, passion, fear.First Company, normally the purview of Terminators and high technology, instead voluntarily relinquishes their gear, taking only the most battered and damaged items so that their brothers may have better. They fight armed with faith alone, and rely not on material things. The Second Company prefers to use the heaviest stuff. It is they who inherit the Terminator armor meant for First, and it is the Second that lead the charge, teleporting into combat, Assault Terminators all, letting their endless wrath cut a swathe from their enemies' flesh.3rd Company are our diplomats. They remain aboard the fleet most of the time, coordinating both inter-chapter elements, the population aboard the large fleet, the people of the planets we visit to recruit from, and any Imperial emissaries we meet. 4th Company..... is kind of hard to write for. Probably they are the ones who undertake to hold the ground that has been burned and cleansed, laboring after the battle to rebuild what was destroyed.
>>244570455th Company is always at the leading edge of the fight, they ride aboard our advance vessels, seeking enemies to crush and allies to save, driven by the guilt they feel. 6th company are our teachers, our re-educators, our personal trainers. They remember Jeremiah's disappointment and are relentless among the chapter in trying to whip people into shape that they may not disappoint the Emperor again. they also are well known for having some of the best eyes in the chapter, for they are always seeking out flaws to eliminate in both friend and foe.7th Company are the ones who work among the people on a personal level. 3rd company may be better negotiators, 4th company may be the ones who wear sackcloth as they rebuild a burned city, but it is 7th company that tends to take the time to comfort the weeping child, to console the parent who has lost their own, and to reunite families split by war.
>>244570788th company is practically a company of Chaplains. Every one of them is a priest of the faith, for the Mourning Sons have seen that even though most Space Marines revere the Emperor as a father and not a god, Jeremiah showed them that the Emperor's love for them is indeed worthy of a god, and he shall be treated as such. The 8th covers their armor in holy writ, carefully selected to present the Emperor's kind and loving side rather than his wrathful nature. Some have accused 8th of hypocrisy, especially when they destroy cultists with incredible fervor, but the men of the 8th know that the Emperor's love is only for the faithful, not for traitors. The ninth represents fear, for though Imperial propaganda would tell you otherwise, even Astartes can be afraid. The coming dark looms large, but the truest test, when the chips are down, is whether or not the chapter will stand with the Emperor even when all hope seems lost and fear grips them by the throat and begins to strangle. These marines embrace the edge of fear, reminding themselves that they too may die, and that they must ensure that at all times their duty is done. The 9th squad often operates the dangerous role of aerospace superiority piloting. The brothers inside their Thunderhawks may rest easy, knowing that the skilled pilots of the 9th will read the battle around them with a practiced eye, and brave fearful antiaircraft fire to get them all to ground. After all, for an Astartes, what could be more terrifying than to be shot from the air by an errant AA shell or laser, never having landed to do the Emperor's duty? The 9th refuses to let that fear come to fruition.
Another interesting thing I saw in the last thread (pic related).Because the Chapter recruits from such a diverse range of people, would a single tear logo for each Company suffice, but have it done in a cultural style?We could base it on the current Captains heritage, the logo changing every time the Captain gets replaced. We could have a Maori logo, an Oriental logo, a Roman logo, etc.Or, we could styilise the logos based on the 'emotions' that were mentioned earlier on.Thoughts?
>>24457045Passion can be misinterpreted.I'd change it to Zeal.
>>24457127I like this tear logo as it is, because it's kind of half a flame, half a teardrop. The drawfag who did it I think did a solid job. Also coming up with as many logos as there are 40k cultures would be madness. I'd like to see the image colored in, possibly with the internal part of the tear being blue, the outer remaining black, against our pauldron's purple background.
>>24456795i hope creating this chapter someday will mean something ...lol it wont
>>24457292It will if we get more contributors. I know there's a decent number of people who like what we've done. We do need someone to help us out and start making a 1d4chan page if we want to give this chapter some permanency. Without that, eventually it will be forgotten, and if someone wants to come back and add to it a while later, they may not be able to find the data they need without a reference page. I think we should make a 1d4chan page. After all, the Eyes of Mordred got a page with only 2 threads of discussion, and much less writing and drawing.
>>24457292If you want "meaning" in the sense of becoming GW canon or something, of course that's never gonna happen. This is, as with 99% of /tg/'s projects, just something fun to do with the community.
>>24456895First of all, we really need to stick to a colour scheme.Are any of the three I posted preferable?>>24457045Will the different Companies have different colour helmets, pauldrons or should we just do different colour eyes?
>>24457537tone down the grey and the silver between the armour and the scheme is fine, also the way I see it not all of them would wear robes/tabbards and the like, it's all personal preference.as for company colours, maybe just have a single tear line on the helmet, this corresponds to company
>First of the original Jeremiah fluff. I'm re-writing this so I will post the new version when its ready.The Chapters hero of legend was Brother Jeremiah, the Master of Sanctity within the Chapter.It was said that during his lifetime he was once given the esteemed honour of being admitted entrance into the Sanctum Imperialis, the chamber containing the almighty Golden Throne which housed the remains of the God-Emperor.It was during this brief visit that he bore witness to the true nature of the Emperor, all of his divine plan and the miniscule workings of all of his plans. It was during this vision of complete and utter purity that the Silent Arbiter realised the unending war was not for naught and it would eventually culminate in the salvation of the Imperium and the human race. It was said that the Weeping Prophet shed tears as he was blessed with this divine revelation.During a gruesome campaign against the forces of Chaos, when the fighting was at its most intense, when losses were many and victories were few, the Arbiter and a few trusted Marines made a desperate last push in order to break out of the situation they had found themselves in.1/3
>>24458064Calling on the divine might of the Emperor, but to little avail, Jeremiah watched as his fellow Battle-Brothers were cut down beside him by the forces of the Archenemy. Against overwhelming odds he fought onwards, taking injuries that would have outright killed lesser men, even fellow Marines. Scores of enemies fell under his righteous fury as he carved a bloody swathe of justice through the enemies. After receiving multiple fatal wounds he finally succumbed and fell to his knees.The forces of Chaos circled around the broken Arbiter, jeering and ridiculing the Marine. Jeremiah looked through hazy eyes and spat blood at the ground as he watched a lone figure emerge from the throng, clutching a knife oozing with foul enchantments and curses.As Jeremiah focused on the cultist in front of him, he witnessed the true nature of the being in front of him, a tiny spark of white light, almost completely concealed by years of hatred, thousands of acts of heresy and corruption. Jeremiah’s eyes cleared from the haze that had overcome him, perceiving the events that may have come to pass. He saw the small light burst into a flame to rival a thousand suns, a truly dazzling beacon of hope against the unstoppable sea of darkness, and it was in this fiery pillar that complete salvation may have been achieved, the absolution of every man, woman and child in the Galaxy and the survival of humanity.Alas, this divine gift, a literal boon from the Emperor had been squandered, merely to fulfil some petty weakness, frittered away to liars and criminals.2/3
>>24458083It was at this revelation that Jeremiah began to weep, no longer tears of sorrow, nor tears of happiness, but tears of anger, grief, anguish and pain. The tears started as liquid, but as the visions he had seen struck him more deeply the tears turned to holy fire. Blue and white streaks poured from the Prophets eyes, the forces of Chaos recoiled in horror as the Silent Arbiter rose up from the ground, ignoring all previous injuries and grasped the cultist with both arms, as if embracing a lost son. Jeremiah grasped the cultists shoulders and looked deeply into the cultists eyes, who was unable to draw his vision away from the pious fury he had unleashed.“Gaze into my eyes heretic, and see your mistakes.” The voice left the Prophets mouth as a mere whisper, but amplified tenfold around the surrounding Chaos hordes.“Weep”. His final words purified the enemies in a sea of devout wrath. Cultists were instantly incinerated and demons were sent screaming back to the Warp.As the battle subsided, the remaining Marines left their positions to find their beloved Master of Sanctity. As they waded through the corpses left behind they came across a single figure, kneeling in penitence, clutching a single skull. It was when they went to help him up they realised the Emperors blessing had unforeseen circumstances. Jeremiah’s eyes now glowed as a white hot flame, the fire that had rolled down his face earlier had scorched him beyond belief, scarring his cheeks and sealing his mouth shut. Brother Jeremiah was henceforth known as the Silent Arbiter, the Weeping Prophet.3/3
This chapter is dumb. Your emo crybaby marines have no place in 40k
>>24457537Just have the stripes be different colors. Wearing more robes could also be symbolic of rank. Base-level warriors get none, Sergeants get robe and tabard, Captains get robe, tabard, and loincloth. Also, seconding that the grey of the cloth and the grey of the armor joints needs to be considerably darker. (but not black).
>>24458198>inb4 some retard actually reacts to this post
>>24457045Company names:1st: deprived2nd: anger3rd: restless4th: grief5th: guilt6th: dissapointment7th: hope8th: suffering9th: fear10th: blind
>>24458292>i admire your assistance, but... you replied to the retard. :/Also, he's probably the same guy that seems to like following this chapter's threads and say the same tired lines every time.
>>24458325change all of these into latin and we're good to go
>>24458325Just remember, these are our themes for what part of the Figure of Legend's teachings each company took most to heart. They're not hard and fast rules. Among the 9th, there's still gung-ho fearless guys, and among the 4th, there's still callous dudes who don't feel like helping out after a fight very much.
>>24458407>1st: deprived>2nd: anger>3rd: restless>4th: grief>5th: guilt>6th: dissapointment>7th: hope>8th: suffering>9th: fear>10th: blind1: privatur2: iram3: inquietum4: dolor5: iniquitates6: dissapointment7: Spe8: tribulacione9: nolite timere10: Excaeca
>>24458407go go google translateprivavitiratusinquietumdolorscelerisdissapointmentsperopatiendotimorcæcus
>>24458480>1: privatur>2: iram>3: inquietum>4: dolor>5: iniquitates>6: dissapointment>7: Spe>8: tribulacione>9: nolite timere>10: ExcaecaNow I'm having flashbacks back to my schoo life.My last Latin teacher was a bro. I have a major Latinum but no Latin skills.Well, it seems like understanding "malus" is a sign of high education for Americans, so I guess my Latin lessons paid off. Though it's likely that no non-English people would have any difficulty with that. Except for the Elevens and co.
>>24458542So these would be like, one-word mottoes to go on each company's banners?
>>24458570Well, I'd suggest either bastardizing the words or going for fully perfect Latin, which means always using the base form for the motto.A friend of mine studied Latin. I could ask her about the correct grammar.
>>24458407Real Latin translation:1st: privatus2nd: ira3rd: sollicitus4th: luctus5th: culpa6th: dissapointment (no translation)7th: spera8th: patientia9th: terror10th: caecus
>>24458507>>24458542I'd say the former is more correct thatn the latter.Especially on "iratus" and "timor"."Iram" would mean "of wrath", if I remember correctly, and not "wrath" itself.
>>24458599>patientiaIt that really the correct term for suffering?I mean, it probably means suffering, but would there be a more appropriate version?>terrorI'm not sure, but timor feels better to me.It probably depends on how strong we want the emotion to be - Full blown terror or just normal fear?
>>24458599Disappointment = destitutioneWould help if we spelt it right the first time. However I don't think just Latinizing it is going to work. Can we find a mythical figure associated with the emotion, and then based the Company name on that?
>>24458646What about changing patientia for penitentia (penitence)?I think terror is ok as it is.And dolus for dissapointment1st: privatus2nd: ira3rd: sollicitus4th: luctus5th: culpa6th: dolus7th: spera8th: penitentia9th: terror10th: caecus
>>24458701>dolusI just checked on a website.Seems like the translation is something akin to "fraud" or "deceit".Unfortunately, most of these sites can only translate from Latin and not into it.
>>24458750Also, "privatus" only works as "XXX privatus", not on its own.On its own, it just means "personal" or "private".
>>24458750I know, but I couldnt find a translation for dissapointment and dolus is has a similar enough meaning and is an easy and short word.Also, it's latin, who will understand it?
>>2445879840k is full of fucked up latin anyway. Having a few things that sound right but maybe are grammatically wrong is almost better.
>>24458798>Also, it's latin, who will understand it?I would rather you don't do anything halfway.Either rape Latin and say it's High Gothic or do proper Latin.
>Oh great, mourning sons thread is back up!>People talking about Latin>welp, i'm bored, gonna go back to writefaggotryAnyway free bumpies, keep up the good work!Pic related, out most holy empororor
>>24459547So for our fleet size, I'm thinking we'd have like 4 Battle Barges, maybe each teamed with a pair of Strike Cruisers for a total of 8. That's a reasonably hefty powerbase for a fleet-based crusading chapter, without being larger than canon seems ok with. As far as support vessels go, I'd say we would have somewhere in the neighborhood of 30 smaller ships, like basically 40k versions of minor corvettes and patrol boats or something. These ships would only rarely go with the Battle Barges into war zones, but would remain behind defending the main body of the chapter, which would be something like 5 or 6 large armored freighter type vessels, containing training grounds, the armories, supplies, personnel, etc. All the rear-echelon stuff goes there, so that the actual dedicated combat ships can go do their thing. These larger storage vessels would probably be equipped with spacedock piers ala Rogue Trader, and whenever the chapter settles in to resupply/trade/recruit people, they would form a large temporary port.
>>24456795OP, is it public knowledge that the Mourning Sons are derived from the Alpha Legion? There's been lots of different fan chapters involving "dark secrets" hurr durr, but it might be interesting if these marines being derived from long-stored gene-seed from legions that turned traitor was a known, public fact, and then examine the consequences of that. These guys seem like the literal personification of "if you have nothing to hide, you have nothing to fear", hunting down the sins and secrets of heretics, but they have to be equally rigorous in interrogating/scrutinizing their own chapter out of the overpowering need to prove that they're loyal to the Imperium. More radical Inquisitors have already accepted them as OK, which is why they weren't purged outright after their founding, but the fundamentalists are always demanding proof of purity, and their gene-seed tithes to Mars/High Lords are demanded far more often. This chapter might have to be very cautious when committing more than a squad or two to battle, as their on-site progenoid reserves would be very small, meaning that a single disaster might irrevocably damage the chapter.Another interesting twist might be that everyone else can hide secrets, but this chapter can't. Perhaps the curse that lets them unravel other people's secrets continually conspires against the Mourning Sons if they try any subterfuge. This might be why the scouts fight alongside the Dreadnoughts instead of going for traditional covert ops. virtually every time they try to be sneaky, something betrays their presence. Wherever the chapter fleet goes, it's more visible in the Warp. When it exits the warp, there always seems to be a radiation flare announcing their presence. If the chapter master tries to tell a lie, he starts to hesitate and stammer, losing his commanding presence and making it increasingly obvious that he's not on the level. His eyes, symbols of his power, might begin to involuntarily (cont)
>>24463770twitch and look away from whoever he's talking to, as a criminal might do under interrogation. In this way, the mutation is more of a double edged sword, especially in the 40k universe, where secrecy can often mean the difference between living and dying. The curse manifests itself in direct proportion to the degree of the lie. Telling someone that they look good when in reality, their clothes are kind of tacky (a white lie), wouldn't trigger more than an eye twitch, perhaps. The older warriors might be able to control this for the sake of diplomacy. Outright lying, like oh, telling a hostile Inquisitor that a chainsword they recovered from a daemon world is free of taint and he should leave them alone (for example), would be more severe. Lying on a grand scale, like the whole chapter secretly turning traitor, might just kill them outright through seizures or maybe their eyes are struck blind. IDK, just some flavor options/ideas. Critique away, I just wanted to make the mutation less of a direct benefit.
Bump for OP's return.
>>24464571Bump for more writefagging.
>>24465218Bump because bumping is fun.
>>24463846I don't like it Seems very un-space marine-y even for a cursed chapter.
>>24463770>>24463846So how about having them special forces that are taught half-truths and like, to make them believe the lies that they are supposed to tell?
>>24469418Well, we're going to need more than "seems bad, man" as a critique. Why exactly do you think this idea is not good? At it's heart, this is very simple. The chapter can see through other's lies, but in return can never tell any lies of their own without the most extreme feats of willpower. You don't see how in the treacherous 40k universe, that would be quite a handicap? Even white lies that to a person like us would be easy to tell carry increased risk of failure.
>>24469988Maybe for the chapter's diplomats or something. If we're looking for ways to strengthen the "curse" side of a 21st founding chapter's powers, there shouldn't be any easy way to counteract it, otherwise the whole concept of a curse is lost.
>>24473285But that's not an "easy" way.Consider the implications for information flow and inner structure of the chapter. This will cause some serious paranoia on the part of the diplomats and their superiors alike. Lots of tension.It's a way to compensate for the weakness, by creating a different weakness.
>>24473493Well, if more posters/contributors/OP agree that this spec-forces thing is a good idea, then I'll withdraw my objections. Some writefagging to describe this situation of tension you mention would be helpful in that case, to strengthen your position.
>>24473532>Some writefagging to describe this situation of tension you mention would be helpful in that case, to strengthen your position....Any writefaggotry I could make in English would result in my opinion being instantly discarded.It's not that obvious when writing a post, but English is not my first language. And I'm already not much of a writer in my mother tongue.
Gonna try a little writefagging involving the intitiation shit.
>>24474602Please, by all means. :)
Well in my mind a major part of the curse is the boon itself, trying to sleep, looking at the ceiling, noticing EVERY little detail, noticing it isn't a plain white, smooth surface, you can see every little flaw.Think about going about your day, talking to people you like, and realising they don't like you, they are scared of you, or think badly of you.Looking at a man and a lady talking and realising he is cheating on her and she is far to gullible to ever notice, the sight isn't just part of the curse, it's the mind that goes with it, being able to interpret the details and understanding human behaviour.Showing up in the middle of a battlefield, saving imperial guardsmen, looking at them, and understanding they fear your wraith more than that of the enemy, or looking at an inquisitor and knowing something is just... off, but not being able to prove anything, then spending ages looking into it, pouring yourself into proving a possible heresy, before figuring out there is no deeper meaning, they just gave you a funny vibe.Constantly having your brain work, taking in everything your damned eyes are throwing at you, it's why the marines watch flames flicker, and water pour, it lets them concentrate on 1 thing, to train themselves to just stop looking.
>>24475068That... is actually quite good. It's not OCD marines or anything, it's just that being able/forced to see what is really going on (most of the time) only serves to point out that nothing is EVER as good as it could be. Imagine having to live with no filter on reality. Shit, imagine being a Librarian for this chapter. Gazing into the warp, knowing that on a fundamental level, your powers are what lies at the heart of human failings. Librarians would be tolerated because they are necessary, but they would live in the worst fishbowl ever. Their battle brothers would be constantly scrutinizing them for taint merely by looking at them, and there would likely be a number of them that simply renounce their gift, unable to stand the suspicion. Also, the librarians themselves would be forced to see every flicker of revulsion or mistrust coming from the other Mourning Sons, picking up on it not just with their physical eyes but their mental senses. The librarians that do manage to rise above all this would be frightening indeed though, because they would have earned their chapter's genuine trust somehow, and learned to be at peace with who they are and how they serve the Emperor.
>>24475198Librarians are still brothers in arms, but every chapter fears/despises/distrusts those who truck with the warp on some level to some degree. If the Mourning Sons were somehow present at the council of Nikaea, I believe that they would probably have sided with Mortarion regarding restricting psyker powers.
So they're Doom Eagles but more emo?
>>24475068>>24475198Don't forget that this also allows them to have higher trust in people.It's like visiting 4chan. I had no more faith in humanity before I found this site.Then I realized that everyone can be asshole and saint at the same time and that most people are genuinely good at heart.4chan recovered my faith in humanity.Being able to judge a person would do similar things to you. You would see insecurities. You would notice if someone lied because they didn't want to hurt you or because they were afraid of you.Rarely would you see behaviour based on outright malice. Most behaviour that would seem like assholishness or evil to a normal person would be seen in a far more positive light by a person with the gift of perception.I wonder how this affects corruption. On the one hand, this positive outlook means that they've got a mind that's a lot more open. They would see the good spark even in the most depraved of cultists. They would see exactly what emotion a daemon was born from. They wouldn't be able to attack them with full zeal.On the other hand, it also allows them to detect corruption. So are they more vulnerable or are they less vulnerable?
>>24475260Sup bro, good to see you as usual contributing your assistance to these threads. I mean at this point, we're 5 threads in, having thoroughly explained how these marines work, and yet it's always comforting to have these same, tired, meaningless labels thrown around. Keep up the good work, anon. ;)
>>24475282As individuals, more vulnerable, particularly when young, inexperienced, and hotheaded. Older marines who've gotten past their ROW ROW FIGHT THA POWAH stage are probably very resistant to corruption. They've seen, they've heard, they've tried to help. They know that in all likelihood, nothing they do will ever matter, but in the name of the Emperor and his love for Man, they *must* continue to try.
>>24475335But you're describing the Doom Eagles except more emo. The sad part is that you think it's new and interesting.Also, Traitor Legion geneseed is just fucking trite by this point.
>>24475260The Mourning Sons don't embrace death, they fight it at every turn. They're trying to kindle a spark of light in a darkened galaxy, inspired by their positivist take on the Emperor's desires for humanity. The saying that defines this chapter more than any other in my mind is "A cynic is a disappointed idealist". They're *trying* to be better men at the service of humanity, but have to slog through an endless ocean of filth. Only by faith in the Emperor and his plan can they keep from losing their core ethical nature.
>>24475408the sad part is that you can't or won't bother to read, either the fluff for this chapter or the fluff for the Doom Eagles. I will say however that I personally thought the people requesting traitor legion geneseed int he very first thread were trolls who somehow slipped past the radar, and I would prefer to see the Mourning Sons as Ultramarines who have forsaken the assburgers elements of Girlyman's bullshit, left for the other end of the galaxy, and tried to live up to the Everyman ideals of the *good* Ultras of older editions.
>>24475452>well, everything's fucked, let's fight anywayHow is that not the Doom Eagles?>>24475416Isn't that exactly the same as pretty much any other given "nice" Marine chapter?
>>24475496>bawwww stop criticizing me
>>24475363>They know that in all likelihood, nothing they do will ever matter, but in the name of the Emperor and his love for Man, they *must* continue to try.And they also know that most people are good at heart.Chaos starts by trying to make the world a better place.Orks are just genuinely having fun and don't understand anything else.Nids... What would they see when looking at a Nid? Especially when looking at their troop movements and their paths through space?Dark Eldar are evil out of necessity... Though they are probably the only actually evil fraction. Even if a Deldar turned good and hated the stuff that they are known for - They can't not torture people.The Tau are just idealists that genuinely think the Greater Good is something everyone should be striving for.Necrons... Don't know anything about them.I wonder how they would take to seeing actual evil. Like, say, a planetary governor who's genuinely a sadistic asshole.
>>24475484The single biggest difference is that for the Mourning Sons, death is not inevitable, because the Emperor loves his children. Fighting seems pointless, but there is a purpose at the end of it all, even if it doesn't seem that way.The Doom Eagles just want to embrace the final death of all things and accept their fate with stoicism.
>>24475507>y u so defensive bro?
>>24475507>Giving actual constructive criticism>Being a snarky ponce about things that could be improvedlearn the difference, it could save your life>inb4 GET OVER IT ITS THE INTERNET
>>24475519>Chaos starts by trying to make the world a better place.But that's wrong. That's a specific subset of Chaos corruption that inevitably swiftly becomes "KILL THE WOMEN AND CHILDREN FIRST!"Chaos is evil incarnate.Nids actively hate everyone who isn't them, according to a psyker who mindread a Deathspitter.The Dark Eldar just like hurting people.The Necrons are just straight up cartoon villains.
Just stop. He won't give up as long as you feed him.
>>24475535>>24475558Circlejerking over how great /tg/'s ideas are and disregarding all criticism was what gave us the Ice Serpents.
>>24475519They would do everything in their power to remove him. Probably they would try to work within the system as much as they could, but eventually if he had a lot of power they might go to war against him. Ideally they would find evidence of heresy or traitorship, but maybe there would be none. As a fleet-based chapter, they might just strike and then leave. Being an asshole isn't properly using the Emperor's people. Remember, this chapter isn't afraid to get their hands dirty. It's an unusual moral line to walk, removing the legal Imperial representatives to protect the Emperor's citizens, but the Mourning Sons would try. Would they succeed? Maybe. Maybe not. Overconfidence is also the Mourning Sons' weakness.
>>24475584>What is reading comprehension"This is gay you suck stop being unoriginal" isn't constructive. You said nothing on how it can be improved.
>>24475529Well, that's slightly different, so okay.
>>24475584Did you read the original thread? We've worked really hard to move away from the original OPness of what they came up with there. Why do you think we've had FIVE threads on this chapter? Each time we get a little better, that's what review and critique does. We need actual review, not half assed trolling and useless labels/buzzwords.
>>24475615Come up with something original? Stop piling special snowflake traits on the fucking chapter? Change them from being fucking Alpha Legion?>>24475594That's the kind of shit that gets you killed by orkish snipers, bro.
>>24475584No, we disregard pointless bitching. When people bring something to the table we're more than willing to work with it. But, that takes work, and trolls don't do work. This is why we ridicule you, as should all good /tg/ers.
>>24475637Yep. It's probably happened a couple times in this chapter's history. There are Inquisitors who don't like them, that has already been established. Trying to improve the system is NEVER free of consequences, if it was, THAT would be mary-suedom.
>>24475637Again, "Change it" isn't pointing out help, it's pointing out a problem. You're doing nothing to help alleviate the problem.You've contributed absolutely nothing to this thread besides pointless whining and namecalling, so you have no say in changing anything.
>>24475622Okay, here's my review.Alpha Legion's trite, change it.999th chapter is special snowflakey but tolerable.Chaplains being able to peer into your soul is fucking retarded.Crying isn't a real flaw.
>>24475649>>24475674So if a critic criticizes a work and doesn't come up with a way it could be improved, his opinion doesn't matter? Okay, guys.
>>24475684Well, like I said earlier, I felt like Alpha Legion was an early troll that snuck under the radar. 999th is just a cool number that is evocative of the chapter's name and purpose. It's a number no one's used before and that's not a big thing in numerology or what not, so we felt it wasn't a big deal. The chapter could see into souls in earlier threads. As I mentioned earlier, CRITIQUE AND REVIEW has smoothed that OP ness out into being a very rare ability only given to the very oldest and most experienced people in the chapter. It is not a psychic ability, it's more like being the very best "tell" reader in existence, building on lesser skills inherited at initiation. Crying was never a flaw, it's a consequence of having hyperactive occulobe implants. does that answer your questions? Can we move past pointless labels now, please?
>>24475726To clarify, even the oldest marines can't see into souls. Maybe, maybe the Librarians can, that might be a chapter psyker power or something.Older marines just pick up on things that people think are hidden, like subconscious twitches, misspeaking certain phrases, tremors in hands, voice, or eyes, that kind of thing. From that, they make deductions and gain insights that *others* interpret as having some kind of "seer" gift.
>>24475707Really, yes. Any good critic should be able to at least either say "This is wrong, and here's how it can be right" or "This is wrong, but it's pretty much unavoidable" or "This is wrong, but if just it was just gone the thing would be improved overall." It doesn't make you NOT a critic to just list off problems instead of seeking solutions, it just makes you a shitty critic. And opens up a lot of doors in politics.
>>24475726Then why is it literally labeled "Chapter Flaw"?Seeing better with no downside is not a flaw.>>24475765So they read people? Can't Marines completely control every part of their bodies?But really, I cannot stress how shitty Alpha Legion being their geneseed is.
>>24475684What would you suggest changing Alpha Legion to, since that seems to be like 90% of the hate that gets thrown this chapter's way. I'd just as soon cut the trolls off at the knees by changing that part.
>>24475805I think Ultramarines are perfect, because they don't have the baggage of the other legions and really you can become anything from their gene-seed.Or, you know. You can just have your Unknown Progenitor be ACTUALLY UNKNOWN.
>>24475800Flawed in that even if they want to tune out what they see in the grim darkness of the 40th millennium, they can't. Ever. It's more of a case of too much data bombarding them at all times than it is that the eyes leak a little. the techpriests that tried to make them succeeded. waaaayyyyy too well. their skill is noteworthy, but not exactly game-changing, it just makes them better detectives, diplomats, and close combatants. It also makes life hell because they feel driven to struggle against the endless sea of suffering the Imperium wallows in. It also means that they get to watch as everything they do corrodes as soon as they look away.
>>24475842Salamanders would also be an ok choice as an origin point for the chapter's moral leaning.
>>24475800I'm pretty sure "completely controlling every part of their bodies" isn't a generic marine power. Unless you ask Matt Ward, maybe. :/
>>24475874Well, yeah, but it's kind of "special" because they have no known successors. I personally have no problem with it but it'll open it up to trolls.>>24475860That COULD be done in a n interesting way, but I'm not sure it WILL be.Also it opens up for their renegades to all be like Avitus, which is cool.
>>24475594The chapter also has a way about potentials, at least thats how we were going, with the chaplains and some vets who have the most advanced site, being able to tell if one person could do better at a certain job to just staring at them for a while, not so much, looking at someone's soul, but their character? if that makes sense, the same for when they look upon a populace or a world, they don't just strike and leg it, they stay put for a bit, and set things up so that the world will flourish
>>24475913Yeah, it is. Psycho-indoctrination unlocks prodigious mental powers.
>>24475842>Or, you know. You can just have your Unknown Progenitor be ACTUALLY UNKNOWN.This has been the best fucking idea about the subject since we started these threads.
>>24475927When the chaplains examine someone, they look for subtle tells and signs known to the chapter to represent moral failing or moral strength, and choose recruits based on that. Determining someone's caste or job or whatever is much too specific.They do stay around a world they've liberated/conquered/had to blast up and rebuild for a while, though. in 40k world, as soon as they leave there's like a 99% chance it all falls apart, but it's the attempt that matters to the Mourning Sons.
>>24475949Isn't unknown primarch just as superspecial and edgy? so seeecret!
>>24475949Agreed. It really doesn't really matter where they stem from. >>24475972Not really.
>>24475972Not unknown primarch.Unknown progenitor, as in nobody fucking remembers where they came from. The goddamn Death Spectres and Storm Wardens have that.
>>24475996Well, in that case, I'm ok with it being an unknown progenitor. Rumors may abound that they're derived from Alpha Legion, but just as many might point to severely alters Ultras, or long-distant Salamanders, or even Word Bearers, seeing as how the Sons seem to gravitate toward revering the Emperor.
>>24475972Not really"OMG GUYZ YOU SO EGDGY WITH YOUR UNKNOWN PRIMARCH WHO IS IT, THE EMPORER HIMSELF LOL!""what? nah man, we just kept arguing about it, so we decided to just drop the entire subject since it was getting annoying"Like when you have 2 kids fighting over a doll or a game or something, just remove the damn game, solves the problem.>>24475964Oh yeah, i didn't mean like, they chaplains just go running about pointing at people assigning them jobs, sorry if it sounded that way, i just meant it like you said it, surely you'd want a planetary governor to have the very highest of morals, and not be a dick, which you do.
>>24476020>not revering the Emperor HERESY
>>24476070no heresy here, boss, the Sons probably revere him more than most.
>>24476041Scrutinizing all the people, probably not. Trying to select a governor of the best available character? Yeah, the Sons would do at least that before they leave.
From the Journal of a former Aspirant.Many months ago…I recall it.The longest day I knew as a mortal.Potential Warriors for the emperor ready and willing to fight lined up and prepared. Their eminence appeared then, Giants amongst us staring down, their eyes reflected down onto us what we were. Their bodies; what we were to be. The Chaplain stared down at me…I saw fire.A deep seated fire in his eyes, bubbling with anger as he saw me, it scared me. The last time I’d feel fear.“Child, in you, there is courage” his words were spoken with a quiet purposeful thinking. “You will need it”His eyes seemed to glow as he spoke to me…slowly opening my eyes to the way of the galaxy. I saw pain, sadness, anger, every emotion at once in my mind. I saw the never ending grief of the holy emperor at being entombed forever between life and death in a universe that was doomed without him.The great knowledge cause be to black out. I wept.
>>24476493I am not the best but there it is.
>>24476493Still a little too much like an actual psyker power, maybe. We need to nail down exactly how the Chaplains convey the teachings and the essence of Jeremiah's vision. *Could* it pass its power down from Chaplain to Chaplain somehow? Each one inherits just the tiniest bit of the holy fire Jeremiah experienced, and as such can do something like what is described here?Could we have Chaplains be Librarians also? Librarians are in touch with the Warp, normally something the Mourning Sons distrust and despise, but through endless purification and "holiness rituals" or something, gain the moral strength to become an acceptable part of the chapter? That might be the most "canonical" way to answer the question of how the recruits are examined and chosen. Thoughts?
>>24456795OP, OP, wherefore art thou OP? Much has happened in this thread, much has been said, and a sea change may be on the wind for the origins of the Mourning Sons. Some guidance is needed, and some official decisionmaking. A 1d4chan page to lock down the good parts of what we've all done would be a very good idea as well.
>>24477598Also you should probably archive this relatively soon, the length is getting rather significant.
Not to deviate from a cool thread and cool concept, but what other Marine chapters has /tg/ fleshed out?I know they did the Emperor's Nightmares. Wasn't there a water-themed one?
>>24477946Abyssal Jaws comes to mind. There's been several if you look on 1d4chan, which is where I'm hoping to get the Mourning Suns put. We've had a lot of effort put into working on this thing, it would be a shame to have it go to waste.
>>24477946not marines but I think the best /tg/ created fan thing were the Scraploota orks
>>24478005>the best /tg/ created fan thing were the shitty canon raping blueberry fapfodderlyl
>>24478005>>24478066This isn't the place to discuss that, really. I'd rather this not turn into a war over totally unrelated topics, if you don't mind.
>>24477158I agree, that did seem a tad too MAGIC, but now we refine! I thought that all marines gained hyper perception, but only a few, the chaplains and other such "higher ups" gained an ability to tell the character of a man.The idea that said chaplains could tell who was developing that ability and by vision quests (spiritual meditation, actual hallucinations?) But also a rite/ceremonial were the actual transition is brought on by the one of the chapters librarians with chaplain support?The actual transition being a painful process. That was the page i was on anyway.What was everyone else's ideas on the difference between hyper perception and the like and how it is brought on?
>>24478158I figured it was a case of the older the marine the more developed the hyper perception is. Obviously there are some people who develop it faster than others, but generally; older = better
>>24478158Well, the more I think about it, the more it makes sense that it's a Librarian ability to really dig deep into a person's psyche, but also that only a Chaplain would have the experience and moral training to be trusted with such a responsibility, lending strength to the concept of having all Librarians be Chaplains. There might be Chaplains without psychic abilities, of course, they would operate as normal. As for the rest of them, it would be that they are extra perceptive, and with some training can start to read the "tells" of the enemy to be used in combat. With a great deal of experience, even non-librarians and non-chaplains can still get a good "feel" for a person's character by noticing subconscious details.
>>24478251Having all Librarians undergo Chaplain training could be seen as the final challenge to prove worthy of having psychic power. Those that fail would be purged. After all, psykers are responsible for many of the Imperium's problems, and the Mourning Sons would likely treat them with a degree of hostility. Maybe not on the Black Templar level, but still.
Hey. Good to see this is still alive. I've been working on my Space Marine drawings. I might be able to do something for you tomorrow.
>>24479499Kickass, dude. Anything you need from us, information-wise?
>>24479499A chapter banner would be really incredible, if you wanted to do one. Here's some examples.
>>24456795Thread's getting long, I went ahead and archived it. Vote up, please!Link: http://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/24456795/
>>24481042bump for those thread contributors in different time zones.
>>24475570>Chaos is evil incarnate.It's emotion incarnate.>Nids actively hate everyone who isn't them, according to a psyker who mindread a Deathspitter.Maybe a Deathspitter is made for the specific purpose of hating everything? Nids are purpose-made organisms.>The Dark Eldar just like hurting people.You can bet your ass that quite a lot Dark Eldar don't actually enjoy torture. They just do it because it's how they've been taught. They might not even be aware that it's saving their souls.Just because you eat meat, doesn't mean that you like killing.>The Necrons are just straight up cartoon villains.Seriously?
>>24476493Just a random idea:What if the aspirants were chosen through interviews?A few experienced marines (And Librarians for the closer selection) go to the world and call all potential aspirants. And then they just talk and make notes.And then they decide who will get a second look, this time with Psyker-enhanced insight.
>>24485299>rding to a psyker who mindread a Deathspitter.>Maybe a Deathspitter is made for the specific purpoooh I like this actually.>a formal interview to become a space marine.Best/Scariest Job interview ever.