I'm trying to work out a setting with 'mech warfare between two governments, both with different styles of warfare and equipment.Gov A utilizes superior overall technology (radar, jammers, "stealth," etc), and has their mechs generally looking more curvy or organic, almost along the lines of the Horned Owl pictured. However, since the other government they used to be allied with has collapsed, they can't keep up with the cost and will eventually run out of money unless they get the resources they're fighting over. Also, due to the higher tech level, their mechs aren't very modular, and their variety might consist of different models of the same overall design. Can't hotswap or replace weapons.Gov B has lesser technology, but has numbers. Walkers are more utilitarian looking (boxy, angular), but have modular weapon bays and can swap out in the field. Focus on ballistic weapons and missiles/rockets. Think this might be viable?
> 'mech warfareNo. Mecha are probably the single stupidest idea for a weapon in fiction. Having a machine standing up is a terrible idea on a battlefield. On top of that there is literally nothing that a mecha can do that a tank can't do better and more cheaply.
>>24314850>Bawwwwww, stop having fun you guise!Sounds interesting to me OP, but my knowledge of mecha and running games are limited.
>>24314837So... Gundam.That's basically the plot of every early Gundam anime.
>>24314856> implying anyone but you has fun with this tripe
>>24314850Yeah, i realize that. Guess I should stop playing 40k and D&D since they're not realistic too.
>>24314865> Guess I should stop playing 40k and D&DYes, you should.
>>24314863Really? Haven't watched any of it.
>>24314863Yeah, thats pretty much Gundam.Just cannibalize the Gundam setting and fiddle with the specifics. Probably remove all that magical Newtype bullshit.
>>24314870Go and watch the original Mobile Suit Gundam. It's pretty good.Also, I forget which series it was, but the mechs in it were originally designed for construction use (both on land and in space) but once war broke out they just strapped guns to them due to lack of tanks or something. I think that is one of the few ways to justify using mechs.
>>24314873Well, except that Zeon lost the tech edge really fast. Plus their stuff wasn't really stealthy, it was actually pretty flamboyant what with all the spikes, fins, crests, etc.
>>24314932I'll check it out. I mainly just stuck with building the models.One reason I was using to justify the mech use was the fight over various abandoned cities (from a previous war) that are now unfamiliar but helpful in establishing bases and such. Smaller skirmishes occur in pockets, and the mechs not only help with navigating the rubble, but also moving things around foraging.
>>24315018Rubble troubles? I got none.
>>24315057oh look it's the realism brigade
>>24315099Always wondered what the context was to this gif
>>24315128afaik, kid's doing a presentation, acts like an ass and the rest of the class gets pissed, basically he was being just like the realism brigade, and OP, if you want a system for it, you might want to look into chromestrike if you want something lightweight
>>24315057Step up son.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=24n77GgRtrw
>>24314850>there is literally nothing that a mecha can do that a tank can't do better and more cheaplyMountainsides like Afghanistan and middle-eastern walled-house complexes like Iraq.And the whole premise of mech's is that myomer legs are cheap. OP, what sort of weapons does the first faction specialize in?
>>24314837one thing I would say, don't fall into the "laser weapons are more advanced" trap, your players would most likely mock you, i'd say weapons like magnetic accelerators and maybe plasma-ish type deals for heavy weapons would b a starting point
>>24314960>retards who have never watched Gundam beforeThey stayed ahead of the Federation in tech by the end of the One Year War, and various subfactions as well as Neo Zeon/Axis remained light years beyond the Federation and the Titans well into 0090's. Singular examples like the Gundam who did not and could not possibly win the war on its own is not a definite tech advantage over the opposing faction. Federation mechs and technology were dogshit. They won the One Year War through insane amounts of mass production of GMs and burying the Zeon forces in weight of numbers, which they always had from the beginning even AFTER they and the Zeiks annihilated half the human species in the opening months of the war.
>>24314837So you want to play Heavy Gear.
>>24315233More precision guided things like missiles and tracked weapons. They can deploy drones onto buildings that can lock onto a target and train a mech's weapons onto that one. Different drones can operate on different frequencies for different targets. Things like autocannons, rockets, and standard missiles are most common on both sides though. >>24315263I think I'm going to avoid energy weapons overall, except for the extremely rare and experimental case, so a lot of them won't be seen.Oh, and I forgot to mention, a 3rd faction consisting of the dwellers of the areas the 2 main governments are fighting over. Think more advance Mad Max, they've captured an old mech factory and use much older generation mech and resort to unconventional/guerilla tactics
>>24315263Laser weapons are weird for people used to bullet guns. They're hitscan weapons with short ranges, with armor penetration that's superb at short range and shit at long range. They have variable focus that can be dialed down to flash-fry exposed clothing and flesh at several times the anti-armor range, or eyes and sensors several times beyond that.IMO, railguns are always a safe bet. Plasma entails soft-science, OTOH.
>>24315300so again. you want to play Heavy Gear.They have a TTRPG version, i'd suggest checking it out.
>>24315312what are hitscan weapons
>>24315326It's old gamer's term for instahit projectiles without travel time.
>>24315313Yeah, i'd say the aesthetic I had in my mind is close to Heavy Gear.
>>24315284>They stayed ahead of the Federation in tech by the end of the One Year WarDebatable. The advent of MS scale beam weaponry (that didn't require and actual ocean of water cooling) really put Zeon on the back foot. It wasn't until the Gelgoog rolled around right at the end that they were able to get that advantage back, and in any case Beam Rifles always favoured the Federation who could trade numbers with the Zeons and come out on top. Comparitively, whilst before a Zeon pilot might be able to survive a hit or two from conventional weaponry before going down, the new beam weaponry is much more likely to get a one-hit-one-kill.Mass production of a cheap beam weapon (the Spray Pistol) was genius on the part of whoever it was who designed the mass production GM.The only aspect in which Zeon was far in advance of the Federation was Mobile Armour development, which was too prohibitively expensive for them to support, and Newtype Weapon Sytems, and they never had THAT big of a Newtype corps, and only Lalah had the ability to actually turn a battle in Zeons favour by herself.> various subfactions as well as Neo Zeon/Axis remained light years beyond the Federation and the Titans well into 0090's. That's also debatable. It's not helped by the fact that Paptimus, a Jovian Agent basically took over MS design duties when he took over the Titans either.
>>24315284Aside from the Gelgoog, the GM was superior to pretty much anything that Zeon made in more than single digits. And even then, the Gelgoog was introduced literally in the last two weeks of the war. The Federation won by mass production of the GM, yes. They won by mass producing a machine that was better than its Zeon equivalents.
>>24315379Also, to say that the Zeon Remnant was in anyway more advanced than the Feds is ridiculous. They weren't even better at being retarded than the Feds in 0083.Axis on the other hand WAS damned advanced and I'd say probably did have the tech advantage over the Feds right until the end of Chars Counterattack. That whole place a was a hothouse of military development and advancement. But special mention DOES have to go to the AEUG for not only building the Zeta, but then doing the limited Zeta+ runs, THEN designing the Double Zeta and putting out that as well. Theres also the weirdness of the Sentinel Gundam project to consider as well.
>>24315406Essentially the GM was poorly protected, but equipped with firepower that could kill anything they were up against (aside from the Big Zam) with a single shot and then mass produced in huge numbers.Data from the Learning Computer is also something that really can't be overlooked.
Jammers can have some wonderful aesthetics, like link related:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vs2Cu7Fj38EWhat sort of scale and environment are you going for?
>>24315423The main advance in things, honestly, were beam sabers and beam weaponry. Even weaker weapons like beam scatter guns were incredibly overpowered: And the mere fact that the Feds had Mobile Suits meant that the playing field was levelled.They didn't have to rely on the highly vulnerable ships and jets they'd been using before: Now, they could go toe-to-toe with the enemy, and win. I actually liked how realistic that was. The GM isn't the best machine out there, but it's a solid workhorse. Also, it's primary weapons are the most powerful of the time - Though Zeon has some, too - and quantity has a quality all of its own. A thing I've really appreciated about UC is how logically the GM lines flow from each other. Up to the Stark Jegan, there's a clear sense of progression before the line changes entirely. (Well, except for the Nemo.) Every iteration of Zeon, however, drastically changes things each time. Why the hell would you need the Dom/Rick Dom/Efreet/Gelgoog/ GOUF lines? That's four different Mobile Suit branches TOO MANY.Pick one and stick with it. Just make that one versatile. At least the Feddies quickly realized which designs were superior, and adapted them for mass-production.
>>24314864Hey, I do. Also, I think you're a moron. This is /tg/, not /sci/. Seriously, you sound like the shitheel complaining about bounty hunters in the previous thread.
>>24315461>(Well, except for the Nemo.) What's wrong with the Nemo?
>>24315461Even the Nemo was pretty obviously just a GM 2.5, essentially just a stopgap to deal with how underwhelming the GM II was until a real successor could be made.
>>24315481Nothing. But it seems to be more of a precision machine - Based off the GM Sniper - than a mass-combat workhorse. So, it's the beginning of Tacticool suits like the ones meant to support the Unicorn. (Can't remember the name.)
>>24315432Well, the 2 parties are on the same continent, just separated down the middle by a large patch of destructed land from a previous war. It's filled with no man's lands, pockets of unclaimed resources, and smaller cities that are either independent or used to be part of either side.I want to focus on small skirmishes in the middle, with things like grabbing factories, ammo plants, and interacting with the people living around there. Nothing huge like battles with hundreds of mechs. The interaction with people could be interesting, as they could be anti-government, wanting to be reunited with who they were with before, or just plain bat shit crazy.
>>24315503The Jesta? Nah, they're a bulked up Jegan. It's particularly noticeable in the love of grenades and shield missiles.
>>24315461>Every iteration of Zeon, however, drastically changes things each time. Why the hell would you need the Dom/Rick Dom/Efreet/Gelgoog/ GOUF lines? That's four different Mobile Suit branches TOO MANY.Hey now. It's not THAT bad. You have the primary Zaku line that goes Mk 1 (prewar) - Mk 2 (OYW) + variants - Mk 3 (NeoZeon ZZ)The Gouf if anything can be considered an offshoot of the Mk 2 Zaku, and development stopped on that line pretty much instantly.>Dom/Rick Dom/EfreetThose are ALL Dom patterns though. The Dom line goes Dom - Rick Dom - Dom Funf - Rick Dias 2 - DreissanWith the Efreet as an offshoot.>GelgoogWhich had what about two or three variants and then an improved model and was never really improved upon.So you have three MS lines: The Zaku line, the Dom line, and a short and stubby Gelgoog line. Compare that to the Feds. Who have their Gundam/GM lines, the Guncannon Lines and the Guntank lines, all of which (apart from the Guntank and even then it saw at least two major updates for changing times) saw heavy revision and numerous models and updates.
>>24315521True, but it reminds me a lot of the Nazi war machine in WWII. You see, in America, when they built something: Everyone got together, and the work was parcelled out. That meant uniformity in the parts used, fuel and so on.But the Germans had every company build their own project. So even the trucks had different requirement, different wheels, different parts...Which made fixing and repairing things an absolute nightmare. So yeah, you see what I mean. In uniformity, there is efficiency.
>>24315542Actually, America does the same: we bought/but from different companies. Certain jets are made by different companies and so on and so on.
>>24314837Why are you assuming that the side with superior technology would go for the overengineered and inflexible piece of shit design route?
>>24315559My bad, I meant during WWII. They would get everyone down, and decide on a single prototype - Everyone else would produce parts of it, is what I meant.The Germans literally built each separate vehicle line from scratch.
>>24315567They might have superior weapons, but more specialized systems. It's damn hard to jury-rig the unit with the Railgun for other purposes, to give an example.
>>24315576This. Again, I'm still fleshing it out, so shit may seem fucked up and need fixing. Certain systems may need different programs to run them.I'm in the Air Force and work on munitions, so I'm using some of my experience here. Can't use the same test set on all of our missiles due to their systems and programming, but we're just now getting to where we are standardizing that. I'm going the same route for that faction.
>>24315542>>24315569True, the lack of part uniformality was another thing that contributed to Zeons loss. On the other hand, unlike Germany they at least saw the problem and tried to implement a uniform parts policy near the end of the war. Too little too late unfortunately.In this case, the lack of uniformity is down to the fact that there were at least two competing MS design companies supplying Zeon with mobile suits during the war. So, you have Zimmad doing the Dom line, whilst Zeonic have the Zaku lines. Then, to further complicate matters Marine MS designs are all made in California using parts they have on hand down there.
>>24314837Thread archived for being informative about original MS Gundam.
So I find the question I'm going to ask is, do you have room for another player? Cause this sounds pretty damn cool. Also, I would suggest along with >>24315291and>>24315313that you check out, if you haven't already, Heavy Gear's setting. It seems fairly close to what you want; two factions, though in HG there's less of a technology gap, but with a large equatorial region with bandits and independent cities and states, all looking out for their own first.
>>24315882I'd say the more the merrier! Just sucks I'm in Korea right now, and most of this setup is for when I can actually find the time and people to play with.
>>24314932You're mixing up info. The first mechs, Mobile Pods were made for construction use. Late in the war, they converted a lot of them into the RB-79 Ball to supplement their fleet numbers.
>>24315784>unlike GermanyNot really. The Nazis got into standardization as well towards the end.Also, you cannot really squeeze out more from an exisiting chassis than the Nazis did. Just look at how they kept recycling those Czech designs until the end - and to great effect.As for Zeon, I think another point might be not just the design team/company rivalry, but service branch rivalries as well. All that bickering between the Zabis can't have been good for development.